Mini 1530 - Guyett's Paranoid Geology Trip GAME OVER

[shos]

VOTE: Jacob

[PinkMittens]

I claim very powerful townie who is conftown. :-p Seriously, I am not ccing anyone but I won't say beyond that.

PM, why did you always jailkeep me?

Well, initially I'd like to say that I have no experience with the role and that I felt really confused regarding my reads both nights (first I had been busy for two weeks over x-mas, second I just had my #1 scumread flip town) so it might not have been the best decision (well, in retrospect definitely not), but my reasoning was something along these lines:

There were three scum alive able to make the kill, and they would most likely not making their person most prone to JKs/trackers make the kill (unless they for some reason expected a watcher, but I think that's more uncommon) hence it felt like a shot in the dark trying to land it on the correct scum. Combined with me being paranoid about almost everyone during the nights, the fact that me saving a player would yield an extra lynch for town (due to desperado) and that you as conftown was a significantly more likely target than the average townie means that I went with that.


Thoughts regarding Jacobs claim: His play makes no sense as bp, hardcore lurking seems like a very bad way to draw mafia-fire. Not sure if the claim itself is completely impossible (though indeed unlikely), I guess a JK+BP could compensate a bit for the desperado role being prone to pushing mylo a day early. Doing that as scum also seems very strange considering that I just claimed JK, he should've realised that people would be sceptical about the claim. Shos statement that "he needs a reason for why he isn't dead" obviously makes no sense considering that we've yet to have a kill negated afaik, what did you mean by that?

Think I'd like to lynch him today, but there's no reason to not discuss it a bit first. You guys who have played more than me, how likely do you feel a BP+JK setup is in a mini normal? Do you think a desperado could warrant that?

[shos]

I think PM is town; I saw this precise reasoning too after you asked the question, and decided to shut up and see what he posts,a nd he posted correctly.

to the pown tile.

RE: jacob; no sense at all as a BP. the claim is possible, since JK+BP *can* fit to a normal game, as we don't know what powers scum have. probably more than a rolecop tho cuz rolecop V JK is a newbie game setup so if we have a BP then scum have some too.

However, this setup has been reviewed by no less than THREE people (see p1 - reviewed by Llamafluff, mykonian and callforjudgement) so it CANNOT just be JK v scum.

therefore, UNVOTE: Jacob, and I'll add that I believe both of these claims. It doesn't make much sense but eh, even if Jacob is lying, he is town fakeclaiming, so we can let scum decide on this wifom. worst case he dies, best case he's like a copvigdoublevoter.

but who

do

I wanna lynch - I'm in the dark.

PoE post coming up

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I claim very powerful townie who is conftown.

At least here you are actually conftown.

[shos]

JacobSavage

Taylor

Titus

Jingle
toolenduso

Kazekirimaru
PinkMittens
shos

still rocking.

...ETL looks like a good candidate. he is playing very unlike his meta. where's all your motivation and power gone, ETL? lost in other games?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

hey shos.

yeah mostly. but also kinda cuz mastin left me by myself

honestly a big part of it is that I got lost on D1 and never recovered. I'm sorta trackin.

[Guyett]

How fast does a fault move?

About a mylonite

[shos]

As if mastin was so active in your hydra earlier.

gotta love dem VCs

[Kazekirimaru]

I'm willing to let ETL get herself situated as a solitary head before we bust out the pitchforks.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

As if mastin was so active in your hydra earlier.

gotta love dem VCs

I know. But it's been even less lately than before due to his RL stuff and what not.

I honestly have no clue where my reads are. I've kind of just been looking for a post that screams to me. Obviously, nothing really has. I also started feeling a little dejected after cooldog lynch because I was like certain he was scum. And then TSO. I've not been doing so well on the whole lately. 1 in 10 is horrible. I was hoping that with Titus replacing conftown I'd have a good lead on something better cuz clearly I suck.

As much as I wanted to lynch Tool, cool's flip stunned me a little, and I was thinking if TSO flips scum, it wouldn't be that far off for tool but his flip has me rethinking things. I need a major reset.

Titus:

I was thinking, if you had someone particular you wanted my impressions of specifically, I'd be willing to do some serious ISO digging tonight. I just don't know who to start with.

[shos]

You're killing me.


if we NL scum will probably choose between conftown titus and claimed JK. JK should try to find and jail the scum ofc.
any one of them dying does not help us at all.

ther are supposedly three scum still alive. I say we go with my PoE list up there; the PRs are probably true because of setup specs and the review team existence, kaze is *still* probably town from the gamestart thingie. he could be scum though but still it's 75% chance.

VOTE: ETL

Jingle is much more workable-with than ETL atm, and ETL's play is faaaaar away from his town meta. I have townread tool earlier, but it doesn't fit so let's leave the confusion for later.

this is the way to go, I think. I hope.

[PinkMittens]

Think you should stop voting until we've come to an agreement Shos, there's still three scum alive. Simply say who you'd like to vote instead.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

It's fine. He believes what he believes about my meta. Jingle knows, I think better than anyone here, that I am usually somewhat bored with VT roles and much prefer to be scum (and as such, are more enthusiastic about the game). That's more in-line with my meta than anything else. Add in the fact that I've been beat to shit by the past few games (and some people in those games), I'm not exactly all about being the best scum hunter ever.

If he's town, then he'll figure it out from the state of my perception about mafia site-wide by looking into it himself, if he's actually interested in figuring me out. If he's scum, then it doesn't matter since he's just using false meta as a justification for his vote.

Either way, it doesn't really matter.

[Jingle]

So, relevant claims.

Spoiler: Claim Spec

Titus- (powerful)
JS- (2 shot BP)
PM- (JK)
GM- (Flipped Desperado)

If these are all true then scum must be truly stacked with PRs. Assuming that Titus isn't WIFOMing to pull the NK, JS and PM are the possible fakeclaims.

I agree that PM's reasoning is fairly solid. I too would have Jailkept the conftown, as that has the highest likelihood of a successful NK prevention and there was a decent chance that the desp target was VT.

JS has not played in a manner befitting a BP ever. He was never going to get nightkilled, even if he was town. He's been acting like lynchbait since D1. So we take the option of him being town and fakeclaiming. Fakeclaiming what? Investigative means there should be results which would be really helpful in sorting this puzzle and thus protown to reveal. Protective? With a JK and a method of making conftowns? No the only thing that could make sense in addition is a utility role like a vig, and I doubt we have another killing role.

The short version is that I doubt all of the PR claims are real and expect 1 scum in {JS, PM}. I think it is much more likely to be JS, considering that desperado targeting BP makes an unkillable confirmed townie. I doubt that Guyett would have put that in the setup.

I'm also even more sure on my shos read now. His actions during claiming and his analysis both leave me wanting for a town POV.

Spoiler: Shos is Scum!

2-st BP

Scumclaim.

It doesnt make sense ti have a jk and a **2s** BP. He makes sure he has a reason why he isnt dead.

This is incredibly quick to jump to a conclusion. It reads to me like scumbuddy claimed something unexpected and shos jumped the gun in calling it scummy.

I trust tool enough, lol.
ETL: we are not nolynching.

We're not no-lynching because? I wasn't aware that you were in charge of all town decisions, but it's interesting that you want to be.

VOTE: Jacob

A naked vote in possible MYLO without discussion. He obviously doesn't care about the potential for a town loss here.

I think PM is town; I saw this precise reasoning too after you asked the question, and decided to shut up and see what he posts,a nd he posted correctly.

to the pown tile.

RE: jacob; no sense at all as a BP. the claim is possible, since JK+BP *can* fit to a normal game, as we don't know what powers scum have. probably more than a rolecop tho cuz rolecop V JK is a newbie game setup so if we have a BP then scum have some too.

However, this setup has been reviewed by no less than THREE people (see p1 - reviewed by Llamafluff, mykonian and callforjudgement) so it CANNOT just be JK v scum.

therefore, UNVOTE: Jacob, and I'll add that I believe both of these claims. It doesn't make much sense but eh, even if Jacob is lying, he is town fakeclaiming, so we can let scum decide on this wifom. worst case he dies, best case he's like a copvigdoublevoter.

but who

do

I wanna lynch - I'm in the dark.

PoE post coming up

Backpedaling as fast as he can. Jacob's claim is obviously real because obviously rolecop and JK is balanced. The setup has another PR because obviously 3 reviewers were needed. Never mind the desperado (an inherently swingy role, but definitely good for town) and whatever Titus is.

Also, where did rolecop come from shos? Your role PM? Because I sure as hell don't see any reason a townie should know what the scumpower is.

JacobSavage

Taylor

Titus

Jingle
toolenduso

Kazekirimaru
PinkMittens
shos

still rocking.

...ETL looks like a good candidate. he is playing very unlike his meta. where's all your motivation and power gone, ETL? lost in other games?

"Let's POE using the claims as conftown. I should be town too. That leaves us with Jingle, who thinks I'm scum, Tool, who's my scumbuddy, and ETL who just got prodded. Lets say that ETL should get lynched because she hasn't been in thread recently and isn't likely to make a counterargument. Let's just ignore the fact that I've said recently that I trust tool. Let's ignore the fact that I've said I want to lynch Jingle. Let's just go after whatever seems to be the easiest mislynch." He's ignoring his own thoughts and statements in order to push a lynch he's expressed no interest in over lynches he has. He's clearly not looking to lynch scum, but rather to have a lynch. He's caught.

TL;DR: Shos is scum, and you should have listened to me yesterday.

PEdit: ETL is telling the truth. I'll dig up some times she's told me as much in postgame discussions, and I'm pretty sure she said the same thing in Antihero mafia scumchat. Unless you want me to believe that she told me that for precisely this reason. If so, ETL's a freaking prophetess and we're all screwed.

[shos]

@ETL: I totally understand you, I hate VT as well. can you link me to another game in which you were a VT?

Ooh ooh a shosscum case!

[shos]

oh I forgot the desperado. hmm.
Jingle's first spoiler has some good points and I agree.

now let's see the case on MEEE P:

[shos]

first quote: you have clearly not played with me-scum. you can search my scum records - I am SUPER calculated. I think about everything super deeply. preparing a fakeclaim with my partner when it's going to be mylo? if you think Iscum did not do that and now am bussing, you're a fool; and even if, at all times when you say X is bussing Y, you lynch Y first, not X. the quote stresses(everyone seemed to ignore this) the part where he is TWO ShOTS. I'd understand if it was a 1s. but two-shots? explain what possible reasoning can be for that. and even better: why would town claim 2s? if you already decide to not lie-to-soak-NK, then why say 2s and not 1s? what difference does it make? JS's claim makes no sense in any manner at all, and if you call ME scum for it, you're a fool. The reason I called him town lately was because I truly forgot the Desperado flip, and I also disregarded titus' words.

second quote: because we have no investigative roles, and nolynching will probably just get titus dead - as conftown, and now, as a PR too.

third quote: it is mylo, not lylo. a vote is not quickhammerable. and explain how it shows I don't care?? O__o; you're forcing shit out on me, and you're in the pool, you just make it easy for me.

JS and Jingle

- scumpartners ftl

forth: see above; re: disregardment of titus&desperado.
newbie games have a rolecop VS cop/doc/JK setup, that's where I got it from.

that last paragraph of yours is really awful, not going to even comment on that.

[Jingle]

We've clearly already discussed ITT how your scum meta is stale as shit. I've already established that I think you're scum. If you think X is scum and might be bussing Y, you vote X because X IS SCUM. I'm less certain about him. I'm not impressed by your rebuttal.

ETL prefers scum in postgame:
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p5462660

ETL suffering from apathy in VT game:
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=32269

As a bonus, Titus is also in that second one. I'm not, but aphix is someone I know IRL.

[shos]

Well in your opinion meta means nothing, imo it means something. we'll agree to disagree.
and what I said was that if you think X is scum BECAUSE he is bussing Y, then you vote Y first.
you entirely ignored my point about the 2-shot.
the fact that you supply defenses for ETL makes me feel even stronger that you three are the buddies. fits my list - taylor and you are in the pool, and JS's townstatus was revoked after being reminded of Desperado & titus.

I did not ask for that postgame post. the fact that you dug it up to help him doesn't do you good.

[shos]

TLDR:
scumteam is {Jingle, ETL, JS}

JS is the most likely for a standalone scum so VOTE: JacobSavage first.

[EspeciallyTheLies]

jingley your defense of me is weird.....

[EspeciallyTheLies]

Here is another VT game where I checked out:
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=31923

and another:
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=32520

shos I had you as null probably town for a long while now. i know it's omgus but it's really very telling imo, that you are pushing on me now, when i've admittedly been absent from the game. JS is someone I'd be willing to lynch but your endorsement of it seriously makes me question it.

If this is mylo, I see no reason for scum to bus. which means if you are scum, JS isn't.

[Kazekirimaru]

ETL, why did Mastin decide to leave?

[EspeciallyTheLies]

I don't think he decided to leave. He had a lot of RL issues lately and checked out of all his games. I happen to be in 3 with him, or 2 rather, and was modding one that just ended. He checked out of all of them. I haven't formally requested to replace my hydra with myself because he seems to still want to pop in from time to time and that's fine with me.

[shos]

The fact that you admit to have sucked doesn't mean that you're more townie, you know. it's all practically PoE; I had a townread on tool so my PoE didn't sit very quitely, but then Jingle came and listed it all and reminded me of the Desperado flip and of Titus unclaimed power, so it all suddenly made sense that JS is still in the pool. if out of the four of you one is town- then it is tool. either way, JS lynch ahoy.