Newbie 2038: Elements [Game Over]

[Umlaut]

Vote Count 2.1

Silicon, ₁₄Si

— metalloid, standard atomic weight 28.085, group 14, period 3, p-block

Egix96

(1): c4e5g3d5

muh316

(1): safebet222

Not voting

(6): JDye, Mizzytastic, cylstar, 72offsuit, muh316, Egix96

With 8 alive, it takes 5 votes to eliminate.

Deadline:

(expired on 2020-11-15 02:50:00)

[muh316]

These last 2 posts were just parroting me. I don't like it.

Parroting you? It's common knowledge that there's scum on a town wagon. You didn't provide any insightful analysis for me to parrot there.

[muh316]

I said off of APig's wagon. You were off the APig wagon too... you could still be scum.

Though we'll probably want to analyze the AGP wagon a bit more to see how it developed and how it was being pushed D1.

You want to look off the wagon and I want to look on the wagon. My thoughts are independent of what you posted

[72offsuit]

Happy cakeday muh

[72offsuit]

I might not post for the rest of the day, so:
Regarding my supposed experience, irl mafia has a lot of differences. for one, people don't have records of everything people say, and the 'loud' people tend to dominate the conversation. I've only really played these games with people I know pretty well. I also never said I was good at irl mafia. Scumhunting is even harder and my only strategy as mafia is to lurk.

72 being so accusatory is weird, but I don't know what to attribute it to. But it's good how they are trying to raise activity levels, I guess

I definitely felt like people were voting muh for only one small reason (their evading the question) which made me suspect people were jumping on the 'easy' wagon. This sort of reasoning will probably lead me to WIFOM but...
I've got to go back and reread what made mizzy and 72 vote Pig

cyl, scum arent going to put their hand up and admit they r scum.

The best way to find scum is to pressure and accuse. If you like their response, perhaps your intitial read is wrong, and they are in fact town.
Perhaps they become nervous, make a few posts that are suggestive of a scum mindest - Survivalism, inconsistency.

Furthermore, by pushing someone, you force others to take a stance on the player pushing, as well as the player being pushed.
This creates further alignment indicative behaviour. Does player X join the wagon? Defend the player being pushed? Scumread the player pushing?

No offence, but if we all shrug and say, hmm that behaviour is weird, but i dont know what it means, town gets nowhere.

If I was scum I would sit back and just be middle of the road - make a light push, without ruffling any feathers.
There is literally ZERO incentive for !Scumme to be active in this game.

Sure, you can take this with a grain of salt, and it could be wifom yadda yadda yadda.
But that;s just how it is. 15 pages of mostly apathy.

[72offsuit]

Mafia might choose to no kill gambit but I doubt it. Pretty sure setup is designed to disincentivise that but someone might try to be clever. If they have it probably benefits us anyway.

You can forget but with two players and probably a mod reminder at 24 hours I doubt it.

Assuming neither of those weird situations...


Doc, you know a member of the town, you shouldn't share it today unless you have to claim, enjoy the free read

JK, you know someone is either town or the attempted killer, you shouldn't share either, but hopefully the polarised position helps your read


Now, unless someone wants to disagree with me about the above from a mech perspective can we quietly celebrate our good fortune and stop taking about power roles?

I shall now return to trying to sleep

I agree with Mizzy. If there is a Doc they shouldnt claim today and can consider claiming tomorrow if needed/deemed useful.

[72offsuit]

Jailed players are slightly more likely to be scum who attempted a kill, rather than town who were targeted.

[Egix96]

I'm also leaning scum for egix, especially because of his last post.

I think we should look off the wagon, and maybe 72. I haven't made up my mind for 72 yet. I find muh to be sort of town now.

What about my last post?

[Egix96]

I might not post for the rest of the day, so:
Regarding my supposed experience, irl mafia has a lot of differences. for one, people don't have records of everything people say, and the 'loud' people tend to dominate the conversation. I've only really played these games with people I know pretty well. I also never said I was good at irl mafia. Scumhunting is even harder and my only strategy as mafia is to lurk.

72 being so accusatory is weird, but I don't know what to attribute it to. But it's good how they are trying to raise activity levels, I guess

I definitely felt like people were voting muh for only one small reason (their evading the question) which made me suspect people were jumping on the 'easy' wagon. This sort of reasoning will probably lead me to WIFOM but...
I've got to go back and reread what made mizzy and 72 vote Pig

cyl, scum arent going to put their hand up and admit they r scum.

The best way to find scum is to pressure and accuse. If you like their response, perhaps your intitial read is wrong, and they are in fact town.
Perhaps they become nervous, make a few posts that are suggestive of a scum mindest - Survivalism, inconsistency.

Furthermore, by pushing someone, you force others to take a stance on the player pushing, as well as the player being pushed.
This creates further alignment indicative behaviour. Does player X join the wagon? Defend the player being pushed? Scumread the player pushing?

No offence, but if we all shrug and say, hmm that behaviour is weird, but i dont know what it means, town gets nowhere.

If I was scum I would sit back and just be middle of the road - make a light push, without ruffling any feathers.
There is literally ZERO incentive for !Scumme to be active in this game.

Sure, you can take this with a grain of salt, and it could be wifom yadda yadda yadda.
But that;s just how it is. 15 pages of mostly apathy.

She isn't really calling you scum though, so I don't get why you're flipping out here.

[Egix96]

VOTE: cylstar

Let's try this again, shall we?
Her coming in with such a noncommittal post in 340 gives me the impression that she stopped trying as soon as she thought she wasn't going to survive the game.

FoSes:

c4e5 - it's really bugging me that he asked muh to claim prematurely, because it seems like rolefishing.

72off - his push on JDye felt ungenuine because I think that JD's catchup was fairly obvtown and it seemed like 72 was specifically trying to sow dissent - going in with the preconceived notion that JD "must" be scum rather than actually aiming to sort him.

[c4e5g3d5]

Also, do you want to explain why you were pushing me for a claim when there was no intent to hammer on me?

I've been on the receiving end of a CFD as a PR without time to claim. Don't want to replicate that when it wouldn't even have been a CFD in your case. MS seems to be more careful around giving time to claim, though.

[Umlaut]

Mizzytastic was prodded.

There was an error in the countdown timer in the last two vote counts, which has been corrected. The sun will set in (expired on 2020-11-15 02:50:00).

[safebet222]

Out of the folks not on the AGP wagon, I think we should flip Muh. He's not lurking... he's posted more than a bunch of you all. He simply is not contributing... except for post #311, he's not really given us anything useful for town. And even that post wasn't very helpful. The whole game all he's done is give us a couple of scumlists and a few comments. These last 2 posts were just parroting me. I don't like it.

VOTE: muh316

Wasn't 72 your top wagon, and I was the neutral one? What happened with 72 that he's no longer a candidate for elimination?

Who says he's not still on my scumlist? I am sorting you out right now. Stop deflecting.

[safebet222]

These last 2 posts were just parroting me. I don't like it.

Parroting you? It's common knowledge that there's scum on a town wagon. You didn't provide any insightful analysis for me to parrot there.

Yeah... Probably not the best choice of words... I didn't like the fact you took my comment of looking off the AGP wagon for scum as looking for scum on your wagon... Again, you could be scum yourself.

[safebet222]

I said off of APig's wagon. You were off the APig wagon too... you could still be scum.

Though we'll probably want to analyze the AGP wagon a bit more to see how it developed and how it was being pushed D1.

You want to look off the wagon and I want to look on the wagon. My thoughts are independent of what you posted

Fine... My main point still stands.

He's not lurking... he's posted more than a bunch of you all. He simply is not contributing... except for post #311, he's not really given us anything useful for town. And even that post wasn't very helpful. The whole game all he's done is give us a couple of scumlists and a few comments.

[safebet222]

@muh BTW... Have a great day! Beautiful weather in our fair city... Enjoy your birthday!

[Mizzytastic]

Sorry about the prod, bit of a mental health crisis here this last week but I'll try and push through. I can respond to stuff as it bugs me fine but I don't have a great holistic feel of the game state.

Something game relevant so it is a valid prod response incase I pass out...

This turned into more of a post than I intended...

@72 Why is a jk more likely to have hit the killer than the target? Surely it'd be dependent on the jk's intent?

@c4 Still haven't answered my questions from yesterday. I'll make it easy for you and repost them so you don't have to go digging

Do you think me and egix are scummy for our treatment of cyl or just bad sports playing a newbie game that way?
If you think it's scummy do you think we make sense as a team with the strategy of being votes 1 and 2 on that wagon for very similar reasons?
If I am scum do you think my leaving LHFtown!cyl to join what turned out to be LHF town Pig at that time makes any sense as scum beyond the WIFOM scum!me is getting from asking these questions? If I don't leave there I think cyl has really good equity for being the wagon that goes through.

Also DADV was true cos Pig is dead, we know that now. Though hardly deader air than the rest of the game. muh wasn't the leading wagon

[Mizzytastic]

Egix is the sort of player I find super frustrating to read. I know this is in his town range from another game, I know that he gets pressure for it (up to and including leading wagon - can't remember if he got miselimed that game) as town and considering 40ish games played probably isn't changing any time soon. I also understand why he get seen as scummy and that scum can benefit from his playstyle. I guess he's just a good case of why what you are looking for with scumhunting is intent.

Don't really have any good ideas though, just frustration

[JDye]

@72

, Are you ever going to answer the questions I asked you in 320. Particularly interested in number 2 since that was a huge reach.

Wrt Cyl

, I'm getting a stronger scum-read on her the longer the game goes on. Not just based on the inactivity but also on what she says (or rather, what she doesn't say). Seems to be trying to get by without doing any scumhunting. I'm getting a weird feeling from her 361 and 362. Can't put my finger on it. I'll explain when I can.

I'm thinking it's a pretty safe bet that we have at least one mafia off the APig wagon... probably gonna concentrate my efforts there first today. Anybody care to disagree?

@Safebet

, why off the Wagon?

[Mizzytastic]

Also, something that is bugging me but I dunno how to turn into scumhunting. From other town perspectives I should be one of the grosser votes on Pig. Middle is often where scum join from a VCA perspective, I showed some interest in moving off cyl cos it was an early vote intended to sort, but I didn't show my working on Pig before joining. I know I'm struggling to keep up with the game, was having some icky thoughts about Pig that I hadn't voiced super well and liked 72s case but you lot don't.

I just feel like someone should be giving me flack for it but I'm not sure what to make of the fact I'm not.

@JDye wrt cyl - because she's supposedly checked out from the game in apathy but the night action results have piqued her interest. Also floating mafia forgetting is kinda gross in general (it does happen occasionally but still...) but

that

is the sort of thing I am more willing to let go in a newbie game. If it is scum!cyl I would not be surprised in the slightest to learn that the scum cut it fine with getting their choice in last night tho.

[safebet222]

@Safebet

, why off the Wagon?

Just not putting all my eggs in one basket... I think we have one scum on and one scum off the AGP wagon...

Besides, I already had a muh/72 scumteam in the back of my head.

[Mizzytastic]

I'm also leaning scum for egix, especially because of his last post.

I think we should look off the wagon, and maybe 72. I haven't made up my mind for 72 yet. I find muh to be sort of town now.

Can we get a more detailed why on any of those?

Also, what happened in between muh being your strongest scum read (reason being that refusing to answer that question was anti-town) after you lost your tone read on Pig to feeling like the people voting muh for refusing to answer that question were joining an easy wagon? Is that the only reason you didn't move from Pig to muh when your read on Pig faded? And what makes him sort of town now?

[c4e5g3d5]

@c4 Still haven't answered my questions from yesterday. I'll make it easy for you and repost them so you don't have to go digging

Do you think me and egix are scummy for our treatment of cyl or just bad sports playing a newbie game that way?

A bit of both.

If you think it's scummy do you think we make sense as a team with the strategy of being votes 1 and 2 on that wagon for very similar reasons?

You don't really have much significant in the way of interactions, but I'm highly doubtful that you would coordinate jumping on cyl or anything similar. Not team-indicative, just two people doing a scummy thing.

If I am scum do you think my leaving LHFtown!cyl to join what turned out to be LHF town Pig at that time makes any sense as scum beyond the WIFOM scum!me is getting from asking these questions? If I don't leave there I think cyl has really good equity for being the wagon that goes through.

It could imply you're w/w with muh, but otherwise, it's a pretty game-neutral move.

[safebet222]

I find muh to be sort of town now.

Care to elaborate on that, cyl?

[Umlaut]

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