Serum & Steel 2: The Rise of Phyrexia--Endgame

[Trustworthy]

Hey PV hey

Do we have multiple vigs?

You do realize that mastin is just guessing what he thinks his role is right?

[Trustworthy]

*she, her

[Trustworthy]

I have no idea why anti thinks his cop power is lame.

Also, anti why didn't you answer why you chose muffin to investigate?

[Trustworthy]

If you didn't get that, why didn't you have any questions about my later theory?

Because literally none of it made sense and I hoped something would fall in place after somebody explained. I thought "monitor" was some sort of role and couldn't figure out why the hell falcon thought I had it.

Ah. What do you think of it now though?

I think it makes sense but may be oversimplifying. The interactions between you and me, and between you and falcon indicate a decent amount of prior history if for no other reason than how we shared meta about other players. I think the meta aspect also applied to mastin, zmuffin, chandra, antihero and DV, though that's memory, not looking back at posts.

Sooooo maybe?

It would have been a pretty heavy duty assumption to think for instance that Tales of You was typical of our ability to read each other or trust each other, and there was a fair bit of mutual wariness going on in the early portion of day 1 that was never completely put to rest.

Well that's why I thought I could be over thinking it, but I didn't give definitive reads on either of you, so it just felt weird. I wouldn't expect for Titus to pick up on some of that but I suppose her partners could have.

[Trustworthy]

Trustworthy do you think your serum target would have shot Titus?

IDK

[Trustworthy]

It's kinda important to think about. They /have/ to be a vig if there are no other anti town teams.

I didn't say I hadn't thought about it.

IDK is the only answer you're getting though.

[Trustworthy]

That's nice. Now that you've registered 50,000 times you can stop cluttering up the game with this and move on.

[Trustworthy]

Oh falcon - did you realize I was a serum giver?

You mean on D1? No, I thought you might be a neighborizer actually.

I wish! I love having neighbors to talk to. Okay no wonder you were surprised I didn't use my role on you.

[Trustworthy]

She was saying how we demonstrated paranoia and then acceptance. At that point I had not shown any in thread paranoia of Titus, so I'm not sure what Mastin was referring to on my end. Titus did a good job of looking paranoid at first though.

Fairly certain you did? At least one head made it clear they weren't instantly having Titus as conftown and in fact were doubting her. I mean, I could be wrong, but when I defended you and Titus from ABR, my thoughts were exactly the same as they are now; I'm fairly certain you did.

At first I didn't. My original gut read was that she was scum but people thought she looked town so I thought I was wrong. Then I caught that post that made me think she was a blink moth and thought she was more likely town, her reaction to me read townish and then everyone else thought she was town so. But I didn't demonstrate any paranoia of her until she made the post in which she claimed our role pm said "is town" and then my biggest fear was we would die night one and she'd ride to endgame on the fact that I didn't contradict that, but enough people recognized that I didn't confirm it that leaving it for the day seemed okay especially since I thought it was clear there wasn't total trust there. Now I'm rambling, but I'd have to look back, I thought you made that post before I'd shown any paranoia.

[Trustworthy]

So mastin you're saying after calling me town all day long you'd have vigged us?

Does. Not. Compute.

[Trustworthy]

Do you have me on ignore antihero?

[Trustworthy]

Like I asked you twice why you chose muffin and you keep ignoring me.

[Trustworthy]

@Chandra/Vezok, I was hoping more existed on SKOT than y'all said. My gut really doesn't ping for skot but it looks like a wagon of win.

@Mhok, I am not a fan of Muffin town. Anti is probably town.

I lean town on skot for this.

Why? I'm feeling like I'd like a skot lynch.

Anyway this is in a similar vein to how titus treated her scum partners in book of shadows.

Also probably up for a mastin lynch.

I'm giving final exams tomorrow, after which I'll hopefully be able to pay a bit more attention and reread through some things.

Shadoweh's busy and won't be able to really read through stuff until later, so I've been instructed to keep doing the 'I'm Tammy and I'm fucking obvtown' thing.

[Trustworthy]

My cat likes cottage cheese, so eating breakfast is a chore sometimes as he continually fights for my food.

Why not skot? I was telling Shadoweh yesterday that I want to lynch him, and after she asked whether or not I want to lynch him for being dead weight or because he's scum, I said he feels flaccid and limp. I think that means he's scum!

Also, Titus' iso doesn't in any way support him being town, so I'm still completely lost on why Falcon leans town because of that.

Still probably would lynch mastin.

Also, I'm fine with giving public serum to Ludi. I'll check with Shadoweh for that too.

[Trustworthy]

@Chandra/Vezok, I was hoping more existed on SKOT than y'all said. My gut really doesn't ping for skot

but it looks like a wagon of win.

@Mhok, I am not a fan of Muffin town. Anti is probably town.

I lean town on skot for this.

Why? I'm feeling like I'd like a skot lynch.

Anyway this is in a similar vein to how titus treated her scum partners in book of shadows.

Also probably up for a mastin lynch.

I'm giving final exams tomorrow, after which I'll hopefully be able to pay a bit more attention and reread through some things.

Shadoweh's busy and won't be able to really read through stuff until later, so I've been instructed to keep doing the 'I'm Tammy and I'm fucking obvtown' thing.

I haven't read Book of Shadows yet but I skimmed Titus's ISO in Gundam Seed. Most of her interactions with Nacho, DV, and Agar involved prodding them and townreading them while telling other people that they were town. The bolded actually falls in line with those kind of interactions. But the underlined makes me think Titus really wants the wagon to go through while taking no responsibility for it.

To put it in context, she asks Chandra in Post 406 to elaborate on his suspicion on of SKOT. Chandra does so in Post 412.

She also asks Vezok in Post 398 to talk to her about SKOT saying "

Vezok, can you talk to me about skot? I am null on you, like the rest of the wagon but I do not see the case.

" Vezok responds in Post 399.

Those were the responses she was addressing in the quoted post. On one hand, she is inquiring about SKOT and trying to dismantle the wagon, and on the other, I get this feeling that she is fine with the wagon hapening but doesn't want to hop on which is what initially made me think SKOT-town. You could be right. I'll read over Book of Shadows to get a baseline and give my thoughts then.

I'm not a real big fan of that tell without looking at their other behavior. Titus is not the type of scum player where she tries to keep off town wagons while cheering them on. Her push on abr shows that. I could see her showing nominal suspicion about a partners wagon she has no interest in joining though. And her early defense of skot pings.

Couple that with skot not doing anything, and I think he looks really suspicious.

[Trustworthy]

I've liked people's cases but haven't agreed with them before.

Mastin's still has a good chance of being scum, but not for that.

VOTE: skot
[synth]skot[/synth]

[Trustworthy]

synth:skot

[Trustworthy]

Stellar content. I can totally see why people would be hesitant to lynch him!

[Trustworthy]

Also, forgot to mention, it feels like you are sucking up to Muffin.

~~~

Kinda conflicted on whether to lynch Mastin and SKOT. I feel like both are scum. Got to head to bed now but I'll look into it tomorrow.

Are you talking to me?

whoops

[Trustworthy]

Okay I was super confused.

[Trustworthy]

It *might* be possible to persuade me to move back to SKOT. But I'm not voting mastin.

Then vote skot! I'm sure wherever your vote is right now doesn't look near as pretty as it would on skot!

[Trustworthy]

That town-slip is a stretch.

Also, we wouldn't have been confirmed town if Titus flipped town because Titus lied.

[Trustworthy]

Oh forgot

mod - Tammy head is v/la until August 12th

I'm going home to visit family. I will still have access and be able to post, but.

[Trustworthy]

I will help lynch mastin if people synth skot so we can make skot dead tomorrow.

Also, I saw ludi suggest massclaim metal. I am liking my earlier suggestion more and more for that and think the way Titus accused me of role fishing when I said I was thinking about it means there is metal scum.

Chandra - why did you think it was a bad idea to massclaim it?

[Trustworthy]

I'm on my phone at the airport so going back and looking at stuff is a bitch, but I'm pretty sure that Hito gave us full fake claims and posted the win condition. It's not unheard of. In Arcadia nat gave us fake claims and flavor upon request, but that was her own creation so. Anyway posting the win condition is standard and in the realm of out guessing the mod to clear someone that is one of the stretchiest, and I wouldn't bank the game on nat not including the win con in fake claims. Besides mastin could just have easily read it on the first page anyway.

[Trustworthy]

It *might* be possible to persuade me to move back to SKOT. But I'm not voting mastin.

Then vote skot! I'm sure wherever your vote is right now doesn't look near as pretty as it would on skot!

and your reasoning is that Titus defended me, right? that it?

I will help lynch mastin if people synth skot so we can make skot dead tomorrow.

Also, I saw ludi suggest massclaim metal. I am liking my earlier suggestion more and more for that and think the way Titus accused me of role fishing when I said I was thinking about it means there is metal scum.

Chandra - why did you think it was a bad idea to massclaim it?

you scum trustworthy, to be locked into such foolishness or simply being foolish?

You're very perceptive!

[Trustworthy]

Also if you're claiming that the win con wasn't originally posted, and was added later then that completely nullifies your town ip argument based on it not needing to be posted if it's posted in their fake claims.

(Though I'm pretty sure it was always there.)

[Trustworthy]

I'm on my phone at the airport so going back and looking at stuff is a bitch, but I'm pretty sure that Hito gave us full fake claims and posted the win condition. It's not unheard of. In Arcadia nat gave us fake claims and flavor upon request, but that was her own creation so. Anyway posting the win condition is standard and in the realm of out guessing the mod to clear someone that is one of the stretchiest, and I wouldn't bank the game on nat not including the win con in fake claims. Besides mastin could just have easily read it on the first page anyway.

Yes, I'm specifying that Mastin stated the

name

of the town wincon before it was pubically posted.

What was your argument about them not having it as part of their fake claims?

(Also, I'm pretty sure the win con was always posted publicly.)

[Trustworthy]

You are going to have to unpack those reasons for me because I'm seriously considering lynching Mhork at some point.

Yesterday, Shadoweh was convinced that Mhork was scum. Today she's not so sure. One thing I'm wondering is the way that Titus kept trying to figure out who I serumed. She started asking you if you had visions, which is the name of the role, but she started asking you before the day had ended. You wouldn't have known that yet. I had already asked Nati when the person would find out they were serumed and she said that they would be told after day ended.

Since Titus asked you if you had been serumed, she must not have known that it would start at end of day. If Mhork was her scum buddy, then she would know that he wasn't told.

UM...NEVER MIND. I *think*. I just realized if they were scum together, she would have just put it in their private topic and she would have acknowledged it there. So hrm. I think. I'm leaving this as is though, so if there is something in the original point someone could tell me. But I think the original point is dumb now.

Shadoweh thinks that Titus wouldn't have serumed her buddy for what is a pretty lame ability, but I don't think this is a strong point for two reasons. a.) she could have easily serumed her buddy for distancing/wifom purposes and b.) everyone with a serum ability doesn't seem to know what it is, so they wouldn't have known that his ability wasn't particularly strong anyway and could have serumed him to see what he had.

So, yeah, and that's about all I've got. Heading out to meet family so get back to this later.

[Trustworthy]

Yeah, sadly agreed here. Was prepared to fight back on mastin's progression from "totally town massive" to "distancing himself from Pander massive" (which by the way, Pander starting distancing himself from me back on D1, so kinda moots that argument that the Titus flip was involved, and I would still be happy to vote Pander) to "Pander/massive 40% scumbuddies" to just outright saying "Pander/massive" like we're a hydra, but unless one of the Magic flavor peeps are on mastin's scum team, that's hard to ignore.

this heavily implies the flavor mastin claimed is unequivocally and deterministically town

so (I assume you're familiar with the flavor) if you didn't think mastin was town why the fuck were you calling attention to it?

and under that context, your out of place reaction to me calling you on it makes me think you knew about this and are now just trying to cover it up. what were you trying to accomplish by doing that?

Are you reading this game? Massive a made it quite clear he's flavor familiar.

I'm drunken phone posting excuse me if I'm out oboe loop though. Anyway I don't get your point.

Vote slot! Or synth him. Where's kagami?

[Trustworthy]

HAS VEZOK POSTED?

[Trustworthy]

that post is quoting massive but directed at chandra

for anyone who is wondering why it makes no sense (even though it's super obvious)

What?

Oh hey you're Australian right? So, you should just speak phonetically for what you want!

That's yeah.

[Trustworthy]

Okay you speak into the cup, but clearly and not garbled like you Aussies do, and I'll try to interpret

[Trustworthy]

HALLELUJAH!!!!!!!

[Trustworthy]

VOTE SKOT!

[Trustworthy]

WE SHOOOOD LINCH MASS TIN

WE SHOOOOD SINTH TAT TOOL TAIL

WE SHOOOOD SER UM SUM 1

WE SHOULD SYNTH SKOT?

WE SHOULD SERUM LUDI?

[Trustworthy]

IS TOMMY IN THE WELL?

[Trustworthy]

I DO MEAN TIMMY

I'M IMPRESSED AUSTRALIANS COULD READ THROUGH MY DRUNKNESSES.

[Trustworthy]

WAIT WHY ARE YOU DOING A WHOLE READS LIST CHANDRA????????

[Trustworthy]

I'm refusing to give a read on pixel right now because I baselessly feel like my lack of scumreads implies something deeply wrong with the game and if something is deeply wrong with the game then they are far and away the most likely reason for this

What?

[Trustworthy]

i have the hiccus

[Trustworthy]

rule the 12 seconds!
and ps and ez and whizz
woooooooooo

[Trustworthy]

Are you scum reading pixel?

[Trustworthy]

holy fucking shit that sucked....



Don't break something that aint broken

[Trustworthy]

No, but if we keep lynching townies then I probably will be

[Trustworthy]

I'm refusing to give a read on pixel right now because I baselessly feel like my lack of scumreads implies something deeply wrong with the game and if something is deeply wrong with the game then they are far and away the most likely reason for this

ffery - I'd love to hear what you think of this.

[Trustworthy]

I like the cover better! Deal with it~

Dude.

The cover sucks.

[Trustworthy]

WHY AREN'T YOU WORRIED I'M FOOLING YOU?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

VOTE: mastin

[Trustworthy]

UNVOTE:

Just looked at vote count. We need to serum and synth first and we need to serum.

[Trustworthy]

Since folks want to either lynch me or synth me might as well claim.
Synthing my loses the one bit of value I have.
I am Pentavus- Mirrodin aligned
Serum Ability Occular halo- which as far as I can tell would be a watcher action
if you want my color alignment I can give it but I imagine that has some elemetn of the game.
I am metal. I would rather not lose it.
FYI- I know nothing of the theme at all. If you want card flavor I can give that to you as well.

So let's say, hypothetically speaking, you're town. You being metal is absolutely no use at all because you don't look town. Noone's gonna night kill you because why bother when you don't look town at all.

The one use being metal has to town is um looking town so that you're a nightkill that doesn't take; it's not looking super limp so noone even notices you except to think you look super scummy!

[Trustworthy]

It must suck to be a paranoid player!

[Trustworthy]

Tattletale - Are you metal?

[Trustworthy]

serum Ludi

Vezok - Do I remember reading that you requested serum today? Yesterday didn't you say your ability didn't require serum?

[Trustworthy]

Thank you for answering if you were metal tattletale.

[Trustworthy]

Actually that post is interesting because she gives Mastin an almost certain town read, but in her latest post said anyone who's played with Mastin can tell Mastin is scum. Yeah yeah changing reads, but her reasoning in 2644 is that she wouldn't use the things she has as scum. She has good reasons why on the previous page she's calling Mastin scum, but I am wondering when she decided that Mastin as scum would go as low as to use mental issues.

[Trustworthy]

i actually don't know why trustworthy didn't die N1. if i were scum, i'd have shot the fuck out of her; serum-giver + didn't ever deny the masons thing = easy for titus to play off being "conftown" (assuming she didn't meet an untimely death, but i doubt scum predicted that)

anyway, i'll prob do stuff here tomorrow. been busy with other stuff and what not

I don't know why we didn't either, which was a big fear of mine. Although more people were town reading Titus so I thought she'd die over me. The only person that seemed to accept that we confirmed each other was Phantom (which was weird as he asked me to confirm that Titus was telling the truth and my response was that I wasn't going to talk about my role anymore). I also considered the possibility that we would live if it turned out that we serumed scum as I figured they'd be able to figure out pretty easily that I was the serum giver. I don't believe we serumed scum though. I suppose someone on the scum team believes they can manipulate me or Titus wanted to keep me around?

[Trustworthy]

Oh I meant to say this before and it's way long past, but Mhork no one is saying that third party is unlikely, we're just not focusing on it right now.

[Trustworthy]

Tattletale could be scum. I'm fine with synthing him or skot unless i change my mind. Happy with lynching mastin as well.

A quick note about fatalism: chandra was plenty fatalistic when i pushed him in tales and kept posting emotional appeals until i switched to nacho and he quickly bussed. Circumstances were different there though as there was a good chance he was getting lynched then. Right now all the attention is on mastin including pie's vote so i doubt ceph thinks he will get lynched today.

Ffery, why do you not think pie can get ceph lynched? I do think some kinds of responses/fatalism could be alignment indicative. For instance he responded to me differently here than in tales. I dont like ceph's scumread of pie though as it feels like pie is very obviously town and ceph should be able to see it. Idk, it is a read i hope will firm up later once i am out of vla and reanalyze.

Why is Pie very obviously town? I think he looks a bit town, and he had some good strong replace in posts, but I don't think he looks so town it's damn near a scum claim to not have him as a town read, and Ceph isn't scum reading him.

[Trustworthy]

Unless I see zmuffin voting for mastin I'm going to defend him with every breath.

-You haven't been doing this
-Muffin clearly thinks mastin is scum anyway

What?

Muffin thinking someone is scum and muffin voting someone because they are scum are very different things.

also

unvote
vote tattletale

Gogo scum Counterwagon.

Unless I'm completely mistaken, muffin was voting mastin for the majority of the day and only unvoted mastin because he didn't want a lynch to go through before we'd settled synth and serum.

[Trustworthy]

Also I really wish Trustworthy had posted more today. They are pretty much confirmed town and likely to die tonight if I am not mistaken.

Trustworthy, was anyone else mentioned in your role pm or only Titus?

I wish we had posted more today too! Titus wasn't mentioned in our role pm, just that there was at least one more blink moth. (Muffin is right with the post that comes next except I originally thought it said blink moth nexus, but it just says blink moth.)

I should be able to try to get more posts in tonight when I get home, but since moving last year I don't get to see my family so they've been eating up my time. Shadoweh moved and has been working extra shifts for her upcoming vacation, so she wasn't able to pick up my slack.

Anyway, Shadoweh thinks that Mastin is town but since I told her that muffin can read mastin pretty well, she's not fighting it too much. She thinks that tattletale is scum, but I must be the only person in the game that likes tattletale a bit though :/

[Trustworthy]

i actually don't know why trustworthy didn't die N1. if i were scum, i'd have shot the fuck out of her; serum-giver + didn't ever deny the masons thing = easy for titus to play off being "conftown" (assuming she didn't meet an untimely death, but i doubt scum predicted that)

anyway, i'll prob do stuff here tomorrow. been busy with other stuff and what not

I don't know why we didn't either, which was a big fear of mine. Although more people were town reading Titus so I thought she'd die over me. The only person that seemed to accept that we confirmed each other was Phantom (which was weird as he asked me to confirm that Titus was telling the truth and my response was that I wasn't going to talk about my role anymore). I also considered the possibility that we would live if it turned out that we serumed scum as I figured they'd be able to figure out pretty easily that I was the serum giver. I don't believe we serumed scum though. I suppose someone on the scum team believes they can manipulate me or Titus wanted to keep me around?

Tattletale also seemed to think this confirmed you.

Did you confirm that someone else could confirm you as town (as in, does it say this in your role PM?)?

Tattletale didn't actually. Here's what Tattletale said:

I think Trustworthy and Titus have probably not really cleared each other (-- insert mod meta and Tammy meta here --) but they both look town anyway (especially Trustworthy)

But, no I didn't confirm anything except that I knew Titus's role. All my role pm confirms is that there will be another Blinkmoth. After Titus claimed the "is town" part and said something about going through the steps to confirm me, I asked Nati if the other blink moth (s) were town, and she just replied that I just knew that at least one other existed but didn't know alignment.

I do imagine that if there is another blink moth out there, that one is definitely town. I was looking for anyone who showed any signs of recognizing my original crumb or what we were talking about, and we've discussed a potential couple of people who may be, but that's nothing at all definite and just our suppositions. But, yesterday I thought if there were three blink moths, then one of them was probably scum, but as none else did, who knows. Though I can't see why scum would have two serum givers. I guess if what we're looking for is not a vig or not an sk, and there's a second scum team then perhaps they have one as well, but who knows. And that's speculating that is probably too out there right now.

[Trustworthy]

Trustworthy my point isn't SK hunting. My point is that we apparently have two vigs as town, which doesn't make all that much sense at all balancewise. So the alternative is that the person you targeted and Mastin could have conflicting roles. It's worth a level of scrutiny

The person who shot Titus could be a vig (who may or may not received serum from me. There could be another serum giver), an SK, or a second scum team.

We won't have any indication of that until tomorrow or later, which is why focusing on it right now does little good.

(Though I will say this in case we die. We are not giving serum to the same person we did last night. So if there is a second kill tonight, it is not because we serumed the vig.)

[Trustworthy]

But, no I didn't confirm anything except that I knew Titus's role.

All my role pm confirms is that there will be another Blinkmoth

.

You're role says Titus is an "Inkmoth Nexus", a "Nexus", a land, an artifact creature, a "Blinkmoth", a "Blinkmoth artifact creature", a "Blinkmoth artifact", a "Blinkmoth creature", or something else?

All my role confirms is that there will be another blink moth.

We had a whole discussion about this at the start of day. I was wondering if an ink moth was a blink moth, and massive (?) is the one who said that an ink moth is a corrupted blink moth. So, whether or not Titus is one of the ones mentioned in my role pm, I have no clue because it just confirms the existence of another blink moth.

It did not mention Titus by name. Just blink moth.

[Trustworthy]

After that post, Titus insisted that you

were

confirmed to each other, and you didn't disagree. So past that point, I did consider you confirmed to each other.

(I think it was very dangerous of you not to shut her down.)

I said I wasn't talking about our roles and I meant it. I wanted to disagree, but Shadoweh wanted me to leave it alone.

I think it was clear that our role pms didn't say "is town" in it if you read my posts about the role before hand that I made to people.

If she would have claimed serum giver, you guys wouldn't have lynched her, and if she was town then scum would know our roles.

Muffin laid it out at the end of day why we weren't confirmed to each other, and that actually made me feel a bit okay about leaving it alone until today.

(But if it were solely up to me, and I was playing this game as Tammy, I'd have shut her down the moment she said "is town".)

[Trustworthy]

But, no I didn't confirm anything except that I knew Titus's role.

All my role pm confirms is that there will be another Blinkmoth

.

You're role says Titus is an "Inkmoth Nexus", a "Nexus", a land, an artifact creature, a "Blinkmoth", a "Blinkmoth artifact creature", a "Blinkmoth artifact", a "Blinkmoth creature", or something else?

All my role confirms is that there will be another blink moth.

We had a whole discussion about this at the start of day. I was wondering if an ink moth was a blink moth, and massive (?) is the one who said that an ink moth is a corrupted blink moth. So, whether or not Titus is one of the ones mentioned in my role pm, I have no clue because it just confirms the existence of another blink moth.

It did not mention Titus by name. Just blink moth.

Inkmoth Nexus is the card name.
It's a land.
It has an ability that let's it turn into a Blinkmoth artifact creature with infect.

Yeah, that's what we figured out at day start. We're a Blinkmoth Nexus, and that's a card in the game.

I just don't know if the blink moth that was mentioned in our role pm is Titus or if there is another one. It says there is at least one other blink moth. I don't know if that's considering Inkmoth as a blink moth though.

[Trustworthy]

Pere - There are several other blink moth cards there. There is the blink moth nexus card, but the one on that page is not our card, you have to click the bottom link of other versions for our card. There's a blink moth well, blink moth urn, and blink moth infusion.

[Trustworthy]

Hey I figured out the password again YA'LL! I'm like so drunk and stuff so im totally posting form Florida!

The infusion is an instant. Haven't seen any of those as player-cards yet.
The Blinkmoth Urn is an artifact, so not a creature, which has been established that a Blinkmoth is.
The Blinkmoth Well is a land. But it does not turn into a creature. Ever.
The other is you (land that turns into a creature - a Blinkmoth)
The last is Titus 9land that turns into a creature- a Blinkmoth)

Look, our ability doesn't say 'Another Nexus' or 'An Inkmoth because that's close enough', it specifically says there's another Blinkmoth card. Titus might have had the ability to fake it but I'm positive she's not the card that was being talked about. It also doesn't say a Blinkmoth creature, so stop ruling out cards at random.

I have nothing to add to today because you're still lynching mastin with no alternatives. If you keep trying to lynch my townreads I'm not going to talk to you guys anymore. (Would it help if I said I thought Chandra was really really town, then you could lynch him out of spite?)

[Trustworthy]

Hey I figured out the password again YA'LL! I'm like so drunk and stuff so im totally posting form Florida!

>_>

<_<

>_<

Every time you post that I feel like I sound like Paula Deen.

Oh, and if you're gonna imitate me you should actually imitate my drunk posting!

[Trustworthy]

Unless I'm completely mistaken, muffin was voting mastin for the majority of the day and only unvoted mastin because he didn't want a lynch to go through before we'd settled synth and serum.

kind of. ive been reading back over mastin's ISO in the past few days to see if anything would change

it hasn't, really.

i looked back over d1 looking for stuff like titus interactions (there's literally none apart from a post where titus asked why mastin didn't include her in a town bloc and mastin said because moonlogic) - normally this might give me pause because I'd expect mastin to mask her trail a bit if scum with titus but i think this is more like a 169generic thing where she wasn't expecting titus to die so soon

How do you think she'd approach that differently as town?

I'm trying to figure out if Titus is the type of scum player to make that complaint against a partner. I wouldn't put it past her I guess as it looks good for distancing purposes.

Although I was thinking about Titus and their probable expectations that she wouldn't die so soon. That would point to an SK if it wasn't a vig that killed her as they'd be pretty aware if there was a second scum team, and probably wouldn't play up the confirmed town thing as much as she did.

[Trustworthy]

Oh I forgot to mention something about Chandra, or did I? If I already said this, sorry.

But, I was thinking about Ceph's play, and the past two times he was scum and anyone started to scum read him, he kinda pulled a bit of a manipulative oh I always get scum read type thing. In ASoIaF, he was prepared to scum read Nacho if he so much as scum read him a little bit. And he and DV did the same type of thing in Tales, but it means less there as Nacho was their partner.

I'm not seeing any of that here. Here he's not displaying any of that. He just seems agitated.

So, IDK if that means anything because it could be a product of being on an alt and playing differently or it could be him changing up for people that might be a bit hyper aware of some of his tactics?

IDK.

[Trustworthy]

I was not expecting tattletale, who has said almost nothing about you all game, to drop a naked vote on you as scum here if you're town
Though I guess it's also possible that scum felt it necessary to jump on town-you for no real reason when, as you've said, there aren't many people town reading you and you were (are?) likely to be lynched today without them needing to lift a finger

Tales of You's Nacho called.
He said "fuck you, Muffin".

Seriously, this is EXACTLY the logic Nacho used in Tales to defend himself and to paint me as further suspicious to secure the mislynch.

Scum can vote me because they can get away with it.
Simple as that.

Nacho was scum in Tales pushing your mislynch.

Aren't you town reading muffin? Otherwise I don't get your point?

[Trustworthy]

Oh I forgot to mention something about Chandra, or did I? If I already said this, sorry.

But, I was thinking about Ceph's play, and the past two times he was scum and anyone started to scum read him, he kinda pulled a bit of a manipulative oh I always get scum read type thing. In ASoIaF, he was prepared to scum read Nacho if he so much as scum read him a little bit. And he and DV did the same type of thing in Tales, but it means less there as Nacho was his partner.

Why are you comparing town nacho's push on scum- ceph in asoaif with scum nachos push on his partner ceph in tales as opposed to compare nacho's asoiaf push with my push on ceph in tales?

I'm not. Not at all.

I don't get your point? You are completely misreading what I said. I didn't even mention you at all in that post, so I don't know why you think I'm comparing you at all. You don't factor into that at all, the only person who factors into that is Ceph.

I'm talking about CEPH'S reaction. He, in both games, went all emotionally manipulative with the "Oh I always get lynched and get scum read when I'm town. yada yada yada." He did it when he was scum in both instances. He HASN'T done it here. If he has, please point it out because I've actually been looking for it. He's seemed more irritated.

[Trustworthy]

Oh I misread your question.

But the point is not the push. The point is CEPH'S reaction to being scum read.

[Trustworthy]

I didnt misread your post. I was asking why you werent using my push in tales as an analogy to asoiaf. Im on a phone so i cant reread but he omgussed quite a lot and posted some manipulative stuff like why i am gloating after i get fox mislynched and some such posts. This was at a point when he was nearly about to be lynched. He was plenty agitated as well. Can you go back and reread day 4 and give me your thoughts?

I'm not talking about that.

I'm talking about my specific thing.

Something I picked up in ASoIaF and something that pinged me in Tales but didn't push.

He, in both games, was emotionally manipulative in that way. I haven't seen him do that here. I'm not talking about any other comparison. Just that one thing that I picked up in both those games that I haven't seen here.

[Trustworthy]

I didnt misread your post. I was asking why you werent using my push in tales as an analogy to asoiaf. Im on a phone so i cant reread but he omgussed quite a lot and posted some manipulative stuff like why i am gloating after i get fox mislynched and some such posts. This was at a point when he was nearly about to be lynched. He was plenty agitated as well. Can you go back and reread day 4 and give me your thoughts?

But, if I have time today I will go back and read that though.

[Trustworthy]

I'm talking about CEPH'S reaction. He, in both games, went all emotionally manipulative with the "Oh I always get lynched and get scum read when I'm town. yada yada yada." He did it when he was scum in both instances. He HASN'T done it here. If he has, please point it out because I've actually been looking for it. He's seemed more irritated.

This might be partially a Chandra tell. It's also possible whining about my meta is a scumtell for me, I'm not actually sure

You did something like that in HardBoiled when you were town though. IIRC, the way you posted something about you getting lynched or scum read was why I had you as such a strong town read in that game. It felt really natural, but the way you did it when scum was more manipulative - looking back obviously.

[Trustworthy]

Oh my god, i wish i had a computer to respond to everything. You said pies posts were manufactured but you were still not scumreading him. You only later scumread him.

Tammy, i was talking about why it is at all relevant that nacho was his partner in tales.

He did it in ASoIaF to manipulate Nacho.

It pinged for me in Tales because I thought he was doing it again to manipulate Nacho, but it wasn't because they were partners. So, he didn't do it to manipulate the person it looked like he was manipulating, it was for distancing purposes.

The thing is that he did the same exact manipulative type posting, but it means less in Tales because he was doing it to his partner.

[Trustworthy]

Please don't call my thought process irrelevant though.

And comment on my actual tell.

That'd be great!

[Trustworthy]

I feel like we should petition Nati to change the name of the game to Blatantly Serum and Steel: The Blatant Rise of Phyrexia.

[Trustworthy]

Please don't anyone hammer yet. I want to talk to think about something and I'm out of town helping my sister move. Well I've been out of town all week but I'm out of town from where I was. Don't mind me I'm delirious from being tired.

[Trustworthy]

I don't need to hold up a hammer anymore.

[Trustworthy]

Chandra - I would very much like it if you were town.

[Trustworthy]

Just checking in.

I just got back from vacation last night, so I'll be able to actually be more active this day phase. I think Shadoweh is getting ready to go on vacation soon and then both heads will be on vacation at the end of next week, but we'll still have access just not a whole lot and we will be drunk, so.

OH WAIT.

Muffin said something about if you got a message that you are now flesh or something to say something. I'd find the post but I'm in the middle of work right now. He's listed as metal and died, so he must have gotten that message if he's dead.

Also, we serumed muffin night one, and since he didn't have titus as a town read we thought it was possible that he was a vig who vigged her. I realized soon after that that he didn't vig her though.

Don't know what to make of only one kill last night though.

Okay I need to get back to work, thoughts later.

[Trustworthy]

Oh sure, when Muffin says not to synth people suddenly think it's a logical thing.. ._.
We didn't serum Antihero. Seruming the same person twice is boring, it's my intention to find out as many people's powers as possible.

[Trustworthy]

Don't be weird. Also pixel is prob-town imo so you're probably gonna keep being ignored on that part.
If you want to talk about ceph and pandas though there isn't a set train to lynchville so just post it?

<_< Why did you track someone that had already used a serum ability and people had mentioned it in thread?

[Trustworthy]

Um antihero muffin didn't want to be serum'd yesterday. If you've been reading the game you'd know that. Like he is the one that literally came up with the plan to serum someone not you and not him. He knew what his role was because we serum'd him night one.

[Trustworthy]

what are chandra's reads

pieguy skot massive scum?

these are muffin's last two posts.

ffery - did muffin talk about this at all last night?

pedit: Mine too. I think it's still one of the favored scum tells.

[Trustworthy]

Oh. That makes so much more sense.

[Trustworthy]

I know

I've wondered about that too. And when he told me I was just flat out wrong the other day I was like :/

But I think he's still mad at me about Fantasy Camp. Although it is weird; I'd probably think it was less weird if he thought there was a chance I was scum, but.

[Trustworthy]

Ceph, it isnt just effort posting from tattletale. I thought a lit of it felt genuine. It doesnt feel fake or made up. I'd elaborate but on phone. I also agree with pie's reasoning. Also forgot to mention, one reason was i actually thought muffun calling mastin not town made me paranoid of muffin but it turned out to be nothing so i can see where ffery's coming from but i dont think it is necessarily scummy.

Ffery, pie and i tend to wirk well together and develop reads somewhat similarly - see 169, tales, quickness where we hydra'ing.

Tammy, i am not mad at you for fantasy camp. I never get mad at being fairly beaten. If i am brief about my thoughts, it is because i dont have time or ability to wall and explain my reada like i usually do. I think i've worked with you just as much as you have with me though and i did consider your reads just as much as you considered mine if not more and i feel the distance is from your end.

One of the problems with lock stepping with someone who reads people the same way you do is there's a lack of critical thought about the reads because it often turns out to just be patting each other on the back and confirming each other's bias. Awesome when you're right but not so much when you're wrong. (See me day one of quickness defending Jason and even though I had actual experience catching scum Jason you both saw something that you thought led him to be guilty which overrode my correct read. I'm not chiding for an incorrect read here because hi but it just dangerous.)

I did feel like you weren't interested in my thoughts but I wasn't going to say anything because I still feel bad about fantasy camp.

I am however being a bit less open about some of my thoughts her and it has nothing to do with you or anyone else this game. I'm trying not to give scum a roadmap to who we're seruming.

[Trustworthy]

This post from Kagami concerns me. Dismissing mastin as obviously scum seems rash for town. It's possible, but it does give me the tingles!

Yes, surely this is the first time you've seen town be certain that another town is scum.

I have no idea why mastin felt motivated to pretend that Titus and TW were masons, especially given we were both in AoT together and she should have spotted what was going on immediately.

Ferry, did muffin tell you directly that he had been demetal-ed as CN suggested, or did it sound like he was just speculating about a demetaler? The kill flavor looks like a metal-specific kill to me.

Kagami how did you go from thinking that mastin was almost definitely town because she wouldn't stoop so low as to use the emotional issues as scum on day one to thinking that mastin was obvscum to anyone who had ever played with her before?

(I'm at the gym. I'll pull up the posts I'm referring to later.)

[Trustworthy]

I feel like there should be a blatant drinking game.

[Trustworthy]

But you were opposed to it when I suggested day one and continued to think it wasn't good day two

[Trustworthy]

trustworthy, I feel like I'm holding down batshit levels of paranoia here.

I really need to go back and carefully reread Steve and Phantom again, I think. I need to put those reads to bed and stop worrying about them. Or not.

I've been rolling some stuff around in my head.

Also been writing syllabi today and my brain is now fried from thinking too much, so tomorrow.

[Trustworthy]

Yeah I got as far as HE VOTED LUDI ON DAY ONE SELF EXPLANATORY and went yeah I'm not reading that. I voted and somewhat actively pushed a LUDI lynch and I'm town so not self explanatory at all.

Some of the vca reasoning is kinda poor too, as you stick us in the spot of who where you would expect scum to vote for abr and then dismiss it because if the town read on us when that's wrong. You should be looking at where and when those votes came in. For instance after pretty much defending abr the majority of the day we deadline hammered him.

Anyway ffery - as far as paranoia there. Pies doing his "I want votes here or you explain why" thing which points to him being more town and trying to take charge. The last time I saw him as scum was too many heads and I don't think he even posted. Although if there is a third party, then this is a bit weaker as he sounded convincing as sk in gundam. I have a bit of a hard time reading pie though because he reads games soooo differently from me. I tend to read his cases and think eh that's not alignment indicative, he's nitpicking, or misunderstanding what's being said. I don't think that falcon and pie lock stepping is out of the ordinary as in tales they pretty much did the same thing. I thought that falcon had some good posts day one and two and he's probably town?

I'm feeling a bit contrary right now and am not going to vote for cn. Shadow eh is scum reading him and she was right about mastin, so maybe she's right there. I just want cephrir to be town though, and part of that is me just feeling contrary but he's also not doing some of the things I've seen from scum him but I'm not sure if that can be attributed to the alt or if the dynamic of his scum game is changed due to a different player list. I think I'll read through red wine later when I get home.

[Trustworthy]

Oh and pie you're misunderstanding the wk point.

[Trustworthy]

I lied! I skimmed he case after saying I'm not reading it.

And dammit I'm at the gym, I can't take a blatant shot here!

[Trustworthy]

FOUR blatant shots! Pies trying to get me drunk!

[Trustworthy]

I don't know why but that post made me feel better about antihero who I've been getting paranoid about

[Trustworthy]

Falcon - I'm not going to quote your post cuz phone posting while riding a bike but I am taking your reads into account. In tales my gut was telling me something was wrong with fox from day one but I got so paranoid about everyone that game I couldn't discern who I was scum reading from who I was paranoid about. Having only one town read I felt good about had me spinning in circles. I wasn't going to vote who you wanted me to vote when I was paranoid about you. It was why that one day I kinda snapped at you about attacking every single post they made. It was causing even more confusion.

[Trustworthy]

I don't know why but that post made me feel better about antihero who I've been getting paranoid about

what are you doing tammy?

Besides playing the blatant drinking game?

Trying to feel better about you.

[Trustworthy]

Totally not what I said.

Earlier I tried to discuss cephrir. I told you something I'd noticed in his scum at that wasn't present here. I didn't even say oh that makes him town, but your response was "Tammy you're flat out wrong". Like that was literally your response. So yah, I'm feeling contrary.

[Trustworthy]

It's not even that you're pushing him. This game is full of too many shouters declaring they're right and everyone else is wrong and not listening to anyone.

People just wheeled muffin yesterday when if you would have read what he was saying sure he thought he was scum but was still having trouble with it. And others of you were like oh she's definitely scum and not listening to anyone who detracted.

I'm not blaming anyone for that mislynch, but it's just the mindset that's annoying. There are pockets in this game congratulating each other on being right and no real attempt to get town to work together unless it FOLLOW WHAT I SAY RAWR!!!!!

so, I'll just sit here taking my blatant shots and interacting with people who want my thoughts and hopefully serum the right people who can help until my death.

[Trustworthy]

*shrug*

Antihero your tone is off and weird. You sound hostile and I can't tell if it's you being scum and trying and failing at affecting a town tone or if something poured sour milk in your Cheerios.

Regardless you're not doing anything but bitching and that freaks me the fuck out.

You don't need to know what I'm doing. You obviously aren't reading the game or you'd know. That pings church bells as well. I'm so lost on why you're not reading the game.

[Trustworthy]

But being contrary just to be contrary or because you want ceph to be town and pie and me to be wrong isnt helping town.

*shrug*

My other head is scum reading cn, so town is in luck!

I'll tell you exactly how the next couple days will go in a minute but I'm out running errands.

[Trustworthy]

I feel like this post explains why you and I have sometimes tangled really badly in games.

How so?

[Trustworthy]

I dont have any intention of strong arming a ceph lynch through and that's mostly because i am not certain enough. I am willing to step back and work with you if you are and discuss other reads. I didnt think you'd be offended at being told you are wrong and i did explain why i thought it wasnt alignment indicative + the alt thing.

I had shut down by that point. You misunderstood what I was saying in the first place because I wasn't wrong. I was saying that something I'd noticed in his scum play wasn't here, and literally said I didn't know if it meant anything. Your response was not one interested in my thoughts, it was just to shut me down. You then got after me for posting something that was irrelevant because you again were not looking the point I was trying to make and thought I should be arguing something else entirely.

It was after that point when I said my thoughts weren't irrelevant and that I wanted you to comment on what I was actually saying that you commented on it, which by that point I wasn't quite in the mood for discussing thoughts.

~~~

Here is how today is going to go. We're going to lynch Chandra, and I swear to Iomedae if you guys lynch before I get a chance to settle on a serum target I'm going to scream. But we're going to lynch Chandra because for the second day in a row we've only had one lynch target. Does that not bother anyone else? Yesterday it was Mastin. Like literally the only wagon was Mastin. And I get why. I can't read Mastin that well at all, and he wasn't dropping some of the things he was in Tales which had me thinking you guys were wrong about Mastin, that and Muffin typically can read Mastin, but well that happens, but even he was putting in more effort to actually read Mastin. And today the soup de jour is Chandra, and literally nobody else and nobody is doing a thing to stop it. None. And Pie's case? Half of that is alignment irrelevant. Maybe he's right and Chandra is scum, but not for most of the reasons he's pushing him for.

Part of what I would have discussed that day if I hadn't been told what I'm supposed to be thinking is that I don't feel manipulated by Ceph. Cephrir knows he can manipulate me and when he has in the past I've felt like I was being manipulated. Ignored a good part of that in ASoIaF and recognized it in Tales. Problem is during Tales, I felt like I was being manipulated by everybody so I couldn't separate paranoia from actual manipulation. Here, I don't feel that manipulation. Maybe it's not alignment indicative, maybe he's changing up tactics, maybe it's just not there all the time. I do want to read back through Red Wine, but it really doesn't matter because you're all lynching him anyway and my other head wants him lynched too.

So, he'll get lynched and he'll flip whatever he flips. If he's town, tomorrow Mhork will yell at you all for lynching someone he's been saying was town from day one. And the people who are full steam ahead on their reads will continue full steam ahead on their reads without for a second wondering where they went wrong. We'll lynch Pander Bears tomorrow regardless of Chandra's flip. But if Chandra flips scum, I suppose people will start wondering where Mhork went wrong on his town read. Or they'll consider Chandra and Mork decided to scum buddy each other. Who knows.

[Trustworthy]

I'm alternating between working on a syllabus and reading through Titus. I might spam some, so sorry in advance.

Chandra's an alt? Aww fuck...now that adds bias interpretations to the posts that I won't see...

This post concerns me.

It's the type of thing that I can see a person commenting on about their partner. It's a little nice distancing. Like a *wink wink nudge nudge* I didn't know you were an alt to someone who is most likely posting as their main in the qt.

However, it can also just be a post that is trying to make it look like she's posting as a good old townie. I'm thinking of the way that Bork approached the alt in the Tales game. (I remember the main, can't remember the alt Lord something?) Anyway he was very oh that's gonna make it difficult for me to read you type thing.

[Trustworthy]

please serum F16

i wouldn't confirm or deny who I would serum in the first place, but it looks like he's getting serum'd today publicly so I don't know what you're asking me to do.

[Trustworthy]

Oh and

Unvote all votes

Hive mind. Call me BN yo!

Oh, we already knew but this is evidence scum have fake claims. She said call me BN - Blinkmoth Nexus. This also tells me if there is another serum giver, they are a Blinkmoth Nexus.

[Trustworthy]

I don't think that either are any better than the other. It worries me that for two days in a row, we've had one wagon and one wagon only and that seems to be the wagon that is definitely going to go through.

I think yesterday's was a bit more understandable. Mastin herself has proclaimed that Muffin can read her and when someone has a near perfect record of reading someone it's understandable for people to follow that or want to follow that.

[Trustworthy]

I am more concerned with 270 being applied selectively. Any player doing nothing should doing something on Day 3 or be lynched.

I am not a fan of Pander's post to Phantom. But for the part about not understanding PB's vote on me. Someone having the exact opposite reads is a decent reason to scumread someone. Phantom coming out on the opposite side indicates an effort to understand the game. The whole rhetoric on not having scumreads go away is baloney. It's Day 1. He gave his reasons. Shutting him off from talking is bad which makes me think Panda's post was mitivated to not have Phantom talk.

I'm wondering if this post makes sense for a Titus-Panda Bear partnership. There is the vote to synth Panda Bears, which I don't think is that strong, but this doesn't quite match what I've seen of how Titus treats her partners.

Not real strong feeling here, but.

Oh and Titus voted to synth antihero in her first post. I'm thinking that might point away from a partnership there too. But, I'm rabbit holing about Antihero right now, so I don't feel great about that.

[Trustworthy]

Tattle, there's been a lot since your last post.

What is your opinion on me/Trustworthy, skot and Panda?

Vezok, can you talk to me about skot? I am null on you, like the rest of the wagon but I do not see the case.

@Chandra/Vezok, I was hoping more existed on SKOT than y'all said. My gut really doesn't ping for skot but it looks like a wagon of win.

@Mhok, I am not a fan of Muffin town. Anti is probably town.

Mastin, what do you think of Chandra? Why? What about Panda?

Tattletale, what do you think of skot's catchup? I like it.

Panda, not everyone needs to ask questions to understand a read. Pixel is pretty clear about his reasons. This sounds like a strech scumread. There's no foundation for the support for the allegation you are making. Finding Pixel's behavior as odd (as described in 205) does not in anyway reflect a lack of understanding.

Kagami, I am scumhunting while resetting. My reads were wrong on Trustworthy so until I find out what it is or I find something independently scummy (ABR), I don't plan on making big moves.

Just putting these here to think about.

[Trustworthy]

Mhork/Chandra/Mastina/Trustworthy - Thoughts on iamsteve please (not subtle redirect)

@Mastina, so we actually get back to the game rather than this you're prolonging this nonsense.Why is Steve town?

Really kids. It is ok to not have the last word.

@Mhork, thoughts on iamsteve.

Oh wow. More random doubtcasting from Vezok.

"Peregrine is proactive and that makes him town.
Chandra is scum."
-pie 2014

I get that distinction. Pie is wrong on you, but PV has had a limited timeframe from which to post. So his proactivity counts for more to Pie.

Look at Gundam Seed. This is not scum Pie.

No. Massive (even if I was scumreading them) which I'm not, does not have the time to actually reach a lynch. The only viable wagons at this point are Chandra and ABR.

We have less than 48 hours people

Stop it. I'm not speedlynching Massive. I'm open to the possibility of them being scum, but we don't have time. We've discussed three players. Take your stances as they are the only lynchable players.

Unless you are townreading both Chandra and Ludi, time to vote one of them Muffin. To me, it seems like you're trying to create a no lynch.

Ok massive's town

Mod: Prod on Antihero?

Trustworthy, we cannot get a hammer bc ABR is cycling through counterwagons.

Most of the Panda Bearsvwagon is highly suspected.

I'm not interested in lynching massive except in order to prevent NL. I still think his mhork ah-ha 738 was town as fuck (although I'm kind of biased bc I don't know flavor)

I still wanna lynch CN. anyone up for a CN lynch?

Wow... really? Give it a rest Chandra's obvious town.

Just more I want to look at and think about.

[Trustworthy]

Should have spoilered those, sorry.

and congrats kagami!

[Trustworthy]

did Peregrine replace out?

[Trustworthy]

No, he didn't as far as I can tell. And both muffin and mastin have more recent posts than he does. I mean there's lurking and then there's well what he's doing. He's v/la now but has been posting on this site every day.

[Trustworthy]

I thought you were scum reading pie guy?

[Trustworthy]

Okay so, I did look through Red Wine, and it's hard to judge on the manipulative score because I was scum with him and knew his alignment. But, he replaced in rather aggressively and I don't really detect much manipulation in the way that he posts initially. But, as soon as ffery? starts to suspect him, he pulls the "and I thought I had finally learned how to be town" and then when there's other suspicion on him (Llamarble thinks his bussing post and response looks like a scum post) he responds that if he's just going to start saying everything he does is scummy he's been there done that and he'd rather pass.

This is the same type of behavior that I was talking about in ASoIaF and Tales.

In Hard Boiled, it was serious and a bit more playful. He started off saying that he was thinking about a meta shift and would appreciate it if he didn't get lynched that game. He then later joked when someone else called themselves lynchbait that he was supposed to be the lynchbait that game, and then shortly after ditched his attempted meta shift. Later in the game Nacho threw some suspicion on me and Cephrir, and Ceph's response was nothing like ASoIaF or Tales. There was no "oh you must be scum because you're scum reading me" thing. (Yes, Tales he did it as distancing because that's how he would act.) I was the one that reacted that way *chuckle*.

Anyway I know that this has been deemed alignment irrelevant and all, but I haven't had a chance to see if he's displayed that type of manipulative tone here. I don't remember it if it has been though.

[Trustworthy]

Oh crap but what I did notice is that muffin was right about what he does as scum with his partners. If the tide seems like it's shifting he readily busses. Here, the tide was certainly shifting towards Titus day one and he kept calling her town. Now this is not as strong for two reasons. She was the scum serum giver and if there is scum with serum abilities then it would be likely that they'd want her around. She had my fake claim with me to back that up, so it wouldn't have gone anywhere that day anyway.

[Trustworthy]

Okay so from what I can gather Titus' reads were:

Scum:

zmuffin, ABR

Ludi (Majiffy) and to a lesser extent Panda Bears?

Null: Vezok (but seemed to think a bit scummy), PV (maybe? slight defense concerning his limited time to post but no solid read), skot (defense here a couple times throughout the day, beginning with his random.org vote and then with vezok concerning his wagon, and told tattletale that she liked his catchup), Tattletale (really nothing there to indicate how she felt about Tattletale)

Town:

Trustworthy, Mastin

, Chandra, Lord Mhork, Massive, Antihero, F-16, Pixel, Pieguyn

~~~~~

What bothers me about Antihero, besides his tone which if he's having a bad time right now that can account, is his not reading the game, his thinking his role is crap - scum obviously have fake claims and he was able to confirm muffin as town so why the hell would he think his role is crap, makes me fear that he's actually a scum role cop and one of the reasons he doesn't want to be able to use his role is because he a) will have to confirm other people as town and b) is concerned that he has to get serum every night if he's given it three times and the fact that the scum serum giver is dead makes him antsy and is fearing his death. I'm also quite bugged by the way that Titus made the push to get the serum wagon off of muffin and onto Antihero. Why one over the other if they're both town? I suppose it could be because of Antihero vs. Muffin's reads? I don't know but that has me picking briar's out of my hair.

What bugs me about some of Titus's posts are the ones where she asks certain people about their reads on certain other people.

Stuff like asking Tattletale what her reads were on Titus/Trustworthy/skot/panda. She asks Tattle again later what her read on skot is and comments that she likes skot's catchup. (She really seems interested in people's skot reads though.)

She asks mastin what she thinks about chandra and panda bears.

She asks me, mhork, chandra and mastin for our reads on iamsteve and then asks mastin why iamsteve is town when she responds.

Her light suspicion then defense of massive is worrisome.

I feel like at least one of the people she was asking about their reads and/or one of the people she asked reads about is someone partnered with her, but I'm not sure which.

[Trustworthy]

Post 3490 is the only real case that's been made against Chandra. I guess part of it could be that muffin also suspected Chandra?

Basically Chandra is the designated day three lynch and since we're a town who can't fathom not just following someone onto literally one lynch opportunity, Chandra will be lynched today.

[Trustworthy]

Gah and I will hate myself if I derail a scum lynch.

Mostly I'm just frustrated with the complacency and yeah I'm going here because sheeping, which doesn't help anything no matter what he flips.

Shadoweh hasn't read today at all (I also doubt she will as she's preparing to go on vacation and has been really busy.) but when I told her my synopsis she said well Chandra has been a lynch target three days in a row. But that's all she said because she hasn't read and still has a scum read there, but still asked why people were lynching him.

[Trustworthy]

I wasn't pointing fingers with the mastin thing; it was a general consensus, but I do feel like most people just went okay muffin says scum so sheep. And I don't really blame people, I can't read Mastin, I was trying, and I was sheeping muffin when I voted Mastin though I unvoted and was pretty much watching muffin's read pretty closely there. And that's fine, but what can we learn from it? Not much of anything, and if today goes along a same path, no matter Chandra's alignment, we're still not going to learn anything from it. Day one interactions sure, but people need to not just continue sheeping blindly.

You are right about Ceph's manipulation in Tales. Like I said I did feel that was there in Tales, but one of my biggest weaknesses in mafia is that I tend to look favorably on someone who takes my side when i'm in an argument with someone. I know that is though, and that game. Just. That game. But the manipulative feel is something I've been actively looking for from him this game and I haven't seen it. I don't know if it's because of the alt, his alignment, him changing tactics, or what.

You are pretty right about the people on Titus not being the ones to have pull to drive a lynch through. The ones mostly on her wagon day one were Magister Ludi, Tattletale, Panda Bears, and ABR. Of those the one I would think would have the most pull is Magister Ludi, but that's mostly based on the potential I believe he has based on one past game. But with her fake claim, and me being able to back that claim up, the scum team would have known it wouldn't have gone to fruition. Now I'm of two minds about this. Potential flow bussers could just ignore that especially as a lot of people had town reads on her, she created a connection between the two of us, and I was telling people to drop the questioning about it for at least a day or two.

I'm not a big fan of skot. There are a few town notes in his play or I'd be pushing his lynch like I was yesterday. Some of the things he's said are easily fakeable, but they give me pause. The main thing I don't like is how much Titus seemed interested in people's reads on skot, and the fact that he's doing absolutely nothing. I would need to go back to peace bringer's posts in viscon and bbhoh and the other game he was scum in and replaced out of, oh asoiaf!, but from memory he tends to attack those who scum reads his partners? and is more subdued. (don't quote me on this) But damn in chef mafia did he not mind getting into tangles. But my main thing about him is that he's doing absolutely nothing this game. Like there's a post that I made concerning him and he accused me of potentially being scum or something, which shows exactly no interaction with the game state whatsoever. I mean it's not criminal to suspect me, but it doesn't show any awareness of the gamestate, which I find problematic. Basically he comes in every now and then to essentially call us stupid for suspecting him but not doing anything at all. I'm just glad we synthed him.

[Trustworthy]

Also, I think I would be behind at least a partial mass metal claim.

Now, if muffin was not talking in the neighborhood like it was his dying breaths then I think pixel is right that he didn't get demetaled night one. But if he was metal and was pushing for a metal claim, then I think that does have some weight.

Though, this shouldn't be shocking because I thought it would be a good idea day one, so. I just really do think there is metal scum, and I'd really like to be able to evaluate that on two levels. Do we need to synth that person? Or do we want to trust they can get to lylo and be unlynchable?

[Trustworthy]

omg

have i told you all how cute my cat is?

omg

[Trustworthy]

Okay, so on antihero: the way he pushed ffery d1, i feel goes past the point of what he can fake as scum. He's somewhat like me and pie in that he lurks and isnt really that awesome as scum. His ffery push felt natural and didnt feel fake and initially resonated to some extent. I dont feel like anti as scum would be bold enough to go after ffery.

So the thing with titus: i dont know what to make of it although i feel that titus would defend townies just as much as buddies so. I saw when i was reading book of shadows that she did prefer one townie to another so i doubt her wanting to serum anti means that anti is scum. I also thought his response to you felt town.

Here's my problem. Or at least what is sticking briars in my hair. Anyone can have a break out awesome day one, and antihero has a recent good scum game. I mean look at bork in Tales? Even ffery had him as a town read day one because good day ones can happen. I'm not good as scum but I can have a good scum game.

Why wouldn't he be bold enough to go after ffery? You also thought that scum wouldn't go after me, and in the second Tales game the entire scum team went after me. I think that going after ffery early on is safe for scum?

The Titus thing might not be alignment indicative admittedly. I mean unless we believe that Lord Mhork is her scum partner (along with either you or ffery), she certainly wasn't trying to make sure only scum got serum. As she pushed for an antihero serum wagon, serumed Mhork and tried to steer me towards either you or ffery. But it is something I worry about, but that could be the scum team's fear of muffin? I'm just really hung up on antihero's disdain for his role, which is essentially a cop.

[Trustworthy]

I am not a fan of Pander's post to Phantom. But for the part about not understanding PB's vote on me. Someone having the exact opposite reads is a decent reason to scumread someone. Phantom coming out on the opposite side indicates an effort to understand the game. The whole rhetoric on not having scumreads go away is baloney. It's Day 1. He gave his reasons. Shutting him off from talking is bad which makes me think Panda's post was mitivated to not have Phantom talk.

I'm wondering if this post makes sense for a Titus-Panda Bear partnership. There is the vote to synth Panda Bears, which I don't think is that strong, but this doesn't quite match what I've seen of how Titus treats her partners.

In what way? Are you saying you don't think she would call out a partner's post as wrong or scum-motivated, or something else? She did keep them as a scum read for day one, but the only place she ultimately took it was the synth vote. When the opportunity to wagon Pander Bears came around, she called it a counterwagon to save ABR.

So then do you think it proves pander bears and titus are scum together? i mean I know yes you think it does because your vote is there but it's not something that memorable as I just had to look back at the vote count to see. okay maybe a little memorable as i remember you saying that you read panda bears as scum independently of chandra.

what I'm thinking about is titus's typical interaction with her scum partners. It's not set in stone, but my experience with titus isn't to crap on her partner's interactions with town. So based on the way she's behaved in previous scum games I have experience with her in panda bears is town or is scum with the person panda was scum reading. But that's not something i feel super duper certain about.

There are some things that I associate with DV town. He's yet to do any of those things. But he's also yet to do the things I associate with DV scum, so :/

[Trustworthy]

It might be a better idea to serum Chandra today if he is a jailkeeper.

Why today?

And why propose this on a day when Chandra is getting lynched?

[Trustworthy]

I'm just really hung up on antihero's disdain for his role, which is essentially a cop.

In fairness, he did stop calling it a useless role after it was explained to him that he was a cop equivalent.

Oh crap I meant to respond to this.

But he threw a fit over us not seruming muffin. Even though muffin said he didn't want to be serumed.

And, do you *really* think antihero needed to have explained what an important role a flavor cop could be? Really? Because that has my head twisted in knots. A newb? Maybe. Antihero, no you're going to have to explain to me how he doesn't understand that his role, which he figured out confirmed his supposed suspect muffin as town, doesn't understand how his role is important.

[Trustworthy]

I'm thinking about the kind of posts she made about pirate mollie in book of shadows. mollie was super obviously scum, but titus found every reason she could come up with for why mollie was town until it was clear we were lynching mollie and then she found her as scum, which felt a bit different than her pander bears treatment.

HOWEVER, I don't find meta based on interactions as hard and fast rules.

As far as why I wonder for Chandra today. He thinks he's a jail keeper but who knows. Ludi is a tracker. Someone else thinks they're a watcher. All of these roles really don't have positive effects until we're low on scum. I mean the only way why we might actually believe that chandra jailed scum is if he jailed someone who was really likely to be scum and really likely to be town. Not sure why we'd give that serum over a role cop, tracker or watcher. If Chandra is a jail keeper the role is more useful later. The possible jail keeper role gives me pause though based on the tracker, role cop, and metal claims though.

[Trustworthy]

*who was really likely to be scum and not likely to be night killed.

I don't know what my problem is.

I may or may not have had a couple glasses of wine.

[Trustworthy]

On the receiving end of Antihero's push, it felt genuine and town.

He and I haven't played much together and I'm not sure at all that as scum he'd worry about a push on me resulting in a huge backlash, particularly as this game was populated at the start, before some of the replace-ins.

My early day 1 play was pretty off the curve. Picking up votes for it didn't surprise me or look de facto scummy/opportunistic.

Titus staying the hell away from all that might be an indication of a scum team that did worry about going after me though, I guess.

Hmmm... then what do you make of Titus' initial push on my slot?

[Trustworthy]

but wait that doesn't make sense, cause she caused a big fuss against muffin.

[Trustworthy]

What would that tell you about the scum team?

er um your previous to this last post post - the wine is sinking in and i'm being unclear now.

[Trustworthy]

Basciallly what I'm wondering is if she felt particularly compelled to keep away from ferry, why would that be? who would be the likely partners to plod along that path? Because if the former is true, maybe we can find answers?

Or maybe i'm in the deep.

[Trustworthy]

also farscape has waffles tres confused and on high alert!

[Trustworthy]

margaritas is much superior to wine!

[Trustworthy]

You did, but he, like Titus, made a push against muffin.

I might not make sense tonight.

[Trustworthy]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?!

[Trustworthy]

PV only one person gets serum.

This is in response to PV asking the mod what would happen if one person gets more than one helping of serum.

Titus was a serum giver, so Mhork would have already known that there were other ways to get it. This is either a really well placed dumb tell or he's not on a team with Titus.

He later says that he can't read and was referring to the votes, but when I read PV's post I thought to myself good question. This feels like a spontaneous response though, so I lean towards not being aware that there was more than one serum giver out there.

[Trustworthy]

Oh I can't read. Never mind I'm interested in your answer too. I thought you were thinking everyone who got a vote got serum

although being interested in the answer too could point to a partnership. I guess.

[Trustworthy]

I'm 90% sure what my ability is and it isn't one I need to get by serum votes.

If someone wants to give me serum though I don't mind.

I want to hear more from SKOT.

I'm still trying to figure out why he said that he didn't need serum for his ability and then yesterday or today asked for serum. I remember that he answered. I don't remember if I was satisfied with the answer. I'll figure that out later.

[Trustworthy]

As much as I want Chandra to be town, I think I'm getting to the point where the game makes sense with him as scum.

It felt better when I thought it then after I typed it though :/

[Trustworthy]

Well I'm rereading the game right now trying to get some perspective. I'll probably only get through day one but that's mainly what I'm going for. I'll get through whatever I can today as I don't have time for mafia on Sunday usually except sporadically and school starts Monday where I'll start having limited time to play and then I'm going on a mini vacation on Thursday and then both of our heads will be drunk.

That's a lot to say I'm trying to reread right now.

I did have a mini melt down last night where I sent several messages to Nati in which I decided Pixel was scum, no town, no scum, no town and then just declared myself to be a crazy person.

[Trustworthy]

I'm not sure that the card colors are alignment indicative though. Titus' is gold just like mine and ABR's was black.

Why on earth do you all seem to believe that being synthed is some undesirable thing?

There is very very likely something like the arcbound ravager in this game, otherwise it would take three days to lynch a metal scum, which would be beyond terrible setup design. Letting the ravager eat metal scum is by far the most efficient way to deal with them, and encouraging him to kill town is stupid (which is exactly what would happen if we do what you all seem to think the synth is for).

Metal town are unkillable by one set of scum and exclusively killable by another one. That's not terribly positive utility. If we synthed town for a couple days, then we've caused the ravager to become a vig that can only hit scum. That would be one good use for the synth.

Now I was just suggesting something else which is also a good idea: use the synth as a soft-investigate. I really don't understand why this idea is meeting resistance.

Coming across this post made me wonder about only one nightkill both nights. Obviously Titus didn't kill herself and if there were a serial killer, why no night two kill. I mean I suppose they could have both shot muffin and Titus' team hit metal, maybe muffin, night one?

Anyway is it possible we have two scum teams and they have varied kills? I think that might be a stupid idea as the game would potentially go on too long, but.

[Trustworthy]

The way zMuffinman is campaigning for serum makes me think he just doesn't want synth.

[Trustworthy]

Ffery - I'm going to really try to get through day one tonight, but I really doubt I'm actually going to reread the entire game. But, day one you seemed very meh on Chandra. You thought that some of his early posts had a smugness you associated with Ceph!scum and thought in tone he had a kind of mouse playing with his prey type feel. I don't think you ever ended up voting him on day one as his wagon grew (if you do I haven't gotten to that point), but today you've said that you don't really see signs of Ceph!scum.

Are you reading him as town? And if so, or not if so, what about his play changed to go from what I'm gathering was a more null read on day one? If there is anything or is he still a null read you don't feel confident in lynching?

[Trustworthy]

Oh and Pie - There are two points I want to elaborate on about your chandra case. I don't want to forget this, and probably won't, but I'm now drinking wine again while catching up and have actual work I need to do while reading so I could, but.

Titus defending Chandra as being a reason for why you're scum reading him isn't all that strong. Titus was defending Chandra, not only from you but from everyone, but she was also defending Mastin and Mhork pretty strongly as well. (She also defended me but I wasn't so much getting attacked, and she was creating that connection between us, so with me it's not that strong a comparison.)

And I'm not sure it's fair to look at the day one wagons in the context of Ludi being the scum designated mislynch. The only person who was a major wagon on day one was ABR, and that could have been the scum designated mislynch. Sure, it could have been either. But Titus, the only known scum we have, certainly pushed rather hard to get ABR lynched. Also, and what sparked this super fun reread adventure today was me looking at your vca and looking at the vote counts as they were. The thing is that SKOT, Pander Bears, Ludi, Titus, Chandra and ABR were all pretty relevant wagons the entire day. The Chandra wagon was started by Falcon and then he got cold feet and jumped off and then eventually moved to Ludi (whose wagon I was championing by the way). I'm just getting to the part in my reread where Falcon does get off the Chandra wagon and things start to go elsewhere so maybe I'll have some better insight in a little bit.

~~~

Oh also, I still do believe that scum have fake claims but I think that my thought on that where I said since she called herself BN meant she knew I was a blink moth nexus is weaker than I thought at the time. The Hive is that we know that there is at least on other blink moth out there. She, or her team, could have easily looked that up or if there's someone on her team with magic knowledge it could have easily been discussed.

[Trustworthy]

Yeah, that's how I feel about Chandra too actually.

I just went and looked at NY169 because earlier when DV kinda chided Ceph about town reading me from my post to you early day one, he said that he'd yet to have his first impulse about me hadn't been wrong, I remember that being pretty spot on in Hard Boiled, but not so much in NY 169. But I just went and looked and he didn't like my first post there, just as he didn't like shadower's impression of me here, but town read me when I got frustrated with Maraca there.

I thought Muffin had Chandra as scum though?

[Trustworthy]

his play doesn't seem as *smooth* as in Tales

I think there are pretty distinct differences between actually flustered me and fake flustered me, and most of my emotions tend to be fake when I'm scum. The fact that I'm not scum-with-daychat should at the very least be quite apparent, as having a scum QT to complain in is theraputic for me and probably contributed to this. No idea what Nati tends to do re: daychat though.

This bothers me. Nati has the day chat thing in the rules, and i'm pretty sure it's been mentioned in this game already. (that would require me to actually re re-read for that specifically and engggggg, but I think it's already been mentioned.)

[Trustworthy]

Ludi was a player most of the playerlist considered scummy, but nobody was voting for him.

Then came the Chandra wagon that fizzled and ludi came as a counter-wagon to that. He is either town and the scum are forcing a mislynch on him to save you or he is scum and the whole team is bussing him because you have some sort of god role and they don't want you to die.

Either way a lynch on you is best.

You know what worries me?

Pies not the first person to come up with this argument, yet he's presenting it as his own.

~~~

Also some posts back, Titus mentioned a 3-person scum team, which would be weird. Makes me wonder if we are dealing with multiball after all.

[Trustworthy]

Chandra's identity isn't hard to figure out, but what can be made of knowing Chandra's identity is where the challenge lies; I don't know how much of my love/hate relationship with Chandra is off of the main and off of the alt, since the two do have differing styles. (Which is, ironically, basically exactly what Chandra says. Baseline exists, using it might end badly.)

Chandra's an alt? Aww fuck...now that adds bias interpretations to the posts that I won't see...

Kind of wondering here why Titus isn't asking who Chandra is.

Skot and tattletale were revealed as alts, but slots main was revealed. Titus did not have the same reaction to them being revealed as alts.

Not sure what to make of that.

[Trustworthy]

dunno

i don't really see the issue with (a) apart from the fact it deprives town of a day phase at the cost of 100% confirming someone is scum (which is potentially good or really, really bad for scum depending on who they target at night because, you know, town would theoretically have metal players, too), though this reminds me that i'm not all that concerned with whether a synth vote actually goes through today

and there could very well be a breaking strategy with metal claims. though i don't know how that would work

also doesn't seem all that relevant to think about at this point in time

i am just telling you what nati's answer was

Someone said we can't know if muffin did suggest metal claims to ffery, but this tells me that it was definitely possible as something was in the works with him day one.

[Trustworthy]

When the Chandra wagon collapsed on day one it dispersed mostly to ludi (read his posts during the rise it's not surprising it did), dispersed somewhat equally onto massive and ABR, then preferencing abr with pander and ludi about equal until pander and abr become the main contenders.

Pander moves from massive to abr putting him at l-2 and making abr the most likely lynch day one.

[Trustworthy]

Post 2325 is a good picture of near end of day wagons.

[Trustworthy]

Okay so remember how Chandra was like oh if Mastin and I were scum together we'd pretend to be paranoid of each other? that is pretty close to how he behaved with Mhork. Now he expected Mhork to town read him (ftr he expressed this in a non-manipulative tone which he has displayed when expecting Nacho to town read him when he's been scum.) But it did take him a long time to actually read Mhork. I'm not sure what this means, but it's something I noticed as feeling kinda meng.

I just don't have any great town reads this game that I feel wonderful about and I'm not even going to tell anyone who my possible town reads are because close to the chest.

But, I'd love to take Mhork's town read of Chandra at face value but even he has disappeared from the planet. I could vote for chandra, i guess, Shadoweh is scum reading her. I just really would like her to be town, unless we lynch her then I was a correct lynch and for Chandra to just laugh about being able to manipulate me. ANYWAY, I have seen a wagon stall on town this many days in a row before. And I mean it's not like people can actually say "oh scum made that wagon fizzle" because Falcon is the one who jumped off and helped that wagon stall day one and noone is scum reading him. muffin also helped to start a massive wagon and wasn't pushing for a chandra wagon at the end of day, even though he in theory was still pushing it. Day two muffin was reading mastin as scum and pushing that and everyone sheeped that, so it's really hard to divine how the day would have gone regardless.

I'm of the mind to just accept this lynch though because I have seen town wagons stall several days in a row. I think I replaced into a slot that held that status a couple years ago. But, I feel like this is going to be an argument that could continue indefinitely and we could end up lynching him in LyLo for a scum win if he's town. I guess one way we could maybe get around that is if Antihero investigated him and he came back town? That would mean putting Chandra off until tomorrow.

The thing with Chandra is have you noticed the level of omgus? He pushed muffin as scum when muffin was pushing him. He's doing the same with pie guy today. It almost feels like he's getting frustrated with being scum read and is lashing out and calling most people who scum read him as scum. IDK.

What I do know is I really need to do something else as I've just read the entire first day of this game and haven't done any of the work I've needed to do so I need to do that.

But I feel like I could vote Chandra (out of pure utility because I don't think it's going to stop being a thing unless there's confirmation), Pander Bears (they just feel ennnnggggggg. This is another one I hate to scum read but I don't feel great about), Massive (though every time he posts I feel better about him, but worry he's third party); there are others I could vote for but I'm holding on to this because I don't want any narrowing down of what I'm going to do.

OH but apparently scum don't have a role blocker OR we've serum'd scum the past two days. But seriously, they couldn't be sure what the roles were that we serum'd and they decided not to kill the people we made prs?

WE serum'd antihero day one (at scum's demand) and then Ludi day two. Ludi claimed that he thought that his role was better than a flavor cop. Neither of these two were touched, unless they're metal and Ludi claimed to not be metal. So, why weren't they killed? This strikes me as odd.

[Trustworthy]

Chandra's identity isn't hard to figure out, but what can be made of knowing Chandra's identity is where the challenge lies; I don't know how much of my love/hate relationship with Chandra is off of the main and off of the alt, since the two do have differing styles. (Which is, ironically, basically exactly what Chandra says. Baseline exists, using it might end badly.)

Chandra's an alt? Aww fuck...now that adds bias interpretations to the posts that I won't see...

Kind of wondering here why Titus isn't asking who Chandra is.

Since I can address this quickly. I'd have thought she already knew, on account of me having alt slipped in multiple games with her so I don't even know why that was ever a surprise.

Why didn't you point it out at the time?

[Trustworthy]

Yeah, that's how I feel about Chandra too actually.

I just went and looked at NY169 because earlier when DV kinda chided Ceph about town reading me from my post to you early day one, he said that he'd yet to have his first impulse about me hadn't been wrong, I remember that being pretty spot on in Hard Boiled, but not so much in NY 169. But I just went and looked and he didn't like my first post there, just as he didn't like shadower's impression of me here, but town read me when I got frustrated with Maraca there.

I thought Muffin had Chandra as scum though?

He had Mastin, tattletale and skot as scum with chandra somewhere above that grouping. I don't think he even mentioned chandra in the neighborhood. I'll check tonight. IIRC skot was a maybe. That's why I voted tattletale out of the chute today. But I dunno. I like some of tattletale's posting today. Still thinking about it.

He didn't talk about his suspects after mastin flipped town?

[Trustworthy]

Also, tammy: can you explain your massive read?

Not in a way that makes sense probably. When I'm away from my computer and thinking about the game massive is a name that routinely pops up in my head as someone who would fit as scum. But then when I read a post from him I go eh maybe not. I have no idea on the maybe not though or the whys.

[Trustworthy]

Falcon - on iPad so not quoting post.

Regarding skot - no real markers. Well my msrker was if he's town he stays in the game and argues and if scum finds a reason to replace out >_>. He didn't replace out of revolution though. His stubbornness and arguing early day one was what I remembered from chef mafia and it's what had me leaning town. And then I read some of his posts in revolution where his tone over the random.org rvs vote suspicion read differently and that had me leaning town. But then he's checked out and does nearly nothing at all, so I'm back to being worried about him.

I don't remember saying ffery is an easy person for scum to attack? I just don't think she would be someone scum would be afraid to attack and that was in response to thinking the scum team were making it a point of avoiding her. My thinking on that is that Titus was clearly going after muffin, but in reading through day one he did say no scum team would have the balls to scum read him. Maybe she took that as a challenge? Perhaps scum don't want to go after her, and that would tell us something of the make up of the scum team. It still is gnawing at the back of my mind that Titus suggested I serum either you or pixel day one.

[Trustworthy]

You did, but he, like Titus, made a push against muffin.

I might not make sense tonight.

Who is the he you're talking about?

I forgot to answer this yesterday.

The he is antihero there, but I think my paranoia might be calming there, and I'm not even sure the original point made any sense anyway :p

[Trustworthy]

The wagon stalling point is anti's

[Trustworthy]

No it was the counter wagon point. I don't actually feel that strongly about that, it was just something I felt in that moment.

Muffins vote counts in Post 1689 and Post 1772 are the wagons I was looking at. As they show the rise of a pander bears wagon in the midst of all that.

[Trustworthy]

No it was the counter wagon point. I don't actually feel that strongly about that, it was just something I felt in that moment.

Muffins vote counts in Post 1689 and Post 1772 are the wagons I was looking at. As they show the rise of a pander bears wagon in the midst of all that.

[Trustworthy]

Omg I actually looked at wagons. I almost never do that.

[Trustworthy]

It didn't spring out of nowhere though. Ludi had been an early wagon on day one. The burgeoning Ludi wagon had collapsed early on and was reboosted. It might not have even reached the height that it did had it not been for Ludi's posts at that time which caused it to rise. Any of the wagons that were building had a chance to build during that time, but then Ludi started posting posts that made people want to wagon him. He got up to like 8 votes I think, and then he started posting relevant townish sounding posts which helped his wagon collapse and then it became between Pander Bears and ABR with a possibility of Chandra as a cherry on top.

I mean most of it doesn't matter as Chandra is getting lynched today and then we'll see, but only looking at the wagons and not what was going on in the thread leaves out a good deal of the picture, especially considering how long we went without a vote count. Yours, for instance, doesn't take into account the rise of the Pander Bears wagon, or does it maybe I'm misremembering and I'm about out of time for what I can do with mafia today, so this point if there even is one is moot.

pedit: at pie

pedit 2: oh

[Trustworthy]

Falcon - on iPad so not quoting post.

Regarding skot - no real markers. Well my msrker was if he's town he stays in the game and argues and if scum finds a reason to replace out >_>. He didn't replace out of revolution though. His stubbornness and arguing early day one was what I remembered from chef mafia and it's what had me leaning town. And then I read some of his posts in revolution where his tone over the random.org rvs vote suspicion read differently and that had me leaning town. But then he's checked out and does nearly nothing at all, so I'm back to being worried about him.

I don't remember saying ffery is an easy person for scum to attack? I just don't think she would be someone scum would be afraid to attack and that was in response to thinking the scum team were making it a point of avoiding her. My thinking on that is that Titus was clearly going after muffin, but in reading through day one he did say no scum team would have the balls to scum read him. Maybe she took that as a challenge? Perhaps scum don't want to go after her, and that would tell us something of the make up of the scum team. It still is gnawing at the back of my mind that Titus suggested I serum either you

or pixel

day one.

I don't remember this happening.

I would have discouraged being serumed on day 1 if it looked like something that might happen. Kaze thought our serum ability would have something to do with dead players.

That was part of what we discussed on day two. And I'm guessing the monitor means you. Titus was trying to give me tips for who to serum and not to serum. She didn't want us to serum muffin. (Funnily enough, mid day two as soon as the wagon moved away from publicly seruming muffin we sent in our choice to give it to muffin.) It did take me a while to realize that the baker man was muffin though. Anyway she didn't want it there, and when she asked if we had decided who to be kind to (giver serum to), I kept saying shadowed and I were discussing it. (We were discussing it but kept decided to leave it on muffin.) Then she said to dress up or be kind to either the plane or the monitor. The plane is easy - that's falcon. I think you are the monitor.

[Trustworthy]

*mid day one

[Trustworthy]

Prod dodge.

Shadoweh is already on vacation, and I will be joining her Thursday. I will do my best to do something with this game tomorrow.

[Trustworthy]

mod - both heads of this hydra are v/la until Tuesday the 26th. Shadow eh head will remain v/la until September 2nd...I think

Shadow eh is lucky and I don't think her plane is delayed, but mine is! Once I get situated and do a couple things I'll try to catch up here but my thoughts really haven't changed.

I think the place we'll be at won't have wifi, so any posts from us will be either caffeinated posts or drunken/hungover phone posts. Though I'm sure shadow eh hasn't read much as she's been busy getting ready for vacation. Regardless you shouldn't expect bunches from me. HOWEVER I did get some tales of flashbacks from dv's latest post.

[Trustworthy]

Yeah yeah you can stop copying me with the I have thoughts but I'm not sharing Nya Nya

Flight delays suck!

serum falcon

I don't know who we're going to vote though. Maybe I a couple hours I ca. Trick shadow eh into telling me, but I know she'll say Chandra and it's not something I feel super great about, so!

[Trustworthy]

Shadoweh said you all suck like a fireball

I have no idea what that means.

[Trustworthy]

Tammy thinks we should vote for pander bears but shadoweh probably actually talked to me more before we were in the same space together.

[Trustworthy]

What that mans is Tammy is the only one playing

[Trustworthy]

Ffery where are you leaning?

[Trustworthy]

I liked it for the most part. I'm not as sure on Pv or VEZOK as he seems to be.

I haven't liked either skot or pander, but skits posts where basically says we're all dumb give me doubts. But I don't know how strong to take that into account especially when he is doing nearly nothing so. He's not someone I'd miss though.

I don't have good feelings about pander though.

[Trustworthy]

I talked to her for a sec before she went to the store. Her thought was that skot will be an easy lynch whenever whereas pander will be more difficult. Not exactly sure where she was going there but she didn't seem to mind if we voted either.

[Trustworthy]

Also if skot is scum I'm eve more confirmed town ~

[Trustworthy]

You're already conftown you butt, now what do you think of the wall I just posted

Drink and at a meet ill rad wall later

[Trustworthy]

I'm here and will be here until deadline. I need to read through the things from this weekend as the only time I did read was while drinking I think. Anyway, don't expect a whole bunch from me as I've barely slept since Thursday. Yesterday in the airport I was barely able to form complete sentences when talking to Faraday, and I'm no better today. Shadoweh is still in Miami, so you won't hear anything from her.

Anyway that's kind of me just whining about how tired I am and my head is in a complete fog.

One thing I do remember and meant to mention the last time I posted was that I don't like the way Pander is going after Falcon. It feels way too much like the way he all of a sudden changed his read on Falcon in Tales. It's not that he's suspecting him, but the way he's doing it comes off a bit oily.

IDK

[Trustworthy]

One thing I do remember and meant to mention the last time I posted was that I don't like the way Pander is going after Falcon. It feels way too much like the way he all of a sudden changed his read on Falcon in Tales. It's not that he's suspecting him, but the way he's doing it comes off a bit oily.

Wasn't that me?

You suspect Falcon?

[Trustworthy]

If all of massive, skot, chandra and pander are town, something is seriously wrong with this game.

[Trustworthy]

I just looked at Revolution and the game you modded. In Revolution I noticed that missing from his play is insulting the game for suspecting him.

[Trustworthy]

I don't know that I have anything to say. I have some thoughts, but muddles and my brain's been replaced by cotton bals. I just want to go to sleep.

[Trustworthy]

I fell asleep. I do t think I missed deadline though.

[Trustworthy]

Right. BaxCk to sleep then.

[Trustworthy]

I didn't take any pictures.

[Trustworthy]

Falcon - Yesterday while looking at something I noticed you were in the Star Wars game that Mhork was saying was so similar that ABR was more likely scum. Why didn't you interact with him about that?

I'm confused about Majiffy's flip (and kill). He flipped Sunblast Angel. Wouldn't that make him the person who shot at Titus night one? But then he wanted to be serumed night two and said that he was a tracker who tracked Mhork to nowhere. Help.

Also, my activity might be a little spotty until Sunday. I'm getting ready to pick my mom up from the airport as she's coming in for my birthday.

Also also, I should have stuck to my guns on my interaction analysis which made it more likely that Pander was innocent, but what can you do. Can some people tone down their I'M RIGHT I'M RIGHT DO WHAT I SAY RAWR and try to figure out how to work with their town reads today? That would be awesomesauce.

[Trustworthy]

Hmm.

[Trustworthy]

He flipped Sunblast Angel. Wouldn't that make him the person who shot at Titus night one? But then he wanted to be serumed night two and said that he was a tracker who tracked Mhork to nowhere. Help.

Hmph.

Lying to get another vig shot?

:/

That doesn't make sense. I didn't give him serum night one, so if he is the person who took out Titus, he either got serum from someone else or didn't need it.

But then he specifically asked for it day two and we voted to give it to him. He claimed that he was a tracker who tracked Mhork to nowhere.

So, yeah, I'm confused.

[Trustworthy]

What I'm trying to figure out is if it says anything about Mhork?

[Trustworthy]

I thought lord mhork was mafia, reasonably town viewed by some, perfect person to go make the kill.

Given the rest of my role, the fact that that part of my serum ability was only tracking was a little underwhelming.

Okay probably a JoaT then.

He is still pushing for a mass metal claim, which he started thinking about the previous day.

So, he either didn't need serum day one or there is another one who gave some to him.

Oh also in a previous post, he said that he totally missed Mastin's claim of another killing role and wish he'd seen it.

[Trustworthy]

My conclusion is that scum probably failed to kill you night 1.

night 1 delay tooooooooo night 3?

[does not compute]

Actually if you are town it makes sense. It's been bugging the hell out of me that scum wanted you serum'd day one over muffin, didn't know what your ability was and left you alive. Then when you could have potentially been serum'd night two as they couldn't have known who I'd give it to, left you alive again night two. This is part of what has left me not quite town reading you.

[Trustworthy]

Pie - I'm going to ask you to do me and this game a super duper big favor. Stop. Just stop. You are confirmation biasing, and everything is giving you more evidence for Chandra being scum. There is the possibility that all four wagons on day one were on town, and you're not accounting for that. Your premises are flawed, which is not leading you to a solid conclusion. Maybe you're right and Chandra is scum, but the arguments you're using aren't helping, because there's nothing really solid that can definitively prove that everyone else was a town wagon to Chadra's scum wagon. How many scum do you actually think there are in this game, because from the way you're arguing it sounds like you believe that scum outweigh town in this game and are the driving factor behind everything, when it could just be shit town with shit reads and loud people shouting down what they want and being unwilling to work with the town.

Your arguments aren't convincing me, and judging from the way that Chandra hasn't gotten lynched, they're not doing a whole lot to convince town either.

I can tell you what is happening though. I for one am glazing over your arguments because the nitpickiness has gotten largely out of control. Posts like 4144 do absolutely nothing to prove your case because what you're saying he means and what I'm taking away from it are two separate things. You might be right, maybe Chandra is scum, but he's not the only one if he is. Constantly attacking him and doing absolutely nothing else isn't helping. It's breeding an environment where he just keeps coming in and arguing with you, so please stop yelling about it. You're not the only one playing this game. Some of our ideas aren't actually shit ideas, and maybe just maybe if you'd be willing to listen and work with someone else, you'd find a more receptive audience.

Your probably town. I had occasion to skim a recent scum game of yours, and it reads rather different, but please try to figure out a way to actually work with people you think are town.

[Trustworthy]

gods SKOT's an irritating "player"

anyway there's something i want to think about. I expect this will take me rolling it around in my head for a bit until I make any sense of it, if at all.

[Trustworthy]

I think DV is rapidly running out of defenders.

If we lynch SKOT today, I will concede tomorrow.

Something bugged me about this post.

[Trustworthy]

I mean you're right all those things are lacking from SKOT's "play" this game. Like SKOT's "play" has been horrendous, and his level of calling town idiots for daring to suspect him when he's acting scummy as all get out is ridiculous. I'm having some problems matching up his play with his recent scum games though.

I'm going to sleep, but what I do want to sleep on and try to figure out is how things work out. No scum kill night one, take out muffin night two (after he had been pushing Mastin all of day two, maybe there was a fear he'd get on the right track after?), kill Majiffy night three (qua? who would kill Majiffy especially when he's not really doing a whole lot?) and synth Antihero and give the metal to Mhork?

Who benefits from that? Do we have a scum team that is just chaotic and going all willy nilly? I feel like there should be something there, and I need to figure out what. (Not gonna lie, my paranoid thoughts are trending towards Antihero and Mhork being on a team together and they had their scum synther do this as part of wink wink nudge nudge we're not partners aren't we clever?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!) But, there was no kill night one, so it does stand to reason that they tried with Antihero. Still something I'm going to sleep on and see if I can work out in any way.

[Trustworthy]

Muffin was confirmed town, forgot about that.

[Trustworthy]

Mhork is probably scum actually.