CI1656: Hearthstone Mafia (GAME OVER)

[Tere]

I am V/LA over the weekend, I have spent several hours catching up with the gamestate, and this slot is town. No flash lynching please, I will talk to you guys properly on Monday. Ta.

[Tere]

OK, I have caught up with all my games and am very information overloaded. As I say, this slot is town and I need a bit of time to skim ISOs and get my thoughts in order.

Other homework:

I need to answer Mantis' questions from the neighbourhood (BTW ika if you are playing with set up spec you should count something like a neighbouriser in because it clearly exists)
I want to look over KJ for myself
I want to look over Grib for myself
I want to get my head round where my reads are at.

Can we not have a bloody flashwagon please? It's very demoralising to read a 30 page thread and then discover two people want to vig me and I am glad it didn't happen because that would have felt like a collossal waste of time. I would like some time to get my thoughts in order and be able to contribute. If you guys must mislynch me after that then fine but I want time to get my house in order and some reads out first.

Ika if you are town and they ignore this and you lolhammer I will rage at you in postgame.

Mantis, thanks for the reach out. Can you do my a solid and find me some typical games of yours both scum and town that aren't too long to read? Some of your stuff looks towny but I having some kind of stylistic issue with your posts that I didn't have at Ratskep and I'd like to have a decent base line from here.

Happy to claim BTW but it's not very exciting.

Right, lunch, coffee and then I will do some work.

[Tere]

OK, first things first. Neighbourhood stuff since that won't take too long.

My slot and Sonic Heroes got invited to a topic at the beginning of the Day Day 1 - very little happened. Both of the slots said it was nothing to do with them. Some speculation about what the neighbourhood mechanic (it's called the Inn BTW) but no conclusions. The only thing apart from that was that Anti said his vote on Mantis was a gut read, because her asking Freekazoid about who the townreads were felt off.

I guess if this is being done by a person it's a night 0 action.

Day 2 Krystal claims they had nothing to do with it. Speculation it's a strange power for a slot to have from her. Krystal asks my slot several questions, which I will try to answer below:

what are you thinking so far, klazam?

(can't answer this, obviously)

Klazam, do you have any reason to suspect that one particular person made this PT?

Klaz said he didn't remember an Inn in the card game. I guess I am thinking this is a specific role a player has.

Do you think it's a town role or a scum role?

- I'm not really sure. Neighborizer is listed as alignment any on the wiki. I don't have any experience with being in a neighbourhood before this game, so I don't have a strong view. It seems informative if the neighbouriser can see the responses of the two players, so I am guessing it could be slightly more likely to be town aligned?

I think it's likely that the creator can see this PT, what do you think?

It's the only point I can see to having this board TBH, so I guess yes?

Krystal asked what Klaz' reasons were for voting prawn and why he stayed on the wagon, which I can't answer. She asked for a precis of the Day 1 conversation with Sonic Heroes. She asked Elk for confirmation on the date / time the topic opened and elk confirmed it was concurrent with start of day. She also posted a list of role / flavour claims including flips and a list of unclaimed night actions, both of which look fine.

Krystal says she's not sure that it's a town role as "I feel like the town way of using it would be to troll people by pairing them with farside". I have no idea what she means by that, you guys can ask her!

Anyway, Klazam is a lurky lamesack and doesn't answer any of these questions, just says that he likes her being active. I can see why Krystal finds that activity suss but I can't retroactively fix it.

I think that's covered everything. Ask if you have any questions. Krystal, point out if you think my paraphrasing isn't right or anything. I am fairly sure that the activity in the neighbourhood by Krystal was penned by Mantis.

[Tere]

Who did Grib cop?

Thoughts from a look over Grib's ISO:

Day 1: He says he finds ika's alignment obvious in 22 and posts aww are you scum after ika's hi intro 27 and 34 says he finds ika, ABR and Reck easy reads in 34. He says he's leaning scum on ika for bad entry and leaning town on Klaz and Mantis at 76. Still not feeling town on ika at 80. Votes Dragon at 128 for his 125. Pokes at Reck for his Dan super town read at 250. Not feeling scum Mantis at 306. Votes ika at 357 for not having done anything useful. Votes Prawn at 441. After a reread he could go for ika, dragonspawn or klazam at 608. After the multiple claims he seems to feel better about ika, worse about me and thinks dragonspawn's claim is OK at 747. There's irritation with ika's lolhammer at 780 and 786.

BTW, I think he crumbs his role in a little sequence dragonspawn picks up on:

The future is open to limitless possibilities.

that seems Random. what are you talking about?

It is just a joke.

Given that irritation with ika's hammer and the amount of time and energy Grib spent Day 1 trying to push and poke ika to sort him, I think it's not unlikely that he might have been his cop target.

Day 2

Grib's first post I think suggests he got a town read on either AP or ika

:

I believe AP, his claim looked towny enough

. The roleblock is whatever.

I miss Anti, he should get in here and explain why he isn't on the scumteam.

ika: you good for a little more participation toDay

?

(emphasis mine, in fact I am wondering if that capital D isn't a typo and is flagging that he viewed ika)

There's a bit more support for AP at 865 and then a post that I think shows

he didn't view dragonspawn

:

They parked a vote on dragon.

i kind of thought dragon seemed town..

what do you think?

He can be town

for now

.

(emphasis mine).

There's more support for ika at 871 and he definitely didn't view AD judging by 882. At the Sonic lynch, he asks AP to vig AD, with an outside chance of Reck, or as an afterthought my slot (grr Grib) at 1028

TEALDEER people: I think Grib copped either AP or ika with a higher probability of ika and got a town result, that misplaced capital D. He definitely didn't cop dragonspawn or AD, or Reck or myself.

I also think ika looks good for his insistence he probably wasn't copped by Grib. Given his lolhammer I think Grib needed to sort him. That's my ideas anyway.

[Tere]

KJ:

Not much in his ISO. I'll bold the main points I find interesting. First main reads list here.

The Grib wagon was engineered to gauge everyone's reaction, get a read on the players substantially supporting/criticizing it, and to look for opportunistic counterwagons.

Grib (the man, the myth, the legend himself) - Reacted very reasonably. Didn't flail or anything, instead continued to engage the game, look for scum on his wagon, and the such. Lean-town.

dragonspawn - Echos Grib's vote on myself, and at least acknowledges Reck's vote showed the same traits. However, the RVS over-justification for choosing me over Reck comes off as forced. All around he's wishy washy with his reads and seems reluctant to take a firm stance on anything this early in the game, despite "kicking the hornet's nest". Lean-scum.

freekazoid - Has genuine reads, even in spite of the head dissonance (or rather, reinforced by it?) Actively engages with other players and manages to hop around wagons in a manner that keeps protown momentum and drives the game forward. Firm town.

Mantisdreamz - Comes off as entirely uninterested in scumhunting. Content to sheep the Klazam vote and fly under the radar. Falls somewhere between lean and firm scum.

ika - Stays active and trying to prevent the rest of the game from stagnating despite being admittedly apathetic. Strikes me as town because I feel scum in his position would be more complacent with a stagnating game. Lean-town.

prawneater - Needs more content. Kinda bad. And by bad I mean scummy. Lean-scum.

VOTE: Mantisdreamz

I think KJ's firm townread of the Freek was interesting given Freek's own early townread on KJ based on almost no information. I picked up on that and flagged it while reading through during the night so it's not just Krystal who found that scummy at the time. I'll point out that Klaz poked at his use of the engineered in that.

This post I also found interesting:

Dragon is pretty scummy as well. Especially don't like his vaguely-explained switch to Reck when he noticed my wagon wasn't taking off. He's asked a lot of aimless questions and hasn't really applied an analysis when people reply to him. He's continuing his wishy-washy trend. It feels like he's scared to lay down any firm reads, and is covering up for it by posting fluff and kicking up a lot of dust without doing much of anything.

Mantis is really latching on to the fact that freek had an early townread on me. Looking at it now it does seem a little fishy, but I think she's really blowing it out of proportion. It's not a strong point, and certainly not an excuse to ignore the rest of the game.

Would be fine with lynching either of these two today.

Prawn's #192 makes me feel a little bit better about him. Puts him around the read of neutral-scum for me because it's just about his only substantial post.

Jason's #309 is really bad.

And ActionDan is probably town but it's hard to tell because he's been lurking so much.

There's more poking of Krystal and Dragon in 312 and 315 and 386 contains more support of Freek and poopooing of Mantis' concerns about Freek's early townread of KJ. Scumreads here are Krystal >= Jason > Dragon > prawn.

In 539 he says "I'm most comfortable with lynching KB because the people on the prawn wagon are terrible (Klazam's vote in particular set off every goddamn red flag in my body), and I don't understand the freek wagon AT ALL." So more support of Freek. There's a vote on dragon at 667 and one on Krystal at 681. There's a complete reversal of his dragon read after his claim though at 752 which I find REALLY weird as a scum approach if dragon is town - they have to get town assistance to lynch him, it makes far more sense to accept his claim without question as scum. I basically think that dragon is probably a real bulletproof scum given the amount of town vig capability we seem to have since I am townreading AP.

Day 2 he about faces on Krystal and pushes AP and dragon to a townread at 953. He also forms a scumread on Dan kinda out of the blue because Dan wants to lynch the bulletproof at 994 which is more protection for that slot.

TealDeer people: I think Mantis looks better from this, and Freek and dragon look worse from reviewing this. I think dragon is probably a scum bulletproof hence his eagerness to crumb his role.

[Tere]

I have done enough walls for one day so I am going to post a quick town to scum list as I see it now. I will have a reread tomorrow and things might change but to be honest I'm sick of looking at stuff today and want a chance for folk to react and talk to me.

I'm sorry Klaz did a fade out in my slot but there's not much I can do except try and fix it.

Town

Tere - I know what my PM says.
ika - I think ika was Grib's cop view N1 and he viewed as innocent. I also liked his insistence he wouldn't be Grib's cop read. He seems to have woken up and got stuck in today too.
AP - I think there's a good chance that AP is what he has claimed. If he's not an he's the SK we will need to sort him later. Town for now.
Krystal - I am having some tonal troubles with Krystal so I need to reread the slot but the "OMG HEY GUYS I CAUGHT THE SCUM" on Freek's slot looked very genuine. I liked her reach out in the neighbourhood. The KJ push on her makes her look less likely to be scum with KJ, and I don't believe she is scum with the Freek for sure.

ActionDan - KJ did park on him. I need to reread this slot - there's not really enough content.

Reck - When I read Reck's ISO it seemed OK but he really does read like a grumpy old hermit taking pot shots off the mountain and I hate that he doesn't have reads or seem to care about the game. I did wonder about him as a traitor slot or similar but I have no idea how prevalent these are in MS.

Dragonspawn - I think this is scum bulletproof. KJ's support of this slot to the extent he did makes little sense otherwise.
The Freek - I don't like KJ's support of this slot and I didn't like that very weird townread early on. I don't also see much sorting from Farside, she came across as much more towny than this to me in Lost Rooms. I need to reread this slot but me no likey.

Enough from me for now anyway.

[Tere]

(emphasis mine, in fact I am wondering if that capital D isn't a typo and is flagging that he viewed ika)

That is a convention that people use to signify game-day rather than reallife-day. I do it myself a lot and often capitalize Day when I dont intend to subconsciously.

Funnily enough, I just saw someone use that and realised it might be a convention I didn't know.

Quite a useful one, too.

I still think Ika's the most likely cop view pick for Grib, although he's now a more close run thing with you.

[Tere]

I like what tere has to say so far. Only problem is his scum read of me. I've already explained why I claimed. I wasn't going to wait till right before I was going to be lynched at the deadline and give no one time to find a scum choice.

I think you are misunderstanding what is bothering me. It's in part this post here where you quickly crumb you are a special:

You too Dexter?

Considering I explained myself in the vote I didn't think I have to explain myself again.

Reckon and jesters votes were scummy as heck. I can only choose one and the game is early so I picked on at random. It's not like we have 40 pages of info to go off of.

If that's to you, your plain stupid. And if you want to lynch me for it than go ahead. Town will only hurt itself by doing so.

Now at that point we were barely out of RVS. You had two votes on you, one from Jason (now AP) at 114 (which I agree with by the way, I didn't like your RVS semi serious vote at 87 in the least when I read through in night) and one from the Freek at 124 which seems waay early to crumb you are a special. The emo routine in this post really bugged me as well. I suppose I could also see this from a town perspective in that you could be trying to draw the NK a bit clumsily, but I am not completely sold on that. That plus KJ's about face on you which only really makes sense if you are scum really looks hmmm. 137 of yours looks a little better though.

Reading through the rest of your ISO 142 looks a bit better. You do still have a consistent scumread on jester at 223. 314 and 317 look like aggressive town. 397 is asking why a case on Krystal when they are L-2, which I am chewing over. 444 is asking why Freek is a good lynch choice. There's the poke at Grib's crumb which I already mentioned (but if you were scum and that was a scum spot I'd have expected them to take out a special not ABR, so ugh, unless ABR terrifies people as town. I will table that as overspeculation). The prawn vote at 634 is a gut vote, fine. Freek and KJ both FOS you for this I see at 639 and 643. Timing of bulletproof and then full claim looks fine at 668 and 671 - you did say you weren't going to be back. More pushing on prawn wagon looks quite genuine. You do explain you were trying to draw the NK in 706. End of day looks honest and I quite like that.

So Day 1 sort of looked OK and at this point in the ISO I was considering offering you an olive branch.

BUT!!!!

Your ISO in Day 2 is basically non-existent. I hate hate hate 1036, that looks like cheeky scum to me and I would send you to the naughty step almost just for it. I like your Freek vote though. I am not as sold on townreading Krystal as you are.

Basically I think I liked your Day 1 but your towniness has fallen off a cliff since your claim. This is either cheeky scum thinking they have a safeclaim or it's a town being lazy who needs to pull their bloody finger out.

I tell you what, Dragon, you can have an olive branch from me today. I am still bothered by your claim but I will believe your claim and not vote for you for today

IF

I see some serious scum hunting. You can start by having a reread though and giving me a decent set of reads. Seem fair?

[Tere]

Its like they are playing a good-cop/bad-cop routine. BRantz is the good cop if that wasnt clear.

This post I totally chimed with and it made me laugh but what do you make of it? Do you think it is scummy?

[Tere]

Mantis, thanks for the reach out. Can you do my a solid and find me some typical games of yours both scum and town that aren't too long to read? Some of your stuff looks towny but I having some kind of stylistic issue with your posts that I didn't have at Ratskep and I'd like to have a decent base line from here.

Keep in mind that this is a hydra and any post with a capital letter in it is Nikanor's.
As far as I know Mantis doesn't play any differently between here and RatSkep but if the above doesn't clear up your style issues I could still get you some of Mantis's meta.

You think I'm town, but you're willing to let your slot's vote sit on me because....?

So you're actually voting for a town read. WHat the shit?

He said it was mild town, and that he wants to probe you a bit more.
This is a really scummy post.

@Tere: Do you think that killerjester defended both of his partners? Your scum reads seem to consist solely of interactions with killerjester. If you are scum, this would be a very easy way for you to accuse townies without directly calling their play scummy. What I'd like to know is, do you have any reasons other than killerjester's ISO to suspect dragonspawn and freekazoid?

OK, thanks, I hadn't noticed the caps thing, that's helpful.

If you would grab me some Mantis meta (and while you are at it some you meta) that would be great. I've only played with Mantis once recently in a timed game where she was a lurksacky town, and then years and years ago, although I observed another timed game quite recently where she was a lurksacky scum . Her activity levels come across as a lot higher here and that might be what's freaking me out although the format is obviously better for busy peeps, which I know Mantis is.

The bolded bit in this post is giving me heebie jeebies as I think it's quite misrepresentative unless I haven't explained myself properly. I thought I'd made it clear I'd done a full read through as well as the work I did yesterday. Going into that reads list I felt I had plenty of other reasons from that initial read through but I wasn't going to push myself through a full set of ISO reads right then. I need to do a full ISO workout on both you and the Freek but OMG that is like the elephant in the room because of your posting levels so my project for today is to concentrate on getting a feel for everyone else.

Looking through my ISO as I write I think it's clear that I have been reading even if I didn't lay out every single thought process in my town to scum list. I'm not going to apologise for that, I spent several hours working on the game yesterday and I think that's clear. This push here feels a bit weak and forced and I no likey.

Would you gladiate with the Freek today? For I feel there is scum in you two and it would split the game open. If not, why not? Can you give me a rundown of your reads and where you are at with folk?

[Tere]

Spoiler: Setup spec done for ika

Green is town vanilla, orange is town power role, red is mafia. Italics is confirmed power, bold is dead.

Player	Role	Flavour	Actions
xRECKONERx	?	?	?
ActionDan	?	?	?
the freekazoid	?	?	?
Krystal Bald	?	?	?
Tere	?	?	?
ika	Townie	?	-
dragonspawn	Bulletproof	Shielded Minibot	-
AngryPidgeon	1-Shot Vigilante	Fire Elemental	Manablocked night one, shot killerjester night two
prawneater	Vigilante Giver	Dark Iron Dwarf	Lynched day one
Albert B. Rampage	Townie	Shieldmaiden	Killed night one
Sonic Heroes	Townie	Micro Machine	Lynched day two
Grib	Cop	Nerubian Egg	Killed night two
killerjester	Roleblocker	Loatheb	Manablocked AngryPidgeon night one, killed night two

Unclaimed actions
Night Zero	Neighborizing of Klazam and Sonic Heroes
Night One	Neighborizing of Klazam and Krystal Bald
Night Two	Neighborizing of the freekazoid and ?

I'm assuming that Grib was a one-shot cop (nerubian egg's ability I can't see as a cop but in Hearthstone it's definitely a one-shot ability), and I'm assuming that killerjester was a one-shot roleblocker (makes sense because AP wasn't blocked last night).

Given those, I'd think that if the neighborizer is scum that there should be another weak/one-shot town power role, and if the neighborizer is town that it's balanced with no additional power roles on either side.

[tinfoil]It's technically possible that AP is actually a mafia bookie and is playing us all for fools by shooting his scumbuddy, but that's pretty much impossible unless town has millions of unclaimed power roles.[/tinfoil]

OK, I think this is an OK summary although my major point of difference with you is I am not assuming bulletproof is automatically a town role.

Can you walk me through the bolded bit like I am about 5 because I don't see the logic flow here at all? why is it balanced if neighboriser is town? It's almost like you know bulletproof is scum.... meeting bbl

[Tere]

also from 1137

[tinfoil]It's technically possible that AP is actually a mafia bookie and is playing us all for fools by shooting his scumbuddy, but that's pretty much impossible unless town has millions of unclaimed power roles.[/tinfoil]

I'd never heard of bookie, but assuming you mean this http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Bookie, I think it's just better to remove that tinfoil hat. KJ was under no vote pressure and was falling under the radar quite nicely. Why choose him as a bus target? Makes no sense at all to me.

[Tere]

What did you like about Tere's posts?

:effort: like that is really hard to fake as town. at least for me. so if anyone makes an entry into a game in a slot like that and puts out decent content in their catchup post, it generally gives me positive vibes

it helps that the rest of this game is a grey murky fuckfield

This post made me laugh.

Hi reck! This a bit of a reach out to you. I see you've descended from your grumpy old man mountain a little and given some reads. How can I keep you engaged in the game? Help me out here.

[Tere]

No, you are not making busywork for me. How about you go back over my ISO and point out the problems with it, rather than trying to distract me from my stated effort of working through people's ISOs?

I'll ISO you when I get to it.

Reck isn't looking superb right now but I'm not seeing much from you trying to engage him or sort him. That vote looks opportunistic to me.

If you are so sure I'm scum are you happy to gladiate with me? Because I'd be totally up for that.

[Tere]

Why? I don't have to prove I am town to you. *shrug*. Also I have clearly said I've found aspects of dragonspawn's play problematic in his ISO dive - 125 discussion for example (from memory, the early claim), and I have also mentioned that weird naked townread of KJ from freek's ISO you picked up on on Day 1 just as a couple of points so you are definitely misrepresenting here.

Go shoo and make a proper case or go and do some sorting work elsewhere (which would be more useful for me since I know I'm town). Right now you are just sitting on the sidelines taking potshots in an attempt to distract me from what I am doing and I consider it antitown. Get the hell out of my way for a bit and go do something useful.

Bottom line is, I don't really care if I die today. But you are not lynching me until I've tried to beat this town into shape because Reck's characterisation of it as a grey murky fuckfield isn't far off regardless of his alignment and I need whichever of you kids who are town and have checked out or lost motivation to get your heads back in the game and I will bully and cheerlead you until you do it!

On a not unrelated note, I'm staring at ActionDan's ISO at the moment. It's not giving me scumvibes but good grief it's sparse. I know he's active elsewhere on site. Any ideas on how to get him back into this game except for looking into a mirror and saying his name 5 times? Anyone?

Also ika get your arse back into this game and help me.

[Tere]

Quick potted AD summary.

Not much until 195, in which he dislikes a couple of things about how my slot voted in RVS, pushes on Grib for his defense of himself during his early wagon and for language discrepancy in the Reck read, wonders about 4 scum set up, pokes at DS a bit about language, and picks up on a voting discrepancy Freek has (he has a townread on me while there's a vote on me IIRC but it could be hydra dissonance I guess, I noticed it reading through the first time too). He thinks KJ's posts are innocuous, disagrees with KJ's townread on Grib, and summarises by saying he has scumreads on Grib and DS and isn't convinced by the votes on Mantis yet.

Eh, so far so neutral, there's nothing horrible there. I had a lean slight town read on KJ reading through when at that stage.

The second wall of quotes 513 he still thinks Grib was flailing and pokes a bit at Mantis about why she doesn't, he defends his previous quote wall against Freek (who had said it was a big yawnfest and looked like quotes for the sake of quoting), pokes a bit more against Freek, and is slightly supportive of Reck, picking out a few of Freek's comments during ReckVagueGate. There's a response to dragonspawn about Jason and Freek and Mantis that I've read several times now and still haven't made headway with. He pokes again at Freek and is slightly supportive of Krystal for her post at 362 and more poking at Freek. He hates SH's vote on Krystal and says he hasn't seen anything of note from Grib or DS.

So I guess I see it that he is leaning slightly town from his post there on Krystal and isn't liking Freek very much. Grib and DS are in his mind but he's not tunnelling.

564 suggests a townread on reck and myself. Places lynch on DS at 665. He makes it clear in 745 and 769 he's not buying BP as a town claim. The WTF at ika at 779 and 881 looks like a flash of towny irritation to me at lolhammer the vig gate.

Then Day 2 he just kinda... disappears. He wants to lynch ika or DS at 875 and there's more about how he wants to lynch the BP in 988.

Day 3 so far he's said he's read up and said he can't find any crumbs and asked AP his role flavour at 1056.

I can't see anything horrible in that ISO per se. But my goodness there's not much to go on, the activity level is horrid and he is posting elsewhere. :/ I can't knock him for him being bothered by BP and wanting to vote it though because I have similar concerns in some ways but I don't want to just sit on that vote. I'd rather give DS a chance right now.

We have to get this guy back into the game and talking because all we have right now is Reck's townread and unless Reck comes down from his mountain properly and starts kicking arse and taking names he's not looking so great himself right now.

Argh.

[Tere]

Right, I think I've posted enough for one day. An ISO a day keeps the doctor away, or so I hear

[Tere]

It's OK, I am feeling a bit like Sisyphus here. You can herpaderp lynch me after I'm done with my thoughts if you like. I won't try replacing into a game again, because this is unfun *shrug*

[Tere]

You! Get in here and do some work, you! *pokes ActionDan with sticks*

No replacing or I will spank you, and not in a good way.

(I guess the mirror trick worked though...)

[Tere]

Vote Krystal Bald

You should know me better than that. Unimpressed. Consider yourself in the scumpile naughty zone. And the whole tone of that post was precisely the kind of tone that's been bothering me. You've been angling to set up my lynch ever since you knew I was the replace because you know full well I will do work and try and come after scum, and right now given the level of apathy in the game that's very dangerous for scum right now.

I've asked Nik twice now if he is willing to gladiate and he's slip slided away both times. So I am asking you. If you are so sure of your read on me, want to one to one?

[Tere]

ika! Come here! *hug*

Yes I am fucking town now have my back and get in this fucking game.

I can't do it alone and the apathy is driving me fucking nuts.

[Tere]

I mean seriously I am never ever doing a replace again ever. This shit is bananas exhausting and soul destroying. Sorry Elk and it's not your fault but it's true. I want to kick all the apathetic townies (and there must be some) up the backside right now.

I have not ISOed you in detail but I have a strong vibe from you that you are apathetic town right now, and I believe Grib copped you. I think AP is town too.

Can we get a bloc going?

[Tere]

OK ika I am getting a drink and I want you to stay and talk to me. Please!

[Tere]

OK so my reads have been shifting today as you can see.

Right now top of head reads.

Town.

Tere
ika - I have you as strong town. I cannot see scumika herpaderping that D1 lynchhammer as you did although I did have an epic facepalm. Read the bloody thread better next time good grief. but the scum Ika I know from timed games is a lurksack who does nothing. Tell me true, ika, do you hate playing scum? Plus I realise that you don't think Grib cop read you (and you get townpoints for admitting that) but I think he did and his reach out to you first thing Day 2 was that crumb. If it's not you it's AP.
AP - There is an outside chance he could be SK yes but I can't get into a headspace where claiming 1 shot as a SK would work. Mulling it over but if he is a SK I think he's playing it town anyway. He's active and actually here and reads genuine so I want him in my townpile anyway at least for a couple of days. I am I would say 99% sure he is town.

____________________________________________________________________________ level of acceptable towniness and I want to rage at you all for that.

We then have a morass of annoying people to sort.

ActionDan - I find nothing wrong in his ISO but it's so fucking thin I have nothing to go on. Either he needs to do some work or he should replace ASAP. We still have over 2 weeks, if we get someone else in his slot who is active we can sort this slot.
Dragonspawn - I didn't have a great gut read on DS when reading through the first time but my ISO dive made his Day 1 look better. I cannot parse his bulletproof claim as town in part because I have NFI why a scum team would have a neighbouriser, it seems like a benevolent investigate to me. I really need you to get cracking on that set up spec and think about it and I am relying on it. He has been coasting since Day 1 which looks awful and could be cheeky scum thinking they have a safeclaim but could be town. If he's town he really needs to step to the plate and start contributing.
Reck - I have read Reck's ISO and it really does feel like this disengaged person taking potshots. He did give reads today but reactively. He could be scum but I dunno if he is town with a scum wincon. I've reached out to him and if he starts working with us he could be OK. I just don't know.

PSA - you bunch of lurksacks need to come and play the game if you are town because we are drowning in Apathy and we need a lifeline. AD, if you really don't have time and are town it would really be fairer to replace out, in all honesty. Your slot isn't in a horrible state, it could be rescued if town.

Person I was reading scum but I have real problems thinking could be scum with Krystal - Freek. I need to ISO him. If all of Day 1 fight with Krystal was scum theatre hats off to them. The KJ readthrough I did didn't look great for them but I need to do a hard reset.

Scumpile at the mo.
Krystal. I was scumreading the slot all the way through my initial reread and decided to give them a chance. My neighbourhood post which is freaking people out was done as a reach out to them because they said they wanted it. I don't see a slot here giving me the space I said I needed. I see a slot freaking out that I've replaced in knowing I will fight like fuck for town and doing everything they can to discredit me. I haven't reread the ISO yet because like Freek's the volume is freaking out but Day 3 play from that slot to me has consisted of pot shots at me, a lazy vote on Reck and general yukkiness. The reaction to me telling them to back the fuck off I am busy is underwhelming too.

Scum games - I have one sad lonely scumgame on Ratskep where I died something like Day 2. It was Diva's halloween game and it was either Oct 2010 or 2011. Non indicative I hope, I will go find the link if you want it. It's behind the Ratskep register wall though. I remember the scum team being Durro and some awful newb and our slots had almost no concurrent times and it was just horrid. Apart from that it was Russian Roulette which you know and a scum game in ArcAngel's Days are Dark where I was hydraing with Mollie and she has some beef with House and went afk, and I was legitimately busy and just couldn't carry it (it was basically a 48 / 48 game and I had one window of 12 hours and one window of 18 hours to do everything at home, sleep read and post the game. So none of that is I hope representative. I haven't felt the scum love yet though

[Tere]

Vote Krystal Bald

You should know me better than that. Unimpressed. Consider yourself in the scumpile naughty zone. And the whole tone of that post was precisely the kind of tone that's been bothering me. You've been angling to set up my lynch ever since you knew I was the replace because you know full well I will do work and try and come after scum, and right now given the level of apathy in the game that's very dangerous for scum right now.

I've asked Nik twice now if he is willing to gladiate and he's slip slided away both times. So I am asking you. If you are so sure of your read on me, want to one to one?

one on one?
what do you mean


besides us, at this point -- who else are you willing to lynch?

If you are so sure of your scum read and are town you should be willing to sacrifice yourself to eliminate me. I propose we gladiate. People can vote only you or me. Scared?

[Tere]

Ugh. I feel a wave of bland washing over me.

Don't talk to me for a bit Mantis. Go away. I want to reread and ISO you. We have almost 3 weeks.

[Tere]

Also if anyone who is town contributes to a flashlynch on me I will scream at and mock you in postgame because I am working my fucking socks off here.

[Tere]

Ika are you in the neighbourhood today?

My POE neighbouriser FWIW is ActionDan or Reck unless it's not player driven and some GM stuff. If you aren't in the neighbourhood and one of those two is (assuming the neighbouriser cannot neighbourise themselves) then we have our neighbouriser.

Part of my difficulty with DS' claim is while N0 could have been random I understand my slot might have been difficult to sort and it seems sorta towny to have me in there twice to try and sort me. Also wtf would scum do with a neighbouriser?

I don't want any of you people to claim off the back of this post. Just putting thoughts down.

[Tere]

You've been angling to set up my lynch ever since you knew I was the replace because you know full well I will do work and try and come after scum, and right now given the level of apathy in the game that's very dangerous for scum right now.

for the record, this is in no way shape or form, the case.

i know you to be a good player, so i question your motives, even when you post a million wall posts.. it's not going to sway me, unless i hear earnestness... in which you seem to have showed with ika.

so NOW i am questioning on whether i am wrong. because you finally showed some emotion.

but please do not get all uppity with me in the fact that i questioned your slot and posts.


if you are complaining about apathetic town, you should realize that a lot of us have been posting as much as we can. so i don't know what you are looking for? people post when they can.

maybe they have not been asking the right questions to the ppl they find suspicious.

but after your wall posts, you have not been posting direct and aggressive posts to others either.


i suppose i am somewhat annoyed because you, like i said -- there's no reason why i should not question you. yet, you vote us for doing that.

and you were totally wrong too, because i had no tone in that post directed to you.
i'm too tired for that crap



p-edit -- too late tere. don't be so fucking mean to tell me i can't talk to you
/mad
/had a bad day at work

*hug*

Sorry you had a bad day at work.

Well tell your other head to give me a bit of bloody space too. I will get to you and I will sort you and if you are town I can reach out and talk to you but I need the space to think and try and work on this. I've replaced into a bowl of apathy here, there's a mountain of stuff to read, I am spending more time on this than I really should and town really needs to get energised and it feels like I am pushing uphill. So I am frustrated.

I am not going to tunnel on you although your scumread pisses me off because you should know me better. But I see a little flash of emotion there that could be town Mantis. But your ISO is enormous and I don't know what's freaking me out about your posts and I need time and space to sort you. Nik has given me some meta for you to read and you should check that and see if that's OK. If you are town you need to give me that space. Please?

[Tere]

if you are complaining about apathetic town, you should realize that a lot of us have been posting as much as we can. so i don't know what you are looking for? people post when they can.

Hey, my time is limited too. And I take a lot of time to read games. I'm kinda fucked off about how this game has played if I am honest. I got my replacement through at something like 3 am or 4 am my time. By the time I'd got up SH had been lynched and we were in night, so I took a full day that day to read and spreadsheet the first two days. Realised what a pile of apathy I'd replaced into. Game reopened basically just when I went V/LA. I've had two days to kick ass and take names and really get a feel for where my head was at, I've spent a significant amount of those two days trying to work through stuff and I still don't feel on top of things. So your slot sniping at me when I've asked for some space for a couple of days in a 3 week game cycle is not productive. If you are town you really need to give me that space.

As I said, I really don't care if you guys lynch me at end of game day, it's a mislynch, and I know my flip. But I will rage at anyone who tries to get in the way of me getting my head around the gamestate and we need to get all the AFKers in here.

And it fucks me off that the majority of the posters are barely playing. You can give great content with limited time, I've seen it done. But we have one who may be town and AFK, one who could be town but has coasted since their claim which doesn't give me town vibes, one who is sitting on top of their virtual mountain, one who has woken up and I hope will work with me but has been apathetic, one who is OK, and whatever the fuck you and freek are but you've produced so much content I don't know yet!

Bah. Let me sort you.

unvote

pedit. No. Stick you vote down and go away for a bit. I don't give a shit about your opinion about me right now.

[Tere]

In fact that strengthens my scumread, so thanks for that.

[Tere]

I may well put Krystal Bald on ignore till Monday. There's more than one scum in the game. Go away and sort some.

[Tere]

Come back ika where did you go!

[Tere]

<3 ok good. Wanna get drunk together?

pedit Freek that post is icky but I will deal with you later, I wanna get drunk with ika.

[Tere]

U R Wrongymcwrong, Freek. You have taken the wrong train to wrongsville.

pedit: sure! I just don't want to be all alone in the night. Hold me, ika.

[Tere]

*shrug*

I've told you I need this and you are not listening.

If you are town do me a solid and try not to talk to me till Monday. I need to get my shit together. Go sort someone else.

You kids can all state intent to hammer if you want. But I want space and time to sort my own head, for the inactives to get back etc. etc. post your questions if you want but I won't deal with them till Monday probs. I've explained why so don't get all emo Tere isn't listening to me. If you respect me as a player you can give me that space if you are town aligned. You can all line up and hammer me at the end of day, I don't care. But we need to build town love badly here.

[Tere]

@mantis

[Tere]

U R Wrongymcwrong, Freek. You have taken the wrong train to wrongsville.

pedit: sure! I just don't want to be all alone in the night. Hold me, ika.

*holds tere*

is your hubby ok with me doing this btw i don't want o get in trouble with him

i was eating sorry...

KB, are you going to unvote or no?

i don't think so.

our vote in on reck... and that seems pretty good to me.


what do you think about reck?

i wouldnt miss him seeing how he has been mostly non-existant, im just more curious about your scum read on tere.

lol. He is benignly mystified by mafia but tolerates it so you are safe.

Mantis' scum read on me to me is really weird. She can go look in Ratskep easily. I think I am bleeding town here so I am weirded out by it. Other people get a pass but I would think she might have a handle on it. I was giving Nik a semi pass in a head earlier but that she rocked up with that big case is odd.

I am less bothered by AP - he has way less access to meta, although he saw me as town in Lost Rooms. He could just be paranoid town. Freek just seems lazy knee jerk.

Both of Freek and Krystal need sorted grr.

pedit: Mantis OK but I am not going to get derailed by that. I answered your thing about the neighbourhood for you, remember? And got fucking scum read for it by somebody. You can ask all the stuff you want and I will try to answer it in my own sweet time. But you also need to understand I am halfway through a full ISO, I am read conservative, and there's stuff that may change while I am doing that. I won't ignore you, but I am going to do it later, OK? This is a three week game day.

For those of hard of tunnelling. none of my answering is appeasement. I don't give a shit if you guys lynch me end of day. I just want town's house in order before I go.

[Tere]

EBWOP I missed a bit "I was giving Nik a semi pass in a head that doesn't know me earlier"

[Tere]

Freek also contains Farside who should know town me so less lazy knee jerk and poss more hmm. But I don't care right now. Where are you at, ika? What's your mental game state?

[Tere]

I will work with you in a few days time when I have a baseline, for what feels like that the 10000th time. You should know I don't deathtunnel. Give me a break here. You can all lynch me and light candles and eat marshmallows and sing kumbaya later if you really want.

If you want to be town helpful my homework is help me chivvy the lurkers into participating and give them some hope town can win.

[Tere]

@ Krystal.

Yup ika I promise you I am not neighboriser. I crumbed role before. I can out if you wish, I basically crumbed it before, it's not exciting.

[Tere]

@Freek. I don't care who the mysterious X is in your neighbourhood if it's not one of these but is it either of reck or ActionDan?

@ika - you are the set up guy. Should we massclaim? My instinct is not in case there's another town role floating about although there's not been much sign of any other specials as yet.

@Krystal and Dragonspawn thanks so much for helping with town morale there. And that's considerably more polite than I want to be.

[Tere]

I seriously am thinking about just replacing out because fuck this shit.

[Tere]

In before "omg this is scumtell for Tere wafflewafflewaffle" from someone.

[Tere]

That little scripted dialogue between Krystal and dragon made me think we lynch that and we're good. And if we're not, fuck this town.

[Tere]

OK ika we got this. I think we have a block with AP right now.

[Tere]

But I want to rant all the swearwords in the world right now and DS just dropped through the floor on my reads list again.

[Tere]

Mantis you can ask me stuff. I am not ignoring you. If it's easy I will answer you, if it's a full fat Tere you are scum argh charge push thing you are wrong and you can wait till Monday.

[Tere]

Mantis what did you think of Dragon's post just then?

I mean I thought there was plenty of content there - ika and I reaching out, we are fighting. I've reached out to him in his ISO dive. There wasn't any I haven't caught up.

IMO that seemed dismissive, lazy and didn't give me town vibes.

[Tere]

OK ika, that goes with my gut. I cannot see what use neighboriser would be to town at all. I think there's another power role. THIS IS NOT AN OUT REQUEST FROM THAT ROLE. That dismissive bomb from dragon is enough to make me lynch him. I'd reached out. That was anti town.

I was going to give him another day but tbh given that response I am comfortable with

vote Dragonspawn

for the moment.

Let's put my head in the firing line. We know Action Dan will follow. Let's see what this does.

[Tere]

staring at post. Hold.

[Tere]

OK DS I am going to respond to you give me a sec.

[Tere]

1. Let me get this straight, you do absolutely nothing different day one then i just did ika and you have the audacity to get upset when I call you guys out on doing nothing? Seriously?

2. I asked if anyone noticed freek hasn't said anything and its ignored. They, on cue, come in and post a few fluff posts and its like I never asked anything.

3. I was on kj for a majority of day one, you guys ignore it and lo and behold he is scum. Shocking I know.

4. you guys rush lynch sonic when it was fairly obvious from the lack of any opposition beside myself that he was going to flip town.

5. its freakin obvious tere is town from the substance she posted and yet despite doing some great posts we spend the last several pages distracting from that and people still wanting to lynch her.

6. tell me, after the last few days of pitiful lynched, why are we still letting Krystal control the discussion?

7. moreover, why the heck is any townie acting like I was scummy to claim when I did when I was the main wagon and we were three hours before a lynch? A question iced multiple times and been ignored.

8. why the heck is anyone town reading action Dan at this point? He has provided absolutely nothing to this point, parked his vote on a claimed pr, and said about two things today with no substance. I can understand null reading him or not thinking he is scum but his actions sure as heck aren't town

9. do you guys seriously think kj was the only scum vote on sonic yesterday? If you don't why not pay more attention to the wagon?

10. seriously lets get this town together and start actually putting some pressure on some good targets.

I've added some numbers in to your quote so it's clear what I am responding to I hope.

1. I am not ika's keeper but I think it's obvious from my posts that I am pissed off with you and I think that was antitown.
2. I have noted Freek's lurking. Stop fretting. I thought their reentry was a bit weaksauce too. Stop fretting. They are not being forgotten about.
3. You moved to reck 233. You are overstating that a bit. It's not alignment indicative for me, the ebb and flow of the game can warp time.
4. Null, I haven't looked at the Sonic vote yet. If you have been looking at vote analysis I would be very grateful if you could share with the group.
5. Yes! Glad you agree!
6. I don't think we are. In fact I keep telling them to shoo and go do something else and they don't like it very much. You did have your little emo moment together just now though which was uhhhhhh....
7. My bother with you isn't your claim 3 hours prior. My bother was the early crumb 2 votes down. That seems very scripted to me. It could be town, it's not a slam dunk. But I would be lying if I said it didn't bother me. I am not tunnelling on you, I am still listening to you though.
8. I am reading him as null. There's nothing wrong with his ISO in general IMO - I don't think his pressure on your slot is actively scummy, I know my PM and I have similar concerns so no. I think him staying on it with no attempt to sort you might be more of a case though. If he doesn't either town it up or replace out shortly I will be feeling far less comfy with that slot. This is a team game and we all understand we have other commitments but it's not fair to leave other players in the lurch like that.
9. please give us some wagon analysis for the group since you've clearly done it.
10. Yes fucking yes!

dragon, have you read my ISO dive on you? Did you see my reach out? I am willing to offer you an olive branch for this game day despite my suspicions but I need more people back in the game and working together. Can you do that for me?
pedit not read yet getting this out

[Tere]

OK:

Hey, we have more pissed off people who care interacting with the game, we might just do this!

I will give Farside 11/10 for that snark

OK so Ika will know who the neighboriser is.

Dragon's rant looks OK from that stuff, so I am going to

unvote

to demonstrate good faith.

OK, we have everyone in and participating apart from Reck and Dan now. Lets try not to snark at each other and try to understand each other.

A bit of me wonders if it's Occam's now and town is eating itself. What do folk think?

If everyone here is town, we need to find each other.

Guys? Guys? Group hug, guys?

[Tere]

Tere is not town,if I have to do meta research tonight to see if this behavior is normal tonight I will be pissed.

Is that Farside? The answer's important.

[Tere]

I am a numpty head and am drunk so a late pedit.

OK ika, that goes with my gut. I cannot see what use neighboriser would be to

scum

at all. I think there's another power role. THIS IS NOT AN OUT REQUEST FROM THAT ROLE. That dismissive bomb from dragon is enough to make me lynch him. I'd reached out. That was anti town.

I was going to give him another day but tbh given that response I am comfortable with

vote Dragonspawn

for the moment.

Let's put my head in the firing line. We know Action Dan will follow. Let's see what this does.

[Tere]

Tere is not town,if I have to do meta research tonight to see if this behavior is normal tonight I will be pissed.

convince me why, cus i can link you to her scum game here and a town game here

When has town Tere asked anyone to Gladiate or have a defeatist behavior or mock player.

I'll tell you for fact in my new just now research I looked Tere and Gladiate and this is the first time she wanted players to only those 2.
Now why is this scummy you might ask.
Because players tend to behave a certain way or at least at some point think having 2 players up for lynch only when trying to "figure them out" would have done it in the past.
As I said the Tere I played was more about breaking stategy and figuring players out.
This
This is just crap posting.

Who is this? Also you haven't researched external sites, clearly. I can link you to my one and only game on Teamliquid where I was dealing with the worst mafia player I ever encountered in my life and I am pretty certain I offered up a gladiate to him there. I was town and he was town incidentally. Ugh. Yeah. The one and only person who if he shows up here I will be WOTO or WOTC or fuck this I'm out of here if he joins anything I am part of. Ugh.

I don't recall gladiate offering on any other site. I certainly haven't on MS (my meta is small enough here you are not wrong for here. But I can find you a game to link to if you would like it.

I don't think I am mocking players. I think this is very misrepresentative. I am pissed off because I subbed in to a pile of apathy, town needs to find each other, and town is finding each other, and I am kicking arse to try to achieve that. I'm not going to excuse being passionate *shrug*

If you all WIFOM or freakout about this at end of day and want clarity on my reads you can all vote me. I'll self vote today if I am confident that's what town needs. I'm just a foot soldier here.

pedit it's almost 4 here and I am going to need to let the decorators into the holiday lets in 5 hours. Expect hungover Tere tomorrow. But I feel a town finding each other vibe so it's worth it.

[Tere]

I am assuming this is all Farside in the Freek in which case girl you should be ashamed. You know I care :/

[Tere]

I see enough town snark here and passion this could be the whole town team talking. ooh I wanted to find something in what Farside said brb

[Tere]

Let me get this straight, you do absolutely nothing different day one then i just did ika and you have the audacity to get upset when I call you guys out on doing nothing? Seriously?

I asked if anyone noticed freek hasn't said anything and its ignored. They, on cue, come in and post a few fluff posts and its like I never asked anything.

I was on kj for a majority of day one, you guys ignore it and lo and behold he is scum. Shocking I know.

you guys rush lynch sonic when it was fairly obvious from the lack of any opposition beside myself that he was going to flip town.

its freakin obvious tere is town from the substance she posted and yet despite doing some great posts we spend the last several pages distracting from that and people still wanting to lynch her.

tell me, after the last few days of pitiful lynched, why are we still letting Krystal control the discussion?

moreover, why the heck is any townie acting like I was scummy to claim when I did when I was the main wagon and we were three hours before a lynch? A question iced multiple times and been ignored.

why the heck is anyone town reading action Dan at this point? He has provided absolutely nothing to this point, parked his vote on a claimed pr, and said about two things today with no substance. I can understand null reading him or not thinking he is scum but his actions sure as heck aren't town

do you guys seriously think kj was the only scum vote on sonic yesterday? If you don't why not pay more attention to the wagon?

seriously lets get this town together and start actually putting some pressure on some good targets.

That's because your wrong. We've posted once a day at least since this game day started.
Have I been that active as I was day 1 and 2, no. Was I doing something this past weekend and been busy these last few days yes.
I'm sorry I had a life.
While all you've done is vote Kj day 1 because....
I'm sorry I missed that big scum tell while you sit doing nothing but bitching or asking pointless questions.


*bitch side off*

We are in the inn with Dan.
All he said was he'd post more when the mafia team thing was done.

In the meantime I'm going to bed.

*i will not be snarky*
*i will not be snarky*
*i will not be snarky*
*i will not be snarky*

Maybe.

bolded. I think everything I could say comes under [redacted] and I am too tipsy to navigate that so I will leave it there.

[Tere]

I need to sleep. I think I would like people to review this though, because there was an instance of mind meld there for a sec.

We might be onto something here.

Good night!

(someone setup speccy, what would be considered normal for a 13 theme? 3 scum? 3 scum 1 sk? 4 scum? Something reck said (which I think could be illuminating? which I think was 2 scum, 1 sk 1 ally?))

I think it's more important that people reach out and find each other, but its a question those of that bent who are town aligned might want to think about on their own.

Night night.

pedit ika why did you have to get drunk now! OK everyone V/LA tomorrow.

Go!

[Tere]

hurry up though I'm fading

[Tere]

We don't have enough mislynches yet to declare the town block all the active peeps do we?

[Tere]

Gut actually says Reck right now. I know I have reached out to him and I want to give him time. But if I had a gun to my head that's where I'd hammer. I've seen enough defensiveness, snarky irritation and townvibe from Freak, Krystal and Dragon I wouldn't be convinced a gun to their head wouldn't be a mislynch.

Given the neighbourhood [redacted] comment, it really could be Reck and Dan.

But thankfully we have two weeks to sort this shit.

[Tere]

Dude you have 30 mins max I need to get up and be professional tomorrow. Make it count (that sounds naughty hehe)

[Tere]

We don't have enough mislynches left to declare the town block all the active peeps do we?

EBWOP

[Tere]

On my mind right now? I am tentatively cautiously optimistic that I have caused enough aggro to sort some people. I saw a flash or two or real emotion from Mantis this evening. Mebbe Farside too. Mebbe DS.

I wouldn't autotownread anyone but I am not in the autoscumreading zone for sure. Cases can be constructed, and I guess I understand Mantis' reservation with my posts so far, but I replaced into a slot that was dead woman walking, and I didn't expect to live the day. I walked in expecting to be lynched. It's not that klaz' ISO was horrible, he just wasn't here.

How likely is it it's 2 scum plus a thing (SK, traitor, er something I haven't considered? The only experience I have is Lost Rooms.

[Tere]

Well AP claimed the Kj kill.

Mebbe survivor.

Reck is either survivor / traitor / scum if I had a gun to my head. Which is IMO the best consensus deal. that or Dan. We should give them both time to get in and keep pressure on dragons though. I haven't looked at votecount yet so I will be interested to see if he takes me up on that

[Tere]

Anyway I need to go to bed *hug* you in the game now?

[Tere]

wut

night night.

[Tere]

Fuck this town and its negativity.

I have zero interest in looking at this thread any more whatsoever.

Replacing out.

[Tere]

Sorry ika.