Antihero vs Jae bores me because I see what Jae is saying more than what Antihero is saying but Heartless is dead town.
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Aris wrote:Does nobody find it alarming that a lurker lynch is literally the only major wagon? Like, the only person with more than one vote is me and thats just wrong. Scum are almost definitely hiding there!
Aris wrote:Caryatid and Ginngie were the jumps onto the wagon and I do note it happened before a great deal of Alt talk occurred. I think Ginngie is the worst vote and her talking around me when I arrived rather than to me is damning I think.
Actually very good points in hindsight. I'm a firm believer that scum will always be present on a Day 1 mislynch, but with no counter wagon (Heartless mentioned past wagons. I don't think that counts) that is even more true. I'd guess two scum before looking at who was on the lynching wagon. And I've already said this, but Ginngie's vote looked the worst in that string of votes.
VNB wrote:Bella said she was unsure of this being of some 'town pings' now that Ari is actually posting, but we agree that we will get information either way from this lynch. I could be convinced otherwise but you'd have to point a name and make a good reason for it Ari.
Information is a bad reason to lynch.
LYNCH wrote:Aristophanes (5) ~ VNB National Plan, Caryatid, Ginngie, Spiffeh, camn
So my two scum guess was based on a seven person lynch. Wasn't thinking about the plurality thing. And this wagon has three players who I have strong town reads on. At the very least, if I'm wrong on Ginngie I probably need to look at VNB a little more closely.
Ginngie wrote:hee
What was this a reaction to specifically?
camn wrote:Well, well. Aristo.
This flexy deadline business needs a bit of adjusting to, I think.
Heartless wrote:That's annoying
cary wrote:yeah
Camn and cary, you were voting him. Were you planning on switching or what?
Who would do that... a couple white guys, who else?
pedit: white guys are the worst
Men are awful.
#NotAllMen #JustThoseOfYouGettingDefensiveRightNow
^Can we please not do this?
VNB wrote:I'm not saying Ahsoka is scum lurking but nancy has more content in thread....
Cary wrote:I didn't mind this at the time but in retrospect: Have you noticed that nancy has more content than literally everyone except Heartless and Ginngie? She has more content than Leon+Max, Kmd, and you put together.
You had to have gone to the activity overview to make this post, and "has less posts than the mod" is a valid criticism in most games, but most games of this size, the mod would have like a third of the posts that nancy does.
Good point.
VNB wrote:We made notes that your last large post seemed like a lot of Information instead of analysis. Also your votes sucked donkeys and you sat on a Prism vote until the end phase. Also I've made jokes about responding to people from 30 pages ago so they can never question me about anything relevant and I am suspicious you're actually putting that into practice.
This actually translates into "scummy because RL". When you're in catch up mode, things will come off IIOA because it's old. I don't change votes when I'm behind unless it's to avoid a lynch I'm not ready for. And 30 pages ago is because that's where I had read up to. Every bit of this is because I've been at work and traveled out of state. Those are things that happen regardless of my alignment in mafia games. Also I should be good after this weekend. I'm pretty sure I said this already, but my schedule should be pretty normal again starting Monday.
Polar wrote:Do you have reads?
I'm actually curious how you could wonder this unless you ignored my posts and chose not to check my ISO before asking. I've been pretty clear on quite a few reads.
Polar wrote:
It's the basis of their Ahsoka vote, of course it's AI. Did they have reasons to think Ahsoka's posts were the scum kind of terrible or was it just BS to justify a vote on a town player?
Which do you think it is?
Ginngie wrote:wait what
Yes?
Polar wrote:I really don't like your Prism scum read. Bear liked your Prism vote, but I didn't. It felt easy and fabricated. Bad arguments, and very subjective. And then it seems like you stick with that scum read just for the sake of it.
Ok? Unless you can be more specific, I'm not sure what to say because you could just say this about any vote.
Polar wrote:This is kinda ridiculous. You're accusing him of being scum and pretending to be drunk (or drunker) to get town read. I don't think Prism's ISO is so devoid of content that you'd have to reach this low to back up your scum read.
That would be ridiculous if that's what I was saying. This discussion has already happened.
Polar wrote:Then he answers your accusation and your reply is "ok, but people do that." There's no reflection from your part on whether or not Prism is that kind of person, nor does his answer seem to affect you in any way. You just stick to what you said. Prism's "drunk" post was manipulative because some people do that kind of thing. That's a terrible argument.
When people you don't know use self meta, do you go "oh, ok, you must be town then"? Because I'm more likely to ignore it.
Polar wrote:You even manage to scum read Prism for liking your post. Did you think it was so unlikely that your post would be liked (it happens sometimes)? Why didn't you ask him why he liked it if your problem was the lack of an explanation? Instead of fabricating reasons say how him liking your post makes him scum.
Again, this has been discussed. When people just see a lot of words and call it town, that will always stand out to me. And I actually did give Prism the option to be more specific which I don't remember happening.
Polar wrote:You also shared a common position with your scum read on the Spiffeh subject. How do you feel about that?
I mean I don't view Prism as confirmed scum or anything if that's what you're asking. Mostly I was wondering where people saw anything scummy in Spiff's posts. But yeah I guess Prism seeing the same thing as me is probably worth some town points.
VNB wrote:I don't think your ISO is clear about what you think at all which is the problem. Like..
"Well Ginngie's explanation on that has since changed to late night posting and effectively trolling. My best guess is that it was an attempt to show a lack of fear of being wagoned because it might be associated with a town Ginngie but I'm still confused by it."
You don't sound like you think she's scum.
Let me clarify then. I don't think town has any reason to try to match their town meta intentionally.
VNB wrote:Kmd: 'My best guess is that it was an attempt to show a lack of fearof being wagoned because it might be associated with a town Ginngie but I'm still confused by it.' Also, bella says there are way too many linguistic qualifiers in this sentence - 'guess' 'might' 'confused'. You don't sound like this is a legit read either way. You sound like you're posting words. The rest of the post has nothing in it either, it looks huge but this bit is it? Nothing you given moves the game forward in any way. "YOU'RE GIVIN ME NOTHING!"
Yeah, you're right. I haven't figured out for sure what Ginngie was trying to accomplish there. There's plenty of context before this about how it reads like Ginngie was being manipulative and trying to accomplish
something
but it's hard to tell what exactly. I don't like the change of explanation either. I think you're reading a lack of confidence in this read that isn't there. Had I been caught up, I would have been voting Ginngie for most of Day 1.
Cary wrote:I'm not really here because I'm busy with my girlfriend but I think you and VNB are arguing about words and you're resisting the realisation that it's just words.
Why is that more likely to be scum doing it intentionally than town just being stubborn?
Spiff wrote:If the conclusion is "nothing meaningful to analyze", then what's the point of posting this in the first place? I don't see why town would devote 1 of their 3 content posts to something that ultimately doesn't matter. I feel like scum are more likely to say something like this because "hey look at me thinking critically about the game!!!", whereas I don't think town would waste their time. It's as if he realizes "analyzing the wagon" is something that's expected so he made sure everyone knew he was doing it even though it didn't result in anything helpful.
He grabbed quotes and everything, it seems like he's trying to pass this off as a meaningful contribution when it's actually useless.
Devil's advocate because I don't town read Leon, but don't you think scum would be more likely to come up with some conclusion to make it look better?
Spiff wrote:KMD isn't an awful vote I guess. I remember playing with his alt before who I was easily able to identify as town and I'm obviously not getting that here. I just don't think anything content-wise against him is all that compelling.
Shaman mafia? I was on vacation from work Day 1 of that game when you started townreading me. People ALWAYS town read me when I have free time to post and scum read me when I don't lol.
Cary wrote:ah. Who here has seen you do that before, do you know?
As town or scum?
Ginngie wrote:camn, NMS
Imperium, Caryatid
KMD, Prism
Leonshade, VNB, Polar
camn wrote:I could dig murdering that list..from the bottom up.
Hell, throw Ginngie in that bottom tier and I'd probably volunteer to go first. Why does my top scum read have reads pretty close to my own. Like switch Cary with Mastina and Prism with Polar and it's basically my reads. (Also, spiff got forgotten so put him in the town tier). *sigh*. Maybe I DO need to re-evaluate Ginngie. Or maybe just Ginngie's buddies if Ginngie flips scum at some point.
Prism wrote:kmd still needs to answer my question about 20 pages back that someone reinforced and went more indepth on at some point, which is "Why is your vote still on me?'
I wasn't caught up and there was no point unvoting someone at one vote. My read on you also never changed so there's that too.
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Camn and VNB, can you go into detail about what you liked about Leon's catch up? I'm not seeing it.
Ginngie wrote:Town: camn, mastina, Imperium, Cary, Leon, Prism
Who's Left: Spiff, KMD, VNB, Polar Vortex
Oh, wow. Your reads stopped matching mine pretty quickly. That was like my only hesitance on scumreading you.
Prism wrote:I get your point, the point is flatly wrong. Again, I made no attempt to play up how drunk I was. You acknowledged this when discussing me knowing what a backspace key is. I made it clear that the invitation was to interact with me and see what you got, not to townread me for nothing. You have yet to acknowledge this one, but reading any of that post as well as any of #420 or any of the post you quoted makes it clear what the intent was.
Again:
Kmd wrote:I think it's obvious you were implying we'd get genuine town you because I don't think you'd be willing to post as sloppy drunk scum if it was what you made it out to be. It's not a "mastermind" move. It's pretty simple, actually. You acting like you don't understand my point is probably worse than that anyway though.
It's not so much how drunk you were as "lol interact with me and see how town I am". Yes, you threw in the "sloppy scum" line and invited people to make their own decision. But the implication is clearly that you're saying you are willing to post because you'll be genuine town. You are clearly looking for town reads with that comment.
Prism wrote:Like, here we are, let's appreciate the fact that we're on page 66 and I'm still having to explain that basically stating "I'm drunk and presumably worse as scum, come talk to me." 40 pages back is not a scumtell. This is the last I'm saying on it, I don't scumread you for it, but the fact that we have mountains of actual shit to read and I felt it necessary to make a 7th restatement because you're refusing to actually read the point and instead talking semantics (Oh, it's less than surgery!) is disgusting
I've read your point. You've completely missed mine (still). I'm fine with dropping the discussion on it though because we were talking in circles long before now. Nothing productive will come from it.
Prism wrote:ie.
Sure, I could have been indirectly implying I was town just for the fact I was posting at all.
I made it really clear in the post though that the whole point was just to talk, nothing more, and to leverage your advantage regardless of what I was or how large/small it turned out to be.
Yes! This! The bolded. That was the point I was making.
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I also want to clarify that Prism's votes that I pointed out and the calling my post town without saying why are a much bigger deal to me than the whole drunk posting thing. The fact that that one point was the one that drew such a reaction doesn't mean that it's the main basis of my scum read.
