Ttyll Mafia - Game Over!

[Mirhawk]

Also, it's kinda hard to have a thought on anyone when NOBODY ELSE IS POSTING

I've seen you espouse this several times and I gotta say it's a lazy sentiment.

At least half the town is moderately active even if we do have several lurkers, I would expect you to have SOME opinion on those players.

Also kind of related I guess but I apologize for not making it explicit that I'm often not home on the weekends and I don't like phoneposting all that much because I'm picky about my editing and I find it onerous to do that on my phone.

[Mirhawk]

snake is another scum

ABR and snake are scum so far

Expound on this?

I mean I can pretty easily infer why I THINK you would say that, but it also looks kinda like omgus.

Eager is taking a pretty safe line at the moment and is pretty meh and fencey aside from that.

ABR is pretty unabashedly not trying to look for scum, but I can't remember a game off the top of my head where he didn't lurk so there's that.

[Wisdom]

Snake said im town, what omgus?

Abr didnt lurk in any game ive played with him

[Aeronaut]

I keep trying to view wisdom with the benefit of the doubt, and he just keeps digging himself further.

I see it was brought up, but it struck me hard when I read it so I'll revisit the point - wisdom HAS been lynched as town. (when I read his post that he doesn't get lynched as town I was going to ask "really? never?!") And wisdom also said their town game is exactly the same as their scum game, and so if they get lynched more as scum than town (showing the same exact playstyles) to me means we are MUCH MORE LIKELY to be lynching a scum wisdom here than a town wisdom.

I will analyse this in depth later. However, what I will say is that the two statements in the last sentence seem contradictory.

I will need to check later, but my basic idea is looking at all Wisdom's games, discarding all the Town games where he was either PR or cleared by PR, and discarding all scum games where he was caught by PR. This leaves the games where he was lynched or not lynched based on his play alone. If he really is lynched much less often as Town than scum, his play must be slightly different based on whether he is Town or scum.

If his play truly is identical as Town or scum, his play carries no information about his alignment. Thus when Town are lynching him they are as likely to be lynching a Town Wisdom as a scum Wisdom. However, this is (probably - I will need to check) not the case. Thus his play must be very slightly different as Town and scum, and he is more likely to be lynched as scum (as players pick up on this). Based on this, he is slightly more likely to be scum based on the fact that he is being wagoned and is likely to be lynched.

Overall, I somewhat agree with the conclusion of this post but I cannot get the logic here.

Here is BTD6 analyzing more things that aren't alignment indicative, and still giving no stances on anything. Inspirational!

Hey guys. Let's do this. Lynch me. You'll see I'm town, and then can finally lynch scum!Wisdom, and then I don't have to deal with stupidity anymore.

How's that sound?

This is actually probably NAI for DS, tbh. Maybe not. I don't know how I feel about this.

whats the matter, ds? people are starting to see who's the real scum here?

Wisdom dick measuring post #43

omg

are both DS and wisdom buddies together? now I just have a scum read on them both - and that would be some incredible staging, BUT, but but but!

they've played together before, if they saw they rolled scummers together, they may very well be like "there's NO way we can be not contentious and not be suspicious, we've got to play it up HARD, and that will eventually lead to 1 of us being free, most likely"

I'm so fucking paranoid now.

I really don't think so.

so it's all pointless

Wisdom nihilism post #103

WSR is hurting my head with this nation talk

I can't see a mod making it different for scum and town, that leaves too much room for huge slips for scum,

I do agree with this though; I really don't see the mod giving out scum PMs before town PMs. On that note, I also don't see a scenario where the mod lets people start posting in a neighborhood before there are role PMs out.

Why does it matter when scum got to choose their planet?

This post seemed like a weird time/thing to chime in on.

I looked at Wisdom's wagon. Apart from myself and DS, there is Vaxkiller, ABR, and Drealmerz.
It seems that at least Vax seems to agree that Wisdom started off Townier and got scummier.
Anyway, it seems like the entirety of today was focused on Wisdom and the interactions with DS, GWS, and Drealmerz.

I will try to analyse the others first.

This, AGAIN, is just a nothing post. He states that he looked at Wisdoms wagon. Great. These are the people who are on the wagon. They are these four people. Here is something Vax thinks. In conclusion, Wisdom interacted with these three people. More to come.

Probably going to be voting this tbh unless he miraculously does something in the next fifteen pages.

MOD

:

Activity call on these folks please!

Vedith Nov 07, 04:57pm Nov 10, 09:18am 2 days 1 hour 31
FrankJaeger Nov 08, 02:50am Nov 10, 08:19am 2 days 2 hours 18
Albert B. Rampage Nov 08, 03:01am Nov 10, 12:42am 2 days 10 hours 18

I was V/LA.

Now I'm back.

1v1 me with Wisdom

Holy shit ABR is in this game I actually forgot. We're all doomed/saved!

By my current notes, Diamond, Gale, and one of BTD/Vax are probably the scum on Wisdom's early wagon, with Eager as scum off the wagon.

that's four scum already, how many scum are you expecting in total?

i doubt there are that many scum on my wagon

Why would you doubt that as town?

wisdom is still super scummy and the better lynch

DS seems more dedicated towards working together and being pro-town (though some scummy stuff there, but it's mostly reading as bait to me) - and if is scum it will reveal itself readily enough, wisdom is priority resolve (which is only okay when the player is scumread, don't vote them if you're not scumreading them), then we evaluate what that means in the light of DS.

I have to be honest and say I see potential for 2 scum-buddies going at it and putting on a show. Like two players who don't generally get along but drew scum together. Go back and look at their interaction, the town-reads and then the quick scum-reads and switch to contention.

It's been in my mind and it persists, even on a re-read.

To expand on what I said before, I really don't see this interaction that way. I guess you could make a case that both of their cases are kind of shit, and they're both kind of scummy for reasons exclusive of those cases, but I don't feel like the risk of being this noisy and fucking up their status in the game quite weighs to any reward to come of it, especially on like D1.

[Mirhawk]

Snake said im town, what omgus?

Abr didnt lurk in any game ive played with him

It's possible I'm misremembering on eager. I noted him taking a side on you vs diamond, I thought it was the other side though. Still if thats the case I'm still interested in your thoughts on why you're reading him that way.

The last game I played with ABR he lurked as scum, and while It's been awhile since I played with him other then that I have the impression that he wasn't very active then either. If he actually doesn't lurk as town I'll maybe go back and check later.

[Wisdom]

I feel like he's just opportunistically jumping one the side of the 1v1 that he feels is more likely going through

His "ok DS is AtEing so is scum, Wisdom is town" feels very shallow

He doesn't really feel like he particularly cares to analyze the situation

And his 665 shows that he doesn't really believe in his DS scumread

[Wisdom]

one

on*

[Aeronaut]

I will 100% be here tonight or I'll replace

I expect a vote, thoughts on Wisdom and DS, as well as thoughts on your lurker buddies (ABR, eager, vedith). I wish the same from the lurkers I listed.

You can't tell me what to do! You're not my dad!

ABR is probably scum, Eager is probably scum, vedith I don't fucking know because he's just a master troll always. Someone needs to clear him.

Not liking DS by Page 4.

cool

I'll vote on whichever of the two leading wagons right now, please guys, don't be like the democrats this year, vote.

If democrats could vote right from the snapchat app then we'd probably have won

Also boring ABR is boring and unhelpful.

VOTE: DS

Okay I'm caught up and this is scum

Wisdom is probably town

Cool nice catchup

He doesn't deserve any pity I can tell you

Why not? I'm quite capable of good town play. You saw me from a scum's PoV in Cyberpunk. I was one of those people who strongarmed your lynch, and was against most of the town lynches of that game.

Hey, we still won though
well, Dwlee did.

UNVOTE:

I found DS's part of the interaction Towny, but I am becoming more convinced that Wisdom is Town too. On closer inspection, their interaction looks more like a Town vs Town interaction.

Who do you think is scum, then? Give me something, anything.

1v1 me

Whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy????

Holy money you actually are scum, Texcat?
Sneaky.

VOTE: texcat

What

snake is another scum

ABR and snake are scum so far

Expound on this?

I mean I can pretty easily infer why I THINK you would say that, but it also looks kinda like omgus.

Eager is taking a pretty safe line at the moment and is pretty meh and fencey aside from that.

ABR is pretty unabashedly not trying to look for scum, but I can't remember a game off the top of my head where he didn't lurk so there's that.

I actually think he's been very active and the center of attention in almost every game I've played with him, besides Cyberpunk where we were scum.

NY180 is a really good example.

[Mirhawk]

Geez Aeronaut, get out of my head you clown.

I agree with 703 in general, especially in regards to BT and your view on Wisdom vs Diamond.

[Mirhawk]

I feel like he's just opportunistically jumping one the side of the 1v1 that he feels is more likely going through

His "ok DS is AtEing so is scum, Wisdom is town" feels very shallow

He doesn't really feel like he particularly cares to analyze the situation

And his 665 shows that he doesn't really believe in his DS scumread

I agree, but my worry is that I see shallow plays like this constantly from players who are lurking who want to look involved in the game.

I do see what you mean about 665 though as it implies that he is reading the game to a certain extent, but is unworried about choosing wrong. Also, there is some contrast between that and his previous post where he states that DS is caught scum.

[Mirhawk]

I actually think he's been very active and the center of attention in almost every game I've played with him, besides Cyberpunk where we were scum.

NY180 is a really good example.

Yeah it's looking like I'm going to have to look into this, my memory on my past games with him is too sketchy to trust.

Anyways, I'm off.

[Aeronaut]

Spoiler: Key

Conftown - {CT}

Town - {T}

LeanTown - {LT}

NullTown - {NT}

Null - {N}

NullScum - {NS}

LeanScum - {LS}

Scum - {S}

ConfScum - {CS}

{LT} texcat [T: 397, 403]

{NT} Frankjaeger [T: 254]
{NT} Mirhawk [T: 479]
{NT} Vaxkiller [T: 431]
{NT} BulletNLynchProof/ThinkBig+ [T: 624]
{NT} drealmerz7 - [T: 42, 43, 108][S: 456, 448]

{N} Gale Wing Srock
{N} PeregrineV
{N} Wisdom [T: 121*, 128, 163, 502][S: 300-307, 409v341*, 432*]
{N} Gamma Emerald/copper223 [S: 112*][T: 673]

{NS} Vedith [NS:107] -1
{NS} White Queens (RachMarie + Ms Marangal). [LS: 253]
{NS} eagerSnake [S: 662]
{NS} DiamondSentinel [NS: 106][S: 406*][T:613]
{NS} Albert B. Rampage [S: Claim, S: Lurk]

{LS} BTD6_Maker

[S: 151, 290*, 503, 570*][T: 584*]

112* (Throwing Shade at Wisdom, Sounds Forced)
121* (Feels the same thing I do about Copper)
151 (scum looking busy post)
290* (Just jumping right onto that wagon, huh?)
406* (I feel like wanting a L-1/Claim like four pages into this game is really early, especially considering the fact that a lot of people hadn't posted much)
409v341* (in 341, WQ has "scum claimed" according to him, but then in 409 he's not sure now.)
432* (Discrediting Vax's post instead of really responding to it. Van also saw the same thing I did, points to him.)
570* (Again says nothing at all. Just states facts about who is posting)
584* (I do sort of agree with this)


PG 7 - Neighborhood/scum talk is WIFOM imo
PG 11 - The Wisdom wagon looks kind of scum motivated to me.
PG 12/13 - Wisdom's case on DS is bad to nonexistent, though.
P15 - Wisdom major ATE at like four votes. It was on a particularly stressful tuesday, though
P20-22 are giving me actual migrains.

[Wisdom]

409v341* (in 341, WQ has "scum claimed" according to him, but then in 409 he's not sure now.)

dont take everything i say that seriously
Neither DS nor Mara actually scumclaimed. It was just an expression of "I am scumreading you a lot now".

[Wisdom]

It was on a particularly stressful tuesday, though

wat?

[Aeronaut]

Yeah but the point of that was that you were very set on them being scum and then changed back to "i'm not sure"

I get that it was a figure of speech, but it's the same outcome.

p-edit: for americans

[Aeronaut]

VOTE: BTD6_Maker

You should all join me on this wagon.

[Wisdom]

not american

Also, I was feeling like Mara should be giving me the benefit of doubt because she's played with me the most in this playerlist and has even hydra'd with me. Instead I got a "Wisdom is scum" tunnel in my face. Later I decided she was just doing it in order to read me.

[Mirhawk]

Vote:BTD6

Alright, but now I really am taking off.

[Aeronaut]

Ok, that's fair. I just didn't understand that switch when you did it.

P-edit Noice

[Wisdom]

VOTE: btd

I prefer ABR or Snake to this, but it's a close third.

[Aeronaut]

yeah

[texcat]

I certainly questioned it. I think I have a general dislike of hydras.

Thaaaat's racist

I hope this was meant to be a joke. (And that hydras have not become a race! ) I feel like the two brains vs one is not quite fair. And hydras being able to discuss and debate in private, when the rest of us have to do it in public, seems unfair. I will try not to allow my view on hydras in general affect how I view WhiteQueens.
As a further aside, there are unfortunately plenty of things in our society that could legitimately be called racist. But I think it's a serious charge that should not be used lightly.

[Wisdom]

texcat, do you have any opinions on ABR, Snake and BTD6?

[drealmerz7]

Hey, GE! Welcome! I look forward to your inputs.

Oh really, I thought you thought I was bad.

errr, sorry! I don't think I ever said that, if I did it was probably in the heat of a moment or just meaning something specific about a play you made, not you - I like what I've seen from you for the most part and think you will probably bring a good element to this game, compared to what else I've seen especially! - (honestly it'd probably take 5 games playing together before I got a real sense of what I think about your play, in general, and of course even then, even the best players make bad plays, sooo, yeah, I have not even the beginnings of a negative judgement on you.) *buddybuddybuddy* is how that sounds, I know, but when a player enters a game, I do like to be cordial and welcoming and I have no personal issues with you sooo...welcome! I look forward to your inputs! (errr, already liking that you're here, from what I've seen!) Players in the game! Can't complain fosho!

I do like to have fun and try and have the energy be good. On my HS we certainly don't all get along personality wise, but we do realize that this is a game and we're trying to have fun, so we get beyond all that and have fun.

catching up more...

[DiamondSentinel]

You're townreading DS? Why?

Because he's not playing at all like he does when he's scum.
He's a player that I feel can't adapt either.

Thanks... Your hand hurt from that back-handed compliment?