Open 680: C9++ (Abandoned due to mod error. See new thread)

[FireScreamer]

Seems to me if he is leaning into his bombastic nature for scum reasons he doesn't have to unvote Toejam slot on this page. He can just lean on his own self confidence as a reason why the slot is still scum.

[Green Crayons]

I don't understand the point.

Comm unvoted the tojam slot. I mean, it's a thing Comm did. Regardless of Comm's alignment, he did it.

Comm is taking a "look at me I'm amazing you're shit" attitude, which is not alignment indicative. But in conjunction with that, Comm said/did scummy shit.

Comm then decided to unvote tojam. What's alignment indicative in unvoting tojam that makes his previous non-alignment indicative "hey look I'm a conceited asshole" style town?

[Green Crayons]

if he is leaning into his bombastic nature for scum reasons

He's leaning into it because that's who he is. As a person.

As in, he wouldn't shy away from it just because he grabs town/scum alignment.

<says this purely off of Comm's own description of his own play, and actions in this game>

[FireScreamer]

He's considering options, not just building up a counterwagon to himself. He wants to lynch scum, not just whoever.

I mean he came into the game and pushed you. But that clearly wasn't going to go anywhere, so is it more likely a 2scum2scum move or did he have genuine reservations about you and had the zealousness of town to go after you anyway?

[FireScreamer]

I'm just very nervous that nobody is asking these questions or taking the other side at all.

[Green Crayons]

not just building up a counterwagon

I thought it notable that, in his freakout over the tojam-counterwagon theory, he tried to discredit the notion that tojam was a counterwagon to his wagon. He also didn't own up to selecting tojam out of the plethora of other players because tojam actually had traction.

Like, you can bet your ass if my head's on the chopping block, I'm going to be pretty incentivized to vote the next most-popular wagon. Unless if you're VT and that other player is a town PR -- which you don't know, and even then, that's simply a more complicated situation -- the most optimal play is for town to keep themselves alive because they know for a fact they are town.

Comm not wanting to own up to that resembles what scum would do: not wanting to own up that they're most concerned about staying alive for fear of appearing anti-town.

[RoryMK]

@Rory

Comm is coming off as a huge dick everyone is refusing to trust his gut. Then he talks about it could take a couple days or potentially until mylo/lylo? No dude we are not giving anyone benefit of the doubt for that damn long. Getting frustrated at how FS and GC are trying to take charge reads as scum to me. I have seen scum get frustrated at Town players taking over the game because they can't do anything about it and they feel like they have no chance in that situation. Calling one of them RC as an attempt at an insult is just icing on the cake here.

Thanks. I'll try rereading Comm later today.

[RoryMK]

@Rory

Can you explain why Ircher is a good pick Rory? I have Shannon marked as town and one of the major reasons was the way they defended the Ircher slot. Seemed more townie to me than the rest. However, that itself does not cover if Ircher is actually scum (if he is, that adds to further Shannon being town as scum would be pulling some risky stuff going hardcore defending at that point, especially when flips and connections start being made).

Honestly, Frank is just sour I called him out. Probably going to remain butthurt all day about it too.

@Alchemist, what to take away from my play: I'll 1v1 anyone, anytime, anywhere. If you fail to gain anything from my back and forth with someone, then that's on you, no one else. I got enough of FS and GC for the day to feel comfortable to make connections once we get a red flip. But now Frank, toejam and Ircher need sorting for me. Also take it from anyone who've played with me. Being noted by me will come back and bite you if you're scum. Because I'm like a WoMD when I set my crosshairs on someone.

I think my notes about Ircher should tell you enough about why I'm scumreading Ircher. Did you read them? I'm not sure why you drag shannon into my Ircher read, because I don't think her defense impacts Irchers alignment in any way.

[RoryMK]

Tojam's replace-out is obviously unethical, but also obviously town.

why? I could see this as not being able to handle the pressure and giving up by replacing out.

Cool, so there we have it. If tojam flips red, I'm voting GC tomorrow with no room for movement. He's try harding now to protect his buddy after he replaces out, using it as some excuse to push back toward myself. Nice backpeddling. Now I want tojam to flip even more.

1. We're not flipping tojam.
2. We're not flipping GC.

Yep, I'm confident in my wager now. I'm going to raise the stakes here is how confident I am of my reads. If toe flips green, I'll hammer myself tomorrow, if he flips red, you meet the noose D2 and town gets two scum in a row.

Or are you going to fold your cards and not call my wager? I'm confident in my reads. Are you in yours?

This is bad, especially if you're town.

You know what Alchemist. I'm going to give you a lesson on my behaviour.
*snip*

Do you have a scumgame on this site? If not then I don't see the point of you showcasing your townplay.

[RoryMK]

I don't like lynching replace-ins until I get to read them a bit unless I have a cop guilty or equal value on that slot

if this is true. Then why did this happen:

In fact I will.

Ari/TB replace me out and tell LlamaFluff to remove me from the Open Games mod queue

Edited to fix bolding and mention that this has been noted.

And my vote stays on toejam.

[FireScreamer]

Oh I think I totally just glossed over 589 and 593. Why on earth was I defending him

[davesaz]

Fredrick E. Campbell replaces Tojam2!

Fredrick E Campbell has requested replacement.

Protip: at least skim the gamestate before replacing in.

The 2nd replace out gives me a completely different vibe that almost completely eliminates the reason that tojam2 might replace out as town.
Now it's at most NAI and trending toward scum.

[Umlaut]

Dave, I kind of agree but I want to at least see what the new replacement does before deciding.

[FrankJaeger]

UNVOTE:
No point staying on a stale pressure vote. I need more from FrankJaeger to really sort the slot and I think it will come.

CommKnight is trying to appeal to his own authority as a reason for cases, instead of pressing the actual case. I really don't like that. (Pedit: I don't care what your rate is, though I suspect delusions of grandeur)

I can see a possible town reason for tojam to replace out.

??

[FrankJaeger]

More? Im waiting on you

[FrankJaeger]

Fredrick E Campbell has requested replacement.

My laugh for the day

[FrankJaeger]

Fredrick E. Campbell replaces Tojam2!

Fredrick E Campbell has requested replacement.

Protip: at least skim the gamestate before replacing in.

The 2nd replace out gives me a completely different vibe that almost completely eliminates the reason that tojam2 might replace out as town.
Now it's at most NAI and trending toward scum.

That last line kinda doesnt correlate

[FireScreamer]

Feels like grasping at straws to keep the Comm alternative alive. Really wanna just flip Comm now

[FireScreamer]

VOTE: Commknight

That's L -1. Lolhammering is a scum claim

[davesaz]

More? Im waiting on you

More generally, not more in response to my first reply.

What doesn't add up in the last line?

[FrankJaeger]

More? Im waiting on you

More generally, not more in response to my first reply.

What doesn't add up in the last line?

Its kinda like fence sitting.
Do you think its NAI or "trending towards scum"?
Idk how you can call it both

[FrankJaeger]

VOTE: Commknight

That's L -1. Lolhammering is a scum claim

Intent to lol hammer.
You gunna unvote?

[davesaz]

Feels like grasping at straws to keep the Comm alternative alive. Really wanna just flip Comm now

You didn't quote anything so I'm not sure what you're referring to. Comm's posts trying to find an alternative to himself?

I like scum lynches but in this setup it's good to go into night with reads on everyone. Roughly half of possible setups have a SK (not mathematically half but no need to be precise this early) and a good number have a godfather. So I caution against premature hammers, especially while we have cold reads on replaced slots.

[davesaz]

More? Im waiting on you

More generally, not more in response to my first reply.

What doesn't add up in the last line?

Its kinda like fence sitting.
Do you think its NAI or "trending towards scum"?
Idk how you can call it both

All replaces start NAI, just like all reads start out null. I think it is unlikely to be town. Some reasons it could be scum. Unlike some other people in the game *cough*Commknight*cough* I don't think myself to be infallible. So I routinely give reads in ranges not in black/white.

[ThinkBig]

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