The Walking Dead Season 1 Finale (GAME OVER)

[farside22]

farside22 replaces Iprobablysuck

HI!!
*waves*

[farside22]

I'm going to do this a bit different.
Mostly ask questions and put a list together.


Mollie: why is it scummy that Krio doesn't know how many games he's been scum?
Peregrine what are your current reads and why?


Town
myotherheadisscum
Catdog
Young/witless
Moi

Leaning town:
Beeboy
hebichan
Maverick
TD

Null
Peregrine
Sircakes
Bbt
Mollie


Scum

max
Kurbio

Stop on page 12
Bbt tunneling seems off to me.
Mollies question to Kurio was out of the blue and I haven't seen her question others.
Max from what I recall is very obviously town and I've seen nothing that reads town thus far.

[farside22]

@Farside: Can you clarify your Maxous read? I think I understand it but I want to be sure.

Let me finish my read and I will explain things a bit better.

[farside22]

Continuing:

before I out my role, some pple might want to save themselves the embarrassment and unvote me

What kind of scum garbage softclaim is that, mollie only has 3 votes and she's freaking out

Meh that's pretty typical of mollie regardless.

before I out my role, some pple might want to save themselves the embarrassment and unvote me

What kind of scum garbage softclaim is that, mollie only has 3 votes and she's freaking out

Why did you unvote him then?
In a Peregrive related meta note, Ive seen him active as scum so he stays null for me.

That's a post.

The next person who Townreads beeboy gets Dayvigged ...

OH ME!
ME!

Ok so, I have town reads on BBT and MoI.

The way BBT questioned YAW's town read on him, and the way he continued to follow up on it makes me think he is town. Plus, post 162 is the kind of blatantly flippant post that I tend to town read.

I agree with his "willing to lynch" philosophy in respect to MoI in post 268, but even if I didn't, I'd still think it was coming more from a town mindset.

I am also leaning slightly town on Kuroi, based on our interaction earlier. It was weird. Almost too weird to have been faked.

My only real scum read is YAW right now, but I could see me supporting a Mollie lynch, for the ridiculous soft claim.

Everyone else is pretty much null for me.

Why is Yaw a scum read?

Funny enough I see Kurbio twisting what Hebichan is saying many times over. Don't think it's weird at all, just meant to make hebichan look bad.

Magna town
beeboy still town
Kuroi still town
Cakez still town

i dont like hebichan's reaction to Kuroi
i dont like mollie

Why.


@Max is there a reason that vague reads are okay to do from others

Maverick http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 2#p8216572 why do you want to join the YAW wagon?
Someone town reading Max needs to explain that town read.

Oh, forgot about Maxous. He's probably town.

@Farside: Can you clarify your Maxous read? I think I understand it but I want to be sure.

How is it different than any other kuroi approach

As much as I hate this line of thinking, I'll have to agree. Ankamius, I'm not going to tell you to unvote me, but I'd highly recommend you to read some of my town games and review it, since you haven't played a full game with me before.

Mass Effect Mafia is the first town game to come to mind that isn't ongoing.

I'm soooooo happy you have time to defend yourself and not doing anything further since you came back into the game and said your caught up.

being difficult to work with is a scumtell?

this whole case is weak

Holy crap I agree with Wisdom.
*fears for life, calls hell*


Town
myotherheadisscum
Catdog
Young/witless
Moi
TD
Mollie

Leaning town:
Beeboy (now replaced by Anka) Anka, your entry in this game makes me sadface.
xkf
Bbt
Peregrine

Null
hebichan
Wisdom
Maverick
Sircakes (moved from null to scum) list is awful even for him A player that barely interacts looks more townish then a player who is actively trying to figure the game out. Hell even the players that were active aren't even mentioned. I call BS on that.

Leaning Scum:

DGB

Scum

max
Kurio (sorry my phone auto corrects things a lot.)


On a side note rant

Spoiler:

the player i replaced makes me wish I didn't replace him. God I hate players like that on a personal level when they are town.

I keep going back and forth with Hebichan. She is weird one for me to figure out.
Next will be why I'm scum reading Max here other then meta reason.

[farside22]

So Max i noticed all game long is pretty disengaged playing.

Here he says he would join the HC wagon but the only comment he has in regards to her.

HC wagon has my seal of approval.

Was this.

You should read the exchange between YAW and myself where they both state a town read on SC and then fail in being able to justify it.

That is really weird. I missed it before honestly, because townreads are townreads but cakez hasn't been the best player today. At the same time, I haven't been able to see many people justify a townread on Kuroi either, but that is more on them than kuroi... maybe I'm tunneling too hard here...

They are voting on me I guess? I think they made an okay reason there though. If they are scum though, they could easily be trying to hide a cakez scum.
They
UNVOTE:

VOTE: Young and Witless

i'm starting to understand the HC scum-reads now

I have no clue why he thought IPS was random voting to hop on catdog where the quote i show

Nope my Daycop says othewise

then you need to ask for a refund

-

i am gonna vote here though

vote: Iprobablysuck

i didn't like his post #11 where he used a random vote justification to hop on the catdog wagon.
if you want to hop on an early wagon, fine just hop on it.
if you want to random vote somebody, fine.

but using the random vote to coincidentally jump on the catdog wagon was excessive and comes across as scum wanting to bandwagon but not wanting to be called out for it.

Here we go

VOTE: Catdog

Angry Beavers was better

reads as a joke and I find it is a big stretch to boot.

Okay, you ATE as town then. I guess that is more factually accurate. Regardless, I have personally mislynched you because of your ATEing.

When I feel like it's tactical, it's scummy.
When I feel like it's sincere, it can make people a townread.

However, it almost always feels tactical- like now

.

can you give me an example?
i'm a bit confused by this

-

regarding SC, I get why people are voting him but i'm not overly convinced. we'll see.

young & witless might be scum white knighting SirCakez

I would like to say more but honestly, too many of this game are very null to me here.

I think IPS or YAW are the most likely scum as of now.

As for town-reads, I like what BBT is doing. Vedith/FB hydra feels like town.

That's.. pretty much it

oh sorry, catdog feels town-ish too

You think IPS is scum because of what you posted in post 34?

initially.

#113 showed he was reading the thread but didn't offer any thoughts as to what was going on.

and then he disappeared.

not saying it's an A+ case but yeah i think he's scummy

unvote, vote: Young and Witless

> The SC read isn't about your reasoning. Both your heads hard-defended SC and overly struggled to justify the read.
> What's the point of your questions to MOI?
> Why is Hebichan's interactions with Kuroi disgusting? That's vague and unconvincing

Above you can see where he talk about another wagon he could see himself joining and then the final one where a wagon is going on he comes up with weak reason's to join the wagon on YAW.
He has little reads and even less interaction and shows no desire to try to figure anyone out thus far.

Vote: Maxous

[farside22]

Sircakes (moved from null to scum) list is awful even for him A player that barely interacts looks more townish then a player who is actively trying to figure the game out. Hell even the players that were active aren't even mentioned. I call BS on that.

Why am I in null if you moved me to scum?

Moved to scum during that point, then back to null just left my note during the read there.

Funny enough I see Kurbio twisting what Hebichan is saying many times over. Don't think it's weird at all, just meant to make hebichan look bad.

neh that's just typical kuroi being kuroi

He's typically defensive and twisting things so he looks better.....

[farside22]

I'll catch up on this later, only had a skim.

Farside's reads are pretty bad though. She could be scum.

Says the player holding onto a scum read from about page 5.

Sure thing bub.

[farside22]

Yeah.

With valid reason.

So what?

Things have progressed since then and you don't seem to give 2 shots and keep the same thing over and over and over again.
No progress = not trying to figure a player out.

@farside

:

You should read the exchange between YAW and myself where they both state a town read on SC and then fail in being able to justify it.

That is really weird. I missed it before honestly, because townreads are townreads but cakez hasn't been the best player today. At the same time, I haven't been able to see many people justify a townread on Kuroi either, but that is more on them than kuroi... maybe I'm tunneling too hard here...

They are voting on me I guess? I think they made an okay reason there though. If they are scum though, they could easily be trying to hide a cakez scum.
They
UNVOTE:

VOTE: Young and Witless

i'm starting to understand the HC scum-reads now

right.
I highlighted Hebichan's vote here.
where she is voting YAW because they mght be scum defending SirCakez as scum, even though SC is unflipped and she is not voting SC even though she's apparently so sure he's scum that she is voting YAW based on a possible associate.
do you NOT find this vote bad or something?
why are you confused that I would scum-read her for this?

Above you can see where he talk about another wagon he could see himself joining and then the final one where a wagon is going on he comes up with weak reason's to join the wagon on YAW.

i don't agree the reasons are weak.
In my view, YAW is playing stereotypical scum and BOTH heads are scummy.

So your voting YAW and think she is scum voting YAW too then?
Because currently instead of voting and pushing her you joined the bw on YAW instead.

[farside22]

entirely possible, sure.
also, i am genuinely asking for your opinion regarding hebi's vote in #451

p-edit: @farside

I'm phone posting so I'm not sure which post your referring to but my recollection of her votes is where I start going back and forth on her.
Gtg but I'll check on this more later

[farside22]

Farside, all I wanted was for you to clarify your read on Maxous in your original post since you said he was town, but didn't do anything town. It's a typo that can go either way.

This?

Max from what I recall is very obviously town and I've seen nothing that reads town thus far.
Accepting pre/in for bad

I'm saying is a meta reference, ie he comes off obvious town in games I've played with him but not this game.

[farside22]

and yaye, I think far is town! I think ank might be too.

@ far - I think bbt is town. can you plz look at wis and yaw. what do you think of magna? a lot of my read on max is based off of magna and his interactions and I have magna as town. magna has been in the unsure pile.

I made a nice list.
It has my reads.
You want in depth reason?

[farside22]

and yaye, I think far is town! I think ank might be too.

@ far - I think bbt is town. can you plz look at wis and yaw. what do you think of magna? a lot of my read on max is based off of magna and his interactions and I have magna as town. magna has been in the unsure pile.

I made a nice list.
It has my reads.
You want in depth reason?

yes.

Can you explain your town read on bbt?

[farside22]

and yaye, I think far is town! I think ank might be too.

@ far - I think bbt is town. can you plz look at wis and yaw. what do you think of magna? a lot of my read on max is based off of magna and his interactions and I have magna as town. magna has been in the unsure pile.

I made a nice list.
It has my reads.
You want in depth reason?

yes.

Can you explain your town read on bbt?

it is a weak read but it is all I had to go on at the time. he said some things that resonated and I still like him for town.

are you going to make me give this read up? you are going to make me give it up aren't you

He's been a null read most of the game for me. I've seen him be pretty low posting as scum and town and most of his push is on YAW.

As or YAW, I just see a guy trying to figure the game out.
There is a lot of pressure on him and he seems to be giving reads regardless of what players are saying about him. He's not defensive and instead you have questioning here, I found his point on hebichan something I felt when I was reading her too.
here he is more indepth about why he's scum reading the player Basically in short I see more thoughts from him then defensiveness.

Also I don't see why Wisdom is scum, I'd like you to explain, other then the fact that he isn't posting much what reads scummy to you.
I noted when I reread your post Mollie that some of your reasoning was meta releated in regards to YAW and Wisdom. I'm curious what your experience with DGB is?

*shuffles list a round a bit mentally*

[farside22]

I need someone who is sane to talk to me and something I noted.
I tend to get a bit tunnelling on things and reread and note things and wonder if I'm going crazy.

[farside22]

SirCakez is town for trying hard to bring progress to the game.

Where are the other 16 players damn

I can give some examples, like this. I am impatient like this when it comes to scum hunting.

You can also ISO SirCakez for full resolution. It's not fake, it's someone wanting activity.

There was also other things he brought up about sc during the game.
Just saying.

[farside22]

He literally asked where the other players were.

That's not trying hard to bring progress to the game.

He explained that.

Like, how is wanting activity alignment indicative? Nevermind a town tell.

Do you know the number of times I've seen players town read someone off an RVS post?
Do I think they are scum? Do I think that comes from town? No. Both alignments do that.
Do I agree with YAW logic? no. I had sc as null for most of the game.
At the time he called sc town, SC had maybe 3 votes and you called it wking.
Do I agree with that? No.
The point is that what some players think is a town quality about 75% is null to me. I'm cynical and salty over the years of playing this game.
You want to expand on a scum read beyond giving players a town read based on bad reasoning, then you can explain to me why max isn't a scum read to you?
Or why dgb actively fucking lurks the game but the noob with foot in mouth is the only being called out on lurking.
You want to explain that to me? I'd love to hear it.
You want to keep hammering the same point repeatedly go find someone else.

[farside22]

It doesn't.

He could be scum WK'ing town or he could be scum defending a buddy.

Okay then.

Maxous is town. He said so in his first post.

DGB is hard to read D1. I'd rather someone vig/investigate her. If not, I'll try to read her later in the game if we're both alive.

That's pretty null.
Did you look up if they have a history together?

[farside22]

FYI it's null because I've said that as scum about players too, just an fyi.

[farside22]

SirCakez is probtown.

VOTE: TiphaineDeath

Also bbt, he said this on post 147, if you are going to sit there and say a lynch could have happened at this point in a large game I'm going to call you a liar.

[farside22]

You should put your vote on a major wagon Farside.

Sure, I can do that.

Vote: hebichan

Okay then. Don't know whether you're agreeing with me or not?

I don't particularly care for meta.

I think your reason for town reading him is weak.

[farside22]

If you say you have never seen a quicklynch in a large game, I too, will also call you a liar.

Only when I'm scum baby.
And only once.
I don't get away with it, players expect better from me.

[farside22]

If we lynch YAW and they flip scum, you know you're getting lynched next, right?

Nope.

[farside22]

We could compare hebichan play vs YAW play if you like.

[farside22]

I'm leaning town on mollie (though I've never seen her scumgame, so I'm a bit paranoid).

Wisdom feels slightly off to me too after I tried searching out the YAW case, but I don't think the weird feeling I got from his posts are worth pursuing unless they keep continuing as such.

What posts gave you a weird feeling?
-smart

These are the ones I'm weirded out by:

How is it different than any other kuroi approach

being difficult to work with is a scumtell?

this whole case is weak

why are you confused that I would scum-read her for this?

you're not voting her though

Why are you weirded out by them.

[farside22]

why AREN'T you weirded out by them, far? this is weaksauce from wis, you have to know this.

They aren't strong and aggressive points, but he has a point.
For example, when max ask wisdom about the scum read, he points out that max isn't even voting her.
Pointing out a weak case that someone made, none of that is weird.

Now I explained more indepth what I noted, why is that weaksauce exactly?

[farside22]

That's not actually the reason I'm weirded out by him, mollie. It's more that those specific posts give me the impression that he's trying to shape the game instead of solve it.

[farside22]

Hi farside

You're cute and all but your going to have to explain how those 3 questions = what you just stated.

[farside22]

why AREN'T you weirded out by them, far? this is weaksauce from wis, you have to know this.

They aren't strong and aggressive points,

but he has a point.

For example, when max ask wisdom about the scum read, he points out that max isn't even voting her.
Pointing out a weak case that someone made, none of that is weird.

Now I explained more indepth what I noted, why is that weaksauce exactly?

which point do you think he was making?

I explained in the paragraph you just quoted.

I admit that Wisdom is acting a bit strange, but if he things he has a solid read on YAW, isn't best he push it? A good deal of mafia is politics after all.

I don't know how he plays though, so I can't really say for certain.

This is a good example of why my vote is on hebichan.
Making some vague comment, positioning herself to go ahead and vote on the wagon whenever she wants.

[farside22]

I'm going to do this a bit different.
Mostly ask questions and put a list together.


Mollie: why is it scummy that Krio doesn't know how many games he's been scum?
Peregrine what are your current reads and why?


Town
myotherheadisscum
Catdog
Young/witless
Moi

Leaning town:
Beeboy
hebichan
Maverick
TD

Null
Peregrine
Sircakes
Bbt
Mollie


Scum

max
Kurbio

Stop on page 12
Bbt tunneling seems off to me.
Mollies question to Kurio was out of the blue and I haven't seen her question others.
Max from what I recall is very obviously town and I've seen nothing that reads town thus far.

Did I really leave that little of an impression on you that you don't even include me in your read list?

Yes.

Mollie, in your opinion, are you any good at faking frustration?

I know this isn't to me but I have seen mollie fake rage, I think women cake fake this gs better then men.

[farside22]

I like my scum read on Kurio still personally.
The gaps in logic are horriblely scummy.
I call what he just did cherry picking post to call it a scum read.
Awful.

Hebichan, here's what I don't get, why is YAW a scum read.
In your own words.
If you think max and mollie are scum too why no push to explain those scum reads?

[farside22]

The wallllllll it burrrrnnnnssssss!!!!!!!

Cries

[farside22]

VOTE: kuroi

Not feeling the hebichan lynch anymore

As much as I agree with you there, I don't see anyone else seeing him as scum.
I don't see anything hebichan did that's town.

[farside22]

Still not sold on YAW Wisdom?

Hypothetical question bbt, what will your reads be if your wrong.

[farside22]

Hypothetical question bbt, what will your reads be if your wrong.

I don't see the point in me answering this or even the point in you asking it.

You're tunneling on one player and thought of nothing else.
So I'm asking what your reads will be if you are wilting.
My point is for you to look beyond the tunnel.

[farside22]

Still not sold on YAW Wisdom?

stop tunneling

Pretty sure I'm not tunneling. And that made me genuinely laugh coming from you.

You're tunneling on one player and thought of nothing else.
So I'm asking what your reads will be if you are wilting.
My point is for you to look beyond the tunnel.

I'm trying to get one player lynched, certainly. But I'm nowhere near tunneling.

Yes you are.
You've literally pushed nothing but the YAW wagon as scum.
I see bbt is refusing to be rational, so when I get home tonight I'm going to push at all my scum reads tonight.

[farside22]

Still not sold on YAW Wisdom?

Hypothetical question bbt, what will your reads be if your wrong.

Said the pot to the kettle.

Not even in the same category.

Here, I'll even humor you for a moment.
What about Kurio was scummy when you voted him initially?
Follow up, why are you voting YAW now, when the case hasn't changed since way back on about page 5?

[farside22]

Maxous has been going back and forth on me and YAW for most of the game. Some of the time he says my wagon looks nicer and some times he feels like YAW is the best.
It genuinely feels like he's keeping his options open for towncred.

For those (yes, mainly DGB) who think the following thought process is from Town let's read carefully.

Hebi is asserting that Maxous is keeping his options open between YAR and Hebi for

TOWNCRED

.

I've capitalized and bolded the important word.

How, from a Town perspective, does Hebi expect that Max is keeping the option open between the two of them to get Towncred? By jumping to a hypoTown Hebi lynch? He's not going to get Towncred for that. From staying on a YAR lynch if Hebi's goes through? He's not going to get Town cred for that even if YAR is scum ... Max has been too passive and not pushing YAR hard.

The only way Max should be keeping his options open for Towncred is if Hebi is scum and Max can eventually shift from YAR to Hebi to help a successful scum lynch (bus or honest move either way this is the only scenario that makes sense).

Town Hebi should not have come up with that scenario and say Max is looking for Towncred. Scum Hebi on the other hand ...

I had max/hebichan scum team since I reread something funky.
Example was how max says he could vote hebichan but doesn't.
Mollie also is in this pile of association.
The interaction with mollie was awfyl

[farside22]

I really don't like Catdog vote at all, with no reason at all.

[farside22]

VOTE: hebichan

eh

So talk to me about your Hebi as scum read Catdog. Because a quick search of your posting this game comes up with only 1 mention of Hebi and it is this vote.

Mollie: moi pointed out here a very correct fact about catdog.

[farside22]

I thought about it and I'm not moving my vote

[farside22]

Any flavour Hebi?

She's a zombie.

Actually I wonder......I need to see what the final episode of season 1 had again.


Nope, nothing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TS-19

[farside22]

I find kurio to be doing surface level scum hunting, that include cherry picking post.
Catdog looks a lot less town on reread.
Max still has done nothing to impress me and finally mollie just feels off to me. Gut reading her as scum currently.
Finally you have hebichan, who in a nut shell made weird reason votes and lack of interaction to figure players out.

Examples:

before I out my role, some pple might want to save themselves the embarrassment and unvote me

What kind of scum garbage softclaim is that, mollie only has 3 votes and she's freaking out

Honestly willing to get some more pressure on this slot. Thought I also dont understand the sudden kuroi townreads, he hasn't done anything that impressive since I voted him.

He hasn't done anything that scummy either though.

VOTE: pirate mollie

This was after calling kurio scum or no reason stated.

You should read the exchange between YAW and myself where they both state a town read on SC and then fail in being able to justify it.

That is really weird. I missed it before honestly, because townreads are townreads but cakez hasn't been the best player today. At the same time, I haven't been able to see many people justify a townread on Kuroi either, but that is more on them than kuroi... maybe I'm tunneling too hard here...

They are voting on me I guess? I think they made an okay reason there though. If they are scum though, they could easily be trying to hide a cakez scum.
They
UNVOTE:

VOTE: Young and Witless

This was the reason for her vote on YAW.

If you look at her ISO, no where at any time does she

ever

mention that possibility.

She has basically defended herself this entire game and not once tried to figure a player out.

[farside22]

Mollie stop calling him perv lmao

UNVOTE: meh

I'll still be able (and probably willing) to vote again by deadline, but 857 was actually not terrible and I'm okay giving her some space. (I do want to know if it's full or x-shot though.)

I don't see YAW giving out a lot of reads? As for the questioning - what does it actually accomplish? Those questions are shallow questions that don't actually achieve anything.

If you were actually interested in my reads, you'd ask me about them instead of complaining that I'm not sharing them. Are you?

..because usually questions have a purpose which helps develop reads.
reads which you were are very slow and vague to give.
like, your ankamius read has just disappeared apparently

but i'm just a broken record at this stage i guess

Same thing. My playstyle recently, driven mostly by a decrease in the amount of time I can devote to this site (and a corresponding decrease in interest), has been to only share those reads that are relevant. My Ankamius read hasn't disappeared, I just haven't been talking about it.

you know what, just to clarify since people are questioning this (!)

I happened to have a scum-read on the two people that became the leading wagons.
I scum-read them both individually before this situation came about

i'm not gonna LIE and drop a scum-read on somebody, particularly on **day 1** because of competing wagons.
that's goes into confirmation bias territory and is not how I roll.

Were people actually questioning that? I would expect the questions to be more along the lines of, why has your read on one of us not changed given that we are the two leading wagons. Has anything changed your read on either of us since those wagons formed?
-smart

What does the post you link have to do with unvoting hebichan?

[farside22]

she claimed a pr and I don't want her lynched yet.
-smart

You think she's telling the truth?
If so why?

[farside22]

I’ve mulled it over on my drive this morning and don’t think I will unvote.

Hebi’s claim is … meh. It isn’t a role that can be proven one way or the other in any way that is alignment indicative as Hebi stipulates to herself. The claim itself is a perfect cover to explain why as Mafia she isn’t Nightkilled and presents Negative Utility WIFOM for a potential Town Vig. And even if she’s Town her play has rendered any potential she’d be a Nightkill target moot.

The main reason why I’m not unvoting is not the claim itself but her play surrounding it. Hebi isn’t engaging her wagon in any way or trying to parse out alignments anyone. All she does is appear to make a claim and do nothing else. She looks scum trying to minimize her links to teammates with her lynch possibly imminent and hoping that the claim bails her out for another day.

Hebi flipping scum would make we want to look more closely at Catdog, Wisdom and Xk.

Given that Maverick popped back up to say “Hey I’m here” and “Hey, I’ll get to your questions soon” following a generally unimpressive prior ISO I think he’s prime bullet material if we have a Vig.

--

IAWTP

its why I have not unvoted either but I am starting to struggle with it cos there is no hint of a cc and the role is believable cos I have had town bp in twd games twice now. so for that reason I think I might be leaning towards believing her.

who wld be your next choice?

I saw the role you had in game 5 was 1-BP with bg as well.
Which other game was the role used.

[farside22]

I think I had it in 1 of the first 1s. I might be confusing it with another game tho, I tend to roll bp a lot. its like some horrible curse or something cos I prefer to die early since my play deteriorate over time.

Well I saw it only in season 5

I don't find the actions of hebichan thus far to sway me in believing her claim.

I'm also not a fan of the idea of asking for or expecting a cc of any sort there either mollie.

[farside22]

I think I had it in 1 of the first 1s. I might be confusing it with another game tho, I tend to roll bp a lot. its like some horrible curse or something cos I prefer to die early since my play deteriorate over time.

Well I saw it only in season 5

I don't find the actions of hebichan thus far to sway me in believing her claim.

I'm also not a fan of the idea of asking for or expecting a cc of any sort there either mollie.

I am not asking for an open declaration of "OMG YOU CAN'T BE BP COS I AM" I just feel like I wld have seen something by now if there was 1. no, I do not want the bp to out themselves.

don't twist my words far

Did 3rd party in the other twd have a bp?

[farside22]

Good I can take a break too.
Thanks moi for checking.

[farside22]

There has been a Lyncher and Survivor in Walking Deaf games before yes

Yeah I checked, that seems to be it.

[farside22]

There has been a Lyncher and Survivor in Walking Deaf games before yes

Thoughts on hebichan and others?

[farside22]

Zzzzzz
Meanwhile hebichan has done nothing since claiming.
Given no reads, fight, extra.
Someone wake me day 2 if I'm alive.

[farside22]

its why I have not unvoted either but I am starting to struggle with it cos there is no hint of a cc and the role is believable cos I have had town bp in twd games twice now. so for that reason I think I might be leaning towards believing her.

who wld be your next choice?

I’d really have to dig back through the game to find who I’d go to next. Farside seems Town to my eyes but I’d really want to re-examine if we are looking at a Hebi as Town world since my IProb read was fairly strong.

Wisdom might be another place I’d go given the hop off Hebi earlier.

--

mollie your new sig is brilliant
-smart

Nothing else to add? Who is scum (putting aside Hebi) in your mind?

I'm starting to get a complex where I think players see my scum play as better then I think it it.

[farside22]

Claim and no CW giving me the heebie jeebies.

Oh I'm sorry I didn't know I should vote on some else here.
Sure I'll work on that if hebichan comes back and does something.
Like you, give reads or something crazy like that.
Sound goid?

[farside22]

People not vote hebichan should just do it.
She's around and not posting here when she is about to be lynched.

[farside22]

There has been a Lyncher and Survivor in Walking Deaf games before yes

[/url]


Thoughts on hebichan and others?

Fine with her being lynched, not townreading her and her claim is sketchy

Also developing a Mollie scumread

I am too. We have a day left and she wants to prevent a lynch from happening.

*Looks at vote count.*

[url=http://s39.photobucket.com/user/ilovesi ... y.jpg.html]

[farside22]

Sorry my stuff got cut and pasted poorly there.

[farside22]

Sorry my stuff got cut and pasted poorly there.

I'm still not sure what you're trying to say.

There are more then enough people to make a lynch hammer.
Your comment about mollie is hard to take seriously.

[farside22]

vote:catdog

[farside22]

Actually probably not dgb or basic but i included them anyway

I would include dgb.

[farside22]

In regards to catdog they said next to nothing there was no interaction and they just vote on her when they realize, what she was scum

[farside22]

Hi Maria, I'm far.
I didn't have a scum read on maverick.
My thoughts would be read the player that was lynched.
She was scum and see how and who she interacted with.
Also I'm scum reading catdog as I said as well as dgb.

[farside22]

Hmm mm I'm going to check perv again.

Vedith thoughts on DGB and catdog please.

[farside22]

town- magna, bunch of letters starting with X
null- PV, cakez, other head, IPS
scum- Pirate Mollie, beeboy, Kuroi,

currently where my head is at.

@Max

– please remind me of your Cakez read please.

i don't think i gave one previously?

I'm very unsure about SC.
I would lean the scum side of null simply based on how long he has sat on the farside wagon for no reason.

I think as far as purposefully vague to position oneself though, this one is a good candidate for such a prospect.

PirateMollie just also had a nice ATE with the "of but I'm trying to be nice" deal.

Current Scum Reads



YAW
Maxous
PirateMollie

Town
Wisdom
Farside
PV
XKfyu
Catdog
BBT

Townlead
kuroi
sircakez
ankamius

scumlean
otherhead

null
basic

Also Vedith I'm looking at both reads herb gave and I'm betting Anka maybe scum with that change from scum to town.
Gut still pings with Kurio but I'm ignoring it temporarily

[farside22]

vote:catdog

What even is this vote?

~Fire

Why not.

The vote on herb reads as a bus.
Look at their iso and see if they ever said jack about herb.

Hi all, will catch up on game later.

Can tell you all that DGB is town so you don't need to worry about her.

Ill hope so.

[farside22]

I see the sir cakes points more then Maria
I'm leaving my vote on catdog because I would like to see more from the spot then one read and for them to disappear.
Also when I have time I'd like to discuss something I noted.
Just give me 2 days to get it together.

[farside22]

Do we know how many scum are in this game?

nope.

Typically 12 to 13 player games is 3 scum.
As a mod if I have 16 - 20 players I have a 4 man scum team.
I see some mods very on this.


I'd say between 3 to 4 scum this game based on normal mods leeway.


So the hubby was nice to give me a computer for a bit so I'm going to run by something for a moment.


Hi Max.

I have a few issues with your interaction with Herbi.

One was this post where you take issue with Yaw's point against Herbi. I saw the defense of her, and even read the "case" on kurbio and I'm curious why you thought her vote on Mollie was valid vs following the crowd?
here You understood the scum read and felt it was okayish but stayed on Yaw. I was trying to understand why you felt strongly about the scum read on them at this point.

here You understood the herbi scum read but this was coming from the player you were scum reading at the time. Did you think they were bussing?
Why if so?

the reason on this is horrible no question here just a blanket statement.

taking issue with this based on no flip and not voting herb at the time again no question just a statement.

Finally I'm not sure why if you where scum reading both players individually why you are "letting off" YAW just for being the competing wagon.
Either you thought they were scum together are you were making up scum reads.

CatDog

I'm still waiting on you to expand on more reads then just SC.
Thanks.

[farside22]

I don't know what gunsmith is soooo

http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Gunsmith

[farside22]

Ok, I have a bit of time while my daughter's birthday cake is in the oven.

Still pretty sure SirCakez is scum. Let's break this down.

He started off by giving a BS reason to townread MOHIS. When called out and pressured for it, he bumbled about and tried to move the focus elsewhere.

His reaction to me pressuring him was fucking terrible. Instead of trying to defend himself or talk with me or anything, he just tried to discredit me. Now, at this point, Mollie and I were already dead in Summer Mafia (which just now ended). I had been yelling for his lynch and molls and I got NKd, and it was confirmed to me he was scum. 211 and 375 where he mentioned Gumball and the mini we were in together pissed me off because he was fucking baiting me. He knew DAMN WELL I couldn't say anything about Summer yet because at the time it was ongoing.

His sudden read on BBT reads as fake. Actually, his whole "reads list" is fucking fake as hell. It took him minutes to go from not really having reads to having opinions on people.

Go look at his ISO. It's full of him asking surface level questions (and not really following up), making jabs at me, and just going through the motion of scumhunting. He avoids the hebi wagon, and look at his votes. TD vote was unexciting, he hopped on IPS when he was getting pressure, and even his vote on us was weird timing. When he voted us in 719, there were 2 major wagons happening. Hebi and YAW. He hardly says

anything

about hebi. When asked about her, he has no thoughts, until it was obvious she was getting lynched and he just made a backhanded comment about not caring if she's lynched and her claim was weak.

Go look at his play in Game of Thrones. he was a lot more engaging and had solid opinions on people. Here it feels like he's just trying to ride it out posting just enough to appear active but not doing anything to make waves or get attention to himself.

I got frustrated yesterday and stepped back from the game. I had just spend a ton of energy on trying to get scum lynched in Summer just for town to fight me on it, I didn't have it in me to do it again. When I checked back in it was obvious he wasn't getting lynched, so I talked to my other head about what we wanted to do. We both agreed that hebi was scummier than YAW and went there.

Seriously. What has Cakez done to earn a townread from anybody?

hey utl lets talk, cos you have moved into my town pile with this post.

cake boy is steady in my unsure pile. he hasn't doesn't done that thing he does where he makes a post and it goes ping! SCUMZORZ like it did in summer. you are not the only 1 who is frustrated over the summer game, as I am sure you are aware of. but I think it was d3 when you and I connected with that read, prior to that we just both had him where I have him now. he said scummy things then but I am not seeing that same mindset here yet. you are right, he isn't trying to make waves. but I am not quite seeing what you are seeing. he is a giant void inside my head tho, and that is a huge red flag.

I will look harder at cake boy, but can you plz look at wis so that we can compare notes? I liked the timing of 1123 and 1124, it looks town herd mentality happening but there are some posts that I do not like.

Mollie: I love you and all, but I don't see wisdom as scum.
I would like more then just your tunnel and agreeing with others currently.

[farside22]

One was this post where you take issue with Yaw's point against Herbi. I saw the defense of her, and even read the "case" on kurbio and I'm curious why you thought her vote on Mollie was valid vs following the crowd?

i didn't agree with the mollie vote obviously but context-wise: this was back when mollie was voting Kuroi for not giving her ~game statistics~
like, i can reasonably understand why a player would react badly to that

Finally I'm not sure why if you where scum reading both players individually why you are "letting off" YAW just for being the competing wagon.
Either you thought they were scum together are you were making up scum reads.

here You understood the herbi scum read but this was coming from the player you were scum reading at the time. Did you think they were bussing?
Why if so?

uhh no.
i read **unflipped** players individually. obviously i'm gonna take a scum-flip into account?
so i didn't really care that hebi and YAW was scum-reading each-other on day 1
I didn't PARTICULARLY think they were bussing but ehh not impossible, which is what i said.

Here's is where I have an issue.
I can understand saying you may scum read them individually but I can't see why you would think they are scum together.
I'd like you to expand more on that thought process.

[farside22]

I don't like mollie.

Also the top 3 wagons are bad.

Curious why the change of read and why Anka isn't listed here.

Personally (kind of answering for wisdom). I have no strong read on sircakez, but he was a counter wagon to Hebichan, which was a scum lynch. So its possible or even more likely that makes him more likely town.

But, meh. Thats kind of bad reasoning, possible both scum, but not lynching Cakez at all today because of that.

~Fire

YAW was CW not SirCakez

[farside22]

Hey wisdom I have one more thing that is bugging me.
If you have a moment I'd like to have a chat about it.

[farside22]

I'm phone posting so I can't provide links right now but frankly the interaction between hebi and Kurio really read awkward to me.
I also noted Kurio basically just vote parked on hebi and did nothing else day 1.
I'm leaning bus there.
Would you just look at that for a few moments and give feed back there.

[farside22]

I'm going to crash early tonight, I had a rough day but I'd like that view this game day.
Thanks

[farside22]

I dont think so

Firstly i agree with magna that scum wouldnt bus their ninja willingly

And then it probably looks weird to you because of kuroi's weird posting style

Im pretty sure Kuroi is town here

At the time of the vote it wasn't pressure on herbi at all.
He just sat there afterwards without commenting on anything else and he sure as hell didn't push to have her lynched
Just my 2 cents.

Moi any thought on this from you?

[farside22]

I dont think so

Firstly i agree with magna that scum wouldnt bus their ninja willingly

And then it probably looks weird to you because of kuroi's weird posting style

Im pretty sure Kuroi is town here

At the time of the vote it wasn't pressure on herbi at all.
He just sat there afterwards without commenting on anything else and he sure as hell didn't push to have her lynched
Just my 2 cents.

Moi any thought on this from you?

She isn't referring to me.
She better not be referring to me.
Because I was on Hebi until I stopped myself because when I get worked up, no one listens to me.

Yeah all of 4 post
Ooooooo
Wow
Exciting
Wait maybe 5 but still same level of crap.

I'm back to thinking mollie is town here.
Interaction aside I recall she busses her buddies and fights more raging with them as scum.
I remember the Harry Potter game with a mixture of hate and frustration though.
Cakez involved in that push keeps me at arm lengths as well.

[farside22]

You're selectively reading, Farside.
Sickeningly so.

No I'm phone posting currently and hate having to do back and forth on it so I use estimates.
I'll show truth links when I get to a computer today.

[farside22]

I'm back to thinking mollie is town here.
Interaction aside I recall she busses her buddies and fights more raging with them as scum.
I remember the Harry Potter game with a mixture of hate and frustration though.
Cakez involved in that push keeps me at arm lengths as well.

what

I am very very town here but not for these reasons. cos that is NOT how I play as scum.

I said as much.

My gut says cakez is scum.
Kurio is scum.
I'm in wait mode with catdog, admittedly on the fence with Max and perv.

[farside22]

I think she is surprised she isn't dead.

[farside22]

So in regards to Kubio and his post on day 1.

You have his reason for voting and scum read here
It's pretty vague stuff.

It's not until iso post 11 that he makes another comment about herbi, just calling her scummy.

And then this is the brunt of what you have from Kubio so call push on Herbi.

Voting me after I voted you? Holy shit. Check the record books. I think we have the first ever instance of this happening!

Hey. Don't worry about it. It's not like it's only three posts after my original assessment of you or anything.

before I out my role, some pple might want to save themselves the embarrassment and unvote me

What kind of scum garbage softclaim is that, mollie only has 3 votes and she's freaking out

Honestly willing to get some more pressure on this slot. Thought I also dont understand the sudden kuroi townreads, he hasn't done anything that impressive since I voted him.

He hasn't done anything that scummy either though.

VOTE: pirate mollie

You.

VOTED

Me.

Hebi, you voted me for not being impressive, although you didn't think I'm scum?

Do you not understand what Mafia is? Scum are SCUMMY (hence the name). We don't call people likely to be scum Unimpressive.

Hebi, you voted me for not being impressive, although you didn't think I'm scum?

Do you not understand what Mafia is? Scum are SCUMMY (hence the name). We don't call people likely to be scum Unimpressive.

That's not what I was saying at all...

I scumread you when I voted you, you hadn't done anything impressive, as in townie, since then, so I didn't understand people townreading you.

However, since you also did not do anything scummy since then, and pirate mollie did something scummy, and much worse than you, I decided to vote there.

Seriously, are you this bad at reading context? Each post does not exist in a void. Get some reading comprehension.

You're squirming. Like I said before, being unimpressive does NOT equal scumminess.

My friends, hebicham is scum. I say that because I think too highly of this player than to truly think they're this backwards.

I know your reasoning, and there is an entire huge break in logic. Unless you know a process greater than logic, I can say you're full of BS.

So because you don't have perfect information, you think I'm unimpressive and thus, having you believe I'm scum.

For the life of me, I won't understand this and for the life of your role here, I really think you ought to die.

It's not that I don't understand something. It's that Hebichan's philosophy simply doesn't make a lick of sense. I'm just given up trying to accept her reasoning as a legitimate defense because it's simply her trying to weasel out of her inconsistencies.

I'm actually incredibly disappointed in the fall of the cakez wagon. Somebody tell me why

isn't

scum?

He might be scum, but he's not as obvious as hebichan - or perhaps you.

dont ask me, i always townread him

You do that to a lot of people.

There is no really thinking things through from this guy.
There is no trying to go and branch out and there isn't a push like BBT that is someone so sure they caught scum.
I'm not going to even mention the fake hammer here because it was pointless.

It's easy to just sit on a wagon and do nothing about getting others to vote for someone you scum read.
But so of the I think this player maybe scum with someone else hasn't even been brought into this game day.

So in short, I would vote this guy in a heart beat.

Vote: Kurio

In regards to cakez what stands out and I can't begin to fathom is if scum hebi says this:

I do have to agree with Cakez. He super lurked when I was scum with him in ME.

Got me lynched cause he even lurked in our QT and never verified my fakeclaim.

So him being active here is a pretty decent indicator since I think hes mostly allergic to playing scum.

Why did she vote him at the beginning?

[farside22]

What am I misunderstanding? Cakez said nothing resolved and mollie said "no1 died, it's not that hard" as if assuming that was what resolved

I'm assuming that mollies action will resolve when a player dies.

[farside22]

btw again, kuroi is like that as town, you're just voting a playstyle

Again I see a player not trying to figure the game out and do nothing more.
I'm see that from scum.

You want to link games from Kurio that say otherwise I'm all ears.

[farside22]

well my computer is being slow.
I'm doing my own research about kurio since I feel certain he is scum.

From Max: I would like from you instead of defense thoughts about the players in the game, who is scum and why.

[farside22]

Max reads leave me less then impressed. He doesn't even analysis the scum flip when making those reads.

[farside22]

Max reads leave me less then impressed. He doesn't even analysis the scum flip when making those reads.

Well the shade on magna over kuroi about bussing was in regards to herbi, but that about it.

[farside22]

Spoiler:

Okay, you ATE as town then. I guess that is more factually accurate. Regardless, I have personally mislynched you because of your ATEing.

When I feel like it's tactical, it's scummy.
When I feel like it's sincere, it can make people a townread.

However, it almost always feels tactical- like now

.

can you give me an example?
i'm a bit confused by this

-

regarding SC, I get why people are voting him but i'm not overly convinced. we'll see.

young & witless might be scum white knighting SirCakez

YAW probably would of put more effort into the defense if they were buddies with SC.

This is kind of a mess since I did the reads in the order I looked at ISOs

Maverick looks scum
IPS looks scum (both of these two for posts that look like there was no actual thought put into them and were just scum faking posts instead)
Beeboy null (he's done nothing AI yet)
Maxous looks townish (posts look real, unlike top two people here)
Xkfyu null (same as beeboy)
Kuroi leans awkward town
BBT leans scum (lots of coasty shitposts, not sharing reads, etc)
PV looks town (not his scum meta at all, and I don't think PV is one to adapt to his meta)

So now I have
Town - Maxous, Kuroi, PV, MOHIS
Null - Beeboy, Xkfyu
Scum - BBT, TD, IPS, Maverick

Feel a lot better now readswise

P-edit: I didn't like it, it was hand waving

unvote, vote: Young and Witless

> The SC read isn't about your reasoning. Both your heads hard-defended SC and overly struggled to justify the read.
> What's the point of your questions to MOI?
> Why is Hebichan's interactions with Kuroi disgusting? That's vague and unconvincing

You should read the exchange between YAW and myself where they both state a town read on SC and then fail in being able to justify it.

That is really weird. I missed it before honestly, because townreads are townreads but cakez hasn't been the best player today. At the same time, I haven't been able to see many people justify a townread on Kuroi either, but that is more on them than kuroi... maybe I'm tunneling too hard here...

They are voting on me I guess? I think they made an okay reason there though. If they are scum though, they could easily be trying to hide a cakez scum.
They
UNVOTE:

VOTE: Young and Witless

i'm starting to understand the HC scum-reads now

HC wagon has my seal of approval.

I read max and sc iso and realized there has been little to none interaction with each other or hebi.

I'm thinking there scum together at this point.
I also recall Anka lurked more as scum so he's another I'd see as scum at this point.

Vote: max

[farside22]

One post by scum on another player doesn't = town.
You of all players know that.

[farside22]

Please tell me max how sc gets a free pass to blatantly not discuss the herbi wagon and he is a town read based on one fucking post from scum.

[farside22]

I have a bias tr on farside for having the same 2 sr's as me (Max and Cake)

Now only if you stopped trying to push people's buttons, I'd consider you my in game mason partner.

[farside22]

YAW's last post singlehandedly makes me completely disinterested in a Maxous wagon.

I felt that too.

Vote: sc

[farside22]

I think Wisdom and MoI are town.

I have no idea about mollie, I guess I'm okay tabling that for a few days.
Kuroi and Cakez are tough... I could see Cakez as a Maxous partner, but Kuroi's reads are actually pretty good.
I think there's exactly one scum in <Maxous, MariaR>.

No idea where Creature's head is at.

@everyone voting SirCakez: do you see him as a potential partner to Maxous? If so, why not vote Maxous?

@Maxous: what do you think we're doing with our vote?
-smart

The bold for me.
Lots of following the crowd and non stance behavoir.

[farside22]

Being unsure on a read is normal what makes this one really fishy I understand the "following" part though.

I see someone following my thought process on 2 player I've scum read and it makes me feel the need to take a shower.
It's not something I recall YAW saying anything about previously either.

[farside22]

Also in retrospect herbi could have joined that YAW wagon long ago.
I half wonder now if they are both scum.

[farside22]

Also in retrospect herbi could have joined that YAW wagon long ago.
I half wonder now if they are both scum.

So all 3 major wagons early on were on scum? That seems hard to believe

I assume you still feel better about a cake lynch then a YAW lynch then.

Not that I plan on voting either because I need Max to flip to help me get a read on Wisdom.

I'm not confident in my ability to read YAW.
I played with smart in 2 games.
Both times I scum read him and once he was town.
This play of his reminds me more of his town play then scum play.
I'm in that icky stage with him currently and would rather lynch sc.
@mollie: I think sc is riding wis coattails on the subject.

[farside22]

I dislike how Mollie won't say when or how there action clears them it gives scum room to stay alive/fake it call it a role fish if you will but I can't be the only one who is getting rubbed the wrong way by this

This is bad.
If some dies night 2 and nothing happens, then and only then will I push mollie

[farside22]

Alright I still feel like it's very unlikely YAW Cake and Hebi are all scum so I'd say if they're is scum (and I'd say yes) it's only 1 and I think everyone should know that and if you don't agree with it tell me why please.

Pedit: Did Mollie claim under pressure or just randomly claim?

That's fair.
Although max wasn't a wagon on day 1.

I think mollie had a few votes when she soft claim.
Hebi voted for her when she did so, add that to reasons why I won't lynch mollie.

[farside22]

Mollie and Maria if we could just claim all girl Mason in thread and table this conversation I'd be happy.
Let's not fight and let those not posting as much skate by.
Thanks

[farside22]

Mollie and Maria if we could just claim all girl Mason in thread and table this conversation I'd be happy.
Let's not fight and let those not posting as much skate by.
Thanks

okay

who are you voting for again?

Sir cakez

[farside22]

The hardest choice of this game yet: Vote with my mason crew or try to find out Wis's alignment and lynch Max. (Btw if it's not obv enough I don't think Max and Wis are the same alignment)

Max when he post I get the impression I'm only getting half the story.
Wis is a good player. I recall him posting more then this but his push on max and getting to see why players are voting mollie over max came across as town
However all that said there are days I trust the guy as far as I could throw him.

[farside22]

I'll reread wis and see.

[farside22]

Just one thing I noted.
If wis is scum this game I'd say that YAW is scum too since wis didn't vote for them on day 1 to save herbi.

[farside22]

Spoiler:

@something smart

: is there a specific reason you keep asking questions that you don't care what the answer is or if it's answered at all?

i don't see you doing in this previous town games. I actually checked

Oh! Me! Me! Me! I got the answer!

hey look, yet another instance of BBT getting manipulated by Maxous

young & witless might be scum white knighting SirCakez

I just realized it was Maxous that got this shit in BBT's head and it's making me dislike him

I would say the way wis is selling the scum read on max with those I quoted, bugged me the most.
There was the on again and off again attack on mollie that wis did as well I didn't get.
At some point wis voted kuroi on day 1 and I don't know what happened with scum read.

[farside22]

Spoiler:

@something smart

: is there a specific reason you keep asking questions that you don't care what the answer is or if it's answered at all?

i don't see you doing in this previous town games. I actually checked

Oh! Me! Me! Me! I got the answer!

hey look, yet another instance of BBT getting manipulated by Maxous

young & witless might be scum white knighting SirCakez

I just realized it was Maxous that got this shit in BBT's head and it's making me dislike him

I would say the way wis is selling the scum read on max with those I quoted, bugged me the most.
There was the on again and off again attack on mollie that wis did as well I didn't get.

At some point wis voted kuroi on day 1 and I don't know what happened with scum read.

mebbe you shld ask him

Wisdom: what happened to your scum read on Kuroi from day 1?

[farside22]

Also, I don't like this female alliance, it feels like this is an episode of survivor, in which case, don't vote me off the island!!

~Fire

You want to join?


Honestly I'm town reading both girls and I don't want them fighting.

[farside22]

All the “Mollie contradicted herself” talk needs to end. It only makes sense if you choose a very narrow reading of both posts steeped in confirm bias of her being scum as you read.

Basic needs to come through shortly on the promise of content in 1592.

--

Sitting down to catch up tonight. Had unexpected doctor's appts come up.

Oh look another empty post and promise of content that didn’t arrive …

--

I don't understand your issue Magna.

Well either your reading comprehension skills are lower than I thought or you are playing dumb.

Either you believe Sir Cakez is Town in which case there is no way that YAW could be scum with Hebi and the wagon that existed on Cakez just fades with scum choosing to cross-vote each other as I showed in 1316 over voting Cakez …

Or

All three wagons are on scum [YAW, Hebi, Cakez] which makes no sense since scum would not have chosen to sacrifice their Ninja over whichever of the other two has a weaker role (and that is a basic truth given any strength in set-up analysis). And all three could have been pushed to lynch with scum’s help.

So I don’t think your YAW stance makes any logical sense. And despite your claim you look more scummy for that.

--

Just one thing I noted.
If wis is scum this game I'd say that YAW is scum too since wis didn't vote for them on day 1 to save herbi.

Same thing I pointed out to BBT above I want you to comment on farside. Please do so when you get a chance.

--

I think so. I took it as "neither alignment" as it cld mean either/or. am i wrong?

It means that it doesn’t make any sense for either alignment. I mean as Town BBT could have kept the read back to see if a push developed on DBG for being a useless lurksack and tried to find scum in that push but didn’t bother. And as scum claiming like that is pretty suboptimal for a number of reasons.

So it is a big fat Not Alignment Indicative pile of uselessness for me.

I wld really appreciate if you looked at the game but I kinda feel like you need a comparison to clarify, which is why if you are in the spirit of looking up other games I wld really like for you to look up other games.

Link them.

I was just saying that neither YAW nor Herbi voted each other till both wagons were big enogh.
At that point bussing is very possible.
If you disagree with that I'd like to know why.

[farside22]

I was just saying that neither YAW nor Herbi voted each other till both wagons were big enogh.
At that point bussing is very possible.
If you disagree with that I'd like to know why.

I'm asking the question - how does a Ninja get lynched if you think both YAW and Hebi were scum regardless of your read on Cakez?

The wagons that I quoted from the Mod were YAW 5 / Hebi 4 / Cakez 3

I'm not saying bussing is impossible. I'm saying that I don't see world where either -

1. Cakez is Town and both your hypo scum YAW and scum Hebi choose to cross bus as opposed to supporting a Cakez wagon, or

2. Cakez is Scum and scum don't push the lynch onto the least useful role in the three (and there is no way Ninja is the least useful Role).

I could be wrong but I'm not seeing it and I've yet to see an argument where either of my assessments is incorrect. Just "bussing is possible" which is true and completely useless in terms of explaining the scenario realistically.

If one of YAW / Cakez is scum I'd wager large on Cakez.

Do you disagree?

I agree that sc is scummier then YAW.
I also recall both herbi and YAW claimed town reads on SC.
Idk I'm probably just paranoid by YAW in general.

[farside22]

Something confirmable as town
I;e bodyguard, vig, etc

And how would anything like that resolve without any NKs?

Vig doesn't need another nk to resolve
BG needs to be lucky to be proved really

Besides mollies claim, what is tour issue with her?

[farside22]

Tour= you

[farside22]

Also wis I asked you about your read on Kuroi.
You voted him at the end of day 1, what happened with that read?

[farside22]

There has been a Lyncher and Survivor in Walking Deaf games before yes

Thoughts on hebichan and others?

Fine with her being lynched, not townreading her and her claim is sketchy

Also developing a Mollie scumread

Cakez. Who is scum. Other than Catdog.

Xkfyu (tried to redirect the lynch away from hebi post claim and pushed a counterwagon)
Ank (hebi vote looks like bussing as he made basically no mention of a hebi scumread before, looks like his scum game from song of ice and fire) (I could be wrong on this one, I haven't seen an Ank towngame before so this might be my MOHIS read 2.0 from earlier)
Mollie (has done little besides pushing wisdom, she's usually more open to discussing other reads, posts like 660 sound like a comment a hebi scumbuddy would make
DGB (ISO is devoid of real content, 803/804 looks really bad with the hebi scumflip)

My scumreads were very stale (really nonexistent besides CatDog >.<) so I went looking around the people who were dodgy around the hebi wagon.

It doesnt feel like a thing scum would make up

Even if it wasnt your intention, im pretty sure UTL felt thats what you were doing there

Yeah I'm not so certain on that scumread anymore after reviewing reads, since I can see where she's coming from on some of the stuff
I would like to see her response to my response (lol) to her case

Hi all, will catch up on game later.

Can tell you all that DGB is town so you don't need to worry about her.

No hope about it Farside, she is town.

I chose DGB because she did nothing to me that helped me read her.

It was between DGB and Pere. Also, I was a 1-shot gunsmith which means DGB is clear as even a GF shows up with a gun, no? Also means we probably have a vig who didn't shoot for false positives.

Oh I was checking out other ISOs and saw this
I buy it

then
VOTE: mollie

803/804 looks really bad with the hebi scumflip)

I dont agree, why does a hebi buddy vote then unvote? A hebi buddy reads the whole thing and calls hebi town, assuming that was the end goal

She called Hebi town in 804 then never mentioned her again though
It's irrelevant since there's apparently a clear on her anyway

so these are the few post I pulled from sc in regards mollie.
One is vague.
The other is about reads and tunneling, which I note most of day 1 sc was only about catdog.
Finally not once does sc mention herbi and instead throws cat at catdog vote on herbi.
Soooooo
Yeah my vote ain't moving.

[farside22]

How are your quotes of my reads scummy?
I can see how you'd dislike the first quote but the rest have me confused.

I'm pointing out your play day 1 is no better then what you've described about mollies play.

[farside22]

Actually mollies better since scum Hebi voted her after her soft claim

[farside22]

Huh?
Mollie has been deathtunneling Wisdom the whole game, with some side jumps to Hebi and I
My reads were pretty bad day 1 and early today but they have evolved since then

Mollie is still stuck on the same people
So I don't get the comparison

where have they evolved? I mean you are still saying that I am scum and I am your major push.

This is true.

[farside22]

Basically changed from death tunnel on catdog to death tunnel on mollie for weak reason.

[farside22]

I'm feeling a bit crazy at the moment.

Vote: wisdom

This is more in regards to the push I saw on max and the vote switch off hebi that I'm having issues getting over.

[farside22]

I'm feeling a bit crazy at the moment.

Vote: wisdom

This is more in regards to the push I saw on max and the vote switch off hebi that I'm having issues getting over.

Why did you think voting would be a good idea when you feel crazy?

Pointless question.

Next.

[farside22]

I'm feeling a bit crazy at the moment.

Vote: wisdom

This is more in regards to the push I saw on max and the vote switch off hebi that I'm having issues getting over.

Why did you think voting would be a good idea when you feel crazy?

^ scum

These unexplained accusations are part of the reason why no one town reads you.

I'm feeling a bit crazy at the moment.

Vote: wisdom

This is more in regards to the push I saw on max and the vote switch off hebi that I'm having issues getting over.

Why did you think voting would be a good idea when you feel crazy?

Pointless question.

Next.

You're not still crazy, are you?

Tell me what you think the point of your question really will do here.
You focus on a line line sentence over the whole process it took to get there
or you aren't paying attention
Or your scum

[farside22]

farside: I dont really remember why i voted kuroi. Most likely the other game i was playing at the time (game of thrones) had tired me because i couldnt find the last scum and i decided i was wrong in giving a pass to kuroi there and then when i was skimming here kuroi felt similar to there so i voted him here too

This probably isnt easy to understand which is why i wanted to avoid but since youre insisting. Basically my head wasnt really in this game until d2, i was just skimmimg which i rarely do.

As for hebi, it was some post or other that i thought i liked so i unvoted. Like i told magna, no way i do that as her buddy without strongly pushing a counterwagon, so you really dont have to worry about me

That's some fancy wine you put in front of me there.
Yes sir.
Some fancy wine.

[farside22]

Let me break this down a bit without sipping on that wine there.
How did you feel kuroi play was similar.

VOTE: kuroi

Not feeling the hebichan lynch anymore

At this point herbi had not said anything but you suddenly don't feel the wagon.
You basically voted on a vanity wagon that wasn't going to happen before deadline and I'm going to say hmm that sound like town wisdom?
Because if you think that sounds like your playstyle let me have link to when that started.

[farside22]

unfortunately i'm not the best at explaining, but tl;dr - Something Smart isn't scum-reading people, he's handpicking lynches.

This doesn't even make any sense. If you're talking about my scumreads of you and BBT, two of the strongest pushers of our wagon, it's pretty evident that there was at least one other scum on that wagon, probably two.

Besides, you can ask anybody who's played with me; my tone is always like this.
-smart

Sad but true.

[farside22]

Let me break this down a bit without sipping on that wine there.
How did you feel kuroi play was similar.

VOTE: kuroi

Not feeling the hebichan lynch anymore

At this point herbi had not said anything but you suddenly don't feel the wagon.
You basically voted on a vanity wagon that wasn't going to happen before deadline and I'm going to say hmm that sound like town wisdom?
Because if you think that sounds like your playstyle let me have link to when that started.

What would be the point of him doing this as scum though?
-smart

I hate that question because scum do things for a wide range of reasons.
Example Infinity for our last game asked me why I was not voting his scum buddy or town reading him.
Do you think I knew it was to help his scum buddy?
So I ask what is the town motive instead.

[farside22]

Maxous has been going back and forth on me and YAW for most of the game. Some of the time he says my wagon looks nicer and some times he feels like YAW is the best.
It genuinely feels like he's keeping his options open for towncred.

I mean, he could just be genuinely be teetering back and forth, but why wouldn't he say that?

As for mollie not being on either wagon... Distancing? There is almost certainly scum on my wagon with the amount of votes there.

I'm just noting this right niw.

[farside22]

Lmao 1-shot bulletproof claims are always fake
VOTE: catdog

Why didn't you vote herbi if that is true?

[farside22]

Let me break this down a bit without sipping on that wine there.
How did you feel kuroi play was similar.

VOTE: kuroi

Not feeling the hebichan lynch anymore

At this point herbi had not said anything but you suddenly don't feel the wagon.
You basically voted on a vanity wagon that wasn't going to happen before deadline and I'm going to say hmm that sound like town wisdom?
Because if you think that sounds like your playstyle let me have link to when that started.

What would be the point of him doing this as scum though?
-smart

I hate that question because scum do things for a wide range of reasons.
Example Infinity for our last game asked me why I was not voting his scum buddy or town reading him.
Do you think I knew it was to help his scum buddy?
So I ask what is the town motive instead.

Well, it seemed like you were simultaneously suggesting that he was trying to save his buddy and that he was making a meaningless vote.
And I mean, what's the town motivation in voting any vanity wagon? To express your feelings, even if they won't affect anything at the current time.
Given the way hebichan's posting started to go downhill, I seriously doubt scum!Wisdom could have thought he could save her, and it seems like doing that would just draw needless attention as scum.
-smart

Wis also not following that scumread today.
He took things I said and moi said and created a case on max.
I quoted a few that bothered me but the main one is where he basically blames max for bbt scum read on YAW for the majority of the game, which is pretty much a stretch

[farside22]

And if i did try to save her i would push a counterwagon, not vanity vote

Add that protecting Kuroi who has done next to nothing in regards to scum hunting and being okay with that.

[farside22]

I'm going back to my original scum read here.

Vote: Kuroi

No scum hunting detected.
Pointless questions.
Disengaged from trying to figure the game out.

yada, yada, yada.

[farside22]

Its not my first game with him

And yet you were thinking he was scum day 1 and it was familiar to his play where he flipped scum.

Okay sell me again why you think he is town, because I found one game yesterday that reads nothing like this.

i feel like this is going in circles.

should probably just get rid of one of the low content players

eh, i'll vote back on PV

vote: PeregrineV

basic or ank either whichever.

I'd go with Anka.
Pretty sure Basic is town. Peregrine is a big blob of nothing.

[farside22]

i feel like this is going in circles.

should probably just get rid of one of the low content players

eh, i'll vote back on PV

vote: PeregrineV

basic or ank either whichever.

How this hasn't drawn enough votes to lynch by this point is a strong sign that scum are not bussing after losing their first member.

I mean read the above - he's basically saying "Meh, let's not scum hunt let's just policy lynch on activity. I don't care who"

Maxous scum means odds of scum Peregrine is very, very low.

Let play, lets make a deal.

I think your town MOI.
If max isn't scum would you follow me onto Kuroi?
I'm pretty certain based on behavior he hasn't done before in a previous game he is just lurking scum here.

[farside22]

Because meta and gut

And i explained to you why i voted him, idc if you get it or not

You said you thought you felt his game was similar to a game that just ended where he was scum.

Tell me the part I missed.

Because frankly I think your lying your ass off since that response is pretty crap filled.

*spits wine on floor*

[farside22]

Its not crap filled, you just cant understand my thought process and i dont care to explain it further

farside: I dont really remember why i voted kuroi. Most likely the other game i was playing at the time (game of thrones) had tired me because i couldnt find the last scum and i decided i was wrong in giving a pass to kuroi there and then when i was skimming here kuroi felt similar to there so i voted him here too

This probably isnt easy to understand which is why i wanted to avoid but since youre insisting. Basically my head wasnt really in this game until d2, i was just skimmimg which i rarely do.

As for hebi, it was some post or other that i thought i liked so i unvoted. Like i told magna, no way i do that as her buddy without strongly pushing a counterwagon, so you really dont have to worry about me

VOTE: kuroi

Not feeling the hebichan lynch anymore

probably, yeah

This said in regards to this post from DGB

Kuroi is still scum

So since Wisdom doesn't want to explain anything further and keeps using the I would have voted the counter wagon as scum routine as an excuse.
I'll ask others, does his vote make sense, does his lack of reasoning make sense.
Does the fact he is using others post to present a case on max (whom he wasn't even scum reading till recently) make sense.
Now he's sure because scum was off the wagon.
Lets see who is off the wagon:

CatDog (2) - PeregrineV, SirCakez
KuroiXHF (2) - Wisdom, DrippingGoofball
Young and Witless (1) - Xkfyu
pirate mollie (1) - Maverick1102
Wisdom (1) - pirate mollie

Not Voting (1) - Young and Witless

Nope, Max joined the wagon so saying that scum wasn't on the wagon and not checking anyone off the wagon makes so much sense now.
What was I thinking

[farside22]

This is litterally the only think that SC said about Hebi on day one.

There has been a Lyncher and Survivor in Walking Deaf games before yes

Thoughts on hebichan and others?

Fine with her being lynched, not townreading her and her claim is sketchy

Also developing a Mollie scumread

That's it and asking if it was okay to hammer.
Sorry let me add that to the really no interaction list.

So forgive me for not being a mind reader and seeing clearly that SC thought Hebi was so much scum that I shouldn't suspect him at all.

[farside22]

Does the fact he is using others post to present a case on max (whom he wasn't even scum reading till recently) make sense.

This isnt your first game with me. I dont case.

I had to dig to see the last time we played together.
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=54&t=61141
I barely remember that game. There was the one I was a hydra before that and you were like, 3rd party.
I did forget you don't do cases. I just remember you as the spammer.

[farside22]

farside will you marry me

I knew this day would come one day!

I know my hubby would say lets go for it.

[farside22]

Usually town think, ponder, analysis.
He sat on a vote and called a player obvious scum.
Today... Nothing of interest there.
You say hey let's vote lurkers
I'm saying hey let's vote an active lurker.
No difference to me.
And yes players change.
How many do you see sit on a vote from the start based on one post?

[farside22]

Also max don't tell me if I sat on a vote and didn't progress my reads you'd call me fucking town.
I'd call you a bold face liar.
Ignoring meta is either you see a players process or you dont.

[farside22]

Prod dodge, basically. Will catch up tonight/tomorrow.

Prodded- I'm here.

mod: replacement for this spot please. Or final prod at least.
Same with dgb

[farside22]

@widsom

mollie dont whine about me not answering when you dont tell me what question

mebbe if I make it in large font you will remember this time. at 1 point you said you thought max was scum with cake boy. then bbt voted cake boy and you told bbt to stop voting town when cake boy had not posted anything to make you suddenly townread him. so what made you change your mind on cake boy?

[farside22]

I'm in the shadows of scum team Anka, kuroi and sc

I think I'm wrong on one of those so max is on my list and on review wisdom is off the list.
Maybe exchange Max for SC.
Idk I'm still thinking

[farside22]

After rereading day 1 again I'm exchanging max/sc for basic in the same group.

So any wagon on Anka, basic or kuroi and I'm there.

[farside22]

I'd lynch Basic.

Sweet!

Vote: basic

[farside22]

So any wagon on Anka, basic or kuroi and I'm there.

All 3 are town

Looks at crystal ball

I'm sorry it's very cloudy. Did you have one that is 100% accurate and I missed it.

I mean the only person you so far built a case on is max and calling mollie out.
So forgive me for doing good something called reading and making analysis.
I'm sure I should follow your example
You know the one where you didn't vote the leading wagons that lead to a scum lynch.

[farside22]

So any wagon on Anka, basic or kuroi and I'm there.

All 3 are town

Looks at crystal ball

I'm sorry it's very cloudy. Did you have one that is 100% accurate and I missed it.

I mean the only person you so far built a case on is max and calling mollie out.
So forgive me for doing good something called reading and making analysis.
I'm sure I should follow your example
You know the one where you didn't vote the leading wagons that lead to a scum lynch.

Wagon, not wagons.

*waits for dgb*

[farside22]

Eh i was on it technically i just left it

Great job, bucko.
Point being you have no leverage over who's reads are better or worse or town or not.
Do you want to play let's make a deal too?
Because so far your read on Kuroi is baseless from what I read.
Do I believe I'm 100% a curate?
Hell no but I'm sure no going to tell people there reads are wrong without analysising both sides.

[farside22]

far he is scum. why won't you trust me on this

It's not that I don't trust you but I think your read on him is bias.
I think I read why he changed reads on SC at the time your talking about.
I maybe wrong about that but I don't see why your holding onto the scum read mollie.
It's not like you didn't think kuroi was scum too.

[farside22]

Mollie: Is this the point in the game you were referring to in regards to Wisdom's post saying SC is town?

VOTE: cakez

maria's point isn't that bad actually

803/804 looks really bad with the hebi scumflip)

I dont agree, why does a hebi buddy vote then unvote? A hebi buddy reads the whole thing and calls hebi town, assuming that was the end goal

Your other scumreads arent that bad though

What's wrong with SC wagon wisdom?

it's on town

I've townread him 2 out of 3 times he has been scum so consider me not very confident

Because if it is, the last 3 post you can see he is thinking about SC more on what sc said in his scum read with reasons.

[farside22]

Sc: why you town reading kuroi and basic?

[farside22]

Ankamius' iso is revolting rubbish.

Yeah I see this more like his scum meta

[farside22]

Yeah he was
Also hebichans bullshit push on him

You mean were hebi town reads and then 2 pages scum reads the spot but doesn't vote and all beef did was ask why he was scum?
That shit is NAI.
Like that is bare minimum effort.

You act like scum don't accuse each other if there scum and then question that read.
It's not that novel of a concept at all.

[farside22]

Yeah he was
Also hebichans bullshit push on him

what is this post in response to?

I thought it was Anka.
I mean seriously hebi accused max of being scum too so WTF is the difference.
Do we just sit down and think everyone she called scum with weak reason is town or do you do a full read over the players game play.
Am I doing this wrong?

[farside22]

Oh, for whoever is worrying about Ankamius; the way hebi treats beeboy in pages 14-15 makes me pretty sure beeboy is town

She never voted beeboy.
That was exactly what I described what it was in my post before you requoted

[farside22]

Wisdom is town, Basic & mollie might want to consider voting for scum instead

Pretty sure YAW is town.

Vote: kuroi

[farside22]

Wisdom is town, Basic & mollie might want to consider voting for scum instead

Pretty sure YAW is town.

Vote: kuroi

Tell me why?

and why is Maxous town?

and why is Kuroi scum?

Not sure about max, but YAW is ss. Sometimes I think the guy works in backwards land when it comes to scum huntinh.
He is an odd duck when it comes to scum tells and as I said I see a lot of smiilarities from this game and our last game together.
He also seems to lurk more as scum.

[farside22]

Wisdom is town, Basic & mollie might want to consider voting for scum instead

Pretty sure YAW is town.

Vote: kuroi

Tell me why?

and why is Maxous town?

and why is Kuroi scum?

As for kuroi he sat on hebi pretty much all day 1 with a weak reason and did shit fucking all.
Active lurking, lack of interaction, lack of scum hunting in general.
It reads bus and lurk scum strategy all the way.

[farside22]

Not sure about max, but YAW is ss. Sometimes I think the guy works in backwards land when it comes to scum huntinh.
He is an odd duck when it comes to scum tells and as I said I see a lot of smiilarities from this game and our last game together.
He also seems to lurk more as scum.

Thanks for answering but none of this is really all that convincing.

SS was part of the hydra from princess bride.

[farside22]

Farside's dancing around and voting ~14x so far today kind of worries me.

Mostly the same players?

Tell me why that bothers you.
You also avoided the question I asked you.
You keep just lurking about though.

Vote: Anka

[farside22]

Oooo i voted 9 x this game day and 3 on the same player.

How dare I try to figure this game.
Maybe I should just sit on my vote and not interact at all.

[farside22]

Maxous is town

VOTE: Ankamius

Nope.

Ank is not being lynched today because he helped lynch scum which is more than I can say for most of the people trying to get that wagon started.

"Waa waa waa bussing" you cry. I don't give two shits about your bussing theories. I'll lynch anyone off the wagon Day 1 when we are in Day 2 over someone whose vote helped get a powerful scum role lynched.

BBT and DGB I'll lynch one of today over Ank. Both haven't contributed anything today that warrants being alive. BBT's weak claim isn't a shield for quasi incompetence and DGB's content is just barely above the Mendoza line.

I'm drawing a line in the sand - if you aren't with me on this Maxous lynch you are lining up for rope behind him.

I'm tired of watching this solid wagon on scum just falter as people play "I'd rather lynch people who make NO sense being lynched today given they helped lynch scum" for reasons that border on ludicrous.

It would not be this hard to get Maxous lynched as Town. Scum are not bussing and it is completely obvious.

Max voted hebi at the end of day 1.
Discuss.

[farside22]

Day 1, VC 24

hebichan (10)

-

KuroiXHF, MagnaofIllusion, My Other Head Is Scum, farside22, Ankamius, CatDog, Basic,

Maxous,

hebichan, BlueBloodedToffee - LYNCH

CatDog (2)

-

PeregrineV, SirCakez

KuroiXHF (2)

-

Wisdom, DrippingGoofball

Young and Witless (1)

-

Xkfyu

pirate mollie (1)

-

Maverick1102

Wisdom (1)

-

pirate mollie

Not Voting (1)

-

Young and Witless

With 18 alive, it takes 10 to lynch! Deadline is on August 20th at 11:00 AM(GMT+1) or in (expired on 2016-08-20 11:00:00).

Mod Notes - None

[/quote]

See vote count.
Sees max name.

[farside22]

This is what you get with Anka in regards to Hebi.

No, I don't think I'd be lynched if I was more scum than town. I just don't feel like going through everything and I see no reason for doing it. She's not asking for meta. She's asking for numbers that serve no diagnostic criteria.

Mollie always has a reason to ask the questions she asks do the things she does. Instead of fighting with her, why is it so hard to work with her?

Well I have these things called questions. Interrogative sentences with question marks.

Sure, I think I have a good one here, why is it that you seem to be so scum this game?

I need to catch up a bit more since my computer KEEPS DYING every time I fix it, but I think I can place a vote here for now.

VOTE: Kuroi

Town.

MOD – I’ll be V/LA from 5pm EDT today until Monday morning for my usual weekend family duties.

VOTE: Hebi

Since iProbably has apparently flaked his replacement is going to get a halo and I don’t have the energy to fight with everyone about that right now.

--

It was off the top of my head when picking people, if I didn't remember you I didn't remember you. Suck it up big boy.

See .. this is why I might join Catdog’s Cakez crusade eventually. Because this response doesn’t pass the smell test. Like day old fish in the farmer’s market. I think your explanation for who you ISOed and why is suspect.

Cool sure, why am I scum and not YAW after his whole thing about pushing activity being a town thing. Pretty sure he's just buddying up again. I want to keep pushing the YAW wagon here.

I'm starting to think I was hasty in townreading this slot after reading this post.

hm

UNVOTE: KuroiXHF

@mollie: convince me on YAW?

VOTE: Hebichan

So that's a whole lot of nothing with a vote.

[farside22]

I'm still waiting on MoI to realize that max was on the wagon for hebi.
If your going off the wagon pick someone off the wagon.
I'm thinking scum bussed.

[farside22]

See vote count.
Sees max name.

Don't care.

Then don't tell me your looking for players off the wagon only.

[farside22]

I can't explain something like that moi.
You should also know im not in a hurry to just lynch a player and do fuck all.
Idk about max. The wagon it's self doesn't bug me, well sc vote does, because it just reads as following.
Consider me waiting.
I'll drop my argument on Kuroi and Anka and you can push your case, but don't expect me to support you if you can't look at more then one player as scum here.
The tantrum was pretty unnecessary.

[farside22]

I'm still waiting on MoI to realize that max was on the wagon for hebi.

So what? Have you read the game?

Don't be dense.

[farside22]

I'm still waiting on MoI to realize that max was on the wagon for hebi.
If your going off the wagon pick someone off the wagon.
I'm thinking scum bussed.

Maybe MoIi is scum

I don't think so.

Ank forming as a counter to Max is definitely giving me bad vibes from the wagoners

Why are you concerned.
Do you really believe max is scum? If so who is scum with him.
Tbf this just reads as fake concern. There is more then one scum in the game and players can feel more strongly about their scum read.

[farside22]

Ank is town because beeboy was town

Dont try to read unreadable people

Since when do you ignore a player that replaced another?
Sure beeboy had his moments that made me laugh, but I look at Anka and all I see is scum.

[farside22]

Let me guess, you havent played with Ank before either

Yes I have.
Even checked his current meta.
I'm pretty happy with my vote.
Thanks for asking!

[farside22]

You never answered my question, farside.

Your experience with me is one-dimensional. You've only ever seen my town game twice, one of which I caught scum-you and the other when I had very strong reads for a lot of the game and came to the right answers when it mattered. Your experience with my scum game is when I'm disinterested and inactive. The problem is that I can be active and fake reads at the same time as scum and I can be disinterested and inactive as town. I've done both of them multiple times and I strongly doubt you have researched into my meta enough to be able to tell the difference between them all.

You want to link those examples?

[farside22]

Ank is still town

I still feel that, let's make a deal category.
You can give me a day or 2 though.
I'm waiting on catdog still.

[farside22]

Wisdom is town, Basic & mollie might want to consider voting for scum instead

Pretty sure YAW is town.

Vote: kuroi

Tell me why?

and why is Maxous town?

and why is Kuroi scum?

As for kuroi he sat on hebi pretty much all day 1 with a weak reason and did shit fucking all.
Active lurking, lack of interaction, lack of scum hunting in general.
It reads bus and lurk scum strategy all the way.

I'd disagree heavily with Kuroi sitting on her wagon all day.
They vote each other before page 10. But the heat between them after Hebichan changes her vote to Mollie stating Kuroi is being townread and is "unimpressive" under pressure feels quite real. Therefore im disinclined to think it as a bus. This comes across as a misrep. He continues to begrudge her for roughly ten pages, but doesnt change his vote from her. Even hammering but not hammering her.

before I out my role, some pple might want to save themselves the embarrassment and unvote me

What kind of scum garbage softclaim is that, mollie only has 3 votes and she's freaking out

Honestly willing to get some more pressure on this slot. Thought I also dont understand the sudden kuroi townreads, he hasn't done anything that impressive since I voted him.

He hasn't done anything that scummy either though.

VOTE: pirate mollie

You.

VOTED

Me.

Did you read the first sentence.

"he hasn't done anything that impressive

since I voted him

.

It was implied that I meant you hadn't done anything scummy SINCE THEN.

Seriously, you latch onto stupid things.

Hebi, you voted me for not being impressive, although you didn't think I'm scum?

Do you not understand what Mafia is? Scum are SCUMMY (hence the name). We don't call people likely to be scum Unimpressive.

That's not what I was saying at all...

I scumread you when I voted you, you hadn't done anything impressive, as in townie, since then, so I didn't understand people townreading you.

However, since you also did not do anything scummy since then, and pirate mollie did something scummy, and much worse than you, I decided to vote there.

Seriously, are you this bad at reading context? Each post does not exist in a void. Get some reading comprehension.

You're squirming. Like I said before, being unimpressive does NOT equal scumminess.

My friends, hebicham is scum. I say that because I think too highly of this player than to truly think they're this backwards.

I believe I remember the only game we played together being the one where I lynched almost all down town lines despite my good reads.

I don't think you know me well enough to make this claim.

I know your reasoning, and there is an entire huge break in logic. Unless you know a process greater than logic, I can say you're full of BS.

I know your reasoning, and there is an entire huge break in logic. Unless you know a process greater than logic, I can say you're full of BS.

In mafia, logic can't always get you everywhere, because you don't have perfect information.

So yes, logic can be very flawed in mafia, but you must apply pressure to points where you think you can get more information so you can actually build a logical case.

So I appreciate your pressure on me, however, I think you are off base in your assumptions.

In other news, I think we should pressure mollie, because we have a bad softclaim.

I agree with the interactions with Kuroi being weird.

Because this weird interaction was the first definitive point of someone calling her scum Hebichan scum chalks Kuroi up to being weird.

So because you don't have perfect information, you think I'm unimpressive and thus, having you believe I'm scum.

For the life of me, I won't understand this and for the life of your role here, I really think you ought to die.

So because you don't have perfect information, you think I'm unimpressive and thus, having you believe I'm scum.

For the life of me, I won't understand this and for the life of your role here, I really think you ought to die.

Again, not what I said originally.

I can't for the life of me stand your blatant misrepresentations of my posts and yeah, that more than anything else does make me think you're a bit scummy.

The unimpressive bit was not understanding why you are townread, there is a line between town and scum in reads, its called null.

I thought most people should be null reading you.

But to further claify, let me go get my first vote on you in a second.

wats the larger picture

he would focus on stupid wording choices instead of the overall context of the post.

what is the overall context of the post?

I had already explained back in my back and forth with kuroi, this is not a useful conversation.

he thought I was scum reading him because I thought his posts were "unimpressive" when really I was just asking why everyone was townreading him so hard when none of his posts have been that impressive since I had voted him. MY original vote on him had nothing to do with me asking about the townreads on him. I then admitted he also had not been scummy since I had made my original post, which he latched onto as meaning I never scumread him in the first place.

I just explained, his refusal to actually read any more than a single post at a time and focusing on stupid word choices and pretending that there were things that were there that weren't.

Not to mention the fake as fuck "respect" after one game where I played horribly.

It's not that I don't understand something. It's that Hebichan's philosophy simply doesn't make a lick of sense. I'm just given up trying to accept her reasoning as a legitimate defense because it's simply her trying to weasel out of her inconsistencies.

I would argue Kuroi did the same exact thing as mollie did just without the claim to fall back on. If you really want to argue about pointless questions, maverick.

I'm actually incredibly disappointed in the fall of the cakez wagon. Somebody tell me why

isn't

scum?

He might be scum, but he's not as obvious as hebichan - or perhaps you.

There's plenty of reason to see Kuroi as town on a review.
Also my read on YAW has fluxuated a bit. But nothing really worth noting right now.
I probs need more time. As ever. But Kuroi to me seems town. Therefore a lynch on him seems rather stupid.
Sorry, ive been doing a more in depth reading than i had prior i was just more concerned with catching up than actually examining and questioning things. Reworking my way through things regarding the flip of Hebichan.

@PV?

Sorry guys, havent read the last 30 pages of day2, but did look over Hebichan ISO.

Vote: KuroiXHF

Hebi attacked him as scum, flipped his opinion the next week.

Hebichan flipped her opinion ALOT. And Kuroi actually called her out on it i believe. Hebichan was on Kuroi, Mollie and YAW any wagon that was really going.
He never really wavered in his approach to Hebichan. He just got less shouty about it over time? Should one sit on someone they feel is scum the rest of the day when its rarely, if ever, addressed by someone else?

On a side note, can you show me where the flip of opinion happened? I couldnt find it from Kuroi's ISO. I dont see how its relevant from Hebi's point of view and I DONT like having to search for things that arent there.
Hoping to have misunderstood.

UNVOTE:

@YAW. Would you say you rule people as town to begin with and gradually think of someone as scum over time?

Btw. Why are people apparently on Ank? Reading his ISO's i found our thought patterns along the same lines. I dont see this wagon being justified.
Also, MOHIS falls in my town line.

DGB im hoping is town but im not going with that 100%. Ive seen too little of her and am conflicted on BBT on the inital reread.

In a nutshell here is why I disagree.
He responds to her and acts like they have this great history together.
She says they had one game togeyher.
He calls her scummier then others, no reason listed and today he's pretty Mia for the most part.
Second the fact is scum bus. It doesn't matter if it's page 2 or page 100. Sitting there with a weak push isn't doing shit.
If you keep town reading players based on weak pushes I'm going to advise a different hobby.
You let that be your basis for the whole game and I die at some point and that is in lylo then hopefully you may come to your sense if around.
Doubtful but I'll scream and shout that is scum till it's lynched or I'm dead.

As for Anka what are you finding that is common thought process?
Mostly I just see questions with no follow up and lack of insight except maybe 3 post

[farside22]

@Those voting Ank:

Do you really think that scum would push the lynch of two (almost certainly) confirmed towns at this point?

That is NAI.
Seen scum and town do it.

[farside22]

Tell me what you think the point of your question really will do here.
You focus on a line line sentence over the whole process it took to get there
or you aren't paying attention
Or your scum

What's the point of answering these accusations? I'm almost to the point of ignoring your tunneling.

And if i did try to save her i would push a counterwagon, not vanity vote

Add that protecting Kuroi who has done next to nothing in regards to scum hunting and being okay with that.

Other than lynching scum, you're absolutely right.

I'd lynch Basic.

Sweet!

Vote: basic

Why does this feel like a vote that only stemmed from Basic's disagreement with Farside about me?

Kuroi is self-conscious of his 6 scum reads, that's not-so-townie thinking.

At the time of your posting, it was five. Now, it's four. Four is a much better number. Either way, how is being self conscious not townie-like? I don't have all the answers to who scum are. ...Do you?

Farside's dancing around and voting ~14x so far today kind of worries me.

Mostly the same players?

Tell me why that bothers you.
You also avoided the question I asked you.
You keep just lurking about though.

Vote: Anka

It bothers me because you're voting everyone other than someone I scum read, so it makes me feel like one of us is absolutely terrible at reading people or one of us is scum. Also, it makes you appear antsy to change your vote every other post, and your antsiness is making me nervous.

And I happen to see a huge contrast in your play from Princess Bride Mafia, when you were town.

I am not going to be bullied into voting some1 who I think is town. sorry.

Ok.

@Wisdom

- I'll join you on a Mollie lynch once Max isn't the leading wagon.

MoI, join me. VOTE: Pirate

PROD DODGING

I haven't ISO'd you, but I don't see a lot of contribution from you, as of late.

Sorry guys, havent read the last 30 pages of day2, but did look over Hebichan ISO.

Vote: KuroiXHF

Hebi attacked him as scum, flipped his opinion the next week.

Hebi attacked him as scum, flipped his opinion the next week.

And?

It's suspicious.

No it isnt

Because......

OK. I'm back from V/LA.

I'll get back to you all today.

This... We need more from you. I'm fine if you scum read me, but my lord - even Farside is giving me something. What you consider suspicious and "because" is not acceptable in Day Two when there's so much more to go after.

Oooo wall of crap.
Sure I'll play along.
Your question again had to do with one sentence.
Not the full post and it was useless.
If not explain the point.
Second, the majority of players are not voting for who your calling scum. While your voting a play who says she can prove herself, you seem eager to lynch for no real scum reason noted above.

I voted for basic because I said I would, nice of you to miss that.
I've actually changed my views on the player, you know the novel concept of thinking and evaluate players and junk.
As for princess bride, that was dealing with a player that pissed me off and instead of shifting over the thread about him I held back in an effort not to make an argument with said player. Other then that no fucking difference at all.

On that note, the weak pushes from kuroi on players should one day smack others in the face.

[farside22]

Hebi, you voted me for not being impressive, although you didn't think I'm scum?

Do you not understand what Mafia is? Scum are SCUMMY (hence the name). We don't call people likely to be scum Unimpressive.

That's not what I was saying at all...

I scumread you when I voted you, you hadn't done anything impressive, as in townie, since then, so I didn't understand people townreading you.

However, since you also did not do anything scummy since then, and pirate mollie did something scummy, and much worse than you, I decided to vote there.

Seriously, are you this bad at reading context? Each post does not exist in a void. Get some reading comprehension.

You're squirming. Like I said before, being unimpressive does NOT equal scumminess.

My friends, hebicham is scum. I say that because I think too highly of this player than to truly think they're this backwards.

Hebi, you voted me for not being impressive, although you didn't think I'm scum?

Do you not understand what Mafia is? Scum are SCUMMY (hence the name). We don't call people likely to be scum Unimpressive.

That's not what I was saying at all...

I scumread you when I voted you, you hadn't done anything impressive, as in townie, since then, so I didn't understand people townreading you.

However, since you also did not do anything scummy since then, and pirate mollie did something scummy, and much worse than you, I decided to vote there.

Seriously, are you this bad at reading context? Each post does not exist in a void. Get some reading comprehension.

You're squirming. Like I said before, being unimpressive does NOT equal scumminess.

My friends, hebicham is scum. I say that because I think too highly of this player than to truly think they're this backwards.

I believe I remember the only game we played together being the one where I lynched almost all down town lines despite my good reads.

I don't think you know me well enough to make this claim.

I know your reasoning, and there is an entire huge break in logic. Unless you know a process greater than logic, I can say you're full of BS.

Quoting what seemed like a greater experience with a player.
She questions it.
You call her behavior BS.
I mean I for example can say kuroi logic is BS, especially since he never expressed a scum read on mollie but would that mean I could sit on that alone for my reason to scum read you?

[farside22]

I refuse to read those walls

The TLDR is Kuroi is voting mollie because he supports moi desire to lynch her for not voting his way.
And he finds me scummy for voting a player he's not voting.
True Story.
Oh and apparently meta that is vague and let's did I miss something........I'm voting too many different times.

Let me know if I missed anything there kuroi.

[farside22]

Day 2, VC 13

Maxous (6)

-

MagnaofIllusion, Young and Witless, SirCakez, Wisdom, MariaR, My Other Head Is Scum

SirCakez (2)

-

CatDog, Xkfyu

PeregrineV (2)

-

Maxous, Ankamius

KuroiXHF (2)

-

farside22, PeregrineV

Ankamius (2)

-

pirate mollie, DrippingGoofball

Young and Witless (1)

-

BlueBloodedToffee

Wisdom (1)

-

Basic

pirate mollie (1)

-

KuroiXHF

With 17 alive, it takes 9 to lynch! Deadline is on September 5th at 10:00 PM(GMT+1) or in (expired on 2016-09-05 22:00:00).

Mod Notes -
MagnaofIllusion is on V/LA until August 29th
Xkfyu is on V/LA until August 29th
KuroiXHF is on V/LA until August 29th

Huh I thought I voted Anka after, we'll just keep the vote there mod.
I'm pretty satisfied sitting there the rest of day 2

[farside22]

Okay so I was wrong on one thing.
Kuroi apparently ha mentioned mollie as scum for some vague meta reason.
Quotes bellow for reference.

THAT is what I was getting at with my questions. I was wondering if he had an amount (or close) of scum games/town games cos there is a thing called scum fatigue where some1 has played scum so often even their town games look scummy cos they just naturally have developed a scummy mindset. I was trying to negate a false positive line of thinking if I was reading him incorrectly. its that he refused to answer the question is what makes me wonder about him but actually that kind of makes him seem a little townish I think. mebbe. I am more concerned about wis's insta-defense of him.

A lot of effort and confusion and dilly dally for not a lot of results. I don't know how you could have asked me, or anyone I've played with and wait for an answer. The answer is yes, BUT the other way around. With the exception of ongoing games - and we all know why I can't comment on ongoing games - I have been recently scum. Here's the thing. It's the other way around. I've been lynchbait long before I've ever been scum.

You should put your vote on a major wagon Farside.

I don't like this post. It doesn't discuss the issues and just recites, "Fuck it. Just vote someone so we can move day along and move to our night actions."

You should put your vote on a major wagon Farside.

Sure, I can do that.

Vote: hebichan

I don't like this easier. Right now, that post is telling me, "Oh, of COURSE, scum buddy!"

Hi farside

You're cute and all but your going to have to explain how those 3 questions = what you just stated.

Wisdom's question to me is very difficult to answer since it's so vague and open-ended. Very small addition is that it's a meta-type question, which he should be aware I don't put much stock into unless I believe I have a good shot at reading someone accurately based on it.

Wisdom's response to the case picks at the most vague point in a way that makes any answer easier to dismiss, but just outright dismisses the rest. This is the main one that caught my eye, since I can see this one being scum-motivated the most out of all three.

Wisdom's final post has the same type of tone as the second one; it's a weird observation to point out since Maxous has been adamant in scumreading YAW, who he is already voting for.

Basically, I get the sense that Wisdom is trying to shape rather than solve the game because they all feel like he's setting traps instead of trying to forward the game.

Yeah. Ankamius is town. When I was scum with him in ASOIAF Mafia, I seem to remember him largely flying under the radar.

hm

UNVOTE: KuroiXHF

@mollie: convince me on YAW?

What was this sudden unvote about, Ank? It seemed kinda awkward.

I've been speaking to Ankamius about this for a while now. Check my ISO.

Talk to me about them, I'm in the process of rereading D1

I'm training someone at work so all I can do at this very second is to tell you who I scumread:
pirate mollie
MariaR - slightly
CatDog
Maxous
PeregrineV - slightly

Talk to me about them, I'm in the process of rereading D1

I'm training someone at work so all I can do at this very second is to tell you who I scumread:
pirate mollie
MariaR - slightly
CatDog
Maxous
PeregrineV - slightly

Alright, I can explain a bit on my scum reads.

Pirate Mollie - It's pretty obvious. She's reaching. She reminds me nothing of the town Mollie I've played with.
Catdog - I haven't liked a damn thing that they've voted, although I feel itching to switch to someone else.
MariaR - Not even comfortable in her own clothes and she's throwing scum tells, but it could just be her. Her old slot-fill hasn't pinged me super hard.
Maxous - I'm really thrown off by his posts.
PeregrineV - All I have is that his silence seems to be something he's consistently done as scum, so I'm actually quite suspicious.

I quoted the first post since that was prior to Hebi lynch and how fake the concern is based on his lack of vote change.

[farside22]

Oh and wisdom shouldn't you ask kuroi to vote max too and be pissy with him for not switching too?
That'd be awesome if you had that exchange too, since your passing in xkfuy cheerios for not seitching.

[farside22]

Well if you can’t explain why I’m wrong on my scum read I can’t really work with you if you are going to fight tooth and claw against my preferred lynch then very well can I? I mean your reason for not supporting it is “I don’t like one particular vote and I’m not in a hurry”. To which I can say .. Ok.

When have I only looked at one player at a time exactly? I’ve had multiple scum reads this game and just because I’m pressing Maxous strongly doesn’t mean I don’t have others.

Sorry I missed this.
I think you and I feel the same about different players.
I feel like if I let this go players are going to keep letting kuroi slide by based on day 1.
I'm betting you feel the same about max.
I can respect that.
I just need to know that he doest get a free pass.
I may let this go if max flips scum. Idk, everything he post just reads desperate to me.

[farside22]

I did vote Max. My vote was on him for like the last... four days or something like that?

But I'd rather Mollie gone than Maxous. I'll vote Maxous again if need be, but I really don't think Mollie is town.

Mollie says she can prove herself. Not sure why you think she's lying about that, since I don't recall you mentioning her soft claim.
Also I don't recall you voting max, I would like that quoted if you did.

[farside22]

Oh shit. You're right. I thought I voted Max.

And I also seemed to have missed her soft claim. When was that?

You really want me to believe that whole time you were scum reading hebi you never saw that interaction between mollie and her?

[farside22]

Okay I checked some of the links from anak, not the hydra ones, since I personally think players lie about whose posting.
Anyways long story short I'm going to say it is a good point towards leaning null town to null for playstyle.

[farside22]

I'm not following players who think mollie is scum.
Sc: what motive does scum mollie have, when she says her ability self resolves when a playerror dies?

[farside22]

@basic:
It's something I see more often then not with scum.
You want to call kuroi someone who is thinking things through or following scum reads based on day 1 reads, I'd look at you sideways.
If you can point to a good reason that kuroi has the scum reads he has currently that isn't vague that may sway me.
But so far I see weak pushes and scum bussing.
Thanks for your input.
I like your points on xfyl (or however you spell it). It gave me something to chew on and think about throughout the game.

[farside22]

Although back to Ank, im not exactly willing to follow him with BBT and DGB.

Again, Magna is the one saying BBT and DGB might be scum, not Ank

I think the confusion is that Anka voted for one of them.

[farside22]

I'm not following players who think mollie is scum.
Sc: what motive does scum mollie have, when she says her ability self resolves when a playerror dies?

that is not what I am saying. nowhere did I say that.

are you going to respond to my post? cos what is happening here is exactly what pie did in YOUR game, I am telling you there are scum who are pushing the players who have claimed. the town players who were pushing me were beeboy (who is genuinely fucking awful) and lld who hates playing town. there is no1 here like that..

not to mention that the hard push/deathtunneling on max is textbook to what a cw looks like, I shld know since I spent the entire game in summer watching cw after cw spring up against cake boy. like that is what happening here. I just can't figure out if it is kuroi or cake boy or fuck mebbe it is both.

I don't even feel like playing anymore. town is going to lose why cos wis is scum and no1 cares. and this happens in every game where he is scum. EVERY SINGLE 1.

kuroi's whole scum agenda is to paint the person who is calling him scum as either crazy or mentally deficient. he does this specifically to female players and I don't understand how he gets away with it.

I am sorry, I don't mean to be a debby downer but this is fucking depressing.

I'm sorry.
I thought your ability self resolved based on someone's death.
That was how it was implied.
I'm voting Kuroi if you haven't noticed.

[farside22]

Pere is giving me the jitters. Someone smack me if I don't go back to reevaluate him.

[farside22]

4. KuroiXHF- It's complicated

Is there anyway to rephrase this that doesn't look like we're the Facebook relationship status of a high school couple and you saw me having lunch with someone else?

I think your daylong ride on Hebi looks bad. I don't like your 1002.

But, for the most part I do like your posting and find it town.

But, I am notorious (in my eyes) for having the wrong reads, (at what I feel are the worst times). Most recent is townreading Mirhawk for his play.
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p8210866
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p8211570

This is the most recent example, but needless to say, if I am townreading you but no one else is, I know I'm probably wrong.

Vote: peregrine

[farside22]

lol more counterwagons on lynchbait

2 votes till scum is lynched

There is a big part of me that what's to point out that you didn't feel the hebi lynch and jumped off that wagon and now feel so certain about max that is to point of calling everyone scum because they aren't following you.
Just wonder is hypocrisy in your nature?

[farside22]

That's also my subtle way to say fuck off too
<3

[farside22]

Yet it makes a convincing case for Wisdomtown.

Idk.
I just felt the need to have wisdom take a chill and have a cold dose of reality.
There is still 2 players I'm waiting on.
One is SC and the other is catdog.
Pretty sure max will be lynched regardless do to stubborn players and 2 I'm scum reading.
Max being Mia for this too makes me also go why bother

[farside22]

Apparently I missed some posting in my quick read.

[farside22]

VOTE: Maxous

This couldn't have been scum. This must be a VERY terrible town move.

This is my shock face at kuroi going to attack players on the max wagon after being okay with the lynch himself.

[farside22]

I haven't really been following this game for a while. Not sure I'm comfortable with a Maxous lynch but I'm not town reading him strongly enough to fight against it either so meh.

Kuroi looks like a good lynch.

Why is Kuroi better then Max?

I'm not following players who think mollie is scum.
Sc: what motive does scum mollie have, when she says her ability self resolves when a playerror dies?

It's a fakeclaim that "confirms" her and is evidently doing a good job keeping her away from the rope.

4. KuroiXHF- It's complicated

Is there anyway to rephrase this that doesn't look like we're the Facebook relationship status of a high school couple and you saw me having lunch with someone else?

I think your daylong ride on Hebi looks bad. I don't like your 1002.

But, for the most part I do like your posting and find it town.

But, I am notorious (in my eyes) for having the wrong reads, (at what I feel are the worst times). Most recent is townreading Mirhawk for his play.
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 6#p8210866
http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.ph ... 0#p8211570

This is the most recent example, but needless to say, if I am townreading you but no one else is, I know I'm probably wrong.

Vote: peregrine

This is murdering my townread on you

VOTE: Maxous

This couldn't have been scum. This must be a VERY terrible town move.

There's a clear on her ding dong

Headsmack
Smack head on desk repeat lynch
Hope's to die tonight.

[farside22]

VOTE: Maxous

This couldn't have been scum. This must be a VERY terrible town move.

This is my shock face at kuroi going to attack players on the max wagon after being okay with the lynch himself.

You're not paying attention.

HAhaha I did misread that.

[farside22]

not to mention that the hard push/deathtunneling on max is textbook to what a cw looks like,

what
Counterwagon to who?

I think that max is a counter to scum!kuroi

OR scum peregrine.

I didn't care for PeregrineV post about how he is woah as me in regards to his reads and sheeping others.

[farside22]

not to mention that the hard push/deathtunneling on max is textbook to what a cw looks like,

what
Counterwagon to who?

I think that max is a counter to scum!kuroi

Uhmm... When have I ever had more than one vote (maybe two votes) on me at any given moment in Day Two when we've had bigger bandwagons in others?

If you're going to pay this much attention to me, can you please let me know when my driver's license is about to expire? The RMV/DMV doesn't send reminders anymore.

I think it got to 4 votes there.
I think your license expires in about 3 years too.

In regards to max.
If town weak reason's for voting were sc, kuroi and Maria in my oppinion.

[farside22]

Hey we are both wrong because mollie voted you before I switched to peregrine and that lasted vote count happened.

[farside22]

Peregrine, cakez, xk, mollie are my guesses if Maxous flips town

xk and Catdog if he flips scum

*adds wisdom back onto scum list*

[farside22]

Goading=wisdom
My POV at least.

[farside22]

Goading=wisdom
My POV at least.

goading is what you did in this post

tell me more

I'm saying that Wisdom is goading you on purpose.
I think anyone that has ever played with you knows how you get.

[farside22]

magna's real estate has plummeted

Well we are in agreement on this (in cross reading each other) then because I stopped Town reading you today when you spent too much time worried about people calling you scum with your supposedly self-resolving role.

I'm, however, intrigued that your Town read on me mostly seemed to occur when you thought you had an ally against Wisdom and when that seemed to evaporate suddenly you "don't get what I'm doing".

What I'm doing was pretty clear. Pushing through a lynch on my top scum read. If it turns out that Maxous is telling the truth I'll go back to the drawing board tomorrow if I live through the Night.

I thought mollie was pushing her top scum read.
You were pushing your top scum read and I pushed mine.
Mollie may still be salty from how badass female mafia went.

[farside22]

but yeah, arguing that the maxous wagon was a counterwagon to anyone is bullshit

Wagon starts growing on Pere, suddenly lynch happens on max.
Forgive me for not be a touch cynical on your oppinion.