Spring Fever (Endgame)

[Transcend]

CHEET IS TOWN )))))))))))))))

[Gorkington]

its only gonna get worse from here.
i have my tryhard hat on.

[Vecna]

Anyways people are gonna hate on my this game, because im not gonna fall in line and follow the popular opinion here.

I have yet to decide whether this is scum titus or not - but so far she has actively avoided any of her usual town-style which allows people to read her. She continues to scumread me, becuase she thinks that me attacking her (when she thinks she should be obv-town or w/e).

I still have a gut feeling there is quite possibly 1-2 scum in Alisae / Frogger / Gigabyte / RandoMidget /Heart . The first four here are not really conforming to their town-meta that I know of them just yet. Alisae is having some good posts here and there, but its mixed with plenty of bad signals. The same applies to frog and Giga. Ill do my due diligence on Antihero to meta-read him and check if this is how he plays as town. Everyone is telling me im wrong, but fuck that. Ive had too many games where my day1 reads were exactly ON-POINT for everyone to be ignored (Alisae of all people should _know_ this). Actually so should Frogger.

Either Dunn is scum there that is trying to appeal to me by having very similair reads - or he is lock-town that is the only other 1 for having some grain of common sense of not going with the waves and pressing where its not popular. (the first thing would be totally pointless though, seeing how im on the same brink of elimination).

The fact people are still voting him after he claimed a strong and confirmable role is kind of meh to say the least.

[Gorkington]

then we can lynch gork for the same reason

i hope this was a joke.
why is this sequence of posts your only response to dunnstral's wall-spree if your last post before it was "JUST LYNCH DUNNSTRAL YA FUCKERS"?
like.
are you not scumreading them as hard now?
why arent you trying to parse things in it?
instead of adding to the shitpost pile while also complaining about the shitposts?

[Aelita]

Vecna is still obligated to respond.

I asked you this question about 700 posts ago, and Eddie brought it up again for me some time after. You've failed to answer. Please answer.

I said multiple times I can't really form coherent thoughts and you ignored that. In the light of this, I am inclined to believe everything else I say will be ignored by you both, so I won't bother speaking if I am gonna be ignore over and over again anyway.

[Aelita]

You wanted to talk to me, so what happened with that?

I was catching up on 20 pages, sorry.

We can talk later instead, I dont think ill be changing your mind regardless. It appears im no longer a lynch candidate atm, so ill just let my actions do the talking instead.

Give me that benefit of the doubt at least. And I think people should realize theres a limit to anyones capabilities as scum.

Very few people are gonna be able to type smooth like I have been in all my talking in this game and make it appear honest

(apparently giga disagreed, but w/e).

Just saying you want to lynch me, after all the effort I put in - with the main reason being not wanna be fooled and not liking the claim and hoping to be towncleared by it - is not really a nice thing to do fmpmov.

SU2 mafia. Reasonably Rational. Nuff said.

[Aelita]

But okay. Present me as a Satan. We'll see who is laughing when you flip scum.

[Gorkington]

Either Dunn is scum there that is trying to appeal to me by having very similair reads

this is a bad tell and you should stop using it.

[Gorkington]

do you not expect alisae to make lots of cutesy points as town?
i dont really get your point when youre saying that you feel like theyre playing like they were in civ.

[Vecna]

i) On one hand they're acting pretty different from what I've seen as sfrom scum Aelita. On the other hand wow her push on Vecna slot is really bad.
ii) I don't understand what you're asking. Are you asking why I scumread giga?

i) is aelita someone that you expect to make pushes you think are good as town?
ii) basically, like, i was metadiving you and i saw a quote from you saying "giga is incredibly easy to read as town" and it didnt sound like you got paranoid about it.
this game i recall you saying something along the lines of "giga seems town but he probably would seem town as scum".
why the added paranoia here?

My stance was that we weren't lynching someone with a provable role - which is also, yes, a towny role.
No matter how much people will yell otherwise (to the point where he's being voted for his role rather than anything else)

I'm not sure if I ever said I townread them? I said I townread vecna

i think i just kind of assumed from what references i found in your ISO that you had been townreading his play as well by how you were defending him.
could you talk about what your read on him personally was over the course of the game?

I think Random is the one scum on a scumteam that is very out there in the open and participating a lot

im going to eventually get around to poking around your ISO.
i just really dont understand how you can so strongly feel like the entire scumteam is driving the game here.
very few scum players can pull off being as active as frogger, ali and giga have been and the way youve been talking, its like you think theres at least two scum in there.
if you want me to take what youre saying seriously and/or if you seriously want to drive pressure on them, you should be condensing strong points to make it clear why you think theyre scum just beyond "dunnstral and i are mislynches".
by probability, town mislynches a lot on d1. running up two townies on d1 isnt unusual, yes?
what makes this scum-driven vs badtown-driven from where youre standing that makes you feel so confident in saying dunnstral seems town just via gamestate?

Its very hard to make these things tangible and understandable since theres a lot of gut involved. But ill try and give it a shot.

3 wagons: the first being Giga, and the following 2 both heavily influenced by Giga.

A certain group of players is not at all afraid to just go out in the open and say ridiculous stuff, and just vote without reasons, without clarification, without shame, and jump around a lot. This to me indicates its quite likely that there is indeed a very strong group of scum-players in this game, and they all have the same similair attitude here: WERE GONNA ROLL OVER THIS GAME.

The scumteam here is putting in a lot of good performances, and they know it - and theyre trying to drive the gamestate and lining up mislynches. This doesnt quite make sense with every scenario and all people potentially being scum - but this is my assessment of how things are standing at the moment.

Theres also 0+ scum in the group of Random / McMenno / Aelita and some of the other low-inpact players (yes I know this is a stupid statement by itself). whoever they are, theyre feeling strengthened by the play of their scumpartners and are even less afraid to play the way they feel like. I think I can clearly sense it in the atmosphere in this game, cant you?

The other lines of thought here is who the leading wagons have been: Giga, Vecna, Dunnstral. All these are players that can solve a game, and have done it lots of times before. Lynching a player like this day1 and having a townflip puts scum miles and miles ahead. If im right, scum only need to kill of 4-5 key people, and theyll cruise to victory totally unopposed, leaving behind the players that get easily demoralized. This is the strategy that is being persued here.

Now I know, all this is wildly speculative - mostly based on gut - but this is my assesment of whats happening here.

[Vecna]

But okay. Present me as a Satan. We'll see who is laughing when you flip scum.

Getting me lynched is not gonna be that easy. And even if you do manage, youre gonna see a town beethoven flip. Wooptie-doo.

[Vecna]

Either Dunn is scum there that is trying to appeal to me by having very similair reads

this is a bad tell and you should stop using it.

So you dont think its interesting he put forward pretty much the same reads as me? While noone else has them?

You dont think its something I should adress, being town and all?

Because either he's copying my reads for whatever weird reason (which I doubt dunn would do, especially in this situation) - Or he's locktown to me for being able to come to the same conclusions.

The fact he claimed tracker/watcher is a role we can quite easily confirm, and is a strong claim we shouldnt lynch regardless (imo).

Dunn is gonna flip town.

[Vecna]

Now, come in here again and state im not scumhunting Titus.

I double-dare you

[Gorkington]

how many games have you seen with more than 1 active scum who were purposefully crafting and driving wagons?
vs maybe 1 really active scum and a bunch of subtle scum egging on town to make bad decisions?
i feel like the latter is a lot more common and while i wouldnt rule the former out, you would have to argue specific points on specific people driving the gamestate for me to be remotely close to considering what youre pushing here as its just not what usually happens at all.


also this is possibly? my last post today because im off tonight, can people make a promise to me to elevate the play in this game?
make an active effort to sort people on their posting/ISO?
idk.
just like throw effort at the game if you are going to post a shit-ton.
or just dont post a shit-ton.
either works for me.
and yes im a hypocrite.
but im a hypocrite who is ready to rehabilitate and change his ways until the next game where he becomes a shitposter again.
[or maybe later in this game when i inevitably become demotivated again but hey i never said i was perfect :') ]

p-edit: i dont think those sorts of things are interesting.
and its this same kind of logic that led you to call leonshade scum in civ when it just wasnt good logic.
scum dont look at people's reads and then say "oh i will use this person's reads".
if dunn is scum he likely just came to the same reads out of convenience.

[Vecna]

do you not expect alisae to make lots of cutesy points as town?
i dont really get your point when youre saying that you feel like theyre playing like they were in civ.

I know theres going to be a bunch of cutesy comments. But I also know that at this stage town-alisae is going to try to have an impact on the game, with snide and sharp ali comments. Theres been a few of them, but not nearly enough to properly read intent. I might be put off by the interactions between frogger/ali and them wanting to gamesolve together, who knows.

[Aelita]

But okay. Present me as a Satan. We'll see who is laughing when you flip scum.

Getting me lynched is not gonna be that easy. And even if you do manage, youre gonna see a

town beethoven

flip. Wooptie-doo.

And that's why I scumread you. You re trying to coast by on being town-cleared by flavor. Just like Reasonably Rational (who, by the way, was also a smooth typer there) and Skybird in SU2 mafia. I am not gonna be fooled by that twice.

[Vecna]

how many games have you seen with more than 1 active scum who were purposefully crafting and driving wagons?
vs maybe 1 really active scum and a bunch of subtle scum egging on town to make bad decisions?
i feel like the latter is a lot more common and while i wouldnt rule the former out, you would have to argue specific points on specific people driving the gamestate for me to be remotely close to considering what youre pushing here as its just not what usually happens at all.


also this is possibly? my last post today because im off tonight, can people make a promise to me to elevate the play in this game?
make an active effort to sort people on their posting/ISO?
idk.
just like throw effort at the game if you are going to post a shit-ton.
or just dont post a shit-ton.
either works for me.
and yes im a hypocrite.
but im a hypocrite who is ready to rehabilitate and change his ways until the next game where he becomes a shitposter again.
[or maybe later in this game when i inevitably become demotivated again but hey i never said i was perfect :') ]

p-edit: i dont think those sorts of things are interesting.
and its this same kind of logic that led you to call leonshade scum in civ when it just wasnt good logic.
scum dont look at people's reads and then say "oh i will use this person's reads".
if dunn is scum he likely just came to the same reads out of convenience.

Yes, the latter does happen more often - I just dont feel this is one of those games. Im not honed in enough yet on which people it are that are the scum driving it, but I feel that its happening. The scum is hiding in plain sight.

And yes, im wrong plenty of times as well - so what. So is everyone. And my push on Leon in that game did help him get back into the game again, which allowed me to read him better afterwards. For convenience sake you do ignore that I was the only one that nailed 3 of the scumslots on day1 using similair logic.

Heck, I even called out the EXACT strategy/gambit that scum drixx was playing, but the entire game kept clamoring that it made him lock-town. I called out the exact plays that your predecessors were making, yet allowed you to fool me sadly.

Dont focus only on the bad please. I was stupid / unlucky to tunnel down on ABR as opposed to any of my other scumreads from day1, and it fucked the game - but my deductions were still valuable and on point.

[Vecna]

But okay. Present me as a Satan. We'll see who is laughing when you flip scum.

Getting me lynched is not gonna be that easy. And even if you do manage, youre gonna see a

town beethoven

flip. Wooptie-doo.

And that's why I scumread you. You re trying to coast by on being town-cleared by flavor. Just like Reasonably Rational (who, by the way, was also a smooth typer there) and Skybird in SU2 mafia. I am not gonna be fooled by that twice.

Are you really gonna stand there and say im "coasting by" on my claim? I dont give a fuck about the claim, and neither does anyone else. I feel it should make me even more lock-town, true, but ive put in about 10 pages worth of content that should far out-do any effect of that claim.

Stop talking about that claim and evaluate my damn play instead.

[Vecna]

At any way Gork - i want to accept your offer.

Lets tryhard this game together ok? Filter out the downsides in eachothers play and solve this shit.

[Aelita]

You're a tad uncooperative, but okay.

So, let's go right back to when Eddie had a wagon. Did you scumread him then? What were your thoughts?

What about after he started making obvtown posts, starting with that wall he hyped up? How did he handle that? Why did almost everyone start townreading him then?

For what reasons do you townread him?

That'll do for now.

I'll humor you, but don't ignore these

1. No
2. He sounded town and still does
3/4/5 Because he's obtown
6. I am a follower, so it's because I trust Nebby when it comes to that.

p-edit: All right. You are picking easy targets to scumread. You keep trying to join a neighborhood which doesn't want you. You want to bribe town into becoming a townleader rather than earning that position. And finally, I don't trust your 'smooth typing' because scum can do that and get away with that if they are good enough players, which you are. Now die.

[Vecna]

Btw, I still need someone to bond with me.

Ill be the passive one - you dont have to talk (you cant)

Doing this will give us nightchat N2 and onward for as long as I live.

[Aelita]

So, like, are you gonna tell me - with a straight face - that scum wouldn't insist they're town?

[Vecna]

Btw, I feel like sharing the name of my role that RC came up with for shits and giggles. Itll make you understand why TB had a hard time understanding his role pm.

Ill not literally copy-paste it since I dont know if thats allowed, but my role name has:

-the word: Modified!
-2 uses of the word bond/bonded
-I do things passively
-And im a self-enabling, but disabled, enabler - of night talk!

yes, my role is 10 words long.

[Vecna]

So, like, are you gonna tell me - with a straight face - that scum wouldn't insist they're town?

This has nothing to do with what I just said. I said, actually play mafia - and evaluate my play. Dont hide behind the fact youre scared of being fooled by a claim, but actually play the game.

[jjh927]

Vecna, do you still scumread me, and if so- why?

I don't think anyone else is going to bond with me at this point in time, but as you can only take passive it's important to me that I prove to you that I'm town. I'd have liked a PT I could talk in but w/e.

PEdit: Ooh, you're even looking for a bond now too! Obviously you would be, but the timing is convenient.