Mini Theme 2112: Skyrim Mod Upick Town Win

[Zenith]

Hello everyone! Any skyrim fans here? I predict that this will be a fun game. May your dragons never fly backwards.

Also, I'm not sure what this means: "The voting in the rest of the day phase will be plurality at deadline."
Though locking private threads doesn't sound like a bad idea, so VOTE: Thief Stone.

[Zenith]

Stealth archer. They all end up as stealth archers anyway, might as well do it on purpose.

Disappointed I didn't get my colored arrows mod. I have a couple of ideas, but they can wait for morning, just turning in at almost half past 1AM.

Bound bow fav spell. <3

[Zenith]

Never a good idea to claim scum, but lately it seems like there's one every season..

Last time it was done by town, but still kinda makes me want to start policy lynching such behavior. =p

[Zenith]

Where da skooma at?

[Zenith]

Personally, I'd prefer a D2 mass flavor claim.

[Zenith]

alimdia's now mocking me for not being able to talk in the neighbourhood - it's quite demoralising :/

idk Sujimichi should i not have? it's not locked btw - i'm just not allowed to speak there

What exactly do you mean when you say you aren't allowed to speak there?

Did the mod or your role forbid it? Are you not allowed to explain? Asking because I'm confused.

No, see, there are actions that are less-than-competent and actions that are blacklist worthy. Scumclaims, in my opinion, fall in to the latter category, only now I have two of them because sujimichi felt like doing it to so now I just hate everyone. I may simply ask to be replaced out of this game with apologies to JJH, have not decided yet.

I feel similarly, though not as strongly, and I wouldn't want to replace out.

@Anyone
May I have permission to vote for Blatant Scum?

[Zenith]

The rules for thief stone technically don't forbid posting in PTs. I would assume if a thread is meant to be locked but isn't, then the Dusk rule would apply, though I could be wrong. Rule #3.

[Zenith]

@Anyone
May I have permission to vote for Blatant Scum?

As long as it is not a hammer, yes.

Do you want me to vote for you? If so, then why? If not, then why grant permission?

[Zenith]

@Anyone
May I have permission to vote for Blatant Scum?

As long as it is not a hammer, yes.

Do you want me to vote for you? If so, then why? If not, then why grant permission?

Poke.

My D20 rolled 18.

[Zenith]

@Anyone
May I have permission to vote for Blatant Scum?

As long as it is not a hammer, yes.

Do you want me to vote for you? If so, then why? If not, then why grant permission?

Poke.

My D20 rolled 18.

Do you have any other thoughts as to what has transpired in this game besides a lack of response from Blatant Scum?

Yes.

[Zenith]

Will you please share them?

Nothing really worth sharing yet.

[Zenith]

@Anyone
May I have permission to vote for Blatant Scum?

As long as it is not a hammer, yes.

Do you want me to vote for you? If so, then why? If not, then why grant permission?

I really can't stop you from voting me, can I?

If you could stop me from voting for you, would you want to?

Will you please share them?

Nothing really worth sharing yet.

I disagree. Your thoughts on other players, however minor you may think them, help establish your viewpoint and creates content with which to assess yours, and others', alignment. By withholding them, I am forced to think you do not actually have any.

You're welcome to think whatever you want. I pay attention and keep personal notes. Have released personal notes pt to public at the end of completed game before.

[Zenith]

Also saying something like "I didn't do it, and even if I did it's not bad," is hardcore lawyer talk, and, yeah, you guessed it, pretty damn scummy.

Agree ^

[Zenith]

Will you please share them?

Nothing really worth sharing yet.

I disagree. Your thoughts on other players, however minor you may think them, help establish your viewpoint and creates content with which to assess yours, and others', alignment. By withholding them, I am forced to think you do not actually have any.

You're welcome to think whatever you want. I pay attention and keep personal notes. Have released personal notes pt to public at the end of completed game before.

I mean... finding scum by yourself is only part 1. part 2 is convincing everyone else that you are right. If you're only doing part 1, you're doing us a great disservice.
Secondly, I don't understand the relevance of releasing personal notes at the end of the game, by that point the game is over - going "I was right!" doesnt really help anyone.
Finally, imagine if everyone says what you said - that they have their own reads but aren't sharing them. Do you think the game will progress or will it stagnate?

Yes I have thoughts. I pay attention to the game, think about things, take notes, etc.
Not really any unshared thoughts worth sharing yet. Keyword yet, so chill. Sharing every single thought I have would be spammy, distracting, and pointless.

The relevance of my mentioning my notes pt is as a response in direct counter to your claim that my lack of sharing thoughts not worth sharing has resulted in you somehow being forced to think I do not actually have any thoughts.

Sure obviously if nobody wanted to say anything ever, the game would stagnate. But i've been participating. I'm not the most active player ever, but I'm not inactive either, so I don't see what the problem is. Right now I think there is plenty of more interesting noise to sort through without me sharing every stray thought crossing my mind. I don't see a reason to share how Kmd4390's avatar weirds me out, or how when looking at Saffron Ghost's avatar I keeping wondering wth that is. Nor do I see a benefit to commenting on every troll/joke post, or restating something that someone else already pointed out, and so on.

TLDR I'll say what I say when I say it. If you have a problem with that, then I don't know what else to tell you. Cept maybe to have some patience, and it would be nice if you could give me the benefit of the doubt and assume that I know how the game works until I demonstrate otherwise. No need to point out the benefits of sharing and activity.


That aside, I've expressed my thoughts on scum claiming. I've sorted Blatant Scum enough that I think probably best to set that puzzle aside for now and let it sort itself out. I've also pointed out why I find alimdia scummy.

@Anyone
May I have permission to vote for alimdia?

[Zenith]

Sry haven't slept in a while and thought #269 was Sujimichi. Guess I'm off to bed then..

[Zenith]

Not selecting my stone may bring side effects. Increasing severity the longer I go without it, but nothing too serious.

[Zenith]

You're welcome to think whatever you want. I pay attention and keep personal notes. Have released personal notes pt to public at the end of completed game before.

I think you miss the point. Withholding your thoughts does not help advance the game, and sharing them does. I do not see the benefit to town for you to withhold them.

Blue green 42 burritos mmm sriracha kittens moonlight nefarious rasta beetle.

Sharing every thought would be a antitown. Not witholding anything worth sharing.

@Anyone
May I have permission to vote for alimdia?

Why are you asking permission to vote for someone again?

Why not?

Not selecting my stone may bring side effects. Increasing severity the longer I go without it, but nothing too serious.

Do you hard claim drug addict?
Does this get solved with your death?

Huh? Don't know what that means.

[Zenith]

Also saying something like "I didn't do it, and even if I did it's not bad," is hardcore lawyer talk, and, yeah, you guessed it, pretty damn scummy.

Agree ^

This is the extent of you pointing out why I'm scummy btw.

What more reasoning do I need to find you scummy?
Posts 243 and 244 were pretty sus..

Also what's this thing you're doing where you ask everyone for permission to vote for someone? Do what you wish so that people can judge you for it later, not pawn it off on groupthink.

I would like to vote you. I asked for permission to vote you. How is asking for permission pawning anything off on group think? I'm not sheeping or asking who to vote.

Nobody has given permission yet either.

If someone, anyone could just humor and grant permission each time I ask, then we could pretend I never asked and functionally it wouldn't matter.

[Zenith]

You're welcome to think whatever you want. I pay attention and keep personal notes. Have released personal notes pt to public at the end of completed game before.

I think you miss the point. Withholding your thoughts does not help advance the game, and sharing them does. I do not see the benefit to town for you to withhold them.

Blue green 42 burritos mmm sriracha kittens moonlight nefarious rasta beetle.

Sharing every thought would be a antitown. Not witholding anything worth sharing.

@Anyone
May I have permission to vote for alimdia?

Why are you asking permission to vote for someone again?

Why not?

So what you are saying is that you have no opinions or reads about everyone else? Since that's what we're trying to get you to share, not what you ate for breakfast.

Also...1) you never asked permission to vote for people in your other games.
2) by asking everyone, you attempt to remove responsibility from yourself

Nonsense.
VOTE: alimdia

[Zenith]

You're welcome to think whatever you want. I pay attention and keep personal notes. Have released personal notes pt to public at the end of completed game before.

I think you miss the point. Withholding your thoughts does not help advance the game, and sharing them does. I do not see the benefit to town for you to withhold them.

Blue green 42 burritos mmm sriracha kittens moonlight nefarious rasta beetle.

Sharing every thought would be a antitown. Not witholding anything worth sharing.

@Anyone
May I have permission to vote for alimdia?

Why are you asking permission to vote for someone again?

Why not?

So what you are saying is that you have no opinions or reads about everyone else? Since that's what we're trying to get you to share, not what you ate for breakfast.

Also...1) you never asked permission to vote for people in your other games.
2) by asking everyone, you attempt to remove responsibility from yourself

Nonsense.
VOTE: alimdia

Nonsense? That's all you got?

That's the summary of your comments I was responding to.

So basically you think speaking in 'lawyer talk' = I'm scum.

Not quite what I said. Close though.

So what you are saying is that you have no opinions or reads about everyone else? Since that's what we're trying to get you to share, not what you ate for breakfast.

Not even close to what I said. Also a strange thing to suggest given the previous quote containing a read or opinion about someone else.

Also...1) you never asked permission to vote for people in your other games.
2) by asking everyone, you attempt to remove responsibility from yourself

1. So what? What's your point?
2. Howso? Seems like non-sequitur combined with baseless and incorrect assertion. I'm responsible for my actions and votes. That doesn't somehow change just because I ask for permission to vote. I'd also prefer if someone anyone would simply humor my request and grant permission each time. That way functionally we could pretend I never asked, because there wouldn't be a functional difference between my always being given permission to vote, and the always having permission to vote that everyone else enjoys without asking.

So misrep, attempt to strawman, non-sequitur, and erroneous assertion; or summed up: nonsense.

[Zenith]

I'm not a fan of hammering without declaration of intent. Among other reasons, it seems a bit rude. Declaring intent and giving time for a claim, also allows consensus to be reached that everyone on the wagon truly wants the person lynched. I've more thoughts on the topic but want to post before thread is locked.

I also don't view effort levels as AI, outside of perhaps rare exceptions like an individual meta read or something.

[Zenith]

But why? Why suddenly decide to start doing this?

Why does it matter?

If it helps you out, maybe let's say that pluto is in retrograde?

[Zenith]

Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn! ABKCEHIIILRSSV

It's time for mass flavor claim. I don't think claim order is important. Just the name of your mod please. I would like to see a mod name claim from everyone, after which I'll explain my crumb above.

[Zenith]

Why?

Reasons.

Just do it please.

I'll explain after.

[Zenith]

If you don't claim your mod name, then you don't want to catch scum..

[Zenith]

I'm telling you, if you don't comply with my request then you don't want to catch scum.

[Zenith]

In other words, if you want to catch scum, please comply with my request.

[Zenith]

I'm telling you, if you don't comply with my request then you don't want to catch scum.

With due respect, you haven’t explained how flavor will catch scum whilst one has already been caught so I am inclined to ignore your request.

I said that I will explain afterwards.

I'm trying to catch scum here, I have good reasons, and will explain afterwards. That should be enough for now so please humor me. Will you please help me to catch scum?

[Zenith]

And by afterwards, I mean immediately afterwards. Not D3 or some shit.

[Zenith]

Personally, I'd prefer a D2 mass flavor claim.

Reasons dammit.

[Zenith]

Hi I haven't read this game what should I know.

You can start by revealing your mod. Just the name of your mod please.

[Zenith]

Sneak Tools

Thanks you. <3

[Zenith]

As for stone, I'm willing to vote for anything other than the mage stone.

I expect a good explanation following.

Right after everyone claims.

[Zenith]

Anyway my mod is

Mod: Localised [redacted] Guild Jobs

Thanks.

@anyone
Redaction is fine. Assuming your mod name is longer than one word, if you prefer to reveal just a single word of your mod name, that's acceptable.

[Zenith]

VOTE: Warrior stone
I'm ok with warrior or thief.

As I stated, my mod contains my role. Should I really claim it?

Just one word from your mod name is enough, as long as the word is quoted directly from your mod name.

[Zenith]

TL on Eve

[Zenith]

Still waiting for Dongfish, Blatant Scum, and Aeronaut. Last one to participate earns a frowny face sticker. x,x

Anyway my mod is

Mod: Localised [redacted] Guild Jobs

I don't mind the redaction.

That said, I'm more curious about the reason for the redaction than I am about what was redacted. If you don't mind sharing, is there any particular reason you chose to redact?

[Zenith]

How did I manage to sneak into town core?

At the least, if I'm correct then you don't seem to be scum.

I'll be around tonight to see what's going on here, but for now

VOTE: Eve

Eve is town.

[Zenith]

Kind of sad that nobody has a skooma mod..

[Zenith]

Kind of sad that nobody has a skooma mod..

What’s that mod?

Well, there's more than one skooma mod, but here's an example: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/65259

Short description

A quest mod seamlessly intertwined with the vanilla thievesguild questline leads you to a fully operational skooma lab. There you will meet the main quest giver - Da'rhakaz - a master skooma 'cook'. Through the series of around 10 smaller quests 'Skooming Skyrim' will let you become a true Skyrim Skooma Dealer. 'Cook' skooma, upgrade your lab, distribute your product, master the art of 'cooking', make the right connections, dispose of too many 'cooks', and stay under cover so the drug enforcers won't catch you, and maybe soon you will become Skyrim's Druglord.

[Zenith]

zenith likes drugs, everyone

Shhh.. It's just some skooma.. What are ya, a milk drinker?

I've logged over a thousand hours on single playthrough of vanilla skyrim, but don't have pc so never played modded. Though I've dreamed about being able to quaff some skooma then maybe run around nekkid for a while before running into this monstrosity, summoning my bound bow, and fighting for me life..

Spoiler: Nightmare Fuel

Or for some real nightmare fuel:

[Zenith]

I asked for that mod but I didn’t get it!!

I also asked for thomas the tank dragon lul. I guess it's popular.
Also asked for DBZ mod.
Didn't get either.
Happy with my role though. I'll be claiming it soon.

[Zenith]

Still waiting for Dongfish, Blatant Scum, and Aeronaut. Last one to participate earns a frowny face sticker. x,x

So Aeronaut is Immersive College of Winterhold.
Here's your frowny face: =(

[Zenith]

Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn! ABKCEHIIILRSSV

It's time for mass flavor claim. I don't think claim order is important. Just the name of your mod please. I would like to see a mod name claim from everyone, after which I'll explain my crumb above.

Spoiler: claims

Sneak Tools

CBBE.

Anyway my mod is

Mod: Localised [redacted] Guild Jobs

Mine is ESF Companions. I don't know what that is because I've never played Skyrim.

I'm also Warrior based.

Technically my mod name is apocalypse

ok "Khajit" is in my mod name

VioLens.

Still waiting for Dongfish

Really Useful [Redacted]

TiphaineDeath = Immersive Weapons
Pine = Improved World Map with Roads
popsofctown = Scaling Stopper
Which using PoE means Aeronaut is Immersive College of Winterhold.

ABKCEHIIILRSSV:
Apocalypse
Brave Khajit
CBBE
ESF Companions
Here There Be Monsters - The Call of Cthulhu
Immersive College of Winterhold
Immersive Weapons
Improved World Map with Roads
Localised Thieves Guild Jobs
Really Useful Dragons
Scaling Stopper
Sneak Tools
Violens


My mod is: Here There Be Monsters - The Call of Cthulhu
My role is: Oracle
Stone: Mage
And I'm aligned with town.

I have a pretty interesting, creative, and potentially overpowered role,

so I suspect the remaining scum must have something big to balance things out.

Once per night, I can ask the mod a question, from a list of pre-scripted questions, choosing to fill in blank(s) with any single word I feel like using, with player names counting as 1 word.

N1 I asked What's blank's flavor?
Filling in the blank with "everyone".
I received a naked list of every mod name in the game, but not who each mod belongs to.

There are other questions I could choose to ask, but perhaps the most useful are:
I can ask if blank is aligned with blank.
I can also ask if there is a blank in the game.

I can only ask each question once.

Not sure how best to use the blank in the game question, but I might could find a way to word it to detect a third party, or specific role, or I dunno what else so ideas are welcome. Keep in mind that unless it's a player's name it has to be a single word.

Asking if blank is aligned with blank, the obvious choice is to ask if blank is aligned with town, though I could also ask if one player is aligned with another. Seems less appealing than the first option.

Big reason I decided early on to reveal, is to ask for advice on how best to take advantage of my remaining questions.

Choosing the mage stone will not give me a bonus. Not choosing the mage stone will cause strange, mostly minor negative effects, though I have an idea on how to potentially turn a negative into a positive later. After tonight, I'll no longer be able to fill in the blank with the letter E, but don't worry, I'll still be able to use the letter E in the game thread..

I have 1 shot bulletproof, so don't bother wasting protection on me. If scum wants to shoot me twice to be rid of me then so be it. Assuming the game lasts long enough, I survive long enough, and we never use the mage stone, if I use my power every night through N4, I'll be forced to commit suicide at the end of D5. Thankfully this outcome can be prevented by either voting for the mage stone D4, or choosing to not use my power N4. Other than that, I may be a bit eccentric in the game but that's about it.

[Zenith]

Why wouldn’t you let Aeronaut potentially incriminate himself before revealing that?

I'm actually kind of suspicious of you. Because of your quick-hammer on town, but also because based on my role, and Pine's role, plus all the hidden town roles, remaining scum must have something pretty powerful in order to balance things out. Out of all the mod names, your mod Apocalypse sounds like the most likely candidate.

[Zenith]

It’s not actually as powerful as you’d imagine because it’s gated by the antitown Mage Stone.

I was already expecting this. I mean you weren't exactly subtle about wanting the mage stone hammered.

Spoiler: magelust

I am selfish and I want this

VOTE: Mage Stone

Turkey you're not in my townbloc yet but you could be would you like to fill out an application?

I would like to fill out an application

Most of it is the mission statement about laying down your life to protect Sujimichi and popsofctown. You should also list your time zone and whether you are applying as a townie or townsiding SK

Oh that’s easy. On mage path I don’t even need to risk my own life. I will he applying as townsiding SK

VOTE: TD

Woo! Called the Pine scum.

VOTE: Mage Stone

Aeronaut, Dongfish remaining??

I am improved spells mod

I would rather power up either myself on mage or the vig again. Please vote thief.

Though being gated by the mage stone makes me even more suspicious that your ability would be quite powerful if unlocked. If anyone is familiar with d&d and such, the most powerful spells tend to be the most difficult to cast. Anyways, specially given the way you've worded your response above:

It’s not actually as powerful as you’d imagine

because

it’s gated by the antitown Mage Stone.

You've only deepened my suspicion that if unlocked, your role would be quite powerful.

Based on the description of your mod, I could also guess that you have a toolbox.


But yea time for bed. Oh, and if you want to admit that you are hiding something pretty sweet, I'll agree to not seek your lynch today. Afterall, wouldnt want such a thing to go to waste if you are town. Between my 1 shot bulletproof and the mage stone being inactive, I'm pretty confident that I could use my ability to sort you tonight.

On the other hand, if you want to claim your ability is nothing special, maybe you end up getting lynched and I get to spend my ability elsewhere.

Just thinking out loud. Admittedly sleepy thoughts. Goodnight.

[Zenith]

My role is fairly complicated. It is a toolbox. I have a 1-shot commuter ability that I can use independent of stone. I did not use it last night in case a vig or cop used their power on me because i hammered town. If it had been a scum flip, i would have used my commuter ability. My role does have something sweet but that requires Mage level 3. The lower mage levels do have other niche-useful things though.

Well, you sort of fell into a trap, but I'm an E of my word and won't seek your lynch today because I can probably sort you tonight, and if you really are town we are likely to need all the help we can get.

I have serious doubt that you are town though, because the stronger you are the more unlikely it seems. Specially since there is a flipped scum with a role that seemed pretty meh.

So it would seem there are 2, well I guess 3 possibilities.
1. You aren't town.
2. We are facing some serious firepower from scum/potential 3rd party.
3. This game is very unbalanced.

I'm still pretty terrible with setup spec. Not because of an inability to recognize power level distribution, but due to being willfully ignorant of the pool of potential roles, because I enjoy a bit of surprise and learning the roles as I encounter them.

That said, if we remove options 1 and 3, what could we even be up against? It would have to be pretty insane right? I mean, is the dark brotherhood able to recruit new members or something?

What makes you think I’m wooden? Would a wooden player hammer someone without a claim?

Does wooden mean mafia? Because then the answer to your second question is "yes."

Also, I do not agree with Zenith's request now that everything has transpired. I do not believe that flavor alone will be useful in sorting a player's alignment and could actually serve as a distraction.

Flavor, plus flips, plus my role seems potentially useful for setup spec, for reasons I pointed out above.

Once per night, I can ask the mod a question, from a list of pre-scripted questions, choosing to fill in blank(s) with any single word I feel like using, with player names counting as 1 word.

Has the word be in English, or you can use a German word instead?

Nothing specifically states the word has to be english. I considered the idea of using a word from another language, but I don't know enough about other languages to make use of this idea.

I can ask if blank is aligned with blank.

Is anyone aligned with neutrals?
Is (a) Townie/ Goon/ Mafia Scum aligned with Mafia?
I am talking about player's titles. Find a group of 3-4 players with the same title. You can clear all of them. Or narrow our lynch/ vig shooting a little.

Aligned with neutrals sounds good. Any idea how to ask that without an E?
I wonder if shortening Gobbles to Gobs could get around the E rule. I'll ask the mod if nicknames count.
Not entirely sure what you mean by shared titles here because asking if townie/goon/mafia scum is aligned with town seems pointless, but the thought of multiple clears sounds op.

By the way, there is a role blocker here.

I suppose if the role blocker isn't aligned with town we'll find that out soon. If scum wants to focus on me, just means rest of town is free to do whatever. Plus I'm not the vig, and thankfully I don't think the vig has claimed yet, so maybe scum will get shot again. At the end of day, I'll make my night action plans clear, to avoid wasted crossfire.

[Zenith]

@Sujimichi
I also find the redactions interesting, particularly the thief redaction.
But yea I'm not trying to argue that mod names alone like Sneak Tools, Localised Thieves Guild Jobs, Apocalypse, etc are scummy because of flavor. Hell as a Cthulhu oracle know firsthand that even if a mod name sounds evil, it's not AI.

However, looking at a mod description can give a rough idea of what kind of power we are looking at, which can be used for setup spec.

@Blatant Scum
Ok, I see what you mean by titles.
I'm not sure about multiple clears though. Let's say I ask if goons (and specify afterward that by goons I mean the title) are aligned with town. If some are and some aren't, what would the mod answer? Yes no? Hmm.. Although if they are all aligned together then I think it could work for multiple clears or guiltys.

[Zenith]

Why?

Reasons.

Just do it please.

I'll explain after.

If your reasoning is good then there isnt a reason for not disclosing it, yes? Especially if you say that you will tell us later. If you were conf town it would have been a different story but as it stands we will claim but not for you.

Huh?

[Zenith]

Catching up, i havent read up to this point

But then why/how did you already participate in the mass flavor claim if you didn't know about the mass flavor claim?

Still waiting for Dongfish

Really Useful [Redacted]

[Zenith]

I can also ask if there is a blank in the game.

I think that third-party is one word, right?
Even wiki has third-party written with the dash.

I don't know, but the mod just said no to using nicknames to circumvent the E rule.

[Zenith]

I redacted thief since you know.... thief stone.

I don't understand, and this doesn't sound like an actual explanation.

Oh, great, so my ability only activates after the Board and Sword thing is at level 5, and it's only at, what, level 1 now?

So it's highly unlikely I'll even be able to use my powered up ability.

Were you not aware of this prior to your voting Warrior? The reason you stated for voting Warrior was so that you could use your ability.

As I JIST said, I didn't know it had to get all the way up to level 5 on Board and Sword. That means there's 3 different board things and Thief already has a level. That means we'd have to vote Warrior Stone four more times JUST to activate some of these powered up PRs.

Voting Warrior Stone let's us talk in our Neighborhood.

The level of paths may change by means other than this vote, and may affect roles in the game. All 3 paths start the game at level 0.

It appears like there are a lot of people that are claiming not to have read the thread, the rules, or the Role PM well. I do not know that I believe it. How did you just now find out that you had to reach level five before your power was active?

I was going to post the same thing, but you beat me to it.
But yea, ppl wanting lvl 5 stone, it's not likely to happen just from voting for stones.

Also er... Zenith isn't confirmed town from this.

Also Also... I don't see anything in your role that you claimed that stated that you had to ask permission to vote

do you think scum would get a role that powerful?

If I were scum, there's no way I'd be revealing my role, or cooperating with town on how to best use my ability, or making the answers my ability receives public. If I were scum I'd keep that info for the scum team unless pressed for claim, and even then I'd probably claim something much weaker but still true like 1shot alignment investigative. Would scum even need an alignment investigative?

Zenith's role is actually insane did you worship Yog-Sothoth to get that role? i can confirm my mod name is on that list

I requested thomas the tank dragon mod, dbz mod, or lovecraftian horror mod, and this was the result. Never played any mods, but if I could, I'd try all 3, maybe even at the same time, with the skooma drug lord mod thrown in too.

That’s... day 6 at the earliest now

No its not, thief stone was at lvl 2 after that first vote.

And now scum has to decide to kill us early or wait.

Why would scum want to kill you??

Eve is very obviously neither of those, by the way.

From my perspective Eve is locked town pretty strongly.

[Zenith]

From my perspective Eve is locked town pretty strongly.

Why is Eve "locked town" from your perspective?

Reasons. Suffice to say she's my strongest TL right now. By locked, I mean that not much outside of mod confirmation can change that. I'd even be skeptical of someone claiming to have copped a guilty on her.

That doesn't answer my question. You called Eve the Vigilante while raising that it could be a Serial Killer when the probability of a Vigilante was raised prior. Why did you drop that concern?

The best way how to deal with possible SK is to behave to him like to vigi, then decide later game which of these role (s)he is.
I wanted to point out the possibility of SK before I died.

The SK question can likely sort itself out.
I'm a 1 shot bulletproof with SK detection.

[Zenith]

I'm a 1 shot bulletproof with SK detection.

...
Are you going to claim ascetic treestump who doesn't lose ability when lynched too?

No? I don't even know what that means.

It's not like i'm claiming anything new in post 664.

[Zenith]

Finally, I redacted Thief because theres literally a thief stone there...

I don't understand, and this doesn't sound like an actual explanation.

I redacted Thief because theres literally a thief stone path there...

So what? I still don't get it. How are those dots connected? How does there being a thief stone make you reluctant to reveal that your mod name is Localised Thieves Guild Jobs? If your mod name were Localised Mage Guild Jobs would you redact Mage because there's a mage stone? If so, why? I don't understand.

Why would scum want to kill you??

Our mod is Really Useful Dragons and ive claimed that if any stone gets to lvl something happens that we get Mod confirmed during.

You dont think scum might be worried about that?

-Fishy

I don't see why scum would be afraid of a claim about something that might never happen even if the claim were true. Tbh, assuming if I were in scum's shoes right now and you aren't scum, I'd be torn between whether to consider you lynchbait, or if I'd prefer to keep you around for a while because of your playstyle and the effect you have on people. Either way I wouldn't be worried. Waste of an NK until after you are actually confirmed imo. There's a potential vig / sk, cthulhu oracle, and who knows what else scum have to deal with, so if all you got is a claim that getting a stone to lvl 5 will confirm you as town, sorry but you seem like a pretty low priority right now.

[Zenith]

What's CNY?
Also, using my power 4 times without the mage stone means I die.
Lvl 5 on any stone might be too powerful. If we have both an op mage stone power, and an op thief stone power, that's too much op power, meaning scum is likely the owner of one of those op powers.
Because balance.

Assuming fish is being legit town here, I could see their role as being a sort of counterbalance in case ohshit town done fucked up now by making scum insane op.

[Zenith]

What's CNY?
Also, using my power 4 times without the mage stone means I die.
Lvl 5 on any stone might be too powerful. If we have both an op mage stone power, and an op thief stone power, that's too much op power, meaning scum is likely the owner of one of those op powers.
Because balance.

Assuming fish is being legit town here, I could see their role as being a sort of counterbalance in case ohshit town done fucked up now by making scum insane op.

One confirmed town role after several day phases is not a good counterbalance to "scum insane op."

More like throwing us a bone.

If getting one stone powered up buffs town and another stone buffs scum, then maybe should be careful which stone we level.
If I'm able to sort apocalypse as town then maybe we should go with boosting the mage stone, else maybe thief or warrior stone.

@Mod What would happen if the morning phase ends with nobody placing any votes for any stones?

[Zenith]

What's CNY?
Also, using my power 4 times without the mage stone means I die.
Lvl 5 on any stone might be too powerful. If we have both an op mage stone power, and an op thief stone power, that's too much op power, meaning scum is likely the owner of one of those op powers.
Because balance.

Assuming fish is being legit town here, I could see their role as being a sort of counterbalance in case ohshit town done fucked up now by making scum insane op.

So you need the mage stone to level up or just use it 3 times? Additionally, it seems pretty unlikely that any stone gets to 5? Unless we see the warrior stone rise to lvl 2 tonight, which means someone else has a clone of my powers.

No. I don't need the mage stone to use my power, but using my power without the mage stone will cause side effects. Including, if i use my power 4 times without the mage stone, I'll die at the end of the next day.

[Zenith]

Does anyone disagree with my {Mastina, Aeronaut, Wake} grouping?

The other players have had fairly townie isos given the claim stuff going on

Well both Aero and Wake are in my neighbourhood, I highly doubt theres 2 scum in there.

Why?

[Zenith]

Does anyone disagree with my {Mastina, Aeronaut, Wake} grouping?

The other players have had fairly townie isos given the claim stuff going on

Well both Aero and Wake are in my neighbourhood, I highly doubt theres 2 scum in there.

Why?

Well 2 scum in a neighbourhood of 3 doesn't make much sense does it? And they would have probably killed me last night to avoid me from outing the neighbourhood. 2 town 1 scum or 3 town seems more likely, because in the 2 town 1 scum scenario, scum wouldn't dare kill a neighbour since our plan was the other 2 outs each other, whereas 3 town well.. there'd be no killing.

Assuming alignment and neighbors were assigned randomly, or if neighbors were chosen then alignments given randomly, either way post 751 seems like bad reasoning.

I don't see any reason to think that neighborhood and alignment are linked in any way. You could group any random 3 people together and give them a shared PT, wouldn't have any impact on their alignment.

Or put another way, statistically the chances of finding scum in your neighborhood are the same as finding scum in any random grouping of 3 players.

[Zenith]

Perhaps you could use the neighborhood PT to get a better read on people, but I don't think being in a neighborhood in an of itself is AI at all.

[Zenith]

@Zenith I reckon having 2 scum 1 town in a neighbour defeats the purpose. The town would just die quickly and nobody can out anyone. My thoughts anyway

Sorry I'm busy this weekend so I havent gotten back on my promise to look at Aero's post hammer comments

~I reckon having 2 scum 1 town in a [grouping of 3 random players] defeats the purpose. The town would just die quickly and nobody can out anyone.~

Does this comment make sense to you?
If so, why?
If not, then why does it make sense when you replace [groping of 3 random players] with neighborhood?

The only difference I see between a grouping of 3 random players and a 3 player neighborhood is that the neighborhood shares a pt. A 3 player neighborhood is literally a grouping of 3 random players who happen to share a pt, right?

[Zenith]

Neighborhoods of that size are either 2 town, 1 scum or all town.

I would be very surprised if it was 2 scum, 1 town. But then again, it could be if JJH randomly decided the neighbors and didn’t design those three roles specifically to be neighbors together.

Alimidia, what has your content been in the neighborhood?

Do you have any reason to think that neighborhood groupings aren't randomized?

Zenith you could ask if Mastina or Blatant Scum win with town. They don’t have E’s in their name

Are you volunteering yourself to be lynched? Or did you forget our interaction earlier?

i agreed to not pursue your lynch today despite my suspicion, but unless you get lynched or something crazy happens, It's difficult for me to fathom a reality in which I use my alignment investigative check on anyone other than you. You've been outed as having a powerful pr, so tbh because of the off chance that you could be town, my wanting to know your alignment outweighs my suspicion causing me want you lynched.

Heres my gameplan with no objections to our role:
Zenith uses his ability to check if we are of the same alignment with someone else.
If he is of the same alignment, we level up thief to 4 with alims power, lynch someone else besides us and level up thief day 3 to confirm our role and the target we chose. That night zenith can ask jjh if he ever wet his pants or something because we'll autowin after that
If we arent of the same alignment, we lynch them and level up mage. Their flip will confirm us and we will have lynched scum on top of that.
The only problem with this is if zenith is scum. I dont see why scum wouldnt benefit from such a role and this is the problem we need to solve today.

I might could consider asking if you are the same alignment as gobbles. I don't see a clear point to it, but I'm open to being sold on the idea.

We're a hydra

Also, i think alim may have redacted thief because just the word itself has negative connotation. We also redacted dragons just because we could, at least former didnt tell me any reasons he had for that. I think its a non issue.

Dong

I suspect as much, but is this coming from town or scum? If this is the actual reason for the redaction then why not come out and just say so when directly asked about it instead of trying to spin this strange excuse about redacting it because the thief stone exists?

[Zenith]

sEnD hElP pLeAsE

(I realize most people won't get this. To put it simply: I got really really addicted to the above game, Cividilization 2--and it's not hard to understand why when you know what the game is. It is basically "Civilization, as an Idle game". As in. Sid Meiyer's Civilization, probably ~5-inspired, one of THE most infamous timesinks of all time.
Combined with an Idle game, a genre infamous for being a time sink in of itself. And it doesn't have many of the deterrents to most idle games--even when the game slows to a crawl, it still feels like you're managing your empire rather than trying to progress to the next level, or trying to grind and beat a high score, or similar problems many other idle games have; it's completely free of Pay To Win content, meaning there's literally nothing to deter me from playing, soooooo. HELP ME I AM ADDICTED DAMMIT.)

Don't know what this has to do with anything, other than making me want to shake off my game dev rust and produce some idle games. Low effort, low risk, easy to tweak and republish the same game with different look/feel for easy passive income, can take advantage of casino psychology and such if done well. Yea I'd like a piece of that multi-billion dollar per year pie.

[Zenith]

Sorry fellas I'm a bit busy with stuff plus I also wanna let other ppl say shit.

So far we've been trying to mechanically solve stuff and that doesn't really work cos... roleblockers.

Also wish Blatant Scum would reply

You think there's more than one roleblocker? Do you think they are town or scum aligned?

[Zenith]

Everyone... vote Blatant with me please. That's the 3rd time he's avoided my direct question about his roleblocker comment.

I think he's scum fucked up and doesn't know what to say anymore.

Is avoiding a direct question scummy?





@Wake
Neighborhood not being secure sounds like a potentially useful thing. I'd think there could be ways to take advantage of that. Like maybe feeding specific info into the hood, perhaps something seemingly useful to scum, and see if scum take advantage of said info.

Divine manipulation of the threads.

[Zenith]

can someone give me a rundown of what mechanical info is public
pretty pls

There's other more role specific info out there, but here's my roleclaim along with a compilation of everyone's flavor claims:

Post: 567

[Zenith]

˙uǝǝɹɔs ɹnoʎ ʇlᴉʇ ʇsnſ ˙sᴉɥʇ ɥʇᴉʍ op oʇ ʇɐɥʍ ɐǝpᴉ ou ǝʌɐɥ I ʇnq 'ʎɹɹos ɯɐ I ˙ǝʌɐɥ ʇou plnoɥs I ɯɐɹƃoɹd ɐ uɐɹ I

Got it repaired. I accidentally minimalized the program instead of shutting it down.

Good, because that was kind of annoying.

[Zenith]

I don't view hood membership as AI.

[Zenith]

I don't view hood membership as AI.

Thoughts on the assumption that a 3-player NH likely contains at least one Scum?

I, for one, do.

Would depend on the number of living players, and the number of living scum, but seems like it would be the exact same odds as you'd get from randomly picking any 3 players and asking if the randomly chosen group contains at least 1 scum.

[Zenith]

-The factional nightkill has unique kill flavour- False

Whaaaaat???!

If Warrior stone is on, I can change one of this:

-Killing actions cannot be roleblocked- False
-Kill-immune roles (eg bulletproof) are enabled- True
-The factional nightkill has unique kill flavour- False
-Players associated with the Warrior stone can place hammer votes- True
-Players associated with the Thief stone can place hammer votes- True
-Players associated with the Mage stone can place hammer votes- True


I would love to turn on the flavours before dieing.

This doesn't sound like a town role. Why would town want to prevent hammers? 3 nights and only people not associated with any stone would be able to hammer. If there isn't someone who can hammer then scum win the game. And why would a town player need or want to give flavor to factional nightkill??? AND WHY BUFF KILLING ROLES AND DEBUFF MY BULLETPROOF??!

Are you in a 3rd faction??

@Anyone
May I have please permission to vote this?
Please kill it with fire..

[Zenith]

Will defend tommorow.
Don't hammer me.

.....

[Zenith]

Will defend tommorow.
Don't hammer me.

Tbh your whole blatant scum shtick really hurts my brain sometimes..

[Zenith]

I mean.. I tried to mostly ignore it before, specially in rvs, but this is some next level shit.

[Zenith]

Why are we not voting Eve, Alimdia?

Didn't you agree that it was weird she knew we were in a Neighborhood before any of us said anything?

I'm not letting this go until I get solid answers, and I WILL yank at this thread if I have to.

Eve is town.

May I have please permission to vote this?

Please do.

@BS why why why why why do you insist on causing such dissonance..??
VOTE: blatant scum

L-1

[Zenith]

Will defend tommorow.
Don't hammer me.

Why you wait? And still posting anyways??

[Zenith]

You too Blatant Scum, vote Eve with me.

Alimdia mentioned in our NH too that it was weird Eve knew we three were in a NH before we three ever said anything. If she's Scum, then of the the three in our NH is also Scum.

I've seen no evidence that eve knew you were in a neighborhood.
Also, there's no way she flips scum, and lynching her would be a massive waste.

i mean yeah all of that list is things that are beneficial to scum
this reads like hes just full claiming his scum role bc he cant think of anything better to do?
intent.

Friendly neighbour who targeted pop. That would give me night to devest Zenith.

I will use/ not use whatever ability you want me to use. If I use something different (which I won't because then I would claim a role which would give me one night) lynch me.

The factional nk flavor seems benign, but all other abilities are antitown. You being alive is hazardous for town..

1. Pine
2. TiphaineDeath
3. Mastina GuyInFreezer
5. Eve
7. Blatant Scum
11. popsofctown
13. gobbledygook

@ Zenith, ask whether there is scum in primes.
If yes, lynch me.
If not, I am confirmed.

@ Zenith, ask whether there is scum in primes.

"Is a prime aligned with scum?"

Is blank aligned with blank?
Not is "a" blank
From what i understand of the spirit of rules from questioning the mod, I'm not allowed to use substitutions. Single words that need to stand and be understood on their own, so no nicknames or referring to lists or redefining words like to make x mean gobbles and blatant scum, etc. I already used my first question in unexpected way, though within the rules, i doubt the mod is going to give me much if any in the way of wiggle room here.

@Mod
If this sounds about right, please let me know via pm.

[Zenith]

Eve only stated you and Alimdia were in the Neighborhood with her and her explanation was as follows:

alimdia i picked you and Wake to be in my neighbourhood because you were the two i recognised from that normal game we played where Plank won - literally the only reason why

Given that there was an explained reason for the claim (though I do not think it was a good idea), what is your theory for why Eve, as Mafia, would fake claim a Neighborhood with players who are not in a Neighborhood with her?

^

[Zenith]

Is blank aligned with blank?
Not is "a" blank
From what i understand of the spirit of rules from questioning the mod, I'm not allowed to use substitutions. Single words that need to stand and be understood on their own, so no nicknames or referring to lists or redefining words like to make x mean gobbles and blatant scum, etc. I already used my first question in unexpected way, though within the rules, i doubt the mod is going to give me much if any in the way of wiggle room here.

@Mod
If this sounds about right, please let me know via pm.

Mod has agreed that this is correct. I don't think asking about a prime is going to work because it relies on that numbered player list to make sense. My question needs to make sense on it's own, without needing additional text to explain what is being asked. I don't see a problem with using foreign words though.

[Zenith]

I believe you have said you consider your Neighborhood a Masonry; however, alimidia did not get that sense (and in fact stated the opposite). I would like to understand why there is a discrepancy there.

alim thinks theres scum in the hood because she thinks that something eve said was a slip that she was scum, with someone in the hood. i find it fairly ridiculous, and dont think its likely eve was aware of the hood before it was outed.

why i think the hood is all town

:
the thief stone closes PTs.
obviously this means scum cant talk, which is very damaging to scum.
so there has to be a trade off for this.
if there is scum in the hood, there you are fucking scum twice. that makes very little setup design sense.
if the hood is all town, the the counter balance to depriving scum of chat is also depriving town of their soft masonry.
ideal counter balance, setup wise.
i'm quite confident in this setup read.

Agree.

Disagree.

I DO NOT like the idea that all 3 in the NH should be considered Town.

It's not logical and it's not safe.

Agree.

I DO NOT like the idea that all 3 in the NH should be considered Town.

It's not logical and it's not safe.

I agree with this statement. I currently am most suspect of Xtoxm.

Why do you suspect xtoxm?

Bla how could you think the hood was all town while not actually knowing who those hood members you were reffering to actually were?

That post I quoted.
Neighbourhood members are more likely to be town than other people.
Xtoxm's slot post give absolute 0 progress to the game. These two tendencies clashes each other.

False. Neighborhood members are

not

more likely to be town,

nor

are they more likely to be scum. Being in neighborhood isn't AI..

[Zenith]

VOTE: mastina

Yeah we should just lynch the lurker. I don’t think scum BS claims the role he did

BS is the kind of player who joke claims scum and scum slips. What do you think scum BS wouldn't do? And why do you think that?

oh right no wonder the neighbourhood's been so silent lately i thought they were just ignoring me

?
You probably have an inactive neighbour, I can use my scum PR without problems.

scum PT*

mason PT*

Well.
We even decided on our night target.

BS might be scum

I second.

Never a good idea to claim scum, but lately it seems like there's one every season..

Last time it was done by town, but still kinda makes me want to start policy lynching such behavior. =p

I didn't claim scum.
It was a genuine slip.

VOTE: mafia goon

In Forest fire he used the game thread as the link provided when someone requested "one of his scumgames".

I hadn't any other scum game to refer to.

Hi I'm scum.

I didn't do anything which would help the town for the whole game.
Why are you giving me a free pass?
(Not complaining, just curious)

How did I manage to sneak into town core?

There is no way how I can softclaim and not leave myself place for huge variety of fakeclaims. I am a very untraditional role with many abilities. My role may be weak or very strong. I don't know. The abilities are very situational. Claiming might hurt town and I have to claim whole role. Should I claim?

If Warrior stone is on, I can change one of this:

-Killing actions cannot be roleblocked- False
-Kill-immune roles (eg bulletproof) are enabled- True
-The factional nightkill has unique kill flavour- False
-Players associated with the Warrior stone can place hammer votes- True
-Players associated with the Thief stone can place hammer votes- True
-Players associated with the Mage stone can place hammer votes- True


I would love to turn on the flavours before dieing.

[Zenith]

False. Neighborhood members are not more likely to be town, nor are they more likely to be scum. Being in neighborhood isn't AI..

I don’t think you could make this type of absolute statement. For instance, if a mafia member in the neighborhood flipped, would you still say the remaining members’ status as neighbors is NAI?

Yes I would.

It seems unwise to consider being in a neighborhood as AI, unless and until you can show a good reason to assume it is AI, which I've not yet seen.

[Zenith]

It isn't compromise. There shouldn't be two scum in neigborhood. So if the scum is between
Mastina
Wake88
Xtoxm

Mastina is totally scum.

Where is the rule saying there can't be 2 or more scum in a neighborhood? I don't understand why ppl keep making these assumptions about a seemingly random grouping of 3 players..

[Zenith]

UNVOTE:

[Zenith]

Maybe we lynch BS tomorrow, turn on flavor, and maybe chance to vig him tonight if vig wants to?

I don't know what unjester means. Does him getting his wincon mean town can't also win?

[Zenith]

Nvm, the bulletproof.. Hmm

[Zenith]

VOTE: Blatant Scum
I don't see this slot/role as beneficial to town.

Hoping for a good outcome from role madness night actions. Just use your best judgements.

[Zenith]

Gobbletygook and dongfish are aligned.

So we should probably either focus on getting thief or warrior stone to level 5, or else I guess lynching one would confirm the other.

I don't feel well, so taking the day off.

[Zenith]

I think my pool is {Eve, Mastina, alimidia, Wake88}. I have many thoughts on Xtoxm's death, but for now, I will say that from a setup perspective, if I was scum with one of the neighbors (which is now impossible because of the Zenith and Dongfish revelations), I would not have killed the Mage Leveler as I would lose access to my powerful abilities. I could have a stone-independent power, but the better play is to attempt to increase the scum power as much as possible.

I have once again forgotten who is in the neighborhood, so I will need to look up that information to further speculate on this game.

Eve, the answer to why Xtoxm’s flip clears me from a setup perspective is here. I have made it known that I have powerful abilities attached to the Mage Stone. Killing the Mage Leveler makes it much more difficult to get those powerful abilities. Hence, I wouldn’t have made this kill if I was going to kill a Leveler.

How did you know xtoxm is mage stone leveler?

[Zenith]

Why didn't you ask if the neighbours are all aligned?

How? I've been open about how my oracle ability works and have asked for suggestions on how best to use it.

I can still ask if there is a blank in this game, but can't use the letter e.

Also, just curious, but will I be alerted if takes a shot at me and breaks my vest? Not sure how that works.

[Zenith]

VOTE: thief stone

[Zenith]

Why didn't you ask if the neighbours are all aligned?

How? I've been open about how my oracle ability works and have asked for suggestions on how best to use it.

I can still ask if there is a blank in this game, but can't use the letter e.

Also, just curious, but will I be alerted if takes a shot at me and breaks my vest? Not sure how that works.

Well...
Gobbledygook has a 'e' in the name..............................

Yea and?
The E rule was activated after my last question, as a result of using my ability without the mage stone.

How would I have asked if the neighbors were all aligned?

[Zenith]

Who you calling less appealing?

VOTE: Alimdia

Kill it with our

Dragon Fire

Thanks for getting us to lvl 4 guys

Zenith was the one who said that using that question to determine if two players were aligned was a less appealing option than using that question to ask the specific alignment of a single player.

We are currently at Level 3 of the Thief Stone. If we lynch alimdia today, he will not be able to increase the level to Level 4 tonight meaning that we will not be able to reach Level 5 tomorrow.

Normally yes, because i could ask if someone is aligned with town and just know their alignment, but if dong can be confirmed then would confirm both.. Though i guess i could have just checked gobbles and let dong sort itself might have made more sense.. I dunno someone suggested checking dong and someone else and it didnt sound bad. I haven't been feeling well lately and never again do i want to play more than 1 game at a time, because I'm def not at my best. =\

[Zenith]

I'm sorry. I've never replaced out before and never wanted to replace out, but my head just isn't in the right place for mafia right now.

@

jjh927
Please replace me.