Open 820: The Siege of Aurelia — Game Over!

[unwnd]

Cautiously optimistic that catboi is truthful in his statement about being town

[unwnd]

Right now I would put T3 at the Keep as a preemptive take

[unwnd]

It's just where I'd categorize your strengths

[unwnd]

Not his scumgame that's for certain

[unwnd]

My skin crawled as well

[unwnd]

It's hard to interpret really. I was scum there so I can tell you my motivations for doing so previously-- which was basically mitigating control. I jumped early because I wanted to limit town's options to synchronize, and because I felt the ~~no fear~~ approach would be townie. Is Kyouko doing the exact same thing? I don't know because he doesn't have the same experience as I do now.

[unwnd]

She*

My mistake

[unwnd]

unwnd is quite town for page 2. catboi to a lesser extent.

I think there's some amount of advantage we could eke out by controlling where people go but I think we also can get a fair amount of useful info just from where people decide to go on their own. unwnd, since you were specifically worried as scum about town's options to synchronize, I'm curious what exactly you didn't want town to have the option to do.

Yeah I'm willing to divulge a bit. I'm sure scum is already aware of it, but there's a mechanic that allows them to switch people. This works in town's favor as well however given

that two scum cannot be in the same place

. Therefore, my intent in the last game was to not make any sudden movements. I didn't want to confirm any information basically. The town in that game tried to use I believe Keep(?) to box in scumreads or something to that effect. We ended up exactly 1-1-1 in terms of wagon makeup where Ydrasse followed my lead, and then catboi just happened to find himself elsewhere too. I think it's a dangerous game (for scum) if they just let townies start plotting because then the onus is put onto them, and it becomes a matter of reacting less to what town does and more about complying and hoping that their plans are misguided.

[unwnd]

The sooner we are to reveal information (e.g voting before proper discussion) the quicker scum will use said information

I'm not sure if your idea fits your intent

[unwnd]

So you're fine with kyouko hammering just like that?

[unwnd]

I dislike both kyouko's explanation and T3's reaction to it, but will take the level 0 read that this makes them unlikely to be teamed. Although looking at 52 again, it might be a town post despite none of the conclusions being good. Or because of that.

Yeah his takes are so undercooked that I have to believe they're genuine

[unwnd]

No strong opinions of any posts here, which may be troublesome if the clock keeps ticking down. Are people afraid of making stances? Are they simply waiting for something to happen? I don't mean to be hypocritical but I don't have enough to generate a wall.

[unwnd]

If people don't want to write words I would even take readlists. Just something to stare at, I suppose

[unwnd]

Ssbm how would u rate ur scumgame? What do u think ur strengths are as scum?

My strengths are bussing convincingly, my weaknesses are being tmi and I sometimes have a hard time staying motivated as scum

Thanks!

Tbh i'm kinda having a hard time seeing u come after t3 this hard as scum

Well, see, my problem with the whole approach is that kyouko seems to be basing her read entirely on whether T3 submits to her, and I don't find the way she's executing it to look like a genuine attempt to read into T3's alignment. If she had gotten an early townread on him and wanted him to go to the gate, that would be understandable. If the proposed plan had been an attempt to gauge his alignment by how he reacted to it. But that doesn't quite seem to be what's going on. Instead, the approach she's seems solely geared toward attempting to intimidate him into going to a location that is, frankly, unoptimal for him. It doesn't look like there's any attempt to genuinely read into T3's alignment off what he's saying, and instead just attack him - 135 is particularly noxious in that regard.

Were this a regular game, I could maybe see it as an attempt to pressure him but in this setup that doesn't really work, and the approach here makes more sense as either trying to make T3 an elimmable suspect on day 2 or pit him against implosion based on his existing stated suspicions - I'm not sure why as town you'd actively try to get 2 scumreads into a location with you but it makes great sense as scum if you believe one will surefire vote the other. I'm struggling to see much of any of it as town motivated play.

No strong opinions of any posts here, which may be troublesome if the clock keeps ticking down. Are people afraid of making stances? Are they simply waiting for something to happen? I don't mean to be hypocritical but I don't have enough to generate a wall.

It's...barely over 24 hours into Day 1? Why the impatience?

I like having a bunch of information in front of me that I can pick through. I'm worried about the game stifling because everyone is afraid of being too preemptive. Maybe hypocritical but whatever.

[unwnd]

Kyouko/T3/Dunnstral is my favorite pairing for the Keep right now

[unwnd]

I would want to clear one of Catboi/PenguinPower/Skitter

I don't mind being in regular XYLO.

[unwnd]

No you can't

I forgot where Kyouko was

[unwnd]

I am a male, a geriatric one

[unwnd]

I am a male, a geriatric one

Sorry, started the post with they since your pronouns arent listed and went with the avatar.

It's fine, I just don't pick one because back in the day (geriatric comes in play here) there wasn't anything like that. I think there was an option to show gender if you clicked your profile however. It's just me being forever lost in halcyon days

[unwnd]

There doesn't seem to be much to be respond to, I don't think Kyouko's intent to read me is malicious. It seems she already did a decent amount of homework on me as well

[unwnd]

I feel decent about Dunnstral

[unwnd]

The fact that nothing stands out, actually

[unwnd]

it's a bit odd but I think you have to read Dunn a bit differently in that regard

[unwnd]

You think T3 has a chance to be scum, catboi?

[unwnd]

Because if my T3 read is wrong then he crumbles up against either of them who will out town him.

Or he'll just be town. This doesn't work however because Kyouko already decided

[unwnd]

More posts about where people want others is always a good thing

Catboi has an interesting perspective on Kyouko. I may be a bit arrogant to say that I don't know if Kyouko has it in her to fabricate to the degree she was about her read on me, regardless of the fact

[unwnd]

I don't know if Catboi does the same strategy twice. It could be a WIFOM play int that sense but for now

That felt oddly spiteful?

[unwnd]

I have two scumreads now I think

I know I'm being vague but it will come to fruition, eventually

[unwnd]

I have two scumreads now I think

I know I'm being vague but it will come to fruition, eventually

Now I'm 1 name away from having a day 1 hero solve

I'm afraid of saying mine honestly

[unwnd]

I don't know why you think I'm bussing catboi, I think the last time I implied I read I thought he was town?

[unwnd]

If Catboi/Skitter had any other two different players I would probably say it's not manufactured. I know them both to some extent however and I think they understand the necessity to interact with one another. Catboi's kneejerk Keep vote can only still be described as spiteful. It confuses me a bit as well. That spitefulness in itself seemed to come from a town insistence where he knows he can win out in the end. I don't feel like Catboi is someone who enjoys the notoriety to speak. I don't think it's outside his range to be daring but. Even if it happened some odd months ago I don't see the point in him trying the same strategy we did previously? He knows I'm in the game as well so I don't know if he disrespects me that much to believe I wouldn't raise my eyebrow to it.

When it comes to Skitter I don't think I have a sensitivity quite yet to her play even if I've been scum with her before. I think even in adversity Skitter is pretty good at bottling up her emotions, but maybe it's just the way she types. Reading back on each other Skitter says provokes but in my mind I'm just reading it like she's straight-faced and going through the motions. What I'm trying to say is that I don't believe tone is a reasonable way of reading her and I don't think her reaction is as striking as catboi's.

So I'm going to flip this around and ask both of you something--

Catboi, what do you think of Skitter coming at you? I believe you know regardless of your alignment that what you did was anti-town. You justify this however and I don't need you to explain it to me. However, I think Skitter right now

knows

what you did was anti-town and is pushing you for it. Do you think she's just trying to build a narrative or is she just confused; You claim that you know you're town and can prove it.

Skitter, if what Catboi did was anti-town do you think he'd let himself do such? I mean this as scum. My own bias tells me right now no. Catboi to me is not someone who enjoys making anti-town plays, especially not this early as scum. He wants to build trust and make sure he has wriggle room. He's effectively put the spotlight on himself. I don't see the purpose of doing so early.

[unwnd]

I don't know why you think I'm bussing catboi, I think the last time I implied I read I thought he was town?

256 looks like a partner interaction - to me it reads like you think he is posting in a spiteful way, which is more likely scum than town imo. Since it looks like a partner interaction and it looks like you imply he is scummy for being spiteful, I see it as "bussing", in quotations, because we aren't actually voting anyone out yet. I am wary that you are trying to make yourself appear to not be partnered with him because you 2 are my top 2 scumreads right now. Skitter seems to also SR catboi though, so if I want skitter in Gate I feel the need to balance it with you in Keep so that if both of you are distancing from catboi, scum don't end up with 1-1-1.

pedit: you don't lose until town identifies each other. What if one town decides the other is scum and votes you by POE, then scum!you wins

No, if you read my last post you can see I still think he's town and think his spitefulness comes from a good place.

[unwnd]

I don't need that but can see where you're coming from. You already know right now in your h2h I'm more favorable of you lol

I just don't know If I'm..quite sold on Skitter being scum.

[unwnd]

To add onto my own #359

I genuinely see it as either both of you distancing as scum or neither of you being scum. I don't think Skitter makes sense in my worldview but hey

[unwnd]

When it comes to Skitter I don't think I have a sensitivity quite yet to her play even if I've been scum with her before. I think even in adversity Skitter is pretty good at bottling up her emotions, but maybe it's just the way she types. Reading back on each other Skitter says provokes but in my mind I'm just reading it like she's straight-faced and going through the motions. What I'm trying to say is that I don't believe tone is a reasonable way of reading her and I don't think her reaction is as striking as catboi's.

So I'm going to flip this around and ask both of you something--

Catboi, what do you think of Skitter coming at you? I believe you know regardless of your alignment that what you did was anti-town. You justify this however and I don't need you to explain it to me. However, I think Skitter right now knows what you did was anti-town and is pushing you for it. Do you think she's just trying to build a narrative or is she just confused; You claim that you know you're town and can prove it.

Skitter, if what Catboi did was anti-town do you think he'd let himself do such? I mean this as scum. My own bias tells me right now no. Catboi to me is not someone who enjoys making anti-town plays, especially not this early as scum. He wants to build trust and make sure he has wriggle room. He's effectively put the spotlight on himself. I don't see the purpose of doing so early.

- when were we scum together >.>
- it apparently worked last time, idk why he wouldnt try that again
- i'm baffled why he would do this as town either
- he's kinda losing trust by taking this tactic, idk how this is gonna help him build trust
- your interactions with him are very suspect and ngl on some level this reads like you defending a partner

- That one game where I was a hydra with pooks
- It barely worked. I'd even say it only worked due to the strength of the individuals. The only way I could see Catboi doing what he did (as scum) is if he had competent teammates who would support him even if it failed.
- I don't get it either? That's why I think it's a situation with Catboi doesn't GAF and is doing what he wants. Not very in line of what I typically see from Catboi as scum, which is far more methodical.
- I wouldn't be that brazen after literally being his partner in the last one.

[unwnd]

I want to do something daring myself but I don't know if it would actually feed into scum's plans lol

[unwnd]

I don't know why you think I'm bussing catboi, I think the last time I implied I read I thought he was town?

256 looks like a partner interaction - to me it reads like you think he is posting in a spiteful way, which is more likely scum than town imo. Since it looks like a partner interaction and it looks like you imply he is scummy for being spiteful, I see it as "bussing", in quotations, because we aren't actually voting anyone out yet. I am wary that you are trying to make yourself appear to not be partnered with him because you 2 are my top 2 scumreads right now. Skitter seems to also SR catboi though, so if I want skitter in Gate I feel the need to balance it with you in Keep so that if both of you are distancing from catboi, scum don't end up with 1-1-1.

pedit: you don't lose until town identifies each other. What if one town decides the other is scum and votes you by POE, then scum!you wins

No, if you read my last post you can see I still think he's town and think his spitefulness comes from a good place.

I see that now that I've read further, but I draw a different conclusion from your observation of the spitefulness than you did

What conclusion would that be?

[unwnd]

I'm just going to state that I thought about hammering Keep. Basically if I did so (and Skitter thinks me/Catboi are aligned), then one of them would have to make a move. Two scum can't be at the same place basically. I just don't know if going out there to merely prove a point would be good however.

[unwnd]

Oh he did hammer Keep didn't he

Catboi/T3/Dunnstral is a very odd makeup

[unwnd]

I don't read T3's posts once I decided he was town

I probably wasn't around for Dunn to hammer

[unwnd]

I said I would be fine at wall but part of me wants to play the different minigame

[unwnd]

Skitter would you come with me if I did so?

[unwnd]

I feel like talking about my intentions in that regard would give out too much information

Regardless of the fact of you not townreading me

[unwnd]

I think Kyouko either loses this game for town or I am fooled by her fake stubborness.

[unwnd]

I feel like talking about my intentions in that regard would give out too much information

Regardless of the fact of you not townreading me

I mean how are you reading me rn

Unsure which is where Gate helps with that

[unwnd]

My previous thought was implied that I want to try Gate

[unwnd]

I think Kyouko either loses this game for town or I am fooled by her fake stubborness.

I think the former is, regrettably, far more likely.

You changed your mind with her recent posting? Last I remember you thought it was fake world scum

[unwnd]

Holding you to not hammer then, because I agree I want more people to chime in

VOTE: Gate

[unwnd]

Skitter just come Gate with me

[unwnd]

I have no read on PenguinPower lol

[unwnd]

i find the fact that unwnd took gate to be rather scummy honestly

It'd be a very poor move on my part to join gate when Kyouko is scumreading me, on top of me asking you to join Gate as well.

[unwnd]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the current makeup of the wagons should indicate that scum has already chosen a spot? See there's 4 left for the choosing and well, scum can lose if they're all forced into one. I don't know if this has happened though, because if I'm scum and I see only one spot is left? I take that last spot just so I don't lose.

[unwnd]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the current makeup of the wagons should indicate that scum has already chosen a spot? See there's 4 left for the choosing and well, scum can lose if they're all forced into one. I don't know if this has happened though, because if I'm scum and I see only one spot is left? I take that last spot just so I don't lose.

Newpaging

[unwnd]

You're free to assume what you want

I'm more interested in results

[unwnd]

Yes I wanted Skitter at the Gate

[unwnd]

Yes I wanted Skitter at the Gate

Y

I want a read on you? I look at it this way, I either 1v1 you and Kyouko gets cleared

or

Something else happens

[unwnd]

This is not how I would play this game as scum, if you ever need a definitive read on me for future games

[unwnd]

Curious why you're not objecting to it? I feel right now Kyouko is just the one who gets cleared. If that doesn't happen however I need to rethink. I'm keeping my cards close until scum makes the first move

[unwnd]

I'm not 100% on that happening, actually

[unwnd]

There's a bit more layers to it? I just don't want to feel foolish about saying something until swaps (or don't) happen.

[unwnd]

If we end up 1v1ing that's an outcome that would surprise me actually. If you desire a reason for me instigating you in that sense

You can look at it like a test of sorts, to see what you do

[unwnd]

More of the former

One of my current reads is currently wrong, likely

[unwnd]

If 1v1ing is something that happens then I'll be prepared for it. I understand if my hush hush is a bit agonizing but I'll try to piece together my thoughts once everything is set in place.

[unwnd]

Would you prefer to be at the other place?

[unwnd]

That's a very bad read no offense

[unwnd]

I am literally reading Kyouko/T3 as either having one scum (both? Unsure) or two townies who will lose the game for us.

I don't know how else to put it without being mean. I just think you two operate in one-dimension and don't have the experience to have nuance in your reads.

[unwnd]

Poisoning the well

[unwnd]

I want to give Catboi a townread but I'm worried of it being preemptive. The thing about Catboi is that I know he's willing to adjust. Change aspects of his play and try new things. His argumentative process is vastly different from Fortress, where it just seems way more raw. Catboi was way more about presentation in both his reads and output, where here it doesn't follow a stylistic pattern. His words I would even say are a bit choppy, which makes it seem like he's not just reading from a script. In Fortress I had a fake scumread on him and then he'd just drop some wall that made it difficult for me (as his own partner) to scumread him lol. That isn't happening here. The personal affront he took towards T3 (and to some extent, Kyouko) compounds this feeling, where it seems that he feels solely responsible in a way. Yet he remains slighted by individual people and now is something is welling up inside him to prove everyone wrong. It's a underhanded way to play this game but I can really understand it. My only concern of that read is again knowing Catboi's range.
--

Everything going on right now feels like pre-phase. I don't townread Skitter but I can't say I scumread her. I will say that her coming conclusions on Me/Catboi is a bit head tilting and her usage of how do I put this? Scummy now ask questions later. She seems really jumpy despite there being a lot of unknown and I'm not really a fan of that approach. Is it confidence, and if so..where is it coming from? I can't read Skitter's tone as I previously said and she hasn't dropped enough inner monologue for me to get a good idea of what she's thinking. The constant 'this is really scummy' feels very slighted and I'm not sure what point she's trying to prove. Calling something scummy does not make it actually scummy, it usually requires a bit more.

Who else? Penguin/Dunn are both pretty enigmatic in general and don't reveal their intentions easily. Gut read on Dunnstral being town but take that with the biggest grain of salt. T3/Kyouko are almost in an ironic way the exact opposite where it's no holds barred. I think I would rather develop reads on Penguin/Dunn but it's not as simple as asking. I know both of them will take their time. T3/Kyouko however are already trying to make conclusive arguments without any aforementioned data I was talking about. I read their persistence right now as towny just for how naive it is. Like they aren't just hiding an agenda and letting their thoughts dilute in-thread. The behavior from Kyouko is so self-assured but it hasn't been earned in my opinion. This is not to offend her, but it's like a quasi-town leader. Who exactly made Kyouko leader and why is everyone just letting it happen? That's something I would like to find out eventually. Then you have T3 who almost plays secondary and believes in Kyouko as a town leader, and it's becoming an echo chamber. Are they both town bulls or scum whose idea of thread control is blindness. This is dangerous given they're both scumreading me and I'd rather not be down 1 when scum just needs to secure 1 more victory in order to win.

I don't have much to say about Implo/S_S right now, so you're spared a paragraph about them.

I can't say I really scumread anyone. That's a bit personally frustrating which is why I'm hoping the phase moves on and I have something like data to look at. Everything else is mostly conjecture.

[unwnd]

This is the exact kind of wall scumwnd makes.

You have no idea what you're talking about.

[unwnd]

You did it again Skitter

Why is it scummy? Put words to that...

[unwnd]

I want to think about the swaps and their meanings before I say anything

[unwnd]

Everyone scumreads me so I'm just gonna go out on a limb and vote the person I think is scum in my pool.

VOTE: something_smart

If pp quick hammers you can evaluate it. I think implo is who I'd vote in other pool

Still townread catboi

[unwnd]

Pp you have a free point if im wrong

Don't delay

[unwnd]

Breaking my heart

Do you play with your food?

[unwnd]

I'm not changing my vote and want to go first so Kyouko can get off her dumbshit solve and other potential townies.

But if you enjoy seeing me writhe that's understandable too

[unwnd]

I did that then got frustrated reading Kyouko's posts so I'm doing it a bit out of spite

[unwnd]

Skitters read on me is not right either but like

I believe it, i guess

I don't think this is the game where i have a ton of impact, so I'm going out like a soldier

[unwnd]

Again, not trying to be that guy but

Have you ever considered that scum was OK clearing you because your reads fucking suck and you serve no threat?

[unwnd]

I just don't really have time to try and get into this game when a self-proclaimed IC is just gonna shout me down and tell me I'm scum. My reads are very raw but that's just how it's going to be.

[unwnd]

I'm not sure he's expecting to, like, win this honestly

You're right but you have painted me in the wrong mindset

I'm town and it's essential you flip wall first so Kyouko can be humbled

[unwnd]

Because I wanted to see what you'd do? I answered that already. I know I probably shouldn't have expected you to get cleared but that's the brunt of my reasoning

[unwnd]

Implo do you have a scum game I can read of yours?

[unwnd]

Penguin I'm town here and I'm still hoping you're not trolling me because I'd be upset.

[unwnd]

I legitimately don't know what else to tell you. It's hard to navigate and prove my innocence when I feel like I haven't done anything wrong

[unwnd]

I am a very spiteful town player and will do things just to prove a point.

When T3/Kyouko both started to engage the thread as if I were scum for basically unilateral reasons it caused an uptick. T3 has no fucking idea how I play scum and certainly Kyouko doesn't.

[unwnd]

You wanna know what's good for town Kyouko? Not trying to play leader and act like you know. Act like you're able to lead us to victory and that my flip is good for town. You know what's good for town? Eliminating mafia. Not a horrible concept to grasp yet you both accept you have shaky reads

but

it's all part of your ingenious plan so my death should happen assuredly. Oh but but nevermind that you're probably still scum welll haahhahahaha

You're in for

such a rude awakening

[unwnd]

Penguin says he isn't trolling me, that tells me I made the right decision. That's pretty much all I had to do

[unwnd]

I may be wrong on Implo because I feel like Dunn is town this game

[unwnd]

I want my block resolved first

[unwnd]

I want my block resolved first

Why?

If Penguin votes S_S, we're up one

If penguin votes me, Kyouko still gets to eat my shit and see me flip green

[unwnd]

I think it's Skitter/T3/S_S

[unwnd]

One I could be most wrong about could be Skitter, but think Dunn/Catboi are both town

[unwnd]

Ahh fuck I should've stuck with my gut

I'm sorry skitter

[unwnd]

If pp quick hammers you can evaluate it. I think implo is who I'd vote in other pool

Painful

[unwnd]

I won't make a case on S_S

I know it's unhelpful but that's not the type of game I'm playing right now

I definitely think it's more honed into my sensibilities instead of direct analysis

[unwnd]

I'm just glad you and Dunn were town

Still kicking myself about Skitter

[unwnd]

I wouldn't say it was ego more like I decided to follow the rabble going on at the time

I think we're in a good position though, now I just have to convince Penguin

[unwnd]

If you want me to respond to that penguin I will

[unwnd]

No its more about doing minimum effort like I mostly have

[unwnd]

Unwnd pushed T3 as town from super early on. He specifically argued for a keep of ssbm/Dunn/T3, presumably on the assumption that T3 would be voted there. He makes multiple mistakes about the locations, most notably 375 where he's like "oh I was totally considering going for the keep just to prove a point about not being scum with catboi" when it turned out the keep was already hammered. Then he calls it an odd makeup when from his POV it should be a pretty easy T3 vote.

I don't understand what this implicates for me, I was sour that Kyouko was playing IC and T3 was just his lapdog. I had it in my mind that possibly Kyouko/T3 were both town and scum were fine with the direction, but I felt bogged down from it. I was annoyed by Kyouko especially trying to weave connections that simply weren't there and felt a situation where if she wasn't going to consider my plight then I was just going to make strong moves of my own to prove innocence, because ultimately that's what it comes down to.

391 indicates that unwnd figured ssbm would hammer him. He goes gate anyway, but presumably the plan is to swap him out (Keep is already determined, so they definitely can).

I chose Gate because I wanted to try something new instead of Wall which is what I did last game. I had no plan beyond being proactive and seeing how Skitter would respond. I pretty much had (Skitter, T3, Kyouko) all breathing down my neck and knowing my own alignment I have to think about who's being genuine about their pursuits. T3 was being a mini-Kyouko and I didn't really want to think about it. Skitter affirming her reads as calling it really scummy to me seems a bit presumptuous but I didn't feel like the effort was entirely scum, despite my own folding later on. I felt more like scum enjoyed the complacency, not necessarily trying to build a narrative; Kyouko was already doing that for them. My read on Catboi was mostly firm but it was far harder to commit given Catboi's depth as scum.

Then he tries to get skitter to come to the gate. I would expect that the outcome of this would have been the same-- unwnd and implosion swap, and implosion 1v1's skitter. But when skitter stalled, they didn't want to risk me or PP taking it, so implosion rushed in with the intent to set up the same 1v1. His explanation for wanting skitter at the gate doesn't make a lot of sense-- obviously nobody is going to IC skitter, so either she gets swapped out or put in a 1v1, neither really helps read her.

I don't care about what Implosion did and I'm not going to care now. I think in hindsight the swaps were made because scum had already planted their feet (You, T3) and they needed a diversion. If there were no movement then it would imply that scum

didn't

need to move, which would make my posts like #524 true lol. I don't really believe You/Implo/T3 as a team were less about manipulating the gamestate and more about letting the (wrong) scenario that presented itself to come true. Your behavioral analysis of me is all chopped together to make it seem like everyone missed crucial evidence, but why wait until now? I've been a bit of a prick in some regards but if there was something I remember from last Fortress it's that your willingness to let your opinions come forth had no bearing on the gamestate. You often had this attitude where you were just thinking on a different wavelength than others and my god was it frustrating to undo as scum. Here your responses provide thorough dialect but none of the conclusions you make seem to follow your own patterns. Why is it now when the pressure is on you that you squabble together all these threaded ties to me and Implo. Was this something you thought about prior? Why not say it then. You had Implo still alive and it just seems to me like your own lack of proactive behavior is being projected onto me and you're saying 'look Implo and unwnd didn't interact and uh his T3 read never changed' yet what have you done?

And he came into today with a plan, it was pretty evident that they decided in the scum PT that he would try to get me executed.

Nothing in this game suggests this at all, you were both sitting on your hands and trying your best to not make eye contact. As someone who has won this game as scum there's no reason to bus and instead you're just hoping to either be townier or hope town makes a bad choice. This isn't a game where bussing and big plays make sense, not unless it's to gain something individually. You're not a big play type of person and I think as scum you're just out of habit where you're not sure where you can fit into the picture because this setup derives a seflishness where commonly most town think exactly like Catboi (and to some extent, me) wherein all we have to do is be townier and follow our instinct. You don't have that same drive and it shows.

And the scumread on me/townread on PP came out of nowhere. In 599, his last reads post before voting me, he has me as null and PP as "pretty enigmatic in general and doesn't reveal his intentions easily". No explanation at all of why that read shifted. It's not organic, it's pushing an agenda.

Huh? I'm not even sure what this is trying to say honestly. How is it pushing an agenda?

[unwnd]

I don't understand what this implicates for me, I was sour that Kyouko was playing IC and T3 was just his lapdog.

Her lapdog*

[unwnd]

So you stitched together a thought process you never actually had and presented it as a case

[unwnd]

I have no read on PenguinPower lol

I don't have much to say about Implo/S_S right now, so you're spared a paragraph about them.

I can't say I really scumread anyone. That's a bit personally frustrating which is why I'm hoping the phase moves on and I have something like data to look at. Everything else is mostly conjecture.

Everyone scumreads me so I'm just gonna go out on a limb and vote the person I think is scum in my pool.

VOTE: something_smart

If pp quick hammers you can evaluate it. I think implo is who I'd vote in other pool

Still townread catboi

Why did you think s_s was scum over me?

Just started to make sense to me at the time I think, basically PoE

[unwnd]

I'll elaborate a bit harder:

Kyouko/T3/Dunnstral is my favorite pairing for the Keep right now

At this current point this is where I had mostly my townreads wanting to be. My reasoning remains the same, he either sunk as scum or he showed he's townie as being scum isn't his strength.

I would want to clear one of Catboi/PenguinPower/Skitter

I don't mind being in regular XYLO.

These are the people I wanted to clear, players a bit more difficult to read; I made a mental error and forgot where Kyouko was #207. I initially said 'i don't mind being in regular XYLO' but I changed my mind. It compounds into why I was goading Skitter into the Gate, but I was afraid of being obvious about it. I didn't want to give scum something to pick up on though I think I failed in that regard.

I feel decent about Dunnstral

At this current point I was feeling decent about Dunn, trying to sort through T3/Kyouko push, and then a fledgling read on Catboi. That would leave Implo/Skitter/You to be sorted. I think at this time I believed Implo to be scum and there was something going in my head like Skitter/Implo having one and then just leaving You/S_S as no read and figure out later.

You think T3 has a chance to be scum, catboi?

Here I ask one of the players I feel is to some degree trustworthy about T3 as by this point my read on T3 was starting to waver just by other odds.

uote="In post 286, unwnd"]I have two scumreads now I think

I know I'm being vague but it will come to fruition, eventually[/quote]

My two scumreads at this point were becoming Implo/T3, but I was afraid of saying it. I was trying to not reveal information because I was afraid of a competent scum muddling the process.

If you read further by this point I drop a mini-wall on Catboi/Skitter fighting each other. I still believed Catboi to be town, but I was wary of Skitter. My gut told me she was genuine in her push but I came to the conclusion either it was exact distancing or just two townies in disagreement. In my mind at this point I have Catboi/Skitter/Dunn as all varying degrees of OK which left S_S/You/Implo/T3.

#370 talks about the daring attitude I was trying to talk about, and eventually I trying to play mediator in a way. I wanted to test my own thoughts on Catboi/Skitter so I got inbetween them. I started to put more of my effort into getting Skitter into Gate because I knew that Two scum can't be on the same wagon, so just in case I was reading Kyouko wrong then she'd have to make a move OR the scumteam would have to clear Skitter for me. There was no way they were clearing me given all the heat I was taking.

The whole talk about 1v1ing with Skitter further really is just...seeing what she'd do. I plainly wrote it. #565 adds onto my feeling of Kyouko/T3 either having one scum or both just town, which is why I wanted Me/Skitter/Kyouko to check that.

[unwnd]

I think I switched to Skitter just because Catboi seemed to be leaning there (correct me if wrong) or something

I think that's mostly the conclusions I've made and how I've got here, it took a bit to remember some shit honestly

[unwnd]

Everyone scumreads me so I'm just gonna go out on a limb and vote the person I think is scum in my pool.

VOTE: something_smart

If pp quick hammers you can evaluate it. I think implo is who I'd vote in other pool

Still townread catboi

Yeah this post is my raw into D2 thoughts where I was like Implo/T3 and then I went 'ok if I'm wrong PP then so be it Kyouko is IC cleared so I'd rather not prolong my suffering of being misread' The whole this is my scumread is just bravado lol

[unwnd]

Kinda cool I was 3/3 though coming into D2

[unwnd]

Oh right the game wasn't over either if PP was just scum so I had that safety net too. I impulse voted and as if you go through my ISO you can see that I wanted my place solved first because I wanted Kyouko to have a rude awakening lol

[unwnd]

That was the right choice pp I'm town!

[unwnd]

No gotcha here I'm truly town

[unwnd]

GG sorry for the misplay with you Skitter and sorry if I wasn't playing up to par