Open 680.1 C9++ | Endgame

[FireScreamer]

Do you think keeping an RB hidden is worth the same as a confirmed cop with a clear? Not even dead. Just not hidden.

He will be dead by the start of D2, GDI. Unless you KNOW there's a Doctor, and you also know the doctor values the RB role in general, so is willing to protect the RB.

By my reads I suspect there is a Mason pair (MM), and then there's a RB+1-x RB (BB), so the chance of a TTT is moderately real. That's TWO SHOTS on the RB, and the Doctor still can't save him.

So even in this scenario we downgrade the RB into an IC1shotRB and both scum have to shoot the same target N1, so lets call it worth a doc protection as well. How much more valuable does the RB need to be?

And this as WORST CASE. Forget the fact that Gamma is SCUM why don't ya.

[FireScreamer]

If the roleblocker manages to get 2 confirms and paint a giant target on his back before the start of night 1 they did enough. Stop trying to provide cover for Gamma's fakeclaim.

[Titus]

Titus says all of these things simultaneously:

• the lack of an RB claim shows Gamma is probably guilty;
  
• if the RB does claim, we should flip Gamma anyway to confirm the full RB as town; and
  
• the RB should claim, to save Gamma.

We went through

this exact scenario

last roll, and it culminated in Titus telling me I should self-hammer to

prevent

the full RB from claiming if I was town. I don't know how she forgot that so quickly.

No. I am saying if a full rb claims, I am likely getting lynched.

Despite my heavy tr by play, there just isn't one.

I was trying to goad you into self-hammering because I knew you were scum last game. I was wrong though.

[FireScreamer]

Umlaut can I possibly convince you to reconsider and vote gamma? I don't understand what the barriers to it are.

[FireScreamer]

Your case on Titus is that she is building an alternative that can be confirmed at any point if she is scum and they are town. It doesn't make any sense when she had Dave as an option as well.

[Almost50]

I mean, if the RB won't claim to save Gamma they sure as hell won't claim after the fact! Duh!

So if the RB is at L-1 or in a massclaim they will lie?

Let me put it this way: >I< wouldn't claim if it's to save a 1-shot RB.

I was a vig and I tried my best not to claim in Timeshift, but was eventually forced to in order to save an even-night Role Cop (or was it odd-night? I don't remember! I think it was odd-night delayed.. anyway). A Role Cop was well worth saving and ESPECIALLY so when I was only 2-shots and had already fired my delayed shot so I intended to use my direct one on the same night and didn't care if I dies. I also knew that by saving Comm there it will redirect the lynch to Scum!James and I had already decided Nero was conf!Scum so nor bad to trade my out-of-shots self for 2 scums.

here it doesn't look like a good move for the RB to out just to save a 1-shot RB and possibly lynch Titus. That'd be trading a full RB for a "very possibly" Goon while buying Gamma one more night at best. (Nero was the Scum Encryptor and James was a 2-shot Ninja, btw).

[FireScreamer]

I mean, if the RB won't claim to save Gamma they sure as hell won't claim after the fact! Duh!

So if the RB is at L-1 or in a massclaim they will lie?

Let me put it this way: >I< wouldn't claim if it's to save a 1-shot RB.

I don't believe you. I've just explained to you why its a fantastic use of a PR. You are trying to provide cover for your scumbuddy.

[FireScreamer]

That'd be trading a full RB for a "very possibly" Goon while buying Gamma one more night at best.

Holy shit that sounds like a FANTASTIC deal. I'd trade actual factual full cop for a goon in a heartbeat. Let alone PLUS a confirmation of another player.

[FireScreamer]

You severely overvalue PRs, severely undervalue limiting scum night options or you are scum.

[Almost50]

Have it your way. The way you're arguing this only makes me 2nd guess you alignment though. Bad play =/= Scum. It's just.. bad play.

And I'm not claiming anything, btw. I'm neither confirming nor denying being one role or another. Tomorrow might be another day though.

[FireScreamer]

Alright if you are the RB and you let gamma be lynched I'll know that it wasn't my bad play that wrecked the game but yours.

[Almost50]

That'd be trading a full RB for a "very possibly" Goon while buying Gamma one more night at best.

Holy shit that sounds like a FANTASTIC deal. I'd trade actual factual full cop for a goon in a heartbeat. Let alone PLUS a confirmation of another player.

That's your prerogative. Mine is different and I learned it the hard way. If I was a Full Cop I would NOT out a GUILTY on D2 if I suspected I could get another confirmed scum by D3. Instead I would out them BOTH on D3.

[FireScreamer]

List for me an average case game for the RB that is better than a day 1 scum lynch and confirming 2 townies.

[FireScreamer]

Not to mention that if you are town and scum want to go RB hunting they are going for you first now anyway after that level of softing it.

[Almost50]

List for me an average case game for the RB that is better than a day 1 scum lynch and confirming 2 townies.

One where they live to prevent a scum kill in LyLo and result in a Town win

[Titus]

That'd be trading a full RB for a "very possibly" Goon while buying Gamma one more night at best.

Holy shit that sounds like a FANTASTIC deal. I'd trade actual factual full cop for a goon in a heartbeat. Let alone PLUS a confirmation of another player.

That's your prerogative. Mine is different and I learned it the hard way. If I was a Full Cop I would NOT out a GUILTY on D2 if I suspected I could get another confirmed scum by D3. Instead I would out them BOTH on D3.

I highly doubt this is honest after you seeing my play in Wake's game.

[FireScreamer]

List for me an average case game for the RB that is better than a day 1 scum lynch and confirming 2 townies.

One where they live to prevent a scum kill in LyLo and result in a Town win

This is average case for an RB right?

[Almost50]

List for me an average case game for the RB that is better than a day 1 scum lynch and confirming 2 townies.

One where they live to prevent a scum kill in LyLo and result in a Town win

Well, I softed nothing. I neither confirmed nor denied anything.

[Almost50]

It's funny though that you believe I softed RB and still want to lynch Gamma!! I'm wondering how your brain works.

[FireScreamer]

Lets say all your reads are right A50. Titus is scum and there is a mason pairing in the game and thats it.

So the RB claims. Titus is lynched. We now have a day 1 scum lynch and a 70 page day of assosiatves to pick from. The RB is killed in the night. Targeted by Mafia and SK.

Day 2 begins. There are now as many confirmed town as scum and a day of data to analyse with a red flip.

This scenario seems bad to you how?

[FireScreamer]

It's funny though that you believe I softed RB and still want to lynch Gamma!! I'm wondering how your brain works.

No I think you are trying to provide your scumbuddy gamma with as much cover as possible and that involves softing to scare townies while at the same time being adamant that you are not to avoid you attaching yourself at the hip to him.

[FireScreamer]

And I'm not claiming anything, btw. I'm neither confirming nor denying being one role or another.

Tomorrow might be another day though.

This is manipulative softing and i've already explained your motivation for it.

[FireScreamer]

Clearly enough people believe the way I do on this issue A50. There have been plenty of RB or not RB claims. So why would scum titus build a counterwagon to themselves that could crumble at any point?

[Titus]

And I'm not claiming anything, btw. I'm neither confirming nor denying being one role or another.

Tomorrow might be another day though.

This is manipulative softing and i've already explained your motivation for it.

Agreed.

Why couldn't you post like this at daystart?

I wonder where Gamma is.

[FireScreamer]

And I'm not claiming anything, btw. I'm neither confirming nor denying being one role or another.

Tomorrow might be another day though.

This is manipulative softing and i've already explained your motivation for it.

Agreed.

Why couldn't you post like this at daystart?

I wonder where Gamma is.

You had da lurks at gamestart. People in glass houses.

His participation in this game has plummeted since the claim. L A Y I N G L O W.