Open 737: Stack the Deck (Game Over)

[skitter30]

I didn't use my ability either night

I don't value creature's life over my own

uhhhhhh

what did you think would happen when you claimed?

[Korina]

Also looking at it,

@mod, you said Creature was a VT in the dead list, not an IC.

[ruru]

probably some people would want to policy lynch me or something

[Korina]

Looking at it this way: Ruru certainly gets the NK if she's being truthful, because there's only one person she'd reasonably protect at this point, since she didn't do it in the first place: Alonzo.

However, I don't like the entire "I don't value Creature's life over my own" when it's even better for town to have a dead bg and an IC going into D3 versus the other way around.
Dead bg means IC gets NK'd that night for certain. Nothing can stop that NK.

[Korina]

Ruru, please tell me you are not braindead and that you understand that having a confirmed townie alive is way more important than having a BG alive.
Obviously, when you claim, you get killed, therefore, your maximum potential is to delay a night-kill on another PR.

[skitter30]

I didn't use my ability either night

I don't value creature's life over my own

ok so this is kinda scummy

but a thought-process i can see town!you having

and you probs die tonight anyways so it's not super worth worrying about imo

[skitter30]

i roll vt an insane amount and this is how i end up in lylo most of the time

[ruru]

I view protecting an investigative as higher utility than protecting an ic because the former doesn't actually change who scum have to shoot and the latter gives a result on a null-ish player

not to mention creature wasn't doing anything during the day and so the order people get shot in matters

I would only ever go on creature here if I was widely scumread

[skitter30]

so i'm just going to treat ruru and alonzo as for now town; ruru prob gets nk'd tonight either by play or by protecting alonzo; i'll worry about alonzo after that i think

i'm town

so two scum in {enigma/performer/irrel/bujaber/vex}

going to go here i think for now

VOTE: bujaber

[skitter30]

so, to do:

1. look at original playerlist and see who's most likely to pick the one mod

2. look at what vex argued early game because i dont' remember what his opinion was offhand; only that he believed it strongly; pretty sure he believes in picking all 3 iirc and if that's a thing he probs isn't scum here

3. look at last stack-the-deck and see if town!brass ever said what he'd pick as scum

[ruru]

VOTE: bujaber

[skitter30]

4. reread a50 eod1 because if they only picked the one mod they prob weren't pr hunting; i think he was at least partially nk'd for reads; enigma thinks they were pr hunting to +town to him; unless they really fell for his pr softing but he does that literally every game and isn't like actually pr-indicative for him

[Korina]

I'll save you time on #2: I said that it was unlikely for scum to take all three, however, I thought they'd have certainly taken two: Daytalk and {JOAT, Rolecop}.

Here's the quotes that were relevant:

Actually thanks vex that’s quite useful. I was too lazy to look myself, partly because of what you mentioned about mods not flipping on post 0.

What’s interesting is that it’s 15 games, so from glance of numbers the average no of mods per game is quite low.

roughly about 1.2 mods/game
which is quite interesting in general
if im scum id wanna take around two mods not one

i think scum were very likely to take:
daytalk, joat and rolecop if they took three
i don't think they did, and im 100% sure they did take daytalk meaning for me its between {joat/rc} for scum second mod

[ofrhz]

Also looking at it,

@mod, you said Creature was a VT in the dead list, not an IC.

Fixed

[ofrhz]

VOTE COUNT 3.9

Alonzo (0):

Performer (0):

ruru (1):

Korina

BuJaber (3):

Irrelephant11, skitter30, ruru

(L-2)

Enigma (1):

Performer

Irrelephant11 (0):

skitter30 (0):

Korina (0):

No Kill (0):

Not Voting (3):

Alonzo, Enigma, BuJaber

With

8

alive, it takes

5

to kill.
Day 3 ends in (expired on 2018-10-16 07:30:00)

Other:

- skitter30 V/LA Fridays and Saturdays

[Korina]

Quick thought before I get off for the night:
The only scum-modifier that was reasonably taken if it is one modifier is JOAT.

Recruit Traitor is a waste regardless. Free PR and extra shot for a possible GC, plus added guilty for GC, so that means another modifier needs to be taken with it, unless scum feel like gambling on that.
Daytalk is weak as a modifier on its own, (and in addition to that, if I am scum, and convinced my scumbuddy to take daytalk, I wouldn't have outed myself.)
Bulletproof is really only good at trying to prevent a possible vig, and even then, it's not really worth trying to take a modifier to prevent a 1/6 chance.
Rolecop is only good if scum take two or three mods, because that's 4/9 or 5/9 non-VT feedback chance. 1/3 isn't really worth giving an extra PR for.
JOAT is the only modifier that could reasonably be left if scum took only one modifier since they're getting two separate one-shot abilities for it.

This could also all be circumvented if Ruru/Alonzo is trying to gambit-PR claim.

About that as well, there is exactly a 0% chance of both of them flipping VT. I thought about fake-claiming PR to try to draw the NK onto myself, but then I realized I can't.
- I couldn't claim IC since:
1) Creature was the IC
2) I would've been revealed at the start of D1.
- I couldn't claim BG since I'd have been killed last night, and Creature would've been alive still.
- I couldn't claim Vig since that brings up questions about why I never shot anyone, which if I try to lie on that one, that ends up with a ML.
- I couldn't claim RBer since Alonzo already claimed it.
- I could claim GC, however, that'd mean that whoever I hypo-inno'd would be "town" until I flipped and it was revealed that I was a VT, which, hurts town more than it helps.

UNVOTE: ruru

I'm gonna ISO dive people later.
Until then, have a good day/night you guys.

[Performer]

Isn't there 1 more person who didn't claim?

I seriously don't like that answer from ruru, looks very suspicious.
Bg role is created to protect others, especially prs.
I think this is literally the first time I've ever seen this kind of reasoning and really , really don't like it. I mean, who says they don't want to protect Alonzo at this point with the mass claiming going around? That's the only answer they should give at this point .
At the same time - if she fake claimed, that is next to suicide for scum to do. On top of that, this is basically suicide from what ruru is saying if she is scum...so I'm inclined to think she can't be scum saying such things.

Also why did Creature of all people, claim his IC role on d1 in post 5?? What the!?
This G A I M is messed up.

Anyway, trying to think if it makes sense with 12 - goon, traitor, another scum role, IC, town rb, town bg. Considering the setup features, it actually sounds plausible .

[Korina]

Isn't there 1 more person who didn't claim?

I seriously don't like that answer from ruru, looks very suspicious.
Bg role is created to protect others, especially prs.
I think this is literally the first time I've ever seen this kind of reasoning and really , really don't like it. I mean, who says they don't want to protect Alonzo at this point with the mass claiming going around? That's the only answer they should give at this point .
At the same time - if she fake claimed, that is next to suicide for scum to do. On top of that, this is basically suicide from what ruru is saying if she is scum...so I'm inclined to think she can't be scum saying such things.

Also why did Creature of all people, claim his IC role on d1 in post 5?? What the!?
This G A I M is messed up.

Anyway, trying to think if it makes sense with 12 - goon, traitor, another scum role, IC, town rb, town bg. Considering the setup features, it actually sounds plausible .

He was forced to claim...
He wasn't the "I can reveal whenever I want" IC, he was the "You are revealed at the start of D1" IC
I also have thoughts about this post that I wanna bring up, but I need to sleep. I'll do it when I get up.

[Korina]

Also, everyone claimed:

Alonzo - RBer
Ruru - BG
Preformer, Skitter, Korina, Buj, Irrel, Enigma - VT

[Performer]

VOTE: bujaber

I'm finding it very challenging to trust your thought processes , ruru, after saying you didn't bg on 2 nights & that you'll die over another pr. Why would you suspect there would be an investigative to protect? What if there wasn't??

So with that said, I want to hear why you're voting bujaber.
-----------
@korina ok

[Performer]

I would like everyone to get on the enigma wagon please. I don't see my vote moving off him this phase.

[ruru]

Why would you suspect there would be an investigative to protect? What if there wasn't??

I consider dying for creature negative utility, period, because I don't get mislynched either and he wasn't playing the game

it's not about saving my bg ability it's about not dying for a player who isn't doing anything.

[ruru]

so, I still think bujaber is scum

bujaber is regularly a highposter as town and even excluding the replacement and v/la timings his posts per day are just lower than expected and it feels like he's not really doing much

despite this, other people who also weren't doing much (gamma/enigma) had much more shade thrown on them which makes me think it's a scum agenda thing.

oh, and I guess gamma also attempted to cfd bujaber d1 so there's that

Spoiler:

Can't blame skitter for just sheeping.

Took a long time for y'all to see it.
VOTE: gamma
L-1

this is a scummy post

the bolded doesn't sound like town talking to a scumread

I feel like tw should be easier to townread by now. I'm getting paranoid because imo his strength lies in knowing how to not appear scummy moreso than trying to look townie. That's my impression from giyga's curse. He won because people didn't really have a reason to suspect him.

this post is dubious

I guess something along these lines:

{Creature, me}
{Vex}
{A50, skitter}
{Ruru, TW}
-----null line----
{Gamma, cjv}
{Enigma}
{HWS, Frank}

Lol who puts themselves in their own readlist

Did I hit a nerve?

this feels like an over-acted response, he had also called enigma a policy lynch iirc and enigma's post isn't scummy at all

it reminds me of some of the fake scumhunting I did as scum where I just threw shade on things in a way that isn't useful to sorting people

[ruru]

enigma probably isn't getting lynched without either {alonzo redflip, any groupscum flip} because of alonzo's inno

bujaber is very likely flipping scum and I don't think we should lynch anyone with less chance of being scum because rb gets a lot more useful with only one scum remaining

bujaber green -> TILT
bujaber group -> re-eval enigma
irrel red -> re-eval alonzo (based on hws's weird d1 associative with gamma+frank)
bujaber group, irrel green-> re-eval performer? (based on lol can't talk about it haha xd!)

something like this?

[ruru]

actually I don't want to lynch bujaber yet

I want to drag out the day for more content from performer

UNVOTE: