Open 702: Vanilla Nightless Game Over
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MathBlade He/HimTechnical SupportHe/Him
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ScumBlade's eloquent performance left me utterly disoriented, debased, depraved and sent me spiraling into a horrific murky abyss with emotional turmoil and immense despair as my only companions until slowly I suffocate in my own gloom, surrounded by failure. I will never recover. -- Zachstralkita about Mini 1841
GTKAS -- MathBlade-
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cytheflyguy Goon
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Luca Blight Survivor
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CommKnight Mafia Scum
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Well, I can say that if Luca is scum this game, he's very committed. Even as far as having a decent reason for removing me from the list that isn't some bullshit under pressure removal or pulled out of his ass.
I can also agree with that list of 3. I mean regardless of Luca's alignment. I don't believe all 3 of those are town at all. 1-2 scum in that list.-
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Lucky2u Jack of All Trades
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In post 653, Luca Blight wrote:I'm gonna chop the lynch pool down to three.
LaserGuy
Impede
Zaraki
One of these is being lynched today.
Did I miss the reason you removed Athena from this list?-
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Luca Blight Survivor
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Luca Blight Survivor
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LaserGuy Goon
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I feel that the fact that she is following her own instincts and pursuing her own leads rather than just sticking with the plan is more likely to come from Town in this context. On balance I feel that scum are probably more likely to just go along with the plan because it's an easy way to look Townie and not draw attention to themselves without really needing to commit to anything. Taking a public stance against the general trajectory of Town's plans may be anti-Town, but it is anti-Town in an a stubbornly independent way that I usually associate with townies.In post 619, Luca Blight wrote:Why is Athena town?
That aside, while it is true that she was reluctant to join the UCV wagon and found you scummy in D1, but I can hardly fault her for that since I did the same thing. None of her arguments on this point have really pinged me as a buddy interactions. Most of the remainder of her content is active and thoughtful. Her tone feels townie to me, and I can see her trying to work things out.
Yes, I'd prefer Impede to Zaraki.Luca Blight wrote:I'm assuming LaserGuy will be wanting to lynch Impede.
If not then can you update us on your read, LaserGuy.
UNVOTE:
VOTE: Impede-
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mozamis Jack of All Trades
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In my exoerience, these excuses are ture? maybe I'ma gullible twat, but this has the ring of truth to me.In post 639, Zulfy wrote:Cuz I got my wallet stolen and had to take quick measures to replace my documents, which meant a lot of waiting in lines and not a lot of mafia playing.
plus his more recen tposts have all seemed kinda noob town to me.
think we should take him out of lynch pool.
@ Lucca - why are you not considering Cult? I'm pretty sure he's scum.You've reached that age, Listy. 24, 25...Your muscles give up, they wave a little white flag of surrender and without any warning at all, you're suddenly a fat bastard...-
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mozamis Jack of All Trades
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easy tiger. no one is "controlling" the days lynch. This is a team game...In post 646, Luca Blight wrote:I am controlling today's lynch because I have earned the right to.You've reached that age, Listy. 24, 25...Your muscles give up, they wave a little white flag of surrender and without any warning at all, you're suddenly a fat bastard...-
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mozamis Jack of All Trades
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still think comm is town - particularly arguing the toss with Lucca like that - there is very little scum motivation for arguing with the most widely read town player. most scum try and blend in more than that.You've reached that age, Listy. 24, 25...Your muscles give up, they wave a little white flag of surrender and without any warning at all, you're suddenly a fat bastard...-
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mozamis Jack of All Trades
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prob why you are scum with her lolIn post 658, LaserGuy wrote:but I can hardly fault her for that since I did the same thingYou've reached that age, Listy. 24, 25...Your muscles give up, they wave a little white flag of surrender and without any warning at all, you're suddenly a fat bastard...-
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mozamis Jack of All Trades
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mozamis Jack of All Trades
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mozamis Jack of All Trades
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it was both cult and laser who were very relucant to lynch UV - and with basically no reason. so keeping it simple they prob are scum.
Last scummer is tricky but never mind for now, 2 is goodYou've reached that age, Listy. 24, 25...Your muscles give up, they wave a little white flag of surrender and without any warning at all, you're suddenly a fat bastard...-
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mozamis Jack of All Trades
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it's Moz, Lucca, Sesq, Comm, Lucky who are unlychable today for me.
Not that keen on Impede or Zulfy.
Zaraki might be the tricky one?
Cyfly, Laser and Cult prefered.
(guess that lynch is pretty much in order of most town to most scum at bottom).You've reached that age, Listy. 24, 25...Your muscles give up, they wave a little white flag of surrender and without any warning at all, you're suddenly a fat bastard...-
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Sesq Mafia Scum
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put athena back in or ill fuckin dieIn post 653, Luca Blight wrote:I'm gonna chop the lynch pool down to three.
LaserGuy
Impede
Zaraki
One of these is being lynched today.
also why is laser scum1312-
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LaserGuy Goon
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In post 584, LaserGuy wrote:
Remember, there is no night kills or power roles in this setup. Therefore the usual reasons for not wanting to lynch lurkers, or even marginally scummy players don't really exist here... we don't risk losing a strong townie voice or PR by lynching them. We just lose a slot that we can't read. It's likely that sooner or later, especially once we get down to only one or two scum left, we're probably just going to have to systematically lynch a couple of the players that people are fairly uncertain about, and that's fine. We have mislynches to spare, and with each scum we lynch, we can afford to lose another townie.In post 571, CultOfAthena wrote:
What's the need to deal with him today as opposed to in the future? Presumably if the lurking is actually due to real life reasons and not an in-game strategy, that should be cleared up sometime later. This seems uncharacteristically concise and nonanalytical, compared to my playerimage of you.In post 562, LaserGuy wrote:
We're going to have to deal with the slot sooner or later. Even if it does turn out to be a Town slot, it's not like they're doing anything to help out. There isn't really any harm in doing this.
VOTE: Zulfy
Yes, Zulfy could someday produce some great content that would make it worth keeping them around. Frankly, I think their content will need to be truly speculator to get them up to near-conftown status. Or they could continue to lurk and prod dodge for the foreseeable future. How much time is worth waiting for them to do something on the off-chance that they contribute something of value?@Athena,why didn't you respond to me here?
Can you explain these reads?
Noting moz Townslipping here.In post 591, mozamis wrote:Migth even be Impede signalling to his scu buddies that he wants them to lynch Zulfy "I'm defintely gonna be on this wagon, lads"-
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mozamis Jack of All Trades
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*not that keen on LYNCHING impede or zulfy that should have beenIn post 666, mozamis wrote:Not that keen on Impede or Zulfy.You've reached that age, Listy. 24, 25...Your muscles give up, they wave a little white flag of surrender and without any warning at all, you're suddenly a fat bastard...-
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CultOfAthena Goon
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The irony is killing me.In post 661, mozamis wrote:still think comm is town - particularly arguing the toss with Lucca like that - there is very little scum motivation for arguing with the most widely read town player. most scum try and blend in more than that.
You're not listening to anything that I'm saying, intentionally or not. Let me ask you a question - in this setup, why would scum be reluctant to lynch their scumbuddy?In post 665, mozamis wrote:it was both cult and laser who were very relucant to lynch UV - and with basically no reason. so keeping it simple they prob are scum.
Last scummer is tricky but never mind for now, 2 is good-
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CultOfAthena Goon
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It didn't seem like you were looking for a response and Zulfy had already begun posting at the time. I still disagree, however, and so I'll illustrate my opinion for you.In post 668, LaserGuy wrote:In post 584, LaserGuy wrote:
Remember, there is no night kills or power roles in this setup. Therefore the usual reasons for not wanting to lynch lurkers, or even marginally scummy players don't really exist here... we don't risk losing a strong townie voice or PR by lynching them. We just lose a slot that we can't read. It's likely that sooner or later, especially once we get down to only one or two scum left, we're probably just going to have to systematically lynch a couple of the players that people are fairly uncertain about, and that's fine. We have mislynches to spare, and with each scum we lynch, we can afford to lose another townie.In post 571, CultOfAthena wrote:
What's the need to deal with him today as opposed to in the future? Presumably if the lurking is actually due to real life reasons and not an in-game strategy, that should be cleared up sometime later. This seems uncharacteristically concise and nonanalytical, compared to my playerimage of you.In post 562, LaserGuy wrote:
We're going to have to deal with the slot sooner or later. Even if it does turn out to be a Town slot, it's not like they're doing anything to help out. There isn't really any harm in doing this.
VOTE: Zulfy
Yes, Zulfy could someday produce some great content that would make it worth keeping them around. Frankly, I think their content will need to be truly speculator to get them up to near-conftown status. Or they could continue to lurk and prod dodge for the foreseeable future. How much time is worth waiting for them to do something on the off-chance that they contribute something of value?@Athena,why didn't you respond to me here?
For one, you're calling Zulfy a "lurker", which carries with it some connotation that isn't accurate in this situation. Zulfy hasn't been "active lurking", ie posting only to prod dodge - so far it appears like he was actually busy in real life and now has more time to dedicate towards the game. The way that his wagon popped up today was jumping the gun. I also take particular issue with your last sentence. How much time is worth waiting? How much is time worth at all? What do we lose of significance by waiting just a few days into the new day phase for someone who was (or at least, professed to be) busy in real life to catch up and begin producing content? Even further, what's with the expectation that Zulfy has to get himself to "near-conftown status"? It seems like you're placing expectations upon him that don't apply to anyone else, and I'm not sure why.
Unless you're still pushing Zulfy on the grounds of lurking, however, the point is moot.-
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CultOfAthena Goon
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@mozamisIn post 571, CultOfAthena wrote:
What makes you think Zulfy is scum? That's a pretty detailed read for someone with two posts, total - seven, if you count his predecessor.In post 558, mozamis wrote:VOTE: zulfy
Normally I would say "we should have done this day 1" but since we caught scum, I'll let you guys off!
but really, this guy has doen LITERALLY no scum hunting all game, less than when town lurk.
i've seen scum lurk like this many times.
obv, there is a chance of him being town and lurking, but if so, we have 1 mislynch available, yeah??
but, as i say this is mainly a genuine "this guy is scum" lynch, with a twenty per cent PL Lurker lynch as well.
Cult is still my other top pick for scum.
Who the last scum is I'm less clear now.-
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LaserGuy Goon
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Quite the contrary, I expect that anyone who is not basically conftown is going to get lynched before the end of the game (and I include myself in this count). I think it's fairly likely that sooner or later we're just going to have to start PoE lynching a bunch of people... I don't see any way around this if at least one scum is even marginally competent. We don't have any investigative PRs, and don't have any extra information as provided through the night kill. Conftown is the only thing we have that even remotely resembles a PR in this game, but it's a powerful one. If we get four conftown players at this point, we can win by literally just lynching every other player in the game.In post 671, CultOfAthena wrote:For one, you're calling Zulfy a "lurker", which carries with it some connotation that isn't accurate in this situation. Zulfy hasn't been "active lurking", ie posting only to prod dodge - so far it appears like he was actually busy in real life and now has more time to dedicate towards the game. The way that his wagon popped up today was jumping the gun. I also take particular issue with your last sentence. How much time is worth waiting? How much is time worth at all? What do we lose of significance by waiting just a few days into the new day phase for someone who was (or at least, professed to be) busy in real life to catch up and begin producing content?
Even further, what's with the expectation that Zulfy has to get himself to "near-conftown status"? It seems like you're placing expectations upon him that don't apply to anyone else, and I'm not sure why.
At the time of posting my vote, Zulfy essentially no content, and Archwing before him had little enough. As I said earlier, policy lynching this game is very low risk for Town... we aren't trading a bad slot (lurker) for a good slot (somebody who gets NKed)... we're just losing a player with minimal content that is hard to read, and narrowing the number of potential scum candidates, something that we're very likely going to have to do anyway. This is actually why I like the scum pools that Luca has been setting up. If we can get to a point where we can pretty confidently say "there is one scum in these three players", then it is actually not a terrible play for Town just to lynch everyone in the pool even on the off-chance that all three are Town.-
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CultOfAthena Goon
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You place far too much confidence in the idea that people can even become "conftown" in this setup. I'm not sure whether you have any ulterior motive or not to push this idea, but either way it's an incredibly dangerous one. You shouldn't treat anybody as conftown in this setup - perhaps theIn post 673, LaserGuy wrote:Quite the contrary, I expect that anyone who is not basically conftown is going to get lynched before the end of the game (and I include myself in this count). I think it's fairly likely that sooner or later we're just going to have to start PoE lynching a bunch of people... I don't see any way around this if at least one scum is even marginally competent. We don't have any investigative PRs, and don't have any extra information as provided through the night kill. Conftown is the only thing we have that even remotely resembles a PR in this game, but it's a powerful one. If we get four conftown players at this point, we can win by literally just lynching every other player in the game.primarygoal that scum actually have this game is to insert themselves into that group, whereupon if we were to follow your strategy, scum would win guaranteed.
Why would you rather lynch someone who you have no or little information on as compared to someone you have information on and you believe to be scum? Comparatively little information is gained from a lurker lynch as compared to a lynch on a more active player.At the time of posting my vote, Zulfy essentially no content, and Archwing before him had little enough. As I said earlier, policy lynching this game is very low risk for Town... we aren't trading a bad slot (lurker) for a good slot (somebody who gets NKed)... we're just losing a player with minimal content that is hard to read, and narrowing the number of potential scum candidates, something that we're very likely going to have to do anyway. This is actually why I like the scum pools that Luca has been setting up. If we can get to a point where we can pretty confidently say "there is one scum in these three players", then it is actually not a terrible play for Town just to lynch everyone in the pool even on the off-chance that all three are Town.-
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LaserGuy Goon
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What do you think the alternative is? If we have a choice between lynching player that is 90% likely to be town and another that is 40% likely to be town, the correct play is to lynch the one that is 40% likely to be town. The more players that we can put into this category, the more likely we are to win. Now sure, at this stage of the game, saying we have four or five conftown players is silly. We don't.In post 674, CultOfAthena wrote:
You place far too much confidence in the idea that people can even become "conftown" in this setup. I'm not sure whether you have any ulterior motive or not to push this idea, but either way it's an incredibly dangerous one. You shouldn't treat anybody as conftown in this setup - perhaps theIn post 673, LaserGuy wrote:Quite the contrary, I expect that anyone who is not basically conftown is going to get lynched before the end of the game (and I include myself in this count). I think it's fairly likely that sooner or later we're just going to have to start PoE lynching a bunch of people... I don't see any way around this if at least one scum is even marginally competent. We don't have any investigative PRs, and don't have any extra information as provided through the night kill. Conftown is the only thing we have that even remotely resembles a PR in this game, but it's a powerful one. If we get four conftown players at this point, we can win by literally just lynching every other player in the game.primarygoal that scum actually have this game is to insert themselves into that group, whereupon if we were to follow your strategy, scum would win guaranteed.
Because a player that is active is likely to continue to be active. They will be easier to sort as the game goes on.Why would you rather lynch someone who you have no or little information on as compared to someone you have information on and you believe to be scum? Comparatively little information is gained from a lurker lynch as compared to a lynch on a more active player.
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