Mini 482: Shrek Mafia - Game Over

[Oman]

Also, I'd like to see the setup. It seems to be a whole lot of doc neutrals, a pair of town masons, a cop, and the two scum?

[Mirth]

Er...what? (Also, for the record, I am sooooo not happy about the quicklynch you guys pulled, as you could have milked it for more information.) Yes, Oman, that was a dumb role claim...

So I'm guessing we wait to find out what the heck just happened. If there were only two mafia, we wouldn't have gone into night. Since Kaleidoscope mentioned Glork and DR specifically, it must have something to do with them. (For the record, DR was my night protect on the coinflip, since I really did flip a coin, and Glork was my night protect after you guys quicklynched, if that helps with any confusion of what the heck just happened.)

[Mirth]

Wait...Oman...was Zindaras your only partner?

[KaleiÐoscøpe]

Roles:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Welcome to Shrek Mafia, (...)

You are

Prince Shrek, town aligned

. One big story yours is. But apparantly, there seems to be betrayal! You must prevent this. Protect those who deserve your aid! You are a doctor. Send, during the night, a name towards me and that player will live through the night.
Good luck!
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Welcome to Shrek Mafia, (...)

You are

Princess Fiona, town aligned

. Together with Shrek, your story seems to become epic. However, there seems to be betrayal inside the brotherhood! You must prevent this. As you are skilled in martial arts, you may, during the night, send me a name of a player. You will kill that player.

Good luck!
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Welcome to Shrek Mafia, (...)

Donkey! From an inside source, you have noticed there seems to be betrayal! Some of your friends seem to be on a furious bloodlust! Make sure you will survive,

Donkey, Survivor and Mason

with Puss in Boots (...), another survivor. It is crucial you survive until the end of the game! If you would get investigated during the night, you will turn up town as long as Puss in Boots is alive. If either you or Puss in Boots dies though, the other one will be forced to join the resistance.

Good luck!
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Welcome to Shrek Mafia, (...)

Puss! From an inside source, you have noticed there seems to be betrayal! Some of your friends seem to be on a furious bloodlust! Make sure you will survive,

Puss in Boots, Survivor and Mason

with Donkey (...), another survivor. It is crucial you survive until the end of the game! If you would get investigated during the night, you will turn up town as long as Donkey is alive. If either you or Donkey dies though, the other one will be forced to join the resistance.

Good luck!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Welcome to Shrek Mafia, (...)

You are

Gingerbread Man, town aligned

. There seems to be betrayal on the move! As you are so small, you decided to track the traitors yourself. During the night, you may target a player. You will be told who that player targeted during the night. But watch out they will not eat your gumdrop buttons!

Good luck!
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Welcome to Shrek Mafia, (...)

You are

Pinocchio, town aligned

. There seems to be betrayal on the move! As you are the most honest one of them, you have asked to investigate these matters. During the night, you may target a player. You will found out that players alignment. Oh nose, they won't lie to you!

Good luck!
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Welcome to Shrek Mafia, (...)

You are

Queen Lillian, mafia aligned

. Together with Dragon (...), you have planned to destroy the fairytale creatures for their betrayal! Your mind was poisoned when you first kissed Harold. They changed your way of life. Betrayal of the highest standard. Together with Dragon, you must decide who will go and kill someone. Make sure all these traitors die! Also, during the night, you may target a non-mafia player to protect them from harm. This may seem useless now, but it might be valuable at some point.

Good luck!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Welcome to Shrek Mafia, (...)

You are

King Harold, town aligned

. There seems to be betrayal on the move! As your influence around the kingdom is great, you must save those who are most valuable to you. During the night, you may send me a pm with a name. You will protect that player during the night.

Good luck!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Welcome to Shrek Mafia, (...)

You are

Dragon, mafia aligned

. Together with Queen Lillian (...), you have planned to destroy the fairytale creatures for their deeds. Letting you get killed for a silly princess? Why would you want to sacrefice yourself for such a low action. Murder those who made this up. Together with Queen Lillian, you must decide who will go and kill someone. Make sure all these traitors die! Also, during the night, you may target a player. If that player was a doctor, that player will not protect that player.

Good luck!
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Welcome to Shrek Mafia, (...)

You are

Artie, town aligned

. There seems to be betrayal on the move! As you are no fairy-tale creature, you can innoticly sneak behind enemy lines. Would you? Nah, you're to cowardly for that. During the night, you may protect someone from harm.

Good luck!
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Welcome to Shrek Mafia, (...)

You are

Merlin, town aligned

. There seems to be betrayal in the kingdom. Your great powers can now be put at use. During the night, you may send me a pm with a name. You will protect that player.

Good luck!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Welcome to Shrek Mafia, (...)

You are

Wolf, town aligned

. There seems to be betrayal in fairytale land! You must sneak upon everyone and found out what they do. During the night, you may send a pm with a name. You will find out who that player targeted during the night.

Good luck!
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Nighttargets:

N1:
1. inHimshallibe ------------------
2. Mirth No target received
3. Haschel Cedricson Protects Jex
4. DeliciousGoldfish No target
5. Adam The Amazing Tracks Jex == Adam
6. 007flash No target received
7. Grek No target received
8. camisade Investigated InHim == town
9. Jex Tracks Adam == Jex
10. Pug89 Protects Nox
11. benhalkum -----------------
12. Nox No target received

N2:
1. Glork ------------------
2. Mirth Protect Glork
3. Haschel Cedricson Protects Oman
4. DeliciousGoldfish Kill Glork == Fails
5. FearieLord Tracks Goldfish == Glork
6. Zindaras Protects Dead Rikimaru
8. Mexal Investigated Haschel == Town
9. Jex Tracks Pug89 == Mirth
10. Pug89 Protect Mirth
11. Dead Rikimaru -----------------
12. Oman Kills Jex

N3:
1. Glork ------------------
2. Mirth Protect Dead Rikimaru
3. Haschel Cedricson Protects Glork
4. DeliciousGoldfish Kill Pug89 == success
5. FearieLord Tracks Zindie == Mirth
6. Zindaras Kill DeliciousGoldfish, Protect Mirth
8. Mexal Investigated Zindaras == Scum
10. Pug89 Protect Haschel Cedricson
11. Dead Rikimaru -----------------

Additional Notes

The basis of the game was to have alot of doctor confusion.
- There were 5 doctors, in which 4 were pro-town. If two doctors would protect the same player, that player would immediatly die.
- There were two trackers, who were nigh useless towards scum. If scum used their secondary nighttargets, the trackers wouldn't detect their nightkill.
- There was one vigilant, who would be unable to kill mafia members.
- There was one cop, who was one of the few certain things which would work correctly, though not against the survivors.
- There were two hidden survivors, who were masons. I put these in because I was curious how a pair of survivors would play instead of one. They also had a chance to continue to destroy the town if the mafia would be eliminated too early.
- There was one scum with a doctor ability, which would be obviously hinting that there was a doc theme and they would be prepared. The actual reason to put it in was to give the scum an additional kill if targeted the same player
- There was one scum with a docblocking ability, which would come in handy if there was to much organisation after a massclaim, simply to break open a gap.

Overall, I expected more from this game. The scum would've had more of a chance if they played it better. Especially Oman's dumb move to claim docblocker, which indicated obvious scum to me, seemed the downfall for the scum. After evaluation, I think I wouldn't have made the masons come up town. Any further questions can off course be asked.

[Zindaras]

This was worse than Harry Potter Mafia.

In my opinion, there was simply no way that Mexal was Sane. I mean, seriously, how bad do you want it to get? Vigilante, 5 docs (or so I believe. Grek, Jex, Haschel, Mirth, Pug), a sane cop and a tracker. I expected the Tracker during the mass claim, but that was pretty much it. Then there's the supposed confirmed mason-buddies, who are really survivors who turn up town in investigation. Really good lynches. Seriously, if the Survivors are the so-called balancing factors (which they pretty much have to be, looking at the rest of the setup), they have to be lynchable, which they flat-out aren't if they come up town in investigations.

I had such awesome luck, too. The guy I replaced failed to send in a kill on Night Zero (that has to be a record of failure), I was busy at the most important time of the game (the doc-claim. I knew we had a doc-based game from the moment I was aware of the roles we had. It was just a matter of timing a believable claim), which gave Mirth the brownie points of first claimed Doc or at least weakened my claim, and my buddy claimed an untenable claim (I thought it was an auto-lynch, personally).

In the end, I figured we had a Traitor and that Glork was that Traitor (if only because he was playing like scum), but I guess we didn't have that luck either.

Day Three, I just decided to have some fun before Mexal claimed a scum investigation on me (he was dripping breadcrumbs all over the place).

I'm sure we'll find out that Mexal was, after all, a random cop, after which I will go into cardiac arrest due to anger over this unbelievable stroke of bad luck.

[Zindaras]

Oh, well, at least I'm spared of that. I still think the game was impossible to win for us.

[KaleiÐoscøpe]

The scum had bad luck, i agree with that, especially involving the docs (the docs never targeted the same person). And after evaluation, the masons shouldn't have come up town. But claiming docblocker was just really dumb.

[Oman]

yeah it was...that two docs kills rule should've at least been made known to the scum. They could've used it as a real help.

[KaleiÐoscøpe]

The doc ability from Zindaras which indicates he could only protect townie's and hinted that it would be usefull, should've ringed some bells at least.

[Mirth]

...had I known you didnt get my night 1 pm (i did send one) for protecting InHim, I probably wouldn't have been defending him so much to begin with, so that turned out lucky.

So, basically, what you're saying is that if Glork and DR wanted, they could have just continued the game and had the rest of us lynch eachother? Wouldn't that be sort of pointless though? Since that could backfire on them? Also, was there a specific reason why Lillian and Dragon were mafia? (I was trying to figure out what theme with characters was for like ever. I like patterns.)

[Zindaras]

[quote="KaleiÐoscøpe"]But claiming docblocker was just really dumb.[/quote]

It made me a sad, sad, kitten.

All the possible things to profit from where hidden. I was forced to kill Goldie during Night 3 to keep him from reducing the numbers against me. I was forced to use my doc protection the way I wanted it to. Due to the mass-claim, the double-doc protection was completely unviable, and, even had I known that I could help along myself, protecting Mexal would still screw me over, as Faerie would've tracked me to Mexal.

I thought a long time about my kill during Day Two. I had to kill Faerie because he could track me to a murder (I later found out this wasn't the case). I had to kill Mexal, because he was going to investigate me as scum, but I couldn't really kill him, since it'd point at me. I had to kill the confirmed Masons, as they had the potential to screw me over. I had to kill the Cop, as his confirmed townies would screw me over. I had to kill the docs, as their protections could screw me over. I had to kill the Vig, as her kills would screw me over by reducing the pool of lynch targets.

It was an impossible decision.

Also, by the way, the town was

way

too quick to confirm people as pro-town based on claims and other information. You made a boatload of dangerous assumptions, and I was unfortunately not in the position to point them out (as I kinda had to survive).

[KaleiÐoscøpe]

So they could win on their own. They realised it could backfire, which is why I think they didn't do it. The characters for scum were randomly decided (random.org).

[Zindaras]

[quote="KaleiÐoscøpe"]The doc ability from Zindaras which indicates he could only protect townie's and hinted that it would be usefull, should've ringed some bells at least.[/quote]

And how am I supposed to interpret that line? It's useful, so I'm immediately going to think that it means that people that are double-protected die? My interpretation was that it would be a good fake-claim, and when I got your Tracker explanation, I figured it was that (the inclusion of a Vig could confirm me as Doc).

And killing Doc isn't really that good a role for scum if there are Trackers on the loose. I mean, I protect someone, they suddenly turn up dead, a Tracker tracked me there. That's not a good position to be found in as scum.

[Oman]

ZOMG, zindy is back to good avi!

[Mirth]

Also, by the way, the town was

way

too quick to confirm people as pro-town based on claims and other information. You made a boatload of dangerous assumptions, and I was unfortunately not in the position to point them out (as I kinda had to survive).

I am totally guilty of this, as I didn't realize it was a doc theme game and that the mod didn't get my night 1 pm. So I spent it assuming that my protect on Glork meant he was town, since it seemed inconcievable to me that the mafia would fail to send in a target and I wasn't expecting 5 doctors.

I must say though, while amusing, this game was heavily unbalanced and didn't really give the scum much of a chance once we broke it.

[Mexal]

Ya, well done town. I should've claimed roleblocker, why didn't I claim roleblocker!

Anyway, why pick Zindaras for the investigate?

Two reasons.

1. I was suspicious of him. I couldn't pin down why but my whole argument with him at the beginning of day 2 rang false to me. He was right in what he said but his jumping all over me for something seemingly minor seemed opportunistic.

2. Process of elimination. Pug would have been a bad play because he already had a lot of suspicion on him plus if he was town, he doens't help the town anyway. Zindaras and FaerieLord were the only other two options and I was more suspicious of Zindaras.

Add 1 + 2 and you get Zindaras.

I haven't read the other stuff yet so I'll comment on that as I read.

[Mexal]

Mirth, what other information could we have milked?

[KaleiÐoscøpe]

And how am I supposed to interpret that line? It's useful, so I'm immediately going to think that it means that people that are double-protected die? My interpretation was that it would be a good fake-claim, and when I got your Tracker explanation, I figured it was that (the inclusion of a Vig could confirm me as Doc).

You are right.

And killing Doc isn't really that good a role for scum if there are Trackers on the loose. I mean, I protect someone, they suddenly turn up dead, a Tracker tracked me there. That's not a good position to be found in as scum.

There would be two doctors involved in this, not just you.

I must say though, while amusing, this game was heavily unbalanced and didn't really give the scum much of a chance once we broke it.

It broke the game mainly because the town lucked out on many levels. The docblocker was dead and the doctors didn't target the same player before (and after) the massclaim, which didn't give the scum the indication of the use of their doc role (FYI: people who got double docced would come up dead with their cause of death being treated with too much care)

[Dead Rikimaru]

I had to kill the confirmed Masons, as they had the potential to screw me over.

Actually if you had killed one of us, the other would have turned into a mafiate.
I feel there was chance the game could have turned in your way.

If we didn't direct nightactions, two docs could have protected the cop and the cop would have died.

+1 to directing nightactions after a mass claim.

[Dead Rikimaru]

He just wanted to survive.

Ping, ping, pingping, pingpingping. Sorry thats my breadcrumb-o-meter.

Your breadcrumb-o-meter was right.
I said this in case claiming survivor were need afterwards.

[Glork]

I find it strange that you accused me of "playing like scum," Zindaras, because I think that's almost exactly how I would have played had I been strictly protown. The last (and only other) time I was a Survivor, I decided to just play a protown game and stick it out, and it worked then, too. The only thing I think I did differently was "clear" too many players, but that's part of being a Survivor -- you want to make friends, not enemies.

[Dead Rikimaru]

I think possibly my only mistake was in naming my mason-partner specifically.

You never fooled me.
It was no mistake.
You named me as your mason partner because masons are easy targets, and putting a target on my back as well increased YOUR chance of surviving.

[Glork]

Oh it was absolutely intentional, DR, but I wasn't going to reveal

that

to the town. I'm glad I managed to make it look more panicked and reactionary, though, because it became perfectly believable/understandable that I would "screw up" and name you, too.


I was trying to decide what to do had you actually been killed... would I claim to be a Survivor as well, or would I profess bastard-modding and state that my PM only said you were "not scum"?
I had tentatively opted for the latter, but either one seemed touchy to me. I'm glad it didn't come pu.

[Mexal]

Ahh, so many roles I've never played with before. Fun fun. I wouldn't know what to think had you claimed Survivor cause I've neer seen it before.

[Dead Rikimaru]

I think this could have been a balanced game. The problem is that the setup depended on luck to achieve balance.
If docs protected the same person there would have been more deaths, and if a mason died the other would turn into scum.
Also, the masons could have decided to become scum by endgame, but without nightkills and having to win by lynching the others the chances were slim, so winning by default as survivors was almost the ONLY choice.
If Zindaras and Oman were informed of those mechanics, they could have benefited from the mass claim (they could kill me and have the cop cleared Glork join them) and from nigtaction directing (having two docs protect the cop just to be sure)
Also, bad bad bad claim, Oman. You would be better claiming doc too.

Thanks for the game, Scope. In the end winning as a survivor was a bit harder than winning as a townie. I'm glad FL was NOT scum, since he could have thought killing a mason would be a better idea.