Adel wrote:unvote, vote Guardian
Adel proceeds to flip back and forth between opie and Guardian (and at one point Matt_S).Adel wrote:call it a pre-emptive OMGUS vote. You should've supported the opie wagon, now I'm going to get you.
@Adel: I have several questions for you.Adel wrote:totally scum.Patrick wrote:Adel, what do you think of Oman?
I also suspect that we have a vig and not an sk.
OK, so then why do you think CO found Guardian guilty this morning and not innocent, when an innocent cop would be much easier to believe than an insane one in a mini normal?Erg0 wrote:The thing to bear in mind with the averages is that scum are almost always going to make a claim that has a high potential of saving them on day 1.
he was agreeing with me, and I tend to give players that agree with me the public benefit of the doubt. I'm always skeptical.Jitsu wrote: @Adel: I have several questions for you.
I noticed on several occasions you acting supportive toward Oman on Day 1, and it didn't seem as if you found him scummy for most of the day. So, how did you really feel about Oman? If you didn't find him scummy early on, what changed your mind?
*shrug* I didn't really think about it. I was more interested in getting him lynched than trying to figure out his alignment.Did you really think Opie was guilty at the end of Day 1?
Because I've seen this rush to reach conclusions before, when I was a vig. A death scene with a knife wound and a gunshot would does not mean that we are up against a mafia group and a sk. That supposed SK-kill could really be from a vig, a second mafia group, or werewolves. I advocate model angosticism.Why do you suspect we have a vig and not an SK?
OK, so what was it that changed your opinion of Oman from "I'm giving him the public benefit of the doubt" and being skeptical of him, to publicly declaring him "totally scum"?Adel wrote:he was agreeing with me, and I tend to give players that agree with me the public benefit of the doubt. I'm always skeptical.
I have respect for your ability to gambit and get results. It's worked well for you in the past in some cases. In others, you could have easily cost the town the game. I've not read any of your scum games yet, but I can see how developing a reputation for acting scummy even as town can help you escape criticism as scum as well. Since you've apparently spent some of the town's currency by randomly lynching Opie with a weak case to try to out the scum and gain information, I want to know what return you've gotten on the investment. What did you learn from Day 1 regarding Opie's lynch?*shrug* I didn't really think about it. I was more interested in getting him lynched than trying to figure out his alignment.
OK, I agree with these statements, but it sounds like your answer here, referencing model agnosticism and listing the possibilities, is saying that it's just as likely to be one as any of the others, and it is unwise to assume one over the other, simply because knife kills are commonly attributed to an SK. Cautioning people that we may not be dealing with an SK and keep an open mind is sage advice, but then why did you say earlier that you also suspected that we have a Vig and not an SK? Are you saying that this situation is close enough to the previous one that you believe the role is the same?Because I've seen this rush to reach conclusions before, when I was a vig. A death scene with a knife wound and a gunshot would does not mean that we are up against a mafia group and a sk. That supposed SK-kill could really be from a vig, a second mafia group, or werewolves. I advocate model angosticism.
I was most recently scum in newbie 540 (& beat MoS in a pie E7). http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=7187Jitsu wrote:I've not read any of your scum games yet, but I can see how developing a reputation for acting scummy even as town can help you escape criticism as scum as well.
do I care? no.Xylthixlm wrote:Adel, let me get you straight. You picked a random player day 1, and bandwagoned him to lynch without ever wondering whether or not he was actually scum. And you expect us to be happy about this?
I think the question you are really wanting to ask is "what made you publically state that Oman is "totally scum". There is amost always a differe3nce between what I am thinking and what I am typing.Jitsu wrote:OK, so what was it that changed your opinion of Oman from "I'm giving him the public benefit of the doubt" and being skeptical of him, to publicly declaring him "totally scum"?Adel wrote:he was agreeing with me, and I tend to give players that agree with me the public benefit of the doubt. I'm always skeptical.
It isn't perfectly clear... especially since I haven't reread since Guardian and opie's alignments were revealed.I have respect for your ability to gambit and get results. It's worked well for you in the past in some cases. In others, you could have easily cost the town the game. I've not read any of your scum games yet, but I can see how developing a reputation for acting scummy even as town can help you escape criticism as scum as well. Since you've apparently spent some of the town's currency by randomly lynching Opie with a weak case to try to out the scum and gain information, I want to know what return you've gotten on the investment. What did you learn from Day 1 regarding Opie's lynch?*shrug* I didn't really think about it. I was more interested in getting him lynched than trying to figure out his alignment.
Because I suspect that there may be a vig and not an sk. It seemed like everyone was rushing to the conclusion that there was a sk, and I felt like giving a little push in the oppisite direction.OK, I agree with these statements, but it sounds like your answer here, referencing model agnosticism and listing the possibilities, is saying that it's just as likely to be one as any of the others, and it is unwise to assume one over the other, simply because knife kills are commonly attributed to an SK. Cautioning people that we may not be dealing with an SK and keep an open mind is sage advice, but then why did you say earlier that you also suspected that we have a Vig and not an SK?Because I've seen this rush to reach conclusions before, when I was a vig. A death scene with a knife wound and a gunshot would does not mean that we are up against a mafia group and a sk. That supposed SK-kill could really be from a vig, a second mafia group, or werewolves. I advocate model angosticism.
follow this link, and judge for yourself: http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... &start=559Are you saying that this situation is close enough to the previous one that you believe the role is the same?
Yeah, I don't think we should be letting slide players who habitually mislead the town.Adel wrote:There is amost always a differe3nce between what I am thinking and what I am typing.
feel free to lynch me then. At least I generate information that can illuminate the alignment of other players.Xylthixlm wrote:Yeah, I don't think we should be letting slide players who habitually mislead the town.Adel wrote:There is amost always a differe3nce between what I am thinking and what I am typing.
unless, of course, it worked and outed two scum.Erg0 wrote:What she did was arguably not in the town's interests
It doesn't exactly make it easier to analyze the game than a natural bandwagon would. As gambits go, pretty lousy. If the wagon was just to attract scum, why were Guardian and pickemgenius both on it?Jitsu wrote:@Oman, Xylthixlm, ChaosOmega: Adel alleges that the Opie wagon was random and designed to draw out scum. What are your responses to this?
I was never convinced opie was scum. My vote was primarily to avoid a Guardian lynch, since I thought he was more likely to be town than opie.Jitsu wrote:@Xylthixlm: When did you start to think that Opie might actually be town? Was it really not until post 682? What about that post convinced you that Opie was a townie being taken advantage of?
