Open 675: Pick Your Power X/Y (Game Over!)

[Prince Lyon]

I feel like this is a game where I end up killed or discredited and I don't see how KTS gets lynched if I end up dead.

[Prince Lyon]

Wheme, does it not sketch you out that KTS voted you to force your claim and then immediately unvoted and called you town after you claimed?

You were saying shit about how it looks like people are forcing wagons for claims but the person that most fits that description is KTS.

[WhemePlay]

Everyone was doing it, Im not going to put the blame on one person.

[Transcend]

What's the case on kts

[WhemePlay]

Apparently he's the one starting all the wagons that are getting to people to reveal, according to Lyon.

[Prince Lyon]

He didn't start it. Other people started the wagon on you and I believe that they sincerely believed it. KTS jumped on without saying much about it then immediately after you claimed unvoted and jumped somewhere else.

[WhemePlay]

Its really hard to remember to put the signature after every post.

[Transcend]

Oh wow

Ask yourself this: when you do VCA in other games how often do you find scum at the beginning of the wagon rather than somewhere in the middle

Fucking morons

[Prince Lyon]

What's the case on kts

Push on me is sketchy.
Jump off of the Wheme wagon is sketchy.
Can't really follow his read progression or thought process throughout the game.

I don't think that I'm good at reading him given that I almost tracked him in our last newbie but this feels different. This feels very deliberate.

[Transcend]

He didn't start it. Other people started the wagon on you and I believe that they sincerely believed it. KTS jumped on without saying much about it then immediately after you claimed unvoted and jumped somewhere else.

Am i not doing the same thing

[Transcend]

Oh okay so this is just another case of rc ego omgusing

[Prince Lyon]

I think your jump off wheme sucked but I townread you for unrelated things. And no and that's a shitty way to look at it; I have scumread KTS since long before he voted me.

[Prince Lyon]

Another way of asking this question: why do you townread him so much?

[WhemePlay]

What about Dave then? He jumped on the wagon randomly and his reason was that he was sleeping and it was good enough of a reason. Didn't state any reason.

[WhemePlay]

What about Dave then? He jumped on the wagon randomly and his reason was that he was sleeping and it was good enough of a reason. Didn't state any reason.

If I recall correctly he's also the one who put me at L-1?

[bangthemafia]

Trans, what are you? Pouncing on anyone that comes your way?

My bad again. Usually I like to keep commenting as I catch up. But I thought this time will read everything, ISO everyone and then post my reads. But got thrilled at this "Alt" thing and thought I must post!

Guys, seriously! Just let me catch up and post. You are focussing at the wrong place
Pedit: Dunn, bad vote.

I would like to point out that BTM tried to find a ridiculous reason to clear Titus and also discredited the push on Alban so if you think he's scum you should want to help me pressure the Titus/Alban pair.

Seriously. You guys are so high on Adrenaline.

I did NOT know what or how "Alt" functions before posting, ok? I thought its somewhat like masons. I also didnt know the vote count.

Also, I know Alban and his playstyle. Have to read everything people posted before making mind, right? I am telling you I was planning to do ISO on every player and then post my reads. Its just that I saw Giga post saying he knows Prince is Titus. What do I make of that?

Idk. I don't think it's something that we deal with right now. If a scum watcher flips though we pretty much autolynch Spade.

@Prince, please explain this for lesser mortals like me! What has a scum watcher flip got to do with Spade?

I have no idea what you guys are rambling about. Stop overanalyzing my posts.

I thought it would bring a wifom situation essentially. Me saying protective powers please protect Schadd, means they can choose to protect or not. So mafia would have to take a risk in trying to night kill Schadd.

Sheeesh!!!

I know Spade's style too. This is just his playstyle. Though those posts about Schadd being Nighkill target were unnecessary, I dont think Scum!Spade is naive enough to suddenly come into limelight by making these posts out of blue.

So you find the above two reactions as town but the below one as scum? Care to explain it further?

The others are less cautious and follow the more likely path of starting with the lurker might be scum (though that's a site meta that needs some serious fixing imo). Though Persivul's is more the skeptic path, it's still a "this might be scum" kind of reaction which is weakly townie. You on the other hand seem to have a preconception that I'm town, which only scum should have.

Seems like you are just going along with what everyone is saying.

Who or what sayings am I going along with? Are you concerned about something here?

Diasgree. A pissed off Town!Spade can talk very curtly. Nothing scummy about it

VOTE: Spade

This was a BAD vote and without any reasoning. Thats BAD.

I don't necessarily disagree, but care to explain why?

VOTE: Spade

Sheeping Titus. Don't hink i have ever done that before.
I also don't like Spade's speculation on reasons for schadd to be alive tomorrow. Setting up WINFOM shit.

That was a quick wagon!

That sounds like a setup to explain why they are still alive.

I also don't like Spade's speculation on reasons for schadd to be alive tomorrow.

Why do you say that? Do you feel Schadd is scum??

I can see people jumping on Spade for those 2 posts. But I dont think that was scummy. Like, yes, Spade could still be a scum, and he is quite good at it. But I am not ready to suspect him for those 2 posts right now.

VOTE: Spade

VOTE: Titus

That was quite a quick change of mind!

oh shoot bang might be mafia ;-;

Completed reading everything. And cant stop laughing!!! Understand why everyone jumped on me!

The thing is that I keep feeling getting influenced my last played game. Of course I can be wrong, but I tend to keep thinking the frustrations usually arise from town mindset. Whether that applies to Giga-Alban interaction or not, I am not confident. Nevertheless, I just hope it is not a scum-scum charade. Right now, I will ISO each player and then make up my mind.

By the way, my reads till now-
Strong town- Transcend, Prince Lyon, GigabyteTroubadour
Town lean- Alban, Spade_Ace
Null- Dunnstral, schadd_, PenguinPower, WhemePlay
Scum lean- davesaz, Killthestory, Persivul, Titus

VOTE: Davesaz

But I will shift to Titus if that wagon builds.

Nothing much in last 6-7 pages. Somehow I still feel alban is town. I would love someone to walk me through his scummy points. Spade, your reason of scumreading alban because he is not scumreading you sucks totally. Is there anything else?

I am posting here whatever I could find in last 6-7 pages reading post by post. Have also done some ISO's and post them separately.

I am fine lynching someone from my scummiest reads- Titus > Davesaz > Whemmeplay > Killthestory = Persivul = Spade.

VOTE: Spade

VOTE: Spade

You both need to explain your votes.

My VCA mini too early theory says you're scum. The fear response is noted.

@Titus. please explain this.

Looking at draft numbers and VCs, bang is likely the third.

Hows this? And who arethe other 2 you scumread?

Titus is at L-1. Please claim.

@Spade, why do you expect a claim? Do you feel Titus has a PR? I am not sure but I think you agreed to someone's theory of Uzi replacing out due to vanilla frustration. Also, how does a PR claim decide alignment? If mafia were higher up in list, they would also get PRs, right?

The on my town role she can claim is VT. How would any other claim sway you?

Didnt understand this.

lyon when titus replaces into scum slots does she still do vca like she does when replacing into a town slot?

idk the way shes doing it here still feels off to me and i cant rly put into words why

Not directed at me, but I've seen her misuse VCA as scum more often than she uses it at all as town.

Thats important information. Thank you. But can someone else who has played with Titus earlier confirm / refute this?

wait, this is te game with bangthemafia? yeah let's lynch him,

davesaz always a viable option

penguinpower always a viable option

I am frustrated. Why cant you guys give reasons for your reads? I thought thats a common way of letting the town assess your thought process and whether they agree to it or find faults with your thought process.

WhaT THE he'll sheLl where IS MY VOTE .

VOTE: bang

You are just useless. No point even engaging with you. You haven’t done anything towny for me. Just sending your one liners, commenting on others’ posts, being mildly aggressive, jumping your votes all over, without giving any solid reasons, you haven’t even given your complete list of reads.

I don't necessarily disagree, but care to explain why?

This was for Titus voting for Spade. So he agrees with Titus about Spade. But doesnt vote for Spade.

Sorting Uzi will be unnecessary, except as it relates to Titus.
I think Titus is very unusual this game. Upbeat entrance "let's rock this" or something like that, and then she fell flat. Which is kinda what Uzi did too.
That is informative, but unfortunately it may not be AI.

Throws shade on Titus, but keeps options open by saying its NAI. Timing of this post is bad. It is at the time when Spade wagon started dying and Titus wagon started picking up. More like basework for future voteparking. If Davesaz flips scum, I would suspect Spade as his scumbuddy.

VOTE: Titus
So unlike town!Titus I've seen many times. The one time I've seen Titus avoid she was scum and I called it.
L-2

lyon when titus replaces into scum slots does she still do vca like she does when replacing into a town slot?

idk the way shes doing it here still feels off to me and i cant rly put into words why

Not directed at me, but I've seen her misuse VCA as scum more often than she uses it at all as town.

Need confirmation from others.
Plus that Davesaz is the scummiest guy in the 1's. So if there is atleast 1 scum in 1’s, it is Davesaz in most probability.

I can't find who said it but
Someone posted about schadd being a target tonight but pr protect them.
That sounds like a setup to explain why they are still alive.
Why would they say that or try to lead protectives?

So he suspects "someone" who said that (Spade in his 116 and 118)

there's a certain thing i'm thinking about 116 & 118, and i'm wondering if anyone else sees it

I don't think I'm seeing what you see. But I see those posts as useless. Makes no sense to post them IMO.

Now those posts are "useless"

I also don't see enough to vote Spade

VOTE: Spade

Sheeping Titus. Don't hink i have ever done that before.
I also don't like Spade's speculation on reasons for schadd to be alive tomorrow. Setting up WINFOM shit.

Again suspecting Spade just on those 2 posts, suspecting enough to vote. After that unvoting, voting Titus, again going back to Spade-

The on my town role she can claim is VT. How would any other claim sway you?

The only town role she can claim is VT, if she is a scum. If she claims any other town role, would you not be swayed??

VOTE: spade

Just to bend completely backwards, this could be an undecided townie in like a rare world, but in all other worlds, this is 1 obvscum.

@Prince, whats wrong with 570? Lurkers are scum or not, or scum wpuld lurk or not is always a wifom. I can see both the points. But why would u giv a free pass to lurkers? And more importantly, if someone disagrees with ur reasoning, why is that a scumtell for u. I think the more rigid/tunnelled/closed/monosyllablic townies become, the more we harm town.

@Spade, I really dont know. Till now I hav not been able to see anything really hard-scummy there. I know he is extremely busy, travelling to cities and has joined new job. But apart from the activity, which is really NAI, I didmt see anything unusual. As I said few tens of pages back, I start almost every game scumreading my last game's scum. Then i tell myself not to get tunnelled and overdo that. So i think right now, unless i see something really scummy or unless there are some associative tells after few flips, i m not for alban lynch so early.

By the way, what do u feel about my 672 post and Whemmeplay?

All I am seeing in Bang's iso is that he is scum. He is using on of my favorite scum strats, acting oblivious, to deflect attention. He is going against people for acting friendly but with the way I see things, a Bang Spade team is a serious possibility. Everything seems thought out and detached, no emotion shown.

VOTE: Bang

I would be willing to go Spade as well if that is how th rest of the town wants to go.

Dude you just suck, did anyone tell you that? Go read the games Spade posted.

[bangthemafia]

Let's lynch in this and see if anyone has any complaints: {Dave Titus bang Alban PenguinPower giga}

I am not sure about anyone else hitting a scum. I m comfortable voting only for Dave or even Titus.

[bangthemafia]

Sorry for forgetting to use spoiler tags in 1590.

[bangthemafia]

Transcend -
Why do your reads keep changing constantly? You town read bang, scum read him, then went back to town reading him, and now you are voting him.
Your other two votes after your read list I am fine with, because you put me and Titus in your scum reads and voted both of us. I want to know why you are voting Bang though, I think the idea of voting people and making them claim then moving on to the next person is really dumb. Which is what I feel like we are doing right now.

Gigabyte -
I think your town. You have been telling people to slow down and think at different points in the game. Don't think scum would do that.

Alban -
Post #185 is me.
I think your town, GJ.

Arona -
Keeps posting in this pink color font, strong moderator read here.

Bang -
Can someone please tell me why we are voting Bang? His ISO makes me think he is town.
I have never been so annoyed at how my name's been spelled.

Davesaz -
You're just cruising along this game. You got 20 posts in 61 pages. Really? Scum reading you.
Your second and last vote was you sheeping lol.

Dunnstral -
Why is Bang scum besides "he is awkward scum". What does that even mean?
Why'd you ask in 1260 why people are voting Alban and then vote him in 1261?

KilltheStory -
I like you for now.

Titus -
Why the vote on Bang??? I don't get it.
Definitely feel like if you were scum your vote would of been on me. Makes me think your town.

Taking a break for now. Part 2 will most likely come tomorrow, I am tired and this is a long read.
This isn't really a readlist, more of what I think right now. Im not done though, this can change.

-Wheme

Good that you finally started talking. And I liked how you are asking reasons for people's reads. But dont white knight me. Its very clear to me that there are only 2 reasons for my wagon-
1. Maybe my way of reacting to people/post is different. I write as i think and usually keep second guessing my reads as town. I also observe, ask questions before making reads, so people feel I m not taking a stand.
2. There are a few "Mr know it all" one line posters in this game who will spend pages trolling or discussing non game things, but will not giv reasons/explanations for their reads, and still will think no end of themselves amd their reads!

[bangthemafia]

Forget it Lyon. I understood.

Yeah so I know schadds role if others are telling the truth.

Yes. So Schadds has the role that you wanted. Thats why I didn't want you to disclose the role you bid for. Since you know that role, you can also try to think the utility of both those role options from town and scum point of view. If its something that benefits scum much more we have some leads for day 2

[bangthemafia]

Damn, really thought I was going to get a pro town power role but ended up with Vanilla Townie.

bro, I am vanilla town. CONFIRMED

DUDE I AM TOWN.

It IS OBV

Same here! Didnt they tell you I am a confirmed town? Well, I am saying it NOW!

[Transcend]

BANG IS TOWN FINAL ANSWER REGIS

[Dunnstral]

Trans, what are you? Pouncing on anyone that comes your way?

My bad again. Usually I like to keep commenting as I catch up. But I thought this time will read everything, ISO everyone and then post my reads. But got thrilled at this "Alt" thing and thought I must post!

Guys, seriously! Just let me catch up and post. You are focussing at the wrong place
Pedit: Dunn, bad vote.

I would like to point out that BTM tried to find a ridiculous reason to clear Titus and also discredited the push on Alban so if you think he's scum you should want to help me pressure the Titus/Alban pair.

Seriously. You guys are so high on Adrenaline.

I did NOT know what or how "Alt" functions before posting, ok? I thought its somewhat like masons. I also didnt know the vote count.

Also, I know Alban and his playstyle. Have to read everything people posted before making mind, right? I am telling you I was planning to do ISO on every player and then post my reads. Its just that I saw Giga post saying he knows Prince is Titus. What do I make of that?

Idk. I don't think it's something that we deal with right now. If a scum watcher flips though we pretty much autolynch Spade.

@Prince, please explain this for lesser mortals like me! What has a scum watcher flip got to do with Spade?

I have no idea what you guys are rambling about. Stop overanalyzing my posts.

I thought it would bring a wifom situation essentially. Me saying protective powers please protect Schadd, means they can choose to protect or not. So mafia would have to take a risk in trying to night kill Schadd.

Sheeesh!!!

I know Spade's style too. This is just his playstyle. Though those posts about Schadd being Nighkill target were unnecessary, I dont think Scum!Spade is naive enough to suddenly come into limelight by making these posts out of blue.

So you find the above two reactions as town but the below one as scum? Care to explain it further?

The others are less cautious and follow the more likely path of starting with the lurker might be scum (though that's a site meta that needs some serious fixing imo). Though Persivul's is more the skeptic path, it's still a "this might be scum" kind of reaction which is weakly townie. You on the other hand seem to have a preconception that I'm town, which only scum should have.

Seems like you are just going along with what everyone is saying.

Who or what sayings am I going along with? Are you concerned about something here?

Diasgree. A pissed off Town!Spade can talk very curtly. Nothing scummy about it

VOTE: Spade

This was a BAD vote and without any reasoning. Thats BAD.

I don't necessarily disagree, but care to explain why?

VOTE: Spade

Sheeping Titus. Don't hink i have ever done that before.
I also don't like Spade's speculation on reasons for schadd to be alive tomorrow. Setting up WINFOM shit.

That was a quick wagon!

That sounds like a setup to explain why they are still alive.

I also don't like Spade's speculation on reasons for schadd to be alive tomorrow.

Why do you say that? Do you feel Schadd is scum??

I can see people jumping on Spade for those 2 posts. But I dont think that was scummy. Like, yes, Spade could still be a scum, and he is quite good at it. But I am not ready to suspect him for those 2 posts right now.

VOTE: Spade

VOTE: Titus

That was quite a quick change of mind!

oh shoot bang might be mafia ;-;

Completed reading everything. And cant stop laughing!!! Understand why everyone jumped on me!

The thing is that I keep feeling getting influenced my last played game. Of course I can be wrong, but I tend to keep thinking the frustrations usually arise from town mindset. Whether that applies to Giga-Alban interaction or not, I am not confident. Nevertheless, I just hope it is not a scum-scum charade. Right now, I will ISO each player and then make up my mind.

By the way, my reads till now-
Strong town- Transcend, Prince Lyon, GigabyteTroubadour
Town lean- Alban, Spade_Ace
Null- Dunnstral, schadd_, PenguinPower, WhemePlay
Scum lean- davesaz, Killthestory, Persivul, Titus

VOTE: Davesaz

But I will shift to Titus if that wagon builds.

Nothing much in last 6-7 pages. Somehow I still feel alban is town. I would love someone to walk me through his scummy points. Spade, your reason of scumreading alban because he is not scumreading you sucks totally. Is there anything else?

I am posting here whatever I could find in last 6-7 pages reading post by post. Have also done some ISO's and post them separately.

I am fine lynching someone from my scummiest reads- Titus > Davesaz > Whemmeplay > Killthestory = Persivul = Spade.

VOTE: Spade

VOTE: Spade

You both need to explain your votes.

My VCA mini too early theory says you're scum. The fear response is noted.

@Titus. please explain this.

Looking at draft numbers and VCs, bang is likely the third.

Hows this? And who arethe other 2 you scumread?

Titus is at L-1. Please claim.

@Spade, why do you expect a claim? Do you feel Titus has a PR? I am not sure but I think you agreed to someone's theory of Uzi replacing out due to vanilla frustration. Also, how does a PR claim decide alignment? If mafia were higher up in list, they would also get PRs, right?

The on my town role she can claim is VT. How would any other claim sway you?

Didnt understand this.

lyon when titus replaces into scum slots does she still do vca like she does when replacing into a town slot?

idk the way shes doing it here still feels off to me and i cant rly put into words why

Not directed at me, but I've seen her misuse VCA as scum more often than she uses it at all as town.

Thats important information. Thank you. But can someone else who has played with Titus earlier confirm / refute this?

wait, this is te game with bangthemafia? yeah let's lynch him,

davesaz always a viable option

penguinpower always a viable option

I am frustrated. Why cant you guys give reasons for your reads? I thought thats a common way of letting the town assess your thought process and whether they agree to it or find faults with your thought process.

WhaT THE he'll sheLl where IS MY VOTE .

VOTE: bang

You are just useless. No point even engaging with you. You haven’t done anything towny for me. Just sending your one liners, commenting on others’ posts, being mildly aggressive, jumping your votes all over, without giving any solid reasons, you haven’t even given your complete list of reads.

I don't necessarily disagree, but care to explain why?

This was for Titus voting for Spade. So he agrees with Titus about Spade. But doesnt vote for Spade.

Sorting Uzi will be unnecessary, except as it relates to Titus.
I think Titus is very unusual this game. Upbeat entrance "let's rock this" or something like that, and then she fell flat. Which is kinda what Uzi did too.
That is informative, but unfortunately it may not be AI.

Throws shade on Titus, but keeps options open by saying its NAI. Timing of this post is bad. It is at the time when Spade wagon started dying and Titus wagon started picking up. More like basework for future voteparking. If Davesaz flips scum, I would suspect Spade as his scumbuddy.

VOTE: Titus
So unlike town!Titus I've seen many times. The one time I've seen Titus avoid she was scum and I called it.
L-2

lyon when titus replaces into scum slots does she still do vca like she does when replacing into a town slot?

idk the way shes doing it here still feels off to me and i cant rly put into words why

Not directed at me, but I've seen her misuse VCA as scum more often than she uses it at all as town.

Need confirmation from others.
Plus that Davesaz is the scummiest guy in the 1's. So if there is atleast 1 scum in 1’s, it is Davesaz in most probability.

I can't find who said it but
Someone posted about schadd being a target tonight but pr protect them.
That sounds like a setup to explain why they are still alive.
Why would they say that or try to lead protectives?

So he suspects "someone" who said that (Spade in his 116 and 118)

there's a certain thing i'm thinking about 116 & 118, and i'm wondering if anyone else sees it

I don't think I'm seeing what you see. But I see those posts as useless. Makes no sense to post them IMO.

Now those posts are "useless"

I also don't see enough to vote Spade

VOTE: Spade

Sheeping Titus. Don't hink i have ever done that before.
I also don't like Spade's speculation on reasons for schadd to be alive tomorrow. Setting up WINFOM shit.

Again suspecting Spade just on those 2 posts, suspecting enough to vote. After that unvoting, voting Titus, again going back to Spade-

The on my town role she can claim is VT. How would any other claim sway you?

The only town role she can claim is VT, if she is a scum. If she claims any other town role, would you not be swayed??

VOTE: spade

Just to bend completely backwards, this could be an undecided townie in like a rare world, but in all other worlds, this is 1 obvscum.

@Prince, whats wrong with 570? Lurkers are scum or not, or scum wpuld lurk or not is always a wifom. I can see both the points. But why would u giv a free pass to lurkers? And more importantly, if someone disagrees with ur reasoning, why is that a scumtell for u. I think the more rigid/tunnelled/closed/monosyllablic townies become, the more we harm town.

@Spade, I really dont know. Till now I hav not been able to see anything really hard-scummy there. I know he is extremely busy, travelling to cities and has joined new job. But apart from the activity, which is really NAI, I didmt see anything unusual. As I said few tens of pages back, I start almost every game scumreading my last game's scum. Then i tell myself not to get tunnelled and overdo that. So i think right now, unless i see something really scummy or unless there are some associative tells after few flips, i m not for alban lynch so early.

By the way, what do u feel about my 672 post and Whemmeplay?

All I am seeing in Bang's iso is that he is scum. He is using on of my favorite scum strats, acting oblivious, to deflect attention. He is going against people for acting friendly but with the way I see things, a Bang Spade team is a serious possibility. Everything seems thought out and detached, no emotion shown.

VOTE: Bang

I would be willing to go Spade as well if that is how th rest of the town wants to go.

Dude you just suck, did anyone tell you that? Go read the games Spade posted.

weak

[Transcend]

use a spoiler next time

[bangthemafia]

Bang as Town - 674 , 671

Bang as scum - 657

Bang is probably town.

Thanks Spade! The town game, though was not 674, but 664 instead.