Open 556: Fire and Ice (Over)

[Mr Glidder]

Any chance to see scum QTs?

I'm okay with it.

[reinoe]

Well, I had a lot of fun in the short amount of time I was playing this game. :p

You were towning it up and I figured that's why you were shot.

[Moonlight]

Moonlight, if it makes you feel any better, I thought you were so town that I protected you the only night I was here.

That's something. Apparently I'm really easy to read for some, not so much for others.

I wonder if Jasmine protected anyone in the first night.

If I had voted rm instead of you, would you have lynched him, or would you still have advocated the No Lynch?

Nah, the only way I could still win would be to somehow convince you two that it's a good idea to go into the night phase. I kept trying to come up with something, I kept thinking "I need to convince them that I'm Town, and at the same time that the other one will shoot me in the night... how?", so that you might shoot each other.

[Randomnamechange]

Any chance to see scum QTs?

I'm okay with it.

midget played excellently. I wouldn't have pegged him as scum in a million years.

tricky was awful, I don't think anyone can be blamed for lynching him.

NM and Ascended looked town and were town.

Idk looked scummy, had we lynched him instead of baezu we might have had a chance.

worst town performance ever?

You, NM, and Ascended looked too townie to keep alive in my book.

I'm shocked moonlight was town. That's all I'll say about that. A draw is better than a loss. I did have 3/4 of the scum team pegged though. I wouldn't have gotten idk though.

You lost. Scum drew.

If anyone was at fault for this being a draw, it would be me. Night 3 Finglove said he wanted to NK either Glidder or reinoe, and I said reinoe. If we had gone after Glidder instead, this game might've resulted in an Ice victory! Sorry. :/

We went after The_Ascended N1 since they were town-looking, but had minor scum-reads on at least one of us (I think it was me, I forget), Boro N2 since we thought you were scum, and if not, we still be ridding us of a town player who had a scumread on us, reinoe N3 because we thought he was scum, and Glidder N4 because we thought he was scum.

So you totally missed midget's 1065? He wondered if I'm telling the truth, and if he was the last VT he'd know I was lying my ass off.

Yup. Damn.

If I had voted rm instead of you, would you have lynched him, or would you still have advocated the No Lynch?

I swear I killed ascended.

In other news, im putting up my wiki page on Sunday.

[Mr Glidder]

Any chance to see scum QTs?

I'm okay with it.

No dissent, here it comes.

Fire Mafia QT

[Moonlight]

That was pretty fun to read.

I, too, expected midget to be shot in the last night. Like I said, the way he wondered if I'm telling the truth was a huge "Hi, I'm scum!" to everyone. xD

[mastin2]

[A draw.]
How anticlimactic

Yep.

This game deserved no other fate than a draw.

This, too. Though I'd say it's overly-harsh to say no player had any idea who the scum were. For instance, I had all of {Not_Mafia, Baezu, Yuriko/NS, BoroPhil, 4heads/Rach} as fairly solidly scum, and idk as one of my only consistent scumreads. (With tman as one more often than not, too.) Which you can kinda see--

Baezu
Not_Mafia
BoroPhil
randomidget/Moonlight
Moonlight/randomidget (about equally on the town half)
4 Heads of Insanity (honestly, about equal to them, too)
YurikoJasmine
Finglove
Zephyrus
tman2nd
idk
Tr1ckster

Something like this. But it doesn't feel right. Best I have right now, off of my casual catch-up. I'll need to do more later.

Not perfect accuracy. But 2 scum in bottom four, 3rd scum at position five, and the fourth scum at the dead-center of my list.

If I had lived, then Trickster's townflip as I promised would have helped massively with this.

Butyeah. Even if there were moments of town players having it right...for the most part, we didn't. Apathy, confusion, lack of cohesion, bad luck, all rolled up into a bundle-load of mediocrity-at-most as a whole. Frankly, I wouldn't have felt like we'd have deserved a win with how things went, nor would I really feel that any scum faction deserved a win given to them. Draw was the best way it could have ended. (Granted, I really didn't read that much past D1, since there was no dead QT I knew of, so I didn't feel much of an incentive to keep up with a game I could see where it was headed.)

Anyway, post-game is typically where I do my teaching, and while I'm not sure how good it'll be given my knowledge (see above) of the game, I can typically still give a few helpful pointers here and there if you want them.

[mastin2]

*fairly solidly TOWN. >_>
<_<

[Not_Mafia]

Scum seemed to be within a lot of peoples 2-4 slots pretty consistently and from the beginning, but they managed to stay under the radar and stay in those positions in people's reads even after people's number 1 scumread flipped town, another townie seemed to pole vault above the scum in people's reads.

@Moonlight, Mastin will probably have better advice for you, mine would be to calm down a little, even stepping away from the game overnight and sleeping on things if you need to, I meta'd you a little so I know why you had those reactions, not sure how feasible my advice is in relation to that, but that's my 2 cents.

[idk]

I swear I killed ascended.

Er, yeah, sorry. I believe we considered Ascended. Idk haha, I forget.

Anyway, I am currently on mobile (so I can't link), but I have no problem with sharing our QT. I'll post it if Finglove hasn't by the time I get to a computer.

[Moonlight]

@Moonlight, Mastin will probably have better advice for you, mine would be to calm down a little, even stepping away from the game overnight and sleeping on things if you need to, I meta'd you a little so I know why you had those reactions, not sure how feasible my advice is in relation to that, but that's my 2 cents.

Thank you. I'm not sure myself if I'll be able to apply such advice when things get heated in future games, but I'll be damned if I don't try to! =)

Anyway, post-game is typically where I do my teaching, and while I'm not sure how good it'll be given my knowledge (see above) of the game, I can typically still give a few helpful pointers here and there if you want them.

*shyly raises hand*

Here's an example from a past game of mine: I townread a player heavily. Someone chimes in that they disagree with my reasoning and provide their own. This causes me to look at things from a new perspective (while keeping in mind that that player might be trying to manipulate me), resulting in me having a null read on the first player after considering their points. A lynch on another player happens, it's a scum flip, and on D2 I figure out through PoE and an effort to get attention away from the D1 lynch that the player I townread is the lynchee's buddy.

This is why I say many times in my games that the most useful players to me are the ones that disagree with me. I tend to keep tons of possibilities in mind when a game starts, then I tend to focus on the ones I consider most likely while disregarding the rest, which results in tunnel vision.

The question is: how do I know when it's right for me to stop and start from scratch on a read of mine? Is there a way to do this without relying on another player for the fresh and different perspective?

[Randomnamechange]

I'm pretty happy with my performance. I think the majority of players were townreading me for most of the game, but my scumhunting left quite a bit to be desired. I do have one question though: was it best to go for the draw in the end? idk, would you have shot me or moon?

[Randomnamechange]

@Moonlight, Mastin will probably have better advice for you, mine would be to calm down a little, even stepping away from the game overnight and sleeping on things if you need to, I meta'd you a little so I know why you had those reactions, not sure how feasible my advice is in relation to that, but that's my 2 cents.

Thank you. I'm not sure myself if I'll be able to apply such advice when things get heated in future games, but I'll be damned if I don't try to! =)

Anyway, post-game is typically where I do my teaching, and while I'm not sure how good it'll be given my knowledge (see above) of the game, I can typically still give a few helpful pointers here and there if you want them.

*shyly raises hand*

Here's an example from a past game of mine: I townread a player heavily. Someone chimes in that they disagree with my reasoning and provide their own. This causes me to look at things from a new perspective (while keeping in mind that that player might be trying to manipulate me), resulting in me having a null read on the first player after considering their points. A lynch on another player happens, it's a scum flip, and on D2 I figure out through PoE and an effort to get attention away from the D1 lynch that the player I townread is the lynchee's buddy.

This is why I say many times in my games that the most useful players to me are the ones that disagree with me. I tend to keep tons of possibilities in mind when a game starts, then I tend to focus on the ones I consider most likely while disregarding the rest, which results in tunnel vision.

The question is: how do I know when it's right for me to stop and start from scratch on a read of mine? Is there a way to do this without relying on another player for the fresh and different perspective?

You did this with our first game when you went after Tr1cks on Day 3 to be fair. But I guess I'll leave this to the pros.

[idk]

idk, would you have shot me or moon?

Depends if on if I had noticed the post Moon ended up pointing out or not. If I didn't, I probably would've shot Moon. If I reread the day and did notice, you would've been the NK.

[Randomnamechange]

So could have gone either way.

[RachMarie]

BTW I was wondering why I got NKed over stronger players too?

[Randomnamechange]

BTW I was wondering why I got NKed over stronger players too?

We thought you were scum.
Interesting that all players involved in the big argument day 2 were town.

[idk]

http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/dubgFNWJ9jun

(sorry reinoe, really thought you were scum haha)

[reinoe]

http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/dubgFNWJ9jun

(sorry reinoe, really thought you were scum haha)

No need to apologize. I couldn't rehabilitate this slot. Zepheyr was scum regardless of what his actual ROLE PM said.

[Randomnamechange]

BTW I was wondering why I got NKed over stronger players too?

We thought you were scum.
Interesting that all players involved in the big argument day 2 were town.

day 1

[BoroPhil]

BTW I was wondering why I got NKed over stronger players too?

We thought you were scum.
Interesting that all players involved in the big argument day 2 were town.

don't you find that happens so often though? Esp D1 and to a lesser extent D2, you get massive town-on-town arguments while scum sit back. If Tricky had engaged with me he could have convinced me he was town but he just wasn't interested.

[RachMarie]

In my experience most froofroos end up being town versus town. I often get early town reads that way.

[LlamaFluff]

over