Rocky Horror Picture Show - players suck, game over

[Almost50]

because cult can ALWAYS just wait until the vote gets to L-1 before shooting their recruit at the wagon

That's true, except... THE MOD SAID SOMETHING ABOUT THE PHASE ENDING SOON. We are in danger of not even managing to vote someone for the immunization. Now WHY would a cult leader risk losing a recruitment opportunity? Are they playing to win or are they playing to make the town lose? NO. These are NOT synonymous to each other, because if they're playing to WIN they are more concerned that they do recruit someone before the phase ends. If they're playing to just make us lose they they'll wait and take the risk of not only missing their chance to recruit this phase, but that the other cult leader would actually be playing to win and has already recruited someone themselves. which means they're already playing catch up.

[Gamma Emerald]

If you assume cult has infinite play-phase recruits, then it's stupid to ever try to strategize around it.
Cult leader could recruit fucking anyone ever period, it's dumb, don't worry about stupid shit like that.

They recruit once every cycle. They want certain players before they could be immunized. You're a cult leader and have no say in the matter.

Why dod you think hes CL

[Gamma Emerald]

Thing is none of us *know* we're immune, besides Creature and Dunker thanks to flavor

suspicious of this sentiment since based on my role I KNOW FOR SURE if I am one or the other since it says my recruit status

I know mine, but I'm not saying

[Inferno390]

B) This is totally shading me as CL. I'm getting tired of this.

I'm not specifically saying you are a cult leader, but it wouldn't surprise me if you were and I can see why others think that, and you defensiveness doesn't help. I understand being defensive, I can be quite defensive too at times, but you started heavily defending yourself from a single accusation against you and it feels like an overreaction. Combine this with how scummy you come across at times and I think you'd look to most as the most plausible clan leader. Of course, players are going to be scummy at times since, unless you are unrecruitable, you are not strictly 'town'. But your scumminess feels more anti-survivor than it does anti-town.

I'm not sure how I started heavily defensive. Based on Screenplay's ISO, he more or less said the thought I was a CL. Gamma was just me misunderstanding what he was trying to say. And then Venmar is just out of nowhere calling me CL. I'm not sure how my defense against Screenplay was bad, All I did was point out that I was not being scummy. So 'm not sure where this heavy defensiveness is coming from: If anything, I've been on the backpeadal from CL accusations several times this game.

I know that, looking through my ISO, not everything I have said puts me in the best light. But A) This my first cult game ever, so I have literally no idea what I'm doing. So a lot of my post are me trying to get comfortable with this game and figure out exactly what to do. And B) There has been a lot of scummy interaction between all sorts of people this game. So I don't understand how that can be combined with the fact that I'm getting attacked (or mistakenly feel like I'm getting attacked) and trying to defend myself from that can result in me looking a lot like CL. People were more or less calling me CL before I got defensive.

[Cerberus v666]

oh btw im unrecruitable so don't bother trying

I would like to inform all of you that only Virgins may be recruited, the number of you totaling 16

Creature and Dunkerdoodles have recently been spotted sneaking out of the toolshed out back - hair and clothes all askew Perhaps they should erase the V?

Virgin count: 14

Is it just me or does this imply that Dunker lied to us? He claims he is unrecruitable yet the flavour suggests Dunker

was

recruitable but now isn't. I'm not sure what this means for Dunker, but I really want to know what he has to say about losing his virginity to Creature, like some clarification from people who know what the flavour means would be nice.

I actually think that makes it more likely that he didn't lie. Looks to me like he had a triggered ability to make himself and somekne else immune, claimed to be immune early in case he didn't want to use it todqy, and then ended up using it. The "virgin" moniker makes sense as representing recruitables, rather than specifically indicating those with the Virgin role(given that the impressionable transylvanians are functionally identical to virgins), so unless there are more recruitable on top of the 16 noted on that post, it makes sense that the transylvanians are included in the count of recruitable individuals.

[TheGoldenParadox]

@Jay: Theme Park is so much different than any other section on the site. There are special mechanics, unique roles.. etc. This is not an open where you know exactly what to do even if you mislynch a PR, nor is it a semi-open where you could still lynch for info. That and the MOD SPENT TIME creating this game. They put in effort to make the game enjoyable to both them and the players. Do you really want to treat it like a paper tissue that you blow your nose into then toss in the litter bin?

VOTE: Ceberus

[Porkens]

suboptimal sexty

[TheGoldenParadox]

We have no fricking info, if you're going to tell us something that will actually let us do something, please tell us. I don't understand these game mechanics and so with NO KNOWLEDGE feel like we should get the biggest wagon.
Also if there's a doublevoter you should claim to make players immune.

@mod, who reviewed this setup?

[TheGoldenParadox]

suboptimal sexty

what does this mean.

[Porkens]

we can do...BETTER

[mutantdevle]

Looks to me like he had a triggered ability to make himself and somekne else immune

If that's true then I have no idea why he would target Creature of all people or why his ability would activate before the end of this Play/Pause cycle. Only Dunker could really answer this unless Creature actually knows something about it.

[Almost50]

Why dod you think hes CL

Cuz he's doing his best to strongarm us into quick voting before we think, and the fact that the proposed target is very likely to have been targeted for recruitment already by either if not BOTH CLs.

Bear with me. OK? Ak yourself this question: Who would YOU want in your team if you were a CL? Like who's capable at both deceiving mist everybody AND making logically sensible arguments in favour of your team that they would make look like they're the best options for Town when -in fact- they are the perfect way for your cult?

I asked myself that question and my answer is definitely Cerb .. and by far (no offense to anyone else).

Now if you agree (or even if you don't) would you -again, assuming you're a CL- want to wait for the wagon of D1 or would you take the initiative at the start of the day to clinch your preferred target before the other CL doe?? I would do the former ON DAY ONE in particular.

Now let's assume both CLs didn't follow that logic, and one even didn't agree that Cerb is the best option. Fine. Now you're a CL who has been taking their time before they submitted the recruitment action, and you see the mod stating the phase is nearing it's end. What do you do? a) Wait some more, or b) make up your mind and submit your action and never care if the town even manages to wagon complete the wagon on someone?

Again, I very much hunt for Scum by thinking like one, and if >I< was a CL I'd have looked at the player list as soon as I got my role PM, and once the game started and I saw Cerb was still in it (i.e. didn't replace out because he didn't want to play anymore) I would have submitted my action on him on the spot.

Considering other scenarios though leads me to believe recruitment actions HAVE been submitted already, and Cerb is sure to be -at least- one of the CLs' targets (unless he IS one, but I don't think he is), and the way Varsoon is going about is either really careless town who don't care at all (maybe because they don't know if they're going to be recruited or not// maybe he thinks whatever cult cerb joins will recruit him too next.. maybe..etc), OR Varsoon is na CL (and one who probably submitted the action on Cerb already).

[Almost50]

Virgin count: 14

Would you believe I missed that little note at the end?????????

So, we already had SIX unrecruitable townies and 2 got added, so we now have 8. Assuming we manage to immune someone successfully we would be 9 vs 2 vs 2 by the start of next phase, which is looking GOOD for us all (except the CLs and their victims), with 11 slots available to recruit/immunize. We probably only need to immunize 2 more (on top of the 9) to be guaranteed we outnumber "each" of the cults, and another 2 to guarantee us majority over BOTH combined.

[Varsoon]

I don't get why people are complaining that the plan of running someone up high to lure the recruitment to them and then all unvoting so that our immunisation actually goes through on whoever we target next is such a bad idea. [Snip]

Overall, the whole process is WIFOM.

You answered your own query there, homeboy.

Who do you think wins the WIFOM gambit--2 players who can submit an action at literally any time or those two players mixed into the rest of us, who are openly discussing if we're gonna pull out or not?

It's pointless and, if the game, by design, requires us to use voting exploitation to win, then it's a fool's errand from the start.

[Inferno390]

Virgin count: 14

Would you believe I missed that little note at the end?????????

So, we already had SIX unrecruitable townies and 2 got added, so we now have 8. Assuming we manage to immune someone successfully we would be 9 vs 2 vs 2 by the start of next phase, which is looking GOOD for us all (except the CLs and their victims), with 11 slots available to recruit/immunize. We probably only need to immunize 2 more (on top of the 9) to be guaranteed we outnumber "each" of the cults, and another 2 to guarantee us majority over BOTH combined.

Yeah, see that 's what I'm thinking, and it gives me pause. Like, would a mod really make a game so townsided? I have the feeling that there is some sort of unknown factor out there right now that survivors haven't accounted for yet, or "not virgin" =/= "immune," or somethng along those lines.

If that's not the case, I'm going to be very disapointed, becasue this is going to be a pretty boring game for my first ever Large Themes game.

[Dunkerdoodles]

hi

are we even supposed to scumread people here

like it doesn't do anything

[Dunkerdoodles]

btw i didn't immunize creature

[Dunkerdoodles]

also btw i wasn't unrecruitable before i just lied to see if people would believe me or not

but now i am i guess so thats cool

[Cerberus v666]

A50, you're certainly overestimating my reputation with this playerlist. Perhaps if there were other people here it wold be likely, but I've played with less than half of the people here, and not necessarily in games where I was impressive.

I do agree that any competent cult would have made their recruits as soon as the game started though, making all this discussion likely pointless.

[Almost50]

would a mod really make a game so townsided?

Townsided??!!

OK, let me try to simplify it more: TODAY is our best shot at actually immunizing someone (since -like I mentioned earlier- a Town Power would have to claim before we hammer, and a VT wouldn't.) So, to each town slot we have a 21-2 hitting ion a townie, and 15-2 on hitting a VT. Now since we already have Dunker/Creature excludes, it becomes 19-2 & 13-2; respectively. Hopefully, we won't land on a PR (a roughly 1 out of 3 chance), but even if we do we will have to pick someone else, and the probability will stay almost the same because it's just one person outed.

So, unless we actually run a CL today, we are likely to run a VT. But that's an oversimplification, for we need to account for the recruitment targets as well, so actually it more of a 17-4 & 11-4 as we stand. Still not bad odds.

Assuming we do immunize someone though, and teh cults gain a member each, it becomes harder for us to hit on a townie. We have only excluded 3 (Dunker/Creature, and the one we immunize today ), but ratios have changed significantly overnight. Now there are 2 member to each cult AND a recruitment target to each of them, so 6 out of 21, and another 6 who are our PRs from the start.

Now let's say we ARE successful on D2 too, and so are the CLs. We can exclude 4 and run any of the other 20, BUT there are now 3 members to each cult AND 2 recruitment targets, so that's EIGHT out of the remaining 20, and 6 others are our own PRs, so only 6 VTs remain. If we hypothetically exclude our own PRs (because

they should claim if run

). we are left with 6 Town vs 8 Cult on D3, and none of them i going to claim anything. Town will want to be immunized, and Cults will want to be wagoned to stop it.

Do still see it as a Townsided game?? I mean, at that point you are more likely to run a cultist rather than a townie, and while you don't know it; they do. They already know both their 4 members/targets AND the ones we immunized, and will also know the PRs who claimed.

Now if we have a vig, that one is more likely to execute a TOWNIE at any iven point, and that may even be another PR. S a Vig, while aligned with the Town could very well mess it up for the Town if they shoot at random or by gut reads only. They need direction, which they probably aren't going to get because WE ALL SUCK AT TEAMWORK.

I think it's balanced, pending more details on the roles/abilities and/or the actual final outcome at the end of the game.

[Cerberus v666]

Also, if dunk and creature did not perform their immunization, then it likely means a third party decided they were unlikely to be cult leaders or culted. Meh. I don't think it warrants any more consideration until someone claims what they did and explains it.

[Dunkerdoodles]

i thought there was no town tho?

[Almost50]

making all this discussion likely pointless.

But it's not pointless at all. Even assuming you have a 50% chance of being recruited (the one half of the list that did play with you before), that's a bit too high a probability for my liking to run you for the immunization.

I would rather lose a battle to win the war, and thus am less inclined to take that risk of "racing with the two CLs" to win your allegiance. Instead, I'd settle for someone who is less skilled but more likely to be "won". I'm sacrificing my queen to checkmate with the rock, so to speak.

[Almost50]

i thought there was no town tho?

Stop being lazy. The term is used loosely to describe those of us who have been saved and made it to immunity, either by the nature of their role or by being successfully wagoned.

[Creature]

Maybe we forget that cult may be recruiting someone we're wagoning.