In post 475, BNL wrote:I haven't been paying much attention to him this game, so I am currently null on him. I retract my scumpoint on him for the perceived self-contradiction, as I realised I failed to see the context of the quote.
This pings me - how could you have been null on Ari who has been the leading wagon and focus for most of the game?
"I think I no longer believe in monsters as faces in the floor or feral infants or vampires or whatever. I think at seventeen now I believe the only real monsters might be the type of liar where there's simply no way to tell. The ones who give nothing away"
In post 481, BNL wrote:Also, Postie and GL, can you explain your Cow townread? Currently having him as null, don't see anything that makes him town.
I like the way that he went about pushing Ari on his misrep of claiming that you voted him. He picked up on something that could be indicative, but instead of using it to push a case on Ari, he instead poked at Ari to see if he would catch his mistake or explain it well. That read pretty town to me.
"I think I no longer believe in monsters as faces in the floor or feral infants or vampires or whatever. I think at seventeen now I believe the only real monsters might be the type of liar where there's simply no way to tell. The ones who give nothing away"
And frankly it's not just the stuff that she does it's the stuff that she isn't doing.
even in 1664 when I was scumreading her I had like a gut thing that I wasn't sure about that prevented me from lynching her and caused me to unvote her.
There's none of that here and if my gut's saying anything here it's to lynch her.
As for Lane, I think his scum game is like, extremely ridiculously underwhelming.
I'm fairly sure he's town here just on account of that because he's made some ridiculously towny posts, not that I agree with all of his positions.
I really like the way he's responding to Postie in particular and he's got a sort of confidence about it that feels ridiculously townie here, and the 'rc will avenge me' line is both hilarious and strikes me as almost definitely coming from a town mindset; I don't see scum!Lane trying to appeal to Town!Postie's self preservation there when she's made little effort to keep herself safe this game. That feels way more like Lane feeling confident that no matter what happens around his wagon that Postie's going to get lynched anyway and drawing comfort from it if that makes sense.
GL, can you take a look at my case on Postie please?
I'm like, dead certain that she's scum here.
In post 531, Aristophanes wrote:H&H, I have to read Dat big post still, but while I do, can you explain what you mean by "what she's not doing" please? That made no sense to me.
let me think on it for tonight, I'm getting tired and we're not in a deadline rush yet.
"I think I no longer believe in monsters as faces in the floor or feral infants or vampires or whatever. I think at seventeen now I believe the only real monsters might be the type of liar where there's simply no way to tell. The ones who give nothing away"
So, I read it, and I do find it odd she hasn't got me in that list of people she's called scum. Also the recent argument with Lane was...distracting I guess.
Possible TvT though so iunno. I have to reread it.
Also, if I live, I'll be wasting a cop check regardless I'm sure.
So that point is meh.
Also also, if the cop gets a scum positive at some point, reveal it please!
A 1 for 1 tradeoff is aight with these numbers.
In post 524, Halos and Horns wrote:The last few pages in particular have been so ridiculously scum!Postie that it blows my mind. Just a few examples
I like this wagon a lot.
Town!Postie every time I've seen her has been a lot shier from confrontation. In the original Slavic Music, when I started pushing on her she backed off really hard. In 1664 when we were fighting she kept trying to give me opportunities to show that I was town (which wasn't what I wanted at the time but we eventually townread each other so I digress.) I'm not quite sure what her scum response to pressure would be but this is absolutely not what I've seen from her as town. And I don't mean to portray her as a wallflower but this response is just incredibly jarring.
Then you may want to read my first game on site. I've obviously changed a bit since then but it's not too long ago and I think it'll help here. I deathtunneled scum day 1 and the post you quoted pretty much summaries my entire attitude whilst it was happening.
In post 524, Halos and Horns wrote:Lane's scumreading a lot of people, maybe, but Lane's stances have been extremely clear since he replaced into the game and in fact they precluded a Cow lynch, who as possibly the easiest mislynch of all time is not someone I would expect someone to come in declaring a townread on.
I don't remember him declaring a townread on TheCow until recently. He seemed pretty on the fence to me at the beginning of the game.
In post 524, Halos and Horns wrote:And he hasn't called 5 out of 9 people scum, he's indicated a townread on the rest of them. Like where does that interpretation even come from?
See 504. Maybe he didn't outright call all of them scum, but the ones where he didn't straight-up say "this is scum", it definitely looks like he thought they were scummy or was trying to cast some serious shade on them.
In post 524, Halos and Horns wrote:Notice that Postie here is entirely backing off from her Aristo read, which she ended up voting twice for long periods during this game but is now declaring as never having been a scumread without substantiating any reasons. 'because I thought they would help me progress my reads' what?
I misread the "why does it matter?" as "does it matter?" oops.
It matters because it looks like you're trying to look busy without actually engaging properly. You're being superficial.
AT THE VERY LEAST this post indicates a scumread that she's entirely 180ing on.
I may have swung a little one way or the other on Aristo during the course of the game, but he was always various degrees of null. Which is why I voted him. To try and get him out of my null zone.
In post 524, Halos and Horns wrote:And this entire 'oh but I would have had my partner bus me!' argument just plain stinks.
She declared that before this game even started. I believe in the last game's thread, after the cop guiltied her? If Postie was a D1 lynch led by anyone besides me I would immediately get incredibly fucking suspicious and demand cop checks on the early voters and the major pushers. Like it just plain doesn't make sense to use that argument. She declared to half of the people present in this game that she would ask her partner to bus her. It doesn't even make remote sense for her to actually have herself bussed when it's going to literally buy the opposite of towncred for her partner. Make herself scummy intentionally to frame the people on her wagon, maybe;
but no one besides us is really pushing her.
Like it's patent nonsense.
Eh, fair enough. Maybe I'd have thought it through better if I were actually scum.
In post 524, Halos and Horns wrote:Doesn't help that she's jumped on literally every single wagon that's gained any traction today, which is scummy as fuck,
I was leading those wagons
- I didn't jump on them at all! The wagons gained traction because of the people who followed me onto them.
In post 524, Halos and Horns wrote:that she called out every L-1 besides Aristo's, which is scummy as fuck as well, etc.
I was scumreading BNL when he was L-1'd, which is why I didn't immediately unvote like I did on other wagons where I wasn't scumreading the person being wagoned. And I did make a "L-1" post to make sure we didn't get a derphammer or scum quickhammer disguised as a derphammer.
In post 534, Aristophanes wrote:Also also, if the cop gets a scum positive at some point, reveal it please!
A 1 for 1 tradeoff is aight with these numbers.
No, the cop should really see if they can get away with pushing a lynch through on their guilty without claiming first; if that doesn't work,
In post 534, Aristophanes wrote:Also also, if the cop gets a scum positive at some point, reveal it please!
A 1 for 1 tradeoff is aight with these numbers.
No, the cop should really see if they can get away with pushing a lynch through on their guilty without claiming first; if that doesn't work,
In post 535, Postie wrote:Then you may want to read my first game on site. I've obviously changed a bit since then but it's not too long ago and I think it'll help here. I deathtunneled scum day 1 and the post you quoted pretty much summaries my entire attitude whilst it was happening.
Also note that I was incredibly confbiased during that game, so I do need to reevaluate my read on lane in case I'm letting too much of that creep in here. That's probably why my attitude towards you in pisskop's game was different when I was tunneling you; I started realising there was confirmation bias involved, as well as paranoia because I saw you'd won all your scum games and I had no idea how to read you.
In post 528, Halos and Horns wrote:As for Lane, I think his scum game is like, extremely ridiculously underwhelming.
I'm fairly sure he's town here just on account of that because he's made some ridiculously towny posts, not that I agree with all of his positions.
Can you go into more detail on this? Quote some posts at me?
In post 528, Halos and Horns wrote:I really like the way he's responding to Postie in particular and he's got a sort of confidence about it that feels ridiculously townie here, and the 'rc will avenge me' line is both hilarious and strikes me as almost definitely coming from a town mindset; I don't see scum!Lane trying to appeal to Town!Postie's self preservation there when she's made little effort to keep herself safe this game. That feels way more like Lane feeling confident that no matter what happens around his wagon that Postie's going to get lynched anyway and drawing comfort from it if that makes sense.
Why does the "RC will avenge me" line have to have some kind of agenda if it comes from scum? If anything, the phrase is inconsistent with the fact that I'm not in his scumreads. Why would he draw comfort from knowing I'll be lynched if he doesn't think I'm scum?
It's weird, I had a townlean on her before but now I really think she's town - I'm not getting the uneasy feel that resulting in me inspecting her in Word Sneak 1.
H&H narrowing down their options to literally one vote when we're not even halfway to the deadline is probably one of the stupidest things I've ever seen, so that's probably town too.
So yeah we've been talking on skype and I'm not liking postie anymore:
Spoiler:
In post 504, Postie wrote:I'm starting to see what was being said about lane casting shade on so many people...
Davsto:
In post 234, lane0168 wrote:Sword never picked up the role pm... You, my fine fellow, are making assumptions that can be verified, yet you don't bother to check into them, you just throw them out there as truth. And that is scummy
In post 242, lane0168 wrote:Uhhh... No. You said it right before you said my post was shallow and safe. Which was right before you said I was scum... You were implying they flaked because they were scum. You are pulling it out from wherever you can.
Then you didn't look very hard, or even care to question it. Cause it doesn't matter to scum, like you.
Aristophanes:
In post 265, lane0168 wrote:I think I'm starting to lean scum on Ari than davsto.
He asked for peoples reads much more than hes given any of his own, Postie town, Davsto scum.
Posted a whole bunch of filler. Like a whole heap.
I think he knew scum can't talk about their words, and his reaction when he "found out" seems genuinely fake. Oh really? Wow! Good job aero!
And I really don't like if my town flip helps coo. Feigning indifference if you ask me.
In post 52, Aristophanes wrote:Also, town, don't forget that scum can share their lists, so they already have the upper hand on us with regards to the double vote.
In post 279, GuiltyLion wrote:His reasons for scumreading Ari feel textbook and fake
Lol that reason could also fell textbook and fake...
In post 299, lane0168 wrote:It makes you a sub par scum hunter mostly, and possible scum, considering what you say I'm doing, is wrong.
In post 302, lane0168 wrote:So who do you think is scummier? Someone who uses fakeness as part of their case (me) or someone who uses fakeness as their entire case (you)
BNL:
In post 374, lane0168 wrote:Alright... What I wanted to say before but refrained from saying is that I really didn't like Bnl's post AT ALL. I'm amazed at the audacity to snip that sentence and play it off as a major scum slip. I was hoping he was going to be watching for a reaction, but it appears he just dropped it off and left.
VOTE: bnl
In post 474, lane0168 wrote:It was an obvious joke, you edited it to make it look scummy. Stop lying.
Me:
In post 469, lane0168 wrote:Postie, again doesn't like a wagon that might actually go to lynch... Don't like all the hopping off wagons.
Rc, you may have been right about Postie, and now theyre just hopping off so they can say see? I did it with bnl too. Possibly.
Postie, why do you get off every wagon that gets momentum? I'm starting to get the feeling you don't actually believe in any of the wagons you have been on and are just trying to look town. If you believed in even one of them, you would have stayed on it
In post 461, Postie wrote:Actually the amount of support for the BNL lynch is concerning. I think every single person except H&H, TheCow, and Flubber has pushed the wagon. I'm townreading H&H and TheCow, so that leaves BNL/Flubber as the only likely scumteam if BNL is scum - but then, why not lynch Flubber since he's going to be harder to read?
UNVOTE:
Wtf? You want to make your scum team now, and one of them has momentum, but you want to lynch the other one because they're harder to read, so you unvote, but don't put your vote anywhere else? Wtf? That's all sorts of crap
lane, you've called more than half the player list scum or possible scum now. And you've not given a single townread so far.
WTF.
This whole post is just pointing out that lane made pushes on 5 different people, but she's pushed aristo, davsto, BNL, and lane. We're playing mafia, our reads are never going to be set in stone and hers haven't been either so why do lane's have to be? I think this is really hypocritical of her to call lane out for.
In post 514, Postie wrote:It's also pretty convenient for you that the only people you haven't called scum are those that have supported getting the people you want lynched lynched.
Please Postie. Tell me if this is a scum tell or town tell. Right now. Tell me why town wouldn't support other people scum reading their scum reads.
Please reply to this post on its own
Sure, town would support other people scumreading their scumreads, but when the sole basis for whether someone is scum or not depends on whether they're backing you up then that's a problem.
The only people you haven't called scum are H&H, TheCow, and Flubber.
In post 215, lane0168 wrote:I am with flubber about being wary on gl's play here.
In post 414, lane0168 wrote:Just chill rc, we're friends for once. I'm feeling this out and kinda might be in your side for once
In post 486, TheCow wrote:Marbles and toastie is my lynch pool. I'd compromise for one of my leans, but I'd rather we lynch
scum
.
Who incidentally also happen to be supporting your positions in a way that's really convenient for you.
That's a little sus.
I feel like she is deliberately misrepping lane here by implying that he is only townreading the people who support his positions. Lane's been defending Ari with his push on BNL, we've been pushing Ari while defending BNL. RC says this kind of aggressiveness is really uncharacteristic of postie as well, I'm not familiar enough with her play to say one way or the other but I trust his read on her more than I do my own.
In post 461, Postie wrote:Actually the amount of support for the BNL lynch is concerning. I think every single person except H&H, TheCow, and Flubber has pushed the wagon. I'm townreading H&H and TheCow, so that leaves BNL/Flubber as the only likely scumteam if BNL is scum - but then, why not lynch Flubber since he's going to be harder to read?
UNVOTE:
I'm really not understanding this logic either, Postie is entirely leaving out the possibility of bussing, which in a cop setup is probably pretty important. Initially I liked the fact that she unvoted at the same time that I voiced my concerns about the speed of the wagon, but looking more closely at her reason for unvoting is making me think twice.
I think RC is at the point where he's not going to respond to you or aristo a lot anymore. I'll try to respond to your points tomorrow but I'm not sure I can articulate everything properly.
In post 545, Halos and Horns wrote:I'm really not understanding this logic either, Postie is entirely leaving out the possibility of bussing, which in a cop setup is probably pretty important.
Really? I know that in a setup with two scum and a cop I'd try and avoid bussing as much as possible because otherwise you'd get boned. See what happened to Postie in Word Sneak 1 - she decided to bus Wednesday when she may not have been lynched otherwise, so the cop result was a loss rather than just a knock.
In post 545, Halos and Horns wrote:So yeah we've been talking on skype and I'm not liking postie anymore:
Spoiler:
In post 504, Postie wrote:I'm starting to see what was being said about lane casting shade on so many people...
Davsto:
In post 234, lane0168 wrote:Sword never picked up the role pm... You, my fine fellow, are making assumptions that can be verified, yet you don't bother to check into them, you just throw them out there as truth. And that is scummy
In post 242, lane0168 wrote:Uhhh... No. You said it right before you said my post was shallow and safe. Which was right before you said I was scum... You were implying they flaked because they were scum. You are pulling it out from wherever you can.
Then you didn't look very hard, or even care to question it. Cause it doesn't matter to scum, like you.
Aristophanes:
In post 265, lane0168 wrote:I think I'm starting to lean scum on Ari than davsto.
He asked for peoples reads much more than hes given any of his own, Postie town, Davsto scum.
Posted a whole bunch of filler. Like a whole heap.
I think he knew scum can't talk about their words, and his reaction when he "found out" seems genuinely fake. Oh really? Wow! Good job aero!
And I really don't like if my town flip helps coo. Feigning indifference if you ask me.
In post 52, Aristophanes wrote:Also, town, don't forget that scum can share their lists, so they already have the upper hand on us with regards to the double vote.
In post 279, GuiltyLion wrote:His reasons for scumreading Ari feel textbook and fake
Lol that reason could also fell textbook and fake...
In post 299, lane0168 wrote:It makes you a sub par scum hunter mostly, and possible scum, considering what you say I'm doing, is wrong.
In post 302, lane0168 wrote:So who do you think is scummier? Someone who uses fakeness as part of their case (me) or someone who uses fakeness as their entire case (you)
BNL:
In post 374, lane0168 wrote:Alright... What I wanted to say before but refrained from saying is that I really didn't like Bnl's post AT ALL. I'm amazed at the audacity to snip that sentence and play it off as a major scum slip. I was hoping he was going to be watching for a reaction, but it appears he just dropped it off and left.
VOTE: bnl
In post 474, lane0168 wrote:It was an obvious joke, you edited it to make it look scummy. Stop lying.
Me:
In post 469, lane0168 wrote:Postie, again doesn't like a wagon that might actually go to lynch... Don't like all the hopping off wagons.
Rc, you may have been right about Postie, and now theyre just hopping off so they can say see? I did it with bnl too. Possibly.
Postie, why do you get off every wagon that gets momentum? I'm starting to get the feeling you don't actually believe in any of the wagons you have been on and are just trying to look town. If you believed in even one of them, you would have stayed on it
In post 461, Postie wrote:Actually the amount of support for the BNL lynch is concerning. I think every single person except H&H, TheCow, and Flubber has pushed the wagon. I'm townreading H&H and TheCow, so that leaves BNL/Flubber as the only likely scumteam if BNL is scum - but then, why not lynch Flubber since he's going to be harder to read?
UNVOTE:
Wtf? You want to make your scum team now, and one of them has momentum, but you want to lynch the other one because they're harder to read, so you unvote, but don't put your vote anywhere else? Wtf? That's all sorts of crap
lane, you've called more than half the player list scum or possible scum now. And you've not given a single townread so far.
WTF.
This whole post is just pointing out that lane made pushes on 5 different people, but she's pushed aristo, davsto, BNL, and lane. We're playing mafia, our reads are never going to be set in stone and hers haven't been either so why do lane's have to be? I think this is really hypocritical of her to call lane out for.
I think there's a big difference between what me and lane have been doing.
I've been doing things sort-of like: nullread player A -> push a wagon on them -> reevaluate read on them -> nullread player B -> push a wagon on them -> reevaluate read on them -> etc...
And it's helped me sort people.
What lane's been doing has come across to me as much more simplistic, without the reevaluating of reads I'd expect to see, like, just straight-up: push a wagon on player A -> push a wagon on player B -> push a wagon on player C -> etc...
I'm not getting the sense that he's actually trying to progress his reads.
In post 545, Halos and Horns wrote:I feel like she is deliberately misrepping lane here by implying that he is only townreading the people who support his positions.
I'm not following you. Can you try and explain this a bit more?
In post 545, Halos and Horns wrote:RC says this kind of aggressiveness is really uncharacteristic of postie as well, I'm not familiar enough with her play to say one way or the other but I trust his read on her more than I do my own.
You should read the game I linked earlier too. Aggressiveness typically comes as a side-effect of me getting into a tunnel on someone when I (rightly or wrongly) feel sure of my read on them. It's probably a warning sign that I'm getting confbiased, but it isn't scum indicative.
In post 461, Postie wrote:Actually the amount of support for the BNL lynch is concerning. I think every single person except H&H, TheCow, and Flubber has pushed the wagon. I'm townreading H&H and TheCow, so that leaves BNL/Flubber as the only likely scumteam if BNL is scum - but then, why not lynch Flubber since he's going to be harder to read?
UNVOTE:
I'm really not understanding this logic either, Postie is entirely leaving out the possibility of bussing, which in a cop setup is probably pretty important. Initially I liked the fact that she unvoted at the same time that I voiced my concerns about the speed of the wagon, but looking more closely at her reason for unvoting is making me think twice.
Bussing would be the other explanation, yes, but I didn't see it as likely. BNL hasn't been super scummy, so I thought it would be odd for scum to push his wagon so willingly and quickly when they still had other options, like pushing the Aristo counterwagon. Also, what Davsto said.
In post 545, Halos and Horns wrote:I think RC is at the point where he's not going to respond to you or aristo a lot anymore.
Well, I'm hoping at least that he can give the game I linked a quick skim and respond to my questions about lane.
