Team Mafia 2018: Mafiosi Revolution (Over)

[Cheetory6]

I would probably be willing to wagon Aristophanes if his next post is terrible or Mulchslot once we get a caught up replacement.

[Firebringer]

I’m up for wagoning cheetory

[Cheetory6]

neato

[Spiffeh]

There's also that you're not directly interacting with any of my specific content beyond just being like "stop scumreading me!"

Most of your stuff is interacting and asking specific people questions that aren't me so I don't really know where I had the opportunity to do much of this

Is UnaBombaH still someone you haven't looked over?

[Cheetory6]

Una/Tora are next on my list.

[Patrick]

Why is it scummy specifically? Pitch me it.

I haven't read every recent Mulch post in full, especially his back and forth with Eddie, but I feel like I've had a pretty good idea where he's at in terms of reads / worldview. If he's town, he's in a position where he has townreads on everyone but Kagami and Spiffeh. I've found it pretty genuine; thought his read on my meta pretty genuine because I think scum would love that to stay on the quiet, thought his doubts on Kagami seemed p genuine, thought his calling Spiffeh town then returning to him seemed pretty genuine. I don't expect all town to share my point of view, but I feel like there's a fair bit of content in there to go alongside the spam, and that most people would go through quite a lot of doubt in reading him.

Spiffeh's posts on Mulch last page don't look like trying to figure him out at all. He brought up a couple of boring points that have surely been said 10 times already and probably could be said about Mulch in most games he plays, and I don't think hammering on Mulch's Spiffeh change of heart looked genuine. I realise he's asking Mulch a question there, but the tone of it was already one of painting Mulch negatively for it.

And like I said, that point doesn't make a great deal of sense to me: if Mulch scum was trying to keep options open on lynching Spiffeh, he didn't need to call Spiffeh town at all. The post where he did looked like a gut reaction and was something I shared to a lesser extent (Spiffeh going after Toranaga was an unpopular target, and might suggest Spiffeh isn't scum).

Also think Spiffeh's dismissive response to me was slightly scummy, but that's not something I can make a good argument for.

[Spiffeh]

Or maybe all the things I said about Mulch are how I actually feel

[Patrick]

Or maybe all the things I said about Mulch are how I actually feel

That's the other option, yes.

[Ether]

Day 1, Votecount 65

---

It's just (ah) a lack of trust (trust)
Not like your lynch needs to be discussed
It's just (ah) some little thing (trust)
Not like nothing you could do is getting through

-[

Crush,

Jennifer Paige

]

4 Kagami (Firebringer, Ginngie, Chara, Kmd4390)
4 Mulch (Kagami, Eddie Cane, Toranaga, Spiffeh)
2 Spiffeh (Patrick, Mulch)
1 Chara (implosion)

4 Unvote (Aristophanes, Cabd, Cheetory6, UnaBombaH)

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch.
The deadline is in (expired on 2018-02-05 00:00:00), on Sunday, February 4 at 11:59 pm EST.

---

Mulch has been banned from Team Mafia for abusive/offensive language following the General Warning that was posted.

As a reminder, please do not discuss ongoing games.

This means that Spam Squad should look for a replacement for Mulch's slot within 48 hours.

[Kmd4390]

iii) Early on Spiffeh made some interesting points against kmd that I quite liked. Seemed pretty unlikely that he would do that with a scumbuddy who was otherwise swimming along fine, which means that leaning more scummily on kmd comes with a more towny lean on spiff.

So what is your read on Spiff now after 180ing on me? I ctrl+f'd his name in your ISO and it seems like you don't like him but it's hard to tell if it's really a scum read and then I see his name missing in your list on 1270 but even that list is only if Mulch is town.\

1. As I said before, there's a world of difference between someone claiming FN when run up to L-1, then repeatedly failing to be confirmed, then claiming they only had 3 shots versus Cabd softing unlynchable early on then pretty-much claiming FN. The reason I do have concerns about Cabd is not that I am especially skeptical of FNs, but that he's familiar enough with me that he should have had a townread based on more than just me outing his obvious-ish soft.

Kmd will understand, I don't really want to go into part of that because I'm trying to say it nicely.

Kagami. Really? Your team outplayed mine once. That doesn't make me stupid. He claimed three shot and got three chances. He claimed rb'd which is plausible for an outed power role. On the last chance, someone confirmed him. That someone happened to be someone who we all thought was town at the time and SK who actually received the message and didn't want to destroy his own game by lynching the friendly neighbor and having them flip town so he just claimed it. We just didn't realize scum were bold enough to tie 66% of their team to that claim. It was a good play and it worked. There's no reason for you to imply I can't play a game that I've been playing for a decade just because I was part of a team that lost once. I really hope you aren't trying to just discredit someone who is voting for you because that would be a low blow to do it like that.

Considering this quote, and kmd/Spiffeh wondering why I say I wouldn't take a scum-PM after a quote like this..
When I say I am "OK as scum", it obviously means OK. Not good, not great. OK.

"OK" sounds better than "bad". If you are bad at town, why would you pick it? That logic works both ways. Basically, I don't think that guessing what you would pick helps here, but I don't like you using it as a defense and then making that statement.

______________

Chara, don't forget you still owe me explanations on Aris and Patrick reads. I saw that you talked a little about Aris but wasn't sure if there was more to it or not.

[Chara]

Chara, don't forget you still owe me explanations on Aris and Patrick reads. I saw that you talked a little about Aris but wasn't sure if there was more to it or not.

i appreciate the reminder. just trying to find time to do something more in-depth than my usual "hop in and post".
not done with Ari, no.

[Firebringer]

VOTE: Cheetory

[Cheetory6]

Is this the part where I ask you to get your actually good teammates to read me?

Because I'm a dick when I'm town right?

[Firebringer]

sick burn

[Kmd4390]

Firebringer is that a real vote or are you just trying to be a trend setter or something?

[Firebringer]

I don’t have a townread on him anymore and I think his apathy that’s getting in game could be his scum apathy and he is very self aware of it and trying to make it seem townie

Idk I don’t think most of his posts come from scum POV
I don’t like recent stuff

[Cheetory6]

Yeah I'm so apathetic with the six hours of isodives I did the last two days.

[Eddie Cane]

party in the usa

[Firebringer]

Effort equal alignment now?

[Cheetory6]

Like just because I don't have a strong scumread at this stage doesn't make me apathetic at all and your assessment of my play as being apathetic when I'm at most just distracted because of work and other shit is kind of ridiculous?

[Cheetory6]

Ask RC to read me for you if you're going to assess what I'm putting into this game as apathetic.

[Firebringer]

Yeah didn’t say what ur putting in game was apathetic
I’m saying ur acting apathetic and it didn’t feel like Town u and yeah u have way more conviction in ur Town games too

We had a game u had me as scum and you death tunneled me for two game days.

There’s no certainty here at all.

[Firebringer]

I think every Town game of yours you had at this point one strong scumread

[Cheetory6]

If you don't think my towngame is tentative until I find something I find scummy then you frankly have literally 0 idea as to what my towngame is like.

I ebb and flow and this game in particular I'm not seeing anything obviously scummy. Which is something a lot of people are echoing. Just wait until I get on a computer.

[implosion]

Implosion's Kagami case posts are hard to find something to disagree with on the surface but I agree with Patrick/Eddie that it really feels like something's wrong with them. The approach feels off to me? Something like.. he's trying too hard to find scum motivation in a way that feels more like "I want this person to look like scum" rather than "all of these points are genuinely standing out to me as reasoning for Kagami being scum".
If he's town he's probably going to find that commentary unfair/annoying though, so I'm eventually planning to pick apart the reasoning itself.

This is actually not annoying, because it gets at the fundamental problem that I am confirmation biased and feel like PoE is vaguely closing in and there are scum in the game and etc.

The annoying piece is that several people have commented on the post with the same thing of "well yeah the points seem sound on the surface but I think they might still come from scum-implosion" in one way or another. And all of these do nothing to tell me whether or not I'm right, and I'm really not sure if I am. There's an element of me reading each of Kagami's posts and trying to honestly assess it as whether it's more likely to come from town or scum, but there's also an element of me building up the best case for Kagami-scum that I can and seeing if other people agree with it or if certain points stand out or if the whole thing is rubbish.

It's also about seeing how Kagami reacts to it, which thus far is not at all except the indirect reaction of calling me scum-if-mulch-is-town.

It's similar to my post toward Chara earlier.