Micro 660: Triplicate Mafia - Game Over

[Not_Mafia]

Power

ArcAngel9 (1)-

Secret Agent Jin

Dunnstral (0)-

Secret Agent Jin (0)-

Not Voting (2)-

ArcAngel9, Dunnstral

Wisdom

FrankJaeger (2)-

HowardRoark, Gamma Emerald

HowardRoark (1)-

FrankJaeger

Gamma Emerald (0)-

Not Voting (0)-

Courage

quibxes (2)-

lane0168, GuiltyLion

GuiltyLion (0)-

lane0168 (0)-

Not Voting (1)-

quibxes

Deadline is in

(expired on 2016-11-29 13:00:00)

- Nov 29th 13:00 GMT

[Secret Agent Jin]

@SAJ: You know you're putting

3!

people at L-1, not just Arc...

I was putting three people at L-1, i didnt realize that the other two groups had voted a person, i thought only the frank/howard group had. Also, i can see the reasoning behind Town!Arc. I am willing to follow what she says but my understanding is that if we no lynch then it doesnt matter if our group is 100% town, the mafia still chooses someone to die. Ill leave it up to Arc, no lynch or Dunn?

UNVOTE:

[Dunnstral]

@SAJ: You know you're putting

3!

people at L-1, not just Arc...

Thought I made it clear I wasn't hammering

@Dunnstral: Why is that you care so much about Wisdom, and don't care at all what happens to my group?

You're already getting lynched

[Dunnstral]

Don't worry about power until wisdom acknowledges me

[ArcAngel9]

@SAJ: You know you're putting

3!

people at L-1, not just Arc...

I was putting three people at L-1, i didnt realize that the other two groups had voted a person, i thought only the frank/howard group had. Also, i can see the reasoning behind Town!Arc. I am willing to follow what she says but my understanding is that if we no lynch then it doesnt matter if our group is 100% town, the mafia still chooses someone to die. Ill leave it up to Arc, no lynch or Dunn?

UNVOTE:

Oh you're right. I was in an assumption that Mafia can only kill within their own groups. So you're saying if all our team is town, Mafia can still kill one of us?

If that's the case, I would like to lynch Dun.

3. If a group does NOT pick a player to lynch by the deadline, the Mafia will choose who within that group is to be lynched.

[qubixes]

@SAJ: You know you're putting

3!

people at L-1, not just Arc...

Thought I made it clear I wasn't hammering

@Dunnstral: Why is that you care so much about Wisdom, and don't care at all what happens to my group?

You're already getting lynched

I don't have a habit of trusting scum.

By the looks of it I'm about as likely lynched as Frank, so can you not dodge the question? (Or my accusation for that matter.)

[Secret Agent Jin]

I will hold off on voting until Wisdom acknowledges Dunn. I dont know what Wisdom has to do with our group but ill wait.

[qubixes]

@Jin: It would also be great if you could wait for Lane and GL to see whether they might reconsider or not, before we go to the lynch...

[HowardRoark]

@Dunnstral: You want to not scumhunt in your group because you want responses from my group? And basically you feel FrankJaeger is town for some unexplained reason.

295 @FrankJaeger: If Gamma Emerald had beaten me into the thread, not understood the rules, and "hammered" me then what would your reaction and next steps have been? Needs to be answered as well and will not be .

The ignorance of the rules is disturbing.

I don't understand why qubixes is the current lynch selection. The previous player did nothing. He is now participating. Explain your votes! Until then . . .
UNVOTE: FrankJaeger

[HowardRoark]

EBWOP: and will not be forgotten.

[Dunnstral]

@SAJ: You know you're putting

3!

people at L-1, not just Arc...

Thought I made it clear I wasn't hammering

@Dunnstral: Why is that you care so much about Wisdom, and don't care at all what happens to my group?

You're already getting lynched

I don't have a habit of trusting scum.

By the looks of it I'm about as likely lynched as Frank, so can you not dodge the question? (Or my accusation for that matter.)

Thought I made it clear I was fine with you getting lynched

[Dunnstral]

@Dunnstral: You want to not scumhunt in your group

But I did

[Dunnstral]

Howard, what do you think of Gamma?

[GuiltyLion]

There is no reason that we can't case/argue against a person from another group, even if we can't vote them, so there shouldn't be that problem. Your reason for voting me is pretty lame ("I need some flips"). What are you going to learn when I flip town, and you didn't as much as have given me a chance? Looks like dunstrall was right that my fate was basically sealed before my entrance into the game (which is stupid and demotivating regardless of what you think of my alignment).

I'll get to this game tonight when I have some time, read trough the whole game carefully and make a write-up. If you're still defaulting to my lynch without a single reason beyond that my predecessor made a single post and was posting elsewhere, I give up.

Except that's not the reason I voted you, you're drawing an A->B connection that I didn't put there. I voted you to advance the game and because I didn't like your unexplained potshots at me. The fact that you take something else that I said ("I need flips") and tried to tie it to my vote without directly asking me about it looks disingenuous to me.

[GuiltyLion]

212 [GL] Can't agree with GL here. It makes a lot of sense to me that Howard!town to scumread someone who reverses on a reply Howard!town clearly sees as BS. Also, scum!GL never reverses his read on anyone, unless he has an obvious reason?

321 is a lot of useless commentary to look busy imo, but I'll address this point directly

The point isn't about the fact that I reversed my read, the point is Howard calls it scummy without explaining why it's scummy. town!GL or scum!GL can reverse a read. Reversing a read itself is not alignment indicative. Therefore it's scummy play to just say "GL reversed his read, so that's scummy" without actually putting the thought or the explanation into why it's

more likely

that I'm scum for reversing the read rather than town. Scum often do that because it's easier to state to the other players of a true fact (GL reversed a read) and let them infer why that's supposed to be scummy, rather than having to make the case explicitly themselves.

also, you didn't highlight any posts that you said look like tiptoeing. Why did you say I was tiptoeing earlier?

[GuiltyLion]

There is one thing that really bothers me about lane though. Why did you complain so much about DBW being inactive and then seemingly not care at all when I do replace in?

I do agree with this though, and would like to see Lane address it. I was also hoping to see him react to my vote but looks like he hasn't been here yet

[GuiltyLion]

Also this reeeks of desperation by Dunnstral.

what is Dunnstral desperate about?

[Gamma Emerald]

Also this reeeks of desperation by Dunnstral.

what is Dunnstral desperate about?

Getting his buddy to not be lynched.
And I am acknowledging you Dunn: I think you're scum and I'm not changing course.

[lane0168]

There is one thing that really bothers me about lane though. Why did you complain so much about DBW being inactive and then seemingly not care at all when I do replace in?

I do agree with this though, and would like to see Lane address it. I was also hoping to see him react to my vote but looks like he hasn't been here yet

Why would I make a show of someone doing something they're supposed to do? I don't get recognition for eating vegetables or getting 8 hours of sleep or drinking enough water.

Also I saw your vote.

Also guilty you strike me as similar to the last game when you ended up replacing out. Kinda popping in out, not too much to say. You're better as town I think

UNVOTE:

[qubixes]

Why would I make a show of someone doing something they're supposed to do? I don't get recognition for eating vegetables or getting 8 hours of sleep or drinking enough water.

You seemed frustrated at not being able to interact with a player in your group, but when the opportunity arises you don't seem interested. I'm not saying you should be applauding me for doing my job. If you want to go the analogy route, it's like you scream "I'm so thirsty!", and when you receive a glass of water, you're not even interested in drinking it.

[qubixes]

Except that's not the reason I voted you, you're drawing an A->B connection that I didn't put there. I voted you to advance the game and because I didn't like your unexplained potshots at me. The fact that you take something else that I said ("I need flips") and tried to tie it to my vote without directly asking me about it looks disingenuous to me.

You're saying "I need some flips" in 316, then a naked vote in 317. Just because of the fact that you posted them in two separate posts I am not allowed to conclude that they are connected, when you don't voice any suspicions about me in the posts before that either? If you had that reason for voting me, why not just say it out loud and try to get me to interact on it, instead of apparently hiding it so you can call me scummy when I don't ask you about it?

I wanted to put out some content within the limited time I had available (which I indicated), realizing I might have to take some of it back, because I didn't have a good understanding yet of what was going on. The tip-toeing and salesman comments were my first impressions on reading your ISO, and I thought it would be beneficial putting it out, seeing what kind of reaction I would get. Hint: your reaction was pretty bad, voting me in apparent self-defense, when I wasn't even fully caught up.

[qubixes]

212 [GL] Can't agree with GL here. It makes a lot of sense to me that Howard!town to scumread someone who reverses on a reply Howard!town clearly sees as BS. Also, scum!GL never reverses his read on anyone, unless he has an obvious reason?

321 is a lot of useless commentary to look busy imo, but I'll address this point directly

The point isn't about the fact that I reversed my read, the point is Howard calls it scummy without explaining why it's scummy. town!GL or scum!GL can reverse a read. Reversing a read itself is not alignment indicative. Therefore it's scummy play to just say "GL reversed his read, so that's scummy" without actually putting the thought or the explanation into why it's

more likely

that I'm scum for reversing the read rather than town. Scum often do that because it's easier to state to the other players of a true fact (GL reversed a read) and let them infer why that's supposed to be scummy, rather than having to make the case explicitly themselves.

also, you didn't highlight any posts that you said look like tiptoeing. Why did you say I was tiptoeing earlier?

I'm not saying your reversal of your read is scummy in this post (even though I still question how you managed to to that in this particular case), or at least that's not the point I'm trying to make. What I am having the most trouble with is you calling Howard scummy there. To me it makes perfect sense for town!Howard to be suspicious of your move, and I think you should be able to see that as well if you're town. Why is it scummy that he didn't give reasons? In fact, if he was meticulously pointing out what was wrong, it might be

more

suspicious imo. What does he accomplish by FoS'ing you and not giving reasons? How does that help is scum goals? Make others infer? Maybe. But really at that stage in the game you were under no pressure, because of the absence of my slot. It's not going to make lane or my non-participating slot vote you. And long-term people would probably forget about it.. I'm not saying Howard is only doing this as town. I'm saying your reasons for calling Howard scum there are crap.

I would also like to point out that you're doing a very similar thing to what you are accusing me of: instead of asking him about his reasons, you immediately accuse him.

As to tip-toeing. Honestly, a pretty large part of your ISO is saying: "I like this, don't like that, this is weak". The only times when it felt you were actually showing any serious push behind something was when you were accused, in case of Howard, and me. If you want post numbers: 26, 121, 123, 124. I think you get the point.

Btw, it's rather unfair calling my catch up post "busy-work", because I'm just making notes and posting them publicly to get into the game (and allow others to interact on it, which didn't really happen except for you I guess..). I'm still trying to figure out the best way to get into a game by replacing in (second time), so if you have problems with it (or more constructive: suggestions), you can tell me post-game.

Might as well vote, since I don't think I'll change my choice.

VOTE: GuiltyLion

[FrankJaeger]

Sup im back

[FrankJaeger]

Qub most probably town

[Not_Mafia]

Get your bump on, go play.