Mini Normal 1929 - Game Over

Steel · Post Post #600 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 12:20 am

Declaring V/LA Until Monday

Carcalilly · Post Post #601 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 3:24 am

what the fuck

you guys can't read joke posts

it's obviously a fake claim, that's what vedith does

Carcalilly · Post Post #602 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 3:28 am

fine I'll stop fucking around

VOTE: alban

ISO · Post Post #603 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 3:33 am

Day 1 VC #15Awesomeusername (0) -
Vedith (3) (L-3) - Alban (104), LlamaFluff (532), Scorpious (587)
WhyMafia (0) -
Steel (0) -
Io (0) -
Scorpious (1) - MarioManiac4 (405)
Alban (1) - Carcalilly (602)
Tchill13 (0) -

Carcalilly (4) (L-2) - Steel (570), Vedith (580), WhyMafia (591), Tchill13 (592)

MarioManiac4 (0) -
LlamaFluff (0) -
No Lynch (0) -
Not Voting (2) - Io (428), Awesomeusername (597)

Lynch ThresholdWith 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

DeadlineDay 1 will end by July 27, 2017 5:00 PM EDT or in (expired on 2017-07-27 17:00:00).

Moderator NotesModerator V/LA July 24-28. Please address issues to Gamma Emerald during that time.
Carcalilly V/LA until July 25. ((expired on 2017-07-25 23:59:59))
Steel V/LA until July 24. ((expired on 2017-07-24 23:59:59))
(As a reminder, if you have a weekend V/LA, please inform me every weekend so I don't forget. Setting V/LA tags is also highly recommended.)
Have fun!

Spoiler: Current Voting History

Spoiler: Previous Voting History

Scorpious · Post Post #604 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 3:44 am

In post 601, Carcalilly wrote:what the fuck

you guys can't read joke posts

it's obviously a fake claim, that's what vedith does

Some of us don't have the luxury of having played many games with people. I am not going to go digging through past games to compare either..

So no. It's not an "obvious fake claim"

Carcalilly · Post Post #605 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 6:09 am

Day 1 clear 3 townies?
Even if you didn't know vedith the claim is so ridiculous that nobody who knows how to play this game should consider legitimately believing it for a second

MarioManiac4 · Post Post #606 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 6:10 am

carcalilly to clarify you are saying your push on me was fucking around? as in, not real?

Vedith · Post Post #607 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 6:18 am

Carca, you're scum but not for the playing round party.
I look forward to Llama putting their money where their mouth is and voting you to L1.

alban · Post Post #608 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 7:28 am

Carca, some defence will be welcome.
No hammering before Carca speaks.

Carcalilly · Post Post #609 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 7:41 am

In post 606, MarioManiac4 wrote:carcalilly to clarify you are saying your push on me was fucking around? as in, not real?

I was pushing you to get reactions and my honest read on you is a scumlean.

Carcalilly · Post Post #610 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 7:41 am

THEN WHY DO U THINK IM SCUM

MarioManiac4 · Post Post #611 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 7:48 am

In post 362, Carcalilly wrote:
In post 357, Steel wrote:
In post 294, Carcalilly wrote:The Mario vote isn't entirely a joke
What is your mario read? I've only really seen you mention his pre-rvs post pinged you.
Leaning scum.
156 173 187 284

this is supposed to be a reaction test?????????????

LlamaFluff · Post Post #612 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:15 am

Both Vedith and Carcalillly are just different types of scummy.

Vedith is the "intentionally useless - adding clutter" type scum, who has done next to nothing but when they do actually start trying to play are really scummy for the most part, but with the amount of spam they add can essentially shrug off anything as a joke.

Carcalilly just seems to be detached from the game while still adding the "joking around" excuse to most of their stuff. For example they are voting alban, who apparently they thought was scum until the "fake claim" where they moved away and then forgot about moving away... and now two thirds of the way through day one are ready to "start taking things seriously".

Still think that Vedith is a slightly better lynch. Basically all they have done that shows any type of read is the joke claim, where they called a few played "confirmed town" and opened up a lynch pool without any sort of reasoning and followed through with it for enough time that it cant have been a joke that they were his scum reads. Trying to say things like "just trust me" and other statements along those lines do nothing to explain a read and at most can be reaction tests on others (but I somehow doubt there was that level of intent even if he is town). While I think most players would immediately see the claim as a joke, the fact that it was continued for so long still bothers me as there are a lot of newer players who might not be able to piece that together immediately.

Now he comes in with the Carcalilly vote late, when he basically ignored the role until I showed up and voted Vedith. First mention of them being scum since literally joke phases of the game, with no reason. It takes me starting to come down on Carcalilly before the vote shows up there.

@Carcalilly - Vedith read?
@alban - You haven't moved your vote in a long time. Still happy with it?
@MM - You aren't voting either major wagon. Basic thoughts on both?

Few other thoughts:

If Vedith or any of the players he notes as "cleared" are scum, I think Scorpious gains town points for recent posts.
One thing that is REALLY bugging me is that a lot of players seem to assume three scum. In 11P games it is very rare for there to be more than two scum. If we get to a F3 at any point, someone go back and read early thoughts to see who was implying three scum and give minor town/scum points accordingly.

awesomeusername · Post Post #613 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:51 am

@Carca: Read 590.

You're like, exactly fulfilling your self scum meta, and your reads seem pretty surface-level.

@Llama: I kinda think Vedith will be easier to read in the future. These trollish types tend to settle down a little bit after Day 1. I'd prefer Carca because her non-trolly posts are scummier IMO.

@Scorpious: What are your thoughts on Carcalilly and Vedith? I don't think you've given any opinions on them yet.

Carcalilly · Post Post #614 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 8:57 am

I know.
As I said I do not have time at this moment to get off that meta. I'm on V/LA because I'm out of state and busy, please chill out.
This is why I asked if you really wanted to lynch me, decide after I get back and can put more effort into things. Clearly, if I'm going to post anything now, I should adress questions geared towards myself.

I townread Vedith actually, this doesn't feel like his scum game from what I know.

@mario uh no, those are actual posts that pinged me and lead me to have a weak scumlean on you.

Vedith · Post Post #615 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 9:07 am

In post 614, Carcalilly wrote:I townread Vedith actually, this doesn't feel like his scum game from what I know.

You town read me because I'm not in your PT...

Once day, Carca, we can be town together <3

Io · Post Post #616 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 9:16 am

Why do things in this game only happen when I'm eating or asleep?
Anyways I caught up and took a look into the case Llama made on Carca.

Here's my thoughts on it:
I'll start by saying I honestly don't think the case of Carca being scum is that strong unless Verdith is also scum.
567 - I don't really see the passiveness in their reads. I noticed their town reads are shallow though just being along the lines of "obvitown" or "this is town" with a quote. I think their scum read on MM4 in particular was anything but passive because that was a hard push early on when others were not on board with scum reading MM4 which is the opposite of passive. I also looked at a side by side comparison ISO between Verdith and Carca and I didn't really see them attacking MM4, so if you could point out the quote that would be great.
590 - I also noticed the case against Carca as a stand alone scum here isn't very strong either as frankly her not voting MM4 can easily be chalked up to being flustered which I don't see as a tell for either town or scum. It's just really not a solid case to say that she is scum for not voting MM4 when making a push on him.

That being said I do think the CarcaXVerdith scum team is pretty strong actually, as they've been rather buddy like this game it seems.
A side by sided ISO look of the two shows a few thins.
First Carca RVS's Verdith which I believe scum tend to do that as an early game distancing. And it's quite funny to vote your partner because you know it's right and the town would never know until they actually got lynched.
Second Verdith as early as 31 said Carca was town "for once" which while a clear joke that Carca is always scum when they play with Verdith doesn't feel right when they continued to maintain that town read for most of the game aside from the small RVS gap of posts between 88 and 135 where he scum read her for a bit.
Then of course Verdith did that whole fake claim that "cleared" Carca.

Honestly I wouldn't vote Carca unless Verdith flipped scum just because I don't see a case for Carca being a stand alone scum.
I'd rather vote Verdith because like Llama said in the last post (612) he's done basically nothing but add clutter.
Not quite sure what the vote count is right now, but I'm going to put my vote on Verdith if he's not at L-2/L-1 already.

Side note: I also don't really agree with you Llama when it comes to Scorpious. His last few posts aren't screaming town to me and his vote on Verdith is basically him declaring Verdith is scum for a NAI reason. Honestly all of his reads this game have felt terrible and based on bad reasoning.

Vedith · Post Post #617 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 9:20 am

Okay, Io, I confess!
Vote Carca.

Io · Post Post #618 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 9:23 am

OK, so Verdith is scum.

VOTE: Verdith

He's trying to go with making it look so obvious that him and Carca are a scum team either hin hopes we mislynch a town!Carca or that we are too scared to lynch a scum!Carca.
That's for another day to figure out though.

Vedith · Post Post #619 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 9:24 am

So why not lynch Carca today then me tomorrow?

Vedith · Post Post #620 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 9:25 am

Wait... I'm trying to make it obvious that me and Carca are scum together, because we are scum together, but I'm trying to get a mis lynch on town Carca?

Io · Post Post #621 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 9:26 am

I'm going to lynch the guy who claims scum before lynching the person he claims is their partner.

Vedith · Post Post #622 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 9:26 am

Did you eat a lot of crayons as a child?

MarioManiac4 · Post Post #623 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 9:27 am

I'm not sure doing anti-town things is scum-indicative for Vedith. (Disclaimer: I don't like using meta to prove someone is town or scum, as meta can be used and manipulated when used in that way, but I think it can be used effectively to help disprove a point.) In Open 690, Vedith came into the game and immediately deathtunneled two town players without ever looking back. Despite what would seem to be incredibly reckless and even antitown behaviour (just like in this game) he was town. In a scum game I played with him, he acted far more carefully. Of course, we can't reach any definite conclusions from this, but I feel like it's not right to lynch Vedith for overly reckless behaviour. I think he's also been fairly consistent in scumreading Carcalilly here. I don't really want to lynch Vedith yet.

I don't really like the Carc wagon either. Like, I don't really find her saying she was joking around early game scum-indicative, considering that, well, she kinda obviously was? Like, looking at her ISO I read all of her early stuff as jokes basically. Not to mention her vote on me felt really town. As in, she wasn't trying to find something to push, she actually had solid reasoning to back all her stuff up. When it was prodded at, she had solid thoughts to provide as to what points she was trying to make.

I really dislike Io pushing Vedith's scumclaim actually.

awesomeusername · Post Post #624 (ISO) » Sat Jul 22, 2017 9:29 am

@Io: Really, a Vedith and Carca team!? I was just thinking that was near-impossible if there are only two scum, given how Vedith helped swing the wagon on Carca in 568, and also expressed suspicion in 542, 558, and I think some earlier posts, although the seriousness of those is debatable.

Also, I initially didn't like Llama's statement about Scorpious either, but it's actually really smart - if Scorpious is scum with Vedith or one of Vedith's "clears," he knows for sure that the claim is a lie. And his posts really look like an inexperienced player who was caught off guard by the claim and feel for it. Does that make sense? That said, I agree that his play has been generally scummy.