Mini Number 2195 | Brutalism | GAME OVER

[Elements]

But I’m trying to judge players based on how they’re viewing the one player I’m most skeptical of.

Yes!
Everyone give their thoughts on me!
Fuel my ego!

[ItalianoVD]

In 415 I mentioned everyone else is null... here’s my feelings on those slots.

Datisi

- Unreadable, but something feels odd. The tone of your posts feel almost like you’re thumbing your nose at us. Like you know something and are toying with us. But maybe that’s just your play style. Now a few of the players have played with you and the atmosphere around you is pretty split. I’ve never played with you so I placed you here based on what those people have said.

Dunnstral

- Is an unreadable players since you play the same as both alignments, which is why I have you as null. All I know is your town games.

Harumi

- As you know I’m currently playing two games with you. This one and the another one and I can’t read you, which is why I have you at null. Your play could come from both town and scum.

Tessa

- You’ve only posted several times and I’d say your posts weren’t bad, but not enough to get a real read on you. It’s why I placed you here.

Elements

- I literally don’t have a read for you. You may be like Dunn and play similar regardless of alignment, but I only have a town game for you and this could be that, but not having a scum game to compare, I can only place you here.

[ItalianoVD]

If these people are scum then bravo, but the tones of RTP and Andres have felt the most like town for me. Pocket or not, whatever, I don’t care, I’ve felt the best when reading your posts.

I feel like Duchess is actually trying to solve the game. Like it doesn’t feel like you’re informed and just doing stuff, but uninformed and trying to figure things out.

Sorry midway as much as you’ve looked like town, you’ve replaced into a slot that I feel/felt is scum. Lunar was playing very different than the two games I played with him. As a townie, even on day one, way more involved and none of those goofy one liners and short answers.

[ItalianoVD]

And don’t question my feelings and guts because that’s all everyone has been doing. No one has a strong case so don’t @ me. You know who you are.

[VP Baltar]

I def want to hear from Italiano and may switch my vote there soon ish.

Why do you wanna hear from me if you’re mind is already made up.

Where did I say my mind was made up? I explicitly said the opposite of that...

[ItalianoVD]

i was writing out my thought/solving process. that's how i play this game, i try to get as much of my thought process out as possible. doesn't matter if it's contradictory or i can't quite explain it or makes me look bad or whatever. i trust that at some point people are going to townread me for the transparency.

You don’t seem to be giving me this same benefit of the doubt, but you want people to just do this for you. Hmm

[Datisi]

But I’m trying to judge players based on how they’re viewing the one player I’m most skeptical of.

Yes!
Everyone give their thoughts on me!
Fuel my ego!

elements can you answer 484 for me please

[Datisi]

i was writing out my thought/solving process. that's how i play this game, i try to get as much of my thought process out as possible. doesn't matter if it's contradictory or i can't quite explain it or makes me look bad or whatever. i trust that at some point people are going to townread me for the transparency.

You don’t seem to be giving me this same benefit of the doubt, but you want people to just do this for you. Hmm

lol excuse me what? what kinda benefit of the doubt am i supposed to be giving you here?

[VP Baltar]

Dunn has given some opinions, and they don’t seem insane to me.

You have literally an opposite opinion from him on your strongest read!

Also, dunn has not really stated opinions beyond gut and tone as far as I can tell. That's either lazy or scummy. Tell me how I'm wrong here?

[Andresvmb]

You have literally an opposite opinion from him on your strongest read!

I don’t know why you keep saying this. Testarossa is not my strongest TR. If I had to say who I think my strongest TR is right now, it would be RTP.

[VP Baltar]

Right now, this summarizes how I’m feeling about slots this game.

Slight Lean Town
{Harumi Ayasato, Testarossa, RTP, RLotus, Green Crayons, Dunnstral}
Neutral
{Duchess, VPBaltar, ItalianoVD}
Slight Lean Scum
{Elements, Datisi, Lunar Martian/midwaybear}

And like, I get you are saying you don't have strong feelings about anyone in the game, but I'm only going off your list. Testa is listed second in that list. Perhaps you are going to say that's a random grouping, but most people try to organize their reads lists from strongest to weakest as a mental organizing tool.

[Andresvmb]

Also, dunn has not really stated opinions beyond gut and tone as far as I can tell. That's either lazy or scummy. Tell me how I'm wrong here?

I’ve already explained my view on Dunn. I don’t have a problem with you disagreeing.

[Andresvmb]

And like, I get you are saying you don't have strong feelings about anyone in the game, but I'm only going off your list. Testa is listed second in that list.

Okay but even if I was organizing them from strongest to weakest, they still wouldn’t be my strongest TR.

[Elements]

i'm interested in why other people not thinking i'm townie (?) is enough to drop me down despite them thinking i'm ~quite towny~?

idk how to read you, so i've outsourced it

[VP Baltar]

My point is that your opinion on dunn doesn't logically flow.

Now, people say illogical things all the time. I certainly do. But if someone came in the thread and had Dunn listed near the top of their town reads list, you can believe I'd be suspicious of that person given how that is clashing with my viewpoint as a town member.

[VP Baltar]

And like, I get you are saying you don't have strong feelings about anyone in the game, but I'm only going off your list. Testa is listed second in that list.

Okay but even if I was organizing them from strongest to weakest, they still wouldn’t be my strongest TR.

Apologies. I was working from memory. SECOND strongest.

[Andresvmb]

In any case, I organize folks in tiers in my head, mostly. And if I had a really strong opinion of someone, you would know. You asked me about Testa already and I gave you an answer. I don’t understand why you’re insisting that it’s my strongest TR when I clarified that already.

In any case, even if they were, that’s not entirely why I’m skeptical of players here. I don’t understand Elements’ entire worldview. I feel they put a Scummy vote down, and I am entirety skeptical of their grouping of players in general. There’s a difference of degree here.

[Andresvmb]

Also, what’s wrong with gut and tone, exactly? It’s D1. There’s no concrete information. Most of what we’re using to read players is based on anyone’s interpretation of anybody else’s words and motivations.

[Datisi]

idk how to read you, so i've outsourced it

?? we've never played together. is there a specific reason why you're not using your own read of me?

[Elements]

idk how to read you, so i've outsourced it

?? we've never played together. is there a specific reason why you're not using your own read of me?

I am using it. It's just influenced by other people's opinions

[Datisi]

ok let me try that again. why do you feel like you cannot read me and that you have to use other people's opinions when you already have a read on me?

[Elements]

I'm not confident I'm right

[VP Baltar]

Also, what’s wrong with gut and tone, exactly? It’s D1. There’s no concrete information. Most of what we’re using to read players is based on anyone’s interpretation of anybody else’s words and motivations.

I mean, in my experience playing with you, you have gotten into some very deep arguments about specifics. The problem with gut and tone is that they are feeling words with no justification. I'm not saying a person can't use them, but if that is the entirety of your case, it sure makes it impossible to pin you to a position if you change your mind later.

I'm all about accountability, and it's impossible to make someone accountable for tone. I'd expect you to get that.

[RLotus]

In post 521, RLotus wrote:
Nah Italiano bites back when he gets scumread as town, the defeatism is the nail in the coffin imo

have you checked any of his scumgames for that?

Yes I found three scum games from him and none of them really work for the scenario he is currently in. One game he got elimmed in rvs, one game he was down to final 3, and one game he was confirmed scum by the tracker. He didn't have the "bite back" that I see him have in his town games, but I wouldn't really expect him to given those scenarios. He also didn't have the defeatism that he has this game, but again I wouldn't expect him to.

[Green Crayons]

RTP's preemptive claim of a secret town tell for Harumi doesn't sit right with me (particularly bc he refuses to engage on it).

Do you think this is something a Partner would do as Scum? Because I seriously doubt it.

dissuading people to join the wagon could be s/s or s/t (or, yes, t/t)

that early on in the game, though, i'd say unlikely to be s/s (getting flashes of duchess/VD here)

also, not sure which way the mixed messages about others joining a Harumi-wagon cuts (s/s, s/t, or t/t). part of why i wanted to talk through with RTP and get his mindset