Mini 1953: XP Mafia (Game Over)

[Maki Harukawa]

I've said about 3 times why I'm conf'd town and you kept prodding me for my upgrade so when I do it 1 time to you I'm a hypocrite? Lmfao

[havingfitz]

Yes

[Maki Harukawa]

you're fucking delusional

[gerryoat]

Checking with the mod now.
I blocked havingfiz, but I neither gained XP nor received a message indicating the type of action havingfitz would use last night--which makes no sense. If havingfiz had trained, I'd have gained XP and seen the train; if havingfitz used any action, I should have seen what type of action it was I blocked.

I mean there is too many un-explained crap surrounding this to believe. Is mastina saying thier upgraded ability is that they will see what action is being roleblocked? THen proceededs to say they didn't get that communication?

You're the only person who is sane this game, apparently.

[gerryoat]

Can someone point to me where I ever said I tr gerry today.

Gerry can be scum with any team

I can only be scum with gerry at this point

can you tell me what would make you TR me. cause it's literally auto. you me srceen are town. mastina is confirmed mafia and maf is in the other 2. sooner you realize this, the sooner we can end this game.

[Maki Harukawa]

Can someone point to me where I ever said I tr gerry today.

Gerry can be scum with any team

I can only be scum with gerry at this point

can you tell me what would make you TR me. cause it's literally auto. you me srceen are town. mastina is confirmed mafia and maf is in the other 2. sooner you realize this, the sooner we can end this game.

both of you are town

[gerryoat]

Can someone point to me where I ever said I tr gerry today.

Gerry can be scum with any team

I can only be scum with gerry at this point

can you tell me what would make you TR me. cause it's literally auto. you me srceen are town. mastina is confirmed mafia and maf is in the other 2. sooner you realize this, the sooner we can end this game.

both of you are town

Can someone point to me where I ever said I tr gerry today.

Gerry can be scum with any team

but you said that....

[gerryoat]

Okay maki, which of fitz and vax do you scumread more?

[Maki Harukawa]

look who I voted

[mastina]

if there is a redirector, why would none of mastina's blocks or srceen's tracks have been redirected at all?

Well for a start.
I didn't claim until D4. Scum had no way of knowing to target me before then.
Even if they did, there's always the possibility of them redirecting me to...the player I originally blocked--admittedly this isn't the most plausible of possibilities, but it IS a possibility given that every player I've blocked save you and havingfitz last night is either flipped town or known town. (Screenplay.)
Even if they didn't, there's the SIGNIFICANT chance that using the redirect action has a cost:

Costing XP to use.
Can't be used simultaneously with the nightkill (i.e. mafia cannot simultaneously kill and action).
Wasn't their original role but was an upgrade to their original role.
All of these are not at all remote possibilities. They are in fact strong probabilities. None of them are even mutually exclusive at that. One would be enough, but we could have MORE than one in effect.

There's plenty of reasons the action wouldn't have been used. Or if used, wouldn't be seen until now.
I'd actually cite that the lack of clear mafia kill both N3 and N4 is proof that mafia were using XP elsewhere and/or saving XP. (yurkin was not a scum nightkill, guaranteed--yurkin was almost everyone's favored mislynch so nobody would have nightkilled yurkin. This is self-evident. Yet we know I didn't block the nightkill that night, unless scum redirected me onto them. Which is actually possible: scum redirected me onto them, while nightkilling me. Remember, Assembler protected me. So me being their nightkill is a strong possibility and nobody should be ignoring this.)

mafia has to have a strong PR because ghost's PR was garb imo.

No, Ghostlin's role was god-tiered. It is a free XP-generator, and assuming his upgrade was identical to dreal's, this would allow the scumteam to have TWO free XP per night, IN ADDITION TO any training they would perform. Potentially allowing them to generate FOUR XP per night between all players, NOT EVEN GOING INTO the possibility of them receiving XP from Dunn and/or dreal.

That being said...you know what's also a strong PR?

...A

redirector

.

[mastina]

You know.

That's important enough a point for me to quote it since you fucks seem to not be reading what I fucking write when it's too long.

yurkin was not a scum nightkill, guaranteed--yurkin was almost everyone's favored mislynch so nobody would have nightkilled yurkin. This is self-evident.

Yet we know I didn't block the nightkill that night, unless scum redirected me onto them. Which is actually possible: scum redirected me onto them, while nightkilling me. Remember, Assembler protected me.

So me being their nightkill is a strong possibility and nobody should be ignoring this

.)

For emphasis.

The night there was clearly no mafia nightkill, Assemblerotws was protecting me.

That is STRONG reason.
Very fucking STRONG reason.
To believe that I was the scum's nightkill.

Yeah

, I was blocking Assembler that night.
But we know that there's a redirector role now.
So we can also infer the very realistic chance that EITHER:
-Scum redirected me onto their nightkiller, stopping the nightkill...
OR:
-Scum redirected me onto a different scum player, allowing for Assembler's protection on me to stop their nightkill on me.

Both are strong possibilities which fit all the fucking evidence.

[Maki Harukawa]

mastina you need to convince gerry or vax

we're at a stale mate atm and I'm not using my vig with a fucking redirector alive

[mastina]

Basically, you're fucking trying to mislynch a player who should be fucking conftown from the results of the prior nights in light of the new information we have available.

Go back and check the damn facts yourself if you don't fucking believe me.

How many players scumread yurkin? At least six. yurkin got to B-1 on D1. Those scumreads did not magically vanish come D2. Those scumreads still existed all of D2. And those scumreads continued into D3. For that matter, simple NKA off of the nightkills we've seen should show you who is, and isn't scum, but I'll do that in a separate post.

[mastina]

[Block] yurkin (6)- gerryoat, Vijarada, Vaxkiller, Raya36, Ginngie, yurkin
[Block] gerryoat (6)- NoticeMeSenpai, drealmerz7, Dunnstral, yurkin, Assemblerotws, EeveeLution Army

HURT: Gerry
oops my finger slipped

This was the blocks. And Ginngie hammering gerry.

Ginngie held yurkin as a scumread; you can iso her to see it, but switched to gerry. (Which is why I think she was killed.)
For that matter, we were Ginngie's top townread. (Read the iso if you don't believe me.) Why the fuck would we have nightkilled the player most strongly adamant that we are town?

Notably, Dunnstral was also on the blocking-gerry wagon. As was dreal. (So, too, was yurkin for that matter. And Assembler and Eevee have flipped town. In fact, we are literally the only player unflipped on that wagon. Literally every fucking other player is flipped town. I think that should tell you something about the nature of the gerry wagon! It should tell you that it was a fucking towndriven wagon. And that the scum have nightkilled exclusively FROM said wagon is reason enough to tell you that it is an all-town wagon.)

fitz can go first I am town he might not be

Look at this gem from dreal. Guess who died that night?

one thought before was that it was just maki and gerry together but I am so not invested :\

And here he also called gerry as scummy, too.

The point I'm making here: the nightkills have held much the same stances. For the MOST part, townreading my slot. All of them, scumreading gerry's slot. And dreal had the bonus of scumreading havingfitz as well!

Nightkill Analysis tells a clear fucking picture.
Not once has the nightkill held one iota of serious suspicion on me.

And yet they have died.

This doesn't match my scum meta, because my scum meta is eliminating the greatest threat to me. The greatest threat to me is ALWAYS the player who is closest to being right. Also, lol if you think I'd ever be afraid of dreal. dreal was mislynch bait--he quite literally was fucking BLOCKED. As in, lost all XP and unable to action a night, because enough town players thought he was scum to end the day prematurely. (Notably, I WAS NOT ON THAT WAGON and told you NOT to fucking rush that day, I wanted to take time there.)

dreal was someone I as scum would keep alive as the next mislynch. dreal was someone I as scum would be pocketing if I couldn't mislynch him. There's NO universe where I see him as the greatest threat. Nor is there any universe where I see him as worth killing. Frankly, even when he has accurate reads he's such an abysmally-bad player at explaining them, a terrible player at pushing them, that people write it off as town confbiased at BEST. Not a threat to me.

But other players--saaaaaaaayyy, gerryoat--would evaluate him differently.

[mastina]

literally the only way she is not confirmed scum if there just HAPPENS to be a redirector, that there was no evidence of until there was a guilty on mastina. don't you find that weird?

There WAS evidence, I just didn't know about it until today. I submitted a block on Assembler a night there was no scum nightkill. Assembler submitted a doctor protection on me. We know that my roleblock didn't stop a scum-Assembler from making the nightkill.

But it is beyond probability that my roleblock was redirected, onto scum, thus allowing for either my block to foil the nightkill and/or Assembler's protection to foil the nightkill. (The two aren't mutually exclusive! If scum A targeted me for the nightkill, and I was redirected to A, then I'd foil the nightkill but even had I not then Assembler's protection would do the same.)

There was a fucking night staring at us the whole fucking time which proved there was a redirector the whole fucking time.
I just didn't realize it until today.

GOD I wish I had Jae with me because Jae probably would've put two and two together much more quickly.

[mastina]

I'd LIKE to say the no kill is a guilty on gerry.
But I actually have good reason off of my role to know I didn't stop a kill.

Yes.
Because of my fucking roleblock leeching XP from people who train, I know that the player I roleblocked (presumably gerry) trained.
Because of my fucking roleblock's upgraded power being a follower in that I know what role action type I am blocking, I know that I fucking blocked a training action.

So N4 (NOT N3), I know I didn't stop a nightkill because I know from my upgraded role that I didn't.
From N3 (NOT N4), I hadn't upgraded yet so I know I didn't block someone from training but I don't know what action type I stopped.

Also btw. I just realized.
D1, we had 1 XP.
D2, we had 2 XP in spite of blocking your slot, Screenplay. That means we received XP from Dunnstral N1. We were Dunnstral's top-townread, or near-top given that we had to have gotten XP from Dunn. (I originally thought that we had received XP from blocking you from training, but you're a tracker, who tracked that night rather than training.)
Nobody else has claimed the N1 XP from Dunn as far as I can tell.

So we have role confirmation that Dunnstral townread us strongly.
Meaning once more. We wouldn't fucking nightkill him.

[Maki Harukawa]

Mastina Dunn gave me exp not you >_>

[Maki Harukawa]

I claimed at the start of d2

[mastina]

WHY would scum redirect/busdrive/wahtever a Screenplay tracker onto themselves?

???
You're asking a question for a scenario which was never posited.
Scum wouldn't redirect a Screenplay track onto themselves, but nobody said that at any point.
Scum WOULD redirect a roleblock to STOP Screenplay's track.

How would they KNOW he would use a loyal action?

They don't need to.
What would happen come today is that Screenplay would claim his action failed no matter what.
What would then happen is:
-EITHER: I claimed a roleblock on him, thus masking the presence of the redirector (doing them no harm),
-OR: I claim a roleblock elsewhere, and thus still creating the 1v1 between us.

Why is that still a 1v1 without the loyal?

Because no fucking shit there's not going to be another roleblocking action left unclaimed in the game. No fucking shit the only way for Screenplay to get no result is for me to have blocked him. And with me claiming to have blocked elsewhere...no fucking shit, that makes Screenplay cry out foul.

Am I wrong?

Of course not.
Because it's self-fucking-evident that a roleblocker claiming not to have blocked the tracker who claims to have no result is a situation where the natural inclination is to call out bullshit and declare one of the two to be confscum...instigating a game-winning 1v1 between two town players.

[mastina]

@ mastina....are you mastin and/or mastin2?

No shit, sherlock.

From this you'd be able to vouch for a fair amount of what I've said here RE: my own meta. How much I don't do the stuff which would be absolutely necessary for me to have done as scum.

But you won't vouch for it because it's not in your wincon to clear me from being scum.

[mastina]

I mean there is too many un-explained crap surrounding this to believe. Is mastina saying thier upgraded ability is that they will see what action is being roleblocked? THen proceededs to say they didn't get that communication?

Yes. My role upgraded such that I see what action type I blocked. This is a Follower which also roleblocks the target. You can further find the fucking mechanics of it in the opening fucking posts:

II. Training
Each player, by default, is allowed to Train during the night. This takes the place of another action and cannot be used alongside any action. When a player Trains, they gain 1 XP.

This is an action and can be blocked or seen with Follower

, but it is not considered a visit and therefore cannot be seen by Tracker, Motion Detector, Voyeur, or Watcher.

Can be BLOCKED or seen with FOLLOWER.

THE MODERATOR LITERALLY FUCKING PUT MY FUCKING ROLE IN THE OPENING FUCKING POST.
THE MODERATOR LITERALLY FUCKING TOLD YOU ALL FROM THE ONSET MY FUCKING ROLE IS IN THE FUCKING GAME.
Pay attention to that fucking wording.
"Can be blocked or seen with Follower".
There's no Oxford Comma.
And that makes a fucking difference.
"Can be blocked, or seen with Follower"-->the two are unrelated, in that blocking is separated from Follower.
"Can be blocked or seen with Follower"-->the two are EXPLICITLY TIED TOGETHER.

The mod literally fucking told you that my fucking upgraded role was a role in this fucking game.

[mastina]

And furthermore.

Vaxkiller, you fucking know this shit.

I have ranted about it in many a past games, including games you were fucking in.

I do not fucking lie as scum.
I don't.
The best fucking lie is the damn truth.

In all my hundreds of fucking games.
Where I've had probably something like 75+ scumgames.
Never once, did I lie about my fucking role.
(Aside from one game which is ridiculously obscure.)

Not.
fucking.
once.

Because I am not inclined to tell a fucking lie.
It's not in my nature.
It's not how I fucking work.

And you know DAMN fucking good and well that I don't.
FURTHERMORE.

I shouldn't quote exact timestamps, but I asked about whether I saw myself blocking havingfitz do anything at around 3:15. At around 3:30 (a little after), Something_smart told me that I had blocked an investigative action. Near 4 (a little before), I asked my first questions about blocks vs. redirects and who'd win. Near 4:30 (a little after), I was told those weren't public. Near 4:45 (a little before), I asked my second round of questions. I got my answer near 5.

That's me rounding things to the nearest 15-minute mark so it should be okay (I don't see anything in the rules saying I can't do that since I'm not quoting exact timestamps), so that should give you a general timeframe of how things progressed as far as my questions to the mod went.

Do you think.
I made this shit up.
Do you fucking think.
I made shit up about timestamps.
That I bullshitted times to interact with the mod.
That I fucking lied about having communication with the fucking moderator.

Do you fucking think.
That is EVER a fucking move.
I could ever make.

Knowing that IT IS SOMETHING RIDICULOUSLY FUCKING EASY TO DISPROVE.
All it'd take is for the moderator to...oh. Yaknow. Not actually be fucking online at the time I claimed he was. And then, BAM. I become confscum.
The only way for me to fucking know otherwise...
...Is.

Oh yeah.

For me to have actually. fucking. talked. to the fucking mod.

[mastina]

I can further even paraphrase the mod's response when he sent me the action.
"Oh, sorry, it was 2:30 in the morning. You blocked an investigation action".

Not an exact quote, of course, but as close as I am comfortable with as far as paraphrasing goes.

The mod fucking told me it was in fact a mistake that he had forgotten to send me the result I was entitled to with my upgrade.
I can't make this shit up.

Anyone.
Who knows fucking ANYTHING.
About me.

Knows that.

[mastina]

VOTE: mastina
I'm happy with this. Mastina's excuse is that screen and mastina were redirected, and SOMEHOW mastina didnt get any info about what they roleblocked (im guessing this is thier upgrade)

Did you even fucking read?

I got the information about what I roleblocked...
...But only AFTER having asked the fucking mod about it. Because the mod fucking forgot to send it in his daystart PM.
His daystart PM contained the link to the daystart and how much XP I have. It did not contain what action I blocked.
This is in contrast to what happened N4, where I got the daystart PM, how much XP I have, and contained the information of what action I blocked.
So I fucking knew it was missing, asked about it, and got the answer later.

I FUCKING TOLD YOU IN POST 1711. "Checking with the mod now. I gained no XP nor was told what action I had blocked, which makes no sense".
I FUCKING TOLD YOU IN POST 1730. 30 minutes later (no seriously on the dot 30 minutes exactly after), one page later. "I got the answer from the mod. I blocked an investigative action".

I got the information. But only after fucking ASKING the mod for the information, and receiving my result.

My "excuse" is not that Screen and I were both redirected.
My working theory is that I was redirected.
Which there is strong fucking evidence for.

You are ignoring large swathes of the things I am fucking saying.
You are discarding large fucking portions of the evidence I am presenting.

[mastina]

When it comes down to it you have to think like this: Screen has a guilty on mastina.

And I'll stop you there because no he fucking doesn't. We've covered this in great length. The result is not a fucking guilty when there's reasonable fucking doubt.

We've fucking established that there's reasonable fucking doubt.

You've placed the burden of proof on me...but I've fucking DELIVERED that proof. Time and time again. I've shown you where it fucking is, every step of the way. Why the actions line up. How they fucking line up. Why I am not spewing bullshit. How things played out. I've cited evidence from across the fucking game and used things which are beyond my ability to fake up.

So no the burden has shifted to you.

Why the fuck is what I'm saying invalid?

If you can't counter my fucking points.
If you can't fucking provide any reason for why my fucking points shouldn't be taken as genuine.

Then why the fuck are you still pressing this?