Mini 1993 - Earthbound Mafia: Giygas' Curse - GAME OVER


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Post Post #325 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 11:51 am

Post by Mathdino »

In post 320, InfernoBrafin wrote:In these posts, Math either A) uses our use of the word scummy to assume we scumread him, or B) assumes that when he calls us scummy, people will scumread us even though he admits that most know that's not how he uses the word. It's not consistent, and strikes me as odd.
scummy is literally acting in a way that makes people scumread you

i've played games where all the scummiest players were town

look it's shit like this

that makes it in no way beneficial for me to keep interacting with you

why do you want me to continue filling up pages with a 1v1 against you

i just don't care anymore

like, there's not a single player in this game who's taken your side against me

and you think i've gone silent on your questioning because i'm scum who's afraid of you...?

literally the more i interact with you, the more other people want to vote you
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Post Post #326 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 11:53 am

Post by Mathdino »

In post 324, Carrot and Stick wrote:Yo.

Fair warning: Assemblerotws and I don't have a line of communication yet so I'll need to set that up sooner rather than later, and furthermore, he brought me in frankly at a time I consider too early (one of the reasons he wanted to hydra with me is because he thinks I can be awesome sometimes, but the times I can be awesome are often after D1), so he'll probably end up disappointed in me, but oh well, I did agree.
inb4 assembler brought you in because you're better at scum

is k

i will respect your lack of confidence in your D1 abilities

and not listen to your reads for now :P
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Post Post #327 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 11:55 am

Post by Carrot and Stick »

In post 20, BuJaber wrote:Sup
VOTE: infernobrafin can I vote inferno only?
Nothing against him there's just something.. I don't know. Robotic? About his tone.
I'm skipping RVS. I am outright calling him scummy.
I'll be honest: this is the first poster not in my slot which I have above the null line.

I realize that's four people in a game which is nigh-guaranteed to have only three scum and thus at least one of InfernoBrafin/acryon/LUV/GoldenParadox must be town (not even going into how it doesn't account for players unposted yet in that any of the people not posting by that point could be scum and thus mean more than one in the above is town), but 'tis what it is.
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Post Post #328 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 11:59 am

Post by Mathdino »

In post 313, Almost50 wrote:But seriously, you don't find it awkward for acro to vote a slot he admits to be a lynchbait in his own experience? I'd say that is either bad distancing or bad posturing (i.e. both are scum or acro is scum who tried to look genuine but failed).

:facepalm: The "too scummy to be scum" fallacy". Go it :yawn:

The question is: wouldn't scum!acronym also know it's likely to be seen that way and thus doing it on purpose to be TR'd by someone like you? I mean, acro is no newbie, so things are not as simple and very much WIFOMy at this stage.
1. I always vote lynchbait slots in RVS, and you can verify that. I do it to sort people. Plus it looks more like acryon is trying to policy lynch hydrae there.

2. It's not "too scummy to be scum". It's "lack of caring what other people think of him".

3. No? I mean I'm a pretty different player from the last time I was in a game with acryon, and I'm pretty confident that me from 2014 would've wagoned him for that shit. It's a risky play.
In post 313, Almost50 wrote:How the hell could he "easily get lynched" for something you're calling him TOWN for???

Math: Either you're scum with this guy or this is you from the that game and acro is replacing Jay. Now which is it?
Because I don't represent everyone, and I often (correctly) townread things that other players don't. acryon had no reason to believe I'd defend him.

Granted, the fact that no one's really argued with me over the acryon-town thing is pretty questionable. acryon is better off sorted after a flip IMO.
In post 313, Almost50 wrote:Hmmm... I guess I should go straight into your scum pile then??

OK.. I'm seeing lots of action between Dino and Inferno but I haven't yet seen anything worthy about BuJaber. (Which is what I'm reading the thread for)!!


Also, and if I may say this.. both Dino and Inferno are being ridiculous. It's NAI for me 9as I can't decide if either would have the guts to do what they're doing if they're actually scum. I know Dino IS ballsy, but this is really really stupid and if it leads to a
mislynch
it would immediately backfire on him.
1. No. Your push isn't OMGUSy. Your push on acryon is fine.

2. Yo I didn't intend to spend 4 pages trying to explain the definition of the word "scummy". It would be a lot more helpful here if you could use that shit to come up with a read.

You're gonna have a lot of fun when you see me jumping off the wagon, lol.
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Post Post #329 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:03 pm

Post by Carrot and Stick »

In post 33, Mathdino wrote:the worst is town, or at least not scum with InfBraf. Cheeky scumplay like that isn't his thing I think.
Loosely, this I think I can agree on. It's a bit tentative, but he's the second player who I have north of null. Unfortunately, even though I absolutely should have both you and Momra sorted, no such luck. I also cannot say I really can back anything else.

I'll probably be resorting to a readslist in order to sort players, with the caveat that there's not really much in the way of townreads so much as it is a hierarchy of "these are the players I find least scummy". Which is backwards from my preferred, but better than nothing at all.
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Post Post #330 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:08 pm

Post by Carrot and Stick »

BuJaber
Beefster

The Worst

Iconeum
alban
Kthxbye

InfernoBrafin
Momrangal
TheGoldenParadox
Lil Uzi Vert
Mathdino
acryon

I think I'm somewhere around here as of bottom of 3.
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Post Post #331 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:08 pm

Post by Not_Mafia »

VOTE: Mathdino

Serious vote
Also, what is NM doing? Worst play I’ve ever seen.
I can't remember the last N_M post that wasn't bland, unimaginative and lame. Some shitposters are at least somewhat funny. You are the epitomy of the type of poster that nobody would miss if you were to suddenly disappear. You never add anything of value.
I'm guessing you haven't read the game and probably never will? Why even sign up to play?
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Post Post #332 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:11 pm

Post by Carrot and Stick »

In post 92, Iconeum wrote:Well, seeing how I seem to have slept through the RVS altogether, might as well:
Not liking the discussion between Math and IB regarding the definition of 'scummy'. I'd say I dislike IB the most in that exchange, though I don't know why Math is going through all that trouble to explain. Also not liking the OMGUS behaviour of that hydra.
Beefster, because you read both IB and Math as scummy right now, you believe it's a SvS fight? Thoughts?
VOTE: InfernoBrafin
fp'd about 7 times?
Barely, but I'd call this above null.
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Post Post #333 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:12 pm

Post by Mathdino »

In post 331, Not_Mafia wrote:VOTE: Mathdino

Serious vote
let's 1v1 in lylo bro

solid idea right here
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Post Post #334 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:16 pm

Post by Carrot and Stick »

In post 101, Iconeum wrote:
In post 100, Beefster wrote:If anything IB is the more likely scum.
What makes him more likely scum then math, from your perspective?
Make that strongly to the point of probably strongest.

With the caveat that my "strongest town" is "in any other game this would be weak town". :shifty:

BuJaber's posts that page also increase my townread there, so he's up there with Iconeum.
In post 121, acryon wrote:
In post 33, Mathdino wrote:Edit: Long time no see Marangal, acryon :lol:
I don't think I've ever played on the same team as either of you?
Hey there Dino :) I think you are correct on that.
In post 34, Momrangal wrote:Alllssoooo

Real talk I am already not a fan of acronym.

That slot can legit get lynched
Yikes. I'm usually better with first impressions, but I admit I came on a little strong. Also I'm not "acronym".

I take Mathdino's side on the Math v. Inferno debate. In addition to being wrong, Inferno seems to be getting frustrated very quickly. This isn't necessarily a scumtell, but it does rub me the wrong way.

Icon feels like obvtown.

Gut says Math is town.

@Beefster:

I otherwise seem to like your posts, but this ends up feeling like convenient hedging for you:
1. "Leaning scum [on Mathdino]. His posts feel kinda IIOA-ish"
2. "[Math vs. Inferno is] probably not SvS, so I'm likely wrong on at least one of them. I need to wait and see how things develop.
3. "If anything IB is the more likely scum."

So are you more or less saying here you think Mathdino is likely town?
You know from Math's entrance I kinda had a pet theory that Math-acryon was 2/3 of our scum, but now I flat-out don't need to say it's a pet theory anymore it's just a flat-out working theory at this point because this screams all kinds of red flags for buddy-buddy. Especially having some idea of how Mathblade operates when he's scum.

I don't know the third scum yet but hey, two out of three on D1 isn't half bad I guess.

One sec, need to check where my hydra's vote is at and the votecount.
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Post Post #335 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:18 pm

Post by Carrot and Stick »

Oh our vote's already on acryon. WELL THEN.
I suppose I can revote for emphasis?
VOTE: acryon.
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Post Post #336 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:19 pm

Post by Mathdino »

does mastina also think i'm mathblade

fucking lol

i joined before mathblade jesus christ
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Post Post #337 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:22 pm

Post by Carrot and Stick »

In post 129, Lil Uzi Vert wrote:VOTE: Beefster
Weakly tentatively have a slightly better impression of LUV.

Unfortunately,
In post 130, Momrangal wrote:Ohmaigod
Ok
That dino v infernodra was a head ache to read
FYI
I think the latter is just... Very green and misunderstood the term. TvT
In post 131, Momrangal wrote:Dino, talk to me
How likely is that vote placed out of frustration vs it being placed because of actual opportunistic behavior?
Can't say the same of Momra.

That being said, I agree with the sentiment at this point that InfernoBrafin IS more likely than not town.
In post 141, Momrangal wrote:VOTE: Bujaber
This is a serious vote, and I think this slot should actually get lynched. It feels like he's decided to just piggy back on the hottest topic atm. Possibly to look like he's being active?
In post 142, acryon wrote:
In post 141, Momrangal wrote:VOTE: Bujaber
This is a serious vote, and I think this slot should actually get lynched. It feels like he's decided to just piggy back on the hottest topic atm. Possibly to look like he's being active?
It does feel a bit like that. However, the big paragraph to me pings as town-effort. Not that quantity = town, but I feel like we'd see the effort portrayed differently if he were just trying to get credit for activity.
Momra I wanted you to be town. :cry:
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Post Post #338 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:26 pm

Post by Carrot and Stick »

Iconeum
BuJaber

(notable gap)

Beefster
The Worst

(small gap)

alban/marshy
InfernoBrafin
Kthxbye
Lil Uzi Vert

(rather some gap)

TheGoldenParadox

(big gaping canyon of a gap)

Momrangal
Mathdino
acryon

About this at the end of seven.
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Post Post #339 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:41 pm

Post by Momrangal »

But I am town!

Why is Buju town and what do you make of me having two followers on Buju?

Also how do you feel about how Buju engages me back?
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Post Post #340 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:45 pm

Post by Not_Mafia »

Mathdino is legit scum
Also, what is NM doing? Worst play I’ve ever seen.
I can't remember the last N_M post that wasn't bland, unimaginative and lame. Some shitposters are at least somewhat funny. You are the epitomy of the type of poster that nobody would miss if you were to suddenly disappear. You never add anything of value.
I'm guessing you haven't read the game and probably never will? Why even sign up to play?
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Post Post #341 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:52 pm

Post by Beefster »

In post 307, InfernoBrafin wrote:
In post 188, Beefster wrote:
In post 173, Iconeum wrote:
Spoiler: Beefster's 180
In post 53, Beefster wrote:Yeah. Mathdino's pinging me too. Let's see how this progresses.
In post 95, Beefster wrote:
In post 76, the worst wrote:Beef!! :D

How are you reading Math so far?
Leaning scum. His posts feel kinda IIOA-ish.
In post 123, Beefster wrote:
In post 121, acryon wrote: I otherwise seem to like your posts, but this ends up feeling like convenient hedging for you:
1. "Leaning scum [on Mathdino]. His posts feel kinda IIOA-ish"
2. "[Math vs. Inferno is] probably not SvS, so I'm likely wrong on at least one of them. I need to wait and see how things develop.
3. "If anything IB is the more likely scum."

So are you more or less saying here you think Mathdino is likely town?
If you want to take it that way, sure.

It's too early to tell.
In post 168, Beefster wrote:
In post 78, InfernoBrafin wrote:
Inferno:
I would define them as "not very good at playing mafia."

@Beefster: Which part of this is self-conscious?
After some more in-depth thought, while it's probably normal for hydras to be self-conscious about playstyle, it's another thing entirely to be self-conscious about others' reads on you.

I might be falling prey to confirmation bias here...

I think Mathdino is town because my gut is telling me that the worst is town and that Math and tw are the same alignment.

Momrangal confuses me.


Alright Beefster, what happened that you did a 180 on your MD read?
I changed my mind.
In post 191, InfernoBrafin wrote:
Inferno:

You "changed your mind?"
No, you need to elaborate on this. WHY did you change your mind?
Inferno:


You still haven't responded to this either, Beef.
I have nothing to elaborate on. I felt one way about him at one point. He posted some stuff that made me feel differently, so I changed my mind. It's intuitive gut-read-type stuff. Mathdino's just hard to read I guess.
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Post Post #342 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:53 pm

Post by Carrot and Stick »

In post 193, TheGoldenParadox wrote:Mathdino is town. I will literally quit mafiascum if math is scum here.
I mean.
It's not impossible he's town, but like.

You shouldn't make promises like this without a backup plan in place because it can and will backfire because right now I feel like I'm entering into "spot the scum" mode of a specific type.

Rather.

This is a playerlist which, by and large, if I had to give it a type of playstyle, I'd call, "sub-par". (No offense meant, but Momra, Mathdino, and LUV are the only three players which I'd call skilled-as-town, and LUV is conditional on him playing from a specific mindset.)

One of my initial troubles is that it was a playerlist that, thanks to their type of playstyle, my normal methods of scumhunting were a little out of focus.

Because things that I'd normally hone in on would be invalid in this sort of environment, more or less.

But I think I've managed to adjust it more or less.

In this environment.
Looking for "things which sound town" or "things which look scum" isn't going to work.
I guarantee it, it'll backfire hardcore.

Instead you have to look deeper. I had some difficulties, but I BELIEVE I've recalibrated such that I've now got a fair idea what to hone in on. (For instance, Beefster might be too high on my town list. If I'm wrong on a townread, it's most likely him.)

You have to instead not think "does this look town?" and instead look for "is this actually town?". Mathdino, undeniably, 'looks' town. By which, I mean, he 'sounds' like he is helping the town. But the question to look for is whether what he is saying is actually driven by town. This is the same metric I am rating Momrangal by, and both of them have not only failed it, but have passed (or failed depending on your perspective) the inverse test.

This is not a game where you're going to get a town win by lynching the most scummy players every day.
This game is filled to the brim with players I'd call lynchbait--it'd be ridiculously easy to lead lynch after lynch. So what you look for from scum is basically evidence of the long game. Evidence of taking root to create long-term interactions which keep the slot kicking. Things which are driven by scum.

My accuracy is such that it wouldn't surprise me to be wrong about having the scumteam pegged.
I individually scumread all three and I see associatives from all three which indicate they're the scumteam, but I'm not a scumhunting goddess so I know I can and will be wrong. So sure. Mathdino could in fact be town.

But I really don't think so. Mathdino has set roots. He has set a plan down. I'm not sure if you ask me to do so that I'd be able to walk you through his process of having laid those roots. Especially since I don't know for sure what his scumteam is. (I don't think you're on it for what it's worth. In fact this post alone makes me pretty damn sure you're town.) But what he has done is to establish a presence and set up a long-term goal.

That can come from a town-him, yes. (Which is frankly one of the reasons why it's even possible for him to be town.) But I strongly believe that the way he'd go about it if he were town would be different. That if he were town, his roots, his presence, would be less precise. He's a calculator as either alignment, sure enough, but as town he is still the UNINFORMED, and yet in this game his actions speak of not being uninformed; there's no hint of disarray, of chaos, of divergence, of disorder, and those are signs that even the most precision-based town players would have on D1.

Who he is going after is something that is an artificial process. Instead of feeling like his goal is to find scum, when reading his posts I feel like his goal is to lynch others while not being lynched.

I see the plan in his posts, and I see a scumteam led by him written all over Momrangal and acryon's posts as well. Their interactions have been forced for the sake of interactions, and altogether they have kept each other at the distance where they can do whatever they need--they're distant enough where they can choose to bus, but close enough where they can choose to scumbloc, depending on the need, and this is an interaction that feels entirely calculated.

Frankly the thing which gives me the most doubt about the scumteam is honestly that I wouldn't expect to be competent enough to have nailed it in the first five, six pages. Legit reverse-self-burden-of-proficiency is the closest I can think of for a reason for them to be town.
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Post Post #343 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:55 pm

Post by Carrot and Stick »

Also,
VOTE: Mathblade.
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Post Post #344 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:57 pm

Post by Mathdino »

Mastina have you read a single town game of mine since I came back from 4 years ago?
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Post Post #345 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:59 pm

Post by Carrot and Stick »

In post 211, Mathdino wrote:Also I'm basically down to policy lynch brafin at this point
This alone is a scumclaim from Mathdino.
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Post Post #346 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 1:05 pm

Post by Beefster »

C&S: I think that's a point worth considering and probably explains why I've been waffling on Mathdino. And my initial gut read.

I was pinged by his defense against A50. So guess what? I changed my mind again. :P :shifty:

I'm going to check his ISO and get back to you.
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Post Post #347 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 1:09 pm

Post by Carrot and Stick »

In post 250, Gamma Emerald wrote:
Votecount 1.11(4) InfernoBrafin: acryon, BuJaber, MathDino, the worst
Btw at this stage of the game given that InfernoBrafin is pretty evidently not scum the votes here notably are >random to have 1-2 scum in them.

The reason I'd finger acryon and MathDino specifically is a combination of a few things.
-Slightly Burden of Proficiency, in that while I don't have the highest expectations of BuJaber and certainly have low ones of the worst I hold acryon and MathDino to a higher standard.
-The reasons stated for staying on the wagon/joining in the first place. I vaguely buy The Worst, as town who has a sub-par playstyle (no offense meant but it's literally in your name that you're the worst :P), believes what he does and would join.
BuJaber in his push feels like wrong town in that I can understand why he has gone where he has but I don't think his vote is right.

Yet with acryon and Mathdino, that's absent.
For those two, their reasons for being on the wagon are questionable, at best. They don't resonate with me at all.

And when you pair that with the first, that amplifies things.
NOT ONLY do I expect them to have a higher standard of play, BUT ALSO they have less reasons than the lower-standard-of-play players for staying on that wagon. It's a double-whammy of reasons why they're suspicious-as-fuck.
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Post Post #348 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 1:13 pm

Post by Beefster »

After an ISO, I agree with C&S's MD read.

VOTE: Mathdino
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Post Post #349 (ISO) » Sun Feb 25, 2018 1:15 pm

Post by Mathdino »

I'm just gonna wait until everyone catches up and is in real time before tearing this apart.

I think mastina thinks I'm someone else and is mixing up my playstyle with someone else.

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