Newbie 1827: Baseball Game Over

[Thor665]

How about this to smack your head against.

Without a counter claim I'm actually, objectivelly (and feel free to show me the math that disproves this, or ask for the math that proves it and I'll provide that and we can debate logic) the most likely town player in this game.

You're voting me while whining about me not backing up statements I haven't made and claiming I lack logic.

Pull your head out of your butt.

[Thor665]

I don't get how you can be so sure of anyones alignment without reading at least a large part of the game. I mean I have to agree with Derpy in that its not good play and definitely won't help town.

How sure do you think I am exactly?
I have not claimed to be sure of anything - so why do you think I am and then use that as evidence of me playing poorly?

I also don't agree that I have reacted badly to my wagon, I don't like the way you have voted for me without even reading my posts and I don't like the way Quick had put me on L-1 without stating and am not buying his reasons that he never realised either but I don't think that what I have said is actually reacting badly to a wagon and more just trying to figure out why you assume I am scum without actually reading anything and why Quick would do a scummy manoeuvre that could easily cause a mislynch.

I agree that you have reacted negatively to the wagon on you.
Doesn't make it a good reaction.

You're overstating my position pretty drastically, which is either you being blind or you fake wailing as scum to attack me.
You complain about Quick's vote, but dropped the conversation with him and haven't been advancing your scum case on him except when I directly ask you to.
It's not a good look.

[wilky]

I don't get how you can be so sure of anyones alignment without reading at least a large part of the game. I mean I have to agree with Derpy in that its not good play and definitely won't help town.

How sure do you think I am exactly?
I have not claimed to be sure of anything - so why do you think I am and then use that as evidence of me playing poorly?

I also don't agree that I have reacted badly to my wagon, I don't like the way you have voted for me without even reading my posts and I don't like the way Quick had put me on L-1 without stating and am not buying his reasons that he never realised either but I don't think that what I have said is actually reacting badly to a wagon and more just trying to figure out why you assume I am scum without actually reading anything and why Quick would do a scummy manoeuvre that could easily cause a mislynch.

I agree that you have reacted negatively to the wagon on you.
Doesn't make it a good reaction.

You're overstating my position pretty drastically, which is either you being blind or you fake wailing as scum to attack me.
You complain about Quick's vote, but dropped the conversation with him and haven't been advancing your scum case on him except when I directly ask you to.
It's not a good look.

No takers?

Vote: Wilky

Okay, I think Wilky is scum.
People should sheep me or explain why their read is better.

I think he's scum due to wagon analysis and the night kill.

Why are you voting 'not voting'.
I'm a Daycop and checked him - he won't flip scum, I promise.

These quoted posts seem like you're fairly sure. I've made my case on Quick he made backtracked on the UCV wagon, then attacked your slot for starting the wagon whilst claiming it wasn't a good wagon then he followed up by putting me on L-1 without stating so meaning he could essentially co-ordinate a mislynch and hope to get away with it especially in a newbie game. I have stated all of this about quick numerous times aswell so hardly just ignoring it either.

[Thor665]

These quoted posts seem like you're fairly sure.

No they don't.
Unless you're saying I'm sure 'Not Voting' isn't scum, but that's not what we're discussing.
At most they show that I'm comfortable enough to call you scum and vote you - that is like the most basic level of confidence possible in the game.
You are also quoting me explicitly asking anyone to explain why their case is better - an implicit admissal of me being aware my case is not potentially as strong as others.

I've made my case on Quick he made backtracked on the UCV wagon, then attacked your slot for starting the wagon whilst claiming it wasn't a good wagon then he followed up by putting me on L-1 without stating so meaning he could essentially co-ordinate a mislynch and hope to get away with it especially in a newbie game. I have stated all of this about quick numerous times aswell so hardly just ignoring it either.

I explained what you're ignoring - you debating things I didn't say is about an annoying as when Derp derps and does the same.
Maybe I'm super unclear and don't realize it?
But in this game people have been going out of their way it feels to ascribe to me things I haven't come close to saying.

You have not been actively advancing the Quick lynch since I replaced in except when I explicitly asked you about Quick.
That is a fact.
You can claim you did it before I replaced in, and that can be true and not affect my stance. You an claim you have been distracted, and that can also be true and have justification. You can claim that the behavior isn't scummy, and we could at least debate the merits of the scumminess or lack of scumminess in the response. But don't spit on my head and tell me it's raining - it's poor play or scummy play.

Who do you think is Quick's partner who isn't voting you?
Also, why would you think he needs a partner? COuldn't he just be scum voting you and hoping for another derp town to hammer the lynch on accident?

[wilky]

These quoted posts seem like you're fairly sure.

No they don't.
Unless you're saying I'm sure 'Not Voting' isn't scum, but that's not what we're discussing.
At most they show that I'm comfortable enough to call you scum and vote you - that is like the most basic level of confidence possible in the game.
You are also quoting me explicitly asking anyone to explain why their case is better - an implicit admissal of me being aware my case is not potentially as strong as others.

I've made my case on Quick he made backtracked on the UCV wagon, then attacked your slot for starting the wagon whilst claiming it wasn't a good wagon then he followed up by putting me on L-1 without stating so meaning he could essentially co-ordinate a mislynch and hope to get away with it especially in a newbie game. I have stated all of this about quick numerous times aswell so hardly just ignoring it either.

I explained what you're ignoring - you debating things I didn't say is about an annoying as when Derp derps and does the same.
Maybe I'm super unclear and don't realize it?
But in this game people have been going out of their way it feels to ascribe to me things I haven't come close to saying.

You have not been actively advancing the Quick lynch since I replaced in except when I explicitly asked you about Quick.
That is a fact.
You can claim you did it before I replaced in, and that can be true and not affect my stance. You an claim you have been distracted, and that can also be true and have justification. You can claim that the behavior isn't scummy, and we could at least debate the merits of the scumminess or lack of scumminess in the response. But don't spit on my head and tell me it's raining - it's poor play or scummy play.

Who do you think is Quick's partner who isn't voting you?
Also, why would you think he needs a partner? COuldn't he just be scum voting you and hoping for another derp town to hammer the lynch on accident?

1- you definitely do seem fairly certain i'm scum from those replies there.
2- I am definitely not avoiding your questions put to me, since you have subbed into the game I have said my piece on quick and given my reasons. For someone who is near as conf. town I have no idea what both yourself and TSQ performance is actually aiming to achieve tbh.

As for Quick's partner I am not entirely sure who it could be just yet, CS was the one who hammered in D1 but I don't feel like it entirely pins him down as scum, the other option of an accidental town lynch could be plausible aswell yes.

[Apple Jack]

Not going get involve myself in a back and forth argument with Thor anymore.

From my POV he isn’t guaranteed to be town, even without a CC

[Thor665]

1- you definitely do seem fairly certain i'm scum from those replies there.
2- I am definitely not avoiding your questions put to me, since you have subbed into the game I have said my piece on quick and given my reasons. For someone who is near as conf. town I have no idea what both yourself and TSQ performance is actually aiming to achieve tbh.

As for Quick's partner I am not entirely sure who it could be just yet, CS was the one who hammered in D1 but I don't feel like it entirely pins him down as scum, the other option of an accidental town lynch could be plausible aswell yes.

1. How so? Literally all you showed me do was place a vote and state my reasons.
2. I never said you avoided any questions from me - why do you keep misrepping what I'm saying?
I'm aiming to achieve a scum lynch. What are you aiming to achieve right now? Because if it's a scum lynch, then try reading what I'm saying more clearly.

What makes you think it's a quick lynch plan?
I almost never see those except in mylo/lylo, what makes you expect one here?

Not going get involve myself in a back and forth argument with Thor anymore.

From my POV he isn’t guaranteed to be town, even without a CC

You haven't functionally engaged me at all and are for some reason retreating down your rabbit hole instead of offering any rational debate and are avoiding presenting evidence to support your claims when directly asked to.
If you're town, and I think you are currently, you are doing the other town players a gross disservice by your current choice of play style and blind tunnel vision.

I am not guranteed to be town, I am still by a substantial margain, objectively the single most likely slot to be town.
You're still voting me and being blind tunneled with derp, Derp.
Logic it up anytime now.
Heck, even just spot my partner and vote them, even that is better play if you're convinced this is all some elaborate gambit that is owningtown's face.

[Apple Jack]

the fact that you know what I want from you but won't because you are hung up on semantics and minor details is just dumb. I feel bad for the new players in here who have to see not 1 but 2 terrible ICs.

Until you show me your work that points to wilky as scum on the VCA, show me your work on why the NK points to wilky being scum, and show me posts that wilky has made that implicate him as scum you words are lost on me.

as long as you refuse to properly respond to the above post in a way that meets MY expectations. I am not going to engage in you and your blatant misreps and lies and I certainly am not going to remove my vote.

[Quick]

@Quick - can you explain why you were so quick to leap onto Wilky with me? Looking back over everything you posted this day phase does not leave me with a lot of impressions concerning your issues with Wilky. Why shouldn't I find your leap opportunistic and scummy?

I thought wilky was Sus D1.

wilky thought shea was Scum for not playing the way he thought other IC's should play. I found issue with that. I think there was another reason or two on why I thought they were Scum but can't really remember.

Plus, like, you are thor and stuff. You are basically confTown to me at this point so why shouldn't I sheep you?

[Thor665]

the fact that you know what I want from you but won't because you are hung up on semantics and minor details is just dumb. I feel bad for the new players in here who have to see not 1 but 2 terrible ICs.

Here are the facts;

1. Everything that you've asked me I've directly answered.
2. Some of the things you've asked me I've said 'I never advocated what you're asking about'.
3. I presume all your daft questions are daft.
4. If you think I'm trying to be clever - just ask the magical hidden questions you think I'm dodging directly. i am talking direct at you and already explained how I didn't accept non-questions as questions.


Also, magic idea - feel free to answer some of my questions while you whine about me dodging the questions you presume I know you mean.

Until you show me your work that points to wilky as scum on the VCA, show me your work on why the NK points to wilky being scum, and show me posts that wilky has made that implicate him as scum you words are lost on me.

as long as you refuse to properly respond to the above post in a way that meets MY expectations. I am not going to engage in you and your blatant misreps and lies and I certainly am not going to remove my vote.[/quote]
I have already done this and linked it to you once.
I don't care about your imaginary standards.
Your imaginary standards and my ability or inability to qualify to them fails to excuse your abysmal play here.

I want to believe you're smart enough to understand that.

wilky thought shea was Scum for not playing the way he thought other IC's should play. I found issue with that. I think there was another reason or two on why I thought they were Scum but can't really remember.

Derpy is basically advocating the same thing, saying that tsq and I are playing so poorly we must be scum.
Do you have issue with him?

Plus, like, you are thor and stuff. You are basically confTown to me at this point so why shouldn't I sheep you?

What in the universe have I done to deserve that sort of response from you?

Unvote: Wilky
Vote: Quick

[Quick]

This is an alt, Thor. I am aware of your standing in the newb project Smith did and in the ELO project Releo did.

[Quick]

and yeah, a little while ago I said I was debating voting for DH. Did you miss that post or something?

[Quick]

Plus there is Majiffy's flow chart. These are all reasons to sheep you, but I'm not going to sheep you on myself, obviously.

[wilky]

1- you definitely do seem fairly certain i'm scum from those replies there.
2- I am definitely not avoiding your questions put to me, since you have subbed into the game I have said my piece on quick and given my reasons. For someone who is near as conf. town I have no idea what both yourself and TSQ performance is actually aiming to achieve tbh.

As for Quick's partner I am not entirely sure who it could be just yet, CS was the one who hammered in D1 but I don't feel like it entirely pins him down as scum, the other option of an accidental town lynch could be plausible aswell yes.

1. How so? Literally all you showed me do was place a vote and state my reasons.
2. I never said you avoided any questions from me - why do you keep misrepping what I'm saying?
I'm aiming to achieve a scum lynch. What are you aiming to achieve right now? Because if it's a scum lynch, then try reading what I'm saying more clearly.

What makes you think it's a quick lynch plan?
I almost never see those except in mylo/lylo, what makes you expect one here?

Not going get involve myself in a back and forth argument with Thor anymore.

From my POV he isn’t guaranteed to be town, even without a CC

You haven't functionally engaged me at all and are for some reason retreating down your rabbit hole instead of offering any rational debate and are avoiding presenting evidence to support your claims when directly asked to.
If you're town, and I think you are currently, you are doing the other town players a gross disservice by your current choice of play style and blind tunnel vision.

I am not guranteed to be town, I am still by a substantial margain, objectively the single most likely slot to be town.
You're still voting me and being blind tunneled with derp, Derp.
Logic it up anytime now.
Heck, even just spot my partner and vote them, even that is better play if you're convinced this is all some elaborate gambit that is owningtown's face.

The quote where you said something along the lines of dont spit on your head and tell you its raining came across to me as avoiding your question and answering what I wanted to answer. Maybe I misunderstood that part.

For the quick lynch question as i've said I just think its suspect that Quick has put players at L-1 twice this game, the 1st one he said he didn't agree with it then did it anyway before turning on your slot for doing it then the second one he didn't declare the L-1 at the time of voting.

[Thor665]

and yeah, a little while ago I said I was debating voting for DH. Did you miss that post or something?

I saw it.
I think you'll agree with me that it didn't show much progression of read and seemed to come out of nowhere with no new info.
What did you expect me to see in it, if anything?

The quote where you said something along the lines of dont spit on your head and tell you its raining came across to me as avoiding your question and answering what I wanted to answer. Maybe I misunderstood that part.

Considering everything that came before it was a diatribe about you misrepresenting me, and that euphamism has nothing to do with questions, but rather misrepresentations - yes. Yes you did misunderstand.

For the quick lynch question as i've said I just think its suspect that Quick has put players at L-1 twice this game, the 1st one he said he didn't agree with it then did it anyway before turning on your slot for doing it then the second one he didn't declare the L-1 at the time of voting.

I understand he voted at L-1, I just see no logic to presume it's a quick lynch plan.
Like, if he did it on Day 1 wouldn't that require CsBlastoise to be scum? Why aren't you voting him?

[Apple Jack]

All right. So if anyone else needs anything from me lmk. Thor isn’t going to give me what I’ve asked so I’m done with him.

[Thor665]

Good logic.

[Quick]

1- you definitely do seem fairly certain i'm scum from those replies there.
2- I am definitely not avoiding your questions put to me, since you have subbed into the game I have said my piece on quick and given my reasons. For someone who is near as conf. town I have no idea what both yourself and TSQ performance is actually aiming to achieve tbh.

As for Quick's partner I am not entirely sure who it could be just yet, CS was the one who hammered in D1 but I don't feel like it entirely pins him down as scum, the other option of an accidental town lynch could be plausible aswell yes.

1. How so? Literally all you showed me do was place a vote and state my reasons.
2. I never said you avoided any questions from me - why do you keep misrepping what I'm saying?
I'm aiming to achieve a scum lynch. What are you aiming to achieve right now? Because if it's a scum lynch, then try reading what I'm saying more clearly.

What makes you think it's a quick lynch plan?
I almost never see those except in mylo/lylo, what makes you expect one here?

Not going get involve myself in a back and forth argument with Thor anymore.

From my POV he isn’t guaranteed to be town, even without a CC

You haven't functionally engaged me at all and are for some reason retreating down your rabbit hole instead of offering any rational debate and are avoiding presenting evidence to support your claims when directly asked to.
If you're town, and I think you are currently, you are doing the other town players a gross disservice by your current choice of play style and blind tunnel vision.

I am not guranteed to be town, I am still by a substantial margain, objectively the single most likely slot to be town.
You're still voting me and being blind tunneled with derp, Derp.
Logic it up anytime now.
Heck, even just spot my partner and vote them, even that is better play if you're convinced this is all some elaborate gambit that is owningtown's face.

The quote where you said something along the lines of dont spit on your head and tell you its raining came across to me as avoiding your question and answering what I wanted to answer. Maybe I misunderstood that part.

For the quick lynch question as i've said I just think its suspect that Quick has put players at L-1 twice this game, the 1st one he said he didn't agree with it then did it anyway before turning on your slot for doing it then the second one he didn't declare the L-1 at the time of voting.

that's not true at all that I didn't agree with it. My position on this has remained the same. I didn't think it was a slip, but I did think it was Scummy.

And you realize you case on me is contingent on me lying saying I didn't know I put you at L-1 correct?

[Quick]

and yeah, a little while ago I said I was debating voting for DH. Did you miss that post or something?

I saw it.
I think you'll agree with me that it didn't show much progression of read and seemed to come out of nowhere with no new info.
What did you expect me to see in it, if anything?

It wasn't the first time I mentioned that I thought it was weird/bad play that DH is still voting you even tho we don't have a CC. I can understand your position if you didn't see those posts, but I made them all the same. I don't always voice everything that is going on in my head ITT.

[Apple Jack]

Derpy is basically advocating the same thing, saying that tsq and I are playing so poorly we must be scum.

Btw this is a lie. Playing poorly isn’t why I was scum reading tsq.

[Quick]

Derpy is basically advocating the same thing, saying that tsq and I are playing so poorly we must be scum.

Btw this is a lie. Playing poorly isn’t why I was scum reading tsq.

So why are you Scum reading shea now Thor again?

[Apple Jack]

I already explained why I was scum reading tsq. That never changed when I unvoted. The reason for my scum read in previously posted in my iso.

I’m continuing to scum read Thor cause he has blatantly misreprepped me and he has refused multiple times to show me his work

[Quick]

That's tin foily at best. Plus for you making pre-flip associations:

VOTE: Derpy Hooves

Let's lynch this Scum that shows no common sense.

[Thor665]

that's not true at all that I didn't agree with it. My position on this has remained the same. I didn't think it was a slip, but I did think it was Scummy.

I'm very interested by this - Wilky, could you please show where Quick agreed with it and then changed his position?

[Thor665]

That's tin foily at best. Plus for you making pre-flip

How is bad play the same as scummy play?
Because I agree with you that he's doubling down (or maybe triple now) on bad play.
I'm not sure i see the scum motivation behind considering I'm offering him a million outs and calling him town.
I think he just honestly believes he's playing well (scary) or is so self concious he can't back off of the derp even if he recognizes it and is sticking to his guns (maybe...scarier? I'm not sure.)

But regardless I fail to see much scum motivation unless his goal is to have people write him off as silly sauce and let him slide till near endgame.
What's your theory here?