Mini Normal 1825 - Game Over

[Naomi-Tan]

Naomi, just let me talk to him xD

Never!!!!

But sure thing I'll just see where your going with this with interest until I have some questions of my own.

[golden009]

I'm not very satisfied by her quoting from her initial post, no. It still feels like she's setting up a get-out-of-jail-free card to escape suspicion if she does some anti-town things.

[Accountant]

VC 1.03

RyanK (1)

: gameplay506

gameplay506 (5)

: rb, Cass, RyanK, Martha Zolanski, Dierfire

Naomi-Tan (1)

: golden009

Martha Zolanski

: pitoli

Not Voting:

Glitch, Comparing Realities, Saru, Naomi-Tan, Chuck

With 13 alive, the majority is 7.

The deadline is in (expired on 2016-09-07 16:06:30)

[Naomi-Tan]

I'm not very satisfied by her quoting from her initial post, no. It still feels like she's setting up a get-out-of-jail-free card to escape suspicion if she does some anti-town things.

Yes. thats just what i'm doing. Because I know i'm going to do it.

[gameplay506]

ok time for me to respond to that god awful "case"
I feel like its pretty needless to do so because I just skimmed over the last 3 pages and seeing the reasons and speed at which my wagon developed its pretty obv its scum motivated lol
but I promised to show you how shit you guys are so Imma do it just now

[pitoli]

I'm not very satisfied by her quoting from her initial post, no. It still feels like she's setting up a get-out-of-jail-free card to escape suspicion if she does some anti-town things.

I have a feeling it may just be a null, something she could pull as any alignment. She had a similar introduction in Mini 1625, where she was town.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 1#p6382331

[gameplay506]

Ok so lets start with the VI.
I should just warn you to pay no attention to my language

1.Gameplay really wants to look relaxed and jovial with his banter but he's not relaxed and jovial. I told people to sheep me, but I didn't try to cut down anyone's input. 2.aGameplay is trying to cut down my input very early, where he can see that I'm probably going to be a very active player and also likely to be townread and hard to lynch because I've got sass and know how to argue a point.2b He's trying to discredit me as early as RVS, as opposed to just being joking and jovial like town normally do in RVS.

Where do I start with this shit.
1. How did you reach that conclusion?
2a. I have never played with you and never had any interest in you so thus: how would I be supposed to know that you were going to be universally townread as you claim/have sass which makes you hard to lynch/be able to argue a point? Wtf are you even getting those arguments from?
2b. I never discredited you. The slug thing was a joke fyi. The gut thing wasn't. Simply because I disagree with you and your way of making reads doesn't mean I am discrediting you. Not to mention that gut isn't reliable at all so I am at my right to say that its shitty to call people town/scum on page 2 based off gut.
So what do I get from all this shiat: RB has an ego problem - he thinks he is too good at mafia, he can't take criticism and got butthurt by my comments. Being the immature thing he is he decided that if I go against him I must be scum. Newbshit at its best.
On the other hand his whole attitude screams town - this one is p damn hard to fake. So given his nonsense arguments and my town read on him I labeled him VI. And just so you know I ain't discreditting you, you did this to yourself with that content of

It doesn't interest gameplay because he doesn't want people to be playing optimal strategy. Scum hate it when I do this because it forces a dichotomy they simply cannot avoid. They either sheep me or they go against me, and either one draws attention. They either need good reasons to go against me (and there are none right now because it's so early) or good reasons to go with me - but then I'm forcing them to play a good town strategy, so they naturally rebel. This is why I'll probably be NK'd early this game because I'm always NK'd early as town because scum just hate me.

More ego problems. You didn't propose any optimal strategy in your posts.

I'm like those diet pill Google ads that say, "DOCTORS HATE HIM!!!" except I'm a mafia player and instead of doctors it's the scum that hate me.

More ego problems of a 12 year old.
Basically what your case is all about (tldr): I am always right, scum either go against me or with me because I am always right, gameplay has a bad reason to go against me(discredits me because he thinks gut is unreliable) so he is scum
Like go yourself

This is also how scum very often respond to my play - because I bait people into doing things and then turn on them. It's very common for people to think I'm AtE'ing or OMGUS'ing or something, which is an unfortunate side-effect of the way I play but I still do it.

Talk about yourself more please
Then I get some pro advice about wallfighting ty RB I really needed advice from a VI with ego problems.

This is why RB is shittown
Now to scum on my wagon in my next post

[gameplay506]

Its actually pretty sad how obvious scum are and how blindly newbs sheep.

Why ryan is scum:
So lets start off a little bit far. Why do I shittalk in RVS. I shit talk in RVS because every so often there is this bad/new scum player who still doesn't know how to play scum and fake reads, arguments especially and go on hanging onto every single little obvious thing as if its scum claiming they are scum. That's basically why I produce that much shiat at the beginning.
Ryan did exactly that to rb:

Which one of us?

You because of the post below:

Don't worry, I have the charisma and ability to make the Ryan wagon strong. You'll still get your mislynch today

Why's that scummy?

You seem to be trying to get a mislynch. You even stated so yourself.

An example at its best.

Then when he sees that he can side with rb instead of going against him( the hard way) he chooses the opportunistic way:

This is also how scum very often respond to my play - because I bait people into doing things and then turn on them. It's very common for people to think I'm AtE'ing or OMGUS'ing or something, which is an unfortunate side-effect of the way I play but I still do it.

Thanks to my questioning, I've just destroyed that side effect. Actually all you needed to prevent people from thinking so is explaining yourself, although some strategies can't be used once you do so.

Anyway, rb, you've convinced me.
VOTE: gameplay506

Red lights. Fake af.

...
Speaking of LAMIST; the setup tells us that scum have day talk if you missed it, so please bare that in mind over the game.

Naomi-Tan, how did you know scum has day talk?
VOTE: Naomi-Tan

Fos:

gameplay506

Dumbtelling.

The other 2 scum can forfeit if they want.

How do you know there is a total of 3 scum?

Dumbtelling once again. This one is more obvious because the setup was advertised as 10-3 so.

All his other posts are fluff and nothing more. He is the one where my vote is staying atm and I don't inted to change it.
Now the others on my wagon:

Ok, I'll try this sheeping thing... see what happens

UNVOTE: Comparing realities
VOTE: Gameplay506

Really a serious vote though, gameplays responses so far seem seriously off. And to my own surprise, I'm starting to like rb's style a lot more.

This is ok. Especially after he backed it up later saying what he found off about my responses.

Agreed.

VOTE: Gameplay

Shall we wait for him to defend himself?

Why?

Hello everyone! It's nice to see some familiar names, and some new friends as well.

I am liking the look of this wagon on gameplay506.

VOTE: gameplay506

Principally this is a Town read on rb more than a Mafia read on gameplay506.
I don't like the entrance from golden009 in 84, as he fails to comment on the wagon, which to me appears to be the most important feature of the game thus far.
I see something somewhat similar by Martha in 71, but this is partially mitigated by 79, 82, and 92.
I don't mind the reactions from pitoli (98) or Naomi-Tan (119), which address the matter directly.

Still conflicted on that one.

[Naomi-Tan]

I'm not very satisfied by her quoting from her initial post, no. It still feels like she's setting up a get-out-of-jail-free card to escape suspicion if she does some anti-town things.

I have a feeling it may just be a null, something she could pull as any alignment. She had a similar introduction in Mini 1625, where she was town.

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 1#p6382331

Huh looks like I did that in my past neat. I didn't even realise.

Pedit; to be honest im also scum reading RyanK because he didn't really look like he was thinking about what rb was saying..

[gameplay506]

I don't intend to look into more posts tonight unless someone wants me to comment on something specifically.
I came here to prove why there are basically 0 arguments on mescum and who is scum. I think I did that.

Some notes from my skimming over the game:
I like Martha's questioning.
Naomi seems genuinely confused so I like her as well.
I have pitoli in my leaning town list too.

[Naomi-Tan]

I don't intend to look into more posts tonight unless someone wants me to comment on something specifically.
I came here to prove why there are basically 0 arguments on mescum and who is scum. I think I did that.

Some notes from my skimming over the game:
I like Martha's questioning.
Naomi seems genuinely confused so I like her as well.
I have pitoli in my leaning town list too.

Confused like a fox!
But I would like you to comment about anything else of note. lack of activity will only inspire more votes not reduce them and if you can find more to talk about that would be swell. I understand how so much pressure can be demotivating but You gotta stay strong.

[gameplay506]

xd
you are so sweet
but yes I got demotivated but not because of pressure but because of how easily people sheep everything that has been dressed in nice talking even if at its core its basically thin air
I will read more but its currently 12 am here so I didn't want to promise anything

[pitoli]

I am liking the look of this wagon on gameplay506.

VOTE: gameplay506

Principally this is a Town read on rb more than a Mafia read on gameplay506.

Still conflicted on that one.

I personally don't like it. Can you talk to me a little bit about your thoughts?

[Naomi-Tan]

I am liking the look of this wagon on gameplay506.

VOTE: gameplay506

Principally this is a Town read on rb more than a Mafia read on gameplay506.

Still conflicted on that one.

I personally don't like it. Can you talk to me a little bit about your thoughts?

Personally I find that post kinda weird but not scummy like they talk about a few people I just wish they had added more too it, seems half done, if that makes sense.

[gameplay506]

I guess you want my thoughts about Dier's vote?
Why I dislike it: It just seems opportunistic and like setting up for whatever situations happens. Meaning that there is a wagon forming on me, he jumps on it. Yet he says " I don't particulary scumread gameplay, I just find him less town compared to rb". How I understand it "if gameplay manages to defend himself and the wagon begins to dissolve I will jump off on the basis of gameplay becoming as equally town as rb". I don't think whether you can understand me because english isn't my primary language but its basically something among those lines.

[gameplay506]

Ye just like naomi said it is missing something because I can't quite understand based on what he is actually voting

[Naomi-Tan]

So now Gameplay has spoken I'd like to hear from all those voting for him and how they feel about there vote now.

[pitoli]

Personally I find that post kinda weird but not scummy like they talk about a few people I just wish they had added more too it, seems half done, if that makes sense.

Naomi, this is how I scumhunt. There's no rule that says I have to explicitly reveal everything I think about a subject before I ask questions. If I do that, then it's playing into scum hands. They already know what I am thinking and then can say what they think I might want to hear.

[Dierfire]

@pitoli

I don't recall playing any prior games with rb, and I have no special confidence in my ability to read rb compared to any other player.

Okay. What makes him your strongest townread?

I'm working with these posts.

Spoiler: These Posts

VOTE: Ryan

gameplay is good at the game, we're sheeping her now.

Everyone aboard the Ryan train, this is optimal townplay.

See you're right our interaction is scummy, you're wrong about the scum. It was optimal because I think I could have got more than 1 scum to get on your wagon and then we can counter-wagon on scum later in the day. It sounds dumb but it actually works pretty well. Gameplay is the scum you're looking for. You should vote gameplay.

VOTE: gameplay

The sudden switch from the wagon on RyanK to to gameplay506 is confident and aggressive; it's an attempt to break out of RVS and move the game forward. This is a good move that helps Town, and one that Mafia players have relatively low incentive to make at this point in the game. On this basis, I read rb as Town.

[pitoli]

@Dierfire:

You said you didn't have a strong read on gameplay when you cast your vote. How about now that he's confronted the case/wagon on him?

[Naomi-Tan]

Personally I find that post kinda weird but not scummy like they talk about a few people I just wish they had added more too it, seems half done, if that makes sense.

Naomi, this is how I scumhunt. There's no rule that says I have to explicitly reveal everything I think about a subject before I ask questions. If I do that, then it's playing into scum hands. They already know what I am thinking and then can say what they think I might want to hear.

Well, I don't like this. I feel being open is important and sharing information and digging for more information will always be useful even If I can't do anything with the information personally. Sure scum can play around this but I think that unless they are carful it'll be kinda obvious such as when I woke up Martha went and commented how I was townie which seemed off to be at the time (like they was saying it to improve my view of them. I feel that if your open your more effective, then again If I wasn't open I'd probably be killed for my strange play-style.

Pedit; I already asked that don't steal my thunder

[gameplay506]

How about now that he's

destroyed

the case/wagon on him?

Anyway gold doesn't seem any good atm
@Martha I wanna know why since you placed a vote on me out of the blue without any reasoning and then expressed suspicion of pitoli did you still keep your vote? Especially since you admitted that you are most likely just sheeping.

This is why I am voting for Gameplay. Probably me is sheeping

And your reasoning was me over reacting?

[pitoli]

Personally I find that post kinda weird but not scummy like they talk about a few people I just wish they had added more too it, seems half done, if that makes sense.

Naomi, this is how I scumhunt. There's no rule that says I have to explicitly reveal everything I think about a subject before I ask questions. If I do that, then it's playing into scum hands. They already know what I am thinking and then can say what they think I might want to hear.

Well, I don't like this. I feel being open is important and sharing information and digging for more information will always be useful even If I can't do anything with the information personally. Sure scum can play around this but I think that unless they are carful it'll be kinda obvious such as when I woke up Martha went and commented how I was townie which seemed off to be at the time (like they was saying it to improve my view of them. I feel that if your open your more effective, then again If I wasn't open I'd probably be killed for my strange play-style.

You don't like it because it's scummy or because it's a different playstyle from yours?

I'm open with what I feel like benefits town at the time. By the end of the day everybody will have a sense of what my reads are, and all the information in my mind will be out on the table.

I feel like I've been pretty open about my reads so far.

[Dierfire]

@gameplay506

I guess you want my thoughts about Dier's vote?
Why I dislike it: It just seems opportunistic and like setting up for whatever situations happens. Meaning that there is a wagon forming on me, he jumps on it. Yet he says " I don't particulary scumread gameplay, I just find him less town compared to rb". How I understand it "if gameplay manages to defend himself and the wagon begins to dissolve I will jump off on the basis of gameplay becoming as equally town as rb". I don't think whether you can understand me because english isn't my primary language but its basically something among those lines.

You are precisely correct about my intentions; I am voting for you less because I find you suspicious than because I am reading rb as Town. I'm not sure why it would be a problem if you demonstrate yourself to be Town and I remove my vote.

@Naomi-Tan

@pitoli

So now Gameplay has spoken I'd like to hear from all those voting for him and how they feel about there vote now.

@Dierfire:

You said you didn't have a strong read on gameplay when you cast your vote. How about now that he's confronted the case/wagon on him?

I feel less good about it than I did previously. In particular, the approach to rb demonstrates some continuity from before the switch that I mentioned above (22, 25, 30, 45), which combined with leaving the vote on RyanK means that gameplay506 isn't changing approaches in response to rb (where I might expect that a Mafia player would feel a need to change something). The analysis of votes on the wagon also sounds reasonable to me.

[gameplay506]

You are precisely correct about my intentions; I am voting for you less because I find you suspicious than because I am reading rb as Town. I'm not sure why it would be a problem if you demonstrate yourself to be Town and I remove my vote.

Well wtf is that