Gay Mafia 3: Trumpocalypse Now D8

[Nachomamma8]

{Desperado, DrippingGoofball, Tammy} - If there's scum in this tier, it's DGB. I think that her giving kuribo a gun is extremely town considering their relationship together; she crumbed she would give the gun to kuribo before he townread her and he never gave her an explicit townread before she put a gun in her hand. I feel this is a less likely move to make when she's lurky, not confident in being able to fool him. There are worlds where she/kuribo are scum together again and trying some strange carnival of lunacy gambit again but that really doesn't look to be the case right now, especially when kuribo continues to get townier and townier.

{Kuribo, Majiffy, Brian Skies, Ser Arthur Dayne} - SAD's been putting in a lot of effort this game, he has some very genuine thought processes and some very good thoughts. For a while I was paranoid because he was pushing the policy lynch angle but he dropped that pretty effortlessly which is a good sign and I think some of our recent interactions (as well as the interactions with kuribo) look pretty good. I'd be surprised to see any of these people flip scum, all of them have pretty natural scumhunting processes (excepting the jiffster), so I suppose that makes Majiffy the weakest of those reads - this doesn't at all seem like his approach as scum but he could have decided that he would try his hand at AtEing in a really weird way?

{-Grey-, Vaxkiller, Syryana} - -Grey-'s posting looks fairly town but there exists a tinfoil world where he's scum that decided to play completely balls to the wall to get townread; I don't find it particularly likely and I really like the emotional edge to his Titus/Alisae read despite disagreeing with it. Vaxkiller has a pretty town looking role, but there could be mod shenanigans/he could be lying his ass off to buy a day but it doesn't seem particularly likely. Syryana hasn't really done anything scummy in my eyes and has a really nice interaction with me, but that's a read I'd trust Tammy more on.

{Wraith, Kise} - I see decent reasons for both being scum, but they are likelier town than not because of role-related reasons. Waiting to see how this sorts itself out.

{Hocho Knife, hiplop} - Both players prefer scum, both players have interactions where they pushed odd targets in a way where it doesn't seem like it's coming from scum. Katsuki pushed Kuribo and then fucked off (moving to self-vote later) and have a stronger personal read there but Spiffeh's strong hiplop endorsement is something I'm factoring in for him and I don't think this is hiplop's scumplay when Spiffeh is his partner.

{Spiffeh, Cephir} - Neither looks particularly scummy, but am mostly townreading both. Spiffeh and I haven't been on the same page a lot which is an absolutely horrible way to read him so not particularly taking it into account, I thought Cephrir's miller claim looked really town for Pine-related reasons but now I'm not so sure considering the constantly townreading him syndrome.

{Pine} - Thought he was town by role, find the showing up in thread and then messing with Trump to be vaguely townish, but the complete lack of investment is fairly brutal in general and so bullets away.

{Little Red Fedora, Albert B. Rampage} - Talked about why I find Fedora scummy, talked about why I find ABR scummy.

[Nachomamma8]

It's just really weird that I'm looking for 6 scum in these names, which means that {Wraith, Kise} are just a scum lunacy pair or my reads are just absolute garbage, but not sure where they're bad.

I guess my reasons for kuribo but he's waaaaaay townier than he was in Gumball (don't understand Spiffeh's comparison at all; his anger that game was mostly directed at M&M and certainly didn't go on heavy rants on townies). I have no doubts that his rage is real and while that's usually not alignment-indicative his frustration at people softly shading him while he's a universal townread and him actually trying to read DGB/Katsuki/Majiffy (he didn't put much work into faking reading Katsuki in Gumball) looks good to me. Majiffy being scum just seems absurd to me; I can see him being bored with the game and just moving on but him getting instantly pissed with the enabler argument (and obviously having genuine emotion surrounding it considering he's still bringing it up now) doesn't seem like it was faked at all and it's not something it makes sense, don't understand the OMGUS argument Spiffeh was wheeling out against him from PT stuff (and it weirdly enough looked like his argument against Firebringer in DEFCON??). Brian Skies as scum, I guess maybe? His solving seems the most focused out of pretty much anyone else in the game and he keeps bringing up good points and I know I keep making Kuribo in Wonderland references but it just doesn't feel like the same person here.

Grey being scum seems like an easy solution; picked up on Alisae/Titus doctor eerily early and started speccing about them in thread might be some fucked convoluted distancing and I do think that the Desperado isn't the real Trump rampage was ultimately distracting but if he's scum with the Fedora slot those are some masterpiece level interactions (suspicion to townreading to suspicion to townreading, scum partners typically don't fake such complicated relationships with one another over the course of a day), and his constant going against the grain and pushing fucking hard against the grain makes him look like a lone wolf townie all the way. If he did decide to go absolutely freaking insane this game then his reactions where he very much seems offended and hurt by people's interactions with him are also masterfully faked, and I still really like his post about Titus to me that he made before he left yesterday. I just don't think there are any worlds where he's scum, probably would move him back up if I did the readslist again.

Vaxkiller I guess could be scum. Watchers are stronger than shit in town hands and we have lots of claimed power floating around already (cop + doc + watcher is already pretty fucking ridiculous even without taking Trump into account), but the "everyone who I see visiting someone else gets my name" bit throws me off - I guess names aren't indicative of alignment (can't be if we have Kise the name checker floating around in addition to that cop who is definitely town) and gays could be wearing bigoted skins in order to pass, but sweet fucking shit. Syryana could be scum if he just felt weirdly comfortable throwing his weight in this game. This is where I want TAMMY INPUT (@TAMMY: AM I LETTING SYRYANA CHARM ME OVERMUCH?).

Wraith I could see being scum for the reads switches and checking out but checking out is a decently strong plague in a game like this, so it's decently understandable. Still feels town for the reasons I noted, and Kise checking his name is a pretty big boon to him. Kise being name checker could be sketchy when we have so many other powers, but it seems like a pretty fucking risky play to claim something that needs killing eventually; will probably feel differently about how town his claim looks if the scumteam has oddball flavor.

I don't think Katsuki looks scummy at all which is pretty absurd but EP has been underwhelming and disappointing while they have been in the game. I feel strange about them being OK with Katsuki fakeclaiming and I feel weird about them letting Katsuki drive without any input, so really would like to see something from them eventually. Hiplop hasn't done jack shit which apparently aligns closely with his town play; could be town and would be surprised if he were scum just because of how strongly he pushed on me/Tammy (especially Tammy) but it's certainly not a townread that I'm comfortable with when I'm really hurting for scumreads.

Spiffeh has some moments where he'll make a push on someone and I'll die a little bit inside (don't understand Majiffy, recent Kuribo pushes) but I think I'm too harsh on him for not agreeing with me in general (Gumball is probably where I pushed the hell out of him for trying to lynch scum? or something like that?). I don't think his play here looks like his play in DEFCON, he's a lot more comfortable with getting in people's faces with how town he is but I really would feel a lot better if he took a more active role in solving. I also find his LRF townread kind of weird and wish he would talk about and look at their behavior a bit and am weirded that I've asked a few times but he's never really gotten around to it. Ceph I don't think looks scummy but my methodology for reading him sucks and that miller reasoning earlier sucks and if he flipped scum I wouldn't be completely surprised. REALLY WOULD APPRECIATE TAMMY INPUT HERE AS WELL.

Pine's role is really weird if he's scum and a role he's almost certainly telling the truth about since so many pieces of it are confirmable. If he had more pieces of his play that looked vaguely town I'd be happy to slot him in as town but SAD's right at this point, play is king and I need him to look town by play before he comes close to being in any town group ever.

[Nachomamma8]

So really I could see anyone being scum below the -Grey- line but feel pretty good about everyone above that. I don't imagine that Vaxkiller/Syryana will flip scum (Syryana just feels too good and Vaxkiller has the role) but those pieces of reasoning have the possibility of being shot down/changing later, so if those two step it up in later days/get themselves killed then we profit and hooray!

I might cry if xyzzy is town but I feel okay about that lynch again, just wish we would have waited until I had time to work with Tammy on this final version of thoughts. My current view of what to do is to clear through Fedora/ABR and see how many scum we get and then see how many more townies become more painfully obvious/how many get cleared through roles/what we learn in general.

[Brian Skies]

Grey is probably the person I'm least comfortable scumreading right now.

Vax I have some doubts on, but looking at his recent posting, I'm not sure that's scumposting. I see why you might have issue with the 'everyone who i see" thing, but I think knowing the actual person going somewhere might be a lot better than just being told the role or its name.

[Nachomamma8]

My concern is more with his "everyone who I see gets my player name" aka he's not confirmed as Jan Brewer, people just get his name when he successfully watches them.

Which in retrospect makes more sense but it doesn't confirm him as town anymore if that's the case which is now a concern.

[Brian Skies]

Oh that makes sense. Why would you think him being confirmed as Jan Brewer confirms him as a Watcher though? I think the important thing is knowing if he actually visited who he says he did.

I also prefer to read people outside their 'role', but take the way they play their 'role' into account.

[Nachomamma8]

I thought that confirming him as 'Jan Brewer' aka a person on the Trump side would be decent confirmation that he was town.
Knowing that he's watching who he's supposed to watch is good but not as good.

[Brian Skies]

I'm going to be completely honest with you. I'm not going to be helpful in the way of flavor.

[Brian Skies]

What do you think of Vax's interactions with Fedora starting here? And his follow up here?

[Nachomamma8]

Definitely seems genuine from Vax's end (especially the follow-up). Don't think they're partners, but that's not a particularly helpful revelation.

[Brian Skies]

Okay, well, I'm only online because I'm still not that comfortable with my last readslist (and it kinda makes me feel like I could be delusional or a lunatic), and you just happened to be online. So if you have anything you'd like to ask me, I'm open to talking about it. Otherwise I'm heading to bed.

[Nachomamma8]

I can't be that helpful with making you feel less delusional or less like a lunatic for a reads list that is probably just completely wrong because that's the extremely wonderful position I'm sitting in right now.

If you have anything that stands out to you in a big way about my block of reads then I'd appreciate you bringing it up but otherwise I'm probably just sleeping and praying for Tammy to stroll in and fix everything.

[Nachomamma8]

What do you think of the top 7 townreads on my list?

[Brian Skies]

I have Ceph and Spiffeh in place of your DGB and Majiffy. I feel comfortable reading Ceph as town, although I can understand if you're just paranoid of him. I haven't experienced his scumgame like you have. Spiffeh being scum requires incredibly deep scumplay that Kise is comfortable speculating, but I'm not. I'm mostly deferring Majiffy to you. I feel comfortable calling DGB town.

[Brian Skies]

Nacho
Tammy, Desp, Ceph
Kuribo, SAD, Spiffeh
Kise, DGB
Syryana, Wraith, Vax
Majiffy, hiplop
Grey, Hocho
Pine, Albert
Fedora

[Nachomamma8]

Spiffeh being scum requires incredibly deep scumplay

?

Why is Ceph so high? Why are you townreading him?

[-Grey-]

Nacho
Tammy, Desp, Ceph
Kuribo, SAD, Spiffeh
Kise, DGB
Syryana, Wraith, Vax
Majiffy, hiplop
Grey, Hocho
Pine, Albert
Fedora

C'mon man, I should at least be higher than hiplop.

[Brian Skies]

It's hard to explain. But I generally liked his early interactions with Kuribo and him engaging with Fedora's post that I hate so much. I also like his general reactions to things I also have similar issues with, and I don't think he's been dropping his suspicions in any places. Admittedly, I haven't been following his recent posts as closely as I have before, but the way he goes about his reads and the tone of his posts feel good to me. Except Majiffy v Ceph. I'm still not a fan of that 1v1 and I'm not sure how to read it since I'm not sure what the basis or the foundation of it is.

Also I'm pretty biased. As long as he continues to make things I think are townish, I'll probably continue to townread him until he does something I think is scummy. He's also the play whose posts I've paid the most attention to until you started engaging me (at which point I may have forgotten he existed).

[Nachomamma8]

Oh and also the what deep play does Spiffeh being scum require?

And also you can pass out any time, I'm losing focus fast and am distracted so I'm not really a good talking partner at the moment.

[Brian Skies]

Kise suspects that there could have been an Xyxyxy, Fedora, Spiffeh triple-confirm gambit. I think it's possible Spiffeh is just town here.

Like, I can see the scumteam just trying to buddy a townie for towncred. I don't think that third step to get a scummate in there is really necessary. And based on Spiffeh claiming to be in the neighborhood, I can see him doing everything he can to keep the wagon off of FF as town on D1.

[Brian Skies]

I also liked his reaction to my fake hammer. So there's that too.

[-Grey-]

And based on Spiffeh claiming to be in the neighborhood, I can see him doing everything he can to keep the wagon off of FF as town on D1.

He like, almost never talks in there actually.

The hood is pretty dead, tbh.

[Brian Skies]

There's also this weird oscillation of his read on me that I'm not sure is fake.

[Brian Skies]

And based on Spiffeh claiming to be in the neighborhood, I can see him doing everything he can to keep the wagon off of FF as town on D1.

He like, almost never talks in there actually.

The hood is pretty dead, tbh.

Then I like him even more.

[Brian Skies]

Nacho
Tammy, Desp, Ceph
Kuribo, SAD, Spiffeh
Kise, DGB
Syryana, Wraith, Vax, Grey
Majiffy, hiplop

Grey,

Hocho
Pine, Albert
Fedora