In post 124, adilm29h wrote:My Read is that, I retract My vote from Fancy Pants for he seems very relaxed about being mafia, unless that is his technique.
I am not sure about Gorny, as he seems to try and find a blame onto someone.
Its hard to tell whether Grey Ice is scum or town, because they have a prominent voice which seems pretty convincing.
So far on My list are Aster and Mother.
I feel in the recent posts, motherGospel had very scum like readings, feeling way too defensive when being accused by GreyIce.
I feel Aster because he is quick to put the blame on someone else and divert their attention, on a simple question I asked.
As this being my first game, I barely know tactics to tackling this game.
i feel those are my two strong reads.
In post 123, Draynth wrote:
Why did you specifically ask gorny for thoughts? Also why did you vote Gorny in 25?
I prefer narrow focus in mafia, but I did ask everyone for their scum reads. Of the active player's I find Gorny to be one of the least town hence why I'd like more thoughts from him.
My exact reason was that he seemed to unvote Aster when he was pushed a little, and he hasn't done anything to convince me he isn't scum, his read list featured mostly null tells which I find pretty scummy as well.
What would you like from me FancyPants?
As to null reads...it's pretty early in day one and at the time, i had maybe 4 pages of posts with some not posting to go on.
In post 130, FancyPants wrote:Meh I don't know if it's a time zone issue but I'm just getting into this game and it seems quiet.
@Xa ligha, if you were absolutely forced to kill one of the players in the game right now, who would it be and what would your justification be?
At the time stamp of that post, it's 430 PM for me, I'm just on my way home from work and then headed to dinner. So Im more quiet than usual.
as to the comment directed at Xa...I find it scummy. For the reasons that:
A) You could be mafia and asking your partner. (I think this is less likely because scum wouldn't openly do that in thread)
b) You're scum and trying to get some information to help you in your NK (again risky and scum wouldn't do that openly)
c) You're scum and signaling your partner via a coded phrase that Xa might be a good target.
In post 142, Draynth wrote:It feels like something that mafia could easily point back to as reasoning for a nightkill, or lack thereof and try to spin some yarn about it. It simply seems to me like this question has the possibility of causing a lot of confusion, directed by the scum of course, amongst the town.
@Fancypants
Asking him 'who would you kill' is different to 'who do you scumread' in my books, am I wrong in thinking this?
That... actually makes a surprising amount of sense.
I think FancyPants didn't ask the question with malicious intentions, but I consider your objection to be valid.
Xa ligha, I think you should
not
answer FancyPants' question.
However, you are being suspected of active lurkingm so please provide some more generic scumreads instead.
In post 144, FancyPants wrote:I don't see the difference and still think he should answer, just pretend I asked:
@Xa ligha, if you were absolutely forced to lynch one of the players in the game right now, who would it be and what would your justification be?
If it makes you feel better. It's just a way to force him into committing on a scum read. I understand that Draynth thought I meant who would he NK but that's not what I meant for the record.
I don't see how knowing his scummiest read, can affect the NK at all.
You seem to misunderstand. Consider the following scenario: Xa ligha answers and says he would kill Alice (I'm not going to use a real player name there for soon to be obvious reasons.) The next night, Alice gets NK'ed.
Clearly Xa isn't stupid enough to kill the person he said he wanted dead, so of course the mafia is framing him. Unless Xa is mafia himself and is trying to make it look as if the mafia framed him to make him appear town. Unless... [WIFOM unfolds]
By using the word "kill" you are drawing more attention upon Xa's answer than when you'd have merely asked about "scumread", because there would be many "best scumreads". By having one clearly marked "kill X" target instead of many "I think X is scum" targets, you are giving the mafia a single unique target they can kill to generate significant amounts of WIFOM while leaking very little other information; in fact, if Alice were to get killed in the above situation, we may as well write the kill up as "Mafia killed Alice to generate WIFOM. Alice wasn't mafia. We know nothing else." And we'd be robbed of our opportunity to learn from the nightkill.
This sounds like the loops my brain gets in when I get highly intoxicated. I'm glad to see the other people already understood what he was asking. My strongest scum read was aster. I felt like your long winded cases were over small things that really weren't all that scummy. But then this happened:
In post 123, Draynth wrote:@Mod
May I ask if the mafia pair's PT was open during pregame, ie. the period between role PM's going out and the game officially beginning?
All the games i've been in the mafia thread has been open the sample role pm's mentioned the pregame being open and I asked in Site Chat and a friend who plays on the site and they've been open pregame for a while. So I went through his history and sure enough, they were all open including 3 were he was Scum. Seeing as he is a SE, this seems like a very odd question. Yes this follows similar logic to Aster's logic about adilm29h but it feels more scummy because he
SHOULD
know the answer and has seen that it's made given town cred to adilm29h to certain people. Which makes Draynth my strongest scum read now.
In post 130, FancyPants wrote:Meh I don't know if it's a time zone issue but I'm just getting into this game and it seems quiet.
@Xa ligha, if you were absolutely forced to kill one of the players in the game right now, who would it be and what would your justification be?
At the time stamp of that post, it's 430 PM for me, I'm just on my way home from work and then headed to dinner. So Im more quiet than usual.
as to the comment directed at Xa...I find it scummy. For the reasons that:
A) You could be mafia and asking your partner. (I think this is less likely because scum wouldn't openly do that in thread)
b) You're scum and trying to get some information to help you in your NK (again risky and scum wouldn't do that openly)
c) You're scum and signaling your partner via a coded phrase that Xa might be a good target.
Mafia don't need to coordinate NK in thread they have their own PT they can communicate in pregame and night phases.
Yeah OK, but why would I assume that it was open? Every mod does things differently.
"just got my hands in cooking! feel free to give me suggestions. So far completed: noodle in soup, noodle stuffed clam over noodle, red white and bluedle american noodle, hot brown noodle"
Also @Aster, thanks for explaining my point better than I could, bthata pretty much what I was trying to say
"just got my hands in cooking! feel free to give me suggestions. So far completed: noodle in soup, noodle stuffed clam over noodle, red white and bluedle american noodle, hot brown noodle"
"just got my hands in cooking! feel free to give me suggestions. So far completed: noodle in soup, noodle stuffed clam over noodle, red white and bluedle american noodle, hot brown noodle"
In post 144, FancyPants wrote:I don't see the difference and still think he should answer, just pretend I asked:
@Xa ligha, if you were absolutely forced to lynch one of the players in the game right now, who would it be and what would your justification be?
If it makes you feel better. It's just a way to force him into committing on a scum read. I understand that Draynth thought I meant who would he NK but that's not what I meant for the record.
I don't see how knowing his scummiest read, can affect the NK at all.
You seem to misunderstand. Consider the following scenario: Xa ligha answers and says he would kill Alice (I'm not going to use a real player name there for soon to be obvious reasons.) The next night, Alice gets NK'ed.
Clearly Xa isn't stupid enough to kill the person he said he wanted dead, so of course the mafia is framing him. Unless Xa is mafia himself and is trying to make it look as if the mafia framed him to make him appear town. Unless... [WIFOM unfolds]
By using the word "kill" you are drawing more attention upon Xa's answer than when you'd have merely asked about "scumread", because there would be many "best scumreads". By having one clearly marked "kill X" target instead of many "I think X is scum" targets, you are giving the mafia a single unique target they can kill to generate significant amounts of WIFOM while leaking very little other information; in fact, if Alice were to get killed in the above situation, we may as well write the kill up as "Mafia killed Alice to generate WIFOM. Alice wasn't mafia. We know nothing else." And we'd be robbed of our opportunity to learn from the nightkill.
Also, now I have written this out, even not killing Alice would induce the question why the mafia passed up the opportunity.
And these questions aren't going to help us hunt scum, they will only distract us from it.
I know what WIFOM is, I just find this whole argument utterly ridiculous, scum are always going to know who the townie's scum reads are if (assuming xa light is town) and more importantly ARE DIRECTLY DIS INCENTIVISED to kill people who the town find scummy.
I think this whole further WIFOM set-up is a huge stretch.
In any case I would rather not argue this further since I don't believe it's getting us anywhere, and Xa Light has already answered my question super poorly because he was allowed to hedge.
In post 133, Draynth wrote:Because the question feels like a scummy one to ask
In what sense?
Seems like a potential WIFOM setup
I don't see how, I'm just trying to get him to commit to a read, if I ask him who's scum he could just hedge and say "IDK too early to tell lel".
IMO, bad way to get someone to commit to a read.
If you ask someone who they think is scummy they can:
- Claim they don't know.
- Claim there isn't enough information.
- Hedge the shit out of their answer in general.
As opposed to putting them in the position of a day vig, where they absolutely have to commit, I couldn't disagree more strongly that this is a bad question. I believe I've used it before (as town ofc) and never gotten this kind of weird response.
My scum reads so far are MotherGothel, for the main reason that she got really defensive when being voted by GreyIce. Also the whole thing where she says 'Now we are getting in the meat of the game', only when she was being accused, where as the game had already started of pretty intense for me at least since a lot of people had been accused which puts them in a pressure spot. Obviously MotherGothel feeling the pressure, mentioned that.
My other guess is Aster, but since there is only one vote allowed, I cast my vote onto MotherGothel28
In post 135, FrozenMagpie wrote:Hey, I just got out of school a bit ago. I'm working on my reads right now. I was wondering if a reads list or bracket reads are usually preferred in this site?
FrozenMagpie where is the follow up?
For what it's worth I consider inactivity to be a scum tell. Scum have a harder time manufacturing posts and therefore are less incentivised to be active. It's not 100% active but as you get inactive town and active scum, but I do believe there is a general bias, particularly in Newbie games.
well those are my reasons for me thinking that she is mafia. The small sign that she cracked under pressure. The fact that she is getting really defensive over one person voting for her, and just pretty much beating around the bush instead of just stating her point. For me that seems pretty mafia like.
Other than that I feel that you are mafia, with the way you are talking. My read is that People who unnecessarily talk to much are hiding something, and just talk a lot to cover up their mistakes, and you made a lot of long posts way in the beginning, Especially over my simple question. Where accusing me would be okay, but you really really looked into trying to force a scum read onto someone
"I, too, would prefer to know the Xalxe of my demise." - Felissan, 2022
- On this day in history: mundanity, and terror, and food, and love, and trees -
