Open 660 - White Flag (Game Over)

[Aubrey]

So this has started huh? VOTE: gamma. Your not gonna fool me twice!

[Aubrey]

[Aubrey]

Speedlynch gamma. He clearly doesn't understand what a personal inside joke is.

[Aubrey]

Ugh. That was so vague that nobody would have thought anything of it, and was a perfect inside joke till you went and ruined it. Now I'm heart broken, and the only answer is to lynch ya. Gimme a hand here Transcend?

[Aubrey]

On another note, it's been awhile chilled. How's it going? Lovely weather? You should vote Gamma. For old times sake!

[Aubrey]

How disappointing

[Aubrey]

And that's terrible.

I know! He didn't include his vote for you. Tragic.

[Aubrey]

You start. I find it a bit early to propose strong lynch options. You however seem to be wanting to get a move on with it.

[Aubrey]

Alright guys, Instead of dragging this out why don't we all come to an agreement on who should we lynch? Getting 7 votes is hard with a 13 player game.

We're obviously not gonna go into arguments without any basis or scum reads or whatever. Just let the game flow for a while.

^^^

[Aubrey]

You start. I find it a bit early to propose strong lynch options. You however seem to be wanting to get a move on with it.

Because I want D1 to actually be D1 lol ... Not D20 and nobody has been lynched yet

What's your mafia experience? I see you're a newer account here. Basically day 1 starts of with shitty votes and wagons to get the game going initially.

[Aubrey]

Alright guys, Instead of dragging this out why don't we all come to an agreement on who should we lynch? Getting 7 votes is hard with a 13 player game.

You start. I find it a bit early to propose strong lynch options. You however seem to be wanting to get a move on with it.

@Eric

You never answered my first question btw. You defended/explained why you proposed this notion in post 49, but never went to act on it yourself. Odd. I don't fully understand why you would say this without a scum read/reads included. While I think you're just newer to mafia, I can't rule out the notion of this being scum trying to seem proactive town.

VOTE: Eric

So far this is the strangest thing that has stood out to me.

[Aubrey]

Also um

Lethargy are town

?

[Aubrey]

Also I have no reason to give Aubrey botd here

VOTE: Aubrey

And so far you have no reason to vote me. Least you haven't given one.

[Aubrey]

LOL. Deja vu.

While I've never seen Transcend's scum play, I can say he does that as a townie. He's a big fat null for me based on that knowledge. Take it for what you will.

[Aubrey]

Nah. If they want it cool, but it'd only kill the surprise for when I do (or if I am) facing off against scum you. I'm also not that big of a fan for meta reads being the sole reason for which someone reads/votes another. Though I get the odd feeling your town and scum play probably aren't to far off from one another. Or you being one to change up your meta here and there.

[Aubrey]

Speedlynch gamma. He clearly doesn't understand what a personal inside joke is.

Ugh. That was so vague that nobody would have thought anything of it, and was a perfect inside joke till you went and ruined it. Now I'm heart broken, and the only answer is to lynch ya. Gimme a hand here Transcend?

On another note, it's been awhile chilled. How's it going? Lovely weather? You should vote Gamma. For old times sake!

Posts for which I'm voting Aubrey.

Congradulations, you still have no reason to think I'm scum. Especially since you are voting me for my RVS entry. Ps: Throwing out three quotes and simply saying "and this is why I'm voting him" isn't presenting a case at all. It's frankly underwhelming.

So, try this again. Why are you voting me?

[Aubrey]

Unless of course you think gamma town. In which case I'd laugh and be very interested in knowing why you think that.

[Aubrey]

Sorry guys ... Been busy for a while ... I suggested we start collectively lynching because I wanted the game to move forward .... Its no problem if you dont want to do it ... I'm still sticking to Transcend btw ... I dont have any reason as to why... Im voting for him Just Because ...

You are missing my entire point. You can't say, "Hey guys let's start narrowing down some lynch options!" Without bringing forward reads. More importantly you said this at a time in which the game just started, and there was no info on the board to even accomplish it. Even now you're saying, " I have no info to work with, but let's get a move on and narrow down some lynch options!" If you're going to say this then you need to be proactive about it and stop relying on other ppl to do all the work to accomplish this. Further more, there is more to this game than just night kill analysis.

The game has just started, and we are pretty much out of RVS and starting to get info on the board. Your initial comment would be better suited for later in the game if it was clear some people were not coming out of RVS while others were.

[Aubrey]

tbh i don't find any scummy atm. mostly i read as not serious.

I assume you're talking about Dave. If so I agree.

[Aubrey]

I think his most recent post is silly seeing as he self hammered as town in a previous game I played with him.

[Aubrey]

I think his most recent post is silly seeing as he self hammered as town in a previous game I played with him.

You are talking of Dave or Eric?

Gamma

[Aubrey]

Speedlynch gamma. He clearly doesn't understand what a personal inside joke is.

Ugh. That was so vague that nobody would have thought anything of it, and was a perfect inside joke till you went and ruined it. Now I'm heart broken, and the only answer is to lynch ya. Gimme a hand here Transcend?

On another note, it's been awhile chilled. How's it going? Lovely weather? You should vote Gamma. For old times sake!

Posts for which I'm voting Aubrey.

Congradulations, you still have no reason to think I'm scum. Especially since you are voting me for my RVS entry. Ps: Throwing out three quotes and simply saying "and this is why I'm voting him" isn't presenting a case at all. It's frankly underwhelming.

So, try this again. Why are you voting me?

I wouldn't be voting you if I didn't think these posts were scum motivated. I think it is evident from a town pov why I pointed these posts out

How are they scum motivated?

[Aubrey]

I wouldn't be voting you if I didn't think these posts were scum motivated. I think it is evident from a town pov why I pointed these posts out

Can you explain this to me? Did you have an issue with the tone of the posts because I thought the quotes you mentioned where just intended to be

shit posts that weren't supposed to be taken at face value.

^^^^

[Aubrey]

:/ your version of quickening the game is not progressive though for the town. You're just mindlessly voting someone "

Just because.

" Your basis is just, lets just lynch someone for little to no reason in order to move onto day 2. Tell me good sir, what do you hope to gain or learn by that? Your play is nothing more than lethargic day one play that is either coming from a lazy townie, a townie who doesn't know how to work from nothing, or scum.

Your not really trying to catch scum. Your not really trying to find likely townies. Your just a blah member right now doing a lot of nothing but complaining about day one, or trying to seem like a progressive townie as scum.

So far I'm not a fan of you or SSBM. I actually have a slight town lean for Dave right now. I like the fact he went after Transcend, and for the reasons provided even if I did not aggree with his suspicions against Transcend.

[Aubrey]

What's the scum motive as well?

[Aubrey]

UNVOTE: erik

[Aubrey]

I don't think I need to go in depth regarding how far fetched your claim is ssbm. Maybe try Occam's razor a bit more here? Anywho, now I need to figure out where to place my vote...I'd keep it on Eric, but while his actions are kinda questionable they are no where near damnable. Plus my main issue with him was his lack of effort. Maybe whoever replaces him will do better. I'll re-read the game and consider where to place it either tonight or tomorrow.

Back to my main man Chilled Tea, who never told me how life was treating him (Rude). Why are you voting little lovable me?

[Aubrey]

Nah. If they want it cool, but it'd only kill the surprise for when I do (or if I am) facing off against scum you. I'm also not that big of a fan for meta reads being the sole reason for which someone reads/votes another. Though I get the odd feeling your town and scum play probably aren't to far off from one another. Or you being one to change up your meta here and there.

newbie spotted.

....not exactly but okay. I don't exactly see the relevance behind this post.

[Aubrey]

Alban, was just thinking the same (SR) about keyen on the reread. Not sure what you mean by laundering but the posts do look fluffy. I don't think I saw any accusation of his yet either.

He's letting others make pushes and is picking ones that look supported to back.

I don't like 119 either. I was clearly being serious about my Aubrey read at the time.

VOTE: Keyen

Oh yes, truly right. I let others push someone and I'm supporting the case back.

It's because it's my playstyle.

I town read everyone by default

, And if someone has made accusation, I let myself investigate that person. If I agree on the said scummy person, of course, I would suspect them too. Also, I never said I wasn't reading your posts as serious nor I stated it specifically. I said,

mostly

I didn't read them as serious because it was either a joke or a shit post that doesn't need to be taken as serious.

If I'm being so scummy, then lynch me.

This is going to sound like a contradiction on my part, but I really really don't like the bold. The rest of the post is fine, but that part about "oh, its my playstyle" I can't say I dislike enough, especially in this game where everyone seems to be new-ish.

P-Edit: I actually agree with Aubre for the most part of that post regarding my slot. I do, however disagree with the Town read on Dave. I think everything Dave has done has been NAI.

Sorry but I'm not new, I think? And it's really my playstyle.

Do you have less than 6 months experience and less that 20 games played? If the answer to these questions is yes, then you are new.

....well I do have less than 20 games under my belt. New though I think is poor term to use. Young. Now that is better! I have about 10 games completed in total. Moving on.

[Aubrey]

Still reading

[Aubrey]

i

Why alban?

Cause I am town reading him.

Aubrey is my scum read. I didn't like they way he went for eric during dave's wagon, while giving a possibility of eric being newb. His post gave reason as "yes eric can be newb but he could also be scum doing his thing" like that can be said about anything on this planet.

Lick (replacer of eric) is also a town read.

I am kinda suspicious of lethargy though. Like I don't remember anything special from them.

It was the most suspect thing I saw at the time, and reacted on it. There is nothing wrong with voting someone for suspect behavior while understanding there to be a possible reason for it. Might I add, being newer is not really alignment indicative for the action I called out. That could come from either alignment. Placing my vote on him was a much better vote than my shit vote on Gamma, and the Dave wagon did not interest me as I've said. Sooo what is so bad about that?

[Aubrey]

By the way amongst the player list, aubrey, alban, and transcend are very good scum players and shouldn't be considered as newbies by any means, especially transcend.

Although I feel alban is prob town here.

too kind

[Aubrey]

Initially the timing felt as if you were trying to derail the wagon on dave. It could also have been a vote, while not for derailing, for distancing.

Sometimes scum try to stay away from the topic at hand. Even if they don't want to directly influence the said topic.

Do you still find eric's slot scummy?

I've basically skimmed the last 3-4 pages. On a skim, I'm much happier with the slot. As I said, my major issue with him was his contraditive attitude. "

Hey guys lets narrow down some lynch options right out the gate and get a move on, while I go sit in the corner and do nothing but complain!

" When BTD said he asked for a replacement, I basically nulled the spot of its ever so light scum lean since it is so early in the game.

Regarding Dave, I just found his early posts playful shitty early day 1 activities. Eh. The argument that town would never vote themselves is farfetched, and a lie. Yea. Not a very interesting wagon in my eyes right out the gate.

--

Holy shit this game is on fire this morning.

[Aubrey]

Post 157: This is actually not a bad post and I say that as the person being attacked. I agree that my slot hasn't been the pinnacle of good play, but I replaced this slot because I read it as Town and it is. I especially like the last paragraph.

P-Edit: I actually agree with Aubre for the most part of that post regarding my slot. I do, however disagree with the Town read on Dave. I think everything Dave has done has been NAI.

I'm glad you liked my post. I did too. On a serious note I don't exactly have much to say about this. The only thing I see commenting on is you considering Dave's actions being NAI vs. my slight town read, and even then I can't say much because I would have to talk about a game that is still ongoing that I played in with Transcend. Don't want to upset Mr. Gamma man.

I didn't like being called a noob when I've played for a bit, until I read your criteria. If that is your criteria, then I fit the bill for you. Eh.

this is the contradiction you made that your talking about that I supposedly didn't like right? If it isn't then I must have missed it in my quick skim.

-

Pre-edit. PATIENCE!!!!!!! I just woke up and doing this while making breakfast!

[Aubrey]

I'll probably do a deeper read of current events in a bit after I wake up a bit more. Alban annoyed me, but I need to ISO him to make sure my annoyance is validated.

[Aubrey]

Oh wait. 658 ended this morning. I can talk about it now. Dave literally pushed Transcend for the exact same reasoning I pushed him in said game. We were both townies in said game as well. While I understand this doesn't mean Dave is town 100% I think it looks good on his part, and it makes me think he is actively trying to place him which seems townie to me. It is a slight town lean mind you. Hence my Deja vu comment.

DONT FUCK IT UP DAVE! xoxoxo with love,

Aubrey.

ps. Dont fuck it up.

I fixed the size.

[Aubrey]

LOL, I'm not really that offended Lickery. It was just one of those "

This asshole

" moments.

[Aubrey]

I glanced through Keyen's ISO. I can see where people may consider his posts fluffy, but I'm not exactly seeing this as super scum. I'm also a bit biased since we seem to have similar ideas here and there. He understood my shit posting early on where as others failed to. We have similar thoughts on Dave. We both understand that Transcend is a bit of a wild card at times (well I assume so based on that one game). We clearly had issues with Eric's play for obvious reasons. I don't exactly consider him lurking when we have players like Deer and that hydra account that haven't said much as of recently. The argument of him considering everyone town and working from there doesn't seem all that scummy to me either. I can't say I understand why you would do that, but whatever. I work from null to X, but to each their own.

If I were to bring an argument forward against him, I'd say a good amount of his posts could easily come from either alignment. He however is bringing forward reads with some reasoning which is nice. I do find it interesting that people are shitting on him for some of his fluffy comments, but gamma never got mentioned. A number of his posts are also fluffy. There maybe other players with fluffy posts, but Gamma is the one other person who I distinctly recall having some fluff to his stuff.

--

Pre-edit. I am not an Alt account and I have never played with Dave. Unless Dave is an alt account.

[Aubrey]

Initially the timing felt as if you were trying to derail the wagon on dave. It could also have been a vote, while not for derailing, for distancing.

Sometimes scum try to stay away from the topic at hand. Even if they don't want to directly influence the said topic.

Do you still find eric's slot scummy?

I've basically skimmed the last 3-4 pages. On a skim, I'm much happier with the slot. As I said, my major issue with him was his contraditive attitude. "

Hey guys lets narrow down some lynch options right out the gate and get a move on, while I go sit in the corner and do nothing but complain!

" When BTD said he asked for a replacement, I basically nulled the spot of its ever so light scum lean since it is so early in the game.

Regarding Dave, I just found his early posts playful shitty early day 1 activities. Eh. The argument that town would never vote themselves is farfetched, and a lie. Yea. Not a very interesting wagon in my eyes right out the gate.

--

Holy shit this game is on fire this morning.

Your case against Eric was thin. Which is why I wrote 134.
Either what you are saying is true or you are backtracking coz you realised LQ is more active and persistent than Eric.
Also your backtracking and explanation appears defensive, and hence, suspicious.

And your case against Keyen or I is that much thicker?

My argument: X person looks as if they maybe attempting to be faking a proactive town stance.

Your arguments: X person is pushing a thin argument early game. X person is lurky-ish,

but I'll ignore other players who are also lurky-ish

.

I fixed the size.

[Aubrey]

I also un-voted the MOMENT Eric requested a replacement, not after he was replaced and LQ displayed immense activity. So scratch this crap of me backtracking cause

"I realized LQ is more active and persistent than Eric."

[Aubrey]

Initially the timing felt as if you were trying to derail the wagon on dave. It could also have been a vote, while not for derailing, for distancing.

Sometimes scum try to stay away from the topic at hand. Even if they don't want to directly influence the said topic.

Do you still find eric's slot scummy?

I've basically skimmed the last 3-4 pages. On a skim, I'm much happier with the slot. As I said, my major issue with him was his contraditive attitude. "

Hey guys lets narrow down some lynch options right out the gate and get a move on, while I go sit in the corner and do nothing but complain!

" When BTD said he asked for a replacement, I basically nulled the spot of its ever so light scum lean since it is so early in the game.

Regarding Dave, I just found his early posts playful shitty early day 1 activities. Eh. The argument that town would never vote themselves is farfetched, and a lie. Yea. Not a very interesting wagon in my eyes right out the gate.

--

Holy shit this game is on fire this morning.

Your case against Eric was thin. Which is why I wrote 134.
Either what you are saying is true or you are backtracking coz you realised LQ is more active and persistent than Eric.
Also your backtracking and explanation appears defensive, and hence, suspicious.

And your case against Keyen or I is that much thicker?

My argument: X person looks as if they maybe attempting to be faking a proactive town stance.

Your arguments: X person is pushing a thin argument early game. X person is lurky-ish,

but I'll ignore other players who are also lurky-ish

.

I don't like this post at all.

This feels very much like scum aubrey vs town alban.

Explain.

[Aubrey]

Cause literally he is suspect of me for my "

thin argument

" against Eric, but his arguments are just as thin as mine were. I've already admitted that my read on Eric based on his actions was only a slight scum lean to begin with.

[Aubrey]

Spoiler: Hella lot a Text

The comparison of arguments. It is meaningless unless you know for certain that one set of argument has to be correct.

Meaning, say alban's arguments are correct/consistent because he is town.

You comparing your set of arguments to his, either to solidify your set of arguments in his eyes (silly since he could be scum) or to weaken his set of arguments (not possible since that would mean you are scum). There is not much point to be made with that comparison in my eyes.

Alban seems to be voting me cause we differ in a few reads, and because I went against Eric for reasons he considered thin. In my POV his arguments were just as thin as mine were against Eric. Hell, LQ even AGREES with me for the pushes I made yet here you two are throwing a hissy fit over it. I've already explained that my read wasn't a strong damnable reason to vote him, but it was questionable and worth pushing. Bite me. As I said the Dave argument did not interest me, and keeping my shit vote on Gamma wasn't really worth anything.

About Eric, no, sorry there was nothing obviously scummy. He just wanted to quicken the game, and I kinda see his pov. You can say the same thing (about me feeling Eric was trustworthy coz he echoed my thoughts), and justify your town read about Dave, but the thing is his reads follow yours, where it is easy for him to sheep you, whereas Eric was alone then..in any case, it's a minor point. Just that don't given him towncred coz his thoughts appear similar to yours (I am comforted by reading your 2nd para - that it could come from either alignment).

I never said he was obviously 100% scummy. I said his activity was questionable, and a few people agreed with me. From memory, others just passed him off as easy lynchbait and went on their marry way. Fine, but that wasn't going to stop me from pursuing him.

The two of you not liking Day 1 and thinking it a bore is not the same as Dave suspecting Transcend for the same exact reasoning I did in my 658 town game. Anybody can sit there and say "

Omg day one is so lame, lets just lynch someone and move onto day 2. Omg day 1 sucks. lets get a move on and leave RVS. I'ma sit on my ass and do nothing useful

" That totally comes from scum or lazy ass noob town who doesn't know how to gather reads other than by NK analysis and a few other simple ways to try and find scum. Furthermore that action/attitude doesn't lead me to believe him possible town. Dave pushing Transcend for the exact same reason (literally) that I pushed him in 658 is a stronger way to begin determining his alignment however for myself. Hell, anybody pushing anybody would be a better tool to figure out one's alignment than what Eric was doing.

Regarding Keyen, my town lean is a good deal weaker than my Dave town lean. Needless to say he echoes my thoughts a bit regarding a few players and activities. Again, different than you and Eric finding day 1 a bore and useless. I maybe using the wrong words about how the two of you feel about day one, but I'm roughly in the right ball park here.

Keyen was definitely not lurking. I felt he was doing active-lurking. I am sure you know what it means. For me active lurking is more suspicious than just lurking.

I'm not going to fight you here. Yes I understand the difference, and I can kinda see where you are coming from here. That being said, I don't feel like Keyen is alone here which is why I'm a bit shocked you are only focusing on him.

About Gamma, well, 'shitting' on Keyen doesn't mean Gamma gets to go scot-free. It's just that I don't think Gamma did any fluffing. I found his playstyle normal.

Gamma hasnt impressed me and is full of fluff posts, or posts that dont expand into why he thinks or does X. Dave (though I townread him right now) could be placed in this position I think as well. This is why I'm questioning why you are only attacking Keyen. Do you townread those slots? What makes you not as suspect of them? Then we also have accounts that are straight up lurking, the Hydra even admitting to actively lurking. Surprised you haven't voiced concerns.

Spoiler:

Initially the timing felt as if you were trying to derail the wagon on dave. It could also have been a vote, while not for derailing, for distancing.

Sometimes scum try to stay away from the topic at hand. Even if they don't want to directly influence the said topic.

Do you still find eric's slot scummy?

I've basically skimmed the last 3-4 pages. On a skim, I'm much happier with the slot. As I said, my major issue with him was his contraditive attitude. "

Hey guys lets narrow down some lynch options right out the gate and get a move on, while I go sit in the corner and do nothing but complain!

" When BTD said he asked for a replacement, I basically nulled the spot of its ever so light scum lean since it is so early in the game.

Regarding Dave, I just found his early posts playful shitty early day 1 activities. Eh. The argument that town would never vote themselves is farfetched, and a lie. Yea. Not a very interesting wagon in my eyes right out the gate.

--

Holy shit this game is on fire this morning.

Your case against Eric was thin. Which is why I wrote 134.
Either what you are saying is true or you are backtracking coz you realised LQ is more active and persistent than Eric.
Also your backtracking and explanation appears defensive, and hence, suspicious.

And your case against Keyen or I is that much thicker?

My argument: X person looks as if they maybe attempting to be faking a proactive town stance.

Your arguments: X person is pushing a thin argument early game. X person is lurky-ish,

but I'll ignore other players who are also lurky-ish

.

Why would I ignore? What incentive do you see for me to do that? Unless you are implying I am scum or that I am scum with 'other players who are lurky-ish', why would I ignore them? And if you are implying I am scum and that's why I am doing it, you have no case on me, but you are using my arguments against me to build a case on me. That's a bit of a stretch.

btw, why those small size comments?

Why would you ignore? hmm. From my POV you are attacking Keyen for actively lurking, but I see other slots that dont seem to be doing much more than him overall. Incentive? Either a townie who is trying to find scum or scum trying to push a lynch based on a lurking argument, but might have friends who are lurking as well. I haven't decided which you fall into. If anything I'm just trying to understand where your coming from. as for the twisting your arguments against you, notice how I haven't voted you. Notice how I'm not calling out to people to vote you and building a "

LYNCH HIM

" argument against you. All I'm doing is defending myself and trying to understand you.

I also un-voted the MOMENT Eric requested a replacement, not after he was replaced and LQ displayed immense activity. So scratch this crap of me backtracking cause

"I realized LQ is more active and persistent than Eric."

I agree with this. I had forgotten about the positioning of your unvote.
But that brings me to another q.
If you really thought Eric was scummy, you shouldn't have unvoted before clearing his successor. I am not saying you are scummy or townie for doing that, but you can't use that argument in your favour either.

Again, I thought Eric was questionable. 100% scum, hell 75%, not so much. I basically let go of those suspicions because I understood that, and wanted to see what the new replacement would do. I've always found it kinda silly to force people to have to answer for someone else's actions. Now of course if the slot had a lot of suspicious activity that I thought had a good chance of being scum driven, and we were a few days ahead in the game, then i wouldn't be so quick to erase previous doubts.

Didn't I tell everybody that I town read everyone by default? And yes, Aubrey is my first real town read. The rest are just null town.

....saying "

I town-read everyone and work from there

" is a bit different than "

I null town read and work from there

" I think your sending mixed signals, and basically work from nulls to X in a very slightly different way. It's like your taking the proven till innocent idea into account but you understand that the "innocent" really isn't innocent until proven so as well. Basically you work form null to X.

--

All this jibber jabber about which is better: taking into account skill level and time played seems pointless to me.

Lastly and most importantly to answer your question about small text Alban. Flair and drama!

[Aubrey]

Noted.

[Aubrey]

I don't know how I feel about Toto. Please explain to me why it is so opportunistic? Like he said wouldn't it be more opportunistic regarding those who jumped on once the wagon began to build? In order...

--

Transcend: post 15 (total RVS)

Toto: Post 42 (Basically RVS it seems with like a hint of real questioning. Once he is pushed he says he wasn't fond of the suicidal play in post 125)

Lethargy: post 56 + 57 (continues adding onto the wagon saying he is deflecting and scum with Transcend. Latter part probably being RVS talk.)

Gamma: post 58 and post 61 (says obvious scum for the self vote. Eh. No, not necessarily.)

Dave: himself post 59 (I mean yea it's weird, but seems like playful town who doesn't care about being serious just yet. Seems a bit early for scum to freak out and think, "

Oh shit gotta do something crazy to get these peeps off me.

")

Ssbm: post 60 who is the final vote on the bandwagon who continued to add onto the wagon because he never addressed toto only to hop off immediately once he realizes the vote count, but was still interested in lynching/pushing the slot based on his comment in post 63.

--

So, why is Toto the most likely to be scum (should their be scum) on this wagon based on opportunism? I'd be interested in hearing Transcend chime in on this since he was the first person to argue this in post 97 + 101, but has now moved onto new votes.

--

phew. That outlines the whole Dave bandwagon pretty much.

[Aubrey]

post 324, I honestly have no clue what your talking about here. what is BW? $200? so lost.

[Aubrey]

LQ, you do realize that post is directed at you. no? Did you not say that you were suspicious of Toto based on his opportunistic vote? Even though you are voting a slot that clearly isn't here right now and has only made one post so far.

[Aubrey]

I'm a bit more interested in LQ's explanation.

[Aubrey]

Of course. You are copying his original read, so I'm curious as to what he thinks as well now that time has passed. I thought it was obvious that my original post was directed at you. My apologies for not being so blunt.

My post is a simple outline of the bandwagon that unfolded against Dave, and a question as to why you have picked Toto out of all the votes as being the most opportunistic. followed by interest in hearing Transcends thoughts on the matter since it was his original read on Toto that you are also following. It wouldn't hurt to also know why Transcend found it to be the most opportunistic as well. Take it for what you will. Obviously If i was scum I wouldn't admit "

oh yea i wrote that shit up to look like I was trying to figure out the game and was a bunch of filler shit.

"

[Aubrey]

Of course meaning "Hell yea I want to hear Transcends thought on it"

[Aubrey]

Like seriously, read the post. I'm straight up asking why is Toto's initial vote opportunistic, and why is he the most opportunistic out of the lot.

[Aubrey]

I dont fully understand what difference it makes what I categorize my post as being. I didn't understand this opportunistic argument you were making (nor did I really understand Transcends original statement, but sadly I think he is full of it sometimes so I ignored it) and I mostly did it for myself and others who may want to reference back to the bandwagon. More importantly, I did it so we all would have an illustration of what occurred for when you and Transcend answered why you thought he was the most opportunistic out of the lot. Which btw, you never did.

Further more, you never addressed why you are not voting him (since you have expressed doubt) but instead are voting an empty slot who has only made one post and clearly isnt here. Your vote, based not the reason you gave, would be better suited if he had made a second post later down the line that held little substance in correlation to his lurativity.

Can we make that a new word here? Lurkativity. Has a nice ring to it.

[Aubrey]

If you think his post is opportunistic, but don't think the others are, then it is the most opportunistic vote on the bandwagon. No?

[Aubrey]

I will agree though. He lacks substance.

[Aubrey]

You're a wall! You wall.

[Aubrey]

Maybe I don't see it exactly as opportunistic since I assume there was a bit of RVS BS thrown in there, hence why I'm having trouble understanding why you and he feel that way about Toto. When I do try and ignore the RVS BS it just looks like the others are just as guilty about being "opportunistic as he does."

Deer will get his ass prodded sooner or later, and then we will all expect adequate content from them. Hence again why I consider your vote as useful as my non existent vote. That is what I am trying to get at. It's why I'm like "

Why isnt he voting Toto then?

"

You making a big fuss about what type of post my post is still doesn't make much sense to me. Whatever though...Honestly I'm at the point where I think I can give you a slight town lean for what you're doing even if I don't fully agree with it in some aspects. At least you seem to be trying to force people to be accountable for their actions, considerate, and worried about things that harm the town in general.

[Aubrey]

I don't know how to word it, and I feel as if it is hard to explain. Basically I found his first vote as RVS even though he questioned and wanted to know why Dave un-voted Transcend. It just didnt feel like a question he asked because he really thought Dave was scummy, but rather because RVS expects you to vote someone for little to no reason in order to see how they react. You get a better reaction from some people when votes pile up a bit, and since transcend was voting him why not? That is what I felt like he was doing. Then the whole suicidal fiasco went down, and shit hit the fan.

Some people start RVS by making some stupid comment about someone's avi or name. Some people might have a buddy that they played with and they vote them for some stupid reason. Some people vote others due to something they did. I don't know. Just seems NAI to me.

[Aubrey]

Eh. Maybe you are correct. Maybe I am correct. Time will tell. I can't vote him solely based on his Dave vote. He remains null.

[Aubrey]

I'm not a fan of how Gamma is wording things...
Making it seem like we're both scum... >.>

What?

[Aubrey]

FUCK, THE GAME ATE MY POST! Ugh. Not going to be as eloquent.

@Keyen

Basically you're not voting anybody, but have said you have 2 scum leans, 1 town read, and everybody else null. One would suspect you would vote one of your scum leans. You don't like them because they are pushing you. It is

kinda

OMGUS, even if they are not voting you, because you are scum reading them only for their pressuring against you. Minus of course your dissaproval of Ssmb's crappy push against me.

[Aubrey]

Off topic question. I probably should have asked this sooner. This hydra. Is this one of those teacher student relationship things or two friends just kicking it? Just curious.

[Aubrey]

Regarding gamma, I'm kinda getting weak town vibes from him. Though I admit it is basically meta based, so I'm trying not to put to much emphasis on it in my read for him. I've played with scum and town Gamma once. His town game he did a lot of sheeping, fluffy posts, and at times did try to ask questions in order to sort slots. Scum gamma just threw out alignments and tried to seem proactive by accusing players left and right in order to seem like an aggressive townie.

Pre-edit: then he goes and does that. Ugh.

[Aubrey]

@Aubrey: remember I replaced into a widely scumread slot when I was scum.

I say I have slight town vibes from you then you go and taunt me. Smooth.

[Aubrey]

That being said, why in the hell would scum try and discredit a town lean on their slot...

[Aubrey]

I mean I can see a really good scum player seeing an opportunity in doing this in the hopes that it increases the likelihood of the town credit, but the question is are you that good? I want to say no, and believe you're just a smart butt townie who has to correct any sign of error he sees in a post. I say that with love and no hate btw.

[Aubrey]

Keyen's most recent post has me a bit vexed. Basically you're being pushed, you don't know how to answer the push, thus it's a scum push? I feel like you're choked, and just lashing out. This can kinda come from either alignment.

[Aubrey]

I partially agree and partially disagree. In the end, I cannot just follow someone's gut unless they are cleared and have a reputation worth following.

[Aubrey]

...VOTE: Lethargy

[Aubrey]

I don't think much of your slot so far. It doesn't help that I'm of the opinion that you are actually here reading and very much up to date, but choosing to not be proactive. Get with it. You signed up for a game, so play it. I don't care if only one head is here. Either you need to step up your slots town play, or you're scum trying to coast through the day.

[Aubrey]

I can't say I'm wowed by Dave's current commentary either right now, and I'm still curious for a more in depth explanation about post 368. His concern never crossed my mind. Like, what?

[Aubrey]

Gamma. You need to come to that decision on your own. Either you're interested in the game and willing to play it like any other game, or you're not. If you are not interested, then yes you should consider replacing out so that you're not a wasted spot.

[Aubrey]

let me add on. If you really are not all that interested in a game, don't join it just so it can fill.

[Aubrey]

[Aubrey]

yea, maybe you should replace if you're going to be inadequate just because of the current game set-up. Don't join games your not interested in.

[Aubrey]

I never said, Gamma you have to go. I said, if you're not interested in playing then you should consider replacing so that someone who really wants to play this set up can. Maybe not in that exact wordage, but my posts meant the same thing. He clearly joined and has been disinterested. He could have easily said, No I'm going to give it my all and play. I'm not going to take responsibility for his disinterest.

Eric, eh. Maybe I was a bit harsh, but I don't think I was out of line. He didn't make sense, and wasn't doing anything to progress the game. He then left, when all he had to do was actually attempt to push the game along in order to get me off of him. I'm not that sorry there.

[Aubrey]

I'll consider that for future reference I suppose. Gamma, I apologize if I pushed you over the edge. I don't always realize how much bite my posts can have sometimes. Granted I don't fully understand joining a game that you don't seem to passionate about just to fill it up, but that is none of my business.

[Aubrey]

I see nothing has really happened since I went to bed. Alban has a town lean.

[Aubrey]

I feel like the likelyhood of his reaction to gamma's abrupt desires to possibly leave came from a younger townie's mindset. It's a weak read, but it's better than what I have for a number of other slots. If he is scum, and I'm wrong, I feel as if I might be able to catch it later down the line since that would mean he is an aggressive scum.

lol hope you don't expect super solid reads right now. I rarely give strong town reads d1. Btw, it's clear deer is a empty slot until his VLA ends, so where is your vote gonna go? Seems like a waste to keep it there in my eyes.

[Aubrey]

And gamma said there wouldn't be any twists. I was banking you were going to say Toto.

[Aubrey]

I waver on Keyen.

[Aubrey]

Lmao. Sorry. I missed your unvote. On my phone.

[Aubrey]

I agree with Chilled in the fact that it seems like the slot is actively lurking (even with one head in a VLA status). Twice now the slot become more active once pressured, but when it is not pressured it is reserved. As I said, it appears to be coasting instead of proactively trying to move the game forward. That read list, coupled with its "

afterwards I'll answer any questions

", seems just like a quick fix in order to alleviate pressure and resume its lurking behavior.

I wonder if it's scared to play without the aid of its other head, or scared to make moves the other head doesn't agree with, but I find it hard to put to much care into the thought due to the slots overwhelmingly laid back nature before the VLA. Not to mention saying "

I'm just to lazy to play

" doesn't exactly help either.

[Aubrey]

Damn. It's like a nuke went down. I'll sort though this in more detail when I get home / later tonight.

[Aubrey]

Attacking this in order. (pre edit: attempting to)

(Pre pre pre pre Edit: It's late. I'm tired. I can't get this damn post to become one big spoiler. I apologize. Sorry. Night. Stopped reading at post 544.)

Spoiler:

UNVOTE
VOTE : Lethargy

This slot is 100% scum. Aubrey has moved up in my eyes. Currently looking at scum possibilities of lethargy, gamma and transcend, maybe ssbm and toto and cracker.

Cracker and deer haven't done much from what I gather.

Don't like gamma at all and he is my next best guess for scum.

Transcend is doing very little in comparison to his meta. His vote on toto is also unexplained.

Why is Gamma your second best scum guess out of everyone you suspect? Have you played with him before?

Spoiler:

I wonder if it's scared to play without the aid of its other head, or scared to make moves the other head doesn't agree with, but I find it hard to put to much care into the thought due to the slots overwhelmingly laid back nature before the VLA. Not to mention saying "

I'm just to lazy to play

" doesn't exactly help either.

That'll be the one. I'm new to the game and my other head is a lot better than me in general. I mostly want to observe in my first few games and gain expirience rather than attempt anything while I still have no real idea what I'm doing. Apologies if you don't like me playing that way.
The "lazy" bit wasn't meant very seriously.

-Mercy

You're probably telling the truth here. That being said, what you're saying is not alignment indicative I'm afraid. You told me you two were friends just kicking it as a hydra, but your description leads me to believe this is a bit of a teacher student gig in a sense. I'm still uneasy about your slot right now.

Spoiler:

That post from lethargy where he/she gives his "analysis" of the game when pushed was the most ridiculous one.

Really? They at least provided a reads list. More than a lot of people have done.

Agreed, however they did seem a bit generic. Including what I said prior to this post about them, the only thing to really take from it is that they have scum leans for Keyen and Gamma. Everything else seems like either basic observations or shallow reads that follow the general outlook of the town. I'd rather see an increase in proactive-ness vs. a reads list.

Pre Edit: If you scum read Keyen, why vote for Alban exactly? Especially after having a town lean on Alban? They've been going at it like cats and dogs.

--

Post 451:

Nothing suspect? We were suspicious of them because we considered them to be actively lurking. They even admitted to it (NAI). It isn't all that different than your active lurking suspicions on Keyen.

--

The votes on Cracker seem like a waste. The slot is basically empty since they are busy. I don't understand alban's freak out over two votes though. They are essentially pressure votes, yet he makes it sound like Cracker is near death.

Spoiler:

What the hell is the point of defending Cracker

Exactly.
I see no reason to defend someone against votes that really aren't even happening yet.
Seems like scum trying to get votes away from a buddy, but a really bad attempt.

Hmmm. Possible. 2 pressure votes shouldn't be enough to freak a scum with

some

skill though. I see 3 options. 1: He really wants to lynch Keyen, but doesn't think the town will come around to it, Or is taking to long to do so. 2: they are friends/familiars (confirmed later) so he feels a bit of a connection there. 3: young scum. All possible.

Spoiler:

ssbm, why quiet?

Interesting, and somewhat random. You start to come under fire and you try and move the discussion to ssbm? I can't tell if you were hoping for support, or trying to move the conversation away from yourself in this instant. I'd be more interested in dealing with the allegations coming my way than ssbm if I were under fire.

Spoiler:

Notice how Transcend and LQ have voted for her, and Chilled has already expressed suspicion.

I dont approve your logic here, but if that's what you think, you should vote for me rather than for her. Clearly, I am a better target to remove on day 1. You can handle her even later if she is scum.

And this is exactly my point for trying to find out scum among the stronger players.
Thinking about an absent player as scum is the worst signal you are sending out to the scum.

P-edit: IGMEOY too LQ. That was opportunistic.

This sends mixed messages to me. Line one: seems like you scum read them. Line two: makes me think you possibly town read them? Then this heroism...bleh. The last thing a townie should want is to cause a mislynch. If you know you're a townie, don't sit there and provoke a mislynch on yourself. That's just crap. Confirmed. They have probably played together since he makes her sound like not so good of a player.

To be blunt I thought it was hella weird for LQ to hop onto your metaphorical wagon when I first skimmed as well. Did seem opportunistic, like a free invitation you basically gave him with your cocky post 457. However, looking at your actions up to this point in detail, your actions kinda deserved scrutiny at that point. It's kinda hard to look at opportunism here, when you basically deserve the scrutiny a bit.



--
I find it hard to take anything Keyen says regarding Alban seriously simply because he doesnt seem to back his arguments up with anything. Gut is good at times, but you're going to need something more substantial to actually have influence over people.

Spoiler:

Keyen seriously, that's pitiful. Like you spent 6 months here, and that's all you got?

and I thought I was the abrasive one.

Spoiler:

Interesting.

Apart from your OMGUS on my reasons and vote for you (which are already stated if you could take the efforts of ISO-ing and finding out), you have nothing to prove my scumminess, have you? Let's see how you build your case against me:
Ohhh he is bullying me...
Ohhh he is pressuring me...
Ohh he is so badd.....
Ohh city, can't you see...
Ohh city, why won't you help me lynching him....

And that's all your reason to lynch me?
Keyen seriously, that's pitiful. Like you spent 6 months here, and that's all you got?

This is really overreacting and its not a good look.

Moar votes on alban.

Disagree. If I had someone like Keyen after me, I might get a bit frustrated as well. Hell, compare the two of them real quick. Logic vs gut. It's bound to lead to some frustration. Kinda obvious.

--

Regarding these jokes that Alban talked about in post 482...My funny bone must be acting up. I didn't always read some of your posts as jokes. The "I dare you" comment did not come across as a joke for example.

--

Spoiler:

Guess the Eric slot might have been scum.

LQ really did get a bit too happy with that momentum going.

hmmm. eh. I've already said it. Alban earned his scrutiny as far as I'm concerned. LQ's activity on the wagon was a bit odd though. I don't fully understand how you came to the conclusion he was town by him being "

pissed off

" or not. Seems like you unvoted the moment the wagon began to dwindle. Explain to me where and why you felt he became a townie for you. If you still think he is suspect, then your vote should still be on him.

Spoiler:

UNVOTE:

Alban isn't scum. I'll re-read the game when I have the time which isn't too soon. Might be in the weekends because I'm more active that times

The alban wagon dwindles, and suddenly you're cool with him? explain. Try not to just give me guts alone either. I wont be all that pleased if you do.

Spoiler:

If Gamma were present at the time, I would be at L-1 now.
So, I don't believe for one second your reason for keeping up the act. If you are a town, your playacting would have cost the town an unnecessary casualty.
But let's suppose you are right.
What conclusions have you drawn about the wagon?

VCA is not my thing at all. I basically just react to things. I just try to get good reads. That's really all I try and do. I am also really really bad at linking people together after flips. I am also really really bad at identifying PRs.

I didn't stereotype you correctly then.

--

I seriously doubt Alban and Key are aligned scum wise. I haven't decided if one is scum, or if they are both town at each others throats. I'm at the point where I'd rather see Key dead than Alban though if I had to choose.

Spoiler:

I think if alban is scum then either you or transcend are scum because something about that wagon stinks to high hell, it looked really contrived and it was gone in an instant, despite how scummy alban was acting throughout. Makes me think the accusation was fake in the first place and alban was putting on a show, but they were too obvious about it. It was either you and alban or Transcend and alban and like I said I think it's more likely to be Transcend.

Risky. In a setup like this, I don't know if scum would make such a bold play that would only put 1 of the 3 members up on a nice little pedestal while one member is possibly dead and the other fending for themselves. That doesn't really protect them, and kinda leaves them vulnerable to losing. Unless of course you think both scum voted for their ally...I think this is unlikely. One of those super big schemes that people talk about, but is rarely the case. Especially on day one.

I dont like these odd ball theories, and pushes that don't make a lot of sense.

Spoiler:

That's just my suspicion on one of you 2 being the second. I mean hell, you even said "I had to keep up the act for at least a little while." I guess maybe that's an indication it wasn't scum theater after all if you admit to it before I even point it out, but it definitely looked like something was disingenuous about how that wagon formed and faded so quickly. So maybe I'm wrong about there being a partner in you and Transcend, but what if Transcend was putting on a show too? Maybe when he said "something's not right" he was referring to your vote (since it was supposedly a reaction test) but he didn't recognize it was a test so he got out of there?

I don't agree with your conclusions on how alban reacted though. That all looked like scum overreacting to being caught.

There is a difference between a Town flipping a gasket and a Scum feeling like they were caught for the wrong reasons. I have insulted enough people with my reasoning that the victim doesn't understand to know the difference.

I'm at the point where I am numb in the head after analyzing all this...stuff. Once I hit this page I just started glazing through shit. Please explain.

[Aubrey]

Re reading my post I see I wasn't clear in a pre edit when I was regarding lethargy. Lethargy town read alban and scum read Keyen, yet voted for Alban...

[Aubrey]

@Aubrey: You were in Open 654. What do you think about my point against alban for attacking keyen when keyen called himself VI?

Hmm. It stems from flak you got when you said you felt like lynchbait in that game? I vaguely remember. Did you look back and see if only scum used this against you or if town also used it against you?

[Aubrey]

I'll go back and relook. I don't know if Alban is my first choice to lynch right now. To much fishy crap going on. Is his vi argument he used on Keyen the sole reason behind your distrust? Do you think he and cracker are aligned? Do you think it was a clever ploy to lure you back in the game? What did you make of the wagon that formed and disappeared while considering those on it? Is Keyen town for you?

He has defended a number of inactive players, are they likely scum? Do you think lethargy and he are scum aligned? Hell he defended Eric, do you think he and LQ are aligned?

You are looking at the whole story here and not just one chapter, right?

[Aubrey]

Quickly checked in while on break at work.

I dont see much to address regarding Alban's latest post. Just seems like a complaint post over all with some cockiness sprinkled in. @Gamma, I question the likelihood in that right now.

Aubrey, I was thinking about something. You said at one point that you were stereotyping the way that I play and then said you had me wrong. What kind of player did you think I was?

You said you suck at things that I thought you maybe decent at. That's all.

Back to work for me.

[Aubrey]

uhuh.

[Aubrey]

LQ the skit is null the slot is empty your vote is wasted

[Aubrey]

Slot*

[Aubrey]

then it will probably get replaced or come back with its promises. If it does come back, and is subpar then I won't have as much issue with your vote. Until then, I implore to actually place your vote onto someone you scumread. This is the third vote by you that has been a waste in my eyes.

[Aubrey]

You scum read them for NAI reasons then.

[Aubrey]

Your being unrealistic.

[Aubrey]

VOTE: LQ

[Aubrey]

2 poor votes. Maybe I was wrong about gamma.

[Aubrey]

Why are you following someone you potentially scumread alongside alban Gamma?

[Aubrey]

Ick. I retract that town lean.

[Aubrey]

why would town vote a slot that has been prodded? The slot will come back, catch up, and know it needs to actually post something useful reading frustrated comments about their absence. Or be replaced. A vote is unnecessary, and a safe place to be for scum in the meantime. I don't care for any of LQ's votes that much. Gamma following is just as ridiculous.

[Aubrey]

I've already addressed that LQ.

LQ the skit is null the slot is empty your vote is wasted

The slot has done the second less amount of content in this game and IIRC, isn't V/LA. No excuse. If you're not going to play the game you signed up for, you make an excellent lynch candidate.

then it will probably get replaced or come back with its promises. If it does come back, and is subpar then I won't have as much issue with your vote. Until then, I implore to actually place your vote onto someone you scumread. This is the third vote by you that has been a waste in my eyes.

[Aubrey]

You literally cannot sit there and tell me that slot is scum based on your intel LQ. That slot should be null through and through. You can be beyond pissed that they promised content, but have failed to produce it, and still have the slot as a null. That's what I'm doing, because in the end the action in itself if NAI. I do expect good content upon the return though. Lackluster content will earn her bad marks from me, as it should for others. This is not like active lurking, where they are posting just enough to avoid suspicion. That could be applied to other members of our little town. I legit think they are busy, and have been unable to play. I mean it took me all night just to go through 4 pages of crap, and post that lil guy yesterday.

Some people have busy lives, and join games against better judgement. Then they leave w/o a word and are replaced sometimes. Some people don't take the game seriously, and blow it off. Then they get replaced when time runs out. Some people have circumstances that come up, and literally can't play. Some people are not try hards and read and comment daily, and then they get swamped. There are tons of reasons for why they haven't shown up that is not indicative to alignment. This doesn't read as scum blowing the game off in order to avoid suspicion specifically. Totally could be a factor, but it is not the only factor here that can be considered.

As I said, voting that slot is so easy for scum to do. IT IS THE SAFEST PLACE TO ACTUALLY VOTE. Twice now you have voted slots that were so easy to vote that literally would allow you to be able to pick and prod the town to see where they would jump at without putting yourself out there. Its fishy behavior, and Im not a fan of it at all.

[Aubrey]

The fact that Gamma doesn't see this, even though we just came from a game in which he had two scum buddies who voted the easiest slot possible who was also not active like Cracker on day 1, is beyond me. The same goes will go for Transcend.

[Aubrey]

Unrealistic as hell. I've played many games where players did the same thing cracker has done and flipped town while promising to catch up. You're not going to sway me here in thinking they are scum based on not being here right now.

[Aubrey]

I don't care how easy the slot is to push, no one cares for what I was voting previously, so I hopped on something else

Yuck.

[Aubrey]

I'm still astonished by you Gamma. You believe Alban is scum, and think that he was being voted by one of his partners. Either Transcend or LQ. People don't really bite at what you're saying against Alban, but someone (me) starts to bring up a case against one of Alban's possible associates from your POV. Since Alban's wagon isn't going anywhere, you want to place your vote somewhere else. Instead of tagging along with the argument that goes against one of the possible conspirators with Alban, you decide to tag along with his line of reasoning against a player that isn't here, and is null? I'm so vexed. Again from your POV, you have reason to suspect Transcend maybe town via post 563, so shouldn't my stance seem more appealing to you? Hell shouldn't a stance that doesn't exactly follows LQ's stance seem more appealing to you? You aren't making much sense.

Furthermore, IN OUR PREVIOUS GAME you actually did not follow your scum buddies who were both voting Ari (who again did the same as Cracker is doing and was town). instead you distanced yourself by saying the spot was null/empty and not worth voting. Clearly you know scum are known to vote easy slots such as Cracker's. Yet, you don't care is this game...You do realize that this is hugely questionable activity?

[Aubrey]

I don't consider it a defense since I have no reason to. The slot is not threatened with being lynched in the slightest. It just has two people on it that I highly question right now.

[Aubrey]

Todays activates are rather boring. How's that update coming Cracker...

[Aubrey]

MOD

When is Deer going to get prodded?

[Aubrey]

Oh yea. The 6th...

[Aubrey]

I get a feeling this game is about to stall.

[Aubrey]

The performance of Lethargy, Dave, and Toto have been rather dull. These three slots are frustrating me a bit. I feel as if you all could add more to this game than what ya'll are doing. Gamma is confusing as usual. We have two basically empty slots so far. One guy, who is suspicious in my eyes, but claims to have a play style that is basically lynchbait-able due to an odd way of playing the game . Then on the other end we have Transcend who is just a plain wild card who throws out votes with little meat of reason and trolls. Keyen who can only give us gut reads, which aren't all that reliable. Alban who panics whenever I actually ask people to play the game.

Just, ugh.

[Aubrey]

So far I'd be willing to lynch these players.

LQ, Lethargy, Dave, Toto, Gamma, and Keyen.

Not in any particular order. Just people I wouldn't be completely opposed to lynching so far. To be blunt, I'd lynch anybody if it meant avoiding a no lynch.

[Aubrey]

The performance of Lethargy, Dave, and Toto have been rather dull. These three slots are frustrating me a bit. I feel as if you all could add more to this game than what ya'll are doing. Gamma is confusing as usual. We have two basically empty slots so far. One guy, who is suspicious in my eyes, but claims to have a play style that is basically lynchbait-able due to an odd way of playing the game . Then on the other end we have Transcend who is just a plain wild card who throws out votes with little meat of reason and trolls. Keyen who can only give us gut reads, which aren't all that reliable. Alban who panics whenever I actually ask people to play the game.

Just, ugh.

See, this is why you are Town.

Seriously. BESIDES deer or Cracker, who would you vote.

[Aubrey]

Oh yea. Ssbm. I don't know what I think about him yet. I don't agree with all of his pushes, but dammit I'll take someone who pushes at this point and asks questions.

Transcend asked the same question I was about to ask.

[Aubrey]

Chilled is null town but i want more from him.

^^^

[Aubrey]

Why is key town for you Transcend. I find it hard to place him.

[Aubrey]

Irony.

[Aubrey]

Wait, that might be the incorrect word. Whatever. Kinda f'n funny. I'm tired.

[Aubrey]

Vote someone Gamma. Plz and thank you. Ps: I have town by my name in my notes.

[Aubrey]

I think Transcend may be putting on an act
VOTE: Transcend

what do you think of LQ.

[Aubrey]

I was asking if you listed yourself in readslists
what were you thinking

Depends. Sometimes I will give a rundown of what I have done itt and use it as a way for people to read me. My point was that Transcend has pretty much just maken stances this game. Little room for being able to identify themselves how they have played so far from other peoples eyes.

The remark Transcend made about thinking I was serious when I made a blatantly sarcastic response on how he has solved the game is a little disturbing. Such arrogance isn't seen too often from players who are above average, but not particularly brilliant. Usually Players like that can see there are a lot of people who are better than them, thereby being humbled, thereby would never think to say something like that.

....What is the point of this? Transcend comes off as a lovable cocky ass golden retriever that you really wanna pet, but your scared he is that friendly looking dog that really really just wants to bite your arm off and bury it beside his dog house as you lay bleeding on the ground. Chances are, he is straight up cocky and thinks a lot of his skill. How is that alignment indicative?

--

I'm so sick of the word "

gut

"

[Aubrey]

When you say, "

A little disturbing

" it leaves one to assume so. I tend to use the term disturbed/ing when I'm suspicious of an action a player made. Apologies for the misunderstanding.

[Aubrey]

I do want to say one last thing, and then I'll shut up for awhile. It is essential in a set up like this that you play your town game to your best. It is just as important to prove to the town that you are a townie through your actions as much as it is to locate scum. Don't hang back and lurk. Don't think you can half ass your way through this one either. We don't have power roles to help. There will be no claiming. Poe is gonna be a bitch if townies are making poor choices and not trying to properly reach their win condition. Think through things and be sure to review from time to time. This game set up is a true test to prove how well you can make others town read you, AND locate mafia through effective scum hunting. There. That is my little pep talk. Go team.

[Aubrey]

Wow. A second nuke went off as I slumbered. I won't be able to address much until later evening.

[Aubrey]

*Transcend

Prolly the most lackluster post of this entire game.

As lackluster as some of your votes in my eyes. Least you're finally off of your Cracker high. Now you're voting Transcend. Didn't you say you played with him before though?

@chill town. For now.

I liked your reads on Eric/Dave

Something feels off about cracker here, i just don't know what.

Hi Transcend, do you remember our last game together?

I do hope eventually you have more than gut to go on.

Care to link it... If you played with a town Transcend, then you shouldn't be

that

shocked by how he is playing. I don't approve of his ambiguous play style, but should you have played with him as town before, then you shouldn't be shocked by it. Those who haven't played with town!Transcend don't exactly shock me with wanting to vote someone who plays the game as he does.

In short, you seem to be voting him for his play style (expected from those who haven't played with town transcend before), but not exactly his plays (what is expected from those who have played with a town Transcend).

[Aubrey]

I just don't like when people complain. So I complain when they do

In general, I won't have time to check in more than once a day. Maybe on weekends

but not this one because I'll be VL/A (@mod)

We are all voting randomly and not asking questions?....You're not the type who only cares about his pushes, but not other peoples pushes are ya? From what I can tell you've been hounding Dave and Gamma mostly. Gamma and Dave are easy pushes as far as I'm concerned that scum can easily push if they are town, and you haven't really shed light on anything else that has occurred.

You can talk about Alban's wagon that formed. You can talk about the forming wagons. Who you'd like to get rid of or keep. Those who support your ideas through their ideas or vise versa. Why Gamma is the best lynch over the other forming wagons. There's plenty to talk about right now.

Hell, I've even brought things up against and for Gamma throughout this game without a word of support or questionability from you. Yet you expect me to sit here and drool over your pushes? Come on now bud...

[Aubrey]

Honestly, I think meta reads are mostly shit.

From what I remember of Transcend in that game, he actually made an impact in that game. He was way more in your face as well, none of this just sitting back and not providing anything thing that we see him doing in this game.

I'll take a glance at it... I'm not very good at throughoutly examining games i don't actively partake in. I may even trudge through and glance at our recent game. From memory, I'm not seeing much difference.

[Aubrey]

Thanks btw for providing it again instead of making me go and seek it out.

[Aubrey]

If I were a day killing Vigilante, I'd shoot Lethargy.

[Aubrey]

Skimmed a few pages, then ISO'd Transcend. Hard to read much about him since he was a power-role, and obviously would want to deepen his reads and try to actively not die as much as a vanilla townie from the town. Then he dropped out.

Here is open 658. http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=68953

[Aubrey]

Is Chilled going to get prodded soon?

[Aubrey]

Lethargy and Deer as well. They gonna get prodded soon?

[Aubrey]

This game really isnt that enjoyable right now. I was so looking forward to it.

[Aubrey]

Why not. They aren't worth a whole lot. I mean damn, two players control the slot and barely do anything.

[Aubrey]

Skimmed a few pages, then ISO'd Transcend. Hard to read much about him since he was a power-role, and obviously would want to deepen his reads and try to actively not die as much as a vanilla townie from the town. Then he dropped out.

Here is open 658. http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=68953

I worded this weird. I meant to say he wouldn't want to die as much from the town or mafia as a power role in comparison to that of a vanilla townie role while gathering deeper reads since he was a 1 shot cop in LQ's game.

[Aubrey]

???! Alban doesn't like my pushes on the inactive, but turns tail and bitches about how inactive they are and need to bloody well play the game. Alban forgets who in the hell ive been pushing the most as if recent. Hint: he has posted the most this game. Reading Transcend based on meta isn't smart. He purposely plays ambiguous for a reason.

[Aubrey]

Did you compare your game to mine? Furthermore the game only has a select number of players playing, so it makes it harder to get good reads. He has also posted a reads list and is making plays with some reason as of lately. Like you I'm not a fan of his style, but I know he can be an assist if he is town. Hence why I'm hesitant to straight up vote him right now.

[Aubrey]

Don't worry, I thought you'd be a good asset if you were town at first till I started getting the creeps from your votes.

[Aubrey]

Transend

[Aubrey]

That was not a jab at your skill.

[Aubrey]

I also haven't placed Transcend yet. He ain't no townread of mine. I'm not not all that excited for why he is being voted.

[Aubrey]

Just not*

[Aubrey]

I may have thought you to be a more analytical player than an emotional player, but I'm smart enough to know that is not AI and not a reason to vote someone.

[Aubrey]

I may have thought you to be a more analytical player than an emotional player, but I'm smart enough to know that is not AI and not a reason to vote someone.

I play the game with a lot of fervor, yes. Hard to say if I am more of an emotional player or analytical player though.

Okay...let me try this again. yes I stereotyped you and thought you may play similar to another. Mhsmith is an example that I though you might be like. Then you said you weren't, as I noted, and I moved on. I'm not voting you because you didn't fit the stereotype.

[Aubrey]

I'm light toned compared to a good number of players your going to meet bud. if I'm overly abrasive the mod will step in. "Stop trying to take over the mods role." I think you said something similar. However if you are so offended, I'll remember to use lighter words when I speak with you.

Back to matters at hand, I'm an easy town read to dish out. Least I think so. Could be vain here.

[Aubrey]

Whats wrong with turn tail?

[Aubrey]

....

VOTE: Gamma

[Aubrey]

Gamma and Keyen are two slots I doubt I'll ever get a good solid read from.

[Aubrey]

Alban...

[Aubrey]

He's the mod.

[Aubrey]

It still means nothing.

^^^^

[Aubrey]

I don't understand where you were going with that.

[Aubrey]

UNVOTE: Gamma

Having second thoughts. May return to it though.

[Aubrey]

UNVOTE:

It isn't right

explain

[Aubrey]

i'm playing survivalistic and to get information my scumreads aren't getting lynched so i'm banking on being wrong

....so you don't really scum read Gamma?

[Aubrey]

I'll prolly sheep Transcend by deadline on reputation alone tbh but I will do a focused reread tomorrow, hosting a dank melee tournament at my house tonight so I'll be off.

Lame. See this is where I have issues with people who are voting Transcend though.

Not to mention if I were scum, and Transcend was town, I'd be setting myself up to vote him the moment I thought there might be a chance town would lynch him.

[Aubrey]

That being said, he really doesnt like Toto or SSBM...why join a wagon with him on it? Correct me if I'm wrong, Toto was the only one voting Gamma at the time, right? Only a few people had mentioned their distaste for Gamma's play till then. He couldn't vote Keyen since he had a gut town read on him. Why not just vote Toto since he scum read him, and people had issues with him?

[Aubrey]

In fact, if he is banking on being wrong, that means he town reads Gamma...? wtf. A townie should vote for the person they scum read, not bank on being wrong. Especially when their scum read has potential to build a wagon.

Hella super duper far fetched but haven't both Transcend and LQ shown issues towards Toto, but failed to vote the slot? I hope they aren't scum trying to distance one another, while keeping their votes off of Toto since people question his alignment. Transcend could vote LQ since it is apparent people aren't willing to vote him based on activity reasons....super fuck'n far fetched.

--

and? You voting solely on rep is poor scum hunting. It also gives you an easy way to vote the slot.

[Aubrey]

wanting to vote*

[Aubrey]

Ssbm.

I'll prolly sheep Transcend by deadline on reputation alone tbh but I will do a focused reread tomorrow, hosting a dank melee tournament at my house tonight so I'll be off.

Lame. See this is where I have issues with people who are voting Transcend though.

Not to mention

if I were scum, and Transcend was town, I'd be setting myself up to vote him the moment I thought there might be a chance town would lynch him.

To vote someone purely based on Rep is poor scum hunting logic. However if you're scum, it is a great tactic to use this as a "foot in the door" method of being able to vote a player you are scared of without having to bring forward a shred of reason for why. It is similar to how scum may vote a player based on poor activity rather than looking at the few posts they made and saying why they are scummy. Also, he seems to be waiting to see how the wagon will lean before committing to it.

Doesn't make me a happy camper.

[Aubrey]

I don't know if Ssbm is scum or not, but I don't like his reasoning for which he is willing to vote Transcend. On the flip side, I don't agree with Trancsend's Gamma vote either now that I'm examining it and seeing who is voting it. I want an explanation as to why he isnt voting a scum read of his and pushing it.

You're not exactly out of the dog house either LQ, but I'm willing to move on for now.



I'm watching you.

[Aubrey]

I'm good. If you're wanting me to find something imparticular, plz just show me instead of making me trudge though that long winded game with the strals.

[Aubrey]

I think Transcend purposely plays to be unreadable. Maybe a better statement is, "I don't think he cares to play in a easily readable way." Hence, voting him based on play style is not that great of a move in my eyes without some reason of doubt. Didn't do me much good my first game with him. I wouldn't expect those who haven't played with him to understand that. You seemed to have an interesting experience since he did seem to be more aggressive your game. He was however a power-role. I imagine that may have a factor in his vigor.

Voting him on rep is just poor imo. It's that attitude that helps make reputable players begin to play in ambiguous styles, stop playing, or etc. Least I would imagine so. I'd hate to be voted just because of a good rep.

You keep on and on about your game, did you ever glance though mine out of curiosity?

Lastly, I've just brought forward questions to him about his plays. Why are you so pushy for to me scum read him?

[Aubrey]

I agree. You should play the best to your win con. Being readable or unreadable is key. Enough with you treating me like some noob ass. That being said, some people don't do it. It's a fact. I understand those special individuals aren't going to change, so I need to learn how to begin getting reads on them, instead of just lynching them and hoping I get a scum lynch.

Transcend, answer me.

[Aubrey]

In fact, if he is banking on being wrong, that means he town reads Gamma...? wtf. A townie should vote for the person they scum read, not bank on being wrong. Especially when their scum read has potential to build a wagon.
.

More of a statement, but I want understanding.

[Aubrey]

Aubrey you know what sleeping is right? I said I was willing to sheep Transcend. That means I vote for who he votes for

"I will sheep transend" read as you were going to vote him alongside the others who where going to vote him. Sorry.

[Aubrey]

I can't say sheeping a player based on rep is better either though.

[Aubrey]

I agree. You should play the best to your win con. Being readable or unreadable is key. Enough with you treating me like some noob ass. That being said, some people don't do it. It's a fact. I understand those special individuals aren't going to change, so I need to learn how to begin getting reads on them, instead of just lynching them and hoping I get a scum lynch.

Transcend, answer me.

I don't mean to lecture you here, but how many times do we have to go over the same thing? Pro-Town is Pro-Active. You Cannot read a player who does not wish to be read.

DO

something about it.

Either you're scum really pushing to mislynch Transcend or you're town with some rigid views that doesnt exactly mesh with my own. Next up I am DOING something. I'm just not going to vote for the reasons you are voting because...

If I know a person purposely plays in an ambiguous style, irregardless of alignment, then of course I'm not going to solely vote them for that play style. That is just silly. At that point it's just luck if you land a scum kill. Instead I'm going to be looking at what they are doing, who they are voting, who is voting them, and etc.

[Aubrey]

wow. Re-reading, I'm a complete imbecile for misunderstanding Ssbm.

[Aubrey]

That being said, he really doesnt like Toto or SSBM...why join a wagon with him (Toto) on it? Correct me if I'm wrong, Toto was the only one voting Gamma at the time, right? a few people had mentioned their distaste for Gamma's play. He couldn't vote Keyen since he had a gut town read on him. Why not just vote Toto since he scum read him, and people had issues with him?

@Transcend, I think this is a better post to point you to in which I would like clarification on your thoughts.

[Aubrey]

Why are you so adamant about this stance with me? I seriously doubt either of us will change the others opinion on it.

[Aubrey]

adamant is probably the wrong word. I'm trying to mean persistent.

[Aubrey]

man people have no idea how to read me

it's great

because i've played this way as scum before

Which is rather annoying. Being this cocky about your ambiguous play just makes me want to lynch you. Especially when you play a set up that is highly centered around townies needing to showcase they are town in order to give scum less opportunities and less places to hide and deflect..

You never addressed my concerns.

[Aubrey]

Key Aubrey alban strong town

Gamma/LQ not on the same scum team, but one is scum. Strong lean LQ.

Dave is still prob a mislynch but just has questionable play.

Ssbm and toto are scumfucks

Deer and cracker are null

Lethargy prob lynchbait mislynch

Did i miss anyone?

You thought scum could be in gamma or LQ, but highly lean on LQ. Then you have Toto and Ssbm. Why bank on being wrong on Gamma when you could have voted Toto. People have issue with him, so it would have fit your surrvival needs. Gamma just reads like the less of your evils listed. Furthermore, one of your scum reads was voting Gamma. He has pushed him a lot through the game, so shouldn't you be hesitant about voting Gamma? And instead voting Toto. Even as reckless as you are, I feel town you would be more senseable here.

[Aubrey]

Don'tcha remember. He's going to sheep Transcend due to rep.

[Aubrey]

Also before Transcend shortens what little of a fuse I have left, why do you townread him?

[Aubrey]

So you and I do see things similarly then.

[Aubrey]

......

VOTE: SSBM

Either this is scum, or town who just made himself great lynchbait.

[Aubrey]

I find it hard to think Transcend and Alban are aligned. I find it silly for you to sheep based on rep. Especially since he is now scum reading you. If you are town, it should now be clear to you that his reads aren't super strong or correct right now from your POV. Or he is scum, and is happy to have such a delicious counter wagon against his own wagon.

In regards to what Alban said in favor of you in post 941, I disagree about SSBM not knowing who to vote as being townie. I find it NAI.

also as a side note, anybody can also complain right now about the current state of the game. Just because someone complains about it doesn't mean you should town read them for it. Scum can easily feign the same thing.

[Aubrey]

Weren't you basing your scumread on transcend due to a meta. You compared his gameplay in your game to this one, and seemed to have it as a leading factor....

[Aubrey]

....

[Aubrey]

I'm aware. I've said the same thing already. However, at one point you did compare his play from your game to this game. You've only payed one game with him...have you not set up a stereotypical idea of how he should play and voting him for it. Stereotypical maybe the wrong word, but you get my drift.

[Aubrey]

sigh

We are not going to go into a round two of that argument LQ.

-- Dear Diary...

My gut hates Toto and Lethargy the most. It really wants them dead. I maybe biased though against Lethargy's slot since I expected a lot more out of hydra.

My head hates LQ the most, but my gut kinda likes him. just a bit. (

shocking I know.

) Probably cause he and I are annoyed by the same things at least.

My head really likes Chilled, but my gut be thinking there maybe a skeleton in the closet...If there is one, maybe I could sell it on the black market.

UNVOTE: SSBM

I'm not opposed to a SSBM lynch. The one thing that really bothers me is, why would scum go after Alban? when the wagon lost momentum after T and LQ dropped off it? Isn't Keyen an easy spot to keep one's vote on as scum? Unless they are scum buddies...However the only tactical manevour here is if he thinks he can generate a wagon onto Alban through his accusations. Accusations that don't seem that likely to me right now.

VOTE: Toto for now.

Sincerely,
Aubrey.

[Aubrey]

[Aubrey]

Can someone sum up the case on Toto?

do you have reasons for why we should like him?

[Aubrey]

Can someone sum up the case on Toto?

do you have reasons for why we should like him?

I'm seeing pieces from multiple people and want a summary.

Cool. Answer my question.

[Aubrey]

Caaaaause I dont see anything I really like so far.

[Aubrey]

Do you?

[Aubrey]

????

Gamma, that is applicable to everyone.

[Aubrey]

.....?

[Aubrey]

Key's prob town too, btw.

My scum group atm is lethargy, aubrey, transcend and toto

. Transcend is obviously a very good scum player so he is there just for no reason.

UNVOTE
VOTE : Lethargy

This slot is 100% scum. Aubrey has moved up in my eyes.

Currently looking at scum possibilities of lethargy, gamma and transcend, maybe ssbm and toto and cracker.

Cracker and deer haven't done much from what I gather.

Don't like gamma at all and he is my next best guess for scum.

Transcend is doing very little in comparison to his meta. His vote on toto is also unexplained.

Aubrey is my town read for several reasons, he has followed my line of thinking regarding some events in the game and I find that to be difficult to be replicated by a scum member.

Alban is a town read.

LQ is still a semi town read but I didn't like his push on alban.

Lethargy, gamma are still my scumspects and

nothing has changed since my last reads list.

Sorry that I haven't done much, I was busy with work. But I am here now.

Soooo what happened here. You started out scum reading Toto....Now all of a sudden you dont understand why he is being scumread, ISO him, and he's all good.

[Aubrey]

If he were to flip scum, I'd be very interested in you Chilled.

[Aubrey]

He is at L2 btw. Should be 5 votes on him.

[Aubrey]

VOTE: Toto
You're targetting someone would could be easilly mislynched based on activity.

?

[Aubrey]

<_____________<

[Aubrey]

I HOPE WE CAN BE FRIENDS

Kill em <3

[Aubrey]

He's going to be fun

[Aubrey]

Can't hammer at l2

[Aubrey]

1: he is in a soft VLA.

2: He is at l2 not l1.

3: Looking through skin is disgusting. What are you. Superman?

[Aubrey]

oh yea.

4: Threatening to hammer someone, should they not answer by tonight, is kinda...Impatient and reckless. A bad virtue.