Mini Normal 1957: The Perfect LUV Game [Endgame]

[davesaz]

Dave, Gurgi, Anime, Dunk: you're all okay with how much Wossi inaccurately portrays what people have said? Are you saying he hasn't been doing that, or that you don't scum read what he does?

Nah, I just wanted to have a VC before moving, for proper analysis no matter which way it goes.
I was ok with where my vote was, but this is better and

time is relatively short

.

VOTE: Wossi

Bolded the reason for my vote.
I'm pretty sure there are more people who haven't played with me than have in this game, but it's pretty well known that I'm fundamentally clueless with D1 reads, but universally on the side of making wagons and compromising on lynches to avoid NL. At that point in the game the best use of my vote was to use it on leading wagon.

[davesaz]

Ok here it is:

This group:
Chickadee
Porkens
Derpy
Gurgi
Anime
Nauci
Xiao long

Lynches this group:
Mumble davesaz
Tchill13
Flavor Leaf
Dunkerdoodles

And we take it from there.

VOTE: tchill

why is flavor in lynch? he was against wossi.

Is this the question you referred to in 1374

[Dunkerdoodles]

i never roll scum so i don't have a scum game
i have like 2 scum games and maybe 15 town

[Dunkerdoodles]

i don't like dave's self meta but it's probably fine

[Apple Jack]

i never roll scum so i don't have a scum game
i have like 2 scum games and maybe 15 town

Second sentence contradicts the first

Dunkers was useless scum in one game I was in with him where I replaced out.

I do agree with chick that dunkers is just being dunkers. But he basically does it as either alignment.

Most players will try to play the same way as either alignment.

[Apple Jack]

That’s why I hate meta. If somebody is scummy they are scummy. I don’t care if they have a history of playing scummy.

[Porkens]

i never roll scum so i don't have a scum game
i have like 2 scum games and maybe 15 town

Locktown

VOTE: unvote

[davesaz]

Pretty sure I was 4th or 5th at the time I voted, as I would not have joined a wagon which wasn't top at that point in time. Evidently there was some off and back on later.
I use two techniques, a long-winded one which looks at flow and a simpler one which looks at on/off splits. Obviously looking at wagon flow will take time, so the simple one first.
I'm not expecting this to mean much yet. Think of it as thoughts in progress so I can remember what I was doing, if I have to pick up reading on mobile. Feel free to pick at it though.

Wossi (7): tchill13, Chickadee, davesaz, Porkens, Nauci, Dunkerdoodles, Derpy Hooves
Xiao Long (2): Lord Gurgi, Animetrix
Derpy Hooves (1): Wossi
Dunkerdoodles (1): wavemode
tchill13 (1): Xiao Long
wavemode (1): Flavor Leaf

From memory plus feels from catchup, I have the following which consists of way too many scum reads.
On the wagon we have Chick and Nauci weak town, Porkens weak scum, Dunkerdoodles and Derpy medium scum. tchill I don't remember my read.
Off the wagon: Gurgi don't remember what I thought, Animetrix weak scum, XL weak scum, Flavor Leaf isn't actively scum but I have a scum vibe from meta (in particular not doing any of the things I'd expect from the main account's town).

At least one scum read should be town from the "on wagon" and "off wagon" groups given there are too many scumreads in both. I think it's likely for at least one scum in each group.

[Dunkerdoodles]

i'm going to lock in a scum in (porkens, tchill, chick)

[Tchill13]

Ok here it is:

This group:
Chickadee
Porkens
Derpy
Gurgi
Anime
Nauci
Xiao long

Lynches this group:
Mumble davesaz
Tchill13
Flavor Leaf
Dunkerdoodles

And we take it from there.

VOTE: tchill

why is flavor in lynch? he was against wossi.

Is this the question you referred to in 1374

yes it was.

[Xiao Long]

I was really hoping xl would have died in the night phase. Oh well.

“I didn’t intentionally didn’t NK Xiao because everyone knows how I kept calling for him to be shot. People now will think I’m town because I didn’t kill the person I obviously want dead.”

Did I translate wrong? Sorry for bad Englando

So since I've placed my vote we have an attempt to discredit me from xl and we also have a very sloppily done job of portraying me as scum. If I was scum how would Ik if there's a town vig or not? What if I actually called for your death because I knew people would continue to scum read you throughout the game until a night action cleared you or your dead? If I was scum here I wouldn't have tunneled Wossi day 1, that's lazy. Had you actually died I would have nowhere to go from my perspective as scum. So I'm definitely not setting up for the long game considering my day 1 play. So someone convince us why I'm scum? Where's my play pointing to a long and drawn out thought process of how I can navigate to a win for scum?

Are we really going to play the “Why would I ever” game?

For starters, I didn’t say you knew there was a vig, but if there was one, trying to get it to kill me helps keep it from killing you.
If you’re scum, not NKing me plants the idea in people’s heads that you don’t have access to a kill since you so vehemently wanted me dead. It’s a level 3 scum play to manage WIFOM like that.
Saying you wouldn’t have tunneled Wossi day 1 means nothing to me.
You knew you weren’t going to die because you knew town would easily follow along the Wossi wagon especially if you kept complaining about the day needing to end.

In the end, it doesn’t really matter what you say about what you would or wouldn’t do as scum. The things you did on D1 make no sense as a towny.

[Tchill13]

TO YOU they make no sense. that's the problem. you can't see a perspective where a towny would do what i did. This is what leads to so many mislynches. I can't help that you can't understand why i would play that way as a towny on day 1. Frankly it's not my problem as long as this doesn't grow into a mislynch on me. So many ppl think THEIR way is the ONLY way to play town or that they're the BEST town and have the BEST reads. Be a little open minded. I honestly thought i caught scum day 1 because of wossi's play and the shift in tone after derpy brought up the neighborhood. I'm tired of pontless lengths day 1's grow to on site. i've seen on multiple occasions town talking themselves out of lynching scum and mislynching someone on day 1 since it has to be a certain length. I'm not apologizing for my day 1 play.

[Tchill13]

the "level" talk comes off as narcissistic. It's fine if your confident in your play but it seems like your just another towny caught up in playing the game THEIR way because THEY'RE good enough to pull stupid gambits and get away with it. So you're probably town that just has an odd play style.

[Xiao Long]

I’m completely open minded to different play styles. The way you pushed Wossi based on nothing but Derpy’s flawed logic is not a play style, it’s showing you’re not able to do legitimate scum hunting because you are scum. Trying to mask your obviously not town behavior as a play style is a weak and overused defense.

Saying level talk is narcissistic is stupid because I’ve already said levels have nothing to do with how good of a player you are. You can easily be a shit player playing a higher level game.

[Apple Jack]

i'm going to lock in a scum in (porkens, tchill, chick)

Reasons?

[Porkens]

VOTE: tchill

[Tchill13]

Once again XL... I pushed Wossi before derpy.

[Tchill13]

Derpy there was a particular post that made me think that you and chickadee were the same alignment. I'm still looking for them.

[Apple Jack]

The things you did on D1 make no sense as a towny.

hilarious you of all people are saying this.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Dave - I’m Boon; why do you think I’d have actively more town stuff stayed.

I’m actually on a major site wide lull is all. Film life is booming in the Bay Area right now, so a lot of work opportunities.

Anywho, I’m coming around on Porkens possibly being town, I’ve taken advantage of his mislynches before as scum, and this is the first time I’m actually town and witnessing Porkens, so I think he’s town.

Animetrix makes me think that Dunker is actually town, although Dunker generally has some fire to him when he’s town, and I’m not seeing that right now. Nonetheless, i don’t really feel dunker is the best lynch today either.

I generally think XL is town due to the mislynch candidacy and the end of Day 1 VCA.

Today, I’d like to go Gurgi or Animetrix.

[Flavor Leaf]

@Nauci - I dropped it because I’m on a site wide lull where I check up like every two days at the moment, and not for too long, so I’m just trying to post what i can when I can for now.

[Porkens]

I hate your avatar. There, i said it.

[Flavor Leaf]

My avatar? All my avatars on my accounts are smug and obnoxious just like me.

[Apple Jack]

At least your honest about it.

[Nauci]

Dave, Gurgi, Anime, Dunk: you're all okay with how much Wossi inaccurately portrays what people have said? Are you saying he hasn't been doing that, or that you don't scum read what he does?

Nah, I just wanted to have a VC before moving, for proper analysis no matter which way it goes.
I was ok with where my vote was, but this is better and

time is relatively short

.

VOTE: Wossi

Bolded the reason for my vote.
I'm pretty sure there are more people who haven't played with me than have in this game, but it's pretty well known that I'm fundamentally clueless with D1 reads, but universally on the side of making wagons and compromising on lynches to avoid NL. At that point in the game the best use of my vote was to use it on leading wagon.

Really didn't like this post. No particular pushes on you for your vote IMO, but you came out with the preemptive defense like you're scum knowing you'd need to be able to explain away why your vote is Towny. Major FOS.

That’s why I hate meta. If somebody is scummy they are scummy. I don’t care if they have a history of playing scummy.

If someone always looks like scum to people it's something you have to account for, so you don't constantly mislynch town.

Dunk always posts sparingly and vote hops in the games I've seen him. I never found it alignment indicative but he's always been super easy lynch bait that scum take advantage of.

It's not that complicated. I'm not even saying don't lynch him. I'm saying don't tunnel him to death for lynchbait posts, and take this factor into account.