Mini Number 2195 | Brutalism | GAME OVER

Datisi · Post Post #3000 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:33 am

#3000

also i was talking w georgebailey yesterday and in conversation got reminded of 2157, so i went to reread some parts of that game. and it kinda strengthened my townread on both baltar and andres? even tho i considered baltar town there (due to my own mechanical fuckups) i was feeling uneasy enough about him that i did not want to follow his vote, and i don't feel any such uneasiness here. as for andres, i got reminded of something that hellbooks told me in mason chat, along the lines of "andres is trying so hard to prove he's town here that i'm starting to trust him", and i think it mirrors his behaviour this game. maybe i'm a sucker for self-meta "i cannot play scum like this".

Datisi · Post Post #3001 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:35 am

@green, have you explained why lotus is obvtown iyo?

Andresvmb · Post Post #3002 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:50 am

VOTE: Green Crayons

This needs to be the execution today. You know how VPB wanted to put his foot down yesterday? I’m not dead set on us needing to flip this slot. I’ve made up my mind.

Andresvmb · Post Post #3003 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:50 am

In post 3002, Andresvmb wrote:I’m not dead set on us needing to flip this slot. I’ve made up my mind.

I’m now deadset*

Andresvmb · Post Post #3004 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:51 am

@Datisi @maxwell I think this needs to be the vote today. I have a solve in mind and this just fits.

Datisi · Post Post #3005 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:52 am

In post 3004, Andresvmb wrote:@Datisi @maxwell I think this needs to be the vote today. I have a solve in mind and this just fits.

can we hear it?

Andresvmb · Post Post #3006 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 4:58 am

In post 3005, Datisi wrote:
In post 3004, Andresvmb wrote:@Datisi @maxwell I think this needs to be the vote today. I have a solve in mind and this just fits.
can we hear it?

If Green Crayons flips Scum, unfortunately it probably means RLotus is Scum. I would flip RLotus immediately after flipping GC if GC is Scum. Why? Well, based on all of the pushes and what we’ve seen this game, maxwell wouldn’t make sense as a Partner for GC. I’m fact, the interactions between Green Crayons and RLotus do point to buddies, provided that GC is Scum. If GC is Town, RLotus is good most likely, and I’m going to sink into despair trying to convince myself that you’re Scum when you don’t feel like it anymore. I think in that situation I would put a hero vote down for Dunn and hope for the best.

The last Scum I’m going to guess is in {DGB, Dunn}. It’s hard to say honestly. I just don’t know.

I’m going to stick to VPB Town, Mom Town. I got good vibes from Testa, despite Battle Mage’s bad push onto RTP I thought it was Town, and Momrangal has come across as emotional Town to me. I can’t ignore all of that. I think there’s one Scum in {maxwell, GC}. Which one it is, I’m gambling on it being GC.

Andresvmb · Post Post #3007 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:00 am

I don’t think I’m the worst player alive. I got Scum vibes from RLotus early in the game. RTP got Scum vibes from Green Crayons. Maybe we were both right. I’m trying to figure out why RLotus called GC very Towny, and attempted to dissuade me from sticking to Mom as Town. The conclusion is pretty straight forward - RLotus and GC are buddies.

Andresvmb · Post Post #3008 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:01 am

Again, this is all contingent on Green Crayons flipping Scum.

Andresvmb · Post Post #3009 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:04 am

But I think I need to see Green Crayons’ alignment. If we’re going to solve this game, I think this is a must. I’m not going to get stuck on {Datisi, RLotus} as the choice today because I need a little more evidence either way. I can’t make that choice today. They’re both sticking to VPB Town so that has to be correct.

Datisi · Post Post #3010 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:06 am

i mean i disagree about maxwell being scum without green bc i don't see why scum!him jumps out to stop the momentum unless that's his own partner. the rest of your post seems correct.

i'm trying to think why i was decently town on green before, it was his play around italiano wagon d1 being kinda needlessly shitty as scum? and his argument against you yesterday? does that offset the rest of his play enough...

my *other* problem is that green might be a town power role, and i'm of the thought if nobody else claims pr, he could be clear. however, considering i just talked about the game where i cleared scum off faulty mech like that, i should probably shut the fuck up.

pedit: this is a response to 3006.

Andresvmb · Post Post #3011 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:08 am

The reason Green Crayons decided to ignore me and not vote is not because they didn’t want to be on my timeline. It’s a Scum tactic. They’re trying to see if we would be silly enough to flip against whoever is Town amongst {Datisi, RLotus}. VPB may have been wrong about some of the harder slots to sort this game. But my gut is telling me that he’s right about you Datisi. That’s how I’m solving the puzzle right now. Who knows, maybe I’m really bad at this haha

Datisi · Post Post #3012 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:09 am

yeah ok. you sheeped me yesterday, i fucked up. i think you're town, i'll sheep you on this.

VOTE: green

i believe y-1.

Andresvmb · Post Post #3013 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:10 am

In post 3010, Datisi wrote:my *other* problem is that green might be a town power role, and i'm of the thought if nobody else claims pr, he could be clear. however, considering i just talked about the game where i cleared scum off faulty mech like that, i should probably shut the fuck up.

Neighborizer is not worth saving for its own sake. If we’re wrong, the power itself is not particularly useful for Town to solve the game anyway, beyond hinting that GC is not committing the NK’s.

Datisi · Post Post #3014 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:13 am

no, i agree the power of making hoods isn't mechanically useful. i'm saying if nobody else claimed pr, green would become an ic (because without him the town is too weak), and i don't think yeeting ic's is a good town strategy. however, i don't have nearly enough confidence in "if no other pr claims, green is clear", because again, 2157 haunts my dreams.

Andresvmb · Post Post #3015 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:13 am

In post 3010, Datisi wrote:i mean i disagree about maxwell being scum without green bc i don't see why scum!him jumps out to stop the momentum unless that's his own partner. the rest of your post seems correct.

I agree that maxwell can always be Town here actually. I was just saying - if GC flips Scum, then the early push against Harumi, the attempt at a CFD against maxwell. I’m guessing those aren’t pushes from a buddy. So if GC flips Scum, I would guess maxwell is good. That’s more what I meant.

Andresvmb · Post Post #3016 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:16 am

In post 3013, Andresvmb wrote:beyond hinting that GC is not committing the NK’s.

I would maybe say that since the NK is factional, GC could theoretically still neighborize and commit the NK. I suppose that’s also possible (if GC is Scum). However, maxwell seems to have confirmed that GC used their role as a Neighborizer - I don’t know if they would have spotted GC going into two different directions, but it would be silly to have GC commit the NK with the whole Team intact when there’s always a chance the Town has some sort of tracking role.

Datisi · Post Post #3017 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:19 am

probably. i'd have to relook at the attemtp at the cfd against maxwell, becuase if memory serves me, it was me + ele, then both of us jumped off, *then* green jumped on, which doesn't strike me as particularly clearing for maxwell, but i might be misremembering, and that's something to look at after we know green's flip anyway.

pedit: i didn't see a note saying multitasking is enabled by default this game, so scum!green would have to be a multitasking neighbourizer for him to be able to perform both actions. if he is that and he did do both, a potential tracker would see him visit both, and that would be a hard guilty p much.

Andresvmb · Post Post #3018 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:21 am

Yeah no I don’t think GC committed the NK yesterday. I think that’s close to a certainty. But given how these games tend to be structured, I would guess with our roles, that could be thought of as a soft clear that could throw the Town in the wrong direction. I don’t know, just some speculation.

Andresvmb · Post Post #3019 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:22 am

In post 1653, Green Crayons wrote:VOTE: maxwell want to trust my gut

Prefer this over VD and elements atm

In post 1686, Green Crayons wrote:So I can’t compel anyone with the maxwell flash wagon hunh?

Here.

Datisi · Post Post #3020 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:28 am

In post 3019, Andresvmb wrote:
In post 1653, Green Crayons wrote:VOTE: maxwell want to trust my gut

Prefer this over VD and elements atm

In post 1686, Green Crayons wrote:So I can’t compel anyone with the maxwell flash wagon hunh?
Here.

italiano was on 5 votes already at that time, and imo green didn't attempt to present very convincing arguments for voting maxwell.

eh. if maxwell continues to live, hopefully massclaim shines light on his alignment.

Andresvmb · Post Post #3021 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 5:54 am

In post 3020, Datisi wrote:italiano was on 5 votes already at that time, and imo green didn't attempt to present very convincing arguments for voting maxwell.

And that’s exactly the point. Green is trying to stay away from the Town execution about to happen, while wagoning someone they don’t care if they get flipped or not. Say the momentum moved away from Italiano for whatever reason - then there’s Green sitting on a wagon happy to cooperate. If GC is Scum, trust me, maxwell isn’t Scum.

VP Baltar · Post Post #3022 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 6:01 am

In post 3021, Andresvmb wrote:
In post 3020, Datisi wrote:italiano was on 5 votes already at that time, and imo green didn't attempt to present very convincing arguments for voting maxwell.
And that’s exactly the point. Green is trying to stay away from the Town execution about to happen, while wagoning someone they don’t care if they get flipped or not. Say the momentum moved away from Italiano for whatever reason - then there’s Green sitting on a wagon happy to cooperate. If GC is Scum, trust me, maxwell isn’t Scum.

Seems unlikely that would have happened at that point of the game. I don't think that vote says much of anything about maxwell either way.

Andres, if I'm reading you right, you think mom is town because of emotion? Why do you think that is coming from town instead of scum?

Andresvmb · Post Post #3023 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 6:03 am

In post 3022, VP Baltar wrote:
In post 3021, Andresvmb wrote:
In post 3020, Datisi wrote:italiano was on 5 votes already at that time, and imo green didn't attempt to present very convincing arguments for voting maxwell.
And that’s exactly the point. Green is trying to stay away from the Town execution about to happen, while wagoning someone they don’t care if they get flipped or not. Say the momentum moved away from Italiano for whatever reason - then there’s Green sitting on a wagon happy to cooperate. If GC is Scum, trust me, maxwell isn’t Scum.
Seems unlikely that would have happened at that point of the game. I don't think that vote says much of anything about maxwell either way.

Andres, if I'm reading you right, you think mom is town because of emotion? Why do you think that is coming from town instead of scum?

How many times have I read emotion correctly this game? Can you trust my intuition for a minute?

Andresvmb · Post Post #3024 (ISO) » Sun Mar 21, 2021 6:06 am

Again, it also fits with {GC, RLotus} Scum though doesn’t it? You saw that RLotus floated the question - why would Green Crayons go against you as Scum? You saw that today, right? Well, Mom went against me

yesterday and today

, yet RLotus didn’t actually say that about Mom too. You don’t think that’s interesting?