Open 697: Tit for Tat GAME OVER SCUM WINS!

[Flubbernugget]

Referring to Sesq

[guyy]

are you still catching up mulch

[SmoothBlue]

Post 67 is

honestly not a bad vote

in general (volume reads of little scumhunting) but not something I can really see at this early stage in the game.

Pretty bad reason to vote here, not neccecarily scummy

. @smoothblue, what was towny about 89? This is one post I definitely need clarification on. And 159 is so bad and nothing really scummy at all from Sesq. He hasn't been anymore self centered than anyone here


VOTE: Blue

You come into the game. Your first scum read already has inconsistencies...
89 - Nothing. I voted him to see his scum reads, he provided them. I unvoted him. I dont see how you "definitely need" clarification on that.

I'd like you to show me the lease self-centered post by Sesq, in your opinion, that provides value.

[Mulch]

I'm here, ok let's get cracking

[Mulch]

I maintain my position that the blind sheep is a null identifier. #101 is still too emotional of a reaction and he doesn't provide any counter points, so just looks like deflection.

The thing is, this is NAI. Both town and scum want to deflect their lynches. A common misconception is that town don't give a fuck about themselves, which is not true. Plus, this isn't really emoitional.

[guyy]

tbh i think smoothblue is more scummy than sesq

but at the same time i'd rather lose sesq than smoothblue

i know that's weird

[guyy]

oh sweet hello mulch

[Sesq]

I maintain my position that the blind sheep is a null identifier. #101 is still too emotional of a reaction and he doesn't provide any counter points, so just looks like deflection.

The thing is, this is NAI. Both town and scum want to deflect their lynches. A common misconception is that town don't give a fuck about themselves, which is not true. Plus, this isn't really emoitional.

this absolutely

if anything its the exact the opposite, for me.

such a shit reason for wagon smh

pedit: i get what you're saying. i'm a late bloomer, so that opinion is probably going to change in the future

[Mulch]

@Mulch: In what way do you think that Commknight's analysis is different from kop's? Also if you could clarify your read on sesq that'd be great. I think I'm getting into a place with sesq that I've done before, where a detrimental playstyle is distracting my abiltiy to read someone.

Maybe I'm missing something obvious but I don't see any analysis from Commknight? At least 2 people now have said that he talked about his reaction test and I literally don't see it.


Sesq:

Sesq has been doing a lot of stuff that isn't really AI at all and is more playstyle indicative. His short, non explanatory posts can easily come from both allignments. But when I was following the game and saw his post in 107 it was sort of a lightbulb moment where he had the exact same reaction from me and in a weird way I could follow his reasoning. It was your worst post of the game by far beacuse it felt super opportunistic and obvious, and not very well thought out (just like all the others that pushed on him). This (as a side point) is a sharp contrast to your usually very detailed and well analyzed reads.


I'm having a hard time this game trying to figure out exactly what to do with Screen's comment. I feel like there is a chance he's just a wolf, but tbh I do think it's best to consider it NAI and the fact that so many people pushed on it is so alarming. For everyone voting him: Do you follow their reasoning? Yes, I can follow it, and I think town and scum can easily jump on it as well. But...it's also just something that's so blatantly on the surface scummy that it's pathetically easy for scum to push it, which is why I'm wary of scum pushing on it for an easy push in lieu of actually scumhunting and finding true allignment indicative things.

[Sesq]

damn... this guy knows how i play better than i do...

i am scared now

also w/r/t screen i dont see anything scummy, can anyone explain it for me?

[Mulch]

I'm sort of scumreading Kunk's analysis of my reads because they sort of seemed to analyze them in a really black and white way that's easy for wolves to fake, like "are they consistent" and "do they match up with my own reads" without really trying to get into my thought process.

It's not a big point cause village can obviously do this too, but it's again one of those things that if occurs often is a problem. Which probably isn't the case in Kunk's particular situation because of the intensity, effort, and critical thinking that they had in their other stuff.

[Sesq]

i see him as an angry man who has a set way of doing things and is mad other people arent doing things the set way

could be scum, but could be not. idk

[Mulch]

It gave me the impression that you already had information that you wanted to use to start a narrative.

This is a scumread style that I can easily follow and easily understand with Kunk early day 1. But I want to know if you just sort of glazed over it, and was like, yeah this is way too much and is an overflux of information for this juncture of the game, or if you really looked at it and see if you coulden't really get where they were coming from. I was able to do just that which is why I'm not scumreading them for it.

[Mulch]

i just meant him saying the "slip" was a reaction test and the follow ups thereafter. as i said, you don't have to agree with the process of information gathering or the information actually gathered, but you can't really deny that he contributed something, even if you think it's useless or counter to town interests. i don't atm

Alright, I have a few problems with this. How did you intend to mean this when you said "I buy that explanation." I mean, that's not really a vague or ambiguous statement. It means you agreed with his explanation. I don't see an explanation.

I have a question as well:

Why do you think it's town indicative to just say random things and say it's a reaction test? Don't you think there should be an exact purpose to it and end goal, or do you think just uttering that phrase is getting us closer to the town's interests? And also, don't you think saying it was a reaction test to get out of scummy heavior is something that could very well come from scum? I need to understand how your thinking along these lines, because right now I don't get it.

[Mulch]

So you are basically saying that by Srceen being so opportunistic......he ended up not being opportunistic.

Not at all. I'm saying that the people jumping on him have a good probablity of being opportunistic.

My bad, you said 162 and I mistyped 168. Caring about your appearance rather doing some scumhunting (during the time when the Srceen wagon was forming) is rather scummy imo. That is why I townread Raya because she was unscathed when the pressure was on her.

I am also willing to lynch CommKnight today as well.

I don't get what your saying here. In 162 Screen is questioning a townread on him. Good scum can fake this but in general being worried about why people are townreading you isn't something that is on the front of scum's minds, who would rather just let the townread sit and not bother to parse through how people came to that conclusion in the first place. If they aren't being lynched, scum usually don't care. I really need you to expand on why you think worrying about a TOWNREAD is caring about your experience, because for me it's the opposite

[Mulch]

wait

VOTE: tywin

you're right mulch

I am sort of townreading this because I can easily see his point of view cause of Tywin's last comment. It made no sense. I might join you on this if Tywin's answer is inadequate to my questions.

[Mulch]

@Raya

, I would appreciate some comments on my catch up and subsequent posting and not just responding to random comments in the past. I realize you may have felt like you needed to resolve that and are pressed on time, but I specifically want you to try and defend yourself to what I found was scummy about you. I find it slightly strange that you chose to ignore it after people were generally townreading you (woulden't you be angry?), but I do realize it could be activity based.

[Mulch]

Your first scum read already has inconsistencies...

I don't see it. Where are the inconsistencies?


I also would like to ask why you didn't call out 189 by Kunk which agreed with my reads with a main basis and reason being that they were consistent. Did you miss it, or did you choose to agree with it- and if so, why?

[Mulch]

89 - Nothing. I voted him to see his scum reads, he provided them. I unvoted him. I dont see how you "definitely need" clarification on that.

Why did you want to see the scumreads if you weren't gonna analyze them in the first place? If I follow, you placed a vote to pressure him into giving reads, he gives reads, you unvote. If he had said random things, were you gonna unvote? What I see here are reads that aren't very special at all, so I want to know why you found them satisfactory.

I'd like you to show me the lease self-centered post by Sesq, in your opinion, that provides value.

At this point I'm wondering if you read my catch up except for my read on you. I understand it's a natural action just to care about myself, but weren't you curious if my analysis held up to anyone else, especially because it was so egregrious and inconsistent as you say with you?

I already explained that 107 was an amazing post by Sesq, yes which held value

[kunkstar7]

Maybe I'm missing something obvious but I don't see any analysis from Commknight?

Phone posting: I meant Comm's analysis where he came up with the 50/50.

[kunkstar7]

see him as an angry man who has a set way of doing things and is mad other people arent doing things the set way

Close enough, meta I last played in would not have tolerated your play in the slightest.

[Srceenplay]

It gave me the impression that you already had information that you wanted to use to start a narrative.

This is a scumread style that I can easily follow and easily understand with Kunk early day 1. But I want to know if you just sort of glazed over it, and was like, yeah this is way too much and is an overflux of information for this juncture of the game, or if you really looked at it and see if you coulden't really get where they were coming from. I was able to do just that which is why I'm not scumreading them for it.

No. I did not try to over analyze it. I just read it. Thought it seem a little soon.
Again that's why I was asking others for some meta on him.

[Sesq]

see him as an angry man who has a set way of doing things and is mad other people arent doing things the set way

Close enough, meta I last played in would not have tolerated your play in the slightest.

you could afford to be a bit more tolerant

[SmoothBlue]

Question for you, why was I required to go into detail about my town read on Raya and answer questions about it but kunstar gets an ez pass? (even though kunstar was the one that wrote a wall about his Raya town read in the first place)

Because Kungstar already went into detail regarding his town read in the initial post. You just agreed to it...

[SmoothBlue]

Your first scum read already has inconsistencies...

I don't see it. Where are the inconsistencies?


I also would like to ask why you didn't call out 189 by Kunk which agreed with my reads with a main basis and reason being that they were consistent. Did you miss it, or did you choose to agree with it- and if so, why?

I bolded them out in 202...