Newbie 1741 - Game Over

[Titus]

Great, so according to your own words, we're far out of RVS but you're still joking around?

Also, given your behavior towards my push, my reply details the fact you are phased. That's pretty true. Stop trying to be bigman on campus if you're town. Stop joking around. A joke is ok, but retracting a vote based on its a joke doesn't make any sense. You seem to be doing whatever it is that gets people to like you. Well guess what I like odd balls.

[Dunhallym]

@MorningTweet
you didn't answer my question: why do you defend Titus?

@shaddowez

That's not exactly my question. You answered about the contradiction in your post, but my question was about your original take on Titu's vote. As I said it was pretty clear it was not random so what made you mention it as "possible random"?

How is it clear it wasn't random? It was Titus' first vote of the game, which was the 11th(ish) post of the game, traditionally during RVS (Random Voting Stage). In her own post she says:

We randomly vote until we get a feel for who is scum

I'm not saying it was random as in "I'm going to use random.org and vote for whoever it tells me to"

Fair enough, rereading Titus's post, it's indeed not that clear. I'm clearly biased because in the games I've played elsewhere people suggesting no lynch on day one were sure to get votes, which is also why I don't find Titus's vote that suspicious. Is it different here? However, it is still pretty clear to me that arona also took the vote seriously, as did most other players.


@PapaZito

Meta is dumb. Don't do meta kids it only leads you to bad places.

Oh man thank you for reminding me about this subject whew.

No probs. I think meta can be useful if you are conscious of its/your limitations. And I know a few people that use it very effectively.
As you are tunneling on Titus for a point that is minor to me, and because algebra seems to be the same, I was wondering if this point was particulalrly bad because it is Titus.
Do you have other reads to share?

@Titus

Ok Zito is probably town.

Just need two more town to powerblock through this.

Why do you think Zito is town?

@algebra

@Titus to get out of RVS you need something to happen, so I decided to create that something with my hard push, which you probably suspected when you posed this question

A couple things here. 1) IIRC the game was already out of RVS at that point since there were some serious votes on; 2) as shaddowez already noted you put someone at L-1 without mentioning it; 3) you came back a few minutes later to say we shouldn't lynch Titus so early and try to look for connections first. The combination of 2 and 3 is the thing that bothered me most at the time and made me consider voting you. But the justification you give here, coupled with point 1, and with 4) the fact that I don't really get the impression that you're trying to stir discussion/scum hunt at the moment is worse.
So VOTE: algebra. I believe that's L-2.
BTW, could we get a vote count?

@Titus

Great, so according to your own words, we're far out of RVS but you're still joking around?

Also, given your behavior towards my push, my reply details the fact you are phased. That's pretty true. Stop trying to be bigman on campus if you're town. Stop joking around. A joke is ok, but retracting a vote based on its a joke doesn't make any sense. You seem to be doing whatever it is that gets people to like you. Well guess what I like odd balls.

What do you mean by "phased"? I agree with your point that nn is being agreable to everyone. I have a couple issues with them as well. I'll go next post not to make this one too long.

[Dunhallym]

@nn
Thanks for the av and fair enough for the RL stuff. I've not played in RL in a while and even forgot that in the popular French version of the game I used to play you don't even lynch anyone on day 1.

.
.../

I don't know if I'm being paranoid here or what, but I could potentially see this Titus/Papa Zito business being SvS.
Meh, probably just paranoid really. That's not the talk for now anyways... Everyone hasn't even posted yet...

Probs just paranoid. I think they're just they were just the two most active people so they ended up talking to each other.

I can't explain the feeling but this answer struck me as odd.

/...
@shaddowez @titus why are you voting algebra? Post 48 seems legit to me - lets gather more information before we go into the night.
/...

This initially struck me when I saw algebra was on your scum list in the post I quote below but in retrospect I see that the reason you suspect algebra is not contained in #48. So I just put it here for the record.

So here's where my thoughts are right now. Please chime in if you agree / disagree.

Townie feeling - Dunhallym - entered the game and gave some good analysis on what was going on. This is difficult to do as scum since pretending to do analysis on who is and isn't scum is difficult when you already know the answer.
Townie feeling - Aronagrundy - more of a feeling than anything, but she seems genuine town.

Scummy feeling - Algebra - quick to go along with a lynch vote but isn't offering much in the way of reasoning. Maybe because he knows the people he's putting votes on aren't scum.
Scummy feeling - Titus - five pages in and he won't let go of his scum tell on me. Is it so hard to believe that a newbie would think a no lynch is good?
Scummy feeling - Morning Tweet - post 81 was the tell. Read page three up to post 81. Tweet's analysis comes out of nowhere basically. As I said above it's difficult to do analysis as scum, no?

No reads - everyone else.

Whatever happens, I just want day one to be over. Nothing here is set in stone - I want to see if scum do before I make any concrete conclusions.

OK, so I don't mind the fact that you voted shaddowez or Papa Zito for the joke but I'm more bothered by the fact you left with your vote here when neither of them is among your "scummy feelings". I also don't like much the last sentence. It makes me feel that you have a hard time committing to anything and are ultra cautious. Of course nothing is set in stone on day 1, but you give your thoughts at time T according to what happened so far.
If you were any more experienced that would earn you my vote over algebra. As it is I keep an eye on you.

[Xalxe]

Vote Count 1.2

Be careful what you wish for. Because it probably won't come true, and life is about expectations management.

Titus (3)

: aronagrundy, ecane, algebra

algebra (3)

: shaddowez, Titus, Dunhallym

Papa Zito (2)

: MorningTweet, nn30

Not Voting

: Papa Zito

With 9 alive, it's 5 to lynch.

Deadline

: (expired on 2016-10-02 15:42:07)

[aronagrundy]

Unvote

(Btw I think I was voting for shadow not Titus)

Great, so according to your own words, we're far out of RVS but you're still joking around?

Also, given your behavior towards my push, my reply details the fact you are phased. That's pretty true. Stop trying to be bigman on campus if you're town. Stop joking around. A joke is ok, but retracting a vote based on its a joke doesn't make any sense. You seem to be doing whatever it is that gets people to like you. Well guess what I like odd balls.

Then why are you trying to phase him on purpose?

[aronagrundy]

Btw i unvoted because I'm cool with shaddowez's response to my vote if it wasn't clear

[Papa Zito]

So here's where my thoughts are right now. Please chime in if you agree / disagree.

How can you have 0 read on me? I'm the loudest thing here.

It's because you are not listening that's so frustrating.

I am listening. If I listened any harder my head would implode. Do you want me to have an imploded head.

I guess the part I'm

still having trouble with

is that a naked vote with 0 interaction doesn't really do much to ramp up pressure so I'm just completely at a loss to how you expected to achieve your intended result. I mean is this an ego thing? Do you think Random Newbie is gonna be so scared that they were voted by The Great and Mighty Titus that they'll just wet the bed and spill the goods?

No probs. I think meta can be useful if you are conscious of its/your limitations. And I know a few people that use it very effectively.
As you are tunneling on Titus for a point that is minor to me, and because algebra seems to be the same, I was wondering if this point was particulalrly bad because it is Titus.
Do you have other reads to share?

Yeah a lot of people claim meta helps them and more power to them I guess but in my experience it's trash and should be avoided at all costs. I'm not gonna make a big stink about this cuz it's not game relevant but if people wanna chat about it after that'd be fine. Re: Titus she has a rep but idgaf what she's done or said in other games, my only concern is what she says and does here. So when she posts moonbeams nonsense like this:

Great, so according to your own words, we're far out of RVS but you're still joking around?

Also, given your behavior towards my push, my reply details the fact you are phased. That's pretty true. Stop trying to be bigman on campus if you're town. Stop joking around. A joke is ok, but retracting a vote based on its a joke doesn't make any sense. You seem to be doing whatever it is that gets people to like you. Well guess what I like odd balls.

... I mean how am I supposed to ignore this. When did THOU SHALT NOT HAVE FUN become one of the Mafia commandments. It's a game ffs.

I have other reads yes. I don't want to share them atm tho. Don't make the mistake that a zillion other people have and decide that since I'm going hard after one particular player I'm ignoring everything else. zzz

[Titus]

@Papa Zito, Who said anything complaining about your focus?

A joke is fine. Calling a vote a joke in RVS tends to be scum. If we're in RVS, then nn should act like it's RVS. If he has scumreads, he should sort those.

Yes, nn30 is scared and you are undermining what I am doing. I voted him and later voted algebra. Nn30 still thought my vote was on them and I was only focused on them. If that's not scared aka phased, then your definition needs to change.

[nn30]

@papa zito - no read because you're talking so much it blurs everything. Remember, I only have RL to compare to - and in RL the most talkative person just means they're experienced. I've been carried by a talkative townie and I've been tricked by a talkative scum as well.

@dunhallym - you're right, it was weird that I left with my vote on papa instead of on someone I felt was scummy.

VOTE: algebra

L-1 I believe.

[nn30]

Great, so according to your own words, we're far out of RVS but you're still joking around?

Also, given your behavior towards my push, my reply details the fact you are phased. That's pretty true. Stop trying to be bigman on campus if you're town. Stop joking around. A joke is ok, but retracting a vote based on its a joke doesn't make any sense. You seem to be doing whatever it is that gets people to like you. Well guess what I like odd balls.

I'm playing it like it's a game.

I'm having fun with it.

[Papa Zito]

@Titus: Dunny mentioned I'm tunneling you.

@papa zito - no read because you're talking so much it blurs everything.

well

Primarily I've been digging at Titus this whole time. Look at the questions I'm asking and observations I'm making. Do you think those further a scum agenda or a town one? Why?


The nice thing about the forum game is you can always go back and review things. I'll point you to the "Iso" feature - scroll to the bottom of the page, below the quick reply box, and you'll see "Display posts by user: "


If you select my name and push Go the page will refresh with just my posts. Even better you can push the [+] button next to it:


Now you can see our full back-and-forth. Neat!

[nn30]

I am so helping rn.

Generate discussion? Check.
Scumhunt? Check.
Pushing wagon? Check.

I'm the towniest town the ever towned and you know it, that's why you aren't even accusing me of anything.

You could be like

"ayy this zito guy's pushing bs on me vote: zito"
or
"ayy let's dissect or hell even question this zito guy what's pushing a wagon and got me to L-2 on page 2"

but nah you're just like
"this is fine" #firedog

@Titus: Dunny mentioned I'm tunneling you.

@papa zito - no read because you're talking so much it blurs everything.

well

Primarily I've been digging at Titus this whole time. Look at the questions I'm asking and observations I'm making. Do you think those further a scum agenda or a town one? Why?


The nice thing about the forum game is you can always go back and review things. I'll point you to the "Iso" feature - scroll to the bottom of the page, below the quick reply box, and you'll see "Display posts by user: "


If you select my name and push Go the page will refresh with just my posts. Even better you can push the [+] button next to it:


Now you can see our full back-and-forth. Neat!

@Papa Zito

Thanks for pointing out the iso feature, very helpful.

Look at the questions I'm asking and observations I'm making. Do you think those further a scum agenda or a town one? Why?

Here are the things I see you doing.

1) Trying to force Titus' thought process into the open. This furthers a town agenda because it fosters transparency that we can later reference. We can use this information to either catch her in a fib or determine that she is indeed town.

2) You're tunneling Titus. This one could go either way. It could further the town agenda because you're genuinely trying to vet Titus and her actions. It could also further scum agenda because if everyone is focused on Titus, they aren't focused on the real scum (presumably you and your buddy).

3) [quote="In post 114 Why am I having to drag this shit over multiple pages?[/quote]

This leads me to believe that point two, while it could go either way, should be leaning town. You seem genuinely pissed that Titus is being difficult and not answering questions. This would stem from your desire to find out if you and her are actually on the same team or not.

I am so helping rn.

I'm the towniest town the ever towned and you know it, that's why you aren't even accusing me of anything.

At the time this quote was merely hilarious. Now, four pages later, the only accusation or vote you've accumulated is my joke vote. This holds a little more weight than it did on page two. What could this mean?

Option 1) You're the towniest town that ever towned.

Option 2) You're the smoothest talking scum that ever scummed.

This exercise has illuminated that I should be getting a town vibe from you.

HOWEVER.

This game has also taught me not to trust anyone and especially not on day one. I've been burnt many times by trusting someone who I knew to be good at the game. I'm still inclined to stick with original feeling - no read - but I will acknowledge that the needle has moved towards town.

[nn30]

DAMN IT why are putting multiple quotes in so difficult.

[nn30]

Read from @papa zito down - the rest is not meant to be there.

[shaddowez]

UNVOTE:

Need to catch up some, and don't want a derphammer this early.

[nn30]

Cleaned up version. I hope this works.

@Papa Zito

Thanks for pointing out the iso feature, very helpful.

Look at the questions I'm asking and observations I'm making. Do you think those further a scum agenda or a town one? Why?

Here are the things I see you doing.

1) Trying to force Titus' thought process into the open. This furthers a town agenda because it fosters transparency that we can later reference. We can use this information to either catch her in a fib or determine that she is indeed town.

2) You're tunneling Titus. This one could go either way. It could further the town agenda because you're genuinely trying to vet Titus and her actions. It could also further scum agenda because if everyone is focused on Titus, they aren't focused on the real scum (presumably you and your buddy).

3) You seem genuine?

Why am I having to drag this shit over multiple pages?

That's either really good fake anger, or genuine anger. I assume you're mad because, if you and Titus are both town, she is wasting your time.

I'm the towniest town the ever towned and you know it, that's why you aren't even accusing me of anything.

At the time this quote was merely hilarious. Now, four pages later, the only accusation or vote you've accumulated is my joke vote. This holds a little more weight than it did on page two. What could this mean?

Option 1) You're the towniest town that ever towned.

Option 2) You're the smoothest talking scum that ever scummed.

This exercise has illuminated that I should be getting a town vibe from you.

HOWEVER.

This game has also taught me not to trust anyone and especially not on day one. I've been burnt many times by trusting someone who I knew to be good at the game. I'm still inclined to stick with original feeling - no read - but I will acknowledge that the needle has moved towards town.[/quote]

[Dunhallym]

@Zito

/...
I guess the part I'm

still having trouble with

is that a naked vote with 0 interaction doesn't really do much to ramp up pressure so I'm just completely at a loss to how you expected to achieve your intended result. I mean is this an ego thing? Do you think Random Newbie is gonna be so scared that they were voted by The Great and Mighty Titus that they'll just wet the bed and spill the goods?

No probs. I think meta can be useful if you are conscious of its/your limitations. And I know a few people that use it very effectively.
As you are tunneling on Titus for a point that is minor to me, and because algebra seems to be the same, I was wondering if this point was particulalrly bad because it is Titus.
Do you have other reads to share?

Yeah a lot of people claim meta helps them and more power to them I guess but in my experience it's trash and should be avoided at all costs. I'm not gonna make a big stink about this cuz it's not game relevant but if people wanna chat about it after that'd be fine. Re: Titus she has a rep but idgaf what she's done or said in other games, my only concern is what she says and does here. So when she posts moonbeams nonsense like this:

Great, so according to your own words, we're far out of RVS but you're still joking around?

Also, given your behavior towards my push, my reply details the fact you are phased. That's pretty true. Stop trying to be bigman on campus if you're town. Stop joking around. A joke is ok, but retracting a vote based on its a joke doesn't make any sense. You seem to be doing whatever it is that gets people to like you. Well guess what I like odd balls.

... I mean how am I supposed to ignore this. When did THOU SHALT NOT HAVE FUN become one of the Mafia commandments. It's a game ffs.

I have other reads yes. I don't want to share them atm tho. Don't make the mistake that a zillion other people have and decide that since I'm going hard after one particular player I'm ignoring everything else. zzz

I don't decide I observe and so far you have not really given thoughts on players other than Titus. You may have reads on other people but I can only work with what's on the thread. We still have plenty of time in the day (as long as no quick lynch occurs) so it's OK atm but I'll get concerned if it stays that way.
I'll reread your back and forth with Titus but one question for you: what would scum Titus gain from her initial vote on nn? I already said I disagree for the reason behind her vote but I still fail to see how it makes her obvious scum.

@ Titus: you didn't answer my question: why do you say Zito is Town?

@Papa Zito, Who said anything complaining about your focus?

A joke is fine.

Calling a vote a joke in RVS tends to be scum.

If we're in RVS, then nn should act like it's RVS. If he has scumreads, he should sort those.

Yes, nn30 is scared and you are undermining what I am doing. I voted him and later voted algebra. Nn30 still thought my vote was on them and I was only focused on them. If that's not scared aka phased, then your definition needs to change.

Can you explain what you mean with the bolded sentence?

@nn

Cleaned up version. I hope this works.

@Papa Zito

Thanks for pointing out the iso feature, very helpful.

Look at the questions I'm asking and observations I'm making. Do you think those further a scum agenda or a town one? Why?

Here are the things I see you doing.

1) Trying to force Titus' thought process into the open. This furthers a town agenda because it fosters transparency that we can later reference. We can use this information to either catch her in a fib or determine that she is indeed town.

2) You're tunneling Titus. This one could go either way. It could further the town agenda because you're genuinely trying to vet Titus and her actions. It could also further scum agenda because if everyone is focused on Titus, they aren't focused on the real scum (presumably you and your buddy).

3) You seem genuine?

Why am I having to drag this shit over multiple pages?

That's either really good fake anger, or genuine anger. I assume you're mad because, if you and Titus are both town, she is wasting your time.

I'm the towniest town the ever towned and you know it, that's why you aren't even accusing me of anything.

At the time this quote was merely hilarious. Now, four pages later, the only accusation or vote you've accumulated is my joke vote. This holds a little more weight than it did on page two. What could this mean?

Option 1) You're the towniest town that ever towned.

Option 2) You're the smoothest talking scum that ever scummed.

This exercise has illuminated that I should be getting a town vibe from you.

HOWEVER.

This game has also taught me not to trust anyone and especially not on day one. I've been burnt many times by trusting someone who I knew to be good at the game. I'm still inclined to stick with original feeling - no read - but I will acknowledge that the needle has moved towards town.

[/quote]

You forget option 3) there are other scummier options
More seriously, I still don't like (i-e find it scummy) that you are too agreeable to people but I like that you didn't change your playstyle after I mentioned it.

@arona: you didn't cast a new vote: why?

[shaddowez]

@shaddowez @titus why are you voting algebra? Post 48 seems legit to me - lets gather more information before we go into the night.

I'll add to the heat as well.

VOTE: shadowez

I missed this, so my apologies on the delay. I'm only going to reference algebra's posts up to 48, since that is the last post of his before my vote. His first several posts were devoid of any real content. This was during RVS, so I didn't really think much of it. In 45 he votes Titus, putting her at L-1, and his only reason is:

A game without Titus is a better game

In 48 he then says to not lynch Titus yet so associatives can be formed, which I've already addressed.

Now, a question for you - I was the very first vote on algebra, yet you're asking why I'm voting him and saying we should gain more information...then you vote me, to "add on to the heat". Isn't that a bit hypocritical?

[shaddowez]

Also....

@shaddowez @titus why are you voting algebra? Post 48 seems legit to me - lets gather more information before we go into the night.

Scummy feeling - Algebra - quick to go along with a lynch vote but isn't offering much in the way of reasoning. Maybe because he knows the people he's putting votes on aren't scum.

VOTE: algebra

L-1 I believe.

algebra didn't make a single post between nn's 97 and 118, and then only made one between 118 and 133 which doesn't get addressed.

VOTE: nn30

[nn30]

@Dunhallym - I try not to be a jerk online. I'm pretty peeved at Titus right now and I still apologized for mis-gendering her. Just my style. I understand you taking it as a scum tell though. Of course scum want to be generally agreeable.

[algebra]

Yea that was quite opportunistic from nn30

[Dunhallym]

@Dunhallym - I try not to be a jerk online. I'm pretty peeved at Titus right now and I still apologized for mis-gendering her. Just my style. I understand you taking it as a scum tell though. Of course scum want to be generally agreeable.

I also try not to be a jerk but that's not what I mean by being agreeable. I mean that you always get along with what people ask you to do and you do not antagonize people even when you claim to find them scummy. By antagonizing I don't mean being aggressive or mean but taking a firm stance.

[nn30]

@shaddowez @titus why are you voting algebra? Post 48 seems legit to me - lets gather more information before we go into the night.

I ask a question.

Scummy feeling - Algebra - quick to go along with a lynch vote but isn't offering much in the way of reasoning. Maybe because he knows the people he's putting votes on aren't scum.

I answer my own question (since nobody answered it).

VOTE: algebra

I act on that thought.

[algebra]

That just made me laugh out loud at how terrible it is

[algebra]

VOTE: nn30