Open 873: PYP: Anime Music & Memes - Game Over!

[petapan]

FF is town pinging me slightly. I'm being cautious, but they just keep going in the right direction to me.

i have to say that while i appreciate that she's here and defending me, i have not actually seen anything that instills confidence in me that she is town

[petapan]

Who do you feel is defending marci?

save the dragns, greyice, lld, unwnd, either directly or indirectly

in the world where she's town there's almost certainly scum in that group

i don't read the game that way currently but it's a contingency because i've seen that type of tactic plenty of times

[petapan]

i said what i said. it's not about keeping a townie alive to look better but the fact that marci if town is basically playing in a way that is negative utility such that her being around is in scum's best interests because she's never going to actually catch scum and will never clear herself and so is a useful misvote down the line either way. i think there's been plenty of discussion about how a claimed tracker is not actually that valuable with multiple scum alive and given scum were likely cop hunting they clearly have bigger targets to go after

so do you dislike the insinuation you wouldn't take marci as a free elimination if scum? because realistically i don't think anyone NKs her here

maybe it's not useful analysis but i felt like discussing the thought as a contingency because i don't want to go yep this is the world we're living in 100% and i won't consider alternatives where i'm wrong

as it is i still think the most likely answer is she's just scum and town are being silly

[petapan]

My point is that your statement is effectively toothless and without any real weight, peta. Not only is is a mathematically useless statement, it also logically doesn't hold a lot of water because the situation is different than the one you're imagining, I suspect.

i guess

i didn't really intend it as anything more than off the cuff speculation i spent about 3 minutes thinking about after seeing ffery's post

[petapan]

Yes I heavily dislike the insinuation that scum don't take the easy elimination on a townie if she's town and prevent a heavy power role from flipping that they need to be scared of. Like, one of the main info roles.

I think the analysis is weird and wrong and strangely names a handful of players who I would describe as "harder than average to kill, but susceptible to paranoia for death later on" which makes my eyebrow raise.

i've seen it multiple times where scum divert attention away from a lightning rod townie to push other eliminations because they know that play is an easy kill. seen it and done it myself. there are certain players where you just know they're never gonna start actually playing.

you may find the insinuation you'd play that way to be egregious and that's fair to argue. maybe that's a sign of townie entitlement. i'm not pushing you now nor do i plan to push you but i think the idea i tip my cards like this as scum is pretty silly, the only reason i have to discuss this possibility at all is to bring it up in the event i'm not alive in a future day.

[petapan]

But as much as it's off the cuff for you you have a presence that leads people to take your statements with a lot of authority.

So... I felt it best to inject a little clarity onto it.

lol nothing i say this game is getting taken with authority but i appreciate the reality check

[petapan]

i guess if i can lay my cards on the table, so to speak

i do think you're town but the world where you're scum scares me more than other worlds because i know you'd draft strategically where certain other team combinations are more likely to make less optimal choices

[petapan]

i'm owned

[petapan]

i think peta/scummystral is never a thing here too ; )

What are your reasons?

i think its dumb 4 2 scum to be tunneled on the same townie. its not a cute look.
i dont think its as dumb for 1 scum to be though but idfk need to think deeply one day

you have seen this happen before in a game so this comes across as overly simplistic thinking on your part

and do you have an actual reason for dunnstral being scum aside from him pushing you?

[petapan]

the thing game i ran, scum tripled up their votes on the same townie day 1 in a desperate attempt to not lose. i thought it was on her slot but it turns out it was a different one.

granted she may outright not remember it given how little attention she paid to the game, it's a sign of lazy thinking not necessarily scum thinking but it all feels half-baked


regardless i'm okay with kicking that can down the road one more day. i want firebringer to claim. it super sucks if the slot is town and rh9 nuked it for no good reason but i cannot ever see it getting cleared now short of a cop report

[petapan]

no, and i had doubts on the read back on day 1, verifiably

[petapan]

Spoiler:

good take, unwnd

now we actually gotta sleep, fr now

oh

by the way bell.... VOTE: Bell goodnight

<3

vicky

VOTE: Taly

FOS: NOTTY.

*Petapan numbers speculation*
I just picked 2 to the 10th power.

I also scumread notty without elaborating

Your response to Taly sucked.

You called them boring instead of obvious frozen scum.

good take, unwnd

now we actually gotta sleep, fr now

oh

by the way bell.... VOTE: Bell goodnight

<3

vicky

They should just be bullshit based on your innocence right

Stake your position or something

i think you misunderstand

we're not entertaining other people's reads

because

they're true, we're discerning the motivation despite internal dissonance

interesting that the two most suspected slots were also the first slots to have semi-serious convo

vicky

I feel like if this were true you wouldn't have voted me without asking me anything.

From what I understand, you baited us into pushing you so you could

justify

your read.

You doubtcasting both

Notty

and our slot when we had resolved a read on the other is disingenuous.

I like Vicky's vote.

-Gaia +Taly

Sure.
Twice I have caught scum who called their partners boring instead of scum. Simple, boring, I know. It's just honest to goodness excuse not to put fire on them. I Also find it slightly weird that Notty put that much effort into controlling for a player's idiosyncracies this early in the game. Also they keep trying to manipulate people's feelings to get off of them and that rubs me bad. *Thumbs down*

Last game I was in Taly was either meltdowning or efforting.

I think I just carry my suspicions from game to game without any reason or logic.

I don't scum read Marci, I just don't town read them. They're always kind of weird, fake, and survivory when they play mafia. So it's pretty hard to read them.

I don't like that you've framed Taly has meltdowning/distressed as opposed to seeking information when there wasn't any present through reaction testing.

It's poor faith, Bell.

Specifically in the statement after the bolded, where you acknowledged that this is a bias you hold against him.

- Gaia

Hmmmm, we still have reservations with

Bell

but this vote is feeling like a vanity at this point.

VOTE: Ydrasse -

Yume's (yes, ours)

itching for a weighted wagon.

So far our system agreed on two townreads;

peta

and

notty

, and that's a LOT more work than it sounds lmao



we gotta sleep, night

Taly

home

VOTE: unwnd

really dont vibe with the focus on luke --> PoE dunn/dragons/luke --> luke/dragons TvS pipeline

and my system mates may be be satisfied with the "i dont get you so i wont engage with you" but im not.

vicky

this is a collection of every vote/scumread taly had day 1 and the sum total is underwhelmig to say the least. i thought the bell suspicion looked genuine at the time but in hindsight it's somewhat defensive. i didn't get the sense at any real point that taly had a push she believed in and i think that fits a certain framework of expected scum play where she says things that sound reasonable but doesn't really push anywhere, and if town i'd expect a little more conviction, some feeling toward a scumread.

that lingering suspicion was partially why i pressured rh9 immediately on entry but also i just really didn't like his posts

[petapan]

i also think the way he spoke about marci/his progression on the slot was nonsencial

Spoiler: I liked Marci's reaction to my vote

Luke

, what do you think about the townvibes you're getting?

Do you mean, how do I feel about the people who said they think I am town?

It is early enough that I am assuming all reads are pretty weak.

I was a little surprised to see LLD's read on me as it happened, because she had not interacted with me at all, so my gut reaction to LLD's post was to ask why, before remembering that she never explains her town reads, so deleted the post lol. I don't really have a read on LLD yet

Notty and I had enough interactions with our Super Secret Hood that I could understand an early read on me, and I would call him somewhat townie too. I liked that his first read also turned out to be Marci.

I liked

Marci's

reaction to my vote, it wasn't defensive in any form.

I didn't get the same impression as

LLD

saying

Ydra

was awkward, but for

Ydra

to admit that it was seemed sincere.

UNVOTE:

bear in mind, this was during RVS. the actual vote in question:

Spoiler:

in

be

ak,

we

tru

st

VOTE: marcistar

I AGREE

VOTE: MARCISTAR

I've indoctrinated someone already!

Let's pivot to a rando

I spin the wheel, and then we HURT:

this feels like it's assigning way too much weight to a trivial interaction - why should marci feel remotely pressured by that vote?

then we get taly putting this vague generalized suspicion/shade of marci but not really pressuring her and putting up some dichotomy she doesn't do much with:

Spoiler:

Marci

had a good beginning vibe and has fallen into the thread's noise to us. This is also a note reminder for us to look at

Ydra's

suspicion on

Marci

.

why do i still see kingtroll hate wtf

floor is

all

yours to WK

Marci your ISO is giving stall vibes

Hmm

I don't know either of them enough to discern the significance. But it is a good note to ISO check there if there is time to deep dive.

LLD/Ceph
Marci/Ydra
Luke/unwnd/Dragons

Peta in loose association to any of these groups

Taly

Marci/Ydra

because there are solid reasons to sus

Ydra

but

Ydra

also sus'es

Marci

who is also pretty suspected, which is worth discerning

this one taken outside the spoilers because it's weirdly bare of actual commentary on marci's alignment, just that she's "pretty suspected"

oh and we're not limming

marci

, D1 PR claims always need a pass

hmmm

not track list: Luke, Bell, Peta, Notty

UNVOTE:

why does

marci

still have votes

unwnd

, you mentioned uncertainty in trust my slot?

i dont have a reply to the passivity claim, just been the mood of the week. but the conviction in questioning your intentions has faded.

ceph/ydra/notty

expressed concern or hesitation with the track list, does that make you pause?

and then suddenly she claims and it's full-on defense beause "day 1 pr claimsalways get a pass" even though it was already known to everyone that marci was a PR before that

but he said nothing about it and vaguely shaded her before the claim

doesn't make sense as an organic thought process

[petapan]

oh wow that's

a bug that should probably get fixed

[petapan]

i don't think it actually spoils anything AI luckily, just that ffery has a notes PT, but definitely something that could go very awry

[petapan]

yeah i think we don't need to discuss this point further

if we could get some weighing in on the talyslot that i had posted about prior to the interruption?

[petapan]

I skimmed a bit of it but are you associating Talyslot with Marci now? Who do you want to flip more?

i think it's a bad progression regardless of marci's alignment

i'm fine with flipping that slot first

[petapan]

fuck that ref what a trash ending

[petapan]

L sports watchers

i'm curious about why not marci today but i am okay with killing fb

because firebringer isn't really trying to be town and i feel safe enough making that vote

[petapan]

i dunno you got asked about stuff but didn't really answer

what is your take on dunnstral vs save the dragons

[petapan]

both town

whys that

[petapan]

do you have any scumreads then

[petapan]

i dont know what happened but leave ydrasse alone

also firebringer is mafia

[petapan]

i think dunn is significantly more solvey this game than i've eve seen him as scum

[petapan]

take care of yourself, the game's not going anywhere. spend time with those who care about you.

[petapan]

clock's ticking

[petapan]

sure, go for it

VOTE: std

i want a claim

[petapan]

lol remember when i wanteed to kill firebringer all day

[petapan]

kill him and policy kill lld and unwnd if this flips town

[petapan]

(if he's scum i still don't think it actually reflects well on fb's alignment)

[petapan]

i love you to firebringer but sometimes we have to kill that which we love

[petapan]

and also, he can flip scum still! HE CAN STILL BE SCUM AND FB CAN JUST BE A NUTTER

yes i agree with this

[petapan]

Yeah.

I didn't have FB on my "E-2 = E-1" list. :/

i mean i'm fairly sure that's an outright scumclaim

[petapan]

okay. deep breaths.

i'm very, very displeased with how last game day went, for a lot of reasons. however, the game is still winnable. so i want to work through this calmly and rationally rather than lashing out, because i know that will be unproductive.

two things are going to happen today:

1. we are going to flip firebringer. the hammer play yesterday was a scumclaim, and there should not be debate around this.

2. we are going to mass claim. it is the proper time to do so. we start from the bottom of the draft order and work our way up. marci can claim a result first i guess.

[petapan]

it's pretty believable that greyice would have watched ceph imo

marci wasn't getting nk'd and ceph was second in the draft

if he had he should have hardclaimed it but your slot aggressively wolfsided and tanked its standing in my eyes (trying to lolwagon ydrasse under the pretense of drunkposting was honestly gross) so forgive me if i'm less inclined to take you at face value

[petapan]

for the

do we popcorn or

we claim in reverse draft order. the addresses if someone is fakeclaiming or scum are not claiming the role they took, assuming someone else went for it and can start with me

i'm confident enough notty is town that we can skip over him and i hope others will agree

[petapan]

i am cop

Bell is mafia

VOTE: Bell

N1 Dunn town
N2 read above

i hate to be a fucking dick about this

but there's literally no chance taly submitted a night action on night 1

[petapan]

for the

do we popcorn or

we claim in reverse draft order. the addresses if someone is fakeclaiming or scum are not claiming the role they took, assuming someone else went for it and can start with me

i'm confident enough notty is town that we can skip over him and i hope others will agree

got it, let's do it then

i'm VT who went for the cop slot because i figured it was the safest bet. this does not technically contradict firebringer's claim.

ydrasse is up next

[petapan]

i am cop

Bell is mafia

VOTE: Bell

N1 Dunn town
N2 read above

i hate to be a fucking dick about this

but there's literally no chance taly submitted a night action on night 1

i... don't know if that's true?

but i also know that 1) i could probably check and 2) checking would be an OOG thing that exists in a place that only certain scummers have access to and

this conversation is on the edge of bad and you're probably right should i just confirm or wha

i mean i kind of probably don't want to take it that far tbh

[petapan]

oh
UB

smh

[petapan]

yeah it makes me uncomfy

both that i could check and that my desire to win the game makes me want to despite it

i feel like you can read into if you want but don't, like, say it in thread i guess

but i think even in a hypothetical world where taly was active and potentially able to submit an action it doesn't clear the slot, i think fb's play has obvious scum motivation and he was mostly antispewing after he replaced in, i have given like a million different reasons to scumread the slot and yet gotten a staggering level of resistance

[petapan]

oh
UB

smh

ahahahhaha

no dude don't judge me too

i mean you haven't played a pyp in a long time but she oughta know ub is a premium selection

[petapan]

it's pretty believable that greyice would have watched ceph imo

marci wasn't getting nk'd and ceph was second in the draft

So...

Do you think they saw me kill ceph? And that is why they guiltied me (and then died)?

idk

my first thought on seeing him flip was that it was a weird kill

my second thought was that maybe maf believed that his hypo cop was not so hypo

my third thought was to go look at the draft order again

so yes i am saying that is possible. peta made a good point that he probably should have just hardclaimed it but he came pretty close ("i have a red result in my inbox") and idk enough about greyice as a player to guess how he would have handled that situation

im not very good at solving things on mech and i don't really plan to try. i was interested in hearing other perspectives on it though (partly bc there are people in here who would know much better than me how greyice would handle that), but that can wait until after massclaim

the odds cop is even in town's hands are not particularly high right now

[petapan]

peta is there a world where Marci tracked GreyICE and not Ydra saw GreyICE visit someone and they shot him N2 thinking he might be cop.

So she doesn't claim who had the 0 result, then claims a person low on the chain to ensure her claim was fine?

the cop is ascetic they would know getting a result means he is not cop

it's possible still she bluffed a result while having one on GI but it could also easily be coincidence

[petapan]

lol sick thank u dunn

[petapan]

do we continue the massclaim anyway or no

there are literally only two slots that can be cop if town now

they should confirm if cop/not cop i think

[petapan]

or they can hypo i guess but bell didn't even hypo yesterday and lld dropped her cover pretty fast so like

iunno if one of y'all is cop i think scum can figure it out yknow

[petapan]

isn't there bell and me and LLD (but not really LLD) or am i missing something

you got outed as non ascetic by marci

[petapan]

hypo if you want, hardclaim tomorrow

[petapan]

remember the mafia are informed so it's not impossible marci took the cop slot with the first pick and they lucked into getting tracker as a fakeclaim

[petapan]

I clearly need to play more PYP.

This setup has some spicy possible outcomes.

oh you haven't even considered the world where scum just load up on kill power? cuz that is the spiciest

[petapan]

nah but consider this: as scum i dont need to fakeclaim as im above all you mfs so i could snag any shiny role i want.
im probs just a scumtracker who saved the fake claim for my buddies ^.^

i'm mainly making the point that if we reach tomorrow and there is confirmed to be no cop you can't be ruled out as a suspect

[petapan]

Peta, is there anything else we need to do today before we kill FB? I want to not rush this, but I also want to progress this game and not stall in the mud and create more apathy.

give me a minute to think things over first, talyslotfirebringer being finally confirmed red is some amount of useful data

[petapan]

oh and we're not limming

marci

, D1 PR claims always need a pass

this is a pretty bizarre post to make in an open setup where claims are entirely NAI and you can tell from the first page of the game who likely has a PR

especially given taly didn't say shit about this when there was suspicion on marci in the first place

I missed that line while trying to get current.

@Taly, if you felt this way, is there a reason that you were okay with a Marci vote before? She has been guarantied a PR since the start of the game. Were you aware of her position on the draft sheet when you voted her?

i mean dude that was literally an rvs vote i don't know what you're on about

Oh.

When I saw your post, I followed back the quote, and given the context, I thought that they were unvoting Marci in that post, for that reason. I see that I was incorrect

oh and we're not limming

marci

, D1 PR claims always need a pass

hmmm

not track list: Luke, Bell, Peta, Notty

UNVOTE:

They were unvoting unwnd here

this post from luke was a bit weird because he completely whiffed on what taly was doing because he glossed over reading her posts quickly

i don't know, there was the whole notes pt fiasco but i'm not completely convinced the slot is town

[petapan]

there's a scum in marci/unwndslot/lld/bell and it's not bell.

ydrasse and notscience are town

[petapan]

Assuming peta is cleared, what are the odds that notscience is also town due to picking the same number as Taly vs gambitting

really high

i don't think he makse that play and if he does he doesn't do a weird touch and go dance with taly he just buries the slot for the cred

could be wrong but like eh if he's leveled up his scum game past my expectations good on him

[petapan]

Little bit different readlist but I'm piecing shit together

Bell/Notty
--
Ceph
Peta
--
Marci
KT
LLD
GreyICE (complete fucking null)
Ydra (The line about marci coaching is hmmmery)
Taly
StD
--
Dunnstral
Lukewarm

Just gonna take this time to spitball about Taly

I really don't know how to read you. Your contribution to the thread passes over me. You've got gripes with me and maybe you believe that I'm avoiding you intentionally. I know that feeling, and then confirmation bias sets in. I've had to ask myself 'do I think your confirmation bias is real' and I'm usually not pressed on this current day to find the answer. You are mostly detached from everything but still watching it unfold. I don't know what you're really expecting out of me if you're just gonna *peck* me or others, and I think what would benefit me (selfishly) is if you put yourself more into the fray.

Maybe in that regard your *pecks* is doing that, but dunno that just leaves most people annoyed or wanting to shoo you away. Come down from your nest and really engage with us

i don't think this slot should endgame, i could go over it with a fine toothed comb but i'm not sure the time investment is worth

[petapan]

Peta I'm pretty confident that slot is town but we can litigate that if I'm wrong on my actual 3 name solve.

okay then

i mean i almost certainly am not gonna be around to ligitigate it

[petapan]

hi folks.

Unwnd town hypo

you don't need to hypo anymore

[petapan]

i need 5 pages double spaced on why firebringer is scum by monday actually

[petapan]

if lld is scum i think it's with unwndslot. that's very level 0 thinking pn my part, connecting the dots but if they wanted to try to just brute force the game i think that's why yesterday went down the way it did. i still think marci makes sense as scum though so meh. her approach to both eliminations has been completely disgusting levels of TMI that should have been punished on day 1.

i think firebringer was telegraphing dunn vs std as tvt pretty hard. shrug. there are other reasons GI could die and it's likely scum had a good idea of what PRs were left. like i really don't think it was a cop hunt.

[petapan]

and if there's no cop, tomorrow you hunt in the slots that could have taken cop

[petapan]

bell can effort but as scum but as town he takes it that his alignment should be self-evident and is annoying about it in a way he can't really imitate that as scum because at his core he feels guilty

[petapan]

tbf the only time i saw notty-scum he was incredibly flat and also busy with IRL constraints

he had a better game in a theme i wasn't in i guess but again i think his level of solving has been extremely authentic

i don't think he doubles up with taly as scum, i don't get a sense of him as a high risk gambit player, and i don't really think he looks aligned with taly

also even though i teased him about it, i think the way he's spoken about the drafting most likely comes from someone who wasn't discussing picks with a team and faking that uninformed perspective is something that wouldn't be in most players' wheelhouse

[petapan]

the issue i feel like is that it doesn’t appear outwardly that you’re trying to get a hold of things because you’ve basically only spoke about kt barring that one bigger post

bbbbbbbbb

tr: notscience, dragons, kingtroll until somebody actually explains to me whats wrong with them, peta, luke?

if i had to say a sr, taly.

taly, dunn, someone who moved off of me after claim idk ill have to look later

taly, dunn, someone who moved off of me after claim idk ill have to look later

Why am I mafia?

i literally already answered this earlier

these posts have stuck in my brain for weeks

when i tried to engage her on them she didn't actually answer

[petapan]

Peta, can I talk to you about my paranoias?

sure go for it

[petapan]

Peta, can I talk to you about my paranoias?

sure go for it

So....

I'm just gonna go cards on the table I'm pretty sure It's Marci/Ffery/FB.

My paranoia is that I'm being setup to be a miselimination to end the game, and tied to people who in my view really SHOULD be seen as town and are being victimized by invisible tethers to me.

I also have this fear that I might be wrong on one of those three in particular and if so... one of these people I'm calling town might be using me as a shield expecting me to die, flip town and exonerate them by association.

i got you, yeah

i had thought that was plausibly the team yesterday i just kind of...didn't want to get ahead of myself but also didn't want to force it

i think it's not impossible ffery is town it's just...hard for me to evaluate her slot because of the midgame replacement which isn't fair but there are certainly strikes against it, and i can't help but get the feeling shes giving herself endless projects hoping to appear busy while town eats itself alive because that was kind of what she did in that one mini normal a couple years ago

but that could still be overthinking it

it's possible someone is fooling me and i'm too far in to properly re-evaluate but i can try taking a look

[petapan]

tbf the only time i saw notty-scum he was incredibly flat and also busy with IRL constraints

he had a better game in a theme i wasn't in i guess but again i think his level of solving has been extremely authentic

i don't think he doubles up with taly as scum, i don't get a sense of him as a high risk gambit player, and i don't really think he looks aligned with taly

also even though i teased him about it, i think the way he's spoken about the drafting most likely comes from someone who wasn't discussing picks with a team and faking that uninformed perspective is something that wouldn't be in most players' wheelhouse

hm ok i am maybe slightly less willing to sheep given that tbh but i appreciate the further explanation

i don't really remember feeling struck by authenticity of solving recently at least but i think he was towny earlier. and the numbers point is honestly maybe enough anyway

i think his motivation has fallen off but it is probably unrelated to his alignment

[petapan]

also i can understand doubts on dunn but he's never ever scum with marci and rereading marci's iso to find those posts about taly made my eyes bleed

[petapan]

i forgot what i aws waiting for

[petapan]

I'm waiting for FF.
and you guys to solve the game. FB isn't going anywhere and we know he's scum.
What does that mean for his teammates?

i've given the input i can give though i haven't reread

a big difficulty is i'm working with incomplete info when i think things will be more clear tomorrow. i think there is probably no cop in the game but i can't fully base a solve on that.

a big issue is that taly's slot was effectively nonexistent in the game for days. she was getting mostly townread after early game (partly my bad but i had already reversed that read by the time day 1 was ending). rh9 showed up and i instantly blew him up, my view is that firebringer entered the game effectively in antispew and so all his posts should be read as WIFOM.

that leaves a lot less info to work with than i'd like

[petapan]

i did a brief study of taly in open 835 to see how he talked about egix, his active partner (he threw not_mafia under the bus like anyone would be expected to do). the quick summary is he was deflective of scumreads on egix but stayed away from overt full defense for the most part, picking at reasoning rather than outright calling egix town. he did do a townread but followed it up with an asking a question thing to appear nuanced, but otherwise mostly didn't talk about egix much. this type of behavior can vary game to game but most people tend to have patterns in how they play toward partners

[petapan]

i did a brief study of taly in open 835 to see how he talked about egix, his active partner (he threw not_mafia under the bus like anyone would be expected to do). the quick summary is he was deflective of scumreads on egix but stayed away from overt full defense for the most part, picking at reasoning rather than outright calling egix town. he did do a townread but followed it up with an asking a question thing to appear nuanced, but otherwise mostly didn't talk about egix much. this type of behavior can vary game to game but most people tend to have patterns in how they play toward partners

Do you think any of Taly's reads followed this pattern in this game?

i'm doing a check on that right now, i posted that primarily to refresh my memory

[petapan]

/allow other people to dive it if they're so inclined.

[petapan]

They should just be bullshit based on your innocence right

Stake your position or something

i think you misunderstand

we're not entertaining other people's reads

because

they're true, we're discerning the motivation despite internal dissonance

interesting that the two most suspected slots were also the first slots to have semi-serious convo

vicky

uwnnd

we're dissociated and have different solving mechanisms and vibes when playing

this is as new to us as it is for everyone else in the plist

so we have different perceptions

its why taly always voteparked nowhere in retrospect in big games D1, lots of input

pedit

cephrir

talking about notty/taly, my dude

We're intending to reread

Unwnd

, given time and obligation restraints. We aren't picking up anything on them one way or the other and wonder if their few focusing points:

(Luke, Bell, Marci, Notty, Peta)

are sincere. 532 read as self-conscious on a skim, but we don't have time to analyze the context.

I'm not a disbeliever that disposition where you are in life doesn't affect your play. We try to not talk about it, but it's there. His flat tire situation brought about a string of posts that I felt were hard to fake. Had a lot of believable follow-up in thoughts before he was stranded. There was also a lot of vulnerability in it too, like him saying he thinks he sucks as scum. I also am reminded of when he was commenting about my play and how I'm not too friendly/cloistered and this was properly addressed in there too. His thoughts seem real and distinct.

does this explain your lack of interest in sorting ydrasse and the wagon

vicky

unwnd is it a bad take to think you're avoiding us

vicky

*pecks unwnd with beak*

taly

home

VOTE: unwnd

really dont vibe with the focus on luke --> PoE dunn/dragons/luke --> luke/dragons TvS pipeline

and my system mates may be be satisfied with the "i dont get you so i wont engage with you" but im not.

vicky

we have 2 concerns

1. how did you arrive to luke/dragons TvS
2. what's the hang-up with us

deadline isnt today

vicky

i know for a fact unwnd isn't above theatering with his mates, but this kind of feels like not it

it'll be easier to sort his slot when we have a claim though

[petapan]

Gaia:
You mentioned that you liked LLD's
contributions but Taly
and Yume
have dissonance with that slot.

Taly
likes that LLD's
receptive to voting and posits that being OK with a somewhat large pool (4 players) of votes is likelier town in D1, trying to scumhunt -- this is more rationalized by the assumption scum isn't willing to aggro. Furthermore, Taly's
said that the notion from LLD
helping us conceptualize playing as a plural entity for once is a town POV, because good faith and town-building. He also doubts scum would have the same energy as LLD
in posting volume, and Vicky
agrees.

Yume
is more reserved on LLD
because she questions if the change from early townping to being willing to vote Luke
is natural, partially because Unwnd
focused there and is wondering if LLD's
take on Luke
is unique.

Vicky
likes the Bell
vote, as Vicky
would've liked any vote on Bell
when she posed it.

It appears we aren't as familiar with LLD
as several in this playerlist, so I caution a solid read at this point.

Collectively, we townping LLD
, but aren't strong there.

this kinda feels like a partner read though. lld will be annoyed with me for bringing this up.

i will say that on every level of tone and in the moment play she feels town to me, not just "fine", but like really really sounds town, if it was f3 between lld and a black box i probably close my eyes and vote the other player. but i look at the nightkills and wonder if those aren't red flags


again, shrug. i think marci always needs to be flipped first for sanity purposes, if she's town it sucks but you can't leave someone playing like she is alive in ELO. from there you'll have more information, y'all are big kids you can figure it out. if we lose cuz scum played good oh well, it happens sometimes. shouldn't have turned the ball over twice in the first half.

[petapan]

lld having no read on taly in 400 posts is certainly something

i would, like, expect a player of her caliber to say

something

about a teammate cuz that is a play newbies get caught on but taly was kind of easy to ignore. it's confusing to me regardless

[petapan]

i'm spent, i can't gesture at vague hypotheticals anymore, good to move on

[petapan]

i lied, i went to reread more


i wanted to double-check unwnd because something wasn't sitting right in my head last night and writing him off for the taly stuff felt thin when i had lingering doubts about his play


i still feel like his initial push on lukewarm was overly severe for what was an extremely frivolous comment (i also thought luke came out better in those exchanges, maybe the towniest thing about him given his extremely wack reads)

slightly think he could have been trying to pocket me

520 is nonsensical

posting trends toward boringly self-indulgent but on a reread i'm kind of missing whether there are actually any scumreads he feels strongly about. the continued push on lujkewarm just doesn't feel like it's based on any tangible reality.

content sort of gets brief and empty and i'm not finding the substance behind it. 850 is weak but beyond that it's the lack of thought that goes into it - he had luke as an early tunnel but std and dunn are just thrown in there as afterthoughts. those are 2 names i'd have highlighted as easy pushes in a scum pt. why does he scumread them? who knows

852 is actively terrible and i struggle to see it as a real thought

1153 into 1228 is Something. i'm wondering now where he made his pivot to hard defending marci. i don't think the vote comp is telling because i don't think scum would be likely to see him as an easy mis-elim and taly's vote on him didn't have much teeth at all.

looking at the exchange with taly in context i can see it as plausible distancing


i kind of struffle to see a post or sequence from him i can actually point to as townie

[petapan]

i'm hungry and need to eat breakfast if firebringer comes back and steals the hammer so be it

[petapan]

1493 1494


1498 is bad mostly for lacking in thoroughness


i think the thing that bothers me about that "i don't think scum are on my wagon" post isthe seeming lack of followthrough, if there's a worldview of who are the scum outside the wagon, where is the push, where is the callout

[petapan]

I think we should just leash marci and if she goes 'lol I was roleblocked' it's not the end of the world

Feels like a waste killing her

VOTE: KingTroll

[petapan]

There was a brief moment that GreyICE talked about this. I've thought about the number selection more. How likely is it for two partners to pick the same number? Thoughts in my head ranged from 'this means Taly/Peta/Notty can't be a team' but I'm unsure if that has substantial backing.

Despite this,

we do know that KT/Marci picked different numbers.

If we were somehow just on the money with our suspicions then flipping one of them would be able to somewhat answer that idea to some satisfaction.

man what is that last line

[petapan]

I’m open to other options.

Peta, for instance, is on the table for me.

I'm interested in this thought btw

scummy

I think there is truth to what peta says about worldviews is likely healthy. There's a lot of unknown variables I don't have the answers to. Zeroing in on a team feels like working backwards. I think Peta is..alright. I don't townread him but he's not doing anything pointedly scummy. There are some contradictions, but they don't feel worth delving into. The only point against him is that he

could

have ulterior motive but it requires me to squint in order to see it. Some nitpicks I have with him were how he's handled marci and he merely responded he doesn't care if I scumread him for it. OK. I think he knows he can make that statement as town as much as scum. That's frustrating to admit but hey.

LLD to me either 1) Dies by night or 2) Gets cleared. If neither happens and LLD is alive somewhere close to a XYLO you hit the big red button and sound the alarms.

Ceph is weird. I think his timing is uncanny and imo that's what he excels at as scum. Yet with the other two, there is nothing provable. That's why they don't get eliminated today because nobody here is willing to risk a potshot theory.

Other unknown variables

1) Ydra's attitude this phase
2) What happened with StD earlier
3) Dunnstral being surprisingly candid
4) Taly promises that come up short
5) GreyICE

Game is hard. Too many variables.

KT/Marci are approachable from a D1 standpoint and I expect by-the-book to rule in this environment

You're not gonna see anything left-field

vacuous nonsense

[petapan]

1882 starts unwnd's day 2, for reference

uncanny

i should also say though i'm already townreading both of you, ceph kill ~strongly implies you/bell are town as it was a PR hunt kill that i don't think scum makes if they had a crack at the premium roles

And I agree with you

What's the stake of limming between LLD/StD

You were someone who believed scum won't double up, and I'd love to test that theory

I'm not basing this entirely on numbers either, I think StD is scummy

scummy

[petapan]

I dig it but I'd dig it more from a 'im town'

It's not my full reason but I'm eyeing that draft selection where you/StD have the same number chosen

Would love to test that out, to repeat myself

again like the most he can manifest is something toward the number selection and calling std scummy but there's never any articulation as to why

[petapan]

StD if I had to slingshot a reason why you're a good vote it's that you're always compensating for a vote even if your words leading up to it seem self-righteous

nonsensical

[petapan]

the repeated references to how i could be bussing marci really are something

Yeah so.

It's all unproven but I maintain what I said about StD/Dunn having one scum.

GI's hypo cop is it's own process. There's no amount of formulative play that answers for everything. I don't see the benefit in just following procedure with unknown variables at play. You also can't really quantify intuition and feelings as well. That feeling of 'one scum between' persists even if GI is depicting a solution for us. I agree with the practicality of it but what if it fails?

I don't understand where you're not accounting for failure, GI.

also very likely scummy

[petapan]

No not really

Where do we factor in someone being selective in the way they are displaying emotion? People are fickle and change the way they behave based on internal factors. You saw it with Bell and I pointed it out. You see it a bit with Marci when she talked about her stress. I see it with Ydra as well. That being said, I can't figure out dunn's behavior. Do you believe this intentional? Dunn should really care that he's being scumread but he doesn't. This is the most damning thing for him at this point.

like i mean this is his case on a scumread on day 2. it's not good, flimsy, 'he should care more' reasoning is something you see in the newbie queue or a bad reality television series where no one knows how to play mafia

[petapan]

I am here

Not ever
Notty

Not today
Bell..?
Peta
Ydra

Sort these two specifically lol
LLD
GI

--

Nullish
Talyslot
FFery

Votes for today
Dunnstral
Save the Dragons
Marci

We're smart people.

There has to be scum between Dunn/StD/Marci.

Right? ..Right?

[petapan]

unwnd's day 2 play is actively atrocious and i want the slot purged. i don't feel like he is ever actually solving at any point and is mostly pontificating over nonsense. there's occasionally some direction to a push but there's never any substance behind it.


i think that fits whether marci is scum or disgustingly selfish town. there's a motion later in the day where he gestures toward elimming marci when i had pivoted to rh9/firebringer that doesn't sit right with me

[petapan]

looking at the draft order again

we have unwnd at slot 4 with no action. if town he selected tracker/jk, ub, neighborizer, or n3 vig which we'll find out. but i think he basically never selects neighborizer and i'm not even sure about UB. of course that leavbes me to ask what i think townwnd would select and i'm not really sure i have a goo answer to that

but i dunno. i look at that slot and think it's a plum position for scum to snatch the cop away from town in, and i think we don't have a cop. i think marci's claim is most likely a trueclaim regardless of alignment and she'd be too uncertain to fake results that way but i dunno

[petapan]

okay now i'm done for real

[petapan]

VOTE: firebringer



glgl

don't take what i said as gospel, use your own instincts. if someone starts towntelling then flip the switch (but also remember the draft positions and claims etc)

[petapan]

that's something all right

[petapan]

VOTE: marci

[petapan]

@town how obvious was it that my slot wasn't cop

wondering if the dunn kill says anything about how many scum are above me and/or about the marci result

before or after the claimed result confirming you as not cop?

[petapan]

towniest thing about lld is that scum apparently did not claim a bunch of vigs

[petapan]

@town how obvious was it that my slot wasn't cop

wondering if the dunn kill says anything about how many scum are above me and/or about the marci result

before or after the claimed result confirming you as not cop?

are you assuming marci is scum tracker here?

uh regardless of the result i think it logically tracks like if she's scum i assume it was a trueclaim

[petapan]

we can finish the massclaim and go from there

[petapan]

yeah go for it

[petapan]

(also i thought dunn was able to read me better than to have to cop me but o well lol)

[petapan]

I'm VT, but I selected Universal Backup, expecting the top 5 above me to go for things like Cop/Doc/Tracker to ensure they were in the pool, and because UB was too powerful of a role to allow to possibly slip out of the setup.

i believe it tbh

[petapan]

something_smart is rolling over in his grave for yall not doing rigorous statistical analysis of ADP in PYP

[petapan]

i'm JOKING

[petapan]

this might actually be the worst town draft of all time

[petapan]

if i have to re-eval notty i'm going to become the joker


consequently if he actually played d1/d2 the way he did as scum then well fucking done

[petapan]

past experience tells me usually the people aggressively wolfsiding are not scum but like hooooooboy there was a lot of that this game and like hell if i can figure it out

[petapan]

An honest one, too.

Of the circlejerk, yours felt the least organic and stuck out the most of the bunch. It also took being voted for you to actually do things, which essentially boils down to a) agreeing with a read I've already shared in thread, b) a cheap nai read, and c) asking a leading question where it's clear you'd already made your mind up

I don't think you're scum, but...

Spoiler:

[petapan]

i'm spiraling a little because i'm back to everyone else feels town

[petapan]

Is it my turn

yes

[petapan]

Marci why are you buddying me that’s just gonna make me want to vote you

[petapan]

i dunno notty going after me day 2 like he did is still absolutely crazypants levels of gutsy if scum, on a level very few players are willing to reach but it also receded a lot quicker than i remembered (mainly due to ffery's entrance)

i get worried that he's kind of fallen into the background while other people are more actively solving

do kind of like 2441, wp on that post if scum

2477 kind of raises my hackles though with the way it dances toward a marci is maybe possibly scum but not really conclusion hiding behind luke for it

2761 is kind of like, the exact progression i'd expect on a bus though. shrug.

[petapan]

3/4/5 is kind of neat as a scum arrangement but my reread of lue's day 1 left me uncertain. his reads were aggressively bad but i could kind of see some believability to how he might form them

but candidly i'm worried because it feels like notty has fallen off the table in terms of solving


bell/ydrasse/lld right now are my list of don't touch them, if they're scum they fooled me, i'll take the loss if they are. tempted to say give unwndslot a pass there because i'm back to thinking him and taly aren't aligned

[petapan]

Candidly in a game of egos some of us need to swallow them and be sheep so

/shrug

feeling down on yourself?

[petapan]

i'm glad you're feeling feisty again

[petapan]

I’m just fucking irritated

Also for the record this is yet again a towntell because scum notty doesn’t unfade but this is the part where bell pretends this makes me scum

well sorry i was being sincere really in that i appreciate you showing life in this game because it's less fun when you're playing like a puppy left out in the rain and you're more readable this way

[petapan]

i'm glad you're feeling feisty again

Yo I'm getting stabbed in the junk as surgical prep and will be laid out for hours wanna chat since you are dying tonight near always

I wanna chat with ye

i'll be around for you to run anything by me

[petapan]

do we think scum is sitting on a vig and lied during massclaim

Ninja
In my defense I did not once claim to be engaged I’m currently just stream of consciousness to be readable so someone else can solve before I have to

Its réal possible that scum has that which is why we can't no elim on 6 or 4.

you can on 4 because they don't have multitasking, it's only on 6 if we miss today that you have to worry about that

[petapan]

Right now I'm on the Ffert/Merci train

If I'm wrong on one of those, where should I look?

Specifically if I'm wrong on Marci where should I look and if Im wrong on Ffery where shpuld I look?

pray for death is my answer


if marci is town after all this i kind of think everything needs to be ripped up and thrown in the trash but i think you would kind of have to look for who was informed with regard to my tunnel maybe - and my mind keeps wandering back to unwnd in that regard i guess.

i think my biggest reasons for clearing ydrasse are related to preflipping marci and also like, general ~feel~ things that i have never properly articulated where she's kind of unmoored in the moment and driftin along hoping to be carried where as scum she usually has some sort of a gameplan to win. but like rating for people who could maybe be fooling me i guess she'd be there


if it's marci and not ffery i'm really stumped and whoever it is is both playing well and has had very little need to cover their tracs in terms of associatives

i've been rereading and spiraling the last few days and i don't have a strong answer, usually when i'm put in a spot to hero solve a game i don't function well and it usually ends in fireisredsir getting misyeeted

i can dig a little more just to make sure i don't have any blind spots but i can't promise i can magically find the answer

[petapan]

also fwiw i don't actually find marci's track target implausible she just kind of needs to be flipped because she's not really doing anything and made multiple real scummy posts

[petapan]

i like [post]1171[/post[ but don't care to actually explain why

[petapan]

Peta can you do a deep dive on notty for me?

That is the only player I have no concept on and I think could be in my blindspot

i basically did the deep dive earlier today and second-guessed myself a lot only to second-guess myself back into thinking he's town when he started posting


the tl;dr is there are points in his iso where i could see it coming from scum-him but he's made certain posts where if he managed to make them as scum it would far exceed my expectation for not just him but for most players. could him tunneling marci so hard be informed? i guess but then to 180 the read and try to murder me for pushing it is...gutsy to say the least. and i think if him stepping back a little was done as an ego check i think that's believable for town-him

iunno it doesn't feel like it's him to me

[petapan]

i wanna cover my bases and reread ydrasse and bell just to be sure

they're the only players i haven't double-checked

[petapan]

Peta has convinced me on Notty town.

Ydra gut town for me.

Bell town by others.

Peta conf town.

Leaves me with a winning PoE

famous last words

[petapan]

2356 is kind of like *clicks tongue*

like i dunno i like a lot of ydrasse's vibe but that particular post feels kinda overwrought

shrug


i feel like a lot of time in these situations it's kind of...you have a bunch of people who have had really bad reads that were scumsiding, right

but they can't all be scum

and a lot of the time the folks who had bad reads are just patsies and the actual scum is someone who has positioned themselves

reasonably well

to look good in an endgame because people focus too much on results over the process they've shown


which, like, i look at 2381 and 2836 and go Hmm

and then i see 2952 and that's...kind of an interesting post because it feels a weird attack for firebringer to make while openly in antispew?

kind of blinking at 2972


i dunno i feel dumb because when she writes posts with actual sentences i find it scummy but then when she shitposts i start thinking it might be towny again

[petapan]

the super comedy world is firebringer claimed a guilty on bell because bell actually is scum. that would be a funny thing to do so i can't rule out firebringer doing it

[petapan]

Sure.
Twice I have caught scum who called their partners boring instead of scum. Simple, boring, I know. It's just honest to goodness excuse not to put fire on them. I Also find it slightly weird that Notty put that much effort into controlling for a player's idiosyncracies this early in the game. Also they keep trying to manipulate people's feelings to get off of them and that rubs me bad. *Thumbs down*
Last game I was in Taly was either meltdowning or efforting. I think I just carry my suspicions from game to game without any reason or logic.

I don't scum read Marci, I just don't town read them. They're always kind of weird, fake, and survivory when they play mafia. So it's pretty hard to read them.

[petapan]

Punished for good read syndrome

This happened in the last game i played too

When will it end

it's a very dumb fuckin' read but like i'm kind of wondering

player with an informed perspective knows marci and talyslot are never endgaming you know

this does not necessarily mean you are scum ofc

[petapan]

if bell's scum this game it's the best scumgame he's ever played by a thousand miles and that includes shakespeare

but rereading him...i kind of think he fits? moreso than notty or ydra or unwnd.

[petapan]

Spoiler:

Cool.
Can we flip Marci.

I appreciate them, but like,
Their approach to this game is so wrong headed that I’m not sure where I’d start with them if they aren’t scum.

The best I can really say is that maybe they were ironically posting a caricature of a scum player while town because they don’t like us or the game and would like to exit stage left.
That’s honestly the most generous interpretation I can come up with that isn’t them just being scum this game.

VOTE: Marci

*shrug*

I can't read spoilers on my phone.
I have read the spoilers on my laptop.
Sorry you're having stressful stuff happen Marci!
I..don't really know how the two connect very well though, it's too murky for me to change my approach.
A bad day can effect a scum game just as much and probably more* than a bad day as town.

I actually don't think the specifics would help me understand.
Well, they might, but I really wanna respect the idea that we shouldn't be asking for a confession hour for every blip on the AtE scale.

Anyway, murderin' time please and thank you.

So you think she’s town. I’m okay steeping you if you wanna take responsibility for it.

Sheeping. *

UNVOTE:

While waiting on response.

VOTE: kingtroll

/shrug

[petapan]

That is basically what I mean. She’s really not being community minded in her play.

But i’m genuinely fine with king troll if Luke is confident In their read on Marci.

I forgot what else I was going to say. Oh well.

mu wolf emote

[petapan]

I also don’t think scum bell just ignores the hypo like he did because that stuck out like a sore thumb but I think town bell is that oblivious

i dunno what if he's scum who's not actually reading the thread lol

[petapan]

I think in general Dunn is pretty defensive.
I felt they were sufficiently defensive early in the game. There was a key somewhere in there to determine whether his defensiveness was scummy or townie.

Right now they seem to be trying to get a handle on what the problems are to figure out how to address it.
It’s either way really.

I don't really think I'm being fooled by Unwnd this game still. They're just town probably.

I'm still pretty skeptical of Notty. They just aren't reaching what it is I need them to reach. Don't ask me what it is.
I remain leaning slightly town on Peta. I don't really have many tells or things I think Petascum does that petatown doesn't. I don't feel like sharing my opinion on him regarding their brushes on those tells this game. It's not terrible.

All I got for GI is that while they have threatened to moralize they haven't actually done so, which means they're not so bored because they don't have a game to solve that I think scum them might be inclined to do. On the otherhand, lol at even the idea of trying to read them through that lense.

LLD keeps telling me how sad they feel about how I think about them this game.
So I won't talk about it.

STD is hard. Sad brains is hard. STD sad brains kill because sad brains or kill because scum with also sad brains. Sad brains. My brain sad.

as far as analysis goes this is kind of poor

Hard time seeing unwnd as anything but a pal to maybe ask a question or two on their opinion about a read.
I don't really think I'd follow them unless I already agreed. I guess it would depend on what they say, but I don't usually feel moved by their thoughts. Just because they're their thoughts.

that said. *stares blankly*

VOTE: firebringer.

this kind of like, fits the model of how i expect scum-bell to bus

[petapan]

like if we remove the standard of "actually posting" from him its kind of...hard to see where he's really solving?

[petapan]

VOTE: STD

K.
Hopefully this hits scum.

this isn't good

He's deciding to trust other people that Notty is town. I don't know why they're satisfied or comfortable with that. In comparison
they won't do the same for me who is being town read as hard or harder by those layers.

I'm considering like, 3 different teams right now, and one of them has notty in it. It bothers me when people place their reads of me low during an FB Guilty on me, that has 3 players angling for "What a mystery, Bell got investigated, could they be scum together?"
I get that other people have other things in mind and I'm also I think a step behind since I'm still in the LLD and Dunnstral could be scum thing.
Esp. Dunnstral given watcher Gray.
And also dead Gray.
Not much reason to murder Gray unless they were on to something.
Or I guess that they knew that FB oh.
Well whatever, I guess they knew that FB/Gray interaction cleared each other.
Still kinda stuck on why it can't be both tho.

this is non-awful though and i kind of bought the paranoia but like. it's one post


and the thing where he's leaning on other people for full solves while his own analysis is pretty sparse just strikes me as strange

It occurs to me that my interactions with Taly and FB are fairly clearing.
Huh. That’s nice.

and like, saying this

[petapan]

yeah i dunno what to tell you i'm not comfy clearing bell

[petapan]

Like my list of people I don’t want to vote looks like-
Marci
You
Bell
Luke
Taly
———————
Ceph
Ydra for some reason
GreyIce because I do agree with LLDs points and think the only person he would be scum with is her
———————

The rest are all down here in a big murky pool.

why is bell on the list bestie

Taly mafia because they don't stand out and other people have stronger reasons to be town, whereas I don't have any reason to think they're town

Marci mafia because their play looked different as town and I've seen mafia grab tracker/jailkeeper as first pick before. They defended KingTroll yesterday in a way that didn't make sense - they acted like they had a townread there early but then kept it up later when KingTroll hadn't made any posts. I have decided that it looked like white knighting. Their vague claim today doesn't actually mean anything - they claimed their target didn't go anywhere but didn't claim a target, yet that is the reason we didn't want to eliminate them yesterday, and now there is 0 pressure there. They don't seem to have any insights today when they are not being suspected.

Bell mafia because they don't stand out to me and I like to believe they've ranked up their mafia game from being super obvious tonal difference, meaning this is within their range for being mafia to me. They have done very little and has also received little pressure for that. Like Taly I have better reasons to townread other players so they drift to the bottom. Not sure what to think about the Hypo thing yet as I think it could be a joke but they didn't do it which is weird.

Save the Dragons mafia because they keep reaching for reasons to read me as mafia and for reasons to avoid voting for Marci and I don't see them thinking about Marci despite saying they resolve. It looks like nothing has resolved to me and we will still have to decide whether we want to eliminate marci or not. I pointed out that they voted for Marci, got the claim, then immediately unvoted, despite knowing that Marci was first in the draft, and that it felt like a planned move between the two of them to relieve pressure. Also their focus has been surprisingly narrow - What have they done today besides defend themself and push me? They aren't even interested in Marci anymore unless other people prod them for info.

what the actual fuck

i had a dream that bell was scum...

One of them is Bell. I’m a freebie. Guess the other two and win a free happy meal.

I think it went something along the lines of u being an evil mastermind who posted this because you thought you would get tred for this bs because it makes you seem like you dont care abt ppl scumreading u and makes u seem carefree

[petapan]

it would be really fucking funny if dunn had the solve and we killed his one wrong scumread first

[petapan]

bear with me here (no pun intended)

scum could have reasonably ruled out lld as cop based on her initial hypo

but they couldn't have ruled out bell if marci is scum

so why did dunn get shot, unless they had the confidence to know he had to be cop?

[petapan]

Hmmmm, we still have reservations with Bell
but this vote is feeling like a vanity at this point.

[petapan]

also i rechecked and the way taly spoke about ydrasse is clearing for ydrasse but i'm not going to elaborate, you're just gonna have to trust on that and you can blame me if it's wrong

[petapan]

then who's scum in your opinion

[petapan]

okay this has been fun exploring alternate theories but after a reread of ffery i still want to take the simplest path of marci -> ffery and if the game is hard do what you can to figure it out

[petapan]

grats on the win, very well played to to Bell/notty/ydrasse/fire

was, uh, frustrated with some moments in the game before that but that was honestly a great performance from everyone. notty I think you took me being disgruntled at you personally at parts of this game, but just to be clear I don't think you suck. I was frustrated with your read on me, but that's part of the game and I was wrong on plenty of stuff too. I think you played a great game.


LLD, you well and truly got me. Every time I had reason to doubt you this game it was like you were reaching into my brain and giving it a squeeze to make me stop supecting you. I've been fooled in games before, of course, but usually it's me seeing things and second guessing myself. This was something unlike anything I've ever experienced in terms of how you got into my head, and it was ridiculously impressive. I think you might have had a shot at winning if you weren't mechanically forced to shoot me.

[petapan]

LLD, I think you did amazing with what you were left with. Sorry again for needing to leave you >.<

Emotionally that week leading up to chemo, and then physically the week following, the energy requirement to feel like I was carrying my weight this game was just... too much.

I started feeling better the week after I repped out, and started imagining a world where I stayed in and Ffery took the Taly slot, and kind of regretted leaving... but then I had my second round of chemo the same day the 6p Melo started, and realized once again that it probably was still the right call. Physically, I would have needed to be MIA, but I don't think I would have actually done that if I was in the game.

In another world, we would have rocked this game though lol

i was going to go to war on you if you had been in the game still lol

[petapan]

I don't want to beat up RH9 for this continously, since Rh9 knows shouldn't have replaced out but I really don't like the excuse of lacking energy.

I looked it over, Rh9 was in the game for a total of 5 hours. Even if RH9 u were feeling demotivated and lacked energy RH9 made a rash decision to replace out so fast after getting pushed. I think RH9 really should have given it 24 hours at least to say "can i continue playing?" Because this was just too fast. At the very least it gives someone like me taking the slot to argue that hey maybe RH9 left the game because of personal life reasons or something.

Idk I looked back on it and was flabbergasted I didn't get instant elimmed for that replaceout alone. I had difficulty integrating into this game but maybe that is a skill issue for myself. I think Spiffeh or LLd might have had easier time making the slot better than I did.

Not mad but felt frustrated i really didn't find a way to recover slot. Probably should have put more effort into it.

i'm not really sure he knows, but yes replacing out in that slot was cool and should not have happened. when you mess up in a game you have to own it rather than subbing out.

i could say some harsh stuff about you not being eliminated but i don't really want to start flaming people over it atp. most i'll say is some people were playing too solipsistic to notice what was an obvious tactical replace out. i should have been more aggressive than i was but i had gotten negativity in response to (incorrectly placed) aggression earlier in the game so i didn't push it enough.

[petapan]

here's a link to my archive of the chat: https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/ ... a_chat.zip