Newbie 1764: Wind Game Over

[ssbm_Kyouko]

sup nerds
reading now
UNVOTE:

[ssbm_Kyouko]

AYYYYYYYYYY WATTUP. BRB catching up on the things I missed. If there are anythings that you want me to go over, want to ask me, ya know, all that good stuff. Once I finish catching up, I will happily give reads.
UNVOTE:

Noooo you changed avatars?

[ssbm_Kyouko]

on page 16 and nydushermain is looking real scummy to me, but no votes on him now, wonder what changed

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I've given my thoughts on accountant potentially being town. If you're asking me to step back and reevaluate, reread the past couple of pages and see what's happening to me. I'm being attacked by people not willing to reevaluate at all and it's forcing me into a corner.

Two things. A. If you are town, me and accountant will both be willing to work with you. But first work with us.
B. In some situations, you won't always get everyone to like you. Sometimes people will interact with you, and then they'll be like "you're fine" and keep your vote on you. This is not because they think you are town, moreso they think that you are the person they want to lynch. If you are town, then I would like to work with you on getting the person who I want to get lynched, well, lynched. Which is Pep. But if you're scum, you're doing fine.

Accountant has made it clear that he isn't willing to work with me. Look at anything he's said in the past like 50 posts. If you're town, I'll work with you but here's something I can say about you.

Actually maybe they're just town that's really confused because this post is like exactly the opposite of what it looks like Acc's doing

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Welcome to the wagon Ramcius! We're happy to have you. That's L-2 btw. If you're ever gonna make a lynch L-2 or L-1, it's better to say it. It's a nice habbit to get into.

Ramicus your thoughts on the case I presented on Pep?

I don't trust other people meta, i mean, i only use my own experience from games with someone and that's it, just example from my other game in other place - i had strong read on someone, who literally refused do a shit, everyone said me stop, it's her meta, let it go, in the end, turned out she was SK, but i don't like Pep, he boast so much, call on everyone for not doing scum hunt, yet he says he don't care game that much to visit every day, even got proded, and still waiting him to do his scum hunt,

but i agree on his lynch D2

(if i survive till then )

There's a lot of anti-town posting going on so far ITT and not all of it can be scum because there are too many people doing it

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Yeah you can't get away from me

buddy

Also Accountant you remind me of Titus

[ssbm_Kyouko]

You seem stubborn in a way that reminds me of her around page 15-20 when you and nyd are pushing each other back and forth

[ssbm_Kyouko]

If you end up as town, Accountant is basically confirming being mafia tbh

Imo you can only line lynches based on "if X flips scum, then Y is probably also scum", never "if X is town..." because it looks scummy even when in your mind it doesn't seem that way because you think surely one of X/Y are scum and if we lynch both we'll catch a scum. There's been like 3 instances of lining lynches going on from (I think) different people so far in the thread and idk that Accountant ever points this out except to call someone scummy for it (because it is scummy) but yeah just be careful about how you phrase it when you have ideas for lining lynches as town. Not sold on town!Pep though

[ssbm_Kyouko]

BTW Kyouko, if you hop on my wagon, I have a good feeling Nyd will hammer it even if it's at L-1.

I saw him talking about hammering the DBW slot because it was (is, as far as I've caught up) lurking but I think he was speaking out of frustration about lynching anyone. I doubt he would lynch his townreads, he seems to organize the game the way I do: push people one way or another away from a neutral line and be willing to compromise to lynch anyone who you aren't strongly TRing, even nulls, if necessary. Of course I'll keep working to sort nulls to get above my "lynch line" or figure out if they're likely scum but I think if pepchoninga, for example, were L-1 at this point he would not hammer pep. Pep's one of his strongest TRs where I'm reading

What makes you think I'm going to hop on your wagon out of curiosity? Did you do something naughty I haven't read yet?

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Also sometimes I recall having seen IoA in some of Pep's posts.

I don't care which one of my two targets gets lynched, as long as they do, because I believe they are both scum.
VOTE: Pepchoninga

Also bussing is common here.

Gamma, what are your reads currently. If me, you, and Accountant work together we can clearly gamesolve this.

Oh I think I can see why there would be a wagon on you now

Charloux, I feel like I've established that I'm okay between going between the two wagons because I think they're both scum and scum needs to get lynched.

I'm not pointing fingers yet, it's just a feeling you get when something unnaturally happened. You switched wagons because there was no point in staying on Nyd's wagon, right? You stated your lynch targets before the wagon dissipated and i don't think you could predict Gamma's and pepcho's behavior so you could prepare beforehand. Nothing wrong i see here.

What was unnatural here? Looks like Alisae sees the wagon on her other scumread is gaining traction and goes with that. Pep's scummier than nyd at the point I'm reading imo

pedit:Will have to catch up to that for full context but with just that and the current read i have like 6 pages before it looks like nyd is tempted to join pep wagon because he's scared of being lynched but he thinks better of it. All the posts being in a row like that is something I do when I feel like I rushed to a decision too quickly as town so I'm more inclined to think that's what's happening. However,

if

Nyd were to flip scum it would certainly look unusual that he didn't take an easy way onto a cw to his own wagon, and the only reason I can think scum would do that in this setup is to avoid lynching their partner. We can't incriminate Pep pre-flip like that though

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I read through a couple of D1s that accountant has been a part of. In one of them, someone got 5 votes by day 2 without him being able to retaliate. On another, I believe jailerkeeper got lynched over night.

Did you check D2 to see if the person who hammered got policy lynched the next day? Or check the role pms of the players that placed the 4th or 5th votes to see if they were scum quickhammering? Did you check Accountant's alignment in these games? This is you resorting to shade throwing onto Acc as soon as the wagon on you dissipates, when you claim you've just woken up and are maybe calmer? Why don't you take a step back and try to look at who else might be scum at this point?

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Because if it was you wouldn't be hiding it from everyone else.

How has he been hiding it? From what I've seen so far Pep has been fairly open about the whole thing.

Wait really, this is your catch up?

[ssbm_Kyouko]

BTW Kyouko, if you hop on my wagon, I have a good feeling Nyd will hammer it even if it's at L-1.

I saw him talking about hammering the DBW slot because it was (is, as far as I've caught up) lurking but I think he was speaking out of frustration about lynching anyone. I doubt he would lynch his townreads, he seems to organize the game the way I do: push people one way or another away from a neutral line and be willing to compromise to lynch anyone who you aren't strongly TRing, even nulls, if necessary. Of course I'll keep working to sort nulls to get above my "lynch line" or figure out if they're likely scum but I think if pepchoninga, for example, were L-1 at this point he would not hammer pep. Pep's one of his strongest TRs where I'm reading

What makes you think I'm going to hop on your wagon out of curiosity? Did you do something naughty I haven't read yet?

Because for some reason people think I'm scum. Also I don't think Nyd would hammer Pep because of this:

Also Nyd, let me ask you another question. As scum, what is your opinion in bussing your partner? Have you ever done it before?

In video mafia yes. I don't think I've ever rolled scum on forum before though. I would never bus a partner if I only had 1 though unless it was a LYLO/MYLO situation.

Also, do you think this is wierd or nah?

Nyd come join the Pep wagon! We have a nice, comfy seat for ya.

Go away vile temptress! I'd like to note that DBW hasn't even voted anyone yet.

VOTE: pep[/unvote]

... I'm horrible at this.

VOTE: pep

This seat isn't actually that comfortable. You lied.

VOTE: DBW

Also look at the timestamps as well. I think they're like all less then a minute.

I've got context now. Looks like he sees Accountant vote an inactive and decides it will be ok to park his vote on an inactive as well. Common scum tactic to stall for time by both of them, but Accountant's vote actually makes sense (Mewtaph was here to talk in RVS but now that there's a big cockfight in the middle of the thread he's nowhere to be seen), whereas nyd's vote is just because DBW lurking without context. Charloux's vote is also sitting there now, but I'm not fully caught up yet. I assume he hasn't posted in the last few pages if there's a request to prod him out though. Didn't like Charloux's line asking about why do people always SR him in games. Some of those on-the-outskirts slots (DBW, Charloux, Gamma, by ascending order of activity) I'd want to hear from them. Gamma almost looks like he's posturing but I feel like I always think that about him and never read him right If we have to deadline lynch someone I'd do DBW but we have a couple of days to work with here. Oh I completely forgot about that Ramcius guy too. Will probably ISO him and Charloux after catchup because I feel like I got mixed signals from their early game and they didn't post much through the post I'm at now.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

i just love how Gamma and Alisae try persuade people join Pep wagon without trying prove he's scum anymore, just begging lynch him

Ramicius problem is Alis and as it seems Gamma too don't actually have any good leads on me. Alis just want to push for a mysslinch. Gamma is either just hopping on it to see what happens or is scum himself.

Also let me remind you I haven't defended Nyd and if I did it definitely wasn't a buddy request. If I defneded him it was to get a stronger case on you and/or Accountat. You are just trying to pull something out of fingers.

Also you talk about Gamma like you are the best buddies and fight crime together. Are YOU buddying him, or are you both crime buddies. Since it didn't seem like he wanted to latch to somebody the way you have seen from the start of the game.

oh good I'm not the only one that reads Gamma this way at least. I do think it's his playstyle but I've only completed one game with him as town and never seen his scumgame

pedit: Posturing around the Accountant/ Nyd/ Pep/ Alisae fight, like trying to see which way the tide is turning before committing to something. I'm on my first read though so maybe I'm just noticing the rest of the players in the game less than these 4

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Ramsicus is probably town. There's maybe 1 scum in those 3 Alisae/pep/nyd unless they're making a really suboptimal bus so one scum left in gamma/DWB/Charloux/Accountant. Need to work out more TRs from deeper reading for PoE though

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Exactly, I just wanna PoE the game so that town can win.

Also, Pep asked you this:

Also Kyouko have you got any reads on the game or are you still catching up?

817 was my reply to that I just didn't quote it

[ssbm_Kyouko]

THAT is one of the main reasons why I SRed him early on

(Along with his passiveness overall)

Also, if I am really wrong, you need to start proving that I am wrong instead of fucking just saying "he's wrong."
If they were really "left behind" or "countered" counter them again.

You should probably reread that entire section instead of just plucking quotes from his ISO. I know I just read this a couple days ago so it's fresh in my memory but the way I remember it pep is telling the truth here and you're either misunderstanding, remembering wrong, conf biasing, or misrepresenting him.

If you want to prove you're right go back and quote where he's now contradicting what he said back then, because that SR on Accountant was not necessarily a playstyle thing. Sure maybe Accountant is always slow to start a push and compounds on a push as he gains support, but if that's the case he has a scummy playstyle. It's not on us to know his meta

[ssbm_Kyouko]

My reads goes as follows.
Scum: Pep
Other potential scum: Nyd, DBW, Charloux
Town: Ramcius, Mewtaph, Accountant, myself.

Pep has been lurking up to this point. And you may think it's due to inactivity, but I doubt that. Like he's posting in gaps, and if he was town, he's someone I'd expect to be more active and vocal. He's moreso reserved and safe leading up to his posts today. Also he shows no interest in scumhunting.
Not having anyone voted at this point in time tells me you have no real scum reads. This also goes for DBW, who's also lurking, except I don't know them. Either way I see them as a potential partner.
I can see Charloux being paired up with Pep easily. Charloux goes after lurkers but ignores Pep. This seems off to me.
As for Nyd, I'm following Accountant's reasoning and logic moreso then Nyd's on Accountant. Or they could just both be town, which I see happening.

Your only real strong points are that I was innactive for a bit and that I'm not interested in scumhunting. Now let me tell ya, I am interested in scumhunting. Actually I'm trying to achieve that. Kinda hard when you can't really find a place in the disscussion till now. My prime targets till now were Accountatn and Ramicius. Two people you put as Town on your list. Yet you almost haven't touched on anything those 2 people have said till now. And there one of the most active people in the game till now. Most of the post I read from you are on my posts and going againt me. You have a personal agenta? Or you just want to get me out of the game as soon as possible since I'm gonna be the easiest target for you? Let me also point out that I hate when people just say that they are confirmed town in there opinion and put it like it's something normal. For me it's a veyr scummy move and one that should not be neglected. What makes you think you are a town?

You not voting should also be considered a valid point.
You have shown nothing to prove that you are scumhunting, and currently you're just defending yourself.
What about Ramicius seemed scummy to you?
I think your scum, and I want the town to win? That's sorta what I'm trying to do here.

And you're reading my reads wrong. You wanna know a tell I recently just learned? Scum trying to push things that aren't slips. Because scum LOVE having a justified vote. Saying that I am slipping for reading them as confirmed town is a mistake, becuase I am not reading them as confirmed town, I am reading them as I think they are town.

And what makes me think I'm town? My role pm.

Who should I vote in this situation? You? Accountant? Ramicus or Ny? Should I jump on the waggon or try and go against my targets. Will I get the support needed and will people agree with my suspicions? You know those are all questions I need to answer myself and get other people to answer some of them before I put my real lynch. But for now I will go with a lynch that my heart tell me.

VOTE: Alisae

And yes I am curently scumhinting also I'm defneding myself since you are only going against me. You haven't defended against my accusations tho. Don't think it's very townish to avoid my suspicions.
I did make a post basically saying why I Scum read Ramicius.
I didn't really understand what you meant with the next one buddy but ok.
And what makes me not belive you? You not being able to show me that pm

Why'd you decide to vote Alisae if you made a post about SRing Ramsicus? Went back and looked at your post on Ramsicus and it looks like you sort of dismiss your own read at the end, unless I was looking at the wrong post. Which post were you referring to when you said you made a post basically saying why you scumread Ramsicus?

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Kyouko, it's not like you to not have placed a vote by now.
Knowing you, you usually make a point on not voting = not notable scum reads.

I'm trying to decide which, if any of you 3 are scum but I'm thinking from the way this is happening you're all town and the scum are outside of it all.
There's also a safe DBW lynch waiting at deadline so I want to be more sure before I set one of you up to get deadlined when we could deadline an inactive instead

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Because if it was you wouldn't be hiding it from everyone else.

How has he been hiding it? From what I've seen so far Pep has been fairly open about the whole thing.

Wait really, this is your catch up?

@DBW - You've been gone almost all day, are you caught up yet? Have any strong reads? Particularly on Alisae/Pep/Nyd?

I read through a couple of D1s that accountant has been a part of. In one of them, someone got 5 votes by day 2 without him being able to retaliate. On another, I believe jailerkeeper got lynched over night.

Did you check D2 to see if the person who hammered got policy lynched the next day? Or check the role pms of the players that placed the 4th or 5th votes to see if they were scum quickhammering? Did you check Accountant's alignment in these games? This is you resorting to shade throwing onto Acc as soon as the wagon on you dissipates, when you claim you've just woken up and are maybe calmer? Why don't you take a step back and try to look at who else might be scum at this point?

BTW Kyouko, if you hop on my wagon, I have a good feeling Nyd will hammer it even if it's at L-1.

I saw him talking about hammering the DBW slot because it was (is, as far as I've caught up) lurking but I think he was speaking out of frustration about lynching anyone. I doubt he would lynch his townreads, he seems to organize the game the way I do: push people one way or another away from a neutral line and be willing to compromise to lynch anyone who you aren't strongly TRing, even nulls, if necessary. Of course I'll keep working to sort nulls to get above my "lynch line" or figure out if they're likely scum but I think if pepchoninga, for example, were L-1 at this point he would not hammer pep. Pep's one of his strongest TRs where I'm reading

What makes you think I'm going to hop on your wagon out of curiosity? Did you do something naughty I haven't read yet?

Because for some reason people think I'm scum. Also I don't think Nyd would hammer Pep because of this:

Also Nyd, let me ask you another question. As scum, what is your opinion in bussing your partner? Have you ever done it before?

In video mafia yes. I don't think I've ever rolled scum on forum before though. I would never bus a partner if I only had 1 though unless it was a LYLO/MYLO situation.

Also, do you think this is wierd or nah?

Nyd come join the Pep wagon! We have a nice, comfy seat for ya.

Go away vile temptress! I'd like to note that DBW hasn't even voted anyone yet.

VOTE: pep[/unvote]

... I'm horrible at this.

VOTE: pep

This seat isn't actually that comfortable. You lied.

VOTE: DBW

Also look at the timestamps as well. I think they're like all less then a minute.

I've got context now. Looks like he sees Accountant vote an inactive and decides it will be ok to park his vote on an inactive as well. Common scum tactic to stall for time by both of them, but Accountant's vote actually makes sense (Mewtaph was here to talk in RVS but now that there's a big cockfight in the middle of the thread he's nowhere to be seen), whereas nyd's vote is just because DBW lurking without context. Charloux's vote is also sitting there now, but I'm not fully caught up yet. I assume he hasn't posted in the last few pages if there's a request to prod him out though. Didn't like Charloux's line asking about why do people always SR him in games. Some of those on-the-outskirts slots (DBW, Charloux, Gamma, by ascending order of activity) I'd want to hear from them. Gamma almost looks like he's posturing but I feel like I always think that about him and never read him right If we have to deadline lynch someone I'd do DBW but we have a couple of days to work with here. Oh I completely forgot about that Ramcius guy too. Will probably ISO him and Charloux after catchup because I feel like I got mixed signals from their early game and they didn't post much through the post I'm at now.

@Nyd - bumping the first of these quotes for your response, and want your opinion on the second one too, specifically: why do you scumread DBW? I get why we would deadline him because the lynch is the safest at this point, but why did you vote him while he was inactive? He can't respond to questions or give thoughts while he's gone, so what does your vote accomplish there? Why aren't you asking him anything now that he's back?

[ssbm_Kyouko]

In a similar vein, Accountant, you unvoted me so quickly, but never asked me anything. I thought your vote seemed more acceptable than Nyd's but it doesn't sit well with me the way you swapped your vote back as soon as I showed up. Why prrssure Mewtaph/me while he was being prodded but not Charloux when he's hardly here, but is still clearly keeping up?

[ssbm_Kyouko]

now you sound like cornered mafia - why town would say that? Or you still think Accountant is mafia?

Yep, i am cornered, but i'm not mafia. I'd rather risk myself be mislynched than spill the beans. Why would town say what? Everything i said was labeled as scummy so i don't know what you're talking about.

I'm not saying Acc is scum, but do you think you can catch him if he is?

Why are you discouraging him from scumhunting here, particularly hunting Accountant? It only serves to lower morale imo

My head hurts from the last few pages... Everybody is acting so toxic...
One thing i don't like about Nyd at this point is how he tried to redirect our attention to Gamma first about his read list. And Pepcho a few pages ago, can't even find it anymore. He is also casting shade at Accountant and Alisae.

But he is being consistent in being inconsistent and that is what's preventing me from scumreading him.

Also i'm troubled with the DBW wagon. There was a lack of resistance to the wagon apart from Nyd. So i think they share the same alignment, and i don't remember a game where finding both scum is this easy.

Well there's another person you're waffling on, why so hesitant to take a stance here too?

I do understand you Charloux. Even tho I would love to lynch Alisae since I do see a lot of his action made out of pure cockiness I do see why you wouldn't do it.

I am asking for you to give opinions on the matter. If a lynch is done it should probably be on DBW since one less person is innactive is better.

But still, we are 21 pages in and you don't have any strong scumreads...this is strange. I would advise you to go ahead the posts once again if posible since you will get accused by people soon, just like Alis tryid to do with me.

I don't think i will survive tonight so there is no need to worry about me getting accused of lack of reads.
What matter are you talking about, i must've misunderstood your question since i think i answered it.

This is a suspicious answer to me. Not worried about having a lack of reads? I would be more worried about getting my reads out today if I didn't expect to survive the night.

And i'm really interested in why i'm getting scumread in every single game without exception. When you read my posts your gut tells you i'm scum, correct? Is it because of my tone or something?

It's posts like this and fencesitting in general that are probably getting you scumread. That's where I'm at now. You've been around the whole time but seem nearly as unopinionated as DBW who has made maybe 10 posts. This doesn't sit right with me. What's your strongest scumread and why?

VOTE: Charloux

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Kyouko your thoughts about the reaction test I pulled out on Nyd?

I think fake hammer tests are generally useless because most players will check the VC before replying. Which he did.

@alisae - yeah if he's scum it's working

@ssbm, sorry I'm kinda confused T.T . Which quote are you asking me to respond to? The first two of the quotes you made or the first two quotes in the last quote that you listed?

I quoted one post for DBW, the 2nd and 3rd posts are for you. Bumping g the 2nd quote which was a direct question to you and bumping the 3rd quote to ask you about your DBW vote

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Lunch is over, be back tonight

Pedit: he's voting only because he's been gone as far as I can tell. No content

[ssbm_Kyouko]

also at this point I think Ram is VI

I don't see this tbh. Seems like he's a bit brazen but trying to sort people directly, not like he's memeing or clowning around or anything like that.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Tbh I think pep needs an avatar. One of those players I've been waffling on, sends too many scummy and townie signals but lately he's seemed really town. Got work tomorrow and I'll be getting fucked up afterwards and probably passing out. Ram is a read I'm really sold on though and I think points raised on Alisae about provoking him seem solid. Would rather lynch this than a slot with no associations to speak of
VOTE: Alisae
L-1

Also talking about the PRs and setup after claiming VT looks really suspicious to me

Will be back before deadline like on my lunch tomorrow and maybe before bed after my friends leave my house, then in the morning within a couple hours of deadline

[ssbm_Kyouko]

That was clearly a frustrated self-hammer, a strategic one wouldn't point out PR tells. Not what I was expecting for either flip, but I guess the Charloux kill is unsurprising after what Alisae said. Gonna start here until something meaningful comes out of DBW though
VOTE: DBW

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Yeah Christmas was an unfortunate time for deadline, surprised it wasn't set a few days past Christmas from the get-go

[ssbm_Kyouko]

How did you evolve from me being town to suddenly possible scum? One of the ways you read me was in the quote below:

Pep, I'm just gonna interpret that as an OMGUS vote. Also the fact that I'm not defending myself from your accusations makes me think you're even more scummy then you already are. Who says I have to defend myself if I think scum is attacking me?
And instead of voting me, you could be civil and coperative and give me the reasons instead of making me ISO you for it.
And generally most people include themselves as town. That's just natural and good play.

What are you talking about? Why wouldn't you defend yourself? What if he's town? This is anti-town if you are town FYI. You're so blinded that you replace into a game, skim through a few posts and call someone scum and instead of trying to refute a point that someone makes against you, you just call them scummy and say nothing? You're ACTUALLY avoiding the question with zero answer, not a half answer like mine apparently.

Honestly I find this post as a plus for ny not because he is protecting me, but mostly because you can see his pure frustration which is made out of a pure town mindset.

so you're saying you read me off "pure frustration" which is probably off tone (I'm assuming).

Yet after the EoD, accountant who had been scum reading me for the majority of the game and ended up giving me a null read decided to read me town after my reaction. To me, that means that my reaction was townier than my reactions towards pressure, etc., so I feel like the way you're reading the game is inconsistent. I'd expect an even stronger town read out of you on me.

Why do you not see the way Accountant reads the game as inconsistent? You're using Accountant as a reference point for Pep's behavior arbitrarily here.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Deathbywobbuffet did not pick up prod and is being replaced.

UNVOTE:
for now, gotta reread game I think. Not too many pages

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Who said I was towny?

VOTE: nydushermain

Don't like the reasons being given for voting pep, his wagon stinks and with Alisae dead that leaves you for first half of scum with gamma/acc/screenplay partner. Also feel like you wouldn't be so fast to jump on the same wagon as Accountant if your read on him was really what it seems to have consistently been since early D1. Scumreading him but then using his behavior as a reference point for what town should be doing, and using that reference point to say pep is scummy is so backwards. I feel like the read given on Accountant is inconsistent with the interactions with him and leads me to believe it's scum!Nyd probably with Accountant, still can't rule out Gamma or Screenplay as partners though.


@Screen - I don't think reads lists are a good idea right now, mislynching today puts us in LyLo and having reads out on the table lets scum decide who to NK to tailor the group mindset towards mislynching tomorrow
Pep is L-1, but I see it as TvT as well, seems like he's not getting lynched anytime soon.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

The words look towny enough there, sure, but I'm more interested in reading people by what they do, not what they say. Scum will say things that look towny in an effort to get TRed. Scum will also do things that don't line up with what they're saying and that's where you catch them. When I take the way Nyd treats Accountant and compare it to how he says he sees Accountant, I find a discrepancy.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

@Mod - VLA through Jan. 2

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Hmm. I see the points being made on Acc but feel like nyd is more likely to flip scum, unless it's Gamma/Acc? Seems like there's somewhat circular relationships within [Gamma, Nyd, Accountant]. Defenses of one another in some places, the way Nyd uses Acc/Gamma's reaction to his post as the standard and judge's Pep for it.

Acc and Nyd's relationship D1 could have been distancing as well, seems like they moved from SRing one another pretty strongly early and then end up ignoring/TRing each other later. There was that meta dive from nyd and then Accountant sort of fell off and ended up pushing Alisae and I. Pushing Pep now too, they're all on that wagon now actually, until that unvote which could be the scumteam realizing their wagon wasn't going to go through.

Could go anywhere in those 3 at this point but would prefer Nyd, he seems to make sense with either of the others.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Hmm. I see the points being made on Acc but feel like nyd is more likely to flip scum, unless it's Gamma/Acc? Seems like there's somewhat circular relationships within [Gamma, Nyd, Accountant]. Defenses of one another in some places, the way Nyd uses Acc/Gamma's reaction to his post as the standard and judge's Pep for it.

Acc and Nyd's relationship D1 could have been distancing as well, seems like they moved from SRing one another pretty strongly early and then end up ignoring/TRing each other later. There was that meta dive from nyd and then Accountant sort of fell off and ended up pushing Alisae and I. Pushing Pep now too, they're all on that wagon now actually, until that unvote which could be the scumteam realizing their wagon wasn't going to go through.

Could go anywhere in those 3 at this point but would prefer Nyd, he seems to make sense with either of the others.

Is it all you have against Nyd

? Cause now you look like defending Acc after he getting heat

Could you rephrase that question? Not sure what "it" is referring to. I'm not defending him, I suspect the team is within [Nyd, Gamma, Accountant]. Nyd is the most obvious of the 3 imo and should be lynched first. Both Acc and Gamma were playing similarly yesterday, I pointed out what looked like posturing to me back then. Have 2 mislynches left so I guess it doesn't matter which we lynch first if I'm right, but I might be wrong which is why I'd rather lynch my top SR.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Oh Gamma isn't a new thing you can read my iso, but I'll quote where I first pointed him out. Nyd is most obvious for 2 things. 1) the big fight D1 between Nyd and Alisae when Pep was on the side reading, I got the impression one of those 3 was scum and the other was outside, either that or maybe it was just the outsiders that were scum. And 2) the way he used Accountant/Gamma's interpretations of his behavior as an arbitrary gauge for measuring Pep's interpretation of that same behavior, then came to the conclusion Pep was scum for it.

Spoiler: Posts involving my D1 Gamma suspicions

BTW Kyouko, if you hop on my wagon, I have a good feeling Nyd will hammer it even if it's at L-1.

I saw him talking about hammering the DBW slot because it was (is, as far as I've caught up) lurking but I think he was speaking out of frustration about lynching anyone. I doubt he would lynch his townreads, he seems to organize the game the way I do: push people one way or another away from a neutral line and be willing to compromise to lynch anyone who you aren't strongly TRing, even nulls, if necessary. Of course I'll keep working to sort nulls to get above my "lynch line" or figure out if they're likely scum but I think if pepchoninga, for example, were L-1 at this point he would not hammer pep. Pep's one of his strongest TRs where I'm reading

What makes you think I'm going to hop on your wagon out of curiosity? Did you do something naughty I haven't read yet?

Because for some reason people think I'm scum. Also I don't think Nyd would hammer Pep because of this:

Also Nyd, let me ask you another question. As scum, what is your opinion in bussing your partner? Have you ever done it before?

In video mafia yes. I don't think I've ever rolled scum on forum before though. I would never bus a partner if I only had 1 though unless it was a LYLO/MYLO situation.

Also, do you think this is wierd or nah?

Nyd come join the Pep wagon! We have a nice, comfy seat for ya.

Go away vile temptress! I'd like to note that DBW hasn't even voted anyone yet.

VOTE: pep[/unvote]

... I'm horrible at this.

VOTE: pep

This seat isn't actually that comfortable. You lied.

VOTE: DBW

Also look at the timestamps as well. I think they're like all less then a minute.

I've got context now. Looks like he sees Accountant vote an inactive and decides it will be ok to park his vote on an inactive as well. Common scum tactic to stall for time by both of them, but Accountant's vote actually makes sense (Mewtaph was here to talk in RVS but now that there's a big cockfight in the middle of the thread he's nowhere to be seen), whereas nyd's vote is just because DBW lurking without context. Charloux's vote is also sitting there now, but I'm not fully caught up yet. I assume he hasn't posted in the last few pages if there's a request to prod him out though. Didn't like Charloux's line asking about why do people always SR him in games. Some of those on-the-outskirts slots (DBW, Charloux, Gamma, by ascending order of activity) I'd want to hear from them. Gamma almost looks like he's posturing but I feel like I always think that about him and never read him right If we have to deadline lynch someone I'd do DBW but we have a couple of days to work with here. Oh I completely forgot about that Ramcius guy too. Will probably ISO him and Charloux after catchup because I feel like I got mixed signals from their early game and they didn't post much through the post I'm at now.

i just love how Gamma and Alisae try persuade people join Pep wagon without trying prove he's scum anymore, just begging lynch him

Ramicius problem is Alis and as it seems Gamma too don't actually have any good leads on me. Alis just want to push for a mysslinch. Gamma is either just hopping on it to see what happens or is scum himself.

Also let me remind you I haven't defended Nyd and if I did it definitely wasn't a buddy request. If I defneded him it was to get a stronger case on you and/or Accountat. You are just trying to pull something out of fingers.

Also you talk about Gamma like you are the best buddies and fight crime together. Are YOU buddying him, or are you both crime buddies. Since it didn't seem like he wanted to latch to somebody the way you have seen from the start of the game.

oh good I'm not the only one that reads Gamma this way at least. I do think it's his playstyle but I've only completed one game with him as town and never seen his scumgame

pedit: Posturing around the Accountant/ Nyd/ Pep/ Alisae fight, like trying to see which way the tide is turning before committing to something. I'm on my first read though so maybe I'm just noticing the rest of the players in the game less than these 4

Alisae was starting to act really anti-town at the end. Calling out Charloux as a PR tell looks like something scum would do to tell their teammate who to NK if scum!Alisae thought her lynch was inevitable, because there is no daytalk. D1 I was thinking there was probably 1 scum in [Ali, Pep, Nyd] and the other scum in [Charloux, Gamma, Accountant, DBW]. You were my only TR going into that lynch and I've still felt pretty good about that read up until the Accountant unvote you just did. You say it's to avoid a hammer but nobody quickhammers because quickhammering gets you lynched the next day on this site. If we were in LyLo it'd be different but that was weird

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Oh shoot just realized I never replied to this thread earlier today. Want to wait until nyd comes back since we have time to, before considering hammering Accountant. Still think that Nyd/Gamma is possible so not too keen on this lynch yet

Also, in response to what Accountant asked me a few pages back, Pep fits in as town there, as is implied in the post:

Hmm. I see the points being made on Acc but feel like nyd is more likely to flip scum, unless it's Gamma/Acc? Seems like there's somewhat circular relationships within [Gamma, Nyd, Accountant]. Defenses of one another in some places, the way Nyd uses Acc/Gamma's reaction to his post as the standard and judge's Pep for it.

Acc and Nyd's relationship D1 could have been distancing as well, seems like they moved from SRing one another pretty strongly early and then end up ignoring/TRing each other later. There was that meta dive from nyd and then Accountant sort of fell off and ended up pushing Alisae and I. Pushing Pep now too, they're all on that wagon now actually, until that unvote which could be the scumteam realizing their wagon wasn't going to go through.

Could go anywhere in those 3 at this point but would prefer Nyd, he seems to make sense with either of the others.

Where is Pep here?

At least it seemed like it would be apparent Pep fits in as town there. Not sure how it could be read in any other way

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Well I was wondering why you saw Accountant at L-1 and chose to call it tempting but not write anything about SRing him, even though it seems like your read on him has moved from scum early day 1 into town more recently. But now he's at L-1, and you say it looks tempting. I want to know why you thought that, because I'm thinking the team i s either [You + Gamma] or [You + Accountant]. You saying Accountant looks tempting makes him look less appealing as scum to me because it points to You/Gamma

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Well I was wondering why you saw Accountant at L-1 and chose to call it tempting but not write anything about SRing him, even though it seems like your read on him has moved from scum early day 1 into town more recently. But now he's at L-1, and you say it looks tempting. I want to know why you thought that, because I'm thinking the team i s either [You + Gamma] or [You + Accountant]. You saying Accountant looks tempting makes him look less appealing as scum to me because it points to You/Gamma

If this is the case, then you should definitely have given intent to hammer immediately. If I flip scum, then that's good. If I flip town, then you immediately know that the scumteam is Gamma and Pepchoninga and can easily win the game from there. Why didn't you give intent?

Oh I was talking to nyd here btw not Pep. Just because I'm

thinking

the team is 2 of a set of 3 players does not mean that the team

is

2 out of a set of 3 players. I can't just immediately

know

the scumteam if you flip town. I didn't give intent to hammer because I am more SRing Nyd and want to lynch him right now. Also since I think the team is either Nyd/Gamma or Nyd/Acc it doesn't make sense to lynch Gamma or Acc if I'm not forced to by deadline unless I can eliminate Gamma or Acc from my suspects, and I don't see Gamma caring to post much really. It's been a lot of Ramcius/Pep/Screenplay talking at you and you talking back but Gamma remains quiet. I asked Nyd him this question to try to sort whether or not you were likely to be scum with him or if it was more likely to be Nyd+Gamma.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Well, I'm assuming Gamma's not the roleblocker or he wouldn't be doing this. I'm a cop, checked pep N1 and got town result, checked gamma last night and got nothing back. Thinking it might be nyd/gamma and they chose to block because they thought I had a guilty on nyd yesterday.

Want to figure out if it's gamma/nyd or gamma/screenplay before day ends though, tomorrow is still lylo and I'm bound to die tonight

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Actually I guess it doesn't even matter if he is since I'll die though

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Just got to this game after work/sleep. Least interested in my newbies so I tend to get to my other stuff first

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Just got to this game after work/sleep. Least interested in my newbies so I tend to get to my other stuff first

I feel like I'd be interested if I were cop??

When you get out of newbie queue and into the bigger games I think you'll understand this a bit better

I want ssbm to explain his thought process on day 2 interactions with his confirmed town!pep. Gamma, I want you to explain why you checked charloux after the end of day 1 where Alisae pretty much said he was pr, as well as I.

What do you mean by my thought process on day 2 interactions with pep? Are you asking why we hardly interacted? I had a town result on him and was working on the assumption there was probably 1 scum in Alisae, Pep, Nyd from day 1 unless scum was completely lurking on the outside. With Alisae dead and Pep cleared I was leaning to nyd by PoE but at daybreak, if both scum were lurking that PoE wouldn't work so I went for the lurker slot.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Well if screenplay isn't hammering here it must be gamma/nyd, so pep vote nyd tomorrow if I'm the nk

VOTE: Gamma

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Well I will be the nk if gamma is the roleblocker but if nyd is RB they might leave me alive, but yeah it's Gamma/nyd

I needed to find the second scum before voting him so he couldn't self-hammer before I had time to figure it out and then NK me

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Well I will be the nk if gamma is the roleblocker but if nyd is RB they might leave me alive, but yeah it's Gamma/nyd

I needed to find the second scum before voting him so he couldn't self-hammer before I had time to figure it out and then NK me

ROFL what? how's that ever a thought process haha. Die.

Is this a joke? The game continues in LyLo tomorrow, it's not as easy as lynching 1 scum, now that I've found both I'm voting

[ssbm_Kyouko]

What I mean is "how's that ever a thought process" supposed to be sarcasm?

The game isn't over until we lynch both scum, and I might die tonight, so why would I not use what time I have to catch the second scum after confirming the first?

If Accountant were here to IC he'd be saying the same thing, I'm sure even Gamma agrees this is optimal play but I doubt he'll say it for obvious reasons. If you weren't caught already and weren't a newbie that'd be a slip

pedit:RB can block me and kill conftown Pep, are you even trying?

[ssbm_Kyouko]

If I had rushed the vote on Gamma his fakeclaim would have worked out to where cop was revealed and there would have been potential for scum to self-hammer. If scum didn't know I was cop right now, I would have a decent chance of coming into tomorrow with enough results to know who the scum was either by PoE or a straight up guilty on scum. The only reason for Gamma to make that claim in LyLo was to bait me out, so I waited to vote once I'd realized what was going on

[ssbm_Kyouko]

You literally quoted the post you misrepped in the post that you misrepped me in lol. I said I was least interested in my newbies and that I tend to get to my other stuff (other games) first, not that I was not interested in this game. I'm interested in all of my games. I didn't know if Pep was alive until I got to the game.

You weren't confscum to me until screenplay didn't hammer me when he posted while I was L-1. Gamma was confscum when he claimed, but as I said, that left the last scum to be between you and screenplay. If one of you 2 were roleblocker and I would have voted Gamma too early a quickhammer could have happened, and then the roleblocker amongst you could block me and kill pep, then it would be on me to figure out which of you were scum tomorrow. By waiting, I was able to figure out which of you are the second scum and now Pep knows too so it doesn't matter whether I die or not because Pep or I *will* live to see tomorrow and lynch you.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

So you're saying that if you just didn't CC, we would have possibly lynched the UNCOUNTERCLAIMED tracker? And then you'd go onto the next day as a "cop" ???? LOL get out of here. Please tell me people are reading this.

I'm saying the only reason Gamma claimed is because he's a goon with a roleblocker and the doctor flip confirmed to his team that there was a cop. He claimed to get the cop into the open and possibly win today by lynching me. It takes 1 town to mislynch in LyLo though and that doesn't look like it's going to happen now that you and Gamma are out in the open

pedit: If I voted with my claim and Pep or Screenplay were too hasty Gamma could have self-hammered to keep any discussion from happening between the last 3 town so that there would be only 2 town left to discuss the game tomorrow

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I'm saying that once my claim was in the open Gamma had what he wanted out of his claim

[ssbm_Kyouko]

There's no point in him fakeclaiming if he wasn't worried about the cop coming into tomorrow with results to autowin

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I'm saying that once my claim was in the open Gamma had what he wanted out of his claim

Wait a minute. LOL

If you were town, you would have already known that gamma was confirmed scum to you. Pep, your "confirmed town" had already voted on gamma and neither me nor screenplay were hammering so it couldn't be us two. Lack of "attempts at game solving"

You realize it takes 3 votes to hammer, right? Neither you nor Screenplay could have hammered Gamma when Pep was the only one voting. I also wasn't in the thread at all while Pep was voting. As I said, I got to this game after my other games

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Also not sure how you can argue that I haven't been gamesolving when I've been quite transparent with how I used my checks and PoE to narrow down scum, and with how I waited to vote until after I had figured out the last scum.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Yeah I was pretty hopeful we would win tomorrow anyways if screenplay killed gamma but I wanted to get it today. Biggest piece of advice I could give you is do the vote in LyLo as town until you're positive about who's scum, especially outside of the newbie queue where scum might have daychat. Even without daychat scum can agree to be online at the same time every day to look if there's a vote on town and if there is, agree to blitz and hammer for the win. Even though you were supposedly watching the thread when you voted the first time there was still a chance to lose if screen and I had agreed on a time to blitz

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Eh, gamma is low activity currently, I'm in a couple other games with him

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Oh meant to say don't vote in LyLo if town like that. Gamma and I are expected to vote each other though since our claims do the work together. What I said about catching the second scum before voting is good play though, would have done the same thing if I was really the cop.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Oh also Charloux PR told very early, he was already the NK before Alisae said anything, but Alisae still shouldn't say that, just gives scum fuel to push your lynch

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I didn't know you were protective but shooting the vest is fine, we knew the setup didn't line up with roleblocker and iirc I was in charge of the first NK because DBW was gone. Anyways I'm good with mafia or being released as it is

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Like if you're the BP and we shoot the vest it's not so bad because you're no longer BP, you're not confirmed yet, and there are more targets for mislynched on d2. Puts us in MyLo instead of lylo d3 if scum don't get hit which gives scum good odds since there are more targets for mislynches.

[ssbm_Kyouko]

Huh. I actually thought pep was the only living town I could fake an innocent on and get away with it after reading my own ISO, but I guess the fact I refused to hammer them when they were L-1 on D2 might have convinced nyd to vote pep tomorrow (in F3?) What does the F stand for? I understand it means 5 way lylo or 3 way lylo just don't follow the F terminology

[ssbm_Kyouko]

4a lol, it's true though. How was hard SRing nyd a scum claim? I explained in my fake claim that I was SRing him by PoE after knowing pep was town from checking him

[ssbm_Kyouko]

I was actually not intending to make pep look scum by clearing him, I actually thought we would be screwed if I got lynched because I thought nyd TRed pep, when Pep was L-1 from ram/Gamma/acc I remember nyd was defending town!Pep pretty hard. Claiming innocent on pep changed his mind some I guess