Mini 543 - Election Day - Game Over!

[Holy]

LOL! XD

Allright, I don't need a confession, I'm pretty sure Mgm is scum.

Open Polls

Obviously, yesterday lynch tendency was on Mgm or Opie, and last night my Vote was bought by the Politician, which I believe that a Politician means scum.

We are now 5 townies VS 2 scum, so I need all the townies to co-operate because now I know that the scum can buy a vote. And if anyone thinks that a vote bought to take down Opie and saved Mgm didn't means Mgm is scum, tell me right now of why.

Yes, I noticed that although my vote not bought by the politician, Opie still lynched with 1 vote difference, but it didn't change the fact of yesterday tendency and our clueless result might be.

[Elias_the_thief]

Well, for one there's the fact that scum can make this kind of case against Mgm the next day if they do that...frankly I'm not convinced by what you're saying. And frankly I need a reread because it would seem that my lack of reread lead me to follow a weak case. Meh.

[Holy]

^lol!

Just re-read then, and tell us your opinion after that.

^.~

[Qman]

LOL! XD

Allright, I don't need a confession, I'm pretty sure Mgm is scum.

Open Polls

Obviously, yesterday lynch tendency was on Mgm or Opie, and last night my Vote was bought by the Politician, which I believe that a Politician means scum.

We are now 5 townies VS 2 scum, so I need all the townies to co-operate because now I know that the scum can buy a vote. And if anyone thinks that a vote bought to take down Opie and saved Mgm didn't means Mgm is scum, tell me right now of why.

Yes, I noticed that although my vote not bought by the politician, Opie still lynched with 1 vote difference, but it didn't change the fact of yesterday tendency and our clueless result might be.

I"m virtually certain that MGM is town now that Akonas turned up cop. I suspect his N0 investigation was Quickben, as that was his first immunity vote (after the joke immunity). I read that immunity as a breadcrumb. This is just my quick answer to Holy's post and looking at Akonas' early posts in each day. I'm going to look at all of his posts here shortly for a more complete read.

I'm really not comfortable with your desire to quickynch someone the cop may have breadcrumbed as innocent, and would vote for you right now because of it. That said your claim of someone that can buy votes is really interesting. Did anyone have this happen to them in Day 1's vote?

[Akonas]

Drat. Go town! Don't let me down!

[Mgm]

LOL! XD

Allright, I don't need a confession, I'm pretty sure Mgm is scum.

Open Polls

Your reasoning here (and the bit not quoted) is weak and WIFOM. Regardless, it is definitely not enough to justify opening the polls without allowing for any sort of discussion today.

[farside22]

LOL! XD

Allright, I don't need a confession, I'm pretty sure Mgm is scum.

Open Polls

Obviously, yesterday lynch tendency was on Mgm or Opie, and last night my Vote was bought by the Politician, which I believe that a Politician means scum.

We are now 5 townies VS 2 scum, so I need all the townies to co-operate because now I know that the scum can buy a vote. And if anyone thinks that a vote bought to take down Opie and saved Mgm didn't means Mgm is scum, tell me right now of why.

Yes, I noticed that although my vote not bought by the politician, Opie still lynched with 1 vote difference, but it didn't change the fact of yesterday tendency and our clueless result might be.

I"m virtually certain that MGM is town now that Akonas turned up cop. I suspect his N0 investigation was Quickben, as that was his first immunity vote (after the joke immunity). I read that immunity as a breadcrumb. This is just my quick answer to Holy's post and looking at Akonas' early posts in each day. I'm going to look at all of his posts here shortly for a more complete read.

I'm really not comfortable with your desire to quickynch someone the cop may have breadcrumbed as innocent, and would vote for you right now because of it. That said your claim of someone that can buy votes is really interesting. Did anyone have this happen to them in Day 1's vote?

I remember seeing him give immunity to QB day one did you see if he ever suspected MGM. I do remember him questioning Holy and seemed to imply that MGM wasn't the play in a sly way when talking with Shanba.

[Qman]

[quote="farside22]
I remember seeing him give immunity to QB day one did you see if he ever suspected MGM. I do remember him questioning Holy and seemed to imply that MGM wasn't the play in a sly way when talking with Shanba.[/quote]

He kept asking MGM what MGM thought.... I'd like to think that implies trust in MGM, via an investigation. Again, I'm pretty sure MGM is cop cleared at this point.

I'm not sure what his N1 investigation was as his first post naming names says:

2 people brought up the post you did where you put me and hascow together as partners. Have you changed your mind in regards to that? Do you still feel it is a pattern you saw that others are bringing up?

I'm not particularly suspicious of you at the moment, no. I think you've been acting fairly townlike.

At first I thought it an odd thing for the Mod to put two people as scum in a game that was scum

I'm sorry? I don't quite understand.

Hrm. After rereading, I really dont see why anyone would want Rigel dead. For one, I'm fairly certain now that Akonas is not scum, and that was who Rigel was after in his few posts. If anything, scum would want him around to puch the Akonas wagon.

I agree; on the other hand, they may be killing him to make me seem like scum getting him off me. Either way, I think it was stupid; I was suspicious of Rigel meself.

Holy's last few posts bother me. She's not really saying much; I'd like to see longer posts with more commentary. More substance. Same goes for QuickBen and anyone else who isn't posting; do a reread. What do you think of the current accusations?

So in it he says both he says farside is "acting fairly townlike", and was suspicious of Rigel.

I don't know which one he checked out, but I'd learn towards a Rigel investigation from the wording in the post.

[Qman]

Damn broken tags

[Gorgon]

Gorgon - is your opie vote only a lurker vote? If not, what are your other reasons?

A belated reply to this ...

My vote was mainly a lurker vote, but also for pressure/reaction testing. I didn't particularily like opie's reaction, which is why I ended up voting for him during the polls. I must admit that it was a half-hearted vote, though. I found day 2 confusing, and had a difficult time of sorting things out. Hopefully I'll do better today.

Obviously, yesterday lynch tendency was on Mgm or Opie, and last night my Vote was bought by the Politician, which I believe that a Politician means scum.

We are now 5 townies VS 2 scum, so I need all the townies to co-operate because now I know that the scum can buy a vote. And if anyone thinks that a vote bought to take down Opie and saved Mgm didn't means Mgm is scum, tell me right now of why.

Now this is interesting. A number of thoughts arise.

1) Why did this 'politician' not buy votes on the previous nights? Because he most likely didn't, since we probably would have heard about it.

2) Remember that we only have Holy's word for the existence of this politician, especially if no one else can testify to having their votes bought. This could be a ploy by Holy to get Mgm lynched. Her eagerness to open the polls is suspicious in this regard.

3) This role, if it exists, doesn't look very protown, so it's not that unreasonable to assume it's scummy.

[Qman]

Gorgon - is your opie vote only a lurker vote? If not, what are your other reasons?

A belated reply to this ...

My vote was mainly a lurker vote, but also for pressure/reaction testing. I didn't particularily like opie's reaction, which is why I ended up voting for him during the polls. I must admit that it was a half-hearted vote, though. I found day 2 confusing, and had a difficult time of sorting things out. Hopefully I'll do better today.

Obviously, yesterday lynch tendency was on Mgm or Opie, and last night my Vote was bought by the Politician, which I believe that a Politician means scum.

We are now 5 townies VS 2 scum, so I need all the townies to co-operate because now I know that the scum can buy a vote. And if anyone thinks that a vote bought to take down Opie and saved Mgm didn't means Mgm is scum, tell me right now of why.

Now this is interesting. A number of thoughts arise.

1) Why did this 'politician' not buy votes on the previous nights? Because he most likely didn't, since we probably would have heard about it.

2) Remember that we only have Holy's word for the existence of this politician, especially if no one else can testify to having their votes bought. This could be a ploy by Holy to get Mgm lynched. Her eagerness to open the polls is suspicious in this regard.

3) This role, if it exists, doesn't look very protown, so it's not that unreasonable to assume it's scummy.

My thoughts on your points:

1.) We don't know he didn't buy a vote D1, he could have bought a vote and put it where the original voter used it. Just something to keep in mind before we run up Holy over the claim itself.

2.) Agreed

3.) It could be either pro-town or anti-town depending on how it's used. I'm thinking a pro town mayor type role that gets two votes but takes one from someone else. I agree that the role is more likely to be anti-town than pro town though.

[Holy]

And if anyone thinks that a vote bought to take down Opie and saved Mgm didn't means Mgm is scum, tell me right now of why.

I see, I got good and bad reactions here. Let me

Un-Open Polls

for awhile.


@Qman: I don't think at N0, Akonas got a result though, he did a 'self-immunity' as far as I can remember. Honestly, I don't think that as a joke-immunity-vote. Hm, I should re-read it. Oh, and Qman, it's undo-able, that's why I decided to do that, it's good to get a reaction too.

@Mgm, I've asked > "... tell me right now of why." ^

@farside22: I'll search that, when talking with Shanba thing.

@Gorgon:
1. I absolutely don't have any idea of why.
2. Hm, I decided to reveal this info, because I don't think make it a secret will help the town. While revealing it, won't hurt anyone but scum.
3. Especially because the vote was bought to make sure Opie (townie) lynched, yeah, I don't think it's a pro-town ability too.

[farside22]

He voted for holy and FOS holy, but did try I notice to get QB to talk more. Here is what Akonas said to Gorgon in response to Gorgon's findings.

Gorgon: How about Holy? I think she's doing some similar lurky things; what do you think?

[Qman]

He voted for holy and FOS holy, but did try I notice to get QB to talk more. Here is what Akonas said to Gorgon in response to Gorgon's findings.

Gorgon: How about Holy? I think she's doing some similar lurky things; what do you think?

I don't know what you are getting at here, are you trying to say Akonas investigated Holy? I don't think he did, but if you do please elaborate on why you have reason to think so.

[farside22]

He voted for holy and FOS holy, but did try I notice to get QB to talk more. Here is what Akonas said to Gorgon in response to Gorgon's findings.

Gorgon: How about Holy? I think she's doing some similar lurky things; what do you think?

I don't know what you are getting at here, are you trying to say Akonas investigated Holy? I don't think he did, but if you do please elaborate on why you have reason to think so.

This is why I'm more inclinded to think he investigated QB actually. I think he was highly suspicious of Holy and seemed to keep putting more pressure on Holy over and over again.

By the way I'm going to be very busy this week so don't expect too much from me.

[Rishi]

Note: Shanba posted in the V/LA thread that he was "gone for the week." I will wait for him to return before prodding.

[Rishi]

*bump*

[Gorgon]

He voted for holy and FOS holy, but did try I notice to get QB to talk more. Here is what Akonas said to Gorgon in response to Gorgon's findings.

Gorgon: How about Holy? I think she's doing some similar lurky things; what do you think?

I might as well offer a belated reply to this as well, even though Akonas is no longer around.

It's a good question. I hadn't really noticed Holy as a lurker. I guess her question for me (in this postnear the start of yesterday kind of stuck with me; I felt it was insightful and townish.

I'm not so sure about her now though ... I think she had a bad and suspicious start today.

[Mgm]

I'm on limited access this weekend. Visitors, movies and work-related stuff. Don't expect anything insightful from me until next week.

[Qman]

Okay so I've done a bit of weighing in. I'd like to see more people weigh in, instead of us all staring down yet ANOTHER deadline and scrambling for a lynch.

Come on people, post, talk!

[Elias_the_thief]

I feel bad about being a noncontributor, as it gives scum a place to hide amongst us, but I really dont have the time to reread and contribute anything worthwhile yet. I got through rereading one game already tonight, hopefully I can finish this one up tomorrow.

[Holy]

OMG, I was busy, and we're still on this same page since my last post. I'll search soon (regarding my post #486) and especially re-read on Akonas, he might left a breadcrumb of his investigation result.
I was prioritizing my deadlined games, sorry.

[Shanba]

I'm back.

I'd like thoughts as to why what amounts to be a doublevoter would be a scum role?

It looks very much like Akonas investigated quickben to me - he was hard on lurkers, and relatively soft of on QuickBen, instead asking him to contribute in increasingly annoyed sounding posts. If he had a town result on a player and that player didn't weigh in on anything, I can see him playing it that way.

Holy - Your whole argument is terrible, frankly. It assumes assumptions on top of assumptions to come to a stretched conclusion.

[Holy]

Holy - Your whole argument is terrible, frankly. It assumes assumptions on top of assumptions to come to a stretched conclusion.

That's why I asked, mister! For I might be wrong. I suspect Mgm, because it saved his ass, but now I'm searching it, because most of you seems so sure that Akonas cleared him.

[Shanba]

Even without the him maybe being cleared thing, it's bad. First, it assumes politician is a scum role. Second, it then assumes that the scum were trying to save MGM by moving your vote to opie. From that it draws the conclusion that MGM is scum.

Now, think. First, I haven't checked to see the accuracy of this yet, but we had spent a lot of effort making sure everyone was accountable for their vote - i.e. they had already indicated who they would be voting for. Scum should thus know that MGM was safe already. That's a flaw in the second assumption. Another is that scum might have done it for another reason - maybe, for example, to try and draw such a response as yours.

Then there's the first assumption. Look at the nature of the vote thief/doublevoter role. For town, these are reasonably powerful roles - the doublevoter being less skill dependent than the vote thief, but both being useful, but not gamebreaking roles. Part of their power, though, comes from the fact that a proven doublevoter/vote thief is all but confirmed. Why? Because of how insanely powerful they are for scum. For scum, they essentially move the endgame one day forwards - scum need to get one less mislynch. That's very powerful, especially because, ordinarily, town are not expecting it - a doublevoter is a role you would keep hidden to catch town unawares. A town normally going into lylo is incredibly careful about quicklynches etc. If they don't realise it's lylo because of the doulevoter, well... you can see how that could be powerful. Vote thief is even worse, as it allows the scum to take away a townie's vote as well as have an extra vote. I've never seen a scum vote thief or doublevoter. I hope never to see one in a 12 player game - it might be possible in a larger game where edges like that are blurred. Rishi would know this.