Micro 1082 - I’m the Real Tracker (Day 4)

[Black]

Hi everyone!

[Black]

I tried to skim but this game started fast on page 1

Let me get my coffee and then I'll digest everything

[Black]

9 and 10 - this exchange made me lol. I'm sad I had to replace Merlyn instead of getting to play with her

13 - I don't like Jason pushing for D2 claims right out of the gate, even when I read it in an Australian accent

17 - this is the post that made me grab coffee. Reading it through...this makes more sense than what I thought Jason was getting at in #13 which was full claims. Anyone that has played with me knows I'm not a mech person at all so I don't know if this is the best play. It feels like having the information out there without the PRs having to hard claim would be good though

19 - this claim feels unnecessary. One thing confuses me:

If I get no neighborhood, I will be taking this as confirmation that I'm a faker.

What do you mean here? Maybe I'm not understanding the setup correctly. Pretenders know they are pretenders, right?

21 - wanting to end the day in a no-lim on page 1 is scummy af

23 - this feels like a fake realization, and followed by a massclaim proposal this just feels really bad

24 - I think Jason feels scummy here for the policy lim comment. Scum want to get rid of claimed roles. This angle makes sense for scum!Jason because then he wouldn't have to waste a NK on Bingle

28 - this feels like leading the Doc a little

39 - another no lim/cut the discussion post. How could this possibly be good for town? I know I said I'm not a mech person but cutting discussion short seems like it would be harmful in any setup

41 - I like this post from Delta and I agree

42 - my own slot comes in with a meta read on Kowah. Ok. This context helps a little I think

44 - oh no. Delta is getting into a language argument again lol. No, I don't think Merlyn's phrasing was scummy, but I may be a little informed

47, 48, and 49 - these feel a little weird from Appearance. I think it's just #49 actually. This reads "don't track me"


64 - feels weird and a little sheepy from PC


65 - this feels like Kowah is trending in the right direction as far as letting discussion develop before ending the day but I still think no limming is a bad idea. We should definitely yeet a scumread today


67 - I like this from Don and it indicates that he's really thinking about the game and the setup


70 - "pretenders who were told they were neighbors" ...ok so I'm assuming I'm misunderstanding the setup and Pretenders aren't told they are Pretenders. I think it was the sample role PM that made me think this? Idk


74 and 75 - these two Don posts give me town vibes


80 - I like this perspective from Bingle re: Kowah's two games. I townread the effort he's putting into solving this whole no-lim thing


88 - starting to feel like this is town!Delta here


93 - I'm not really a big fan of Bingle just accepting the "your posts feel fake" claim and not asking Kowah to elaborate


95 - this post feels scummy to me. There's an informed air about it. I agree that Delta feels town so far but Jason seems to have way more conviction here which doesn't really make sense to me. Also I don't get the Kowah TR at all, and the Bingle read is a little fence-sitty. It feels like Jason is going after Invis for poor reasons here

I have nothing to say about mechanical stuff cuz I am bad at mechanical stuff

Felt. But I'm trying...


102 - this feels like a town post from Invis


113 - I agree with the bulk of this and I townread this analysis

Delta, what was scummy about Merlyn clearing Kowah of scumhood, as you put it?

How would Town!Merlyn be so convinced NotScum!Kowah through purely meta? What's the benefit for Town!Merlyn in doing this?

Are we reading the same game? Merlyn said that particular behavior wasn't scum indicative but where did she say she was convinced Kowah was not scum?


135 - agreed

[Black]

Let me get my coffee and then I'll digest everything

Hell of a coffee.

Relax! My catch ups take time

[Black]

I will be randomly targeting a player who is not me.

This is the extent of the mechanical discussion we need D1

.

Yeah well so much for that...

[Black]

I think this is where I stand after reading

Black

Donempire
Bingle
Deltabreedy
Invisibility

Political Clout
Appearance

JasonWazza
Kowahbunga

VOTE: Kowah

[Black]

another no lim/cut the discussion post. How could this possibly be good for town? I know I said I'm not a mech person but cutting discussion short seems like it would be harmful in any setup

yeah I was just trusting that everyone else knew what they were talking about LOL

I'm a little surprised by this answer. I guess I just thought that you would know better since you seem pretty experienced

[Black]

I like this post from Delta and I agree

does this include the part about Kowah being scummy for not pushing anything else?

I don't really think not pushing anyone 40 posts into the game is scummy tbh

[Black]

But yes, most roles especially roleblockers should be on jingle no matter what.

they should?

Sure, if he is neighbour then he has no use for his night action. If he isn't and is faking it for some reason, then obviously roleblocker should also be on him as he wouldn't be trustworthy.

Besides, roleblocker has a 1/8 chance of stopping the night kill. Much higher likelihood of stopping an usefull role like inspector or loyal checker than stopping mafias kill, meaning we're not giving up an invaluable asset with our n1 roleblock either. Of course all these are assuming a town roleblocker.

Don't you think it would make more sense for the RB to block who they think is scum? I mean yeah if they are wrong then they potentially block a useful role, but I still think that's a better play than blocking someone you townread

[Black]

agreed.
though, bingle has claimed a weak pr and other seeking neighbor can always target him.

I understand that. I still think the RB should only block Bingle if they think he is scum though

[Black]

Are you really scum reading me for having conviction that this is Delta Town?

And when Delta is your third town read to boot?

What the fuck?

Maybe it's a playstyle thing but I'm never this sure about someone based on meta alone. Don't let Delta being third on my list confuse you about where I stand. I think he could definitely be scum still. You don't seem to think so and I read that type of conviction as informed, especially this early in a game

Can you explain your Kowah townread?

[Black]

agreed.
though, bingle has claimed a weak pr and other seeking neighbor can always target him.

I understand that. I still think the RB should only block Bingle if they think he is scum though

Why does Town!Bingle need to not be RB'd in your mind?

I think putting our RB in a useful spot for all of town isn't a bad idea, If Bingle is Town, we give all our PR's a night to use their power, If Bingle is Scum, we openly force the other scum member to also not use their role to get a kill off.

I don't think the RB'er should ever block someone they think is town. Do you?

[Black]

Like just to be clear, knowing someone's personality and taking it out of your thinking isn't a Meta read, it's just not being stupid and ignoring how that person plays.

Uhh I'm not sure what I'm missing here but how a person plays as either alignment is exactly what a meta read is

[Black]

Kowah hasn't done much D1 here to go off, personality seems the same, i don't think he has done anything read worthy at this point though.

Though that's also coming from someone that uses Meta mostly as a rule out of reads rather then a generator of reads.

like describe what you see here specifically in Delta town cuz it is not as obvious as you think it is

Town Delta is way more confrontational then Scum Delta, could be playing to meta, but i think it's good enough for this early.

though 105 feels a bit wonky even then, though Delta has a habit of arguing semantics a lot.

You townread Kowah because his personality feels the same as his last game and you townread Delta because he plays more confrontational as town. These are the definition of meta reads

Honestly I have no clue what we are even arguing about anymore. Are you always this defensive when someone scumreads you?

[Black]

I think there is a misunderstanding here. I'm talking about 81. You said "personality seems the same" so I assumed you were townreading him because his personality seemed the same as his last game. I'm sorry if I misunderstood

[Black]

And frankly this one is bad considering the sorts of things your posting (like somehow getting a Town Read for Kowah in a post where i said i literally have no read on Kowah)

Yeah I already admitted there was a misunderstanding here. I couldn't figure out why you TR'd Kowah and I think I attributed that comment to it by accident

Your reasoning for voting me is Conviction, and that is just an objectively bad reason to scum read someone (like in what world would that ever not be a Personality tell?).

I'm not voting you. And that's only one of the reasons I scumread you tbh. Admittedly it's not a very strong reason

And the sort of posts you pull up, that Kowah one is before i town read Kowah, and i don't see why you would assume that 110 is the only reason i have to read Delta as town (which as a point, sounds like someone that does actually have TMI).

It was 100 posts in the game. If you had other reasons to TR Delta I assumed you would have included them there. But I accept your explanation of wanting to keep your reads close to your chest

Which also, those posts don't even really have conviction in them, you literally used posts where I'm either not having a read (no conviction) or where I'm even calling out something else Delta did (how is this conviction?)

I think you're a little too focused on the conviction thing

[Black]

Absolutely

[Black]

I like jason for town and delta slight town
I think you bingle are focusing a lot a lot on the setup slightly scummy

I don't like this. Why is Bingle scummy for focusing on the setup but Jason is town?

[Black]

I will be randomly targeting a player who is not me.

This is the extent of the mechanical discussion we need D1

.

Yeah well so much for that...

do you think it's alignment indicative bingle said they like to review games or are they just enthusiastic about the setup?

I don't see how that could be alignment indicative at all

[Black]

alignments are random and roles are random

Yeah that part of the setup I do understand. That conversation was assuming town!RB

[Black]

Scum don't have usefull powerroles. You could argue inspector and tracker have utility, but town has far more use for them. Even if roleblocker rbs a mafia power it would do no good if that was a mafia doctor. It has to be the mafkilling otherwise it's useless.

Point is, town needs their results tonight, scum might not

Idk. Maybe this is just a difference in personal mafia theory. I consider the possibility of stopping the night kill worth the risk of potentially blocking a town PR. I don't think I would ever block a townread tbh

[Black]

IT IS VERY IMPORTANT THAT EVERY PLAYER CHOOSE THEIR OWN TARGETS, REGARDLESS OF WHETHER THAT TARGET IS ME. This denies scum access to the thought processes of the roles to scum.

Quoting this for posterity

[Black]

Delta, why did you answer Invis's question and not mine?

But my statement is backed up by something- Kowah doing this as town in our previous game together. You were actually there too, though you replaced out pretty early, but I think you were still around when Kowah started advocating a D1 no lim policy there too.

I don't like meta reading someone if they are used to doing scummy things as town. The reason people including me were suspect on his no-lim gameplan was because it would be forcing town into hibernation. Playing the game simply in mechanical terms would only benefit scum here. If that is how he plays as town!kowah, then we need to warn him that this helps scum and be suspicious of him anyways as the facts of the matter dont change. And fwiw, i don't buy meta reads, so i'm plainly reading people as per their actions, not their intentions.

I don't believe spitballing ideas itself is scummy. However i don't believe kowah has done enough to convince us of his game plan, which also with him abandoning his no-lim idea as he votes bingle makes it seem as though he wasn't that committed to it in the first place and was just saying it to get some content out.

why didn't you warn kowah then that his actions were helping scum? and I feel like you are assuming a lot in kowah's intentions like he did x so y must be true it doesn't follow logically. In fact his inconsistency does give me pause let me do y but do x instead. I think that itself is worth exploring. at what point does someone go from 'spitballing' to advocating?

@ kowah how attached are you to no limming day 1?

I would hammer it right now if I could.

Also another News Flash for Bingle, outing the Pretenders early, isn't actually good for town.

Isn't this literally impossible to do without their flips? Not even scum can know who is a pretender until the flip. In fact, one of the scum could even be a pretender. So this post seems very odd.

I mean, technically we could massclaim, determine which roles contained pretender slots lim one of those roles and have a pretty good shot at publicly outing pretenders on D2. That would also be a very stupid plan.

I guess what scares me most, and is likely entirely unavoidable, is the potential of lost information this game. It's going to happen, and I just don't want it to. Reading this post makes me no longer feel a mass claim is a good idea today. I stand by a no lim.

There is a disconnect in your thought process here. You say you would hammer a no-lim right now but then you go on to say that you don't really want to lose information this game. Do you not consider ending the Day on page 10 a loss of information? Because I do. Cutting discussion short like this would only benefit scum

[Black]

Huh. I'm at l-1 i believe. Didn't know you guys hated me this much...

Is that it?

Fwiw I townread your slot pretty heavily and I think it's obvious there's

at least

one scum pushing you rn. Maybe two but that seems risky tbh. If you really are town then who do you think is scum on your wagon?

[Black]

Also I'm not sure if this needs to be said but please announce intent to hammer before doing so

[Black]

I would also say that political clout is a townlean for now. I might elaborate if needed.

This is the only read I don't get. PC's reads don't really mesh with mine and I also don't really like how he jumped on your wagon

[Black]

Howdy, will catch up in the next hour or two.

UNVOTE:

Hi Drew!

[Black]

This post by Black jumps out at me, like in my soul it feels like role phishing

Nah, I'm just a dummy

Why do you scumread Don? And what do you think about Kowah?

[Black]

Also, I tried to sub into Merlyn's slot.....but you beat me too it Black lol.

Too bad! She's mine :p

[Black]

do you think the disconnect is scum because you are pretty brutal with admonishing him but don't assign a town/scum value. why not?

No offense but are you reading my posts? I haven't liked Kowah since I replaced in. I had him at the bottom of my reads list after my catch up and I'm voting for him. I think the disconnect is probably scum, yeah, and I don't think I'm being brutal about it like you're claiming

[Black]

This post really seems like you are trying to make a case when it isn't there Black.

How? There's a contradiction in Kowah's words and his actions. I don't think I'm fabricating anything about that

And I do like PC's question here.

I don't understand why...I think it's pretty obvious how I feel about Kowah

[Black]

I don't think you should discount your original position Dr. if how you felt is x it is incorrect for black to say well I felt y a long time ago it doesn't change the fact of the interaction in fact it makes your observation more relevant imo.

Did you miss my reads post too or what? Because it kinda feels like you were trying to shade me for no reason just now

[Black]

do you think the disconnect is scum because you are pretty brutal with admonishing him but don't assign a town/scum value. why not?

No offense but are you reading my posts? I haven't liked Kowah since I replaced in. I had him at the bottom of my reads list after my catch up and I'm voting for him. I think the disconnect is probably scum, yeah, and I don't think I'm being brutal about it like you're claiming

okay...but I still stand by my post let's say I agree that you aren't being harsh. what is the point of your post then because it really isn't clear. let's even say that everything you said about kowah in the post was true. it still doesn't answer how you actually feel about it. If i say this post indicates x. it doesn't really say anything without me also saying therefore y must be true.

I mean I'm not 100% convinced Kowah is scum, but I figured it was clear that I didn't like the disconnect. I'm trying to engage with him to read him better

[Black]

I don't think it's relevant at all but we can agree to disagree I guess

[Black]

I don't think it's relevant at all but we can agree to disagree I guess

That is one fair question they had.

Did your read on Jason change after your reads list(I just went back in your iso to check it out).

And did my entrance change your read.

I'm sorry but I don't consider "why didn't you explicitly say you scumread this" a fair question

I didn't really like his responses to me or to Bingle. His replacing out caught me off guard and I usually lean on the side of that being townie, so that throws me off. I would personally never replace out of a scum game but I can't really say the same for everyone. I think there's a decent possibility the solve is just Kowah/Jason(You) and in that world, maybe Jason replaced out because I called them out as soon as I replaced in

I thought it was weird how you didn't mention Kowah at all until I asked you about him, and then it seemed like you rode the fence a little with your response. "I could vote for him but I always think he's scum" seems like you're trying to get on the wagon without actually getting on. I don't really like it tbh

[Black]

but it is a fair one. if someone says w and then you say hey buddy you are doing x here you are saying y but also saying z. do you think a is true because I do in fact doing a is scum. you say nothing of actual value and it feels like you are just posting to post. as x y and z are a completely different conversation than a. imo.

I'm sorry but I don't really understand what you're trying to say here. I think saying I'm posting just to post feels pretty disingenuous though. I'm trying to solve and there's meaning behind my questions even if you don't see them

[Black]

Drew there was some confusion on the "question" my b

And you really believe that someone would rep out because you called them scum? Especially a player like Jason?

This is my first experience with Jason so idk what you mean by that. I'm trying to think of why scum!Jason would rep out. I wasn't rude at all in my argument and I think Bingle was pretty respectful too. Feeling defeated and not wanting to play is the only thing I can think of

[Black]

but it is a fair one. if someone says w and then you say hey buddy you are doing x here you are saying y but also saying z. do you think a is true because I do in fact doing a is scum. you say nothing of actual value and it feels like you are just posting to post. as x y and z are a completely different conversation than a. imo.

I'm sorry but I don't really understand what you're trying to say here. I think saying I'm posting just to post feels pretty disingenuous though. I'm trying to solve and there's meaning behind my questions even if you don't see them

then what's the point of your post to kowah talking about disconnect? because it doesn't go anywhere and you don't take it anywhere unless i'm wrong.

It hasn't gone anywhere because it was a statement to Kowah and they haven't responded. Give it time...relax!

[Black]

PC what is your mafia experience?

[Black]

Pre Edit2: Fair enough Black, but my experience is that Jason would not back down......I even had a real battle with him when he was scum, and he fought right back. So no, I don't feel he is the type to back down, and definitely not to replace out with his tail between his legs

I appreciate the context. I'm kinda grossed out by meta reads because I've had some bad experiences with them lately (*cough* Fire&Ice) but I'll take this into consideration

[Black]

PC what is your mafia experience?

Nvm you can ignore this. For some reason I could've sworn you were a new account

[Black]

It did not say 2011 the last time I clicked it. You're an old man here

[Black]

Hey screw you buddy, my original account on here was from 2011.

But Black, you asked me about Don, what are your feelings on them?

The 2011 thing was to Political Clout. I thought he was a newer player. The fact that he's more experienced makes me feel worse about his push on me

I think Don feels townie in his thought processes. I like his reads and his approach to the game. And like I said before I think his wagon has scum on it

[Black]

You replacing in, ignoring Kowah and the pressure around him, and jumping right on the Don wagon based on your predecessor kinda stinks

[Black]

I don't really think your reasons for doing so are very strong in particular either and that can be said about PC and Kowah too

[Black]

Hey screw you buddy, my original account on here was from 2011.

But Black, you asked me about Don, what are your feelings on them?

The 2011 thing was to Political Clout. I thought he was a newer player. The fact that he's more experienced makes me feel worse about his push on me

I think Don feels townie in his thought processes. I like his reads and his approach to the game. And like I said before I think his wagon has scum on it

Oh I'm dumb. You were yelling at me because I suggested you're old too lol

Sorry I'm tired

[Black]

PC what is your mafia experience?

let's say i'm a newer player what would you say and let's say i'm an experienced player what would you say? because I'm going to be open and tell you right now that I think you are going nowhere with this question and i'm going to circle it back around and say just like with kowah you didn't go anywhere and didn't take it anywhere. ultimately how does it help you solve my slot?

I'm getting the feeling that your push on me is fabricated and scum motivated. You're not really an easy person to read imo and I was thinking some of the weird vibes I'm getting from you could be attributed to you being an inexperienced player. But the fact that you've been around the block makes me feel worse about you and your push

[Black]

huh? objectively this is wrong. what could kowah say about your post that would take it somewhere? like there is a certain finality to your post. kowah you are disconnected ending the day on page 10 is scum drop mic and the former part of the post has nothing to do with the latter part of it. I stand by what I said feels like you are just posting to post and not doing anything with it.

Again, I'm sorry if you don't see the purpose behind what I'm doing but saying I'm just posting to post doesn't feel like an honest opinion of me. This is how I play. I engage with people and point out things I find contradictory or weird so that I can read them better

"The former part of your post has nothing to do with the latter part of it"

...what?

[Black]

and by your logic I also ignored Delta and Appearence as well. Why not comment on that?

You ignoring Kowah stood out to me because I already had the feeling that you two could be the scum team before you even replaced in

I apologize if you had said as much, but what is your opinion on Bingle?

A lot of the mech talk has made my eyes glaze over but I townread his tone and the way he's presenting his arguments. We seem to agree on a few reads as well and that usually pings me as town even though it probably shouldn't. It's not really a solid read but I don't think Bingle is a good lim option at all atm

[Black]

If I had to guess then there's one scum in Kowah/Drew/PC, possibly two but it's probably not that easy. I have a tendency to townread scum so if there isn't two in this group then the second scum is probably near the top of my list

Speaking of....where the heck is Delta?

[Black]

Between Gamma and Epsilon.

[Black]

I think Black and PC are town. If one isn't, I would say it's Black. At least one is, but I'm thinking both are.

Can you elaborate a little on why you think PC is townie?

[Black]

I do not think ending today early is as beneficial as I would in a more standard game

Also I'm curious about this. I don't think ending the day early is ever really that beneficial. What are the benefits and why is this game different?

[Black]

This is not important to this game, it will devolve the conversation away from the actual game here because it's just my opinion

I think it's important to understand your thought processes so I can sort you better, but if you don't want to talk about it then I can't make you

[Black]

There's no way you can say 357 isn't relevant to the game so I'm still waiting on an answer to that

[Black]

The deadline is in 20 hours?!

This might be the slowest game I've ever seen

[Black]

There's no way you can say 357 isn't relevant to the game so I'm still waiting on an answer to that

My town read on you and PC comes from the conversation you both had. on page 13 or 14. I thought PC asked some very good questions about the questions you were asking, and I was having the same thought about the same questions. Your 344 was a good retort to PC's concerns. So I liked the overall feeling of that conversation.

I still don't think PC's questions were very good but you're the second person to say this. It felt like he was trying to shade me more than actually solve me. Idk, maybe it's just me

[Black]

@mod: I'll be out of town with limited access until Monday

[Black]

I don't know about anyone else, but I never think a player's posts are good when they're questioning me and my motives.

I disagree with this mindset on a fundamental level

[Black]

Abnegation replaces Deltabreedy

welcome what do you think of black?

so far a lot of people that is my feeling has said it's town v town. I think I can institute wisdom of the crowds here and say I'm wrong I would like fresh eyes to look at the interaction and see what they say first.

I find it odd that your first thought is to ask him what he thinks about me instead of the guy you're voting for. If you think I'm scum then why aren't you voting for me? The Don wagon seems easier to push through huh?

[Black]

I'm about all packed up for my trip so in an hour or so I won't be here much. I'll poke in throughout the weekend to make sure we're not risking a no lim

[Black]

i had a dream that invis was mafia.

This is the best slip I've ever seen lol

Hi Alianna XD

I like your catch up posts here but rumor has it you're a wizard...

[Black]

Btw, don't take this as an indicator that my view on kowah has changed(political might try doing it with his track record), it's just that this is a worst slot in my eyes right now.

This is how I'm feeling atm. I don't think Kowah is doing anything particularly townie here but I'm ok with a PC lim

[Black]

alright, so here's where i'm at.
bingle/dr. drew/invis/kowah are all townleans of various degrees and i wouldn't vote them today.
black is a bit of a complicated read. i don't find her scummy, but i also know she's good at scum and i don't expect scum!her to play in a scummy way. might be better to give this one some time.
don is null because i'm too lazy to read his wallposting. appearance is null due to lack of content.
i'm fine with pc wagon.

VOTE: political clout

e-2.
also, mech question. is there a benefit to having people claim at e-1/intent in this setup?

I think I overlooked this...can you explain your Kowah townread?

[Black]

i am questioning why doc took issue with invis questioning me.
i thought that question was a fair one, given that all my reasons were in spoilers.

on the contrary, i actually find it townish for drew to poke on that

it makes more sense after 469.

got that.
ngl invis would be worth checking, depend on pc flip.

what's up with you talking about who you think the investigatives should check? this wouldn't be the first time you've done that today.

what's up with you talking about who you think the investigatives should check? this wouldn't be the first time you've done that today.

i'll explain tommorow
(it's to do with my role)

I don't really like this from Appearance ngl

[Black]

Deadline is in 9 hours and it looks like PC is at E-1 and the other option is Don. I don't think anyone that jumped in the Don wagon ever gave good reasons for it, including PC. PC's interactions with me didn't feel good and now he's either flaked or lurking

I'm down to hammer this. Someone asked if claims matter. I don't really think so? Like even if PC claimed Tracker or any other PR he could still be scum

Intent to hammer before I pass out

[Black]

I read your catch-ups...maybe I overlooked it. I'm gonna try to beat you to it...

[Black]

Ok, I found it. Seems mostly meta? I'm not a huge fan of those arguments but I do think they can be useful. I'll take it into consideration

[Black]

Ok I thought about it for a solid 5 minutes or so. I don't think claims matter and PC is definitely summer than Don

VOTE: Political Clout

[Black]

Scummier*** I blame the autotext and probably the wine a little

[Black]

Hi!

I didn't get the chance to analyze the PC flip yet but I still think Kowah is a very likely partner

Alianna kill seems kinda random?

[Black]

Alianna townread Kowah so if it is Kowah then the kill doesn't really make sense. Unless he made the kill just to say he wouldn't have made the kill. Not sure about that though

[Black]

So whoever was roleblocked is confirmed not scum.

Wow I'm a total idiot. I'm not sure why I didn't realize this

Kowah is town. I'm the RB and I blocked him N1

[Black]

So whoever was roleblocked is confirmed not scum.

Wow I'm a total idiot. I'm not sure why I didn't realize this

Kowah is town. I'm the RB and I blocked him N1

Theoretically kowah can still be scum if you are pretender.

Tracker results are also hard investigative.

So whoever was roleblocked is confirmed not scum.

Wow I'm a total idiot. I'm not sure why I didn't realize this

Kowah is town. I'm the RB and I blocked him N1

Theoretically kowah can still be scum if you are pretender.

Tracker results are also hard investigative.

I'm tracker. I tracked Kowah and they didn't visit anyone last night

Bingle that makes sense

Considering Invis and I can't both be Pretenders, it's safe to assume Kowah is locktown here?

[Black]

So whoever was roleblocked is confirmed not scum.

Wow I'm a total idiot. I'm not sure why I didn't realize this

Kowah is town. I'm the RB and I blocked him N1

Theoretically kowah can still be scum if you are pretender.

Tracker results are also hard investigative.

I'm tracker. I tracked Kowah and they didn't visit anyone last night

Well, according to my tracker ability. Black visited Invisibility last night.

Now I'm really confused. Don't these claims contradict each other? You can't both be Pretenders...

[Black]

What am I missing here? I targeted Kowah (not Invis) so that makes Kowah a Pretender, but then why wouldn't Kowah show up as visiting me in Invisibility's result?

[Black]

Am I the pretender?

What is happening?

[Black]

Yeah clearly mech is my weak spot but it looks good to me too

[Black]

My only issue is I still think Don and Bingle are pretty townie, but I guess it doesn't matter as long as we follow the plan

[Black]

Drew becomes defacto lim if everyone else is confed. Can’t conf him over you/me because we need his action to keep vizzy alive.

If black blocks doc and kills vizzy that creates a 1v1 between black and doc, which is solved by appearance on black. There is a loophole here for black scum to win by killing appearance, but we should be able to close that with a slight rework.

Vizzy on black, appearance on drew should work I think?

I'll tell you right now I'm probably going to block Drew. I think he's the most likely to be scum here. If I die overnight then it should be fairly obvious who did it

[Black]

I’m a little bit annoyed with myself that I didn’t see how problematic a d1 maf pretender lik was for the setup, btw. A roughly 5% that puts town in just off of autowin N1 is a big oversight. Considering if we’d had the ability/desire to be a little more proactive with a plans we could be in actual autowin for sure… well. Not a great place.

My best suggestion atp would be to add one pretender to the role pool and make it a semi-open.

I don't understand this and at this point I'm too afraid to ask

[Black]

Blocking drew if we’re in autowin is literally gamethrowing, fwiw. At this point, the town wincondition is get to a point where we have fewer mechanically unconfirmed players than eliminations left to make.

I'm just gonna take your word for it. Playing like this is weird to me but I feel like it does give us the best chance to win, and that's really all I care about

[Black]

Vizzy on Appearance.
Appearance on Black.
Doc on Vizzy.
Black on me.

Appearance checks black to prevent Black from fake guilty shenanigans involving blocking Appearance.
Vizzy seeing Appearance target means that Black and Appearance are both town. If they're not, the action fails.
Vizzy not seeing Appearance target means that there is scum between Black and Appearance.
Vizzy getting no result means Black is scum.
Vizzy dying means there is scum between Doc and Black.
I am town if there is a kill.
If anyone other than Vizzy dies, there is scum in Doc/Don and we have two eliminations.
If there is no kill, we have three eliminations and three unconfirmed slots (me/Don/Doc) at worst or a 1v1 at best.

Autowin if everyone agrees to the action plan.

Aye aye Captain

VOTE: No Lim

[Black]

VOTE: No lime

My guesses for scum are appearance and black.

No lime? Blasphemy

[Black]

VC 2.00 be here later

[Black]

something i just realised tho is black could always get killed and i could get framed.

I was gonna say something about you bringing this up after you hammered but I feel like the hammer happened long ago...

[Black]

Bingle is clear...so it has to be Drew?

[Black]

do I track Appearance or Black?

I personally think Black is prob town.

Why did you track me if you think I'm town?

[Black]

do I track Appearance or Black?

I personally think Black is prob town.

Why did you track me if you think I'm town?

Wait I just remembered you're the pretender nvm

[Black]

Bingle is clear...so it has to be Drew?

I mean I trust the process, but why?

I guess it could be Don? I thought it was you by POE but Don isn't clear I don't think

[Black]

I'm unconfirmed but from my POV it has to be Don or Drew

What's the plan Bingle? Do we no lim or take a shot on one of us three?

[Black]

Appearance visited Bladk

TBC, appearance could not have visited black if she was scum. Appearance’s action would have failed and been a no target result.

I didn't know it worked like this

Can I just brag a little and say I knew it was Jason?

VOTE: Drew

[Black]

Bingle is clear...so it has to be Drew?

so did you block Bingle and Kowah just happened to get the correct result?

Yup lol. That's kinda why I forgot he was a pretender at first and called him out for tracking a townread XD

[Black]

Need a littlw help clearing this up. In the role card it says the "action" will succeed. Now i'm wondering if that action is visiting, or getting a result. If it's the former it confirms black, but if it's the latter and he could have visited without getting a result, then that's trouble. In a scum!black scenario as she can both rb and kill doc will have no way of confirming himself, as he can't heal invis.

Now i don't think this is likely, we still have to be wary of every possibility.

Well, the lim went through regardless, if it happens that doc is somehow town, then we'll finally have some reason to be playing this game. I'll get you next time Black!!

Idk why but this post just feels really fake. If Doc is actually town then I feel like this post was made to cast shade on a confirmed slot

[Black]

I think we just win here though

[Black]

VOTE: Don

[Black]

Fuck. I didn't get to block Don. Why tf is night deadline 24 hours?? I was gone all day yesterday and when I got back to Tulsa my power was knocked out from the craziest wind storm I have ever seen in my life. I can't connect to internet at my apartment and they are saying power could be out for several days so idk when I'll be able to post again

VOTE: Don because it has to be him

[Black]

I didn't forget to RB. I wasn't online at all during the 24 hour night phase. GiF was late starting Night and I wasn't around when he finally did it

I'm seriously not making this shit up about the wind storm. My power is expected to be off until the 24th!!! and the storm fucked with everyone's phone service too

[Black]

It's clearly Don here. He was even casting shade on me before Doc even flipped. He was setting this moment up yesterday because he knew Doc would flip town

[Black]

That's not what I'm saying at all. You had to question me being cleared because that was the only way you could win here. You had to push Drew over me yesterday because you know we're both town and Drew was the easiest way out yesterday. Had you started arguing that I'm not clear and pushed me it would've be obvious that you were trying to set yourself up for the literal only chance you could win this. Instead you played it correctly which was being up the doubt and played it cool, waiting for today to push it more heavily.

And you had to kill Invis last night. Invis was most definitely going to track you, and if you killed me then you would be tracked to me. Not to mention it wouldn't make sense for you to kill me since you have to keep me alive to win this scenario. You only got lucky that I wasn't around yesterday or Invis would be alive and you would've already gotten limmed

[Black]

That scenario doesn't exist and I never said it did. You're not thinking clearly. Even if I was here to RB you, you would have come up with some elaborate theory about how I didn't send in a kill to frame you. I have no doubt you had either argument ready to go depending on what happened overnight

[Black]

I mean I agree that you shouldn't have even got this far. You do a great job at seeming townie that's for sure. You've clearly thought this through and you're pushing the only angle you have here. I just have to hope Bingle and Kowah make the right play

[Black]

I mean I agree that you shouldn't have even got this far. You do a great job at seeming townie that's for sure. You've clearly thought this through and you're pushing the only angle you have here. I just have to hope Bingle and Kowah make the right play

There is no angle where scum!don wins this game. I already explained how every route leads to a 5p situation where he loses for certain. The only angle scum!black could win is this, where she gets a nightkill and blames that on not roleblocking me. Mystical forces indeed.

This doesn't make sense. If I were scum here why wouldn't I just no-kill to frame you? Why would I make up some story about a deadly storm in my city knocking my power out for a week? If Kowah and Bingle don't believe me they can look it up. 150,000 people without power in Tulsa

Also why do you keep saying you don't have an angle to win? You're clearly pushing one right now. And even if I did get the chance to roleblock you, you would have said I framed you lol. There's always angles for you

[Black]

I don't know that apparently. I don't know anything about mech and my eyes start to glaze over when you talk about it. This entire game has been one big mech conversation and it has probably been my least favorite games out of the 13 or so I have played

All I know is my role and that there's no way Bingle can be scum because I blocked him and a kill went through. Kowah is a confirmed pretender somehow and that means it can't be him because scum can only have one pretender

So that means it's you

[Black]

It's understandable. It's impressive you got to mylo in the first place while getting the most unfavorable hand imaginable. So there's a silver lining to this game.

It feels like you are projecting here because if I were scum then my hand still wouldn't be as bad as yours! You rolled a useless scum role and had to sit by and watch as your partner got whacked early on. I think you made the best out of your hand by putting on your best town impression and by trying to appeal to Bingle in your PT though. You seem pretty smart so I'm sure your mech talk has been convincing. We'll see what Kowah and Bingle think I guess

[Black]

GIF confirmed he didn't mod error.

VOTE: Donempire

I'm curious how this is going to play out postgame

[Black]

That last comma looked aggressive as all hell, wasn't my intention!

It just came across as grammatically correct to me.

Yeah I didn't get an aggressive vibe from it at all. Don you played an incredible game and I think I only won due to some mech misunderstanding or something. I still don't quite get it but yeah. I think without this dispute then town wins this easy thanks to you and Bingle. You both had this game wrapped up in a nice little bow.

My bus on PC didn't even matter ultimately. The mech plan was so sound that it didn't matter who was townie and who was scummy. It was definitely a weird one to play for me. I feel like I didn't have to do much until it was time to argue my position in F4

Speaking of which, I did lie about not being able to send in my role, obviously. I was here Saturday afternoon when Night hit. I thought the only way I could win was say I wasn't around to RB and then blame it on the 24 night deadline

I couldn't have really expected the storm that night though. There was no warning about it on the news or anything. Suddenly tornado sirens started going off and it got super windy. Power went out around midnight Saturday along with cell service. That part was really weird to me because normally the power goes out but I can still use my phone for entertainment, but I guess the wind was that strong to where it messed with everyone's phone service for like 36 hours. Not even just Cricket but people with different carriers all over Tulsa. I had to drive several miles to be somewhere with power and thus WiFi so I could use my phone. It was so eerie. I just happened to get somewhere with service when Day was starting back up! That timing was NOT planned at all

So I just wanted to say that I did lie about not being able to send in my role but the storm was not an embellishment at all. This shit sucks. Luckily phone service came back sometime yesterday but we're expected to be without power for

four

more days. I'm fine and my cats don't really mind the heat so that's good

GG everyone <3

[Black]

Speaking of which, I did lie about not being able to send in my role, obviously. I was here Saturday afternoon when Night hit. I thought the only way I could win was say I wasn't around to RB and then blame it on the 24 night deadline

I literally only voted Don because I wound up deciding I was going to believe this.

[Black]

I appreciate the kind words Don, but I really can't accept the victory here. I do feel really good about myself for being able to pull out the "fake win" here, but without the mod error I was toast. Town deserves the win here IMO. I just capitalized on a mod error that never should have happened

I'll leave the mech arguments to you guys haha but I just wanna say I enjoyed playing with y'all and hopefully we can play again soon Don

[Black]

Stop knowing when I'm scum and maybe you'll live next time!

[Black]

XD

Fun fact this is the first time I've been scum since my first 3 newbie games on the site. I almost forgot what it felt like...

[Black]

GiF seems to think about this site once a week

[Black]

i want to read the scum's murderous plots.

It was mostly me planning the bus and then talking to myself lol