Newbie 1732 [Game Over!]: InnocentVille

[shannon]

Astral Flare - No one else is really sticking out to me as scummy at this point, I think I'll go re-read everything.

PEdit: Actually Chrimi makes an interesting point about the misrep. And this part he quoted from AF is kinda hilariously dramatic
"You will explain this contradiction, along with giving the usernames of all your other alts, if you want this vote to be elsewhere today."

[Chrimi]

Astral Flare - No one else is really sticking out to me as scummy at this point, I think I'll go re-read everything.

PEdit: Actually Chrimi makes an interesting point about the misrep. And this part he quoted from AF is kinda hilariously dramatic
"You will explain this contradiction, along with giving the usernames of all your other alts, if you want this vote to be elsewhere today."

That's why I was having trouble taking it seriously and laughing for the whole page.

[PenguinPower]

PP: Why aren't you voting? You said in Post 147 that you were unvoting your RVS but wasn't voting as you had nowhere better to place it. And yet, you read Chrimi as scum in the very same post.

Because of post 81:

I believe Chrimi is at L-2 but I'm not certain; I'd recommend not voting her until we get another vote count.

I assumed that was implosion acting in IC capacity.

[Chrimi]

PP: Why aren't you voting? You said in Post 147 that you were unvoting your RVS but wasn't voting as you had nowhere better to place it. And yet, you read Chrimi as scum in the very same post.

Because of post 81:

I believe Chrimi is at L-2 but I'm not certain; I'd recommend not voting her until we get another vote count.

I assumed that was implosion acting in IC capacity.

So Penguin, the way cases work is you give a bunch of examples and reasoning for why you think someone is scummy.
If that person defends against

literally every single one of your points,

you have two options.

1. Refute their rebuttal, make more points
2. Accept their defense against your points as satisfactory and drop it

You are doing neither. You seem to accept that your points were invalid, yet you hold your scumread and case over me as "Well, it's a general gut feeling of all your posts in general. They just give me this

vibe

, mannnn." I would appreciate if you made some actual points, or dropped it because you get no information from lynching someone with no case or actual points against them.

[PenguinPower]

I have dropped it (post 162)). Do you see my vote on you?

I have new thoughts based on interactions between that post and now, but I would like some answers to my questions before I firm those up.

[Chrimi]

I have dropped it (post 162)). Do you see my vote on you?

Yet you answered AstralFlare's question to "why aren't you voting?" with "Chrimi's at L-2 and the IC says we shouldn't vote her until there's a vote count."

PP: Why aren't you voting? You said in Post 147 that you were unvoting your RVS but wasn't voting as you had nowhere better to place it. And yet, you read Chrimi as scum in the very same post.

Because of post 81:

I believe Chrimi is at L-2 but I'm not certain; I'd recommend not voting her until we get another vote count.

I assumed that was implosion acting in IC capacity.

You're implying that once the votecount happens, you will vote me (or that you would be voting me if implosion didn't say what he did).

[Chrimi]

Also penguin, sorry for being quiet. I was a bit busy yesterday, but am more free for now. Question: Are you still voting for AstralFlare (I couldn't find an unvote skimming thorough the archive, please correct me if my info there is wring)? If so, why?

I'm not. It was an RVS vote. I am currently withholding my vote until the next vote count.

This doesn't sound anything like you've dropped it.

So give a real response to this please:

So Penguin, the way cases work is you give a bunch of examples and reasoning for why you think someone is scummy.
If that person defends against

literally every single one of your points,

you have two options.

1. Refute their rebuttal, make more points
2. Accept their defense against your points as satisfactory and drop it

You are doing neither. You seem to accept that your points were invalid, yet you hold your scumread and case over me as "Well, it's a general gut feeling of all your posts in general. They just give me this

vibe

, mannnn." I would appreciate if you made some actual points, or dropped it because you get no information from lynching someone with no case or actual points against them.

[PenguinPower]

Yet you answered AstralFlare's question to "why aren't you voting?" with "Chrimi's at L-2 and the IC says we shouldn't vote her until there's a vote count."

He brought up my comment in 147, which I was addressing. At that time, the only reason I wasn't voting you

was

because of what the IC said. Up until 175 that was still the case.

Between 147 and now there have been a few things that have made me rethink my positions, which also include my position on you.

[Chrimi]

Yet you answered AstralFlare's question to "why aren't you voting?" with "Chrimi's at L-2 and the IC says we shouldn't vote her until there's a vote count."

He brought up my comment in 147, which I was addressing. At that time, the only reason I wasn't voting you

was

because of what the IC said. Up until 175 that was still the case.

Between 147 and now there have been a few things that have made me rethink my positions, which also include my position on you.

Ah, alright.

I appreciate the clarification. :b

[thenewearth]

Well someone's not fixing herself

[AstralFlare]

@IC: How do you differentiate between anti-town townie and anti-town scummie?

Because I'm having a hard time deciding which Chrimi is right now.

[Chrimi]

@IC: How do you differentiate between anti-town townie and anti-town scummie?

Because I'm having a hard time deciding which Chrimi is right now.

I don't appreciate the needless hostility nor the animosity. Try again?

[Chrimi]

@IC: How do you differentiate between anti-town townie and anti-town scummie?

Because I'm having a hard time deciding which Chrimi is right now.

Answering your questions directly and pointing out your misrep is anti-town.. how? :u

Just because you disagree with someone (or can't seem to understand what they're talking about) doesn't make them anti-town.

[Chrimi]

In fact, the whole:
"You said you were trying to cause discussion and then joking is a contradiction!!" is just a misrep too.

I said me voting myself and scumclaiming was to cause discussion, me unvoting and saying "Spooky, I don't want to be at L-2!" was a joke. When you started claiming it was scummy, I said I was doing both- Of course, you assumed I meant I was doing both about the former, excluding the latter entirely.

Of course, scum will jump on anything to make a wagon out of..

[Jibs]

Hello Astral!

I liked your response in 190--very proportionate.

I'm sorry as well, but I don't see a contradiction.

My point was that you said that Chrimi was good on page three and then quoted some of her posts from page three as examples of deflection. The fact that you clearly don't care earns you some townpoints.

Jibs: The Rocnix townread. The one thing in your analyses I'm scratching my head over. Explain.

It is a mystery to me as well, my friend. I remember thinking that 161, and especially the reads on you and Chrimi, felt town. In general, I have been very suspicious of the people voting/pushing Chrimi, but unable to clear imp/Chrimi/tne. That probably clouds my judgement a little bit.

How certain are you about Chrimi being scum? I really would like to see your perspective on the rest of the game, especially if you have a <50% scumread.

[Jibs]

Hello 0x!

It sure seems like a lot of people are scumreading you for little or no reason. What's up with that? Is it a mafia plot?

Out of me, shannon, imp, and rocnix, who is most likely to be scum?

VOTE: 0x40

I think that's L-2?

[0x40]

I don't think that hiding an alt is really particularly harmful to the town

meta is not the end-all be-all

It's still anti-town, and therefore it's indicative of being scum. Even if it's just a minor scumtell, it's not like we have much else to go by at this point in the game.

when you say:

The only legitimate reason for town to hide information is if the information is more beneficial to scum than to town, which is obviously not the case here.

it's based on a false premise that hiding that information has to be based on the motivation of trying to win this game, rather than motivated by out-of-game reasons or in this case not really motivated by anything in particular (I really have a hard time doubting Chrimi when she says that she simply didin't find listing the hydra account relevant).

This has to be one of the most ridiculous arguments I've ever seen from an IC. This is based on a false premise that Chrimi cares so little about winning the game for town that she's using out-of-game reasons to justify making an anti-town play, which by the way, would even go against the site rule of "Play to win the game."

[0x40]

The whole ISO is basically pushing Chrimi over absolutely nothing.

Hiding information that could help town and not even giving a good reason for doing so is "absolutely nothing" to you? Can you explain why that is? If you care at all about finding scum, it's a little bit strange to call this "absolutely nothing."

[0x40]

0x40, it appears you're now the target of two people's suspicion. I'm sure shannon has her own questions, but in the meantime...
What did you make of Chrimi's reaction and thenewearth's nonreaction to your accusations? Did your interpretation change when it became apparent that we're not going to lynch them for having alts?

I think the most scummy part about Chrimi's reaction is her refusal to explain why she can't just give the username instead of making such a big deal about it. thenewearth at least gave a reason for not giving the usernames of her alts, and even if it's a bullshit out-of-game reason that in my opinion should get her permabanned from the site, it's at least a reason that kinda makes sense.

My interpretation never changed when it became apparent that we're not going to lynch someone just for a minor reason like that, because that was apparent from the very beginning. I do however think that this, along with the refusal to give a good reason, makes Chrimi the best lynch candidate over anyone else at this point, and that is why my vote will remain on Chirmi for the rest of the day or until gives the username or a reason for why she can't.

[Chrimi]

0x40, it appears you're now the target of two people's suspicion. I'm sure shannon has her own questions, but in the meantime...
What did you make of Chrimi's reaction and thenewearth's nonreaction to your accusations? Did your interpretation change when it became apparent that we're not going to lynch them for having alts?

I think the most scummy part about Chrimi's reaction is her refusal to explain why she can't just give the username instead of making such a big deal about it. thenewearth at least gave a reason for not giving the usernames of her alts, and even if it's a bullshit out-of-game reason that in my opinion should get her permabanned from the site, it's at least a reason that kinda makes sense.

My interpretation never changed when it became apparent that we're not going to lynch someone just for a minor reason like that, because that was apparent from the very beginning. I do however think that this, along with the refusal to give a good reason, makes Chrimi the best lynch candidate over anyone else at this point, and that is why my vote will remain on Chirmi for the rest of the day or until gives the username or a reason for why she can't.

I already gave you a reason why I can't. Remove your vote, or find a

real

reason why I'm scummy.

[Chrimi]

You pressuring people into revealing who their alts are and being rude about it is much more likely to result in a permaban than thenewearth refusing to share information they aren't required to share.

I recommend you read the rules again.

[thenewearth]

http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?tit ... te_account

Why are we not linking the wiki page of it

And why are we still talking about it?

[0x40]

0x40: Same as Chrimi, but thoughts on people besides Chrimi.

Out of me, shannon, imp, and rocnix, who is most likely to be scum?

I'm gonna read the thread again more thoroughly when I get home, but as for now, nothing from them really stands out as all that AI to me. I have a very minor townread on Jibs, implosion, and Rocnix, because those 3 have contributed the most so far in my opinion, so shannon would be the scummiest out of those, but not by much.

[0x40]

I already gave you a reason why I can't. Remove your vote, or find a real reason why I'm scummy.

What reason? And saying that your meta is useless is not a valid reason, because that's simply not true.

[Chrimi]

I already gave you a reason why I can't. Remove your vote, or find a real reason why I'm scummy.

What reason? And saying that your meta is useless is not a valid reason, because that's simply not true.

1. There are many players who believe meta is bogus.
2. Alternate accounts are made to try different playstyles, or to enjoy people not knowing who your main is.
3. Me giving the username(s) of my alt(s) is completely pointless and doesn't help town or scum.