TBD Mafia 2 [game over]

[Llamarble]

btw Llama do you anything about why Lycan had the stance they had on Toby

Not really, it looks like they were interested in Toby maybe because they're an unusual entity, so they focused on them and tried to work with them and stuff?

[chesskid3]

Also i categorically deny being a survivor so anyone who takes a potshot at me better be prepared for post game rage and the honorary scum mvp.

Or yaknow feel free to have scum NK me tonight Bulbs its cool.

[Alisae]

Eh maybe my memory is failing me on how Lycan treated Toby with the "He's useless move on" and WK bits.

[Bulbazak]

I can't remember if I've played with Chess since Fire Emblem: Awakening, and he was town there. But he was extremely strong town and immediately apparent. I'm not getting that here, and like I've said, I'm not seeing town motivation for a lot of his actions.

You were town and voted honorary scum mvp as I recall?

The difference here is you, not me.

:/

My hydra was the only one that married scum and produced a scum child, which we didn't know at the time and were blind to. During the course of the game we got a tracker guilty on scum and were instrumental to forming the town bloc that ended up winning the game. However, we were also constantly being attacked by 2 other slots that were town but trying to undermine everything. We ended up being night killed, but one of the last things I said before the end of the previous day was the steps town had to take to win the game, and I listed both scum in the family PT as part of the PoE, as we excluded them from the town bloc. We got a ton of hate that game for essentially not noticing the scum that were essentially staying in our blind spot all game, even though we helped set in motion the tools town used to actually go on and win.

FE:A, along with Marvel Avengers Alliance, are both responsible to my shift in playstyle towards favoring PoE, as it was instrumental in breaking those games wide open.

[chesskid3]

lmao are u seriously trying to take credit? that game was an absolute stomp at first and then it took many extra days to close out because of people like you.

[chesskid3]

My hydra was the only one that married scum

lol

[chesskid3]

but anyway yeah this game is scum Bulbs not the regular VI Bulbs

[Bulbazak]

No, we were blinded by the scum team and ineffectual in that regard. But along with Nacho/Mastin, we did help put together the town bloc that helped to win the game. My point is that the hate we got in that game was extreme and unrealistic, and all revolving around us being wrong on our Maestro read, which blinded us on Penguin.

[Bulbazak]

Anyway, this is not the time or place to discuss this. My point is that I don't remember playing another game with you besides that one, although it's possible, and your play here is nowhere near the same.

[chesskid3]

Uhhh? Man I watched this movie and Dicaprio was a pilot but then the next one he was hunting for diamonds wtf my brain cant handle it

[Bulbazak]

Also just did a double check through your topics, and we were in L4D together. And I still had you as town. So yeah, feeling pretty confident in my read here, even though you're trying to discredit me while simultaneously calling me scum.

[chesskid3]

Well im discrediting you as a person while also calling you scum,
doubling down on the fact that we didnt get a scummy in fire emblem because of you, and that if you somehow are town we're still better off with you dead yes

[Llamarble]

So we have about a day. I think Mario is still a good choice. Not a slam dunk, but nobody is yet, at least for me.
He simply hasn't put The Work into scumhunting.
The highest engagement posts are replies when others find him suspicious and substitutions of setup-thoughts (toby prob not town for setup) for reads, which are often when scum will engage.
Looking at the game holistically, he fits well as scum with several other players.
There is definitely a lazytown / relaxed reading that also works for his posts though.
This is not a perfect lynch. Mario is lynchbait (he gets lynched a lot as town, which makes me doubt this but also makes him a significant liability in a long game).
Hopefully he is scum lynchbait this time.

I will look at Bulba again since he's probably the most viable alternative for today. Also there is a promising "bulbascum knows Mario is town" explanation for their interaction

At this point I've already towned hard enough that I have trouble believing anyone genuinely thinks I'm scum. It's not like Lycan was even scummy so I'm not sure why I had votes to begin with, or why the votes have been so bizarrely sticky - don't people know an active day 1 with a lot of wagons creates town wins?? And when all the sketchy people votepark someone and then try to push it through at deadline over a very active pro-town replacement, doubling down instead of considering doubts (compare my expression of my doubts and not overselling reads that don't deserve it), is that seriously a lynch you want to be on? I'll probably get nightkilled anyway.

EVERYONE SHOULD PLACE A VOTE FOR SOMEONE WHO COULD ACTUALLY GET LYNCHED WITH THEIR NEXT POST (and check in before deadline to assure a majority is reached on someone)

[chesskid3]

Vote: Bulbazak

Im around to move it anytime

[Vecna]

Llamurble reading into my reaction the way he did once again shows no actual interest in reading into a situation and genuinely trying to read allignment. Him going from a townread on me after first readthrough, purely trying to find reasons to scumread me after seeing im the one that continues to be onto him (after he even admitted my reasoning for doing so is totally valid) makes me totally unwilling to lynch anywhere else today.

Ooh, "He even admitted X" is one of my favorite scum-constructions!
I said that avoiding ruffling feathers was a scumtell. Tell me more about all the feathers I'm not ruffling. Tell me more about how superficial my reads are...
You said lack of depth to reads is scummy, but in the 1 day I've been in this game I've already consumed the entire thread multiple different ways, even looked for supplemental information in other games trying to figure this out. I've pointed out posts that make me doubt the overall impressions I get of people so I can test those impressions and compare against other games.
1 day of play, and I'm already obvtown.
And yeah, once I'm satisfied that I understand this game well enough to lead the town, you'll see me get persuasive and actually explain things in such a way that others can see the game from my perspective and reach the same conclusions.
My scumgame, since Mastin asked, has always rested on the fact that sometimes I lurk as town (obligations and all), and then I kill everyone I can't just shout down and do 1v1 fights (because those are literally the easiest thing for scum to do, choosing a single target and constructing logical arguments why others should lynch them, complete with that delicious "He even admitted") until endgame. I am good at finding the path to victory. The thing I do not excel at as scum is exactly what I've spent the last day doing - the studying-storm of becoming one with the game to solve it.

Im sure theres been plenty of times where scum do use that line of reasoning. Thats not whats happening here though. Other favorites that are often used by both town and scum alike; Talking about how you've become Obvtown, talking about your own meta, and how youre totally not playing to your scum meta atm. All rather unimpressive arguments.

Also im not gonna deny you probably would be very persuasive in the days to come. And thats exactly why I want to lynch you right now, because youre a danger to this town and one im not confidant thatll ever get lynched if I do happen to die. So yeah, I do believe you trying to set me up to get lynched here is part of your path to victory.

For now, lets discuss your progression on your read on me, since you want me to talk about the depth of your reads. Explain the progression how you went from a townread to having it flipped straight away. And do it without stuff that you attacked later on (like my statement that you attacked in this post), but in the proper linear time-path.

And yes, you do continue to thread lightly without ruffling any feathers. You have suddenly gotten a townread on every vocal and high quality player, while scumreading the one player actively attacking you and 3 lurkers.

[Vecna]

I've noticed in my own (and others' but most of my scumtells are differences I notice between my own scum / town games) play that scum gravitate toward this phrasing more often.
I believe the reason for this is scum feel a greater need to concretely justify themselves to others whereas town know that their own righteousness will clear them eventually.
So scum go for arguments like "Behold the inconsistency or error this player made!" or better yet "they :admitted: to this scummy thing!" because that even claims their target shouldn't disapprove of them.
Sorry if I haven't fully expressed the idea, but I think it's an important one. I guess to summarize, scum want their reasoning to be ironclad and look really good; town want their reasoning to be right.

Ill not argue the truth to this, since its often the case - but theres also the flipside some players will get questioned quite a bit more than others, and them knowing that their own "righteousness" will often be met with heavy resistance from everyone and their dog at every point during the game.

[Vecna]

Actually, as a survivor he'd definately have reasons to stop me from poking into it, and harassing alisae with questions on that matter - if everyone starts to dig into that sort of stuff it would only be a matter of time before he is (force) outted.

Have you played with scum-Chesskid before? Is that angle-looking that youre descibing how he has played as scum before? Hadnt really considered that reasoning behind it, and it seems a bit farfetched to me.....

This is dumb and inaccurate, please refer to earlier post for why forcing survivor claims is dumb before thread was derailed with vig speculation

Say as you will, were not gonna agree on this one clearly, and youre not gonna remove the idea from my head that there are other reasons than this for you freaking out over the issue.

[drealmerz7]

vecna, you just ignoring me?
that's not very pretty

[Srceenplay]

So llama chess or bulbs

[Vaxkiller]

At the moment I want a mario lynch as well. Vecna is close behind. Bulba pings back and forth for me and I would rather figure that out later.

A few others I would be willing to jump onto even tho im not as confident about them.

[chesskid3]

actually it appears to be bulb mario or llama.

But it won't be Llama

[Vaxkiller]

And I doubt were going to get our Mario lynch

[Alisae]

btw chesskid I love the quote in your sig

[chesskid3]

which

[Alisae]

both