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[Aristophanes]

VC 2.05

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Lynching

Fykus

(4): WhyMafia, Toranaga, Sergtacos, humaneatingmonkey

Misère

(3): Thor665, Mulch, Fykus

Toranaga

(1): Chip Butty

Chip Butty

(1): BlueBloodedToffee

Not Voting

(2): Misère, skitter30

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch

The day 2 deadline is in

: (expired on 2017-10-04 11:52:50)

Mod Notes

: Keep it fun! Please let me know if I mess up. The automatic vote counter doesn't work

Misère is being replaced.

[Thor665]

I'm still happy with my Misere vote.
Humaneatingmonkey and Chip lost some town polish for me due to the last few pages.

[Sergtacos]

Sorry that i havent posted, been a crazy weekend (almost every weekend is crazy at universities) will try to catch up later tonight.

[Virtuoso]

@Mod, what happens when Trackers track Millers?

If a tracker tracks a miller who has no other actions, they will get "Player did not visit anyone" If they are roleblocked they get "No results."

[Toranaga]

I honestly feel really bad for flipping on y'all yesterday. let's try lynching a wolf. it could be misère after all. why is she wolfy? why not fykus instead? why is chip villagery?

[skitter30]

Hi I'm back! I'm going to read the last whatever pages now!

[Fykus]

Flip me tomorrow unless you want a repeat of d1.

[Thor665]

I honestly feel really bad for flipping on y'all yesterday. let's try lynching a wolf. it could be misère after all. why is she wolfy? why not fykus instead? why is chip villagery?

Misere is wolfy for offering little and being present on a town flip and being among the rather sketchy Havo pushers.
Fykus, well, there is his current hum drum, I suppose, but has at least felt more involved to me than Misere - this is basically a rotten tomato to a rotten egg, neither are pleasent, both stink, but I can say which I'd much rather be hit by.
Chip looked good Day 1. He looks pretty bad Day 2. I'm choosing to guardedly lean him as maybe a person I don't like rather than particularly obv. scum though, as most of what I don't like is his tone more than the specific thoughts he's pushing, and I did rather like him Day 1 - so the idea that he's more pissy today tends to softly suggest to me he's town as town is the one doing the sucking this game (also I think he is feeling raw about Havo and working overtime to suggest Havo is terrible to salve himself - which also feels like a potential town mindset)

What are your thoughts on the three?

[Chip Butty]

So Toranaga has been caught in a lie, and you're just going to disregard that?

[WhyMafia]

So Toranaga has been caught in a lie, and you're just going to disregard that?

How so?

[Mulch]

Let’s lynch misere

[Chip Butty]

So Toranaga has been caught in a lie, and you're just going to disregard that?

How so?

1269

[Mulch]

He refuted it tho

[skitter30]

So, I wrote a catchup novel. Spoilered cuz I write a lot.

Spoiler:

Chip

1053- Kinda ick. Undermining all future attacks on him based on the Havo fullclaim thing; did this to Tor shortly thereafter
1139 - More ick, especially given later
1164 - I disagree about BBT. That particular vote doesn't go against his stated strategy. But his whole shtick is blatantly anti-town at best, if not outright scummy. The fact that people are excusing his behavior is kinda worrying me. Like, I feel like town!BBT is incredibly easy for scum to push as a mislynch, and the fact that this isn't happening is weird.
1170 - Yeah I don't get this. You're almost excusing his behavior and are willing to give him a pass until almost LYLO? Why aren't you pushing him if you 'retain doubts' about him? Why has your interpretation of his play changed?
1173 (from BBT) - but I don't think this comes from partners?

Chip/BBT interactions are kinda weird on this page. I don't really get why Chip isn't concerned about BBT. From Chip's end, my best guess is that scum!Chip is trying to stave off attention from partner!BBT, but BBT's response doesn't really make sense if that's what's happening here; doesn't make sense for scum!BBT to highlight partner!Chip's change in read. So I'm not sure why chip is kinda chill about BBT.

1176 - Hmm. a) not sure why you didn't think of that before cuz I've been low-key thinking that for much of the game b) he's like playing the exact opposite of how a PR should play; if he's town, yeah he's never getting night-killed here, but he's making himself incredibly lynchable. c) you pushed Havo for a hardclaim but you're fine with leaving BBT because 'oh he might be a PR'???
1180 - Again, the fact that BBT hasn't been wagoned is sketchy af for just this reason. And I don't get the argument for why his play is NAI? Unless he does this for like every game.
1185 - I guess what I don't get here is what makes Havo and BBT different. BBT is drawing attention by very refuding very obstinately to play the game. You were OK with pushing Havo, but are backing off BBT. I don't really get why you're treating them differently?
1194 - Um, OMGUS much? Backing away from the PR thing once people point out how ridiculous this is
1204 - Yeah, I actually missed it. I was responding to something else and I missed it in the ninjas. I came back and people were saying he softed and I didn't get it
1259 - are you ironically echoing fykus's post that you called 'not very reassuring' previously on that page? cuz otherwise you're calling out fykus for doing the exact same thing you're doing lololol
1271 - I'm not sure it does? The two people who got added to the Havo wagon are yourself and WM. Presumably, you aren't arguing that you're forming a counterwagon on Havo to save your scumbuddy HEM, and you're townreading WM.
1288 - oh, you're arguing that misere/Tor/HEM votes on Havo are the counterwagon for HEM. Hmmm, ok. Are they scum together? Misere/Tor don't really make sense together I think? And HEM/Tor also? I'm not really sure if I get your point here. I dunno. You're implying that scum formed a counterwagon on Havo to 'suck away votes' from the HEM thing, so multiple people piled on, but I'm at least townleaning like all of them, so it's hard for to see there being multiple scum in that group

BBT

1173 - this makes me think he isn't a chip partner though
1189- Yeah, I'm confused here. I don't get why Chip is going on a limb to defend BBT, but BBT is pushing chip


Tor

1182 - are you positing Chip/Fykus/??? Because I don't get your point about Fykus otherwise?
1190 - this is basically exactly what i'm thinking lolololol
1199 - why are you tryng to get chip to work with you on a fykus wagon here? Especially cuz it seems your fykus scumread is partially colored by the fact that chip was defending him?
1264 - this lolololol

Mulch

1064, 1065 - Why do you think misere is scummy? They only have like 10 posts and I like them. Better question, why are you so *confident* about this?
1068 - ???. This post is just weird and I don't have the words for why atm. I'll try to figure it out.
1150 - This basically. I was responding to something else he said and didn't see that post in the ninjas. When I came back to the thread everyone was talking about him softing and I was confused af cuz I missed it
1241 - this was chip's talking point, interesting. I also think tora's been pushing chip the most so he'd get a lot of the flak of a chip townflip, so I don't think he could cost on 'not technically pushing him'
1242 - I don't get the purpose of this question. It's kinda busywork that looks like analysis but isn't and also undermines Tor's experience
1249 - I still don't get the misere push
1278 - you said you're OK with the fykus push though. why are you soft defending him here?

Serg

1097 - I was thinking the exact same thing as I was reading this
1216 - lolololol. There's like no way tor/chip are scum together here.

WM:

1157 - townpoints
1158 - not sure why you're pushing for his lynch so hard on meta, since this is pretty similar to his meta in like every game I have with him, and you apparently have meta with him too

HEM:

1221 - townpoints
1222 - this post feels off to me but I don't have the words for why. Like you're trying to be cavalier about getting lynched to make us think you don't care too much about surviving, but also imply that the game would be worse off without you? I dunno, it's bothering me. I also don't know what 'lynch me only when you're choosing between claimed power roles' means.
1272 - this basically. Fykus and misere have a similar post count and I like misere's, but Fykus has done nothing and your soft-defending Fykus and pushing misere for like nothing
1301- I like this post too.
1329 - he wasn't. he unvoted ten posts and twenty odd minutes after Havo softed, in his first post after the soft. I'm not sure how you can characterize that as 'conscious in his decision to stay because he found Havo's softclaim voteworthy'.
1337 - hmm, apparently you misremembered that. ok
1341 - the game is explicitly 10:3 lol

I wanna wait on Fykus a bit.

Misere hasn't said anything since daystart lololol.

I'm somewhere like here atm:

{HEM, WM}
{tor}
{misere, Thor, serg}
{mulch, fykus}
{chip, BBT} --- not scum together

VOTE: chip

[skitter30]

So Toranaga has been caught in a lie, and you're just going to disregard that?

I don't think he lied.

He votes Havo in 109 and is the second vote on the wagon.
HEM is the third vote in 122.
Tor posts 136 at 11:36am
WM is the fourth vote in 139.
You're the fifth vote in 145
I'm the sixth vote in 154.
Havo softs in 157 at 3:40pm.
Tor switches his vote in 167 at 4pm.

The Havo wagon developed from L-4 to L-1 in around five hours, and he wasn't around for the second half of the wagon. He unvoted in his next post after the soft.

Given that he wasn't here when that happened, and unvoted at the first opportunity, and this whole thing unfolded over like five hours, I don't think you can fault him for being on the wagon when it go to L-1 even if he disagreed with the later votes.

[Mulch]

Not reading that wall but why am I scummy?And why is misere only null?

[Mulch]

641
788

641 was really pockety of me and 788 was the worst vote on the wagon

@Chip

@whymafia

For the last fucking time this is why misere is scummy

[Chip Butty]

there wasn't even any fucking case against him, it was just lack of reads super early in the game. total bullshit pressure and I'd be hard scumreading both of you if I knew you enough to respect your games.

I have zero experience with a Miller best I can remember. The site I used to play at never used them that I recall.

So Wiki says they are a negative role and usually used to counter or lessen the power of the town cop. And the correct play is to claim early although it's debatable.

And I think a good argument has been made by both sides or at least I can see both sides.

I would hate to have to resolve the slot in LyLo tho. But my gut says scum wouldn't do this on D1.
As the Wiki says the claim usually gets lynched or night killed anyway. Or maybe that was one of you guys that said it.

I haven't found any reasonable argument against openclaiming. I wouldn't do it with certain player fields that I am confident to read me well, and I can see an argument for not claiming if you're trying to keep cop equity and if your kill create cop hunt cleared town. The fact is, claiming miller on later gamedays isn't as believable, and claiming miller after getting peeked scum will get you lynched everytime. Certain players with certain fields in certain games can play it in a different way, but this is not the game for that.

I wanna say this post is a little scummy. Bare in mind this is extremely thin, and I don't want to out all the reasons for it. But this is too much commentary instead of adding something to the discussion. Your post is fine otherwise, I get where you're coming from etc. Just think it comes more from scum than town.

this was the fucking reasoning I had for voting Havo

He hasn't refuted it. How can you reconcile these two posts? First he says it was a BS wagon, then he gives his reason for being on it.

If not for his hardclaim I'd be voting him.

Actually i might still be voting him, so

UNVOTE:

For now...

[Chip Butty]

Basically, that's a second lie.

[Mulch]

It’s probably really bad if i don’t read that wall but I’m too tired to do it tonight lol

[Aristophanes]

VC Updated!

Also, BBT is due for a prod.

[Chip Butty]

Let's get a wagon going then. I'm probably more confident than I should be about this

How about skitter?

That's fine too. I could go for dualing Skitter and Misere wagons

I'll probably vote skitter when she gets back, but if a Misere bw catches fire, I'll jump aboard...
R

I'm pretty much here at the moment...

VOTE: Skitter

[skitter30]

I don't know how to read you so you're kinda nullscum by default.

I know you've quoted that like four times, but I still don't get why you think misere is scummy.

I don't think 'trying to pocket you' is a valid reason. I also don't see them trying to do that. Given misere's low votecount/content, I think their Maria trajectory kinda makes sense. They'd been scumreading her since like 115, so I don't havea problem with 788. I don't get why you don't like about 641.

So I don't get why you're so confident about them flipping scum. I don't get why you're soft-defending Fykus. Some of your posts ping me the wrong way like 1068.

Misere has like six posts, but I leaning towards liking the ones that they have.

[skitter30]

I'm somewhere like here atm:

VOTE: chip

I'm pretty much here at the moment...

VOTE: Skitter

I like the ironic echo lololo

[Chip Butty]

I'm somewhere like here atm:

VOTE: chip

I'm pretty much here at the moment...

VOTE: Skitter

I like the ironic echo lololo

Lol