DoY I: British Monarchy Mafia (Mini 1896) - Game Over :O

[shaddowez]

Wraith

- Why do you think you were RBed instead of any of the other possible situations that could have led to the same result? Also, do you think Farside would have targetted you?

[Wraith]

I'm too exhausted to get mad I think

and wraith is tunneling me because I made a stupid mistake (that I'd never make as scum, btw) and can't let go or even see that it is possible that I'm so out of it that it's a reasonable mistake, it's really annoying

my guess would be that the scum in my SRs aren't voting me because they feel like they can just ML me any Day and are more concerned with sticking to their agenda, and will come around if other votes start to come around, plus omgus tends to scare off scum I think, but it's all guesswork

What mistake?

Sequence of events:

1. From the start of D2 I was dropping not-subtle hints I was a power role. N1 I protected WoodCutters but they ended up dead anyways, so I suspected I was roleblocked. Because my D1 strategy was to lurk tactically while presenting myself as scummy lynchbait to avoid getting nightkilled immediately, I suspected it was more likely I was roleblocked by town rather than scum.

2. Farside got modkilled and flipped Town Roleblocker. Farside had a "null" read on me D1 and played his cards re: me close to his chest throughout that day, so it is extremely likely that he roleblocked me N1.

3. People start to really pick up on my not-subtle hints and get suspicious. I stop playing coy and claim Town Bodyguard, and also drop my speculation on what happened that got WoodCutters killed.

4. drealmerz makes Post #1958, implying that I am fakeclaiming scum presumably because of insider knowledge and an apparently stupendously unlikely story. He tries to portray me as claiming to have been sniffed out as a BG by scum and drawn a scum roleblock when that was entirely the opposite of what I actually claimed. This is such an utter failure of reading comprehension that I can't help but interpret this as malicious intent rather than incompetence, but several other players disagree.

5. drealmerz changes his story and claims that he thought WoodCutters flipped the Roleblocker. This completely contradicts his earlier implication that I claimed to have been RB'd by scum, as WoodCutters flipped neither Roleblocker nor scum.

6. drealmerz then scrambles to justify his slip again by claiming a misunderstanding of action resolution order. A two-second glimpse at the NAR would be sufficient to prevent such a misunderstanding.

7. Caught out with multiple slips, drealmerz resorts to denying those slips ever happened and pleading ignorance. This excuse only works if you believe he is ignorant of multiple game rules and clearly-worded statements.

But no people are being fucking dumb and giving him a pass based on his "honest mistake" defense.

Would it impact your opinion to know that Drealmerz once misvoted in lylo despite having two votes on him and having the scum team told to him?
Or that he tunnelled the sole VT in a role madness when said VT had wanted a scum lynch?

Yeah, I'm more surprised by Drealmerz admitting he fucked up prior to the postgame more than anything.

I was trying to avoid blatantly inflammatory statements like "I know drealmerz is completely incompetent in general" but you're putting me in a corner here.

[drealmerz7]

wow, nice misrep there, titus

or are you that delusional about the reality of those games? wait, you actually might be, your head is often so far up your ass you can't see a fucking thing except your own shit

I'm actually not incompetent, but keep on thinking that if it serves your agenda, whateverrrrr

[Prism]

This is all pretty in line with town drealm. I don't want to offend him, but I get why you would describe it as heavily incompetent, and he can definitely speak without thinking through what he's saying or sorting it out in his own mind first.

As far as the T&B townreads go, we've got one person giving T&B a townread for playing, and one person giving a meta read that I can probably disprove if I check, so that's the next step here.

[Titus]

Opps! Didn't mean to quote the WHOLE of the first post, but that's ok I guess.

Anyway, this is why we're scum read by some, and this is also why we're Town read by some. What do YOU think?

~A50

I would have read that specifically. If someone quotes a specific post and says hey this is important, I generally read it in its entirety.

I also read people based on their relationships with other people.
That being said, I'm generally anti-gambit so my first initial push seems to put the Smackdown on you for this, but you seem to have a reason or two for this and it does seem to be different from games where you are more cautious and reserved as scum. So gun to my head town based on that but severely annoyed and I'd expect more traditional forms of scumhunting quick.

[Wraith]

Wraith

- Why do you think you were RBed instead of any of the other possible situations that could have led to the same result? Also, do you think Farside would have targetted you?

omfg I explained my reasoning in detail twice now.

Third time's the charm.

My D1 strategy was to lurk tactically and present myself as scummy lynchbait in order to avoid being pegged as a strong town voice and make it viable for scum to keep me alive as a future mislynch. It would prevent me from getting nightkilled and allow me to examine the other players for the ideal protect target. This element of it was completely successful - I avoided the nightkill and picked the correct protect target.

Unfortunately it backfired because I was probably

too

scummy - I managed to avoid getting mislynched D1 by being so blatantly inflammatory with my comments that town probably believed I was too bold to be scum, but it probably drew a roleblock from town. This was the "hidden" meaning behind this post:

Fuck I think I've buggered it all

Who hates me besides T&B? Fuck I need to do the re-read.

I suspected the Town Roleblocker was either T&B or Shepard.

Then farside got modkilled and flipped Town Roleblocker.

A brief review of his ISO demonstrated how muddled his read of me was. That, combined with his general avoidance of giving a truly detailed read of me, led me to conclude farside very likely roleblocked me N1.

[Titus]

The problem is, I don't think I've ever seen a scum drealmerz ever, but whatever his alignment, I feel relatively confident his reads are inaccurate because he's not neck deep in calls to policy lynch him.

[Prism]

He actually is pretty close to being neck deep in calls to policy lynch him, he gets me as a freebie mainly due to me having fallen for that trap twice already.

[Wraith]

This is all pretty in line with town drealm. I don't want to offend him, but I get why you would describe it as heavily incompetent, and he can definitely speak without thinking through what he's saying or sorting it out in his own mind first.

As far as the T&B townreads go, we've got one person giving T&B a townread for playing, and one person giving a meta read that I can probably disprove if I check, so that's the next step here.

There's a limit to the amount of mistakes I'm willing to forgive.

You saw my attitude toward dreal early in the game. He was extremely jittery and gave off emotion that came off to many as fake. I know this as typical drealmerz play.

But to so badly "misread" my comments, and then to change his story several times with equal lack of comprehension, breaks my limit. As I've been saying, I can't help but interpret it as malicious rather than innocent incompetence.

[Tea and Biscuits]

Sorry, some stuff came up. Will get to this ASAP.
I have no idea what's happened to my hydra partner.

-- Postie

[Wraith]

I really shouldn't have been so heavy-handed in dropping my hints today. I am almost certainly going to get killed tonight.

[Titus]

The problem is, I don't think I've ever seen a scum drealmerz ever, but whatever his alignment, I feel relatively confident his reads are inaccurate because he's not neck deep in calls to policy lynch him.

Scratch this. I forgot In Memory. I kinda dismissed him because of the fact he was rambling with wierd shit even though my hydra partner wanted to lynch him.

[Titus]

Sorry, some stuff came up. Will get to this ASAP.
I have no idea what's happened to my hydra partner.

-- Postie

Hiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii

[Wraith]

The problem is, I don't think I've ever seen a scum drealmerz ever, but whatever his alignment, I feel relatively confident his reads are inaccurate because he's not neck deep in calls to policy lynch him.

Scratch this. I forgot In Memory. I kinda dismissed him because of the fact he was rambling with wierd shit even though my hydra partner wanted to lynch him.

So you're saying drealmerz scum play is indistinguishable from drealmerz town play?

[Prism]

You saw my attitude toward dreal early in the game. He was extremely jittery and gave off emotion that came off to many as fake. I know this as typical drealmerz play.

But to so badly "misread" my comments, and then to change his story several times with equal lack of comprehension, breaks my limit. As I've been saying, I can't help but interpret it as malicious rather than innocent incompetence.

It'd be some awfully pointless malice with a timebomb attached to it. My argument that he's not always the most well thought out works both ways but you're suggesting more willful intent than I think would be present even if he were scum.

I still think your reads are really off, in particular townreading T&B for

playing mafia

. This goes double when the other head has essentially flaked and is too afraid to post out of fear of messing it up.

[Titus]

The problem is, I don't think I've ever seen a scum drealmerz ever, but whatever his alignment, I feel relatively confident his reads are inaccurate because he's not neck deep in calls to policy lynch him.

Scratch this. I forgot In Memory. I kinda dismissed him because of the fact he was rambling with wierd shit even though my hydra partner wanted to lynch him.

So you're saying drealmerz scum play is indistinguishable from drealmerz town play?

Yes, but my sample is small.

[drealmerz7]

The problem is, I don't think I've ever seen a scum drealmerz ever

what the hell are you talking about?!?!?!?!?

I was scum in In Memory, I was scum in PYPDD

you were in both of those games and I owned you in both of them

p-edit, oh there she goes, getting her story more accurate

I seriously can't wait until this uber-stress in RL is DONE with and I can bring better focus to my games, I'm actually pretty decent when I set my mind to a game

[Prism]

Prism's push against T&B is flawed. The main thrust of the initial argument seems to be that T&B's posts didn't reflect them backing off Drealmerz and that Drealmerz didn't really give them a reason to back off like they claimed. For one, I don't think that you need to make posts reflecting the strength of your read against someone and be 100% truthful about it. Secondly, the posts he outlined as 100% not coming from someone who was just pressuring were empty rhetoric, and, as I've talked about before, empty rhetoric is a fairly common way to pressure someone for pressure's sake. Finally, he makes the claim that "drealmer giving content was never an issue" which, to some extent is true, but pretending there's no difference between Drealmer's 80 and before and the content he produced after that is borderline insane.

However, I would be interested in hearing Postie's response to this post here - why didn't you let Superjack know that you were feeling doubts to your drealmer read?

Still the best thing Nacho posted all game even if he got elements of my argument a bit wrong. (In particular, empty rhetoric isn't exclusively scum play, but I think it was scum play here.) Postie's reaction to drealm reads nonsensically from a town perspective. It's not impossible or horrible for town to fake a read or use empty rhetoric depending on the case, but I

strongly doubt

that this was one of those.

T&B still blatantly bullshit that interaction with drealm through and through, in particular that they never really scumread him.

[drealmerz7]

hey look, prism makes the partial scumread case on T&B for me

you're tops, prism, tops! LIKE ROYALTY!!!

[Titus]

hey look, prism makes the partial scumread case on T&B for me

you're tops, prism, tops! LIKE ROYALTY!!!

Ok, I love Prism's tone but this buddying and over the top tone is ridiculous.

VOTE: Prism

[Prism]

Call me a broken record, but Postie's interaction on Drealm is still something I consider damning, and their push on me is just the nail in the coffin on that.

The core of their thrust is that I "didn't want to be seen wagoning town" when I literally wound up voting both wagons despite thinking they were TvT-forced to by looming deadline, pushing my strongest scumread through the entire time.

I'm not saying I'm town for it, but the idea that me not wanting to vote two likely towns unless I had to is a scumtell is

ridiculous

.

[Titus]

VOTE: Drealmerz

and I've caught a bug mental.

[Prism]

hey look, prism makes the partial scumread case on T&B for me

you're tops, prism, tops! LIKE ROYALTY!!!

Ok, I love Prism's tone but this buddying and over the top tone is ridiculous.

VOTE: Prism

Please explain how this drealm post justifies a vote

on me

, I'm begging you.

[Prism]

There you go, okay.

[Prism]

I'm actually going to make the judgment call of defending drealm more here.

I called him out for buddying me and finding it scummy earlier on, multiple times. I don't think he'd continue doing it like this. This reads legitimately to me.

I'm reasonably sure he's town. I'm again not going on this. Almost/Wraith/T&B/Infinity all moaning "What happened to your scumread?", incoming. Eat your heart out.