Mini 1887 - Oddrole Mafia (Game over)

[Viridian]

So, those voting for McMenno are arguing that even though only ~half the people that have targeted Dwlee this game showed up as a result for arona's autopsy, it totally still means "a list of people that came into contact with Dwlee this game" as opposed to "people who killed Dwlee99 this game," and that this makes McMenno the most likely person to be scum in the game either because of or in spite of his claim. Am I understanding this correctly?

[Socrates]

Well, that's what my comment about being screwed over by mod error was about, because if he did commit an error, there's little chance of us being able to untangle it without the game being compromised.

And I forgot about Rando's claim. There's always the possibility that he lied somehow and for some reason.

If arona lied about the results of their ability, then kudos to them for creatively sowing chaos and that would happen to disprove your statement that your power couldn't be abused by an anti-town role.

But there's also a possibility that the mod took a third interpretation of the role, and only revealed who targeted Dwlee LAST night, rather than for the whole game. What this would mean is that I roleblocked dwlee last night (for possibly the second night in a row) and McMenno killed Dwlee. Under such a scenario, I could not have blocked the mafia nightkill and there's no other means of explaining it's absence, which would imply that McMenno himself is the mafia.

We do need clarification on how the role works, but I'm surprised that neither you nor Arona had already asked these questions.

[Socrates]

Like, did your role PM just say what it said in the list thread verbatim?

[Socrates]

But yeah put yourself in my shoes. I look at the player list for mafia, and by POE I'm basically down to McMenno and Titus. And then this happens.

If YOU'RE somehow scum by means that I failed to recognize, then kudos to you, you put way more work into this game than you needed to.

[Socrates]

Well, I'm signing off for the night.

In case the town decides to lynch me, a warning: there is a very good chance that the mafia endgames us TONIGHT between possible third party role interaction and the possibility of killing the immortal's lover. If everyone is who they seem to be, then rando might need to goo Momo's slot just to prevent a double kill.

[Viridian]

No, my slot's original role PM doesn't have further info. It didn't really occur to me to look into it until now bc I replaced in after McMenno claimed the Dwlee99 kill and was just like, huh I guess I get why my predecessor waited to use this and then focused on other things, like how to try to assess the alignment of the former daykiller by seeing if they were willing to clear me, etc

[Titus]

Titus, did you shuffle on N1?
Everyone: thoughts on arona now?

No. I felt that would be anti-town. I only shuffled after momo claimed immune. If his role was switched, we might get a nightkill stopped or get the daykiller into competent hands.

I need to talk to arona. I am reading slots by emotional tone and less by mechanics until I can put more time in, which is likely tomorrow night/Sunday

[aronagrundy]

I'm just going to quote the wiki here:

The Forensic Investigator is an investigative role that can target a dead player to learn the names of everyone who targeted that dead player since the beginning of the game. For instance, if Player A Tracks Player B on Night 1, Player C Jails Player B on Night 2, Scum D kills Player B on Night 3, and Forensic Investigator E examines Player B on Night 4; Player E will receive a result saying that players A, C, D, and E targeted Player B at some point. Despite how this example turned out, the order in which the names are listed should be arbitrary (that is, not exactly in the order in which they targeted the player).

[aronagrundy]

i think everyone's overthinking this and mcmenno is flailing

[aronagrundy]

So, those voting for McMenno are arguing that even though only ~half the people that have targeted Dwlee this game showed up as a result for arona's autopsy, it totally still means "a list of people that came into contact with Dwlee this game" as opposed to "people who killed Dwlee99 this game," and that this makes McMenno the most likely person to be scum in the game either because of or in spite of his claim. Am I understanding this correctly?

wait
UNVOTE:

randommidget who did you target n1?

[aronagrundy]

Am I really supposed to believe mcmenno and scum targeted dwelee last night? It seems pretty unlikely

[Randomnamechange]

Let's be honest, Bork Bork claiming grey goo wasn't going to save him. He MIGHT have been the motivator, though, and that would have been important information to know. Can shuffler be pro-town? He might have been the shuffler, too.

Those are two pieces of missing information that the scum can take advantage off, I guess.

Let's resolve this, though:

Rando: There's no point in hiding it at this point. Who did you target last night?

i targetted dwlee both nights. i was trying to figure out if i was the goo-er or not. if someone else got goo ed then i was the motivator, if someone else got motivated then i was the goo.
socrates has some good points here, but we need to ask the mod about role functionalities first. im rly tired atm so im going to re read the last few pages to make sure i understand them later

[McMenno]

I'm just going to quote the wiki here:

The Forensic Investigator is an investigative role that can target a dead player to learn the names of everyone who targeted that dead player since the beginning of the game. For instance, if Player A Tracks Player B on Night 1, Player C Jails Player B on Night 2, Scum D kills Player B on Night 3, and Forensic Investigator E examines Player B on Night 4; Player E will receive a result saying that players A, C, D, and E targeted Player B at some point. Despite how this example turned out, the order in which the names are listed should be arbitrary (that is, not exactly in the order in which they targeted the player).

THE WIKI. DOES. NOT. MATTER. did you know that the wiki page for masons includes a bit about the possibility of scum masons? I do, because someone tried to apply it to an entirely different situation (they were town too)

yes

roles "might" resolve a little differently from the role list (like the immortal role announcing it's been killed) but not so

drastically

. EAGERSNAKE DIDN'T MAKE IT AN ENTIRELY DIFFERENT ROLE. YOU HAVE A *LITERAL* FUCKING GUILTY AND YOU ARE SO CONFBIASED THAT YOU JUST HANDWAVE IT AWAY.

goodbye

[aronagrundy]

This game is bastard tho

Btw yes i am currently questioning the results because rm didn't show up. I pm'd the mod

[Titus]

i think everyone's overthinking this and mcmenno is flailing

I think he's scum flailing though. Saying someone is guilty because they didn't come at you hard enough is hella scummy.

[McMenno]

This game is bastard tho

Btw yes i am currently questioning the results because rm didn't show up. I pm'd the mod

the game is bastard thus everyone has a secret win condition thus you are secretly mafia... verily spoopy

[aronagrundy]

i think everyone's overthinking this and mcmenno is flailing

I think he's scum flailing though. Saying someone is guilty because they didn't come at you hard enough is hella scummy.

Yeah but like I said I'm interested in how to interpret the result.

[Socrates]

Let's be honest, Bork Bork claiming grey goo wasn't going to save him. He MIGHT have been the motivator, though, and that would have been important information to know. Can shuffler be pro-town? He might have been the shuffler, too.

Those are two pieces of missing information that the scum can take advantage off, I guess.

Let's resolve this, though:

Rando: There's no point in hiding it at this point. Who did you target last night?

i targetted dwlee both nights. i was trying to figure out if i was the goo-er or not. if someone else got goo ed then i was the motivator, if someone else got motivated then i was the goo.
socrates has some good points here, but we need to ask the mod about role functionalities first. im rly tired atm so im going to re read the last few pages to make sure i understand them later

Whelp.

[Socrates]

I didn't go 2 for 2 on mod errors, but I did go 2 for 2 on games with stupidly overpowered towns.

I suppose this is what Prana was ranting about day 1.

[McMenno]

finally

can we win now

[aronagrundy]

socrates are you claiming scum or what

[McMenno]

how dense are you on a scale from god scumhunter to ignoring claimed scum with a guilty on them

[aronagrundy]

well jeez idk maybe he just really cares about game balance

[Socrates]

Like, mods, it's no fun to play as scum and to know that regardless of how well you play, you are just going to lose to some mindless power role. Please stop putting those kinds of roles in your games.

A fucking Sensor?

And now a fucking Forensic Investigator? The role that is literally noted as being "Tremendously overpowered" in the wiki? And this is actually an

even better

version?

At least make your investigative roles require some kind of thought to use.

[aronagrundy]

that sucks and i'm sorry, but who's ready to have some fun with some pre-flip associations