Open 680.1 C9++ | Endgame

[Umlaut]

Pagetop

Official Vote Count

Gamma Emerald

(3): FireScreamer, shannon, Narna

Titus

(2): davesaz, Umlaut

FireScreamer

(2): FrankJaeger, CommKnight

Green Crayons

(2): Titus, Alchemist21

RoryMK

(2): Gamma Emerald, Brian Skies

Alchemist21

(1): Green Crayons

CommKnight

(1): RoryMK

Not Voting

(0):

None.

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Deadline

: (expired on 2017-05-03 20:06:48)

Mod Note

: Thanks for the top!

[Titus]

Titus can you explain those pls.

Vote histories.

I could swap out Umlaut for FS though.

In depth there please champ. Make your case. Don't just encourage people to go look at X thing with your opinion prebiasing them.

No. There is no good case d1 barring someone planning to murder the IC and even that fails sometimes.

[Umlaut]

There is no good case d1 barring someone planning to murder the IC and even that fails sometimes.

[Gamma Emerald]

Titus stop with the "no good case D1" shit pls it's a headache

[Titus]

Titus stop with the "no good case D1" shit pls it's a headache

Ok, then stop asking me for a good case.

[Gamma Emerald]

I just want A case, good is optional

[Titus]

I just want A case, good is optional

My case is the votes speak to me. The VCs suggest CommKnight town, shannon scum. FireStarter's vote pattern is different. GC reasonless got sheeps but Shannon didn't. GC and CommKnight has high odds of scum but CommKnight town. So GC has conflicting info. Umlaut votes after CommKnight not lynchable.

Pretty much stuff like that is my case.

[FireScreamer]

I don't care if there is no good day 1 case. People contributing toward day 1 cases is how we form a better day 2 case. This is an iterative process and you are sabotaging it Titus.

[Titus]

I don't care if there is no good day 1 case. People contributing toward day 1 cases is how we form a better day 2 case. This is an iterative process and you are sabotaging it Titus.

No, I am not. Sorry. You can read me. I still take stances on everything. Sorry not sorry I won't vote town.

[FireScreamer]

I very clearly cannot read you. Do more things. Give me a fighting chance. Sort and be sorted. Don't just turtle up.

[Titus]

I very clearly cannot read you. Do more things. Give me a fighting chance. Sort and be sorted. Don't just turtle up.

I don't think you are reading me anyway.

[FireScreamer]

I very clearly cannot read you. Do more things. Give me a fighting chance. Sort and be sorted. Don't just turtle up.

I don't think you are reading me anyway.

What have you done for me to attempt reading?

I've been giving you the benefit of the doubt here because I think you'd be a real asset if you started working at this game and theres plenty of time left for you to do it. So yeah you are right I havn't been reading you but i've been waiting for you to give me something to read.

[Alchemist21]

In 342, GC asks Titus again about her vote on me
GC asks follow ups in 357

Also, thanks for confirming that GC did, in fact, engage Titus on his suspicions.

It seems the sort of thing that is easily verifiable by reading GC's ISO. And then once GC's follow up question is noticed, it should have been like 'OK you did follow up but Titus didn't answer - Why didn't Titus answer, and why didn't you keep pushing it?' Not the shit show we've had.

The most damning point for me is that the whole thing was a total non-issue until Gamma brought it up like 300 posts later. And if anything I'd have expected Titus to be lambasted for not answering the question (why she voted me with no explanation) rather than Alch for not following up enough. (It is bloody hard to follow up with Titus, especially when Titus is lurking for hundreds of posts at a time).

Seriously, I think there's scum here. I was being voted by GC and then Titus, and Alch chose to engage me about my reads but not Titus for not responding to GC. Then when it became clear I was not going to be wagoned, Gamma brought up GC and Titus again, and Alch went after GC.

I mean there were three naked votes on Alch in a row, and it was at that time - 300 odd posts after Titus first voted me - that Gamma chose to ask Alch why he hadn't followed up with Titus more.

Join me here on Alch or Gamma because I'm pretty sure this is where scum's at.

What is the specific issue here?

Answer this question Shannon.

The specific issue is that it was you who started the whole GC vs Alchemist shit show we've been seeing the past umpteen pages.

Long long ago, in a post known as 151, Titus voted me without giving a reason. GC got mad at Titus for doing that, because he wanted to vote me first, and Titus didn't give a reason for the vote. Alchemist got involved, and started asking me to justify my actions.

That looks, to me, like the start of a wagon on me. Except it wasn't. Titus didn't come back to answer GC's questions, the wagon moved on, and Alchemist unvoted me.

Much later, these names popped up again.

In 390, Titus calls GC scum for whining. There are three naked votes on GC shortly after. A shonky looking wagon, from my POV.

You followed that up, not by asking Titus why she'd continued to evade GC's questions, but by accusing GC of not even asking follow up questions. And that's plainly false, and you can see it in GC's ISO.

Then Alchemist got involved again, and said he didn't think Titus had a case to answer because it didn't even look like GC was suspicious of me. My problems with this are that he didn't bring it up at the time (he waited for your prompting), and that he refused to accept a reasonable explanation from GC.

So: My issue with you is that you waited until a very opportune moment to bring up GC's supposed failing re: Titus, the point you made was false, and it gave Alchemist an in to really wagon GC.

If you're

not

directly involved, you should join me in looking at Alch and Titus very closely because this is really bad stuff.

I think Shannon's wrong about me, but her thoughts seem to be coming from a Town mindset. Also appreciate her giving us her thoughts and not just sheeping wagons when asked.

[FireScreamer]

Alchemist. Can you make a scum case on someone for me that isn't GC or based on GC associatives?

[Gamma Emerald]

In 342, GC asks Titus again about her vote on me
GC asks follow ups in 357

Also, thanks for confirming that GC did, in fact, engage Titus on his suspicions.

It seems the sort of thing that is easily verifiable by reading GC's ISO. And then once GC's follow up question is noticed, it should have been like 'OK you did follow up but Titus didn't answer - Why didn't Titus answer, and why didn't you keep pushing it?' Not the shit show we've had.

The most damning point for me is that the whole thing was a total non-issue until Gamma brought it up like 300 posts later. And if anything I'd have expected Titus to be lambasted for not answering the question (why she voted me with no explanation) rather than Alch for not following up enough. (It is bloody hard to follow up with Titus, especially when Titus is lurking for hundreds of posts at a time).

Seriously, I think there's scum here. I was being voted by GC and then Titus, and Alch chose to engage me about my reads but not Titus for not responding to GC. Then when it became clear I was not going to be wagoned, Gamma brought up GC and Titus again, and Alch went after GC.

I mean there were three naked votes on Alch in a row, and it was at that time - 300 odd posts after Titus first voted me - that Gamma chose to ask Alch why he hadn't followed up with Titus more.

Join me here on Alch or Gamma because I'm pretty sure this is where scum's at.

What is the specific issue here?

Answer this question Shannon.

The specific issue is that it was you who started the whole GC vs Alchemist shit show we've been seeing the past umpteen pages.

Long long ago, in a post known as 151, Titus voted me without giving a reason. GC got mad at Titus for doing that, because he wanted to vote me first, and Titus didn't give a reason for the vote. Alchemist got involved, and started asking me to justify my actions.

That looks, to me, like the start of a wagon on me. Except it wasn't. Titus didn't come back to answer GC's questions, the wagon moved on, and Alchemist unvoted me.

Much later, these names popped up again.

In 390, Titus calls GC scum for whining. There are three naked votes on GC shortly after. A shonky looking wagon, from my POV.

You followed that up, not by asking Titus why she'd continued to evade GC's questions, but by accusing GC of not even asking follow up questions. And that's plainly false, and you can see it in GC's ISO.

Then Alchemist got involved again, and said he didn't think Titus had a case to answer because it didn't even look like GC was suspicious of me. My problems with this are that he didn't bring it up at the time (he waited for your prompting), and that he refused to accept a reasonable explanation from GC.

So: My issue with you is that you waited until a very opportune moment to bring up GC's supposed failing re: Titus, the point you made was false, and it gave Alchemist an in to really wagon GC.

If you're

not

directly involved, you should join me in looking at Alch and Titus very closely because this is really bad stuff.

I think Shannon's wrong about me, but her thoughts seem to be coming from a Town mindset. Also appreciate her giving us her thoughts and not just sheeping wagons when asked.

What's with the uncertainty at the beginning?

[FireScreamer]

S L I P B O Y Z

VOTE: Alchemist

[Alchemist21]

Alchemist. Can you make a scum case on someone for me that isn't GC or based on GC associatives?

Right now all I can give you is Rory based on what I said earlier. I still have all my earlier expressed Townreads as well.

[RoryMK]

prod received. Will catch up soon!

[FireScreamer]

Does anyone have a meta read on if Radja is like this as town?

[Alchemist21]

In 342, GC asks Titus again about her vote on me
GC asks follow ups in 357

Also, thanks for confirming that GC did, in fact, engage Titus on his suspicions.

It seems the sort of thing that is easily verifiable by reading GC's ISO. And then once GC's follow up question is noticed, it should have been like 'OK you did follow up but Titus didn't answer - Why didn't Titus answer, and why didn't you keep pushing it?' Not the shit show we've had.

The most damning point for me is that the whole thing was a total non-issue until Gamma brought it up like 300 posts later. And if anything I'd have expected Titus to be lambasted for not answering the question (why she voted me with no explanation) rather than Alch for not following up enough. (It is bloody hard to follow up with Titus, especially when Titus is lurking for hundreds of posts at a time).

Seriously, I think there's scum here. I was being voted by GC and then Titus, and Alch chose to engage me about my reads but not Titus for not responding to GC. Then when it became clear I was not going to be wagoned, Gamma brought up GC and Titus again, and Alch went after GC.

I mean there were three naked votes on Alch in a row, and it was at that time - 300 odd posts after Titus first voted me - that Gamma chose to ask Alch why he hadn't followed up with Titus more.

Join me here on Alch or Gamma because I'm pretty sure this is where scum's at.

What is the specific issue here?

Answer this question Shannon.

The specific issue is that it was you who started the whole GC vs Alchemist shit show we've been seeing the past umpteen pages.

Long long ago, in a post known as 151, Titus voted me without giving a reason. GC got mad at Titus for doing that, because he wanted to vote me first, and Titus didn't give a reason for the vote. Alchemist got involved, and started asking me to justify my actions.

That looks, to me, like the start of a wagon on me. Except it wasn't. Titus didn't come back to answer GC's questions, the wagon moved on, and Alchemist unvoted me.

Much later, these names popped up again.

In 390, Titus calls GC scum for whining. There are three naked votes on GC shortly after. A shonky looking wagon, from my POV.

You followed that up, not by asking Titus why she'd continued to evade GC's questions, but by accusing GC of not even asking follow up questions. And that's plainly false, and you can see it in GC's ISO.

Then Alchemist got involved again, and said he didn't think Titus had a case to answer because it didn't even look like GC was suspicious of me. My problems with this are that he didn't bring it up at the time (he waited for your prompting), and that he refused to accept a reasonable explanation from GC.

So: My issue with you is that you waited until a very opportune moment to bring up GC's supposed failing re: Titus, the point you made was false, and it gave Alchemist an in to really wagon GC.

If you're

not

directly involved, you should join me in looking at Alch and Titus very closely because this is really bad stuff.

I think Shannon's wrong about me, but her thoughts seem to be coming from a Town mindset. Also appreciate her giving us her thoughts and not just sheeping wagons when asked.

What's with the uncertainty at the beginning?

The "I think" part applies to her thoughts coming from a Town mindset. Guess I should have put it mid sentence but I'm kinda used to starting off sentences with I think.

[FireScreamer]

Alight no slip boyz


VOTE: Gamma

[Alchemist21]

Oh hey did anyone else see Campbell's Soup got banned? Serves him right.

[Alchemist21]

Hey guys gotta read from page 20 and after.
Been super busy irl . if i dont think the time for this game will come i will replace out

Reading tonight. Off work tommorow

He never came back.

Frank are you still gonna play?

[Titus]

Oh hey did anyone else see Campbell's Soup got banned? Serves him right.

Why?

[RoryMK]

I tried reading last night, but I just couldn't focus and I didn't want to do a crappy job. I'm fully aware my input in this game has been pretty crappy, no need to point that out. I'm struggling to get solid reads. Hopefully my catchup will change that.

@Rory, I was just curious as to if you could see the PT's because let's say there was a game with PT's outside of scum chat, if you were able to see it and playing in that game you'd know there'd non-mafia with PT's ongoing. But that's cool. Makes sense to do it that way to prevent things like that.

Also I've had two games with Frank, one as both town and one as both mafia. I'd like to think I got a feel for him. As far as Narna goes? I only had a single game where I was mafia and she was town. I'd like to think I know how town her acts.

Yeah it doesn't work like that. I can only see PT's people give me access to. If I want to play a micro(my queue), I will always make sure to notify the mod that I'm playing so I never get any information I shouldn't get. If I somehow do get information, I will immediately replace out to avoid the game getting compromised.

So what is it about Frank specifically that makes you townread him?
How could you possibly know Narna's scum game if you haven't played with scum Narna? I can understand if you would lean town on him for stuff he did, but a solid townread seems a bit much here. Can you elaborate on why you have such a strong townread on Narna?

---

- I don't really buy GC's case on Brian Skies at all. It takes balls to engage a vocal player like Skies though, so even though I don't support it, I think he's more likely town for it.

---

Spoiler: Alchemist wall

Rorys posts look disingenuous.

Kinda agree with this. Hard to say if he's just like this on early D1 though.

Rorys posts look disingenuous.

Is there a reason you still haven't moved your RVS vote if you think that's true?

Do you have any other reads?

It also feels like he tried to turn it around on Frank here.

VOTE: Rory

Can you explain where I went wrong by asking Frank 2 questions in an attempt to get him involved?

It looks like you're trying to discredit his point against you by challenging his lack of vote.

How am I discrediting his point? I ask him if he has a reason not to move his RVS vote and followup by asking if he has other reads.
Maybe he has a scumread on that player now, and didn't mention it.

It looks like the message you were sending was "if you really thought that you would vote me," and I see that as a subtle discredit attempt.

How do you feel about it, now that I've explained it? Does it still bother you?