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[Iconeum]

but here now, yes

[Iconeum]

i could've just waited and claimed traffic analyst yesterday as wolf and you all would've let me live

mm

this is true

it's true, but IIRC anya literally said that she was scared of being the one flipped over infinity and that was (part of?) why quickhammer

how does that match this statement?

[Iconeum]

scum rolecops do not exist, this is a true fact

ehm

i mean

they do

[Iconeum]

s_s is scum with anya and there is a rolecop on their team and they copped infinity night 1 and knew if she claimed people would unvote and move onto anya so anya quickhammered, and now s_s is assuming anya knew infinity would claim a power role and not get yeeted because of the fact that well, she did know that, even though there's little ground to assume that right now, speaking from the thread's pov / current discussion, and is trying to cover it up by crying "scum rolecop is a thing that exists"

this is spicey …

but scum are killing a N1 rolecopped doctor on N2 :p

[Iconeum]

is there anything more going on in your head other than that

well I was all ready to blitz through an execution on Anya regardless of what she said or did coming into the day. and what she said today is pretty much exactly what she ought to be doing here as scum-- basically to a T.

the problem is, I can see the town motivation. It's dumb, but it's not like, out of the question dumb. And there is the counterargument that it was pretty dumb as scum too, which it probably was? except of course if scum knew that Infinity was a PR, and they didn't want her to claim.

and I mean there's definitely some hedging going on, I would much rather lose in the world where Anya is town than in the one where she isn't. Is that irrational? I guess? but it's freaking annoying to reward people for doing dumb shit.

Was it really that bad though? I guess maybe it wasn't; surely, people would have looked pretty sideways at a doctor claim after we already had a rolestopper flip; in fact, I think I would have gotten more suspicious of Infinity if she had claimed that. And scum very likely have a strongman or some method of bypassing the doctor, whereas Anya if town has undoubtedly the strongest role in the setup...

so actually, if Anya is town here, and we trust her, we're not in that bad of a spot, unless Koto's the mailman. so it's definitely not the right play to throw up our arms and say "it's unwinnable if she's town" which would normally be my MO here.

tl;dr there is a LOT going through my head but you can probably imagine why I wasn't especially keen to share it

1) there is a high ++chance of there being (loyal?) mailman, which is stronger than TA? No?
2) what town motivation do you see? Considering anya believed she could just claim herself out of trouble, why the 'being scared of daying lolhammer' reasoning?

3) the main issue i have right now is i *wanna* believe anya because that is like the only thing that gives us a decent shot at winning this

[Datisi]

1) there is a high ++chance of there being (loyal?) mailman, which is stronger than TA? No?

if there is an actual loyal mailman, the chances of there *also* being a town ta go down like... a lot.

also there's whatever the fuck llama is hinting at, apparently.

man, i almost want a massclaim.

[Iconeum]

s_s is scum with anya and there is a rolecop on their team and they copped infinity night 1 and knew if she claimed people would unvote and move onto anya so anya quickhammered, and now s_s is assuming anya knew infinity would claim a power role and not get yeeted because of the fact that well, she did know that, even though there's little ground to assume that right now, speaking from the thread's pov / current discussion, and is trying to cover it up by crying "scum rolecop is a thing that exists"

I can... almost believe this

(Doesn't have to be he's scum with Anya, just the idea that his post was predicated on there being a rolecop without his explicitly saying so because he thought of it as "known")

I thought Zoomer was pretty obvtown though, have to think about how much weight to put on that long-term.

wtf umlaut

do you *actually* take this seriously or??

[Iconeum]

Datisi if you just baited scum with a meme tinfoil theory I will be seriously impressed

is it bad that i actually considered this for a

[Iconeum]

*moment*

[Something_Smart]

how does that match this statement?

I mean, it may be that her fear was unfounded. If Infinity had claimed doctor and Anya had claimed TA, I sure as hell would have wanted to leave them both alive (I don't know about anyone else), but she could still have been afraid of getting killed.

It is a bit weird though, you aren't wrong.

[Something_Smart]

there is a high ++chance of there being (loyal?) mailman, which is stronger than TA? No?

Well if there's an ungated loyal mailman then they need to claim so we can murderize Anya with extreme prejudice. But until that happens I'll assume there isn't.

[Iconeum]

i have a feeling the team is either some combination of {outworld, umlaut, llama, anya} or we just lose

{Umlaut, Llama, S_S}
Would that be so easy?

reading through these pages, i'm amazed Samantha isn't in any solve

[Iconeum]

I would return a positive to a TA last night

wait what

[Iconeum]

It should be pretty clear (sans modifiers which I really dont want to get into) what I am at this point.

It is not, at least not to me. So why not say it?

i'm slightly bothered by this?

i've seen you call out the mailman, and now this

why aren't you just openly pushing mass claim?

[Iconeum]

yes I can see anya as mafia

the problem is I can see you outworlder and umlaut as mafia as well

the only people I actually feel good about being town are koto and something_smart

this is bullshit yeah?

[Iconeum]

i guess
do we force the claim out or do we just slam the hammer down on anya? like i think that's the only q we have right now

this is probably correct

but forcing claim out equals massclaim i think, and i don't know if that is optimal or not

[Iconeum]

if massclaim is optimal, then we do that and start with the llama and work from there

if not, i think we just yeet

[Iconeum]

alpaca is hilarious

fine i'll tell you all one more time why i'm not wolf

if i was wolf i would:
-not hammer someone like that and make myself look really wolfy
-just claim traffic analyst if you ran me up yesterday

also dats you said something about the designer using wolf traffic analysts before but doesn't that become predictable if they do it over and over again? surely they'd mix it up and not just let players guess if the role is wolf or town because they always make it wolf

and it's town this time!!!!!

this can be countered by simple statements like

-if you were town you would have waited for a claim and not pretend to be scared of dying
-if you were town you would not have trolled like that at EoD 2

[Iconeum]

im feeling either massclaim

or yeet anya

[Iconeum]

anya's day 1 vote on Rathe was ugly
anya's EoD2 was disgusting and doesn't match with anything she's saying

it looks like her role is probably real to some extent, but with what i can see in this setup it's just super likely to be a scum counter to town power

[Iconeum]

i've had games where i was capable of seeing through town just playing bad, making bad gambits, but just *felt* it was town because ?? gut and all

i'm not having that feeling here with anya

[Datisi]

im feeling either massclaim

or yeet anya

+1

here's what i'm thinking rn: llama said there's great value in having him be alive tomorrow. if he's town, and anya is scum, massclaim is technically not optimal because we're drawing info out for not reason.

*however*. llama, if town, is

already

a prime nightkill target. and considering we lost two (2) protectives already, i would be ~somewhat willing to bet there isn't another one. so massclaim, in that sense, would help us figure out the llama/anya dichotomy while having not that many drawbacks - if lamma's town he's probably eating shit tonight anyway, and if he's scum it's a moot argument, no, it's actually better to get him to lock himself in a claim pre-lylo.

[Datisi]

ico, what ya think? massclaim or just yeet the fuck out of anya?

[Iconeum]

logically speaking, probably?

but gamestate wise, pending who's town, i can see a kill in someone like (Ico/Dats/SS) or something

[Iconeum]

if we yeet anya and she is scum, llama is probably dead yeah