Team Mafia 2018: Inventions Mafia Day 4

[beeboy]

Day 1, VC 6

With 15 alive it takes 8 to lynch.

xRECKONERx(2)

- Aneninen, mastina

Aneninen(3)

- Katyusha, GuiltyLion, CheekyTeeky

mastina(2)

- chesskid3, Creature

Something_Smart(2)

- Primate, RadiantCowbells

Screenplay(1)

- Hinduragi

CheekyTeeky(1)

- xRECKONERx

Not Voting (4)

- Something_Smart, Errantparabola, Screenplay, BigYoshiFan

Deadline:

(expired on 2018-02-04 21:00:00)

Invention Vote

1-shot Hider: Target a player at night you will hide them making you immune from being targetted by night actions. However if your target is not town aligned or is killed you will die as well.

With 15 alive it takes 8 to elect a player.

chesskid3 (2)

- chesskid3, xRECKONER

RadiantCowbells (1)

- mastina

Something_Smart(1)

- Katyusha

Not Voting (11)

- Aneninen, Hinduragi, RadiantCowbells, Something_Smart, Primate, Errantparabola, Srceenplay, GuiltyLion, BigYoshiFan, Creature, CheekyTeeky

[Creature]

Also, xRECKONERx has way too many scumreads (8).

[Creature]

Assuming Errantparabola, who hasn't posted, is the null-line.

[Something_Smart]

Reck, do you believe me that the things you scumread me for are primarily playstyle?

[Creature]

VOTE: Aneninen

[Katyusha]

1. Do you think it’d be obvious if a scum!Hindu misread you? Usually in games with close friends where I roll scum I pay extra attention to how I’m reading them because there’s generally some sort of expectation they’d have of my ability to read them

2. What precludes Mastina from just being wrong then?

3. I would think having this many interactions with slots so early in the game shows that I’m scumhunting and trying to sort people? Is there something that seems fake to you about the way I’m going about things?

pedit: @reck

Tbh i’d trust your partners on creature and Hindu lol

Can you ask cheet/keely why he scumreads me? He played with me in spring fever so like he should know this is my town game lol

1. Why would scum!Hindu be misreading me? He would know my alignment. I don't think there was an expectation of me to say "Hey, I'm town, why aren't you reading me that way, Hindu?" It was just a really bold play from Hindu as scum but makes total sense for Hindu as town and right now I'd prefer to Occam's Razor and say he's town than say "Hindu's doing this weird uncharacteristically big play as scum".

2. She could be wrong, sure. But what makes it gross is that there was already a burgeoning wagon on me when she placed the vote which makes it opportunistic as hell, especially considering the reasoning is implied to be "I don't like this RVS vote".

3. Nothing seems fake or not fake. You're null. You're middle of the road right now. I don't know why you're getting so defensive. I'm not saying you're the most likely scum here, I'm saying you're not exactly at the top of either list (though my teammates disagree). Keely was reminded of the last time he played with you and said your poking here feels equally forced as it did last time.

My partners can't read Hindu and don't know him at all which is why it's null for them. You seem to be pushing hard on Hindu here, or at least trying to get me to be open to voting him. Is he your top scumread?

EDITED readslist based on partner comments

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1. Right but your point is that he's avoiding an easy mislynch in your early game by defending you. I'm trying to understand why that's specifically town motivated to you when I don't see it as a bold play, especially if you're familiar with each other. fmpov i dont think calling you obvtown from that interaction makes a lot of sense if he thinks you're capable of that as scum either and i'm trying to see how you and anenien feel about that

2. Point about opportunism is fair but the read from a single rvs vote feels more like a mastina tell than not

3. I'm not defensive, I'm trying to understand why I'm null because I find that particular read strange. I guess Keely hasn't played enough with town me to know this is how i usually sort people - I really do think that I'm out of my scumrange btw but thats mostly because i started picking up on my tells and i kind of have a tough time avoiding them

Do you think my questioning is forced though?

Hindu isnt my top scumread btw, check my vote. I think it's possible he flips scum here though but theres probably only one scum in hindu/you/anen so I want to understand the three of you better

[Something_Smart]

theres probably only one scum in hindu/you/anen

This is a bad thing to say early on.

[Creature]

Thoughts on xRECKONERx having 8 scumreads?

[Something_Smart]

It's easier as town to find things to scumread than it is to find things to townread.

[Katyusha]

theres probably only one scum in hindu/you/anen

This is a bad thing to say early on.

It’s far from set in stone, their interactions just don’t feel svs to me at the present

[Katyusha]

Thoughts on xRECKONERx having 8 scumreads?

I think a lot of them are nullreads tbh?

[Something_Smart]

Null-scum presumably.

[Creature]

Still that's a lot of null-scum.

[Katyusha]

elect: hinduragi

had a change of heart and I’m probably gonna Trust The Doggo on SS

[xRECKONERx]

Reck, do you believe me that the things you scumread me for are primarily playstyle?

I don't really care about self-meta.

[xRECKONERx]

Thoughts on xRECKONERx having 8 scumreads?

It was binary: they're either town or scum, no in-between. At least 2-3 of each side of those reads were null.

[Something_Smart]

Reck, do you believe me that the things you scumread me for are primarily playstyle?

I don't really care about self-meta.

That's not an answer.

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't understand. I'm saying I didn't buy RC's explanation.
That was also prior to Shea or Keely being online. They've since both confirmed that Cabd and RC have major problems with each other and that it's not bullshit. Keely notes however that RC's expectation that Shea/Keely would've already briefed me on that note is "skeevy".

In my team we had most of the team except for Keychain who was busy tramping around talking about all the playerlists as soon as they went up so from that perspective it does seem weird that you didn't notice my switch. Obviously our personal situations don't align with everyone's on your team but I don't think that there's anything skeevy about my reaction.

man i have such a hard time believing Spiffeh actually truly with his heart of hearts thinks I'm scum for reading the RC swap as bullshit before I had teammates online to give context

like i am REALLY having a hard time swallowing that

@Anen can you ask Spiffeh why he's shit pls i need good stronk town spiffeh here to talk you off the ledge

I don't think it's at all difficult to believe: it's not exactly uncommon knowledge. At the very least you choosing to pick a fight with me and say that you don't believe me without doing anything to verify my claim feels like you're not actually interested in an explanation but are instead looking for a reason to push on me.

That said I don't want to start overcommitting to reads before I've had some time to let the game play itself, so if you're town feel free to show it.

[xRECKONERx]

1. Right but your point is that he's avoiding an easy mislynch in your early game by defending you. I'm trying to understand why that's specifically town motivated to you when I don't see it as a bold play, especially if you're familiar with each other. fmpov i dont think calling you obvtown from that interaction makes a lot of sense if he thinks you're capable of that as scum either and i'm trying to see how you and anenien feel about that

2. Point about opportunism is fair but the read from a single rvs vote feels more like a mastina tell than not

3. I'm not defensive, I'm trying to understand why I'm null because I find that particular read strange. I guess Keely hasn't played enough with town me to know this is how i usually sort people - I really do think that I'm out of my scumrange btw but thats mostly because i started picking up on my tells and i kind of have a tough time avoiding them

Do you think my questioning is forced though?

Hindu isnt my top scumread btw, check my vote. I think it's possible he flips scum here though but theres probably only one scum in hindu/you/anen so I want to understand the three of you better

1. Hindu and I haven't played together in years. The last time Hindu knew me or played w/ me, I was pretty dominant. Therefore, if Hindu was scum and saw me as town (especially since I came out so strongly asserting myself with the RC situation) I don't see him stepping up to stop a push on me when he could've just let me continue to duke it out with RC endlessly. If he was town, I don't know what he'd do. If he was scum, I would expect him to stay back and let the fight continue without hard town reading me. Ergo, I think he is not scum. It's pretty simple logic to me.

2. I do not care about mastina's history or playstyle or tells or meta. It's dumb and bad and I won't abide it.

3. I think expecting people to know you're obvtown because you think you're obvtown is a futile, pointless endeavor that just lets to ego masturbation. I don't care if you think we SHOULD know you're town by now because of your meta. I don't give a fuck about self-meta. I think your questioning is null, personally. Easy to be either alignment.

[CheekyTeeky]

hey cheeky what level of consultation was made with team before this

more from a pC

Zero. Why is there someone on my team who knows how to read you?

[Katyusha]

Raybells do you think it makes sense to nullread me in this gamestate

pedit:

1. meh, I don’t feel that Hindu did much to really abate scumreads on you but I suppose that’s my position as a neutral observer. Your logic at least makes sense

3. It’s not that I expect you to find me obvtown (even if I think I probably am) it’s just I have a lot of content and not really having a stance one way or another seems off to me - you even mentioned that’s why i’d be easier to read with flips

[RadiantCowbells]

S_S's self meta is accurate but doesn't make him town. If I had to lock him into a read I would say town
Mastina's reason for townreading me is shit but I'm getting deja vu and I feel like I've been in this exact position with her before and she's been town.
I think that CK3 is a lot likelier scum than a lot of the people currently getting wagoned but I don't want to commit to that
Reckoner pissed me off so I don't trust my read there right now and will go back to it later.

No comment on Cheeky at this time

If RC/Adenine/Creature/Katyusha/Mastina are all town then we're 3 short of poe

Raybells do you think it makes sense to nullread me in this gamestate

Coming from who? I certainly don't nullread you

[CheekyTeeky]

okay so what was the point of that comment then?

This question is phrased in a way that makes it difficult to not give an awkward answer. There was no POINT per se; I just said what I was thinking.

Which RC? Are you assuming RC is ignorant of self-meta?

There's only one RC, and he is very aware of self-meta but I wasn't trying to draw any conclusions from it. (In fact, it's rather the opposite: that is such a characteristic thing for him to say that he'd absolutely say it as either alignment.)

I move you down to a scum lean.

[xRECKONERx]

I don't think it's at all difficult to believe: it's not exactly uncommon knowledge. At the very least you choosing to pick a fight with me and say that you don't believe me without doing anything to verify my claim feels like you're not actually interested in an explanation but are instead looking for a reason to push on me.

I barely know who you are, let alone what your personal gripes with people are.
I didn't think you would lie about something like that so brazenly and then dare me to confirm with my teammates, that would be suicidal.
I thought, instead, that you were using a real story as a convenient cover for your swap. It could've been both things.

[Something_Smart]

I move you down to a scum lean.

Because of the post you quoted?