NY 169: The EPIC XD Mafia Game of Greatness (Game Over)

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

75 pages.

I will skip them all.

Who should I sheep and who is obvscum?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Vote: Stuffed Crust

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Oh it's a hydra.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Hey! We played together before, once, maybe, I think.
Anyway, I'm glad that you're hopping on the biggest wagon without any articulation, and I know, it's awkward that it's my wagon, and so anything I say in response is going to be taken with a grain of salt, but
Why?

Why not? The righteous people of this town are obviously trying to lynch who they think is scum. If I want to look hip and cool and fit in I should conform to their views, no?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

goodmorning is probably town.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Tammy is highly town too unless she started being able to imitate her town aggressiveness? Idk someone who recently played with her can link me to something like that.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

75 pages.

I will skip them all.

Who should I sheep and who is obvscum?

Geists, koreanbbq, doom, casso, mcmaraca and mafiaSSK are all dog poop scummy.


If you want a good sheeting bet f16 is the most town so far but his town piling is at a snails pace right now.

Sheep tammy cos she is adorable.

Why is F-16 the most town? I get the impression they are prodding here and there without pushing too hard or having

concrete

reads. And 1758 just looks like white-knighting. Only thing I somewhat like is the ending of 1060.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Fair assessment, but within this town lies a cruel and villainous hive of mafia-sworn evil-doers. They seek to kill the good men of this town via deceit, guns, and nooses. I believe that there are people who are rallying for my lynch who are part of this den of villainy. To push my lynch is to support their twisted, evil ways. I am a member of the town itself, and while the mafia would love to honey your ears with lies such that you won't believe me, I ask for you to grasp at the purity of my confession!

I am town! If you want to find the true villains, don't string me up! Nay! Look unto the sea of bloodthirsty faces, crying out to have me slain. Are they not the true villains?

Ser Arthur Dayne, you've traveled far to come to this wretched place. I ask for your allegiance against those who would plot to see this town in flames. What say ye?

unvote,
Vote stuffed crust

I let a lot of the mental patient schtick slide but you are covering having to address anything with it and firing off posts at anything. It's getting old and I think you are desperately trying to troll your way out of your predicament

Dunno what you're talking about. IF you think that I'm scum because my rhetoric is off-side, absurd, goofy, etc, well, isn't that a policy vote more than anything?

Also, I've been doing a pretty fucking good job of defending myself against accusations made against me. I don't really think that constitutes as 'trolling'.

-V

What is your read on Generic?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

town

Brian

12. Brian Skies - The dismal amount of effort you're bringing here scares me.

Did the only thing that change between those two is he stopped putting in effort? Or didn't put enough effort?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Wait that's cabd's I thought he was signing with ~ not mara.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

@EVERYONE: if one of my townreads or null-town reads is wrong who do you think it probably is?

This sentence is actually bad on so many levels.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Actually I'm down with Pie.

Vote: Pie

Nearly 0 scumhunting, and the only case/scumread is on the dude with the largest wagon

Like I don't actually get the feeling they have any interest of solving this game.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I got the opposite impression from Pieguyn's posts. It felt as if he was scumhunting constantly right from the moment he replaced in. He came in, questioning Sakura, then moved onto DOMO, and then to StuffedCrust. He seemed to have plenty of cases and he listed quite a few scumreads in his reads list. Tell me how he has done 0 scunhunting.

Yeah but like

Do you SEE those.

1) They look terribly fake.

2) They look like that thing scum do where they focus on one person and ignore everything else and so they can LOOK like they're actually scumhunting and putting effort while they are literally bouncing off thoughts with one person.

3) There's a difference between attacking people and scumhunting. Scumhunting that leads you to form a scumread on someone actually requires attempt to convince people to vote someone to create pressure and get a reaction.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Furthermore, I can't really see how that's alignment indicative.

you being unable to keep up with the bullshit that you spin as scum is hella alignment indicative

you slipped all over the place in xenogears, to the point where i couldn't even be fucked to point them all out to everyone in my dogged pursuit of bussing you

i let you get away in calvin and hobbes and it isn't happening again

Well, the problem is that I'm not scum this game, so you can't really bus me,
and my bullshit is less 'spun' and more just me trying to find scum.


-V

Okay so like

who do you think is scum.

Because I don't think I have seen a post that wasn't about defending yourself since I entered the game.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Well I mean other than the one where you explain your read on Generic which I asked you about but etc.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I was third into geists. And my first three votes were held for a significant period.

But I have isoed you and found you have tactual oh also argued against the accusations amongst the bullshit. So that was a misrep on my part.

And your assessment of me I like a lot, even though I actually think my efforts are better than sub par.

unvote

This is quite a bad post for a multitude of reasons.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

give us three

No wtf I'm trying to get a reaction why do you ruin everything.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Generic how

a) impulsive are you.

and b) reflective are you.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Okay that's actually a pretty genuine post.

Pedit: the first. The second can easily be faked as scum so eh.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Actually I'm down with Pie.

Vote: Pie

Nearly 0 scumhunting, and the only case/scumread is on the dude with the largest wagon

Like I don't actually get the feeling they have any interest of solving this game.

what the fuck?
I've been trying to sort most of the players the whole game. I started by getting a bunch of townreads and trying to verify they were all correct, and then I've been pushing on people since then. you completely left out the part where I've been pushing on other people besides SC and how I expressed several scumreads that weren't SC.

Okay so here's the problem. Getting townreads is the easiest thing in the world, especially when YOU BARELY HAVE SCUMREADS. It doesn't create conflict, and it creates this sense that you're actually achieving something. Number 2, what's more troubling is the fact that YOU TRIED TO NARROW DOWN THAT TOWN LIST. You do realize the majority of people, are, in fact town, right? And at one point you're supposed to go "okay, I have this list of like 12 townreads, now lets try to narrow down the others to scum BECAUSE WE HAVE TO LYNCH SOMEONE". Number 3, while yes, you did mention "several" scumreads, you did them in time intervals (okay there's a difference between mentioning scumreads and actually pushing them - the former is useless without the latter). My biggest problem with you is that you pick one person, huff and puff after them in what looks like an attempt to show you're

pushing

suspects, while tunneling everything out.

also, if you haven't read the thread, then how the fuck would you get the idea I've done "nearly 0 scumhunting"?

I don't know, random epiphanies just fall unto me.

2) They look like that thing scum do where they focus on one person and ignore everything else and so they can LOOK like they're actually scumhunting and putting effort while they are literally bouncing off thoughts with one person.

and why the fuck do you think this is alignment indicative?

Because... like... it literally is, most of the time?

3) There's a difference between attacking people and scumhunting. Scumhunting that leads you to form a scumread on someone actually requires attempt to convince people to vote someone to create pressure and get a reaction.

WHAT THE FUCK DOES THIS EVEN MEAN?!

It means you had/have no intention of actually pushing someone and was/is putting on a show to look like you care about "figuring" out the scum.

your reasons for accusing me are BS. your push on me is opportunistic as fuck

Lol wat. It's opportunistic... because there are 2 people voting you? And it's not like I want to create pressure anywhere,

no

, why would that be beneficial at all?

ok so how the fuck have none of you noticed that Casso and Ser Arthur just came up with this wagon on me out of nowhere? that's giving me really bad vibes. it feels like scum lining up a mislynch. I'm not sure about Casso considering Thor hadn't read a lot of the thread, but Ser Arthur is scum and I'm sure of it. sheep me plz o/

You caught us me and casso are totally partners.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Okay so here's the problem. Getting townreads is the easiest thing in the world, especially when YOU BARELY HAVE SCUMREADS. It doesn't create conflict, and it creates this sense that you're actually achieving something

can't wait til you get around to doing a read on me because this is pretty much all i've done so far and i'm town

Well there's a natural way to go about it and an ungenuine way to go about it. Sometimes people ARE genuinely lost and find it their best method, but there's a clear distinction between forming townreads and fixating on townhunting. And upon an ISO of you, you don't actually look too bad so meh (well there's too little to make a judgement). And I actually like your casual entrance?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Ser Arthur, I appreciate your new profile image.

Yeah I make an attempt to remember to change it when I enter games b/c I know it gets crazy annoying for people using smartphones >_>

People that I have conviction about being scum and want to see lynched:

Desperado

KoreanBBQ
Mc Maraca

People that I'm suspicious of and want to see pressured:
Pretty much all you guys, but especially
Cephrir

Pieguyn

Casso
Sakura

zMuffin
Goodmorning

Can you please elaborate on the bolded in like one to two sentences? Or just link me if you've said it somewhere else?

Also, don't think I mentioned this (I did mention it to empire before entering however), but I'm moving back home tomorrow, and I'm gonna be in the hospital monday which might affect me tuesday also, so I might not be very active the next few days.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

goodmorning is probably town.

Why is goodmorning the first person you iso'd?

Because he like... legit posted 3 minutes before? People only exists to me in this game once they start posting after my replace in (unless I already know they really well?). Also I kinda liked that post so read his ISO and liked it on a gut level too.

Tammy is highly town too unless she started being able to imitate her town aggressiveness? Idk someone who recently played with her can link me to something like that.

If you feel even slightly unsure about me why don't you address me directly?

I'm not? I said UNLESS people can link me to a game where she was scum and imitated her to town game this good (because I haven't played with you in a good while?). Also no offense but if you were scum I think I'd rather someone else link me than you saying you can't imitate your town game this good

(Also if you're going to hang out at the gold saucer, could you get an avatar that is more pleasing to me?)

I'm trying to find my Cait Sith picture >_>

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Why does Pie have like one of the most boringest reactions in the world.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

The fact that I still can't get a concrete read on him is already infuriating but there's the fact that he seems to hop from one target to the next forgetting EVERYTHING from the last, like restarting fresh every once in a while or something. Add that to a generic OMGUS

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

How is it OMGUS?

I love how you keep just tapping at people rather than actually going for a proper punch Arthur.

I have a feeling like you think I'm talking about you when I used generic when I actually mean the regular definition of it...

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Unvote
Vote: zMuffinMan

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Fwiw Ceph's reaction is quite terribad but okay we'll assume he's untouchable because he's on V/LA.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also if we all think really hard we can wagon F-16 because I know that half probably want it in the depths of their heart. I just have to awaken it for them.

(Some of their most recent posts are fine but the ones before that are )

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also the Stuffed Crust wagon is really bad and I have no idea why people are trying to restart it.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

what's up with the falcon?

Basically most of their posts between the mc vote and unvote are terrible and look like they're slowly trying to back up from what they realize is a horrible vote.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Hi Bert!

Hi I noticed you post here and there but you have no content since I entered the game.

Do you like... have scum reads and can you switch off SC kthx.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Tammy you can read Nero right?

Because I'm just gonna sheep your read on him.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Tammy you can read Nero right?

Because I'm just gonna sheep your read on him.

haha but isn't Tammy voting someone else? Why sheep that person and not someone else she is scumreading, why Nero?

Also it's nice to feel comfortable when there's a lazy club around, but my worries are there's scum in it

?

She's scumreading nero? I don't even know I'm just trying to get her read on him so I can actually put a read to that slot because I'm terrible at reading nero.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Do you like... have scum reads and can you switch off SC kthx.

I posted some reads not too long ago and I already said I have no scumreads.

Oh okay I actually thought you forgot about those and were going to actually give me scumreads.

Oh well.

Sigh.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Can you at least use your vote to pressure someone that isn't town or something please?

pedit: @sakura

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Please

Press

Enter.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Could you sheep us, Brian?

it would be awesome

Can I just proxy my vote to you until I catch up?

Vote: MuffinMan

Going to try and catch up tomorrow and figure out what's going on this game.

So like... what.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also I'm very tempted to move my vote to F-16.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I don't understand why all the stoners still have their votes parked on the SC wagon.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

@ser,

why are you voting me?

what's your read on casso?

I think all I want from you is a concrete scumlist and want to see you pushing some scumreads *shrug*

Also I can't read Nacho and I can't read Thor so there's no way in hell I'm attempting to read a hydra of the two. The aggression they have put forth right now can honestly come from either alignment for them, but I've kinda liked Nacho's posts.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also can I make a request to be called either SAD or Arthur because everything else is weird to me and I can barely recognize you're even referring to me kthx.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also I'm very tempted to move my vote to F-16.

How about you
a) Actually do it
b) Explain why you find me scummy and try to dig deeper

Talking about your temptations isn't helping the game.

a) Literally anyone with a brain can foresee that your wagon won't kick off today so there is like no point to me wasting my vote there.
b) I'm actually quite content with watching your interactions with mc tyvm.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I also have a very good reason to think that scum would try a discrediting tactic with Tammy since I've seen it happen before

It would be lovely if you can link a few games so I can see if you actually believe what you're talking about or not.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Okay

I'll go look at that again.

Anyway while you're here does the muffin scumread on casso look natural to you or not. I mean the way he just votes casso first with weak reasoning then strengths it after casso attack them. (Okay I'm probably not getting my point across but does it look like they're trying to make a camping vote look better by putting forth reasons after they're attacked so it looks like they're initial vote was stronger or not? <-- probably still confusing but w/e )

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

their*

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Pie wtf.

I thought you were actually town.

How do you go back to making me think you're scum in a span of 2 pages.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Unvote
Vote: Casso

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Tbf the collection of people on this wagon give me the chills.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also fwiw I have a gut-scumread on Desperado just like to throw that out.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Sakura and Ceph too but I think I already mentioned those.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Not so Town
9. Stuffed Crust (Mac + Varsoon) - GiF said not town.
15. Sakura Hana - could see a scum team with Sakura and pieguyn due to the way their back and forth ended without a sense of resolution. It's hard to fault anyone for lack of participation over the last several days, but I'm not that comfortable with Sakura atm.
10. pieguyn SonOfZeus - He's not doing some stuff that I am used to seeing him do when he's town, particularly cross-checking his reads with other players and frequently asking people what they think about other players' posts. The Sakura interactions didn't feel quite right somehow.
20. Desperado - such a huge and intentional meta change feels town, but I dunno. I feel his more recent posts are coming off more engaged and hence more town.

I agree with all this except the SC read

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Unvote

considering i didn't even really do what you apparently wanted me to do, what made you unvote me?

Take a guess. I'm pretty sure it has something to do with a deadline approaching and a select number of people required to be on a lynch.

also, when did you change your mind about casso? coz your 2471 makes it sound like you were leaning town on them, if anything, and 2633 makes it seem like you don't think it's a good wagon

See above.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also this is gonna be awkward but

Unvote

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

F-16_Fighting_Falcon
pieguyn
Sakura Hana
Cephrir
Desperado

^ Here are the scums. Please feel free to create a wagon on any.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

It worthy to note I will also vote a wagon on BROseidon.

And like MafiaSSK and DOMO are literally unknown to me so wtf

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Here ya go Tammy.

Also I'll be out for the whole day.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Vote: F-16

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

The one new page of the first sexual experiences thread was more interesting than 10 pages of this thread.

To an asexual.

Let that sink in.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Here domo have some scum points.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Unvote
Vote: Sakura

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

lol you chuck me scum points and then jump on the wagon I'm on? Nice work.

F-16_Fighting_Falcon
pieguyn
Sakura Hana
Cephrir
Desperado

^ Here are the scums. Please feel free to create a wagon on any.

Also you get scum points because your posts suck terribly.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

And like MafiaSSK and DOMO are literally unknown to me so wtf

I know you. I'm the reverend. You won lottery addicts at lylo thanks to me. My worst town game here.

Anyway your ISO is amazing, now I know what kind of level I need to aspire to.

fwiw I think you're town. In your scum game with me you were ridiculously active.

Yooo, what up rev.

Also I meant "unknown" in the sense I remember nothing they did in this game (well at that point) but etc.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Who are your partners, Sakura?

Good question Bert.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Why are you confident she'll flip scum, Arthur?

She's obviously part of THE LIST

TM

This wagon on Sakura feels so icky, it's not even funny

Unvote

Please start committing to lynches ty.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Or maybe one of DOMO/SAD?

Lmao.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Those are both utterly terrible suggestions and you should probably know that.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

You guys do realize the MafiaSSK wagon literally gives 0 percent of actual helpful information right?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Like literally there is no way to analyze anything of his wagon no matter the flip when he's lynched in half a day.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I could also, very easily go to Bert

Other than a few terrible posts he's probably town though.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

So who's good enough to analyze mafiassk's whopping 34 posts for scum-relationship tells if he flips scum?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

We had so many good wagons.

SO MANY.

WHY DO YOU PEOPLE RUIN THEM.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

He has a better chance of being scum than anyone we were wagonning before

... How does he have a better than random chance of flipping scum?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I actually already said I'm fine with a Bro wagon and still am.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Like at least that would feel better.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Let me ISO brian really quick and get back to you if Norlkaz would be a good/fine wagon.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

How do we have 145+ pages of Day 1 and then we push the most useless wagon.

Like if mafiassk flips scum the ONLY thing we gain is one scum down (which I mean is kinda good but it's literally a random chance right now). We gain no other helpful info, and we start day 2 with no lynch info whatsoever.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I kinda like Brain's posts so wouldn't really be up for wagoning his replacement.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

R u kidding me
We don't need associate tells to hunt scum

Okay feel free to go hunt by magic but I'd MUCH prefer a wagon that actually yields info.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

How do we have 145+ pages of Day 1 and then we push the most useless wagon.

Like if mafiassk flips scum the ONLY thing we gain is one scum down (which I mean is kinda good but it's literally a random chance right now). We gain no other helpful info, and we start day 2 with no lynch info whatsoever.

Except for everyones day 1 play, which is a kind of big deal. We have plenty of strong wagons to analyze, we have good reactions to who jumps on this kynch and who defends it... You act like the entire game thread disappears once we lynch someone with less than 50 posts, but that's not the case.

Wut.

We're getting one flip. How does this one flip help us regardless of what the flip is.

Also feel free to analyze the "strong" wagons but you'll be literally analyzing them blindly because the mafiassk lynch/flip and the wagon relates a whole total of 0 percent to those "strong" wagons.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

How do we have 145+ pages of Day 1 and then we push the most useless wagon.

Like if mafiassk flips scum the ONLY thing we gain is one scum down (which I mean is kinda good but it's literally a random chance right now). We gain no other helpful info, and we start day 2 with no lynch info whatsoever.

Except for everyones day 1 play, which is a kind of big deal. We have plenty of strong wagons to analyze, we have good reactions to who jumps on this kynch and who defends it... You act like the entire game thread disappears once we lynch someone with less than 50 posts, but that's not the case.

How will you be doing things differently if mafiassk flips town? What if he flips scum? How will you take into account his flip and/or his wagon and how will you use this new found piece of information?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also you are literally wanting to wagon mafiassk because he's likely not to be here and thus not likely to pull an AtE like Sakura just did, and thus you won't feel bad if his wagon flips town.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

How do we have 145+ pages of Day 1 and then we push the most useless wagon.

Like if mafiassk flips scum the ONLY thing we gain is one scum down (which I mean is kinda good but it's literally a random chance right now). We gain no other helpful info, and we start day 2 with no lynch info whatsoever.

Except for everyones day 1 play, which is a kind of big deal. We have plenty of strong wagons to analyze, we have good reactions to who jumps on this kynch and who defends it... You act like the entire game thread disappears once we lynch someone with less than 50 posts, but that's not the case.

How will you be doing things differently if mafiassk flips town? What if he flips scum? How will you take into account his flip and/or his wagon and how will you use this new found piece of information?

I won't do things differently if SSK flips town, scum. Maybe I notice interesting interactions when I read through his posts, maybe I won't. Who are Sakura scumbuddies based on her posts so far?

I don't actually do analysis before a flip, but I would imagine if she were to flip scum I would learn a lot more from her 174 posts than from mafiassk's 34 posts if he were to flip scum

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I'll be out the whole day tomorrow, and

might

check in before the deadline on the 26th, but in case I don't.

Unvote
Vote: MafiaSSK

Feel free to call this bussing if he flips town. That's likely to be the only piece of information you'll get from the wagon *shrug*

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also I am literally only doing this because I want a lynch before I lose my sanity.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I'll be out the whole day tomorrow, and

might

check in before the deadline on the 26th, but in case I don't.

Unvote
Vote: MafiaSSK

Feel free to call this bussing if he flips town. That's likely to be the only piece of information you'll get from the wagon *shrug*

scum*

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yay, let's wagon the townread (at least one of mine) after the null we're trying to wagon claims doc.

Anymore stupid decisions while I'm not there so I can't yell and complain about them in the moment?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

VOTE: SC

=====[]

You hammered when we still had two hours before deadline and Pieguyn before you had said it was L-1?

vote KoreanBBQ

This is quite bad please stop

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

VOTE: StuffedCrust
Because, deadline.

Ewww.

How is this any worse than the other SC votes?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

VOTE: SC

=====[]

You hammered when we still had two hours before deadline and Pieguyn before you had said it was L-1?

vote KoreanBBQ

This is quite bad please stop

That's an interesting post SAD. Why is pressure on the hammerer who would have been well aware he was hammering be a bad thing?

Here, let me see if I can change what you said to make you realize why it is a bad accusation:

"You hammered when we

only

had two hours before deadline and Pieguyn before you had said it was L-1, meaning that even

if

SC had claimed a role there was literally no way for a new wagon to form."

That's how absurd what you said sounds.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

VOTE: StuffedCrust
Because, deadline.

Ewww.

How is this any worse than the other SC votes?

It's just weird when people justify votes that are obvious.
I can't really explain it that well and can't really be bothered to since SSK is probably town anyways, but I feel that people who do that have a need to justify the obvious vote are only justifying it so they can point back at it and go "look, look, my hands were tied".

Or they are trying to justify it to themselves because they have a guilty conscience because if that wagon were to flip town (especially considering mafiassk didn't even have a scumread on SC to begin with, I think?) they know they just speed lynched someone who wasn't here to defend themselves or here to claim like he (mafiassk) just did.

Meh *shrug*

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

So who's good enough to analyze mafiassk's whopping 34 posts for scum-relationship tells if he flips scum?

Tammy responded to this defense as if this wasn't something you cared about normally, which alarmed me. Why did you start caring about them here?

VOTE: SAD

Umm, I actually always cared about them?

R u kidding me
We don't need associate tells to hunt scum

Okay feel free to go hunt by magic but I'd MUCH prefer a wagon that actually yields info.

When did you become a big ol information lynch person? I'm pretty sure I remember that once when I was scum and lurked and trolled, you declared that were going to travel to everyone's houses and type my name in to ensure my lynch when there was literally no information to be gained from my lynch because i didn't do anything.

I mean I get it if you're town reading SSK, but other than that when did you do big associative tells for scum hunting?

The difference between the game she mentioned here and this one is in that one I had a SCUMREAD on her. I have no problem with lynching one of my scumreads when it will yield no information. I do, however, have a problem with lynching a completely null read that will yield no information, especially when there were so many better lynch options. In the particular game she mentioned, I believe she was by far the best lynch option of the day, and again, I was scumreading her.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also I quite enjoy playing with Tammy so even had I been scum I wouldn't have supported a kill on her this early, but etc.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also I quite enjoy playing with Tammy so even had I been scum I wouldn't have supported a kill on her this early, but etc.

I call BULL-****

lynch this

You do realize part of the reason I replaced into this game was because Tammy was playing and I hadn't played a game with her in so long and I finally had some free time? (And the other reason was because of Empire-mod).

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I think most of us can agree that DOMO has this natural way of being really scummy without actually trying hard at all.

I disagree. The one game I had with him (where I was scum) he was really town and I found it much easier to buddy up to him than attempt to push a lynch on him mainly because he had such a strong town presence.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Arthur, I buy that you wouldn't have liked to kill Tammy but it is still possible that your buddies wanted to kill her despite your objections. I am taking it as null.

Which is why I said etc.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Vote: Bert

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

there is no purpose to this statement other than for dayne to remind you that he's town for rlz

Yeah haha lolz I'm totes not town for rlz you got me on that one statement in the after game discussion and/or dead queue plz try to explainz without looking like a complete moron how you felt when I flipped town after lynching me on that statement lolz.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Hmm it can't be possible that the whole scumteam (minus nacho) is jumping on my wagon can it.

Hmmm.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I'll get back to you on that, V/LA on Sundays.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Why did you bring up the argument about SSK being a bad lynch even if he were scum then?

I'll be honest I just didn't want that lynch to go through when there were better ones.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

And like I still maintain that it the lynch was purely random at that point, but you probably guessed right since I hate his claim and the way he claimed (and he's now risen on my scumradar).

So props to you for guessing correct on something that had complete random probability? Go you!

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Here, I made tiers, enjoy!

Bert, Desperado
MafiaSSK, geists, Cephrir
pieguyn, BROseidon, KoreanBBQ, Norlkaz, zMuffinMan
goodmorning, Sakura, DOMO, Generic
Casso, F-16, MC Maraca

Top -> Down - Scummiest to least. People within a tier are arranged most to least also.

Don't ever touch anything in the last two tiers unless they claim scum (I mean or something nearly as bad or PoE?). The middle tier should actually be split into two with the first two being higher (and Ceph maybe joining them?), but w/e I like the symmetry of 5 tiers. If you're keen you'll also notice I've developed a scumread on geists!

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Any chance you could explain those tiers? Because I disagree with nearly everything right there.

Well, we can start with you posting what you disagree with, and I will reply with either "gut" or "either terrible or scum". But srsly feel free to post what you disagree with.

Any reason why I'm in the "don't touch" group, but you're ignoring my hard towning of geists today?

Because you're town, and I have a scumread on geists? I only actually sheep my townread's reads when I have a null.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also MafiaSSK are you actually keeping up with the thread or are you having your scumbuddies posting summaries for you in the scum QT of what's happening?

Because oddly enough you look like you're either keeping up with this thread and hardcore lurking or not actually keeping up with the thread and getting epiphanies or something about what's happening.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Because you're town, and I have a scumread on geists? I only actually sheep my townread's reads when I have a null.

But I've been hinting that I got night info, did you not notice or do you just not believe me? And if you don't believe me, why am I town?

I believe that once you are ready to fully out what info you have or may not have I will make my decision about whether and where to move geists. I also believe that if you do not have night info you are likely to call someone town based on logic that you think makes sense to you in your head, but actually turns out wrong.

I mean no offense to you by this but I think you can be easily emotionally manipulated based on the open we played together and you're very tunneled to small things and make them out to be bigger than they actually are. Thus, you spin stories in your head and forge events that relate to someone's alignment that were actually minuscule in size, but were made monumental by your illusions.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

SAD, why is BBQ in the same group as pie and BRO? How is BBQ less town than I am? BBQ claimed vanilla and self voted in an attempt to sacrifice himself. If that's a scum move, it's a very good one.

Because nero is crazy enough to do that as any alignment? And as I said, that tier really deserves to be split into two, because KoreanBBQ is the epitome of null, with anything higher being scummy and anything lower being townie.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Hmm also if there's a gunsmith it would be interesting to make mafiassk a mafia doctor, at least out of a setup point of view.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

The setup would work really neat with a town vig that comes out as having a gun, a mafia doc that comes out as not having a gun (and mafia doc that can protect from the vig's shots).

(Meh basically what MC posted of 167?)

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I'm not liking him pointing at SSK specifically here, when geists or anyone else for that matter could be scum doc.

... Because... he actually claimed doc already?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

And I already said I suspect his claim so it's quite silly to vote me on it now.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

This could be scum using set-up spec to try to get us to lynch off the town doc, leaving me unprotected.

Yes, my words will surely motive the whole town to suddenly jump on mafiassk and shred him to pieces, especially considering I am a beacon of innocence. Follow me, my legion of blind followers!

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

motivate*

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also I love how you ignored the fact Ceph and MCM literally thought/speculated on the same thing (I'm assuming so?), and I literally put it into clearer words.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Cool. I'm going to get lynched because people are sheeping each other (steaming from the nacho vote) because people are too lazy to push their own wagons.

Just like the D1 lynch.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

So who's good enough to analyze mafiassk's whopping 34 posts for scum-relationship tells if he flips scum?

Tammy responded to this defense as if this wasn't something you cared about normally, which alarmed me. Why did you start caring about them here?

VOTE: SAD

aye

Vote: SAD

VOTE: Arthur

Sheeping Casso because I also agree with them.

^ These votes are an example of how awesome my wagon is.

At least Bert had the dignity to find his own reason (it's too bad he's scum but w/e)

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

you're getting wagonned because so far five people think you're scummy, or are at least pretending to.

1/5 are voting for a reason I already defended, 2/5 are sheeping because "aye" and they "agree" with the reason I already defended, 1/5 is voting because of a true statement I made that they linked to something out of someone else's meta and are trying to call me scum based on it, and 1/5 are voting partly because it's the highest wagon currently and partly because of a comment I made that 2 people already indirectly made and was made in support of something I had already made previously.

Did I hit the nail on the head?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

So why would you think that the person who has reason to vote you is scum, while the half arsed cases are town?

See above.

Basically because the reason is far worse and contrived than the sheeping.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

And it basically looks like he's attempting to make up a reason to jump on the wagon so he can look like he's honestly scumhunting.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Based on the gunsmith claim, I am more suspicious of MafiaSSK. I think a mafia doc fits the setup well. I don't discount the possibility of him being a town doc and someone else being a mafia doc so I am somewhat ambivalent. I am thinking if there is a protective town PR, they should claim so that mafiassk can be lynched. Not sure if that is the optimal move yet so I'd rather have more discussion about this.

^ That's my partner right there right DOMO?

Desperado, can you explain your scumread on Giests and your townread on BRO? I have the opposite feeling about Geists and BRO isn't one of my townreads.

Arthur, can you explain your townread on me?

You benefit literally 0 from the Tammy kill, and in fact, lose a lot.

Also, I'd like to know the reasons for your scumreads on Desperado and Geists.

Desp is in the caterogy of either "horrendously terrible or scum". I'm choosing to believe the latter. And Geists was mostly out of a gut-reaction based on an ISO and PoE.

Elaboration on your Bert scumread beyond Nero's case would help as well (assuming that is why you voted him).

See above.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Desperado, can you explain your scumread on Giests and your townread on BRO? I have the opposite feeling about Geists and BRO isn't one of my townreads.

Sorry, failed quote. Doesn't belong in my post.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also worthy to note is Bert's reason to vote me cannot actually be defended by me other than with "But honestly I wouldn't do that!" which he can always ride off as being more attempted AtE.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Lmao?

>Implying I actually care about things "doing me favors"

Bro I have 0 interest in actually trying to appease people and/or trying to get people off my wagon that got there because of an idiotic sheeping vote. I'm only really interested in communicating with people that seem reasonable.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I'm totally willing to accept there's likely to be a scum doc based on my role, but you have to understand why I, a claimed gunsmith, am reluctant to lynch a claimed doc. If he's town and we lynch him, they'll pick me off without a sweat, and that's two town PRs down. Surely we're better off waiting a day or two before looking again at SSK?

Well no one (other than BRO?) was actually advocating his lynch today.

This is probably my bias about players who don't know me thinking I'm scummy kicking in, but I don't want to vote SAD today, though I would like for you to explain your read.

I already explained this, umm... unless you want more? (Which I am terrible at articulating, so I hope you're not looking for a whole paragraph with post links or something...).

This post really gives me the willies.

How does a post clarifying my tiers give you the willies...

Also, why are you voting Bert?

I already explained this too, do you people read the thread

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

So taking into account my claim, are you still scumreading ffery?

No. I find the probability of mafiassk being a scum doc much higher that geists being a scum doc. If I had to relocate them I would put them somewhere right next you.

I already explained this, umm... unless you want more? (Which I am terrible at articulating, so I hope you're not looking for a whole paragraph with post links or something...).

You said it was a gut reaction based on ISO which doesn't give me much in terms of figuring out what I'm doing that you don't like. Not that I'll stop doing it, but I might bother to explain my reasoning in more detail.

Meh, I get a lot of gut reactions based on things I read which I can't exactly explain. It may sound crazy, but I really can't help you on that front. And usually if I had any questions about things you were doing I would've asked them right away, an had DOMO not claimed I would've probably wanted a wagon on you at some point to see your reaction.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I think F-16 is giving me most concern right now.

Arthur, can you explain your townread on me?

You benefit literally 0 from the Tammy kill, and in fact, lose a lot.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

- the way he parked his vote on you D1, followed by parking his vote on me for a majority of the rest of the day. the one with me irked me a bit because i prodded him about it, and he said he wanted me to do something, and then i never did it and he backed off of me and now i'm apparently on the townier side of his middle-tier reads. i can maybe sorta understand it if something i'd done had changed his mind about me? but he hasn't mentioned me at all, really, so i dunno how that happened

This looks like textbook crowd folowwing not that I'm not guilty of that as well

I think I finally nailed what irks me so much about you. It's that you don't read the game, then shamelessly proceed to think you can analyze things you probably haven't even looked at.

Here, I'll help ya out:

1) Do you know what "crowd following" actually is.
2) ISO the mod and tell me the highest number the Pie wagon and the Muffin wagon ever go to while I was on them.
3) Figure out my position on the wagon.

Combine 2 and 3, and then compare them with 1. I think you'll find the results rather fascinating!

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Ceph is literally deja vu of Jason in The Wire game

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

looking back on it, why was my reaction one of the most boringest reactions in the world?

Because I had the same exact read as before I pushed you - which is boring because it wasted my time and really didn't effect my read at all.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

what the fuck?

first off, I thought SSK was null. how did he go from null to null-scum?

When he claimed. And I've already stated this before.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

there was plenty of discussion about SC so I'd imagine you should be going back and looking at his wagon and people's stances on him etc.

You want me to analyze a wagon that formed in a half a day for who's scum on it? Are you serious? I'm sorry for not being that good?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

and instead you ATTACK THE GUY WHO'S SCRUTINIZING HOW YOUR NULL READ HAMMERED?

I "attack". If you think that's me "attacking" then are you in for a surprise. That was me pointing at something that irked me and found silly.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I think F-16 is giving me most concern right now.

Arthur, can you explain your townread on me?

You benefit literally 0 from the Tammy kill, and in fact, lose a lot.

SAD, I'm interested why this is so. You're saying that he benefits 0 from it, yet here you are insisting that it makes him town. Do you not see why your logic is flawed here? He's benefitted from the tammy kill just because you're towning him for it.

And yes, because the scum knew this, they killed Tammy to frame F-16 because they knew people would think she would never kill her and then when she actually dies people will think that F-16 is then scum because she killed Tammy so people would think she is scum because she tried to make herself town!

Do you see how we can keep going in circles and WIFOM?

I'll choose to follow occam's razor for now.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Now I can easily speculate why these two are excempt from suspicion but I want SADs reasons and his thoughts on their connection to the SC wagon.

Please abort any thought of analyzing the SC wagon THAT GOT HIM LYNCHED and instead look for who was pushing him earlier in the day (which I want to do when I have a bit of time).

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I like muffin's wall there too.

Oh good. We're thinking the same exact opposite.

Muffin can start raking up some scumpoints for his recent posts.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I don't like the way the Arthur wagon looks...

Lynch this after you lynch me.

Also:

I like muffin's wall there too.

Oh good. We're thinking the

same

exact opposite.

Muffin can start raking up some scumpoints for his recent posts.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I don't care about votes as much as most people do.

Really? Interesting...

This looks like textbook crowd folowwing not that I'm not guilty of that as well

---

Fuck you, I'm reading the game. I just don't fact check minute accusations against people other than me; that's their job.

Really? Interesting...

- the way he parked his vote on you D1, followed by parking his vote on me for a majority of the rest of the day. the one with me irked me a bit because i prodded him about it, and he said he wanted me to do something, and then i never did it and he backed off of me and now i'm apparently on the townier side of his middle-tier reads. i can maybe sorta understand it if something i'd done had changed his mind about me? but he hasn't mentioned me at all, really, so i dunno how that happened

The accusation here that was made is that I camped my vote. You then proceeded to ACCUSE me of "crowd following". What the fuck do you mean "it's their job". Nothing he said was freaking wrong. THE ACCUSATION YOU MATERIALIZED OUT OF THIN AIR IS. STOP. SCAPEGOATING.

---

If you'd like to argue your suspicions didn't shift with convenient timing, I would consider it a reasonable rebuttal if you could produce evidence, but I don't care nearly enough to look for it myself.

Ei incumbit probatio qui dicit, non qui negat

Not to mention that statement is terrible for other reasons (for example the fact that you expect me to defend myself when you yourself HAVE NOT PRESENTED A CASE OR ANYTHING FOR ME TO DEFEND AGAINST. In the words of The Hound, "Bugger that. Bugger him. Bugger you.")

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Unvote
Vote: Ceph

Hi Jason. I'm not falling for you again!

Before anyone asks, this is falling under the "either extremely terrible or scum". Again, I assume anyone playing mafia and it's not their first time has some competence, so...

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

You and SAD both ignoring the buildup on the SC wagon is strange. Yes, the flash wagon at the end is hard to analyze, but you have the entire day leading up to it where SC was constantly under pressure to look at.

Please abort any thought of analyzing the SC wagon THAT GOT HIM LYNCHED and instead look for who was pushing him earlier in the day (which I want to do when I have a bit of time).

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Arthur, you agreed with me that a Tammy nk shouldn't necessarily make you town but you townread me based on it, why? Wouldn't the same reasoning apply to me?

Your scum-partners could agree better with you when you say "I don't want to kill Tammy because she's townreading me and we're bouncing off ideas off each other and I feel I can influence her when we need" rather than were I to say "Hi I don't want to kill Tammy because I'm enjoying playing with her".

Cmon bro. Too ez.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I don't care about votes as much as most people do.

Really? Interesting...

This looks like textbook crowd folowwing not that I'm not guilty of that as well

---

Fuck you, I'm reading the game. I just don't fact check minute accusations against people other than me; that's their job.

Really? Interesting...

- the way he parked his vote on you D1, followed by parking his vote on me for a majority of the rest of the day. the one with me irked me a bit because i prodded him about it, and he said he wanted me to do something, and then i never did it and he backed off of me and now i'm apparently on the townier side of his middle-tier reads. i can maybe sorta understand it if something i'd done had changed his mind about me? but he hasn't mentioned me at all, really, so i dunno how that happened

The accusation here that was made is that I camped my vote. You then proceeded to ACCUSE me of "crowd following". What the fuck do you mean "it's their job". Nothing he said was freaking wrong. THE ACCUSATION YOU MATERIALIZED OUT OF THIN AIR IS. STOP. SCAPEGOATING.

---

If you'd like to argue your suspicions didn't shift with convenient timing, I would consider it a reasonable rebuttal if you could produce evidence, but I don't care nearly enough to look for it myself.

Ei incumbit probatio qui dicit, non qui negat

Not to mention that statement is terrible for other reasons (for example the fact that you expect me to defend myself when you yourself HAVE NOT PRESENTED A CASE OR ANYTHING FOR ME TO DEFEND AGAINST. In the words of The Hound, "Bugger that. Bugger him. Bugger you.")

1) that's not a contradiction

2) Your read magically changed because everyone else's did; it's their job mean if you have a problem with that assertion then you need to argue with it

3) I don't care whether I have presented a case or not despite this being a massive double standard

1) Yes, "textbook crowd following" has NOTHING to do with votes. Dear me, where did I ever get the idea that it does?

2) What the fuck. No. Literally. WHAT. THE. FUCK. You're saying you're going to accuse me of something I didn't do and that IT'S MY JOB OF THEN FIGURING OUT IF IT'S TRUE OR NOT/FACT CHECKING IT? Are you going to keep fucking denying you're scum? "Hi I'm going to spew shit at you and I give no fucks if it's actually true or not that's your job of figuring out! Oh also I'm town!"

3) Yeah I'm done this please die scum.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

2) Your read magically changed because everyone else's did; it's their job mean if you have a problem with that assertion then you need to argue with it

My favorite part about this statement is how it subtly implies that he knows he's wrong yet continuing the argument, whereas a town would've admitted he's wrong right away.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Arthur, you agreed with me that a Tammy nk shouldn't necessarily make you town but you townread me based on it, why? Wouldn't the same reasoning apply to me?

Your scum-partners could agree better with you when you say "I don't want to kill Tammy because she's townreading me and we're bouncing off ideas off each other and I feel I can influence her when we need" rather than were I to say "Hi I don't want to kill Tammy because I'm enjoying playing with her".

Cmon bro. Too ez.

Okay, I like that your read reversal is internally consistent. It seems like you re-evaluated your reads based on the nk. 3930 matches up with that theory.

Cephrir, I'd like a response to my questions in 4101.

Hi, you seem like a reasonable fellow in this town of crazies please tell me you see where I'm coming from with Ceph and that I'm not just seeing everything he does as scum and it's an ad hom attack.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Nacho/Thor/Whoever why are you still voting me if I've defended against everything you've put forth? The fact that you seem to like what I say yet still have your vote camped on me makes me quite uneasy.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I don't care about votes as much as most people do.

Really? Interesting...

This looks like textbook crowd folowwing not that I'm not guilty of that as well

---

Fuck you, I'm reading the game. I just don't fact check minute accusations against people other than me; that's their job.

Really? Interesting...

- the way he parked his vote on you D1, followed by parking his vote on me for a majority of the rest of the day. the one with me irked me a bit because i prodded him about it, and he said he wanted me to do something, and then i never did it and he backed off of me and now i'm apparently on the townier side of his middle-tier reads. i can maybe sorta understand it if something i'd done had changed his mind about me? but he hasn't mentioned me at all, really, so i dunno how that happened

The accusation here that was made is that I camped my vote. You then proceeded to ACCUSE me of "crowd following". What the fuck do you mean "it's their job". Nothing he said was freaking wrong. THE ACCUSATION YOU MATERIALIZED OUT OF THIN AIR IS. STOP. SCAPEGOATING.

---

If you'd like to argue your suspicions didn't shift with convenient timing, I would consider it a reasonable rebuttal if you could produce evidence, but I don't care nearly enough to look for it myself.

Ei incumbit probatio qui dicit, non qui negat

Not to mention that statement is terrible for other reasons (for example the fact that you expect me to defend myself when you yourself HAVE NOT PRESENTED A CASE OR ANYTHING FOR ME TO DEFEND AGAINST. In the words of The Hound, "Bugger that. Bugger him. Bugger you.")

1) that's not a contradiction

2) Your read magically changed because everyone else's did; it's their job mean if you have a problem with that assertion then you need to argue with it

3) I don't care whether I have presented a case or not despite this being a massive double standard

1) Yes, "textbook crowd following" has NOTHING to do with votes. Dear me, where did I ever get the idea that it does?

2) What the fuck. No. Literally. WHAT. THE. FUCK. You're saying you're going to accuse me of something I didn't do and that IT'S MY JOB OF THEN FIGURING OUT IF IT'S TRUE OR NOT/FACT CHECKING IT? Are you going to keep fucking denying you're scum? "Hi I'm going to spew shit at you and I give no fucks if it's actually true or not that's your job of figuring out! Oh also I'm town!"

3) Yeah I'm done this please die scum.

1) You're a moron.

2) I was agreeing with Muffin. If you have an issue, take it up with him, rather than deflecting the issue by starting a fight with me and throwing in some fake rage.

3) I'd prefer not to, if only marginally.

2) What bong are you smoking from? Because there's no way you're in your right mind and think this. Here, I'll make it very clear:

MU

FF

IN

'S

S

TA

TE

ME

NT

H

AS

N

OT

HI

NG

T

O

DO

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IT

H

YO

UR

S

You were not (key words: WERE NOT) agreeing with Muffin. You made a NEW accusation. JUST because you quote his post and then write something under it does not mean you're agreeing with the statement. He said I basically camped my vote and that I didn't explain my reads when I switched off of them. YOU came in and then said that it was "crowd following". These are two COMPLETELY DIFFERENT THINGS. What the hell do you mean "take it up with muffin"? Stop fucking scapegoating. You and him were NOT saying the same thing. Not remotely. Stop deflecting your wrong accusation and putting the blame elsewhere. I can see where he's coming from and I even agree with him (and I am aware of the weaknesses in my playstyle, so again, I see where he's coming from). However, the accusation you made is WRONG. So you're either scum and spewing shit or haven't been reading the fucking thread and think you can bullshit your way through the game. You've already claimed that the latter is not true. So that leaves me with the former. If you're wrong, which any townie would've realized by now, you would've maned the fuck up and admitted it instead of crying about "But why don't you go blame hiiiiiiim? ;_;".

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Muffin can start raking up some scumpoints for his recent posts.

cool. why?

Tbf I read your posts before I read mafiassk's, but basically I always believe there's at least one scum that tries to go against the major wagon especially if it looks like it's going to go through anyways. Your recent posts have been saying you don't agree with my lynch, yet you offer no alternative neither do you make a full effort to convince anyone (supported by the fact you wishy-wash your statements by then putting a things you don't like - so no one that is currently on the wagon can even be convinced of the things you DO like because it looks like you're not even convinced of them yourself).

Also do you usually take suspicion on you this lightly/calmly, or are you trying to materialize this air of coolness around you by brushing off suspicion on you in an attempt to look town?

also why geists scum and why casso town?

I've explained the former already, and the latter I basically agree with MCM (I think it was them?) who said they're town in what they did concerning the sakura wagon.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I'm done trying to have this conversation, you can die now

Hahaha I love how you give no fucks about actually looking like you care about scum-hunting anymore. I mean, I feel for you. I really do. It's hard when you're scum and you've been caught in a shit position to actually argue through it. So I genuinely feel for you.

Nah bro, I def think he's scum too. Outside chance of just retarded, but, probably scum. You can see that from when I originally voted him in the first place even if my reasons were kind of shitty.

Pro tip: You didn't actually have ANY reasons of your own, but it's okay we'll pretend you did *wink wink*

the things i don't like are the things i don't like and i'm not going to avoid mentioning those things just because i think you might be town. your read progression on me is still one of the things i don't like about you because i don't understand how you went from initially thinking i'm town to thinking i'm scum (or at least a worthwhile vote) to changing your mind about me at some point between the end of D1 and that reads list you recently gave to now thinking i'm scum again (or at least that i've earned "scum points"?). it'd be nice if you actually explained what was going on with this.

I never actually voted you because I necessarily "suspect" you. I did it because I didn't really want to be on Pie anymore and Casso had voted you and I wanted to add my vote as a pressure, plus it was a bonus that I your virtually non-existent scumpool had made me uneasy. I unvoted you because, as I said in 2094, it wasn't likely that you'll be the lynch of the day. Plus, I found your coolness in the way you replied to my vote kinda townish (I mean I suspect it now because I'm getting paranoid so meh).

I am not the best person to tell you that since I am scumreading Cephrir based on his posts about me which is hardly unbiased. I'll re-evaluate his interaction with other people and go through his other games when I find time. I read through your argument with him and I didn't find anything alignment indicative. I can see "misreps" coming from both town and scum. I had a huge argument with Bulbazak in Micro 252 where I thought he was scum because of perceived misreps on his part but when I took a step back and objectively analyzed his posts, I realized he was town. Cephrir's play reminded me of Bulbazak's a lot in that he tends to attack nearly everything his scumreads do so a similar strategy like not looking into what he said about me in particular might help figure out his alignment. Let's try this: you go through Cephrir's posts about me and offer your opinions. I'll go through his posts about you and offer mine.

Yeah - that would probably be a good idea. I'll have a look in a bit.

Also, what is your read on Desperado? In 4113, you talk about how you are going to prove him to be a moron at endgame implying you think he is town. Has your read changed since D1 and when you posted your tiers? What other reads of yours were influenced by the nightkill?

Well I mean when I argue/talk/etc with people I always assume they're town, so even if they're scum they would be pretending to be town. So that's more an "if" statement.
I haven't looked into the nightkill too much to get any of the "subtle" reads out of it, but yours was pretty obvious, and as I said - I'm following Occam's razor on you until (if) I start getting scum-vibes from your posts.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Vote: Desperado

I feel pretty confident in Desperado/SAD scum and probably scum in Muffin/SSK.

...

Why would you not stick to the larger wagon then?

I mean I'm all happy your voting someone I think is scum (and the unvoting me is a bonus ) but like it makes no sense from you PoV?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

[quote="In post 4378, Cephrir"][/quote]
The fact that, I assume, mafia interests you yet you must resort to childish techniques at the first sight of a debate instead of replying to my post sadness me. But I still feel you bro.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Ser Arthur Dayne - Initial read on Tammy is kind of weird (Tammy is highly town unless she can emulate her usual town aggressiveness): SAD hasn't played with Tammy for a while, sure, but I'm fairly sure he played with her on Westeros longer than anyone else in the game, so the bit of paranoia that she could fake what she showed here seemed disingenuous.

When I played with her, her scum game was kinda crap and whenever she showed that kind of emotion meant she's town. However, I haven't played with her in at least 6 months, likely closer to a year. People change their playstyles, and she could've easily developed the ability to fake that kind of rage as scum *shrug*

His push on pie is weird and not really representative of what pie was doing (and I don't like his backtrack when he goes from "pie is doing zero scumhunting" to "his scumreads are fake/he's tunneling"). Him pushing pie pretty strongly and going "meh, can't get a read on you" was strange but probably not alignment indicative, and his later pushes on Muffin/us where he votes us then doesn't comment on the vote at all both feel weird (I think I read something about him explaining the reasons he did this somewhere).

Yes, I sometimes vote without much of a reason. Yes, I vote a lot without putting a one liner. Again, as I've probably stated somewhere, it means I either really don't have something to add other than just agreeing with people, I just want to add my vote as a pressure, or I want to get a reaction out of someone.

I'm still weirded about by his defense of SSK on the basis of being not good information; I like that he was so honest about the associative tell thing (yeah, it was a lie all along), but I'm not really sure what he was supposed to defend himself with as scum and that honestly doesn't look so great when his initial reaction was to lie about it, which would be for SAD-town.

I've already stated that I didn't want the mafiassk wagon to go through because there were better wagons. Plus, I may have exaggerated a few things here and there about my feelings towards the wagon, but I still thought it was a crap wagon because it was information-less. I just exaggerated the fact I don't really care about informational wagons that much *shrug*.

His switch on SSK also seems like an odd position to take; he doesn't seem to be getting boxed in by POE and I don't follow his case on SSK today, so the newfound scumread on him seems opportunistic. I like his snark, and I'm inclined to believe him when he says he wouldn't kill Tammy because he joined this game to play for her, but it's not enough for a townread.

Are you serious? I've already admitted that I think the claim by mafiassk was really weird, plus when domo claimed that just strengthened my suspicions. The "newfound scumread on him seems opportunistic"? Are you serious. Go back and read the posts of this day. You'll note that I was one of the very first people that indicated suspicion of his claim. I can't really see how you see that as opportunistic.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

And like I still maintain that it the lynch was purely random at that point, but you probably guessed right since I hate his claim and the way he claimed (and he's now risen on my scumradar).

So props to you for guessing correct on something that had complete random probability? Go you!

Here ya go nacho. Please tell me how this was opportunistic at this stage.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

SER ARTHUR DAYNE

I see you ignoring me. quit it and answer my questions already
4399

Your bidding, master.

looking back on it, why was my reaction one of the most boringest reactions in the world?

Because I had the same exact read as before I pushed you - which is boring because it wasted my time and really didn't effect my read at all.

nope you were townreading me earlier

No I wasn't? I first scumread you, tried to reaction-test you, it didn't change my mind, then I thought you were town after a while, then I returned to thinking you were scum after some horrible posting.

Pie wtf.

I thought you were actually town.

How do you go back to making me think you're scum in a span of 2 pages.

where'd this come from?

This thing called the brain? You might recognize it, it's this organ most humans have that servers as the center of the nervous system.

there was plenty of discussion about SC so I'd imagine you should be going back and looking at his wagon and people's stances on him etc.

You want me to analyze a wagon that formed in a half a day for who's scum on it? Are you serious? I'm sorry for not being that good?

wow this is a blatant misrep

No it's not? But try again?

it's not just about the wagon. I said IN THAT SAME POST there was other information, e.g. people's stances on him, and then there was another wagon on him earlier D1, and so on. even if you found the wagon hard to analyze I'd expect you to at least have expressed that but you didn't even talk about said wagon at all. it makes me think you're scum BS'ing your stances and forgot all about the wagon

See 4303.

and instead you ATTACK THE GUY WHO'S SCRUTINIZING HOW YOUR NULL READ HAMMERED?

I "attack". If you think that's me "attacking" then are you in for a surprise. That was me pointing at something that irked me and found silly.

how is that even relevant to anything?

it doesn't change the fact that you're supposedly interested in looking at the information from the lynch. but then when Generic tried to do that exact same thing, you apparently found it to be silly. either way, your thought process is contradictory as fuck

Yes, because it was silly? Also, I never directly said

I'm

interested in looking for information from the lynch, I said I'm interested in a lynch that produces a lot of information. Those don't exactly equal the same thing.

also answer my point about OMGUS plz

And this is?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Unvote
Vote: Bert

Ceph is (sadly) town.
Muffin is town.
mafiassk is (still) scum.
Bert is scum.
Koreanbbq is town.
Pie is now leaning town.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

bert looks fucking awful, the quick attempt to derail casso's wagon and then oh shit better bus him then.

No, bert was attempting to bus ssk prematurely then jumped on the opportunistic casso wagon.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

This claim is so dodgy taking into account how he doesn't trust geists to lead the town that I can't help but feel it's deliberately bad, designed to derail the current wagon. It wouldn't be outrageous for him to sacrifice himself to save casso, if indeed both are on the same scum team.

No. The casso wagon wasnt much of a wagon when he claimed who he protected.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

SAD looked like a decent wagon at one time but he floods the game with whining walls and everyone seems to back off him.

Yeah, that's what you generally want to do. Followed up by sometime of lurking so people forget about you with you posting a few posts here and there to prod-dodge. Er... almost like this.

But srsly I don't have much to say other than I still think Bert is the best wagon. I still think nacho acted really town at the end of day 1 so meh.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

My statement for today is I'm puzzled by all the associating of 5 person or 6 person scumteams, because I've never seen a game like this where this is being discussed on D2 and scum teams are listed in such large numbers. I'm surprised that a strategy that works here is to list scum team speculations before flips.

It's generally done when there is such a huge amount of people being read town plus the gap between the "nulls" and the "suspicious" is large as hell.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I can understand it with Domo though as he/she if town is likely to die very soon barring unforeseen circumstances (aka being town or lying or having other protective roles).

I've also come across gunsmith as something people have mentioned, and I need to look up what that is.

Also please lynch this.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I really think Bert is scum, do you think SAD is distancing from him that early?

Yes.

Let's just lynch Bert.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

This will support the notion that I'm "deciding" which of my "partners SSK and NACHO" to bus.

Good point.

We can start by lynching you since you're obviously dragging your team down by being so obvious.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

This will support the notion that I'm "deciding" which of my "partners SSK and NACHO" to bus.

Good point.

We can start by lynching you since you're obviously dragging your team down by being so obvious.

A) Elaborate; why is Bert scum?
B) You still haven't explained your sudden flip on me and it's not OK. It has also conincided with pressure on me decreasing/it becoming clear I am unlikely to be lynched today.

A) I've already did this. And like his most recent posts that isn't him complaining about how long the game is are all trash.
B) Oh, it actually is perfectly okay. Also there was literally never enough pressure for you to actually get lynched (at least not before I started attacking you?) so the latter point is stupid and silly.

Basically if you haven't noticed yet I like to reaction test people. A lot. Feel free to ask Tammy, she's pretty familiar with my meta

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Unvote
Vote: Desperado

I'm just going to go ahead and pretend I agree with the "scumslip" or whatever other reason people are voting him right now, mainly because I have an independent scumread on him. But it'll look better if it looks like I'm conforming to the town's wishes.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also for the wackos in the crowd who need their hand guided take Bert's most recent votes, put them all one after another, and come to the conclusion that they're all sketchy as fuck. Thx.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Spoiler:

Vote: SSK

Vote: Casso

Trusting my instincts that tell me that the people with cases on Casso make points that are justified and point to Casso-scum in most likelihood.

Let the door go boom or bust.

Vote: MafiaSSK

Vote: Casso

sneaking off for a few mins while under pure euphoria of halftime Aubie Seminoles

just looked at Nacho's iso

unvote

This will support the notion that I'm "deciding" which of my "partners SSK and NACHO" to bus.

Vote: Ser Arthur Dayne

Nachos to disingenuous in the past few pages

Vote: Casso

Kaboom. Lollapalooza

Vote: Desperado

Nacho's probably right about Desperado if Nacho's town.

Big IF though. Oh well.

What type of fence ya building there?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yes.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

desp started off tyring to buddy sakura. That then collapsed into a scumread. That feels reasonably town motivated. Not pushing for #1 scumread isn't in its own right a scum tell, that then comes down to meta. I've played desp once and we was more aggressive. I don't see him calling those who scumreading him an idiot, although he might have. I found him to be quite rude in the face of critisism in oz, where I consider him to have been sort of scum. Here he just seems dismissive.

I'm leaning town with desp, but my meta with him is very limited and complicated due to the nature of our last game.

pedit - Do you agree or not that this is not the same desp we saw in oz?

who fucking cares what i looked like in oz? i was in that game for one day and it wasn't even mafia

please click my username and find some actual games if you're going to try and meta me

This is not scum.

What about what he said can't come from scum

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

SAD

I still don't understand why your read on my is sketchy as fuck.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

For someone who loves commas so much, this is poor use of language!

My sig is supposed to be ironic.

What motivation is there for scumdesp to ridicule the townread he's getting from the closest we have to conftown?

?

I can actually remember a few times where I have done the same exact thing as scum.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I can actually remember a few times where I have done the same exact thing as scum.

Show me.

I was more going on the basis of "trust me". In fact I can remember vividly me doing this on another site (well it was kinda shortly before I was lynched but that's not the point).

I'm saying it's not hard for scum to question townreads on them in an attempt to look town.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Now that I actually read what you wrote, what you say doesn't even make it sound like you're giving him a townread based on "oz"

I found him to be quite rude in the face of critisism in oz, where I consider him to have been sort of scum.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Anddd that's my last prod.

You know who we should flashwagon? Bert. Acting confused yet still posting in this game? It's easier than that.

Vote: Bert

You're kinda late on the double-bus thing you seem to have going on.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Vote: Bert

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Hi.

The scumteam is Bert/Cass/mafiassk/BRO.

gg.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Casso has a chance of being replaced with koreanbbq.

Everyone else is obvtown.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Oh I see, PoE

Plus

WHAT IS UPPPP? SSK HERE REPLACING ROFLWAFFLE.

Geists=Town
Generic=Town
F-16=Town
Tammy=Uber Town
Bro=Maybe Scum
MC=Maybe Scum
Pitoli=maybe scum
BBQ=scum

Vote Korean BBQ

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Casso has a chance of being replaced with koreanbbq.

Everyone else is obvtown.

Indulge me please, what made Pieguyn obvtown?

See the thing about Pie is he has posts/points/things that I strongly like and then posts/points/things I really dislike. But then after observing him for a while, it came to me that the things I disliked were more a product of playstyle rather than actual alignment.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I'm still waiting to hear why SAD flipped on me yesterday for no apparent reason. Or maybe he answered and I forgot.

Yes.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Be back later. I suggest leaving SSK alive as he doesn't need to be lynched until it's actually MYLO/LYLO. Wasting a lynch on him now is pretty pointless, we already know what he will flip. Try someone else that's suspicious so we have more info tomorrow.

Vote: Bert

bert y u so fake

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

On the other hand, SAD is laying low and voting me LOL and not saying much else other than attaching "scum" to every post I make.

Yes.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

You caught me Bert.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I've been trying to suggest pushing someone not named SSK, since SSK flip gives us no info, but it went nowhere

lol

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I meant lynch a potentially dangerous scum player, not lynch yourself.

Well tbf he is a scum player, not sure how dangerous his scumplay usually is but not many people are suspecting him this game so obviously at least a bit.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

<snip>

pbpa sucks cmon F-16.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Would rather lynch the confscum so that he stops posting about cheese.

Fyi this is a really scummy statement regardless of whether it is meant to be a joke or not.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

SAD I'm pretty sure is scum! Cephrir too! Also don't like Pie still! That's it!

I like those enlightening statements that overflow with compelling reasons.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Bro gut scum

BRO - town because gut

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Must be Nero.

It's GIF

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Unless Nero suddenly developed a scumread on me or I didn't care enough to notice he had one on me before.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Bert and Cephrir are being replaced.

Did they request replacement or?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Second, Mastin should be announcing his heal target from last night and other prior nights today. If a watcher/tracker can subtly verify him, that would make me feel better about Mastin.

He already fucking claimed scum dude wtf are you not reading the game.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Wait you just replaced in.

Still w/e.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

This reminds me of your oh-so-clueless entrance to the asoiaf game.

I'm gonna pretend I know what she's talking about and agree because the post looks fake regardless.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Wait fucking hell I thought you replaced bert and I'm supposed to scumread every bert post or whatever he said

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Wait you just replaced in.

Still w/e.

If he claimed scum, why no large wagon on him?

Yeah, the thread is going to take hours to read. I am taking shortcuts. Sue me.

Because we're currently trying to lynch his scum-partners which include Bert.

It would be awesome if you can move your vote there. If for nothing else help Empire by lynching the slot so he doesn't have to get a replacement.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I almost want to quick lynch mafiassk now before people actually believe the bullshit he's spewing around

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

unless you think that CaMa was trolling then scum do have daytalk though I think that (assuming that SSK is scum) then his plan to troll and get lynched today was made last night.

I disagree. I think he started trolling/etc today then his scumpartners told him he might have a chance because he wasn't 100% the lynch so then he toned it down and tried to act townish.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Prod received, I'll have a looksie on this game tomorrow probably.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Unvote
Vote: MafiaSSK

This day should probably end now. Now sure what to think on titus. Can't really decide between bad or scum, but I'm gonna give the slot the benefit of the doubt for now since I had a townread of Ceph.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

what do you think of the associatives between SAD and zmuffin?

regardless of

SAD's

muffin's alignment, i'm town here. so get over your boner for me, i don't swing that way, tia

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

The desire to push through the day

Yes.

the soft defence of Titus with a qualifier that he was townreading ceph...

And yes.

Not a fan of that post at all.

I don't see how either of the former two statements lead to this conclusion but ummm... rock on?