Team Mafia 2018: Inventions Mafia Day 4

[chesskid3]

o shiiii i missed the edit

[chesskid3]

HINDU I SUMMON THEE

[singersigner]

@Aneninen...I was asking why you demanded a reads list and no mention of a claim, specifically because you pointed out it would be at L-1.

Again, what claim? Isn't the Setup 12 VTs 3 Mafias and the inventions?

Um...no...

I don't have a good feeling about you because I think your response to me entering the game was contrived and your breakdown of my ISO when questioned about it didn't really answer my question. In fact, it kind of confirmed that it was a whimsical read to throw at me because it felt safe at the time.

Think whatever you wish. However, I don't think my read on eg. Errant, Katyusha, GuiltyLion, Something_Smart were better, from your point of view. Why haven't you mentioned those?
Why do you think it would have been riskier if I had thrown out a scumread on you?

I haven't read your thoughts on other players so I didn't take those into account.
I think a

townlean

on me is safe because it's not committing to me being town, and you feel obligated to put me in a category. If you had said I was scum you would've had to answer for it.

Errant I explained here.

Is that all?
I had no problems with Errant's catchup. Maybe we see catchups in a different way?

Maybe. It's the same problem I have with mastina in that they're clearly keeping up with the game but aren't participating in the current state of it.

GuiltyLion seems to have a decent amount of heat so that seems like someone who can also clarify some questions/reads. No opinion, yet, though.

Or have I misunderstood you and I should have taken that "may or may not be scum" part

literally

?

Yes. Like I said, I've made my opinions on certain players in that list clear the other ones would just be convenient if they flipped scum but have no reason to stay alive.

Which part of your question have I left unanswered?

I just meant that you did an ISO to try and answer it but you called what I did a catch up, which is was not. Because I am not. And came across as "sure they're town because I know they are so I can safely call them town" with what seemed like a retroactive justification for your statement.

[Aneninen]

@Aneninen...I was asking why you demanded a reads list and no mention of a claim, specifically because you pointed out it would be at L-1.

Again, what claim? Isn't the Setup 12 VTs 3 Mafias and the inventions?

Um...no...

Well, instead of doing all those ISOs I should have read the game description instead.
This doesn't seem to be my most intelligent

day

game...

I haven't read your thoughts on other players so I didn't take those into account.
I think a

townlean

on me is safe because it's not committing to me being town, and you feel obligated to put me in a category. If you had said I was scum you would've had to answer for it.

From your point of view, those reads aren't better. I usually use these categories: town, lean town, null/unsorted, lean scum, scum. Anyone can meta it.
Also, in most games even my "strong" reads are weak on Day1. (There are exceptions, though.) As I expressed before, what counts as "strong town" read on Day1 means little or nothing later, eg. on Day4.

Maybe. It's the same problem I have with mastina in that they're clearly keeping up with the game but aren't participating in the current state of it.

So. Let me rephrase it.
Do you think it's a tell if someone has "instant" interactions with others or merely catch-up posts every now and then? (If so, I disagree.)
Or, do you think a dialogue-like interaction tells more about a player than an asychronous one which consists of catch-ups and/or quote walls? (If so, I agree. Quick reactions may tell more because they're more likely "instinctive" or how can I describe them.)
Or, do you think they look scummy because they're around but not posting meanwhile. (If so, I disagree. Sometimes I have some time to post, but on certain days i hardly ever have any. Still, I'm reading eg. when I have a break at work, sitting on the loo, etc. I actually read your posts during the latter thing. As far as i can remember. – I guess others may have similar "IRL-activity rhythm". )
Or, something else? (Well, not getting what you mean would be maximum the 3rd stupidest thing I've done this game so far...)

I just meant that you did an ISO to try and answer it but you called what I did a catch up, which is was not. Because I am not. And came across as "sure they're town because I know they are so I can safely call them town" with what seemed like a retroactive justification for your statement.

I thought you had read quite a few pages for those posts. Although I didn't check whether the things you mentioned had been close to each other in the thread or not.
In short, Primate's nul + they looked genuine + gut were enough for that lean town read. Think what you wish about it.

[chesskid3]

Well, instead of doing all those ISOs I should have read the game description instead.
This doesn't seem to be my most intelligent day game...

All is forgiven if you bring the hammer down

[chesskid3]

[Aneninen]

Well, instead of doing all those ISOs I should have read the game description instead.
This doesn't seem to be my most intelligent day game...

All is forgiven if you bring the hammer down

You know, I have a feeling that even if we happen to win Team Mafia, I won't get a nomination for the Best Townie Award of the year...

But still, I think Mastina should post a readlist. And claim, yeah. That one too. Then it may happen.

[chesskid3]

M O M E N T U M

[chesskid3]

also I'm asking as a personal favor because I'd like to confirm my slot and swap out tbh

[Aneninen]

Mastina's flip confirms

no one

. Not even you.

[GuiltyLion]

a meme from Mathdino

[chesskid3]

a meme from Mathdino

Well I think we have the answer to this question as soon as someone drops the hammer

[chesskid3]

Mastina's flip confirms

no one

. Not even you.

I mean. Mastina flips scum; Reck is diving RC which will confirm RC-scum once Reck's corpse is here tomorrow morning; There will be 1 scum left and it's probably GL as outlined in 2750 so I'm not really worried

[GuiltyLion]

EPs catch up resonated with me because a lot of their stances on the game state as they progressed followed my own thoughts. I believe EP's catch up is much stronger than Aneninen's because she didn't focus on ISO picking to determine her reads and she took the whole game and interactions into account.

the thing is if you've read the whole thread, you can rewrite (or just agree with) things that other people said later and pass them off as your own thoughts or your own "progression". Like it's true that Aneninen's ISO picking doesn't take the game/interactions into account, but it's not hard for scum to do a page by page catchup like EP did. I only put stock in people's thoughts resonating with mine when people post them

before

I've posted mine.

[CheekyTeeky]

I just meant that you did an ISO to try and answer it but you called what I did a catch up, which is was not. Because I am not. And came across as "sure they're town because I know they are so I can safely call them town" with what seemed like a retroactive justification for your statement.

Singer why aren't you pushing my locktown read on you when I haven't commented on your alignment previously?

[CheekyTeeky]

Well, there are still like 20 minutes of pro-towness to make use of.

What does everyone think about electing a scum/scum read to hide behind a scum/null read?
I think it’s to dangerous to have a town read in the mix. I would rather risk someone unsorted or hard to sort.

Omg GL is scum af - I remember his message from Dino that I'm town for this train of thought alone - but he neglected to mention srceenplay or RC for being the first to mention it prior to me.

I have some ideas for why this might be but most of them end in a GL scum conclusion.

@GuiltyLion wh4t is your reason for this please?

Hi GL

Answer please.

[GuiltyLion]

The second, and the plan chosen, was to be the driving force behind a scum lynch. This scum flip would lift suspicion and remove the hider from him. However this lynch cannot be mastina since his position on her is beyond solidified. Thus to accomplish this he would have to the previously unknown 3rd scum.

How do I know plan #2 was chosen?

5.Bonus RC is arrogant.

RC probably believes that he alone is the one who can carry the scumteam to victory. Based on all the chaos he has caused today and the numerous townreads he has obtained for it, he's probably not wrong.

Furthermore, unless the 3rd scum were in Reck/Creature/Cheeky (hint: it's not), they aren't in a good position to endgame.
RC probably believes he alone can strongarm the town and pull this game out of the absolutely awful position Elli's program and my stubbornness have put them in. Thus out of the two options we discussed above, RC would choose option 2, with the backdoor that if the bus failed, it would have helped option 1 because he and his partner would have distanced.

6 Because of all the above Guiltylion is the most likely candidate for scum 3.

Please note how RC was actively trying to close the lynch on GuiltyLion while I was away.

Eh I think RC just saw a slot that he thought he could drive a quick informationless lynch on and went for it, since a lot of people have been casually scumreading me because I haven't posted that much. Don't think he anticipated me making it back to the thread and biting back.

I agree with the entire rest of this post however

@p-edit: Cheeky the Dino "cheeky town because of her bad hider plan" thing wasn't a serious read/justification, we just both happened to be on Discord and talking about the game at the same time and he threw that comment out and I repeated him

[GuiltyLion]

You sure you can’t take hider creature?

Srceenplay why did you post this?

[chesskid3]

Eh I think RC just saw a slot that he thought he could drive a quick informationless lynch on and went for it, since a lot of people have been casually scumreading me because I haven't posted that much. Don't think he anticipated me making it back to the thread and biting back.

I agree with the entire rest of this post however

can you hammer mastina then

[Aneninen]

I just meant that you did an ISO to try and answer it but you called what I did a catch up, which is was not. Because I am not. And came across as "sure they're town because I know they are so I can safely call them town" with what seemed like a retroactive justification for your statement.

Singer why aren't you pushing my locktown read on you when I haven't commented on your alignment previously?

Now I start thinking that I was wrong about Cheeky before...
That's a damm good question.
(As a remote possibility. If I'm wrong about Singer and she's scum, her read on me is just as safe as my one on her. I mean, it doesn't matter much at this game phase; I'm not a hot topic nor important. But that's mere speculation and it's relevant only if Mastin flips town. I don't think Singer wouldn't have derailed Mastina's wagon instead of pushing it if there were scum together. Or, Singer may not have read that post.)

[CheekyTeeky]

@p-edit: Cheeky the Dino "cheeky town because of her bad hider plan" thing wasn't a serious read/justification, we just both happened to be on Discord and talking about the game at the same time and he threw that comment out and I repeated him

What's your read on me now and why?

[GuiltyLion]

@chess - I can/will hammer mastina but I want to give it a day since she's reached L-1 since not everybody has checked in yet.

@Cheeky - town. high level one liner is that there's a lot of attempts to sort peripheral players and re-evaluation/re-thinking that I don't think scum would feel the need to do or would think to fake. also personally felt you were a lot more crafted/calculated in Reverse Mafia than you are here

3. srceenplay and GL are both people I'd join a wagon on. I don't think that GLs defense is stellar. I think his lash out at RC is scum frustration. Maybe it could be wrong and I definitely don't want to make it more frustrating if he's town because I know how that can be. shrug

hey EP let's talk about this - my main defense is that RC's push on me is for NAI reasons having to do primarily with difficulty keeping up with the game, and that he hasn't sufficiently justified any of them nor would a town!RC believe that they are actually indicative.

I can sort of see why that wouldn't hold up for you if you're townreading RC, but can you explicitly address this - what reasons do you have of your own for thinking I'm scum and/or why are RC's reasons good?

There was also an assumption in his push that I need to be towntelling or that I haven't towntold, but he of all people should know that there's nothing you can just post to show your alignment, it can only be drawn out through opinions and demonstrating that you're genuinely game-solving. I can get why people aren't explicitly townreading me but I don't think my ISO is short of opinions or pushes when I have been here and I feel most of these thoughts were largely ignored/buried under the spam of this game. RC didn't really engage with any of these on a content level, instead asked me for a readlist and openly admitted to planning to spin my posts as scummy.

[GuiltyLion]

GuiltyLion seems to have a decent amount of heat so that seems like someone who can also clarify some questions/reads. No opinion, yet, though.

do you have any questions/reads in particular for me and do you have an opinion on the "heat" that I've received?

also thank you for 2878 that's the 2nd best post of the game after Reck's scummastina video

[Srceenplay]

You sure you can’t take hider creature?

Srceenplay why did you post this?

Because I would have rather him take.
It was to late though. Hammer already occurred.

Reck had posted something right around that time that pinged me the wrong way.

There is to much setup going on with the hider. I’m not understanding it enough to put me at ease. It seems like to much can go wrong.

Thought it might have been better for creature to try and clear someone without telling who the target is. Might have been safer.

[singersigner]

I just meant that you did an ISO to try and answer it but you called what I did a catch up, which is was not. Because I am not. And came across as "sure they're town because I know they are so I can safely call them town" with what seemed like a retroactive justification for your statement.

Singer why aren't you pushing my locktown read on you when I haven't commented on your alignment previously?

1. I don't know what lock town is but I assume it's like SUPER ULTRA TOWN READ?
2. Because you didn't add any caveat that made it seem like an outright wrong motivation for labeling it. As it stands it's just an empty read, and seeing as I don't make it a habit to question accurate reads on me until something else pings my scumdar, I just hadn't processed it as relevant.

GuiltyLion seems to have a decent amount of heat so that seems like someone who can also clarify some questions/reads. No opinion, yet, though.

do you have any questions/reads in particular for me and do you have an opinion on the "heat" that I've received?

also thank you for 2878 that's the 2nd best post of the game after Reck's scummastina video

*bows*

And not yet. I tried isoing you as your name came up and the only thing I found in particular was that I disagreed with one of RC's reasons you're scum being because you ask a lot of questions. That particular playstyle resonates with me since I do the same thing when I start a game. I can't say I'll ask a lot of questions here, though, unless I'm alive D2 and it'll feel like a reset. I also don't always follow through with my line of questioning unless I disagree with the answers I get, in which case it looks like apathetic playing or "feigning" activity.

Anyway. I don't hate you yet. Just figured I need to flush out my own opinions before I go knocking down others'.