Team Mafia 2018: Game 3 - Random GIFs Game Over

[Bins]

I immediately revoke what I said about Dunker, I read it over again and I feel like he was reacting very similar to me, but he just came to a different conclusion but it isn't scummy.

[Mathdino]

No surprise on havingfitz's read.

Since Binswagon isn't picking up steam (fuck me for outing the Bins scumread right)

I'm willing to 1v1 havingfitz in our remaining 4 days til deadline if we can't get a lynch.

I'm stonewalling A50 and Titus (this time cuz I think they're both town) and Bins won't get lynched. So unless you all wanna compromise lynch Elena, this is the direction we're going.

[Bins]

lmfao I'm going to let T-Bone respond to this because I can't wait for his reaction

[Bins]

Key I want an updated read on Elena too if you pleeeease :d

[Mathdino]

T-Bone, the man who said a week ago that he doesn't want to worry too much about actually getting a lynch yet because the deadline's so far away.

We're nearing the weekend and we're not in that much better a position than when we started. We need to start thinking about getting an actual lynch and people don't seem that concerned.

@mod: Request deadline extension on account of multiple replacements.

I also find it hilarious that no one scumreading me has actually commented on my Bins progression (and the warning I got for it).

Bins who are you willing to lynch?

[Bins]

{Keychain, Bulbazak, Radja} - town
{CDB, Dunker} - pretty town but there's not a lot to work with
{Mathdino, UCV} - i really question play here but i'm townreading for various reasons
{Chesskid, Aero, A50} - can't really strongly justify a townread here
{tbone} - own special category 8)

My would lynch list includes:
Aeronaut (lol)
Titus(Transcend)
Havingfitz(LLD)
Elena Fisher



This really isn't anything I haven't stated before.

[Mathdino]

Sell me on Radja town (ideally looking at his ISO)? I locktowned them early but never had cause to reevaluate until later.

[Bins]

You seem to scumread me for LLD's undetermined alignment.

You pulled Radja into this "team" the same way. He reacted in the way I would expect town to. His team stuff seems legit as well (ex. reck handwaving comment re: chess/mathdino).
Idk, I would be surprised if he's scum.

[T-Bone]

React to what, exactly? If Math really wants to go down that route, he's getting lynched over Fitz 100%.

But, until Titus does something otherwise, she replaced into a scumslot. She's a fairly transparent player when it comes to her alignment in my opinion, so to me, her silence is deafening.

[Bins]

I'm stonewalling A50 and Titus (this time cuz I think they're both town)

was what I was referring to as ridiculous, lol.

[Mathdino]

Y'all overestimate how easy it'll be to get me lynched. Like I said, very few people have commented on the new info at hand, and almost everyone scumreading me is either 1. doing it off of tone/disagreement or 2. someone I scumread anyway. Bins, you act like it's normal that Radja completely 180's his read on me after I throw a line of shade his way for a laughable "Thanks for confirming you're scum" comment. That shit comes from scum much more often than not. Town doesn't tunnel like that.

And the Titus reads are almost equally ridiculous. Eddie scumread was never overly expanded on, Transcend scumread was for being useless, and Titus is still catching up.

[Radja]

Okay since Reck is dead in his game, he's going to help me sort this game out. He hadn't been paying attention to this game much, so here are his thoughts. I figured this might help move this game forward even though I'm not really in the mood to read anything yet. So just posting Recks thoughts, I'll add my own later(probably tomorrow). There's some stuff I already mentioned but these are just Reck's thoughts.

Here goes:

Recks reads:

Town

:
- A50 (Reck thinks A50 is frustrated by me scumreading him and he's seen some signs that A50 is actively trying to sort that out
- LLD-slot: her reaching out to Reck seemed town as heck
- Titus(Skirt/Transcend): Skirt/Transcend were townreads for Reck and Titus hasn't really done anything
- UCV: gut town from early in the game when he got pushed by certain people

Null:(could be scum if they don't make content any time soon)
- CDB: post more!
- T-Bone: Reck thinks it's fishy you tried to stall votes 2 days ago to wait for something "really important"
- Aeronaut: post more!
- chesskid3: Smocaine wasn't really doing anything and chesskid hasn't contributed much yet

Scum

:
- Mathdino: kmd thoughts seem fake, empty questioning, terrible posting and reacting to Bins/LLD/Radja/Elena scumteam,
- Keychain: prodding and questioning seems pretty fake, posts like 692 are just pointless noisemaking that look inquisitive but aren't, interactions feel generally disingenuous

Reck hasn't read up on Dunker, Bulba, Elena and UCV and will reread them when he finds more time.

Here's some specific stuff on Mathdino:

1. You think there's a potential LLD/me scum connection. Do you seriously think that, as scum, LLD would reach out to me to ask Reck for a read on her? That doesn't seem like scumbuddies interacting, or do you think differently?
2. the kmd thoughts don't feel like kmd thoughts. Phrasing seems off as kmd tends to be more reserved about saying things as strongly as Dino is presenting them. He also has a hard time believing you were talking to kmd in real time on discord because of kmd's work schedule. Feels like you faked some of those team reads.
3. The attack on UCV is exactly what UCV gets mislynched for as town frequently.
4. The flip on my alignment looks incredibly opportunistic. Reck also thinks A50 is town turned into mislynch fodder and Dino's white knighting him to appear town by defending what he considers to be an inevitable mislynch.
5. The flip on my alignment is also a complete 180 from early Dino declaring there's no way I would have taken a scum pm because of the composition of my team(Reck/Shea/hiplop/Cheet)

[Radja]

VOTE: Mathdino

You're right, I did go 180 on you, I had you as solid town until you started doing weird shit, like adding me to your scumteam for no reason and my teammates also had me reconsider my read on you. You went 180 on me too though, so the fact that you're scumreading me for that makes absolutely zero sense. As a reminder, here's your reaction to me posting that I would consider taking scum.

@Radja: On a team with shea, Reck, hiplop, and Cheet, while you self-proclaim as one of the weakest mafia players? Hell yes I think you chose town, lol.

[Bulbazak]

Aeronaut's ISO is super unimpressive but also he feels like he's in the same "easy mislynch" boat with me? I've seen his name thrown around wiht mine a lot for that so.

Think this is an interesting interaction.



Ugh.

I've just been slogging through this catch up, absorbing things to summarize/dump about in the end, but I actually really want you to expound on this some more.

In fact, this being an event that most players will follow I would love to set an example for all how NOT to play around me.

UNVOTE:

I will wait until I'm put to L-1. point out where I crumbed and instantly hammer myself. It should serve to teach many of you how A50 plays his game (and yet I WILL change my playstyle, so it will only be an end of an era).

Terrible posting. FYI I have played a game with you not too long ago where I thought you were obvtown and I never really thought you were scum for the entire game. In this game you've done nothing to make me think you are town, which is a huge concern to me. If you are in fact town your threat to selfhammer are pretty terrible. Especially in a team game like this.

Radja gets it.

Spoiler: Off Topic: I think the mod wants to eat my soul...

Actually, THANK YOU KMD! Now that you reminded me, EVERY SINGLE PERSON who calls for my lynch "based on self-voting" I'm going to accuse them of being Scum, and I do have reason to .. precisely from that game, where NO TOWNIE voted Joda "because she self-voted", while 75% of the total Scum count in that game did. THANK YOU AGAIN.

I mean, let's just ignore the fact that the argument is less about you self-voting and more about why you would threaten to throw the game as town in a team based game with a title on the line.

VOTE: havingfitz

It's not Titus.

I think I might have an idea why you switched here, but I want you to say it.

On to 57 when I get home-ish.

[Mathdino]

1. I'd like to think I'm pretty good at associations. I see no reason scumbuddies wouldn't interact in that way. LLD is smart.

2. Wow. Wowww. This shit again. KMD is explicitly not coaching me as he would if he were literally in this game. He literally told me that he was going to present his notes to me differently because "people aren't scrutinising him and his notes like they would in a non-Team Mafia game" (paraphrased). You seriously think I would make up pages and pages of interaction between me and my team?

Also KMD isn't on Discord, he's the only one in the PT only. I asked him to look through my game in particular and he posted ALL of his notes on his catchup.

Does anyone here think I or anyone in this tournament would make up tons of reads by another player, INCLUDING meta knowledge I couldn't possibly have?

3. I WASN'T ATTACKING UCV. Holy fucking hell I've already been over this. I was trying to lock UCV as town based on a different thing entirely. I have absolutely 0 intent of lynching UCV today and you'd see that if you or Reck actually ISO'd me.

4. Insane. The people I hard-defend don't get mislynched. A50 will not get lynched as long as I'm alive.

5. Reck flipped town. I reserve commentary on the rest of your team.

But huh it's almost like I would reevaluate my reads based on new information as it comes :O :O :O

It's almost like I came up with early reads based on the info I had at the time (which half the game had a problem with) (crazy idea) and now that I'm reading people based on their actual ISOs and performances in game, that's a massive contradiction to people.

[Mathdino]

VOTE: Mathdino

You're right, I did go 180 on you, I had you as solid town until you started doing weird shit, like adding me to your scumteam for no reason and my teammates also had me reconsider my read on you. You went 180 on me too though, so the fact that you're scumreading me for that makes absolutely zero sense. As a reminder, here's your reaction to me posting that I would consider taking scum.

@Radja: On a team with shea, Reck, hiplop, and Cheet, while you self-proclaim as one of the weakest mafia players? Hell yes I think you chose town, lol.

I just addressed this.

You have GOT to be kidding me.

You seriously expect me to stay 100% true to my page fucking 1 reads after you went AWOL all game and caught up in a way I consider scummy?

This is a political scumread if I've ever seen one. If I kept you as a townread, this entire situation wouldn't have happened and you know it.

What is my motivation for 180ing you as scum?

[Bins]

:{ reck doesnt notice me


tbh reck's townread on LLD makes me doubt this lynch on fitz even more


pedit
-uh it's not much other than LLD had a lot of people in her "i would lynch you" like aero (lurking, not posting much) but aero was the one she pointed out as being an easy mislynch? with them both on my meh-list at the time i wanted to note that down

[Mathdino]

He also has a hard time believing you were talking to kmd in real time on discord because of kmd's work schedule. Feels like you faked some of those team reads.

While we're at it, what the fuck is this shit? I never even claimed to be interacting with KMD in real time. I was interacting with

GuiltyLion and NSG

in real time. The majority of the time I got with KMD in pseudo-real-time was at like 1 AM and 2 AM.

[Radja]

VOTE: Mathdino

You're right, I did go 180 on you, I had you as solid town until you started doing weird shit, like adding me to your scumteam for no reason and my teammates also had me reconsider my read on you. You went 180 on me too though, so the fact that you're scumreading me for that makes absolutely zero sense. As a reminder, here's your reaction to me posting that I would consider taking scum.

@Radja: On a team with shea, Reck, hiplop, and Cheet, while you self-proclaim as one of the weakest mafia players? Hell yes I think you chose town, lol.

I just addressed this.

You have GOT to be kidding me.

You seriously expect me to stay 100% true to my page fucking 1 reads after you went AWOL all game and caught up in a way I consider scummy?

This is a political scumread if I've ever seen one. If I kept you as a townread, this entire situation wouldn't have happened and you know it.

What is my motivation for 180ing you as scum?

So you can go 180 on me, but I can't go 180 on you? Good talk.

[Mathdino]

tbh reck's townread on LLD makes me doubt this lynch on fitz even more

Tbh Reck saying that Mathdino/Keychain are scum and then getting at least 4 things wrong about my ISO makes me doubt Reck is reading this game very closely at all.

That in itself doesn't mean Radja is scum. But it loses a shitton of credibility if he wants me to answer questions that I've answered 3 times already. Each.

Edit: Radja, I've explained my reasons for questioning my townread on you. I've also explained how your flip-flop has clear scum motivation.

You haven't explained scum motivation for MY reads changing.

[Bins]

i know but i wanted more comments on LLD AtE from people who i think can read it better than me

[Radja]

tbh reck's townread on LLD makes me doubt this lynch on fitz even more

Tbh Reck saying that Mathdino/Keychain are scum and then getting at least 4 things wrong about my ISO makes me doubt Reck is reading this game very closely at all.

That in itself doesn't mean Radja is scum. But it loses a shitton of credibility if he wants me to answer questions that I've answered 3 times already. Each.

Edit: Radja, I've explained my reasons for questioning my townread on you. I've also explained how your flip-flop has clear scum motivation.

You haven't explained scum motivation for MY reads changing.

you pegged me as a scumteam with other people for no fucking reason. I've told you this a million times.

[Mathdino]

I was scumreading those other 2 people, and started lowkey scumreading you at the time. Your interaction around LLD was consistent with scumbuddies.

That's not what I asked though.

I asked you what my scum motivation is for changing my read on you.

[Dunkerdoodles]

@Radja

: A50 is a bad/opportunistic scumread. And yeah, my whole team towntunneled you because of pages 1 2 and 3. If the evidence starts swinging in the other direction, hell yeah I'm gonna start questioning my own tunnel.

@T-Bone

: T-Bone what you're really asking is "Give me a good reason smart!town!Dunker would muddy the waters". Dunker is not good at reading me. Or, it seems, anyone for that matter given that he relies completely on shit he can't even describe.

Like, it actually makes perfect sense he's scumreading me. He was simultaneously scumreading me in both games we played together before my flip in the other game. And he's correct that my style this game has been similar to my style there. I have a fairly consistent playstyle with an all-over-the-place tone in general. The exceptions are things like
A. Switch: N0 guilty on Bins, gotta do something different.
B. NSG's game: Replaced into a MyLo slot at L-2 and was told to save myself and solve the game.

Tonereading is trash in this situation. I'm confident Dunker would toneread me as scum in most games on this site. That's why I've been annoyed. I knew once my scumgame ended he'd act all high and mighty like HEY GUYS I WAS RIGHT ABOUT DINOSCUM THAT TIME when he was literally only right because he deathtunneled a townie and then literally told everyone "Guys lynch this guy and lynch me in LyLo tomorrow if I'm wrong". No town motivation for that. Just stupidity.

But what reason is there for scum!Dunker to completely ignore all reason and abandon the town's topics of discussion to just tunnel me all day?

I just caught you in a recent game, how am I bad at reading you?

[Mathdino]

Tonereading is trash in this situation. I'm confident Dunker would toneread me as scum in most games on this site. That's why I've been annoyed. I knew once my scumgame ended he'd act all high and mighty like HEY GUYS I WAS RIGHT ABOUT DINOSCUM THAT TIME when he was literally only right because he deathtunneled a townie and then literally told everyone "Guys lynch this guy and lynch me in LyLo tomorrow if I'm wrong".

I just caught you in a recent game, how am I bad at reading you?

Fixed your quote for you.

Remind me exactly why you scumread me last game?